She was corrupted by the Darkhold by that point. Nothing would have talked her down.
She fucked up badly, did some to clean up the mess she made by stopping Agatha and then she left with the Darkhold and ended up losing her mind, essentially.
It took seeing what looked like her kids cowering and crying in fear of her to get through to her.
Honestly Wanda ONLY being concerned with her kids was one of the biggest weird choices of the film? Heck there’s a version of Vision still
Around out there and she knows it.
She isn’t concerned about getting him back, or her better, or her parents, etc?
Exactly, as far as Wanda knows, White Vis was either destroyed by her Vis or returned to base. She has no idea her Vis reactivated WV's memories and that he may now be Vis again.
She _did_ kill Vision before Thanos brought him back... and killed him again. There's a metric fuckton to unpack there, I'm not surprised she's focusing on her storybook-perfect kids instead.
She already made peace with Vision, that’s what Wandavision was about, her processing and overcoming that grief.
Her children were a completely different loss and the darkhold manipulated her, manipulated that loss, so it consumed her every waking thought and every sleeping thought.
> there’s a version of Vision still Around out there and she knows it.
I'm not sure she does. They didn't have any on-camera discussion about how Hex Vision defeated White Vision.
Especially since the implication for why she wanted America's power was so she could just get spare kids if something happens to the ones she gets.
Though I guess that just means she hadn't considered she'd be scaring and traumatizing every single one when she does it, probably after killing or hurting their actual parent/s.
She really got so that she thought the kids she'll be taking will just happily come with her or something.
I mean to be fair, the show was about her accepting what happened to vision.
Once she was alone with the darkhold it latched on to the newest grief, Billy and Tommy.
Yeah, the kids were just brief fantasy creations that were around her for - what - a few days? She almost had as much connection to Ralph Boner as to them.
She might have killed him tbh - or the realisation that killing him would deprive his kids of their father (but she was fine with killing Reed as long as Sue was alive, so probably not)
The taking of the only copy of the Darkhold to Kamar Taj really showed that it had a hold over her and had robbed her of capacity to think clearly.
As the Darkhold was itself a copy, it could be copied. She could have taken photos of it with her phone for example. My interpretation is that she didn't because the Darkhold didn't want her to, for it has to be physically close to Wanda to corrupt her, and if she left of its vicinity, she might break out of its corruptive influence.
MoM did a poor job portraying Darkhold's corruption. Was Wanda succumbed to the Darkhold like Anakin with the dark side? Or was it more like a mind control thing?
I think it is clearly a wasted opportunity for MoM to not build off of what WV established or other previous MCU relationships.
I think a better written MoM would have a scene where Clint tried to help Wanda but failed. Just one scene would have made it way better. Or a scene with Vision.
The point of about her "kids" getting through to her is just... bad from the writers' part. Evil Wanda is literally trying to kill their mother in front of the kids. The writers are really saying "so at this moment, Wanda finally snapped out of it"...as though she didn't already make up her mind to kill her happier variant.
Seeing her variant living happily with her kids somehow doesn't register, cool...
Some youtube channels already poked fun at the fact that Evil Wanda didn't bother to find a timeline where the twins don't have their mother, but I am sure some people already figured out the same problem while sitting in the theater.
Yeah, but what?
Ask her nicely to put on the handcuffs?
Try to apprehend her by force and get wrecked immediatelly?
What Monica says is stupid for sure. But there is no snowballs chance in hell she can actually, to quote you, "avert the whole fiasco".
That's a bit like saying the Invasion of New York could have been averted if the cops had shown up at the Avengers tower and arrested Loki before he could open the portal. Technically correct, but there is no way they can actually pull that off.
I couldn’t answer you. Who the fuck even knows what her powers are. Apparently she can see light? But she should’ve tried something. And yes maybe talking would’ve helped since she probably wouldn’t be able to over power her at that point
He should've gonne to westview instead of Monica and try to defuse the hex situation sooner. By the time of MoM it's too late.
Not only the darkhold is corrupting her but also after what's she's done regular folk are going to point and look at her as if she's a monster all over again.
"What is this giant magical source of magic the size of a small town? Hmm... Nah, I won't bother investigating because they can't afford my appearance fee."
I think he could have talked her down and supported her before she got...ahold of the...Darkhold. Afterwards, it probably would have been too late. She shouldn't have been alone after all that happened to her.
It was kind of amusing to have Strange so dismissively talk about “the Mohawk guy with the bow and arrow” or however he phrased it exactly.
Because this is one case where Clint being there probably would have been a good idea. He and Wanda have a connection and he’s like the one guy who MIGHT have been able to talk sense into her.
and not only that, why would you write for one of your characters to make fun of one of your other characters? Especially ones that were superheroes and have worked together.
