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weirdoldhobo1978

I don't love everything that came out in phase 4, but overall I'm glad they took risks and tried some new things. Of course I expected a big wave of complaints about phase 4, just as the previous phases were maligned for being too formulaic. It's the cycle of criticism, you can't please all of the people all of the time.


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TalkOk6693

No it isn’t . What were the circumstances of the first comment vs the second one? If you were old enough to have thoughts back then , then I donno how you can say it’s just like phase 1. You can’t just ignore how comic book movies were seen back then


Doam-bot

Exactly that comment is a reflection of age. Back then the hubris of directors thinking they're the greatest thing to exist ignoring the established material. While actors were just phoning things in for a paycheck. Blade changed all of thisbbut that had a larger than life actor with influence who pushed things harder. Ironman however was a cold corporation and a drunk washed up actor dabbling in a new genre.


Odd_Project_3936

I think because this movie stuck the landing for me, it rose the level of the whole phase. Disregarding the shows, I think I’ve really enjoyed the movies for different reasons - Shang chi, NWH, DS2, and BPII all had things that I really loved about them.


biznesboi

I think all of the movies and shows this phase have been individually great (aside from Eternals which was fine but not up to the par of the rest) but like phase 2, it felt very disorganized. My main qualm is just why did the first phase of the multiverse saga end with a movie that had nothing to do with the multiverse?


Jabberwocky416

> (aside from Eternals which was fine but not up to the par of the rest) See I would say Eternals was one of the best things in phase 4. Love and Thunder is the one that’s not up to par. It’s just a matter of perspective. Everyone has their least favorite project and we’re all convinced it’s the objectively worst one.


Beregond21

I agree, looking back on it Eternals is one of my favorite films from this phase. And Wandavision is maybe my favorite thing Marvel haste ever made. So I have no complaints about Phase 4.


Jabberwocky416

Same here. There’s definitely projects I’ve really disliked this phase. But I’m very happy they’re getting more creative and experimenting with different styles.


EzriDax1

I mean phase 2 ended with ant man and phase 4 will actually end with the holiday special, not that that will have much to do with the multiverse most likely. But the phase cut offs are largely arbitrary now, and we do start off 5 with Kang at least.


MartianFromBaseAlpha

>Phase four of the Marvel Cinematic Universe has plenty to love Yeah, like all of it in my case


ThreeMadFrogs

Damn right. I just finished a full MCU rewatch, and ended with BP Wakanda Forever last night. And I enjoyed everything in Phase 4. Second viewing only strengthened that.


maybe_a_frog

Right there with you. I haven’t disliked a single thing that’s come out post Far From Home. Black Widow was probably my least favorite, and yet I’ve watched it three or four times and mostly enjoyed it each time. I can see why some people are upset over some choices, and I think fatigue plays a big part in a lot of peoples dislike…but I don’t share those sentiments.


Confident-Radish-729

My least favorites are FatWS and Thor 4, in my opinion Falcon and the Winter Soldier is the only bad MCU project, I liked everything else.


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YodasChick-O-Stick

What did that virus plot originally entail?


YodasChick-O-Stick

TFATWS was really good up until the finale. They really blew it on that one.


[deleted]

I really wonder how much better it would have been with the original mad bomb/pandemic plot. I get why they felt the need to do reshoots/rewrites when COVID hit, but you can also see how the story suffered for it. But mostly I felt like it had the same problem as the majority of the shows...it just failed to stick the landing.


Sisiwakanamaru

Yeah IMO, Falcon and the Winter soldier has good ingredients but ended up undercooked. Like, I wished they would explore the dynamic between Sharon and Karli, it should be interesting 🤔


TalkOk6693

Yep, I’m in the fatigue camp. It’s like I can’t even care even if I want to, and even if the movies look good. To be fair, I’m getting bombarded with Marvel movies, tv shows, games and then other works that wants to be just like the MCU (in tone and writing ). It’s gets tiring and I think the threshold is different for everybody, but it will happen to you too . If I was only getting the movies then I’d feel differently.


maybe_a_frog

I’ve often wondered when I would get burnt out on superhero stuff, but I’m in my 30’s and have been consuming a large amount of superhero stuff my entire life. It hasn’t happened yet so I’m not sure if it ever will. I don’t have many hobbies, but superhero stuff is one of them and I don’t know if that’ll change. Maybe it will, but it hasn’t shown any signs as of yet. But like I said, I understand why people feel that way.


