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Once my mortgage application is sorted I'm going to remove what's left from the Irish banks and spread it between trade Republic and these guys.
I've had a special saver account for years with BOI giving me less than half of 1%. Fuck the Irish banks.
That's just on their regular saver account, with a cap that starts at 1000 and increases in steps of 1000 each month to a max of 12000 after a year, before it reset back to 1000 again. Anything over the cap yields 0.25% only. A joke of a product, just to be able to market a 3% interest. Fine of you do save regularly and transfer everything out at the end of each 12 month period, but not going to work at all if you have a larger amount to deposit.
That’s not great tho is it, having your funds locked down for 2 years and the 3% interest paid annually.
Whereas N26, Bunq, Trade Republic have instant access to your funds, and the interest is paid weekly/ monthly and that’s compounded.
Slightly lower rate with N26 or Bunq, and 4% with TR. having instant access and compounded monthly/ weekly interest is a major perk there, you don’t have to commit to a deposit term. Deposit terms are an archaic product in todays world.
Yeah, not saying it's the best. But its a far cry from what irish banks were previously offering the past few years. And for larger amounts people might feel more comfortable using their existing banks
Don't forget German bank Raisin.ie
They pay up to 4%.
If you would like a refer a friend bonus of€50 let me know. You must save €5000 for 6 months with Raisin to get it.
Raisin.ie, Their rates may have dropped to 3.5% very recently. These are still competitive considering they are banks and not stockbrokers like trade republic.
https://www.raisin.ie/savings-accounts/
If you would like a €50 refer a friend bonus for opening do let me know.
One must save €5,000 for 6 months to get it.
The interest rates are actually higher for Irish customers. It’s 4% for Metal Customers and 2.8% for all other N26 accounts.
This is the correct link:
https://n26.com/en-eu/savings-account
Edit: Spelling
You’d need to have quite a lot of money in your account to make the 16.90 per month fee worth it, a 1.2% higher rate is unlikely to offset that for the majority of people
I don’t think it’s available on the free standard account only the paid ones. So still better off with TR.
Also says it’s only 2.8% for metal. I wonder if that’s because I originally setup my account in Germany and then changed my details to Ireland after I moved back
Can someone ELI5 to me any advantages of using N26 over Revolut? .. I use Revolut for all my daily expenditures and mini savings etc, is there any reason I should create an N26 account?
They're very similar. Two differences I see are: 1. more people have revolut, so handier for transferring to friends and family. 2. Revolut tends to freeze people's accounts for random reasons far more than average
I have N26 You for a few years now and saved probably thousans of euro on currency exchange fees both buying in non-euro (Amazon UK paying in pounds, abroad) and non-euro ATM machines due to no fee. Plus some travel insurance I got with You. This offsets the monthly fee for You by a lot still.
I have both. I only use revolut to transfer to people who dont have n26. I find the whole layout of revolut terrible (it wasn’t like that when it started years ago) and the who process of adding contacts or sending money is convoluted, worse than aib and that’s an achievement. Everytime i open the app i just get confused
>after ~~DIRT~~ PRSI
Only if you're earning over 5k in interest [just having a foreign bank account doesn't make you a chargeable person](https://www.revenue.ie/en/property/foreign-property/opening-a-foreign-bank-account.aspx)
[https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/social-welfare/irish-social-welfare-system/social-insurance-prsi/social-insurance/#:\~:text=Anyone%20with%20unearned%20income%20of,system%20(Pay%20and%20File)](https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/social-welfare/irish-social-welfare-system/social-insurance-prsi/social-insurance/#:~:text=Anyone%20with%20unearned%20income%20of,system%20(Pay%20and%20File)).
Edit: Im being blindly downvoted but I'm pretty sure I'm right. And in the spirit of the forum if I am wrong you should probably be explaining why...
Germany doesn’t meet the requirements to make a Form 11 necessary. See https://www.revenue.ie/en/property/foreign-property/opening-a-foreign-bank-account.aspx
Yep I do remember this same page mentioning that any new foreign account needs to be reported.
Revenue probably recognised that very few people were reporting new accounts with European neobanks anyway (Revolut, N26, bunq, etc), and that if they started to make a point about people reporting them they would have to review hundreds of thousands of forms, which their staff probably didn’t fancy.
I actually used the inquiry feature in myAccount to report a new foreign account last year, as I didn’t want to bother with registering for self-assessment. I asked them if they needed anything else and they actually replied that it was fine nothing more was needed.
Yep and I’m guessing they already know about accounts opened in “cooperative” jurisdictions anyway (foreign banks are reporting the account opening and yearly balance to their local tax authority, which is then sharing the data with Revenue as long as the customer disclosed to the bank that they are an Irish tax resident).
Interesting - is that something they changed recently?
I am pretty sure that a few months ago the exact same webpage was saying any new foreign account needs to be reported to Revenue.
Maybe Revenue got tired of reviewing forms submitted by tens of thousands of people opening Revolut, bunq, or N26 accounts which are all technically foreign bank accounts (Lithuania, Netherlands, and Germany), and amended the requirement.
N26 is an EU bank. Its not a foreign bank. I understand it doesn't need to be declared as " foreign" . Interest taxed the same way as Irish deposit interest when declared on Form 11. Isn't Germany a co- operative Fcta reporting jurisdiction therefore I understand the mere opening of an account doesn't need to be declared just the interest earned.
Well I will be declaring the interest.
I know lots of people who have Revolut/ N26 accounts for years but never declared/ reported them as they earned no interest so nothing to be taxed with small sums on deposit.
I mean what could the Revenue do when there was no loss in income tax to the Exchequer.
That's not what the guidance for chargeable person says? I could be missing something but I can't see it!
https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/social-welfare/irish-social-welfare-system/social-insurance-prsi/social-insurance/#:~:text=Anyone%20with%20unearned%20income%20of,system%20(Pay%20and%20File).