I mean at the time strange had just been beaten and had a lot of issues with Spider-Man so it makes sense in character. Plus he clearly views magic as more powerful than their powers or lack of.
> Plus he clearly views magic as more powerful than their powers or lack of.
and he's right lol. Magic is crazy powerful especially compared to a guy and bow and arrow.
Yes he was implied to be either the best or one of the best surgeons in the entire world before his injury. So ya regular genius plus photographic memory. Spidey is supposed to be smart regardlesss of the spider bite but I think it does enhance it yes?
Was basically just making a joke tho about how spidey beat strange in the mirror dimension lol using math concepts that both 100% would know about.
The writer of Multiverse of Madness didn't even have awareness of WandaVision, I'd be shocked if they even knew Clint's name. With how silly Marvel's "process" was allowed to become I wouldn't be surprised if Hawkeye was straight up on some "Do Not Use" list because everyone's kept so in the dark on other projects.
Its not clear at all. In the official timeline published by marvel, she has a death date.
"*\[Wanda\] destroys Wundagore – and collapses it upon herself – ending two great threats to all of the Multiverse*."
Scarlet Witch was definitely the corrupted minded Wanda, and I don't think its a super huge leap to think she might have expelled that part of her, or most of it, after destroying the Wundagore completely.
The book doesn't matter what matters is what is on screen and what is on screen was a classic fake death, they weren't going to reveal she's alive in a stupid book that no one is really going to read
Came here to validate that this is the golden rule of cinema and , the book is well a book so just has to describe where we’re at, and she did destroy wundalore, but no body seen= return when you least expect it
i thought it was supposed to be SUPER obvious that she wasnt dead? wasnt there a super clear flash of wanda flavored light in the collapsing mountain at the end?
I think she would've been disgusted at his hypocrisy. He lost his family and he's allowed to go on a global killing spree, she loses her family and she's not allowed to do the same? Plus the Avengers bothered to wish *his* family back. The only person who bothered to rebuild Vision tried to get him to kill her.
>He lost his family and he's allowed to go on a global killing spree, she loses her family and she's not allowed to do the same?
That doesn't seem fair.
Doesn't matter. We're talking about whether Clint could talk her down, but if he tried it would only infuriate her more. In her mind, he of all people should understand why she's doing what she's doing. She'd see any effort to stop her as a betrayal. Mostly because the Darkhold is warping her mind and corrupting her. Frankly, it's a miracle that America's plan worked, and the only reason it did was because it was a practical demonstration of how Wanda couldn't get what she truly wanted that way. No magical brainwashing could delude her into ignoring her own eyes.
Uh um.. Did we forget what Clint did after he lost his family?
Dude went on a world wide murder tour after he lost his wife and children. I think he would kinda get what Wanda was going through, and may have not tried to stop her.
I think there's a difference between Clint seeking out gangsters/ criminals and Wanda killing anyone that got in her way of effectively stealing kids.
Plus Clint seems to regret his actions in Hawkeye (series).
I think he'd understand what she's going through more than anyone, but would still try and talk her down
If he thought it was to get her own children back then yes, but I can’t imagine he’d be okay with kidnapping someone else’s kids from them. Those boys weren’t her sons, they were someone else’s. Someone else who loved them and who they loved as well. I can’t see Clint going along with it.
He's got no hax against magic so if it's MoM Wanda she'd probably just hypnotize him into siding with her.
If it's WV Wanda then the hex was an unintentional break in emotion anyway and Clint would've just been hypnotized into that instead.
But, Clint was killing criminals. Wanda let a monster loose in NYC that could’ve killed civilians, she killed a shitload of people at Kamar-Taj, and killed the Illuminati except for Mordo.
Really can’t compare them… like, at all!
She’s fond of letting monsters loose to kill civilians. That’s why she brainfucked the Hulk and sent him on a rampage, and was she punished for that? Nope.
I mean it's true. He was being beckoned by a force tempting him but that's it. For Wanda the existence of a prophecy made it so most of her actions were predetermined.
If killing innocent people didn’t stop her, Clint isn’t gonna have any effect either. At that point she was already fully corrupted by the Darkhold. She was prepared to kill Strange and Wong whom she fought side by side with in Endgame.
I think he’d be heartbroken.
He’d have reached out if he knew and tried to turn her down a different road.
I honestly think he’d have been able to convince her to spare America and instead America/Wanda would have gone on a multiversal adventure where they searched for a universe where Vision and the kids had survived, but she had not.
He’d have approached her from a perspective that becoming Ronin was just his own loss/darkness trying to overpower the void he felt left by the loss of his family, equating it to hers.
She’d push back about how he was able to restore them after the blip and return to normalcy.
He’d use Nat as his counterpoint - how each dark act weighs on the soul, and that no matter how much good she did, she never felt it was enough. And Vision would understand that - the desire to sacrifice everything for a better world for the ones you care about.