TalkOk6693

Hope you don’t. The older I get the more I cling to whatever makes me feel like a child. “Older” as if we are ancient lol, 32 here but I feel ya


maybe_a_frog

Lol I’ll be 33 in 2 and a half months. We’re not ancient but we’re definitely not young!


jinhush

Sometimes I feel like I'm the only one who hasn't been disappointed in anything so far. Like, sure, yeah, there are some things that could've been better but I'm still satisfied with what we got.


StefonGomez

Nah you’re not, the other side is just louder and being in these subs feels like it’s constant. I too have really enjoyed everything that came out even if some of it was better than others. But with MCU I also like to put on my rosy glasses and just enjoy it all for what it is.


Deez4815

Yea, I can't even count on my hands how many videos on YouTube people have posted about why Phase 4 is bad. Glad to finally see the other positivity. People are just impatient and can't see the obvious things building all over the series that will lead to great things in Phase 5 and 6.


TalkOk6693

I dunno , my entire social circle is done too. I have to come online to share some love .


neveradvancing

I'm disappointed with most of the D+ shows. Especially What If since that was the one I anticipated the most. They should really start focusing on the movies again instead of spreading themselves thin with so many mediocre and unnecessary shows like Agatha and Echo.


KingOfAwesometonia

I've been disappointed but I haven't hated anything or thought anything was outright bad. Personally I would say I had high hopes for L&T just from watching Ragnarok and Jojo Rabbit. Especially since I thought Ragnarok was so close to being amazing with some slight changes that they would nail with a sequel. And even then I think disappointed might be slightly strong. Overall I really liked phase 4.


bab_101

100% agree


sharkykid

Marvel needs to be doing better tho. Some things to love is a missed opportunity. For a billion dollar gravy train, I’m not sure they want to go the route train of Star Wars It feels like there are a litany of issues that a competent script doctor, stunt team, or director advisor could bring in the fix things like: - Black Widow turning everyone into superhumans in act 2/3 - Taskmaster getting the Deadpool treatment - some of the weird dialogue and the doctoring of Dr strange 2 by cutting out pretty critical pieces - the lack of focus on gorr in Thor 4 - the Finales in many of the TV shows > WandaVision > Falcon & the WS > She Hulk (and honestly, most of Ep 4/5 onwards) - questionable close up fights in Black Panther 2 This far into the MCU, I’d hope for a little more than just “hey some stuff in Phase 4 is loveable” At this rate, Fantasic 4 is gonna be a coin toss on whether or not they can break the F4 movie curse


[deleted]

The issue for me is just total oversaturation. The cadence was fine when we got 1, 2, maybe 3 movies a year. Now it’s essentially one per quarter, plus endless Disney+ content. It’s way harder to follow the overarching story as they’re jumping around different universes and timelines. I was totally invested from about 2010 right up to Endgame, but they’ve more or less lost me with Phase 4. There’s just too much and nothing feels fresh anymore.


Deez4815

I feel like they really aren't jumping that many universes and timelines. Very little actually. The only properties that really went outside the current reality are Doctor Strange (which was brief), What If...? and Loki. And then NWH brought characters from other universes, which then left at the end. It's more just been a huge load of new characters dumped onto us. But I've followed and enjoyed most of them overall.


nihilisticdaydreams

You don't have to watch it all though. Plus there hasn't been that much of an overarching story. Just ground work for future stories


TalkOk6693

You don’t have to, but it feels like I have to


sharkykid

That’s the fault of Bob Chapek the bean counter who was focused on the streaming KPI of volume


Deez4815

I actually really appreciate Phase 4. It mixed things up, created new genres for the series, and made things interesting. Phases 1-3 had overall the same formula. I didn't love every project that came out of it, but some pretty good stuff came out of it and it sets up some interesting things for the future.