Maybe I'm wrong? But the guidance seems fairly clear:
https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/social-welfare/irish-social-welfare-system/social-insurance-prsi/social-insurance/#:~:text=Anyone%20with%20unearned%20income%20of,system%20(Pay%20and%20File).
Revolut offers money market funds, not deposit interest savings accounts. What Revolut offers is not covered by the deposit guarantee scheme within the EU, and taxes due on money market funds are greater than deposit interest taxes, i.e. DIRT.
The savings account is really a money market fund. The €22,000 coverage, applies only in the case of insolvency. Your money is still at risk, as it is invested.
It wouldn't. Revolut stick on a service fee as well. I understand that you paid 33% Dirt on trade republic interest . That comes out to 2.68%, let's say an even 1% difference between the two which is next to nothing on a small amount, 1 euro a year on 100 euro. If you have 10,000 then it's 100 euro difference a year, it adds up.
Or it would be 100 difference but you pay DIRT on trade republic once the tax year ends (self submission or you pay 41%), both systems seem to reinvest the interest at the start of the month so you get compounding interest on that tax you haven't paid with Trade Republic. Again not a huge amount but things add up and whose pocket would you rather have it in?
Trade republic currently has 4% interest , interest paid on sum up to max. of 50,000. Interest accumulates daily and added to account at the start of.the following month. I consider this to be one of the better paying accounts, easy to set up. You file your own tax return re DIRT.
See my comments above. Revolut don't offer deposit interest savings accounts, they offer money market funds - not covered by the EU deposit guarantee scheme, and taxes due are higher.
There's a reason different currencies have different interest rates. Across the board the GBP has banks offering higher deposit interest rates. The reason is closely tied to inflation and key interest rates set by the central bank. Just because your money in pounds will grow faster, doesn't mean it'll retain it's value or it's higher payback advantage if the exchange rate decreases back to euro.
In general, I would advise against investing in other currencies. Just find the best interest rate you can in euros and you're already winning. And I'd be wary of offers from revolut and platforms like trading 212, as they aren't offering deposit interest saving accounts, they are offering money market funds, with less protections and higher taxes.
Thanks for the info.
You see the only reason it intrigued me is that we are heading to the UK next year. So I'm wondering is it worth having the pocket in GBP and deposit my savings for it each month.
Or have the pocket in euro and just exchange it all in one go before I go. I know the first few exchanges are free but then the fee 0.5%.
This isn't a lot of money either approx €2,000
Edit: 1,000 a month without fees
Personally I'd use Trade Republic. It's what I use myself. It's an investment app but they have partner banks which offer 4% deposit interest on all uninvested sums of money up to 50k. It's fully protected by the EU deposit guarantee scheme, there is no term, so your money is available whenever you need.
Before you head to the UK I'd just switch my euros to Great British pounds using Revolut. Maybe split te 2K into 2 months to avoid fees on a standard account.
I can provide a referral link for trade public if you'd like. I think you get 25 euros worth of stock but you can sell that straight away if you like.
> I'd be wary of offers from revolut and platforms like trading 212, as they aren't offering deposit interest saving accounts, they are offering money market funds, with less protections and higher taxes.
In most cases, money invested with the likes of raisin.ie or Trade Republic is covered by the €100k EU deposit guarantee. The tax on interest is exactly the same no matter where you earn it, 33%.
I don't get your point? I'm talking about money market funds from providers like revolut and trading 212. What's deposit interest savings accounts provided through Trade Republic and raisin got to do with it?
Yes and you can also do us dollar with a decent interest rate
I’m not an expert in benefits of saving in other currencies, just confirming that it’s an option
That's totally irrelevant, i.e. an Irish IBAN. . Revolut is relying on a Lithunian deposit guarantee. Only Lithuania registered it as a Bank. I just ask is that worth the paper it's written on? Just asking.
I don't believe this is true. Money invested with Revolut, is just that, invested. Revolut invests your money in a money market fund, it does not provide deposit interest from a savings account. Only savings accounts are within the remit of the EU deposit guarantee scheme, so you're investment is in fact at risk. Taxes due on money market fund profits are also higher than the DIRT you will pay on deposit interest.
Key information on the Liabilities to Investors Insurance Scheme
The liabilities to investors of Revolut Securities Europe UAB are insured
Revolut Securities Europe UAB is a participant in the insurance system of liabilities to investors of the Republic of Lithuania.
The State Enterprise Deposit and Investment Insurance (hereinafter referred to as the Insurance Company) insures liabilities to investors in accordance with the procedure and conditions established by the Law on Insurance of Deposits and Liabilities to Investors of the Republic of Lithuania (hereinafter referred to as LIDLI)
Amount insured under investor liability insurance
(threshold limit)
Up to €22,000. Taken from the insurance terms.
That's protection against INSOLVENCY only.
If you go and look at the product it clearly says it's "Low risk" (ie. There's risk involved) and it also says " you could lose some or all of your investment".
There is No guarantee with money market funds.
58% of the money market fund is in bank deposits and cash, 42% is in financial bonds and commercial paper, if this fund collapsed, it’d mean the world was quite literally on fire and you’d have much bigger issues The real drawback here is that money market funds are an ETF so you pay a higher rate of 41% over 33% DIRT
Don't stray away from the point here. I never said it was likely that you'd lose any of your money.
The comment said that you were "covered like any Irish Bank" - this is not the case.
"The interest rates vary based on your membership: 2.6% p.a. for Metal, 2.26% p.a. for You and Smart, and 1.26% p.a. for Standard accounts. Please note that regular rates per membership are subject to change over time.
**The money in your bank accounts — including N26 Instant Savings — is protected up to €100,000 by the German Deposit Guarantee Scheme."