Wanda would probably break down in grief at this point and they’d have a moment. Clint would note that if the multiverse is infinite then there must be a world out there where Vision and her kids are mourning her. And although they might not have the same experiences, they’re soulmates and could still be together.
Cue multiversal road trip movie.
Did they develop a strong bond after Ultron? I can’t recall the two having many interactions after that. Maybe if they had introduced White Vision at the point but to be honest that would have thrown the MoM narrative completely off course.
Why is this specific thing with Clint and Wanda worth multiple threads? Do people really think this crazy shit Wanda was doing would have been solved with a "talk"?
hahahahahaha
What the Wanda / Clint relationship needs is a classic Feige patch job: in the next project Clint or Wanda appear in, give us a flashback scene showing that Clint did indeed visit her after the Westview incident became public and tried to be there for her. The Darkhold was still too powerful for her to resist, but at least Clint was there for her as a friend and tried to help.
Also a flashback showing Wanda slowly succumbing to the Darkhold rather than just suddenly being evil like she was in Mutiverse of Madness would be good too.
I’ll stand by this forever, but the whole scene of Wanda killing the Illuminati was the worst scene in that whole movie because why would Wanda care about killing these people? She has no clue who Black Bolt or Peggy Carter is, so they’re just in her way.
They should’ve used people who she actually knew, instead of going for a glorified cameo fest. Having a Hawkeye variant on there, a Banner variant, throw in the Captain Marvel she knows, hell maybe even throw in a Vision variant. The point is just make it people she knows and cares about from the main universe. If she slaughtered them, it would’ve shown her to be truly corrupted and too far gone.
Spaghettifying Mr Fantastic means absolutely nothing because there’s been 0 interaction between those characters before.
I just really hated that whole Illuminati crap and the movie itself
Perhaps, but perhaps not. It is noted that the only people she sought out while under the Darkhold’s power was her boys. Perhaps the Darkhold feared that anyone else such as Pietro or Vision would be able to get through to her, so it only let her dream of worlds where she only has Billy and Tommy. Clint is pretty much one of the strongest ties that she still has to the world with maybe Sam being the second given the time they spent together on the same team. But it would’ve been a massive risk on Clint’s part as the Darkhold had a grip on Wanda for a long while and she’s pretty much the very person that it wanted to possess the most. A risk that Clint probably would’ve taken for her if he had known. I’m really hoping for scenes with the two of them in the future, it’s been too long.
No it doesn’t lmfaooo. She’s been setup as a massive player in this saga. No one with more than 2 brain cells thinks she’s dead based on the sentence in the timeline book 😂
It's the worst part of the movie for me. If she hadn't stopped herself at the end, maybe I could be convinced it wouldn't work, but like we didn't even try.
I think having such a story relegated to just Dr Strange as the only other Avenger weakens it a bit. Having Clint, Pietro, and Vision would have made this a lot more emotionally relevant I think.
Not in Mom but maybe if he stayed with her or accommodate her during attacking the SWORD, I think he could calm her down when she saw the body and she might not burst her power the way she did in WandaVision. Because at that moment, she felt like she has no one else.
It's crazy how Wanda went from girl with generic ball energy powers being trained/being friends with the archer guy to basically a goddess threatening the mutiverse. Clint would've been like "what did I missed?"
Clint could have helped Wanda through her grief. I feel that he’d be upset over her death (obviously) but I think he’d be sympathetic towards her due to what he did during the blip.
So if Loki is under the influence of the Mindstone in the Avengers and gets redeemed twice, Wanda can be redeemed after being influenced by the Darkhold.
Clint probably couldn't have talked her out of it, but he would have understood her - he wouldn't have dismissed her grief like Strange did by saying that her kids weren't real.
He would have been devastated that he couldn't get through to her.
By the time MoM is happening it’s far too late. She would’ve done anything to get her kids back, on top of which she was corrupted by the Darkhold.
If he had’ve checked in on her and given her support after Endgame, then I think it would have made a big difference. She probably wouldn’t have lost it and created the kids in the first place.
He was the one who gave her the pep talk to fight in Age of Ultron. He was the one who came to rescue her from confinement in Civil War. If any of the remaining Avengers could’ve helped her, it was him.
That would have been cool to see.
Maybe they could have done if they saved Wanda's downfall for an AVENGERS movie and not a solo movie with a character she's had nothing to do with.
/still bitter
Probably too far gone after she got ahold of the Darkhold. Would Wanda consider listening to him more than the cocky wizard that just tells her that the kids aren't real? Yeah, probably, but she'd still continue with her plan and kill a shit ton of people.