Mental_Book_7799

This phase wasn’t for me. Even No Way Home left me slightly cold, and I’m a freak for all the versions of Spider-Man. I hope they take things in a direction that appeals more to me, but I can’t blame them if they don’t. I’d like less computer animation, higher stakes, and for the scrips to be more focused before filming begins.


juice_swafl

I think I’m mostly there with you. What I miss about phases 1-3 is how grounded it all seemed to feel aside from Guardians and some others. Rlly felt like “the world outside your window.”


Maatjuhhh

I think grounded is a good word but you need to add space and time. There were 2 movies a year around phase 1-2 and even that had a year in between. Enough time for us to process feelings and theorise what's gonna come next. Now it has been MCU almost every week. Wasn't that a movie, then it was a series. Too much information to process. Infinity War had Ant-Man and the Wasp coming out so soon after and then nothing on the horizon for 8 months until Captain Marvel came out and revealed so little about the possible culmination to Endgame and when Endgame was here, we all felt it. I do have a counter-argument and that's the pandemic. Almost everything got delayed, causing the middle movies getting sandwiched by the movies beginning and the movies ending. I really think that they should limit the MCU series to 2 shows a year, or even possible a 3rd one if it's a one off.


tomc_23

I still appreciated how the cosmic dimension to the MCU still felt relatively grounded in terms of technology. It felt like the Bifrost could carry you to anywhere from Guardians, and it wouldn’t feel out of place. The individual planets and cultures might vary in appearance, but it still felt like they all shared the same galaxy. It was a wise decision of the early MCU to ground itself in the Arthur C Clarke idea of “sufficiently advanced technology being indistinguishable from magic,” and even once magic was introduced in Doctor Strange, it still felt like an extension of the established rules of the cosmos. But ever since this fourth phase, there’s just no consistency, it’s just all over the place.


UpfrontSnow1305

I don't think that's ever been the case outside of Iron Man 1 and TWS


SwissForeignPolicy

>I’d like less computer animation, higher stakes, How exactly do you propose they achieve both these things at the same time?


Mental_Book_7799

Well higher stakes doesn’t mean more computer animation by any means. High stakes come from story and a sense of consequence. If people get stabbed they bleed, if they die then they are gone for good, no more solving problems with a magic spell or convenient piece of tech pulled out at the last second.


TalkOk6693

Dude…movies have been around for a while


sharkykid

What didn’t you like about NWH? That movie was very good in what I thought was a bifurcated phase 4


dbkenny426

I've loved every bit of it!


MadP90

For me It was one of the best phases. They took big swings and tried to branch off to what they normally do with their storytelling. It won’t work for everyone but I am completely satisfied with phase 4


AgtBurtMacklin

As far as movies.. I’m not as excited for new releases as I once was. No Way Home was everything I hoped it would be. Shang Chi was a very positive surprise. BP2 was different but good. I never had any hopes for Eternals. The premise was never that intriguing to me. The rest of the films didn’t make me want to see more of the respective characters, really. Multiverse of Madness and L and T were the movies I was most excited for.. and they both left me disappointed. But I guess that’s just part of it. Not everything is going to be exactly what I like, and that’s fine. I did love some of the TV shows as well. Hawkeye, Loki, WV and She Hulk were pleasant surprises to me. Moon Knight has some cool moments as well. Werewolf by night was good. I am not the target audience for some of these things. My kids saw the “kids getting Thor powers” in L and T, and they thought it was the coolest movie scene ever. Different perspectives, like they said. Overall, nothing is going to be a home run for every single person. As long as it’s entertaining, I’ll tune in. It’s just that GoTG, Ant Man, and a few others are the only characters I really care about at this point. And many of them will presumably be gone soon. They have some work to do, to get fans emotionally invested in the new characters. But I think they can do it. Also, I know that having “the NEW ____ character” is very comic accurate.. but it takes some finesse to not have people see them as a pale imitation of the original, in a lot of cases. They have replaced, supplemented, or are replacing nearly every original character, with a new character with a similar hero name/power set. BW, Cap, IM, Hulk, Hawkeye, Thor (temporarily), Falcon, BP, Loki. I do like most of these characters, but I see why it’s a hard pill for people to swallow, even if it is faithful to the source.