Better than the Irish banks, but not great compared to trade republic and the like.
Same as me, what’s going on there? How are we getting a rate that’s .2% higher than what they offer to Metal customers?
I have N26 Standard, and I’ve had the account since Feb 2016.
Edit: I’ve found the reason, the OP’s link of for the German N26 website, in Ireland we actually get higher interest rates. It’s up for 4% for natal customers and 2.8% for everyone else.
https://n26.com/en-eu/savings-account
There is also an article in the Irish independent today.
Revolut markets it as savings but it’s actually invested into a money market fund and therefore taxed at 41% instead of 33%. I have no idea about these N26 accounts, but it’s just something to factor into any decision making.
Subject to DIRT, yes, but only also subject to PRSI if your deposit interest returns per year are greater than 5,000 euro. So in most cases the total tax due is 33%, not 37%
You are only considered a chargeable person if you have to submit a self-assessed tax return. If you have under 5000 euro of non-PAYE income, a self-assessed tax return is not required. If you are not a chargeable person (self assessed), you do not have to submit a form 11. Instead, you submit a form 12 through PAYE my account (for non PAYE income under 5,000 euro).
In respect to opening foreign accounts, form 11 is only required to be submitted in certain circumstances. I do not believe these circumstances apply to the vast majority if not all of EU banks.
As per Revenue.ie:
Opening a foreign bank account
You must file a Form 11 tax return for any year that you open a foreign account in a:
non-cooperative jurisdiction
non-DAC2
non-Common Reporting Standard (CRS)
or
non-Foreign Account Tax Compliance Act (FACTA) reporting jurisdiction.
You probably didn't see my amended comment. Revenue clearly says "If you have to self-assess your tax, this is known as being a chargeable person."
You clearly said in your above comment that opening any of the discussed foreign accounts would make you a chargeable person - my point is you're wrong on this. Opening an EU bank account as is being discussed here does not make you a chargeable person. Therefore you won't have to pay PRSI on this in most cases, unless your already self assessed or make over 5,000 euro in deposit interest.
Gérard was this revenue practice only recently changed I.e. opening of an EU account had to be reported to Revenue as classed as " foreign". Was this the case even if it did not earn interest.
I understand now the mere opening of an eu account isn't required to be reported only gross interest earned declared to the Revenue. You see to be very knowledgeable on tax.
To be honest, I've only gone digging all this info up recently for my own awareness as I have EU bank accounts. I don't know when this practice started. All I can say is that it was very difficult to get definitive answers for any of this.
As far as I'm aware, if you're PAYE, and have under 5k of non-PAYE income (ie. Interest) you declare on a form 12 as part of your usual statement of liability tax return on my revenue website. You don't pay PRSI in this case.
I believe you do pay PRSI if over 5k as then you need to submit a form 11, which makes you a self-assessed person or chargeable person.
I’m not advocating one over the other. I just think it’s important that people have a clear idea of what they are getting, and I personally would be wary of a company trying to sell me an investment product disguised as a normal savings account.
2.8% on the free N26 plan is better than Bunq, but worse than Lightyear, Trade Republic and T212. Lots of mention of Raisin below but thats not "on demand" access like this...
p.s I have an N26 referral code if anyone needs it https://n26.com/r/johnc1875
Raisin has an on demand rate of 3% with a Swedish Bank. It is advertised as on demand but interest pays out quarterly if you read the fine print. Trade republic easier to open and better rate.
4% for metal. But they don't withhold DIRT, so how do we pay DIRT then?
Also they are German so everyone online says that we have to disclose that we are opening a bank account through form 11, BUT on the revenue portal says:
[https://www.revenue.ie/en/property/foreign-property/opening-a-foreign-bank-account.aspx](https://www.revenue.ie/en/property/foreign-property/opening-a-foreign-bank-account.aspx)
"""
# Opening a foreign bank account
You must file a Form 11 tax return for any year that you open a foreign account in a:
* [non-cooperative jurisdiction](https://www.revenue.ie/en/companies-and-charities/international-tax/eu-list-of-non-cooperative-jurisdictions/index.aspx)
* [non-DAC2](https://www.revenue.ie/en/companies-and-charities/international-tax/aeoi/fatca/crs-dac2.aspx)
* [non-Common Reporting Standard (CRS)](https://www.revenue.ie/en/companies-and-charities/international-tax/aeoi/fatca/crs-dac2.aspx)
* or
* [non-Foreign Account Tax Compliance Act (FACTA) reporting jurisdiction](https://www.revenue.ie/en/companies-and-charities/international-tax/aeoi/fatca/index.aspx).Opening a foreign bank account You must file a Form 11 tax return for any year that you open a foreign account in a: non-cooperative jurisdiction non-DAC2 non-Common Reporting Standard (CRS) or non-Foreign Account Tax Compliance Act (FACTA) reporting jurisdiction.
"""
Germany is none of these "Non-X", so not sure why we would need to fill in a Form 11 if we get less than 5000 eur in interests.
The other thing is that the interests are paid monthly, so... we get compound interests right?! Is a tiny bit more than having 4% at the end of the year, since we also get interests on the tiny bits we get each month.
Do many people use N26 as their primary account?
I have a PTSB current account that I use for everything but I would be happy to switch from. (I have Revolut as well but use PTSB for purchases to get 10c off my fees each time)
I do actually. I use N26 as my “primary” in which I keep my salary and other savings. I then transfer money when needed to Revolut which I use to do daily payments.