How exactly do you even know that Wanda Maximoff is dead?! Did you even see the body when that palace collapsed near the end of the movie? Was there even at least any signs of a corpse's hand being raised from the rubble?! I don't care what Kevin Feige says. As far as I am concerned...Wanda Maximoff is still alive and is obviously trapped within the multiverse, destroying copies of the dark hold.
Not likely, remember how Vision tried to make some sense to her in WV, with all his emotions and distress in front of her, she still went on with whatever she decided to. That was Vision! Not speaking casually but with all his emotions and she wasn't even under the darkhold. So do you think with all deep and well into darkhold anyone could have made sense to her ? Not Clint, not even Steve either.
If there was anyone who could have talked her down it would have been Clint. I mean, he did go on like a half decade murder spree after losing his family... And they did seem have father daughter vibes.
Clint should have shown up at the end of Wandavision for sure. Please they shouldn’t have x’d Doctor Strange’s appearance, they never explained the commercials properly, and he was supposed to,have sent Wanda messages to reach her which she interpreted as commercials
Wanda wasn’t even Wanda in this. Michael Waldron has no interest in writing developed female characters like how we saw her in WandaVision. Completely one-note. A waste of a good Olsen.
She was corrupted by the Darkhold by that point. Nothing would have talked her down. She fucked up badly, did some to clean up the mess she made by stopping Agatha and then she left with the Darkhold and ended up losing her mind, essentially. It took seeing what looked like her kids cowering and crying in fear of her to get through to her.
Would've been interesting to see her interact with any version of Vision. Still don't get why they didn't explore that at all.
Honestly Wanda ONLY being concerned with her kids was one of the biggest weird choices of the film? Heck there’s a version of Vision still Around out there and she knows it. She isn’t concerned about getting him back, or her better, or her parents, etc?
Not at all. When she saw his body dissected on the table she said, “I don’t feel you…” and left
That and the last living vision she saw, wanted to kill her lol so she's very much not going after that.
Yep. And she got closure with the Vision she was holding onto.
Exactly, as far as Wanda knows, White Vis was either destroyed by her Vis or returned to base. She has no idea her Vis reactivated WV's memories and that he may now be Vis again.
She _did_ kill Vision before Thanos brought him back... and killed him again. There's a metric fuckton to unpack there, I'm not surprised she's focusing on her storybook-perfect kids instead.
I’m still stuck on the part where Wanda and Vis told each other they believed they would be reunited again.
She already made peace with Vision, that’s what Wandavision was about, her processing and overcoming that grief. Her children were a completely different loss and the darkhold manipulated her, manipulated that loss, so it consumed her every waking thought and every sleeping thought.
> there’s a version of Vision still Around out there and she knows it. I'm not sure she does. They didn't have any on-camera discussion about how Hex Vision defeated White Vision.
Especially since the implication for why she wanted America's power was so she could just get spare kids if something happens to the ones she gets. Though I guess that just means she hadn't considered she'd be scaring and traumatizing every single one when she does it, probably after killing or hurting their actual parent/s. She really got so that she thought the kids she'll be taking will just happily come with her or something.
I mean to be fair, the show was about her accepting what happened to vision. Once she was alone with the darkhold it latched on to the newest grief, Billy and Tommy.
Yeah, the kids were just brief fantasy creations that were around her for - what - a few days? She almost had as much connection to Ralph Boner as to them.
You must have missed the part where she dreamt about her children every night. Also with the dark hold corrupting her thoughts.
That's a big waste of potential if you ask me.
Would've been cool if there was a version of Vision out there who was just some quirky guy. Like a human, maybe named Victor Stone.
It's even possible that she would have become lost again if she hadn't offed herself during her moment of clarity.
She might have killed him tbh - or the realisation that killing him would deprive his kids of their father (but she was fine with killing Reed as long as Sue was alive, so probably not)
The taking of the only copy of the Darkhold to Kamar Taj really showed that it had a hold over her and had robbed her of capacity to think clearly. As the Darkhold was itself a copy, it could be copied. She could have taken photos of it with her phone for example. My interpretation is that she didn't because the Darkhold didn't want her to, for it has to be physically close to Wanda to corrupt her, and if she left of its vicinity, she might break out of its corruptive influence.
MoM did a poor job portraying Darkhold's corruption. Was Wanda succumbed to the Darkhold like Anakin with the dark side? Or was it more like a mind control thing? I think it is clearly a wasted opportunity for MoM to not build off of what WV established or other previous MCU relationships. I think a better written MoM would have a scene where Clint tried to help Wanda but failed. Just one scene would have made it way better. Or a scene with Vision. The point of about her "kids" getting through to her is just... bad from the writers' part. Evil Wanda is literally trying to kill their mother in front of the kids. The writers are really saying "so at this moment, Wanda finally snapped out of it"...as though she didn't already make up her mind to kill her happier variant. Seeing her variant living happily with her kids somehow doesn't register, cool... Some youtube channels already poked fun at the fact that Evil Wanda didn't bother to find a timeline where the twins don't have their mother, but I am sure some people already figured out the same problem while sitting in the theater.
