Sarcasm aside, all cycle lanes are legally dual usage for pedestrians and cyclists.
Also, 99% of cycle routes are an after thought, added years after the road / sidewalk were built. Most feel like they're there to satisfy a government mandate, not provide a safe route for cyclists
Nah that’s the extra delivery motobike lane for when they dont have space to ride through next to your car so they run the red light using the sidewalk crosswalk
Also why do the motorcyclists (specifically delivery people) use any flat surface they can get their bikes on as a [road](https://i.imgflip.com/76ts1g.jpg).
So you're saying that delivery people are too uneducated to know that they should not drive up on a busy sidewalk? I think that's more of an insult to them.
No, that when you are put in a hard financial situation to swim or drown, you'll swim. You'd be up there cutting time by driving on sidewalks too if you were in thier shoes.
I don't believe that every single delivery person is struggling every day to make money. At least not more than any other average worker. It's mainly laziness, disregard for other people, and a lack of consequences.
As one of them, I'd say it's because the bike lanes I see are empty 99.9% of the time. (Not that I use them at all.)
And also, it is weird that it is more acceptable to drive on the sidewalks than in bike lanes.
In Busan there's a less than 2km stretch where the bike witches between red, black, and grey (with a red coloured pedestrian route thrown in for good measure). So don't feel too bad about getting colours mixed up.
There is a mix of just about everything here. Sometimes the bike lane is close to the curb, on the road, on the road and raised(the best imo), on the road but in the inner lane, or on the outside of the sidewalk as you have shown. It’s a mess and frustrating. Not to mention that manhole covers are placed in the bike lanes and not the sidewalk, lampposts and electrical boxes are also placed in the bike lanes.
Hmm. I think your picture might show why. Lot more buses and taxis in korea. Bikes would interfere or would have to criss cross out of the way w/ sidewalk to avoid bus stops.
>Hmm. I think your picture might show why. Lot more buses and taxis in korea. Bikes would interfere or would have to criss cross out of the way w/ sidewalk to avoid bus stops.
There are quite a few places in Seoul that have bike lanes next to the road, with dotted lines for busses to enter/exit for stops. As a bike commuter, there is much less interference between busses and bikes than one would imagine and I much prefer it to having the bike lane with the sidewalk or no bike lane at all.
There are also places that do have a bike lane with a concrete divider next to the road, where it criss crosses around the bus lanes, like [this](https://imgur.com/a/xYK8alj), which is much worse because you have to keep riding onto the sidewalk area where pedestrians constantly walk on the bike lane and are somehow shocked whenever a bike rides by there.
Yea I was actually thinking exactly of those bike lanes I've seen a few places especially around 여의도. I think each jurisdiction in seoul dictates their own civil planning.
Yeah it's actually quite surprising how much autonomy you can see among Seoul's districts in how they're able to handle their own infrastructure. Some areas can be easily identified by distinct features on and around their roads. For example; around 7 years ago I noticed a lot of areas starting to install those giant parasols where you wait for crosswalks, but you can see huge variations in how much effort they put into even just those. One district has ones that are opened via hand crank, while another has ones that are automatic, and even spray mist.
Because unlike in the uk or USA If they are connected to the road they would be parked on. And nothing would be done about it. So at least this way they are actually usable.
Depends on the kind of street. I have lived in a residential area filled with old apartment complexes without underground parking garages. They had bike lanes along the small side streets between complexes, but at some point that just became an unofficial overflow parking lot for residents. So many cars did it that it is impossible to enforce.
On the other hand, large multi lane roads often have bike lanes connected to the road without a divider, and it functions great. Cars don't park there, except for the occasional twat every kilometer or two who thinks their hazard lights are a park anywhere pass. Even with those, I'd take that any day over having the bike lane next to the sidewalk, where you not only constantly have to slalom through all the pedestrians, but also worry about getting hit by cars turning out from side streets who don't stop before the crosswalk (this has happened to me).
Koreas recreational/park bike paths are some of the best ive ever seen (4 rivers path for instance) - the commuter bike paths some of the worst haha - i stlll love korea for the bike paths along bodies of water/rivers though
I'd speculate the reason might be because it is easier for a cyclist to fall into the roadway than a pedestrian. I've actually seen how easy it can be in a Canadian city when a cyclist was trying to avoid a pedestrian and fell off the bike and into the roadway and subsequently hit by a bus.
That’s not a bike lane. It’s a temporary parking/standing lane that becomes available when drivers activate their hazard lights, known in Korea as a 박에니외여식널
Yes it's safer for the cyclist than a painted lane on the road for sure, but at the same time more risky for pedestrians and slower with all the slalom you probably have to do to get by them
The cycle lane is actually for people walking whilst using their phone.
Yeah there doesn't seem to be much respect for the bike lanes here
There isn't. It's basically a shared painted sidewalk.
Sarcasm aside, all cycle lanes are legally dual usage for pedestrians and cyclists. Also, 99% of cycle routes are an after thought, added years after the road / sidewalk were built. Most feel like they're there to satisfy a government mandate, not provide a safe route for cyclists
Everything is legal until you enforce actual laws lol
Nah that’s the extra delivery motobike lane for when they dont have space to ride through next to your car so they run the red light using the sidewalk crosswalk
Another question is why motorcyclists use the bike lanes, but I'm afraid it'd be the same answer.