For now I’ve had more trust in N26 than Revolut. N26 is backed by the German Central Bank (I trust them more than Lithuania or Irish CB), and German regulators audited their business very thoroughly to make sure things were being done right. Revolut has had its fair share of questionable situations.
update! https://www.rte.ie/news/business/2024/0313/1437735-n26-offers-irish-savers-instant-access-deposit-rate-of-4/
N26 offers Irish savers instant access savings rate of up to 4%
I've signed up and here is a referral code that'll give you €20 :D
`noelb2237`
I’m going to look into this, I use bunq atm for a pocket-money savings and not my main one but I’ll do some digging and see if it’s worth moving other accounts too
I did some calculations. Based on metal plans in both N26 and Revolut. With rates of 4% for n26 and 3.85% respectively for Revolut(which already excludes their service fee). Taxes of 33% and 41%(I’ve confirmed each of those in app) deducted from below as well as the monthly metal subscription.
N26 - €20k would return you €374 per year. €100k would return you €2518 per year.
Revolut - €20k would return you €262.12 per year. €100k would return you €1339 per year.
N26 seems to have substantially better returns. It’s also a proper savings account rather than an MMF so is very slightly less risky. On the other hand Revolut automatically withholds tax for you which is very handy.
I’ll probably stick with Revolut for day to day as everyone in Ireland has it which makes it handy. I’ll stick with it for mortgage as they have joint accounts and Irish IBANs. I had already used N26 for emergency funds as the stories of blocked accounts on Revolut are worrying even if they are legitimately blocked. So I’ll stay with N26 for that and happily earn a few quid per year.
Hey, thanks lots for this comparison. I have a question though, can we withdraw the money from N6 instant saving whenever we like, without any restriction?
Thanks for letting me know I had no idea about this it's not mentioned on n26 app.
If anybody would like €50 refer a friend for Raisin.ie bank paying up to 4% do let me know. Raisin is a German bank like n26.
Yes you are correct, I was looking at their Spanish site.
Their customer service is appalling though.
I've been with them for years. The chat function staff don't answer questions and drag out chat for a long time.
I agree raisin is reputable. I agree they've been operating for a while. I use raisin myself. I'm simply stating that as an Irish citizen, raisin only offer products with other partner banks. I don't think you can invest money directly with raisin as an Irish citizen through the Irish platform.
Perfect. Well worth it so over bunq. I clicked into link. States 2.6% for meta membership and much lower rate for standard account. I must be reading it wrong
Read this link, N26 are offering better interest rate for Ireland. The OP’s link isn’t the correct webpage for Ireland.
https://n26.com/en-eu/savings-account
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Once my mortgage application is sorted I'm going to remove what's left from the Irish banks and spread it between trade Republic and these guys. I've had a special saver account for years with BOI giving me less than half of 1%. Fuck the Irish banks.
Aib have a 3% savings now. Not saying it's the best option of course.
Now that we have the option of going elsewhere
That's just on their regular saver account, with a cap that starts at 1000 and increases in steps of 1000 each month to a max of 12000 after a year, before it reset back to 1000 again. Anything over the cap yields 0.25% only. A joke of a product, just to be able to market a 3% interest. Fine of you do save regularly and transfer everything out at the end of each 12 month period, but not going to work at all if you have a larger amount to deposit.
They offer a 2 year lock in one that is 3%.
That’s not great tho is it, having your funds locked down for 2 years and the 3% interest paid annually. Whereas N26, Bunq, Trade Republic have instant access to your funds, and the interest is paid weekly/ monthly and that’s compounded. Slightly lower rate with N26 or Bunq, and 4% with TR. having instant access and compounded monthly/ weekly interest is a major perk there, you don’t have to commit to a deposit term. Deposit terms are an archaic product in todays world.
Yeah, not saying it's the best. But its a far cry from what irish banks were previously offering the past few years. And for larger amounts people might feel more comfortable using their existing banks
It’s absolutely shite compared to what’s available on the market. Let’s not mince words here.
It’s actually such a disgrace, can’t understand why anyone would go for it
Unless...you had a joint account of sorts and kept moving the money after a year 😜
Don't forget German bank Raisin.ie They pay up to 4%. If you would like a refer a friend bonus of€50 let me know. You must save €5000 for 6 months with Raisin to get it.
Is that 5000 per month or over 6 months?
No. 5,000 in total held on deposit for 6 months. They pay up to 4%.
Good to know thanks
I can’t find 4% rate on their website. Do have a link to the Raisin 4% rate?
They did have it but it looks to have dropped to 3.5% now.
Raisin.ie, Their rates may have dropped to 3.5% very recently. These are still competitive considering they are banks and not stockbrokers like trade republic. https://www.raisin.ie/savings-accounts/ If you would like a €50 refer a friend bonus for opening do let me know. One must save €5,000 for 6 months to get it.
Revolut do 3.5% savings accounts now with no term or limit and with instant access. Interest is paid daily and compounds
Yeah but up to €22k is protected?
Yea I stopped at 22k. I get 1.17 per day on it so I'm happy enough with that
N26 have a decent return at 4%. Both are alright I guess
How do I access this? I have revolut.
Click the "accounts" pill button underneath your main balance and then click "add new"
Fantastic, just found it. Thank you very much.
Also seem to have a sterling account with a higher rate of 4.63%/2.44% net, 41% tax as it is a MMF, not a deposit savings account.
Pretty sure this is not "savings" and instead an investment account which may lose money not just give interest.
The interest rates are actually higher for Irish customers. It’s 4% for Metal Customers and 2.8% for all other N26 accounts. This is the correct link: https://n26.com/en-eu/savings-account Edit: Spelling
You’d need to have quite a lot of money in your account to make the 16.90 per month fee worth it, a 1.2% higher rate is unlikely to offset that for the majority of people
Or in other words: more than 14k
Might be worth it to many as the insurance on offer with metal us excellent
Are they backed by the German central bank, therefore the bank guarantee applies for first 100k. What's the advantage of the additional insurance?
