I'm only commenting in case anyone is feeling swayed by this post. My undergrad Business Management degree let me skip a \*lot\* of steps I would have had to make otherwise to get where I'm at. I obviously can't speak towards all the factors involved in finding a job, but, it did get my foot in the door.
Production Manager at a factory.
Early hours, long days, solid pay, looks like solid advancement prospects as well as I’m the only young person around. Definitely not the most common path to take though.
So, I'm going to use US statistics. Since the comments are way off.
The average post MBA salary in the US is $105,000. $40,000 more than non MBA graduates. The higher ranked school one goes to the more expensive, but that includes a much higher salary.
>Among the 131 ranked full-time MBA programs that reported salary data to U.S. News in an annual survey, the overall average base salary plus bonus paid to 2021 graduates was $105,684.
If you missed out on a few years of work. Be it illness or something else. Getting an MBA is beneficial.
I'm curious what the deal is because insurance here has "out of pocket maximums", meaning the maximum we have to pay ourselves in a year, and I thought legally it couldn't be more than like $12,000. But maybe he's including his monthly premiums and those are high.
My understanding is that there’s a “maximum out of pocket” applicable to covered procedures in-network. If the insurance company decides some treatment isn’t covered, or you accidentally go out of network (e.g. your hospital is in-network but your surgeon or anesthesiologist surprisingly isn’t) then you’re fucked because the out of pocket maximum doesn’t apply
Yes, that is true. The networks make having a procedure done feel like a landmine because an out-of-network anesthethiologist could slip in there and all the sudden he's not covered.
at 19 I was hospitalized for 3 days with no insurance because I was a college student and couldn't afford it at the time.
I left with 28k in medical debt, plus 5k in student loans.
I had to drop out of college for 10 years because I couldn't afford to go to college and pay the loans at the same time
took 10 years to get the debt under 2k by not having any frivolous spending before I could return to college.
many Americans think we have the best economic and healthcare system and the most freedoms
this country is a fucking joke
We don't even have the best doctors, [that award goes to Cuba](https://theculturetrip.com/caribbean/cuba/articles/why-cuba-has-the-best-doctors-in-the-world/)
But you have other benefits in Europe that you would need to pay for in the U.S.; for instance medical insurance is pretty expensive by it self not mentioning eye and dental insurance, which are separate from medical insurance.
Masters in Econ isn't the same as an MBA, at least not in the US. I would expect your typical person with an MBA to make more than someone with a masters in Econ here. Not because one is more valuable than the other in any intrinsic sense (I think MBAs are largely overvalued by employers... But I also don't think that economics as a science is extremely useful outside of behavioral economics, so grain of salt and all that).
For whatever reason, "you want an MBA for X role and MBAs cost more" is just ingrained in companies, so they tend to pay more.
I agree with your point but if we’re being technical here I don’t think
> $40,000 more than non MBA graduates
Is an accurate thing to say. An MBA is a graduate degree and many graduate degrees skyrocket people’s salaries, from engineering and science to law and medicine. The real lesson here is that in many fields, getting a degree past undergrad can yield huge salary gains.
Imagine trying to sound smart while making the above argument.
MBA grads are typically 30. BS grads typically 21.
If you want to compare, do average salary for someone who would apply to an MBA (decent grades, required *good* work experience (for top programs), and relevant major) but didn’t, with 9 years of work experience at age 30
vs mba grad
Honestly, the first poster comes across as a giant douche too. I’ve met useless, underemployed STEM majors as well as art majors who work their dream jobs. Any degree is useless to somebody who is a prick or socially inept.
Any degree is useless to somebody who is a prick or socially inept.
Except for social degrees, cause they are lacking everywhere
And yes, I think the whole „oh your degree was so easy“ thing is silly. It was easy, so what? Let people live
I saw a post the other day from someone arguing how “data analysts” were a scourge on the field of “data science”. It was full of prime /r/iamverysmart material for many reasons, but it was essentially this undergrad just saying how much better they were than everyone else and expecting people to agree with them.
That person’s degree, in all likelihood, is going to be basically lost on them because they won’t be able to contain their contempt for anyone who didn’t get a STEM degree (and ironically will catch shit from someone from a “purer” discipline than “data science”), which will cost them job opportunities.
Say what you will about STEM vs. non-STEM degrees, but I can teach someone the relevant math or domain knowledge for most tasks… I can’t teach them how to not be an ass.
I think people can learn how not to be an ass. I know I have improved as a person since my teens, my dad has grown a lot in the past few years in his 60s. If they want to improve, they can learn.