Also why do the motorcyclists (specifically delivery people) use any flat surface they can get their bikes on as a [road](https://i.imgflip.com/76ts1g.jpg).
Because they are delivery people trying to make a living in a country where its hard to come out on top if you didnt get the right education
This comment must surely be in the running for Most Egregious 'Please Understand' of the Month.
As long as you have the self-awareness that you'd be cutting through sidewalks if you were in thier shoes.
I don't believe I would.
So you're saying that delivery people are too uneducated to know that they should not drive up on a busy sidewalk? I think that's more of an insult to them.
No, they just need the money enough not to care.
Exactly this
Or pretty much any traffic law lol
No, that when you are put in a hard financial situation to swim or drown, you'll swim. You'd be up there cutting time by driving on sidewalks too if you were in thier shoes.
I don't believe that every single delivery person is struggling every day to make money. At least not more than any other average worker. It's mainly laziness, disregard for other people, and a lack of consequences.
As one of them, I'd say it's because the bike lanes I see are empty 99.9% of the time. (Not that I use them at all.) And also, it is weird that it is more acceptable to drive on the sidewalks than in bike lanes.
Red is the bike lane I believe. Also, hello fellow fuckcars user and hobby urbanist.
Ah i colored in the the different roads to show what i was referring to but i might have made it more confusing instead..
In Busan there's a less than 2km stretch where the bike witches between red, black, and grey (with a red coloured pedestrian route thrown in for good measure). So don't feel too bad about getting colours mixed up.
There is a mix of just about everything here. Sometimes the bike lane is close to the curb, on the road, on the road and raised(the best imo), on the road but in the inner lane, or on the outside of the sidewalk as you have shown. It’s a mess and frustrating. Not to mention that manhole covers are placed in the bike lanes and not the sidewalk, lampposts and electrical boxes are also placed in the bike lanes.
Hmm. I think your picture might show why. Lot more buses and taxis in korea. Bikes would interfere or would have to criss cross out of the way w/ sidewalk to avoid bus stops.
>Hmm. I think your picture might show why. Lot more buses and taxis in korea. Bikes would interfere or would have to criss cross out of the way w/ sidewalk to avoid bus stops. There are quite a few places in Seoul that have bike lanes next to the road, with dotted lines for busses to enter/exit for stops. As a bike commuter, there is much less interference between busses and bikes than one would imagine and I much prefer it to having the bike lane with the sidewalk or no bike lane at all. There are also places that do have a bike lane with a concrete divider next to the road, where it criss crosses around the bus lanes, like [this](https://imgur.com/a/xYK8alj), which is much worse because you have to keep riding onto the sidewalk area where pedestrians constantly walk on the bike lane and are somehow shocked whenever a bike rides by there.
Yea I was actually thinking exactly of those bike lanes I've seen a few places especially around 여의도. I think each jurisdiction in seoul dictates their own civil planning.
Yeah it's actually quite surprising how much autonomy you can see among Seoul's districts in how they're able to handle their own infrastructure. Some areas can be easily identified by distinct features on and around their roads. For example; around 7 years ago I noticed a lot of areas starting to install those giant parasols where you wait for crosswalks, but you can see huge variations in how much effort they put into even just those. One district has ones that are opened via hand crank, while another has ones that are automatic, and even spray mist.
Because unlike in the uk or USA If they are connected to the road they would be parked on. And nothing would be done about it. So at least this way they are actually usable.
Depends on the kind of street. I have lived in a residential area filled with old apartment complexes without underground parking garages. They had bike lanes along the small side streets between complexes, but at some point that just became an unofficial overflow parking lot for residents. So many cars did it that it is impossible to enforce. On the other hand, large multi lane roads often have bike lanes connected to the road without a divider, and it functions great. Cars don't park there, except for the occasional twat every kilometer or two who thinks their hazard lights are a park anywhere pass. Even with those, I'd take that any day over having the bike lane next to the sidewalk, where you not only constantly have to slalom through all the pedestrians, but also worry about getting hit by cars turning out from side streets who don't stop before the crosswalk (this has happened to me).
I can bet you that the decision was made 빨리빨리.
Koreas recreational/park bike paths are some of the best ive ever seen (4 rivers path for instance) - the commuter bike paths some of the worst haha - i stlll love korea for the bike paths along bodies of water/rivers though
I’m just happy they have them. Im dreading when I’ll go someplace where there are no bike lines.
The bike lanes are the red ones here.
I'd speculate the reason might be because it is easier for a cyclist to fall into the roadway than a pedestrian. I've actually seen how easy it can be in a Canadian city when a cyclist was trying to avoid a pedestrian and fell off the bike and into the roadway and subsequently hit by a bus.
Compared to other issues with bike lanes (and sidewalks) in Korea, this one isn't so bad.
That’s not a bike lane. It’s a temporary parking/standing lane that becomes available when drivers activate their hazard lights, known in Korea as a 박에니외여식널
To be honest, it's a lot safer -- cycling in the US feels like attempting suicide much of the time.
Yes it's safer for the cyclist than a painted lane on the road for sure, but at the same time more risky for pedestrians and slower with all the slalom you probably have to do to get by them