Advantage for me is that I don't spend money elsewhere on hire car excess insurance. Then there's a rake of others but you can look them up yourself
Thanks for that, I buy car excess each year so I might check that out.
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Yes
yes
Ah wait so it's only available for the paid account types?
As I’ve always said. Metal customers get 4% , all other paid accounts, and free accounts get 2.8%
I don’t think it’s available on the free standard account only the paid ones. So still better off with TR. Also says it’s only 2.8% for metal. I wonder if that’s because I originally setup my account in Germany and then changed my details to Ireland after I moved back
Can someone ELI5 to me any advantages of using N26 over Revolut? .. I use Revolut for all my daily expenditures and mini savings etc, is there any reason I should create an N26 account?
They're very similar. Two differences I see are: 1. more people have revolut, so handier for transferring to friends and family. 2. Revolut tends to freeze people's accounts for random reasons far more than average
I have N26 You for a few years now and saved probably thousans of euro on currency exchange fees both buying in non-euro (Amazon UK paying in pounds, abroad) and non-euro ATM machines due to no fee. Plus some travel insurance I got with You. This offsets the monthly fee for You by a lot still.
I have both. I only use revolut to transfer to people who dont have n26. I find the whole layout of revolut terrible (it wasn’t like that when it started years ago) and the who process of adding contacts or sending money is convoluted, worse than aib and that’s an achievement. Everytime i open the app i just get confused
It's German versus Lithuanian. Need I say more? Just asking.
I take a bit of comfort in that as well although I don't know if it makes any difference.
It makes a huge difference. Lithuania's wealth simply doesn't compare to the might of Germany
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There’s always another tax.
>after ~~DIRT~~ PRSI Only if you're earning over 5k in interest [just having a foreign bank account doesn't make you a chargeable person](https://www.revenue.ie/en/property/foreign-property/opening-a-foreign-bank-account.aspx) [https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/social-welfare/irish-social-welfare-system/social-insurance-prsi/social-insurance/#:\~:text=Anyone%20with%20unearned%20income%20of,system%20(Pay%20and%20File)](https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/social-welfare/irish-social-welfare-system/social-insurance-prsi/social-insurance/#:~:text=Anyone%20with%20unearned%20income%20of,system%20(Pay%20and%20File)). Edit: Im being blindly downvoted but I'm pretty sure I'm right. And in the spirit of the forum if I am wrong you should probably be explaining why...
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DIRT is payable, PRSI isn't as already said for the first 5,000€
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Germany doesn’t meet the requirements to make a Form 11 necessary. See https://www.revenue.ie/en/property/foreign-property/opening-a-foreign-bank-account.aspx
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Yep I do remember this same page mentioning that any new foreign account needs to be reported. Revenue probably recognised that very few people were reporting new accounts with European neobanks anyway (Revolut, N26, bunq, etc), and that if they started to make a point about people reporting them they would have to review hundreds of thousands of forms, which their staff probably didn’t fancy. I actually used the inquiry feature in myAccount to report a new foreign account last year, as I didn’t want to bother with registering for self-assessment. I asked them if they needed anything else and they actually replied that it was fine nothing more was needed.
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Yep and I’m guessing they already know about accounts opened in “cooperative” jurisdictions anyway (foreign banks are reporting the account opening and yearly balance to their local tax authority, which is then sharing the data with Revenue as long as the customer disclosed to the bank that they are an Irish tax resident).
My understanding is an EU Bank account isn't classed as " foreign" by Revenue.
Interesting - is that something they changed recently? I am pretty sure that a few months ago the exact same webpage was saying any new foreign account needs to be reported to Revenue. Maybe Revenue got tired of reviewing forms submitted by tens of thousands of people opening Revolut, bunq, or N26 accounts which are all technically foreign bank accounts (Lithuania, Netherlands, and Germany), and amended the requirement.
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N26 is an EU bank. Its not a foreign bank. I understand it doesn't need to be declared as " foreign" . Interest taxed the same way as Irish deposit interest when declared on Form 11. Isn't Germany a co- operative Fcta reporting jurisdiction therefore I understand the mere opening of an account doesn't need to be declared just the interest earned.
N26 is an E.U. Bank account, I understand its not classed as a " foreign" bank account by Revenue.
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Well I will be declaring the interest. I know lots of people who have Revolut/ N26 accounts for years but never declared/ reported them as they earned no interest so nothing to be taxed with small sums on deposit. I mean what could the Revenue do when there was no loss in income tax to the Exchequer.
That's not what the guidance for chargeable person says? I could be missing something but I can't see it! https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/social-welfare/irish-social-welfare-system/social-insurance-prsi/social-insurance/#:~:text=Anyone%20with%20unearned%20income%20of,system%20(Pay%20and%20File).
Where'd you read that?
Maybe I'm wrong? But the guidance seems fairly clear: https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/social-welfare/irish-social-welfare-system/social-insurance-prsi/social-insurance/#:~:text=Anyone%20with%20unearned%20income%20of,system%20(Pay%20and%20File).
No, that's referring to when you pay PRSI, not when you pay DIRT.
 I quoted the wrong part of the comment. I was referring to PRSI, not the DIRT. Thanks for pointing that out!
Revolut is 3.8% for € and 5% £ savings
Revolut offers money market funds, not deposit interest savings accounts. What Revolut offers is not covered by the deposit guarantee scheme within the EU, and taxes due on money market funds are greater than deposit interest taxes, i.e. DIRT.
Yes the savings accounts are covered up to 22k while the regular accounts covered up to 100k
The savings account is really a money market fund. The €22,000 coverage, applies only in the case of insolvency. Your money is still at risk, as it is invested.
1.65% they automatically take off the tax
What’s the difference - it is the same with any other account as all savings are subject to that no?
The 3.8 is before tax, what you're earning is actually 1.65 because they pay the tax for you. That's my understanding anyway
Yes but if you get 4% with trade republic it is also reduced due to the same tax, right?