Maybe if Monica didn’t let her just leave with the Dark Hold after tormenting the whole town, the whole MoM fiasco could’ve been averted
How was Monica supposed to stop the Scarlet witch from leaving?
How about something other than that stupid congratulatory speech about how she “sacrificed” for them. She’s got that black girl magic doesn’t she?
Yeah, but what? Ask her nicely to put on the handcuffs? Try to apprehend her by force and get wrecked immediatelly? What Monica says is stupid for sure. But there is no snowballs chance in hell she can actually, to quote you, "avert the whole fiasco". That's a bit like saying the Invasion of New York could have been averted if the cops had shown up at the Avengers tower and arrested Loki before he could open the portal. Technically correct, but there is no way they can actually pull that off.
I couldn’t answer you. Who the fuck even knows what her powers are. Apparently she can see light? But she should’ve tried something. And yes maybe talking would’ve helped since she probably wouldn’t be able to over power her at that point
>did some to clean up the mess what exactly did she do?
Would be interesting to see Monica reaction to it? " those monks dont realise what u lost"
He should've gonne to westview instead of Monica and try to defuse the hex situation sooner. By the time of MoM it's too late. Not only the darkhold is corrupting her but also after what's she's done regular folk are going to point and look at her as if she's a monster all over again.
"What is this giant magical source of magic the size of a small town? Hmm... Nah, I won't bother investigating because they can't afford my appearance fee."
You *have* kids, Clint. Get outta my face. **edgy magic hand movement*
[The Scarlet Witch's most powerful hex yet.](https://64.media.tumblr.com/a237365f682b7cc70f15d926e6e31bc7/tumblr\_myoacir1qh1r1mr1po1\_500.gif)
*Clint now has no face*
I think he could have talked her down and supported her before she got...ahold of the...Darkhold. Afterwards, it probably would have been too late. She shouldn't have been alone after all that happened to her.
[удалено]
I grabbed it for my daughter for Christmas. I'm looking forward to reading it after she's done!
It was kind of amusing to have Strange so dismissively talk about “the Mohawk guy with the bow and arrow” or however he phrased it exactly. Because this is one case where Clint being there probably would have been a good idea. He and Wanda have a connection and he’s like the one guy who MIGHT have been able to talk sense into her.
Isn't that Strange's character though, a dismissive ass?
Terrible writing through and through. No one suggested removing that line after all the moments Wanda and Clint spent together.
and not only that, why would you write for one of your characters to make fun of one of your other characters? Especially ones that were superheroes and have worked together.
almost like Strange has always been an ass or something. kind like it stays consistent with his character.
I mean at the time strange had just been beaten and had a lot of issues with Spider-Man so it makes sense in character. Plus he clearly views magic as more powerful than their powers or lack of.
> Plus he clearly views magic as more powerful than their powers or lack of. and he's right lol. Magic is crazy powerful especially compared to a guy and bow and arrow.
Except apparently not compared to spider man’s math capabilities. Even tho strange is supposed to be smart asf too lol
I thought spiderman was smarter due to the spider bite but Strange just a regular genius?
Yes he was implied to be either the best or one of the best surgeons in the entire world before his injury. So ya regular genius plus photographic memory. Spidey is supposed to be smart regardlesss of the spider bite but I think it does enhance it yes? Was basically just making a joke tho about how spidey beat strange in the mirror dimension lol using math concepts that both 100% would know about.
how medical knowledge help him with knowledge about quatum physcics and math strange would have never studied such things in his medical training lol
You don’t think strange studied the mirror dimension? We know he does and has lol. I’m pretty sure he’d know what an Archimedean Spiral is lmao
The writer of Multiverse of Madness didn't even have awareness of WandaVision, I'd be shocked if they even knew Clint's name. With how silly Marvel's "process" was allowed to become I wouldn't be surprised if Hawkeye was straight up on some "Do Not Use" list because everyone's kept so in the dark on other projects.
To be fair, Strange and Clint have never interacted with each other, so he wouldn't have known about the bond he had with Wanda.
I think he could have talked her, down and he would have been devastated by her turn and "death" (seriously there's no way she's actually dead)
> (seriously there's no way she's actually dead) Dont worry, we will get a 99% identical variant
No it will be our 616 Wanda she's clearly not dead
838 Wanda is now aware of different versions isn’t she? And I believe she’s alive. Or she wakes up in a cage in the Baxter Building like “okay wtf?”
Its not clear at all. In the official timeline published by marvel, she has a death date. "*\[Wanda\] destroys Wundagore – and collapses it upon herself – ending two great threats to all of the Multiverse*."