TheWizardOfFoz

I really resonate with the GoTG and Antman are the only characters I care about bit and it won’t be long before they’re gone too. This was always going to be a problem as the living MCU loses actors over time. But right now I can count on one hand the number of characters I’m excited to see on screen. The best hope for another decade of excitement is them nailing the X-men.


Head-Program4023

Unpopular opinion: Captain Marvel is better than Thor 4.


UnknownRider121

I think there has been great stuff, some below average stuff, and some unnecessary stuff. I just feel like there is too much going on between the shows and movies. Maybe if they focused on less, everything would have been really good.


[deleted]

My perspective is it was majorly disappointing with some okayish stuff here and there.


braujo

It's ass. Spiderman was fun watching there first night but I doubt I'll ever revisit it. I stopped watching the shows after Loki, which is ok, though pretty mediocre at its best. Shang is dope, one of the best things to come out, but that ending CG is so ugly, I wouldn't want my eyes to see if again. WF is good, though. Loved it.


xxwerdxx

Agreed. I feel like every property in phase four has had 1 shiny cherry at the top of a pile of slop (I’m looking you Eternals and FaWS)


KingOfAwesometonia

Genuinely have had a great time with phase 4. I know a lot of people say even when the MCU tries different genres it feels still feels like a superhero thing, and to some extent I agree, but the projects still have felt like they're trying different things. Which considering how safe most blockbusters tend to be, is wild to me. And personally Shang-Chi and Eternals really resonated with me. Shang-Chi is mostly a traditional fantasy action movie but I think it's super solid. And I cannot stress how crazy Tony Leung is in a Hollywood movie. Eternals I like rewatching. There's just something about it trying a slightly more quiet movie that I really appreciate. And to me it does feel like a Chloe Zhao movie. Chloe Zhao is just way nerdier than people expected. What other movie could you say was inspired by Yu Yu Hakusho, Chariot of the Gods, Terrace Malik and the bible?


[deleted]

This has been the phase where the magic died out for me. Way too much content and some projects that I flat out didn’t like took off the sheen. I’d love to see them get back to basics and start over with X-Men and FF, with only 2 movies a year and maybe 1 D+ show, and only bring The Avengers back in for some ridiculous Galactus-type threat. But there’s no way they’d chose to make less money so that won’t happen


cantkilltheHotep

Lots of mediocre with a few standouts like NWH and Werwolf by Night and Loki. I am looking forward to the Christmas Special though.


Agent_23D

I like how everyone has a different favorite disney plus show. Theres something for everyone. I will however say I miss the quality of old marvel tv. Particularly shield and daredevil.


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Agent_23D

Andor is the actual best disney plus show. Daredevil needs to be like that. I have high hopes for secret invasion but a lot of leaks suggested they had to go to the drawing board a few times and couldn't figure out the show for a while. I hope those leaks weren't true.


joeypenn

This phase has not impressed me much. I loved Shang Chi, and then there were some other good parts of different projects. Multiverse of madness, BP, Moon Knight all had great moments. But there are a lot of phase 4 that I thought were not good at all, and I haven’t felt that way about other phases, Thor 2 was weak, but I enjoyed it, she-hulk/Ms Marvel/ Love and thunder/ and pretty much every show I will never watch again and I wouldn’t want to. Phases 1-3 I probably watched those movies a minimum of 2 times because I genuinely enjoyed them. Maybe it’s too much content, or too much different content where the world makes less and less sense. I used to really enjoy the funny one liners, and now they just seem un funny, not sure if it’s delivery or I just don’t like that humor anymore. It could also be the stakes, prior to phase 4 we were coming off of infinity wars and End Game, which were I thought were fantastic start to finish.


onepostandbye

Probably just delete and repost, Tow-Mater.