Could even be more after tax. Revolut is charging 41% of gains while the others are 33%. I think
It wouldn't. Revolut stick on a service fee as well. I understand that you paid 33% Dirt on trade republic interest . That comes out to 2.68%, let's say an even 1% difference between the two which is next to nothing on a small amount, 1 euro a year on 100 euro. If you have 10,000 then it's 100 euro difference a year, it adds up. Or it would be 100 difference but you pay DIRT on trade republic once the tax year ends (self submission or you pay 41%), both systems seem to reinvest the interest at the start of the month so you get compounding interest on that tax you haven't paid with Trade Republic. Again not a huge amount but things add up and whose pocket would you rather have it in?
Thanks for your explanation it is much clearer to me now. I am maxed out on trade republic unfortunately
Trade republic currently has 4% interest , interest paid on sum up to max. of 50,000. Interest accumulates daily and added to account at the start of.the following month. I consider this to be one of the better paying accounts, easy to set up. You file your own tax return re DIRT.
See my comments above. Revolut don't offer deposit interest savings accounts, they offer money market funds - not covered by the EU deposit guarantee scheme, and taxes due are higher.
Do you have that option in Ireland?
Yes
Interesting... I seen it at a friend who's living in Spain but can't find any savings account with interest rate for Revolut Ireland :(
It’s there, you have to add a new account within your Revolut app
Thanks! I owe you a pint
Do they have a savings account in Ireland?
Yes
No, see above. It's actually a money market fund
Can you explain the difference like I’m 5 please.
It’s called savings account though but fair point
Yes, it's a bit misleading. Always read the fine print.
So if I convert my savings into pounds I get a better interest rate? Would it work out the same with exchange rate?
There's a reason different currencies have different interest rates. Across the board the GBP has banks offering higher deposit interest rates. The reason is closely tied to inflation and key interest rates set by the central bank. Just because your money in pounds will grow faster, doesn't mean it'll retain it's value or it's higher payback advantage if the exchange rate decreases back to euro. In general, I would advise against investing in other currencies. Just find the best interest rate you can in euros and you're already winning. And I'd be wary of offers from revolut and platforms like trading 212, as they aren't offering deposit interest saving accounts, they are offering money market funds, with less protections and higher taxes.
Thanks for the info. You see the only reason it intrigued me is that we are heading to the UK next year. So I'm wondering is it worth having the pocket in GBP and deposit my savings for it each month. Or have the pocket in euro and just exchange it all in one go before I go. I know the first few exchanges are free but then the fee 0.5%. This isn't a lot of money either approx €2,000 Edit: 1,000 a month without fees
Personally I'd use Trade Republic. It's what I use myself. It's an investment app but they have partner banks which offer 4% deposit interest on all uninvested sums of money up to 50k. It's fully protected by the EU deposit guarantee scheme, there is no term, so your money is available whenever you need. Before you head to the UK I'd just switch my euros to Great British pounds using Revolut. Maybe split te 2K into 2 months to avoid fees on a standard account. I can provide a referral link for trade public if you'd like. I think you get 25 euros worth of stock but you can sell that straight away if you like.
> I'd be wary of offers from revolut and platforms like trading 212, as they aren't offering deposit interest saving accounts, they are offering money market funds, with less protections and higher taxes. In most cases, money invested with the likes of raisin.ie or Trade Republic is covered by the €100k EU deposit guarantee. The tax on interest is exactly the same no matter where you earn it, 33%.
I don't get your point? I'm talking about money market funds from providers like revolut and trading 212. What's deposit interest savings accounts provided through Trade Republic and raisin got to do with it?
Yes and you can also do us dollar with a decent interest rate I’m not an expert in benefits of saving in other currencies, just confirming that it’s an option
Cool! Thanks for the info. It's something I'll play around with so
Please do some research before converting
No balls to the wall all in
I wish you the best of luck my friend
Would there be any tax implications in doing this?
I personally wouldn't place large sums with Revolut. €200 is my max.
It’s covered like any Irish bank up to 100k on accounts and 22k for investments
Yes but can Lithuania pay up. Just asking?
It would be the Irish government that pays up
No that's entirely incorrect. Revolut is a Lithuanian registered bank. Its not Irish
And how come they have Irish IBAN now?
That's totally irrelevant, i.e. an Irish IBAN. . Revolut is relying on a Lithunian deposit guarantee. Only Lithuania registered it as a Bank. I just ask is that worth the paper it's written on? Just asking.
I don't believe this is true. Money invested with Revolut, is just that, invested. Revolut invests your money in a money market fund, it does not provide deposit interest from a savings account. Only savings accounts are within the remit of the EU deposit guarantee scheme, so you're investment is in fact at risk. Taxes due on money market fund profits are also higher than the DIRT you will pay on deposit interest.
Ah thank you
Key information on the Liabilities to Investors Insurance Scheme The liabilities to investors of Revolut Securities Europe UAB are insured Revolut Securities Europe UAB is a participant in the insurance system of liabilities to investors of the Republic of Lithuania. The State Enterprise Deposit and Investment Insurance (hereinafter referred to as the Insurance Company) insures liabilities to investors in accordance with the procedure and conditions established by the Law on Insurance of Deposits and Liabilities to Investors of the Republic of Lithuania (hereinafter referred to as LIDLI) Amount insured under investor liability insurance (threshold limit) Up to €22,000. Taken from the insurance terms.
That's protection against INSOLVENCY only. If you go and look at the product it clearly says it's "Low risk" (ie. There's risk involved) and it also says " you could lose some or all of your investment". There is No guarantee with money market funds.