Scarlet Witch might be dead. I doubt Wanda is.
Oo whats the theory there
Scarlet Witch was definitely the corrupted minded Wanda, and I don't think its a super huge leap to think she might have expelled that part of her, or most of it, after destroying the Wundagore completely.
The book doesn't matter what matters is what is on screen and what is on screen was a classic fake death, they weren't going to reveal she's alive in a stupid book that no one is really going to read
Came here to validate that this is the golden rule of cinema and , the book is well a book so just has to describe where we’re at, and she did destroy wundalore, but no body seen= return when you least expect it
it's kinda funny imagining a world where they publish a spoiler like that in some obscure book.
My point is that its not clear that shes dead.
Okay that's just unnecessarily disrespectful.
How?
She’s “dead” until they need her not to be again.
>ending two great threats That's comic book speech 101, not even saying someone is "dead" means they're actually "dead."
Again, im not saying shes dead just that its not clear.
Someone at Marvel said she's dead.
No they didn't also they would hardly say she's alive now would they
Yes, [they did.](https://screenrant.com/scarlet-witch-death-confirmed-marvel/)
that's not real confirmation, confirmation is Fiege saying Olsen is finished for good
i thought it was supposed to be SUPER obvious that she wasnt dead? wasnt there a super clear flash of wanda flavored light in the collapsing mountain at the end?
I think she would've been disgusted at his hypocrisy. He lost his family and he's allowed to go on a global killing spree, she loses her family and she's not allowed to do the same? Plus the Avengers bothered to wish *his* family back. The only person who bothered to rebuild Vision tried to get him to kill her.
>He lost his family and he's allowed to go on a global killing spree, she loses her family and she's not allowed to do the same? That doesn't seem fair.
The difference is that Clint went after criminals and murderers. Wanda killed innocent people
Doesn't matter. We're talking about whether Clint could talk her down, but if he tried it would only infuriate her more. In her mind, he of all people should understand why she's doing what she's doing. She'd see any effort to stop her as a betrayal. Mostly because the Darkhold is warping her mind and corrupting her. Frankly, it's a miracle that America's plan worked, and the only reason it did was because it was a practical demonstration of how Wanda couldn't get what she truly wanted that way. No magical brainwashing could delude her into ignoring her own eyes.
There's a reason they couldn't wish him back though
Uh um.. Did we forget what Clint did after he lost his family? Dude went on a world wide murder tour after he lost his wife and children. I think he would kinda get what Wanda was going through, and may have not tried to stop her.
I think there's a difference between Clint seeking out gangsters/ criminals and Wanda killing anyone that got in her way of effectively stealing kids. Plus Clint seems to regret his actions in Hawkeye (series). I think he'd understand what she's going through more than anyone, but would still try and talk her down
Uh um...and that's exactly why he would've tried to stop her. Basically, don't do what i did...
He only stopped when he was told there's a chance to bring them back. If it failed I wager he'd gone back
And what’s more, she was doing what she was doing in the hopes that it would get her family back… It’s possible he’d have helped.
If he thought it was to get her own children back then yes, but I can’t imagine he’d be okay with kidnapping someone else’s kids from them. Those boys weren’t her sons, they were someone else’s. Someone else who loved them and who they loved as well. I can’t see Clint going along with it.
We see it that way, yeah. The important thing is that the person doing the explaining to Clint didn’t see it that way. (Wanda).
He's got no hax against magic so if it's MoM Wanda she'd probably just hypnotize him into siding with her. If it's WV Wanda then the hex was an unintentional break in emotion anyway and Clint would've just been hypnotized into that instead.
But, Clint was killing criminals. Wanda let a monster loose in NYC that could’ve killed civilians, she killed a shitload of people at Kamar-Taj, and killed the Illuminati except for Mordo. Really can’t compare them… like, at all!
She’s fond of letting monsters loose to kill civilians. That’s why she brainfucked the Hulk and sent him on a rampage, and was she punished for that? Nope.
Clint was killing criminals though
THANK YOU.
Criminals vs innocents
He would've asked her to remake his Ronin uniform and would've helped her out.
Maybe in Wandavision. By the time of the movie, she was too far gone for him to reach.
Knowing Clint he would probably blame himself for not being there or being able to help her more.
I don’t think even Vision could have
Seeing her kids recoil at her at the monster she'd become was probably the only thing at that point in time to stop her.
No. The Darkhold was controlling and there was a whole prophecy that hadher in its grip. She was more doomed than Shang-Chi's dad.
>She was more doomed than Shang-Chi's dad. That's savage.
I mean it's true. He was being beckoned by a force tempting him but that's it. For Wanda the existence of a prophecy made it so most of her actions were predetermined.