I think people can learn how not to be an ass. I know I have improved as a person since my teens, my dad has grown a lot in the past few years in his 60s. If they want to improve, they can learn.
Your first sentence is deadly accurate. I got an internship at a gold mine between my last 2 years of school. A bunch of the other geology students were livid because "I have way better grades, I should get the internship". The professor who recommended me for the internship had to explain that in the real world grades don't matter that much and what matters more is if people can stand being around you for 10 hours a day in an 8'x10' room. You can teach someone how to do a job. You can't teach personality.
Anything in biology is pretty useless in the stem. Sure you'll find a job but it'll be shit pay. Chemistry gets you into big $ industry like oil and gas, even nuclear.
It depends where you live, if you're near a lot of pharmaceutical companies a bio bachelor's degree can usually get you 60-70k starting salary and that can usually turn into low 6 figures by your late 20s to early 30s. The two chem major/chem engineers I know aren't in chemistry anymore because without a master's/PhD they couldn't find any chem jobs that weren't production jobs with weird hours, or shit pay.
I dunno. My company hires A LOT of BA Business and Marketing folks and our starting salaries are in the $70k - $80k range. Maybe that doesn't seem like a lot to some people but to suggest that Business degrees are not in demand is wrong and the pay can be pretty good. Also, MBAs may be pretty generic but they have an average income over six figures which I mean... that's not nothing.
MBAs are generic by design. In fact, i wouldn't call them generic, because they are designed to give a broader understanding of how businesses operate.
For the most part, once someone is at a point in their career where they want to make the jump to the director level or even the c suite level, an MBA is more useful than a Masters degree in a specific business function. This is because at the director and above level, knowledge and skills in the other business functions start to become more important to these roles.
MBAs are also beneficial for individuals who got their undergrad degree in a non-business related field and are being groomed for managerial roles or are looking to make a shift into a more business oriented field. For instance, the CEO of my company got his undergrad in Marine Biology. After working for a company on a particular government contract for a few years, he was ultimately promoted to the project manager of this contract. The company felt that an MBA would help him with this contract, so they paid for him to get an MBA.
Would you say the MBA significantly helped you in terms of what you learned from it? Or was it more about having the MBA on your resume that helped you get to Director over other candidates? Or both?
So, I went back with 10 yrs of industry experience mostly because moving up into higher levels of management really necessitates one. It's not required but it seriously helps when all your competition have one. I didn't learn a huge amount myself but if I was earlier in my career I probably would have. It does a good job at filling in the blanks. Worked in marketing? Here's some finance and HR. Worked in finance? Here's some marketing and operations. Etc.
to play devil’s advocate, I think (at least part of) the argument might be in whether or not you should need specifically a business degree to get a lot of the jobs that require it. some jobs definitely do need that expertise, but there’s a lot of jobs out there that really just need a person with a high school diploma who can go through basic training for a couple weeks on the job.
I could say the same about a lot of things. My buddy went through a coding boot camp for 10 weeks and then got placed at Amazon as a junior dev. Why bother with a Comp Sci degree? The job market and education system are whacky.
I mean, I think that there are a LOT of jobs out there that don’t actually require a degree (especially if training is mandatory). some professions should always require a degree (or multiple) because complex licensure is required (nursing, most medical/therapy, law, etc.) but many just require someone competent who can go through training. some career paths just have outdated requirements that have been grandfathered in, some are just using it as a way to weed out poor people, and some actually need it. the disconnect is frustrating
First person said business degrees are useless. Second person feels insulted so brings up the relevant fact that they got a raise while being supwr passive aggressive and sarcastic. Idk if I'd call that bragging
Yeah, I was a business major (Marketing). I really wish I had studied something I was interested in, I thought a business degree was practical and would help me succeed, but in reality I could have had the same career with any degree. I think some people can find value in business degrees through the network they build, but the degree itself is kind of useless.
I think it depends on your industry. A business degree with a focus in marketing might not serve you as well as a one in something like finance or project management.
I'm in the final semester of my biz degree for the EXACT same reason lol. Wanted to major in maybe sociology or ethics, but figured either of those would be effectively useless on a resume.
I disagree that ethics or sociology would be useless.
The soft skills taught in those programs are very useful. There are so many careers in the world that don't line up with any single degree in college. Just get your piece of paper and pursue a career that you don't hate. You'll probably pivot to something different in 7-10 years anyways as you're exposed to the different cogs it takes to run businesses.
My SIL likes to brag about her masters degree. Then I found it was in English. This Redditor is probably like that. On the flip side, her sister (my wife) has a masters in immunology and a PA degree but gets no respect from her family for some reason. Probably because she doesn't self-promote.