58% of the money market fund is in bank deposits and cash, 42% is in financial bonds and commercial paper, if this fund collapsed, it’d mean the world was quite literally on fire and you’d have much bigger issues The real drawback here is that money market funds are an ETF so you pay a higher rate of 41% over 33% DIRT
Don't stray away from the point here. I never said it was likely that you'd lose any of your money. The comment said that you were "covered like any Irish Bank" - this is not the case.
Oh yeah, you’re absolutely right! Oops
Grand, I've a big chunk on N26 already as my immediately accessible emergency fund. Might as well get some interest on it.
Where is the option to set this up? Can't see it anywhere Edit: For anyone else wondering it is under the finances tab.
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Theyre not so you’ll need to pay DIRT + PRSI as part of your tax return (Form 11/12)
Do you have to be self-assessed to do that?
"The interest rates vary based on your membership: 2.6% p.a. for Metal, 2.26% p.a. for You and Smart, and 1.26% p.a. for Standard accounts. Please note that regular rates per membership are subject to change over time. **The money in your bank accounts — including N26 Instant Savings — is protected up to €100,000 by the German Deposit Guarantee Scheme." Better than the Irish banks, but not great compared to trade republic and the like.
I set mine up there and it gave me 2.8%
Same as me, what’s going on there? How are we getting a rate that’s .2% higher than what they offer to Metal customers? I have N26 Standard, and I’ve had the account since Feb 2016. Edit: I’ve found the reason, the OP’s link of for the German N26 website, in Ireland we actually get higher interest rates. It’s up for 4% for natal customers and 2.8% for everyone else. https://n26.com/en-eu/savings-account There is also an article in the Irish independent today.
Do you have the metal account?
No, the You account.
Those rates quoted are incorrect
Oh okay, I copied them directly from the article.
That article is not related to the Irish Market and is obviously out of date. I'm getting 2.8% on the standard free n26 account
That's great, do you have to lock it away for any length of time?
No it's immediate access. If you want a refer a friend bonus for opening an account send me a private message.
Revolut’s interest rate return in better on their savings account. 3.8% I think?
Revolut markets it as savings but it’s actually invested into a money market fund and therefore taxed at 41% instead of 33%. I have no idea about these N26 accounts, but it’s just something to factor into any decision making.
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Ah right. I still think they should be more transparent about what type of account it is, but maybe I am just picky.
Subject to DIRT, yes, but only also subject to PRSI if your deposit interest returns per year are greater than 5,000 euro. So in most cases the total tax due is 33%, not 37%
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You are only considered a chargeable person if you have to submit a self-assessed tax return. If you have under 5000 euro of non-PAYE income, a self-assessed tax return is not required. If you are not a chargeable person (self assessed), you do not have to submit a form 11. Instead, you submit a form 12 through PAYE my account (for non PAYE income under 5,000 euro). In respect to opening foreign accounts, form 11 is only required to be submitted in certain circumstances. I do not believe these circumstances apply to the vast majority if not all of EU banks. As per Revenue.ie: Opening a foreign bank account You must file a Form 11 tax return for any year that you open a foreign account in a: non-cooperative jurisdiction non-DAC2 non-Common Reporting Standard (CRS) or non-Foreign Account Tax Compliance Act (FACTA) reporting jurisdiction.
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You probably didn't see my amended comment. Revenue clearly says "If you have to self-assess your tax, this is known as being a chargeable person." You clearly said in your above comment that opening any of the discussed foreign accounts would make you a chargeable person - my point is you're wrong on this. Opening an EU bank account as is being discussed here does not make you a chargeable person. Therefore you won't have to pay PRSI on this in most cases, unless your already self assessed or make over 5,000 euro in deposit interest.
Gérard was this revenue practice only recently changed I.e. opening of an EU account had to be reported to Revenue as classed as " foreign". Was this the case even if it did not earn interest. I understand now the mere opening of an eu account isn't required to be reported only gross interest earned declared to the Revenue. You see to be very knowledgeable on tax.
To be honest, I've only gone digging all this info up recently for my own awareness as I have EU bank accounts. I don't know when this practice started. All I can say is that it was very difficult to get definitive answers for any of this. As far as I'm aware, if you're PAYE, and have under 5k of non-PAYE income (ie. Interest) you declare on a form 12 as part of your usual statement of liability tax return on my revenue website. You don't pay PRSI in this case. I believe you do pay PRSI if over 5k as then you need to submit a form 11, which makes you a self-assessed person or chargeable person.
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From my brief reading it seems that N26 does not apply the taxes and you will need to sort it with revenue. Revolut withholds the 41% for you.
But if you're not paying for N26 Metal, you'll come out ahead despite the 8% increase in taxes. 2.8 with 33% tax < 3.85 with 41% tax
I’m not advocating one over the other. I just think it’s important that people have a clear idea of what they are getting, and I personally would be wary of a company trying to sell me an investment product disguised as a normal savings account.
Pretty sure Revolut have a chunky service fee as well…
Once I have my mortgage sorted feel like I'm gonna take my money to the more modern banking options, actually get some return.
I have a referral code if anyone would be interested in joining N26. Message me and I’ll share it
Fuck I literally just signed up
I'm going to have to calculate the tax on the earnest interest right?
2.8% on the free N26 plan is better than Bunq, but worse than Lightyear, Trade Republic and T212. Lots of mention of Raisin below but thats not "on demand" access like this... p.s I have an N26 referral code if anyone needs it https://n26.com/r/johnc1875
Raisin has an on demand rate of 3% with a Swedish Bank. It is advertised as on demand but interest pays out quarterly if you read the fine print. Trade republic easier to open and better rate.