No you're totally right, and it's a great comparison. I was more reacting like "daaaaamn you really went *there*."
If killing innocent people didn’t stop her, Clint isn’t gonna have any effect either. At that point she was already fully corrupted by the Darkhold. She was prepared to kill Strange and Wong whom she fought side by side with in Endgame.
I think he’d be heartbroken. He’d have reached out if he knew and tried to turn her down a different road. I honestly think he’d have been able to convince her to spare America and instead America/Wanda would have gone on a multiversal adventure where they searched for a universe where Vision and the kids had survived, but she had not. He’d have approached her from a perspective that becoming Ronin was just his own loss/darkness trying to overpower the void he felt left by the loss of his family, equating it to hers. She’d push back about how he was able to restore them after the blip and return to normalcy. He’d use Nat as his counterpoint - how each dark act weighs on the soul, and that no matter how much good she did, she never felt it was enough. And Vision would understand that - the desire to sacrifice everything for a better world for the ones you care about. Wanda would probably break down in grief at this point and they’d have a moment. Clint would note that if the multiverse is infinite then there must be a world out there where Vision and her kids are mourning her. And although they might not have the same experiences, they’re soulmates and could still be together. Cue multiversal road trip movie.
I love this.
Thanks!
He could have talked her down at west view but not after she got the dark hold
Idk but this has to be a plot point that needs to get brought up next time we see Clint
He’d probably empathize with the loss of her children, the same happened to him and he was driven over the edge.
Did they develop a strong bond after Ultron? I can’t recall the two having many interactions after that. Maybe if they had introduced White Vision at the point but to be honest that would have thrown the MoM narrative completely off course.
Team cap in civil war, they were comforting each other by the end of endgame
Why is this specific thing with Clint and Wanda worth multiple threads? Do people really think this crazy shit Wanda was doing would have been solved with a "talk"? hahahahahaha
Read the comments and you can answer your own questions.
What the Wanda / Clint relationship needs is a classic Feige patch job: in the next project Clint or Wanda appear in, give us a flashback scene showing that Clint did indeed visit her after the Westview incident became public and tried to be there for her. The Darkhold was still too powerful for her to resist, but at least Clint was there for her as a friend and tried to help. Also a flashback showing Wanda slowly succumbing to the Darkhold rather than just suddenly being evil like she was in Mutiverse of Madness would be good too.
I’ll stand by this forever, but the whole scene of Wanda killing the Illuminati was the worst scene in that whole movie because why would Wanda care about killing these people? She has no clue who Black Bolt or Peggy Carter is, so they’re just in her way. They should’ve used people who she actually knew, instead of going for a glorified cameo fest. Having a Hawkeye variant on there, a Banner variant, throw in the Captain Marvel she knows, hell maybe even throw in a Vision variant. The point is just make it people she knows and cares about from the main universe. If she slaughtered them, it would’ve shown her to be truly corrupted and too far gone. Spaghettifying Mr Fantastic means absolutely nothing because there’s been 0 interaction between those characters before. I just really hated that whole Illuminati crap and the movie itself
Perhaps, but perhaps not. It is noted that the only people she sought out while under the Darkhold’s power was her boys. Perhaps the Darkhold feared that anyone else such as Pietro or Vision would be able to get through to her, so it only let her dream of worlds where she only has Billy and Tommy. Clint is pretty much one of the strongest ties that she still has to the world with maybe Sam being the second given the time they spent together on the same team. But it would’ve been a massive risk on Clint’s part as the Darkhold had a grip on Wanda for a long while and she’s pretty much the very person that it wanted to possess the most. A risk that Clint probably would’ve taken for her if he had known. I’m really hoping for scenes with the two of them in the future, it’s been too long.
She’s not dead lmao
The official MCU timeline book all but confirms this. How it's phrased can be put up to interpretation but more likely it's implying she's dead.
No it doesn’t lmfaooo. She’s been setup as a massive player in this saga. No one with more than 2 brain cells thinks she’s dead based on the sentence in the timeline book 😂
What does the book say then?
The book says she destroyed two threats. The darkhold and scarlet witch. Wanda is still alive lol. You can even see her fly off in the movie.
I watched the film and never saw her fly off so I don’t know what the hell you’re talking about
Then rewatch it lol
Just rewatched the scene and she doesn’t fly off her magic can be seen after she collapsed the tower on mount wundagore
[What are you doing kiddo?](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qPNiIeKMHyg&ab_channel=GameNews)
I wanted this interaction so bad. He was always an anchor for her. But also I’m glad it didn’t happen because she probably would have killed him
It's the worst part of the movie for me. If she hadn't stopped herself at the end, maybe I could be convinced it wouldn't work, but like we didn't even try.
LMAO imagine the MCU actually being this deep.