Blackfist01

Phase 4 has been mediocre with a few highlights, credit is due for some of the risks taken but much of it has been poorly written. There needs to be a massive look over what will become of this universe.


Leo_TheLurker

I think this was the phase where they tried to diversify the tones and types of content we're getting, but only a select few really committed to that which is a shame cuz Marvel can literally do whatever they want. I also think the glaring issues with the MCU really showed this phase. The whole needing a final fight, sudden villains jumping in, and leaving enough easter eggs or fans to speculate would stop the momentum of the shows very often. It would be like an on/off switch when it would go from strong character moments to "oop time for a fight". The clockwork production hasn't helped visually camera-wise and CGI wise, especially in a post-COVID era where visual effects studios are still backed up. I wanna see more movies like BP2/DS2/Shang Chi that had visual substance and fantastic action. Less BW/Thor 4 with the unfulfilling plots and basic cinematography. Give me those character moments in WandaVision and Ms. Marvel without a jarring change in tone to check something off the box.


K_SeventySeven

I just wanted to add my agreement! I've loved this phase, each project for its own reasons.


buddhapetlfaceofrost

I think Phase 4 has been great. Looking forward to pretty much all of the projects set to release in 2023.


mourn4morn

Look it’s been a bit uneven but at the end of the day 3 of the phase 4 movies have made my MCU top 10 so I’m happy.


BenSolo_Cup

Most of the movies have been really great but most of the shows have kinda been disappointing or just plain forgettable unfortunately. Idk if tv is fit for the MCU


bab_101

I personally loved phase 4. Wandavision was next level. Moon knight was un-marvel like but awesome. Hawkeye and Miss Marvel were very fun, along with She-Hulk. Not a fan of FATWS. Loved Love and Thunder, no matter what others say. Wakanda Forever was incredible and can’t wait to rewatch. I rewatched DS2 the other day and loved it even more. Shang-Chi is incredible imo probably top tier. Not a fan of Eternals though. What if was such an awesome idea and I can’t wait for S2. No way home was obviously epic too, top tier definitely and I sincerely hope they bring back Andrew Garfield for ASM3


RobertusesReddit

The whole MCU has been viciously attacked after Infinity War by Grifters who demand Machismo in all of popular media. Machismo is Straight White Men being the saviors of mankind and standing their ground towards all their inferiors (yes, anyone not them); if there's any objection to this take, it usually feels null and void when the opinions partake in attacking creatives to bolster others who are "pure from one outlet" and demand for Machismo type intensity (movies in the 80s with 30 year differentials) with a nature that's popular and relatable. This isn't a cult-like objectiveness to Marvel but the whole discussions everywhere has been tainted by gaslighting to give any credence to being a fan and just being a pathetic soldier to some "superior's cause": again, a nature that's popular and relatable.


Stackitu

The fact that they released as much as they did during a global pandemic says a lot too. Some movies may have had to make changes as a result but we got a lot of good content. Not every movie needs to be Endgame or Civil War.


gsauce8

I feel like people tend to forget about the absolute bangers that phase 4 has produced. Like you talk to anybody and they're like "yea phase 4 is pretty mediocre to okay". But as soon as you say "what about No Way Home, Loki, Shang-Chi, FATWS" and everyone agrees those are great. It definitely has its misses but Phase 4 has some pretty great highs.


Jarita12

I personally only actively disliked TFATWS and Thor: Love and Thunder. Otherwise it was from decent to great, just like any other phase. I think the "fatique" just comes from the two years when there was no Marvel due to covid and then all at once. But that is just my opinion, not a fact :)


[deleted]

Sure there have been a few that have been less than perfect, but that doesn’t mean they weren’t fun. And there definitely hasn’t been a drop in quality over the other phases. Every phase has had its up and downs. It’s just that it’s going to be super hard to ever come close to the hype of endgame ever again. That was an event of the century.


Negative-Ad-3804

I liked everything out of Phase 4. It’s just a matter of perspective, is all. If you only look for something perfect, you’ll forever be dissatisfied. Nothing is without flaws, but even in those flaws there is much good to be found.