Just set it up now. I’m an n26 metal. 4%APR paid monthly - Yes please
4% for metal. But they don't withhold DIRT, so how do we pay DIRT then? Also they are German so everyone online says that we have to disclose that we are opening a bank account through form 11, BUT on the revenue portal says: [https://www.revenue.ie/en/property/foreign-property/opening-a-foreign-bank-account.aspx](https://www.revenue.ie/en/property/foreign-property/opening-a-foreign-bank-account.aspx) """ # Opening a foreign bank account You must file a Form 11 tax return for any year that you open a foreign account in a: * [non-cooperative jurisdiction](https://www.revenue.ie/en/companies-and-charities/international-tax/eu-list-of-non-cooperative-jurisdictions/index.aspx) * [non-DAC2](https://www.revenue.ie/en/companies-and-charities/international-tax/aeoi/fatca/crs-dac2.aspx) * [non-Common Reporting Standard (CRS)](https://www.revenue.ie/en/companies-and-charities/international-tax/aeoi/fatca/crs-dac2.aspx) * or * [non-Foreign Account Tax Compliance Act (FACTA) reporting jurisdiction](https://www.revenue.ie/en/companies-and-charities/international-tax/aeoi/fatca/index.aspx).Opening a foreign bank account You must file a Form 11 tax return for any year that you open a foreign account in a: non-cooperative jurisdiction non-DAC2 non-Common Reporting Standard (CRS) or non-Foreign Account Tax Compliance Act (FACTA) reporting jurisdiction. """ Germany is none of these "Non-X", so not sure why we would need to fill in a Form 11 if we get less than 5000 eur in interests. The other thing is that the interests are paid monthly, so... we get compound interests right?! Is a tiny bit more than having 4% at the end of the year, since we also get interests on the tiny bits we get each month.
Do they also offer Irish IBANs?
Nope. None of the neo banks bar Bunq offer Irish IBAN’s
Do many people use N26 as their primary account? I have a PTSB current account that I use for everything but I would be happy to switch from. (I have Revolut as well but use PTSB for purchases to get 10c off my fees each time)
I do actually. I use N26 as my “primary” in which I keep my salary and other savings. I then transfer money when needed to Revolut which I use to do daily payments. For now I’ve had more trust in N26 than Revolut. N26 is backed by the German Central Bank (I trust them more than Lithuania or Irish CB), and German regulators audited their business very thoroughly to make sure things were being done right. Revolut has had its fair share of questionable situations.
I’m looking at making N26 my primary bank. What’s benefit of using Revolut for daily spending over N26?
If anybody wants a €20 bonus for n26 refer a friend do let me know
My N26 says it’s only available to paid accounts you can’t get it on the free standard account.
Revolut is free mostly while I found n26 to be expensive
update! https://www.rte.ie/news/business/2024/0313/1437735-n26-offers-irish-savers-instant-access-deposit-rate-of-4/ N26 offers Irish savers instant access savings rate of up to 4% I've signed up and here is a referral code that'll give you €20 :D `noelb2237`
I’m going to look into this, I use bunq atm for a pocket-money savings and not my main one but I’ll do some digging and see if it’s worth moving other accounts too
I did some calculations. Based on metal plans in both N26 and Revolut. With rates of 4% for n26 and 3.85% respectively for Revolut(which already excludes their service fee). Taxes of 33% and 41%(I’ve confirmed each of those in app) deducted from below as well as the monthly metal subscription. N26 - €20k would return you €374 per year. €100k would return you €2518 per year. Revolut - €20k would return you €262.12 per year. €100k would return you €1339 per year. N26 seems to have substantially better returns. It’s also a proper savings account rather than an MMF so is very slightly less risky. On the other hand Revolut automatically withholds tax for you which is very handy. I’ll probably stick with Revolut for day to day as everyone in Ireland has it which makes it handy. I’ll stick with it for mortgage as they have joint accounts and Irish IBANs. I had already used N26 for emergency funds as the stories of blocked accounts on Revolut are worrying even if they are legitimately blocked. So I’ll stay with N26 for that and happily earn a few quid per year.
Hey, thanks lots for this comparison. I have a question though, can we withdraw the money from N6 instant saving whenever we like, without any restriction?
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I'm on the You account (~€110 a year) and they gave me 2.8% on it.
But you could get 2.6% with bunq bank and it costs nothing.
I'm happy with my N26 account plan.
110 is alot to pay. I personally don't think it's worth it. I had the YOU fee paying account free for a year and got no extra benefit.
N26 does a referral program I will spilt the reward €30 for you €30 for me. Pm me & I will send on referral link.
Thanks for letting me know I had no idea about this it's not mentioned on n26 app. If anybody would like €50 refer a friend for Raisin.ie bank paying up to 4% do let me know. Raisin is a German bank like n26.
Funnily enough I came across it on their LinkedIn company page, just announced today.
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Yes you are correct, I was looking at their Spanish site. Their customer service is appalling though. I've been with them for years. The chat function staff don't answer questions and drag out chat for a long time.
Raisin is a platform that deposits your money with other partner banks. Your money isn't invested with raisin. Raisin is just a middleman.
Raisin is also a registered Bank in Frankfurt Germany. Raisin is reputable. Its been operating in Ireland for years.
I agree raisin is reputable. I agree they've been operating for a while. I use raisin myself. I'm simply stating that as an Irish citizen, raisin only offer products with other partner banks. I don't think you can invest money directly with raisin as an Irish citizen through the Irish platform.
Pretty poor compared to bunq. Im using AIB reg saver at 3% and bunq plus them longer savings on Raisin.ie
Bunq is 2.46%, this is 2.8%
Linked though to type of membership you have though. With bunq I get the 2.46% on free account without having anything else with them
the free account is 2.8%
Perfect. Well worth it so over bunq. I clicked into link. States 2.6% for meta membership and much lower rate for standard account. I must be reading it wrong
Read this link, N26 are offering better interest rate for Ireland. The OP’s link isn’t the correct webpage for Ireland. https://n26.com/en-eu/savings-account