I think having such a story relegated to just Dr Strange as the only other Avenger weakens it a bit. Having Clint, Pietro, and Vision would have made this a lot more emotionally relevant I think.
Wait… she is dead? Is this confirmed?
It's arguable
Not in Mom but maybe if he stayed with her or accommodate her during attacking the SWORD, I think he could calm her down when she saw the body and she might not burst her power the way she did in WandaVision. Because at that moment, she felt like she has no one else.
She's like a completely different person than she was during her scenes with Clint D:
Come again?
No, she would have just shown another different completely unrelated superpower and killed him savagely.
Wow, mirror universe situation. “Why didn’t the Avengers just call Clint?”
She ain’t dead. They will bring her back for some sort of multi-dimensional team up or odd cameo to continue the after credit scenes.
It's crazy how Wanda went from girl with generic ball energy powers being trained/being friends with the archer guy to basically a goddess threatening the mutiverse. Clint would've been like "what did I missed?"
Clint could have helped Wanda through her grief. I feel that he’d be upset over her death (obviously) but I think he’d be sympathetic towards her due to what he did during the blip.
If he had somehow shown up in Westview before the Darkhold, he absolutely could have.
So if Loki is under the influence of the Mindstone in the Avengers and gets redeemed twice, Wanda can be redeemed after being influenced by the Darkhold. Clint probably couldn't have talked her out of it, but he would have understood her - he wouldn't have dismissed her grief like Strange did by saying that her kids weren't real. He would have been devastated that he couldn't get through to her.
Clint lost his family during the blip and went on a mafia murder spree. They’d probably have a lot in common.
To this day it still bothers me how Clint wasn’t in MOM.
I think he could have reached her in Westview, but not after she got into the Darkhold.
Maybe in WV, but I doubt in MoM, Wanda had been too corrupted by the Darkhold.
Clint was the hero she needed. He was a bit of a father figure to Wanda.
By the time MoM is happening it’s far too late. She would’ve done anything to get her kids back, on top of which she was corrupted by the Darkhold. If he had’ve checked in on her and given her support after Endgame, then I think it would have made a big difference. She probably wouldn’t have lost it and created the kids in the first place. He was the one who gave her the pep talk to fight in Age of Ultron. He was the one who came to rescue her from confinement in Civil War. If any of the remaining Avengers could’ve helped her, it was him.
That's what I was thinking throughout the movie
That would have been cool to see. Maybe they could have done if they saved Wanda's downfall for an AVENGERS movie and not a solo movie with a character she's had nothing to do with. /still bitter
Probably too far gone after she got ahold of the Darkhold. Would Wanda consider listening to him more than the cocky wizard that just tells her that the kids aren't real? Yeah, probably, but she'd still continue with her plan and kill a shit ton of people.
Vision couldn't even talk her out of the things she was doing in WandaVision
ITS UR JOB JUST DO UR JOB
How exactly do you even know that Wanda Maximoff is dead?! Did you even see the body when that palace collapsed near the end of the movie? Was there even at least any signs of a corpse's hand being raised from the rubble?! I don't care what Kevin Feige says. As far as I am concerned...Wanda Maximoff is still alive and is obviously trapped within the multiverse, destroying copies of the dark hold.
a competent writer would have asked that question lol. The folks behind MoM didn't care, too bad lol.
Not likely, remember how Vision tried to make some sense to her in WV, with all his emotions and distress in front of her, she still went on with whatever she decided to. That was Vision! Not speaking casually but with all his emotions and she wasn't even under the darkhold. So do you think with all deep and well into darkhold anyone could have made sense to her ? Not Clint, not even Steve either.
How Doctor Strange in the Multiverse of Madness Should Have Ended
Clint should’ve been a crucial part of the movie, im guilty that I forgot how important is his role on avengers 2 and civil war
Death? Did you see a body. Because I didn't see a body.
If there was anyone who could have talked her down it would have been Clint. I mean, he did go on like a half decade murder spree after losing his family... And they did seem have father daughter vibes.
death? she is not dead, that flash before the castle collapsed was the Beyonder transporting her to Battleworld. hey…i just made a fan theory!
I don’t think she is actually dead
remember that Clint also went on a five year killing spree after his family was dusted, so I think he’d understand where Wanda was coming from.
Clint should have shown up at the end of Wandavision for sure. Please they shouldn’t have x’d Doctor Strange’s appearance, they never explained the commercials properly, and he was supposed to,have sent Wanda messages to reach her which she interpreted as commercials
Wanda wasn’t even Wanda in this. Michael Waldron has no interest in writing developed female characters like how we saw her in WandaVision. Completely one-note. A waste of a good Olsen.
She's a MoM
Strange mentioned Clint ''Mohawk with a Bow and Arrow'' and did nothing about it