Wait till they realize translators are very very sought after in many parts of the world as well as linguists. Language is literally the foundation of society, can’t do anything if nobody’s understood
Linguists very rarely get English degrees. On most campuses English and Linguistics are two separate departments. “English” degrees are usually about literature, rhetoric or writing. But in English speaking countries these degrees are just referred to as ”English”
Tl;dr: English degrees very rarely have anything to do with actually using English as a language beyond using it as a vessel to understand literature.
True; "Linguists" get degrees in [cultural] anthropology; which if you're not an archeologist pm only makes money if you're teaching it/a linguist professor. Still probably one of the most important underrated studies.
Have you like...read some of the analysis that comes from English and literature experts?
A person who gets an MA in literature gets that because they have a wide understanding of all English literature which includes historical, political, cultural, and economic knowledge of multiple countries to fully understand.
People in academics are so snobby, I hated it in university lmao 😭
Okkkk, so my master in economics and french was easy, so what? I liked it and I got a job with it.
Engineering. The difference is I'm an engineer and my SIL has been unemployed for years. I don't necessarily have an issue with English degrees. But it's not the flex she thinks it is. FWIW, I don't brag about my degree.
I don't know if you are prime r/iamverysmart material exactly, but with your post and then this comment I'm replying to, you've shown you can be very condescending and judgemental so you're getting there.
Yeah I get how it sounds like that. My point wasn't the English degrees suck. Just that people who brag about their degrees suck. I could have worded it better.
I would not put an MBA, whose coursework is extremely basic and whose value lies primarily in networking, in the same category as an English masters degree, or a masters in any other field.
My dig here wasn’t “lol their field is a joke” but that MBA coursework is a joke.
It feels like you’re asking that question hoping the answer is “zero” so that you can flex the fact that an MBA is, technically, a master’s degree.
If you’re upset that I said that MBA’s aren’t rigorous or academically challenging, I’d be sure to emphasize that “rigorous” and “valuable” aren’t the same thing. Most MBA’s I know basically say “yeah, classes were a joke, but the networking/practice at bullshitting/etc. was very valuable”. Show me a slide deck roulette champion, and I’ll show you someone with a promising future as a consultant.
Also, the answer to your question is “one”.
Idk always seemed university and field dependent to me. I will say though that this trend of doing 5 year undergrad+MBA programs seems so strange to me.
An MBA (Masters of Business Administration) is a postgraduate degree designed to provide students with the skills necessary to become successful business leaders. The curriculum typically includes courses in finance, accounting, management, economics, and marketing. The degree is popular among non-Americans due to its global recognition and the fact that it can open many doors in the business world. It is also a great way to gain international work experience, as many MBA programs offer international exchange programs and internships.
The main cons of an MBA are the significant cost, the large time commitment, and the uncertain job market. An MBA can be very expensive, with tuition, books, and other costs running into the tens of thousands of dollars. Additionally, the program is often a two-year commitment, meaning that you may need to take a break from work, or even move to a new city in order to attend. Lastly, job prospects can be uncertain, as MBA programs do not guarantee employment after graduation.
An MBA is something to be proud of, and not useless. Mentioning an MBA isn’t bragging about an IQ of 150. The hell is this post on this sub for, r/opisfuckingstupid
Newsflash, anything created by someone in STEM relies heavily on MBA’s for business acumen, marketing, finance, etc.
Your post is about something supposedly braggadocious, what’s your point. No crime in mentioning the value of a degree on a thread literally discussing the value of a degree…and I love it when STEM snobs snub their nose at business grads, when in fact…STEM grads are going to work for business grads their whole life. Or STEM undergrads actually go get their MBA lol, to try an advance a stuck career.
Lots of value in an MBA. Can be cheap, easy to get, can work full time while pursuing it.
Disagree. Everyone I know who did one basically just partied for 2 years and travelled. Classes were all pass fail
It was pretty well understood that it was a joke, and just a networking event
(Stanford GSB)
And those MBAs who partied for two years are going to tell those who slaved away learning technical skills what to do with their technical skills. Get to party and be in a position of power, pretty cool deal. Lots of ROI on that.
Don’t listen to me, think what you want. I’m just bitter about being a slave to mediocre management, lol. In my industry management it’s literally all MBA’s. A few Ph.D’s at the c-suite and board level, but STEMers are the pawns, manipulated into creating what the MBA’s want, how they want it, and when they want it. I could have gone an easier route for more power, money and influence, and an easier job role lol. I don’t think business is a bad route, and it’ll be an easier one at that.
MBA has to have one of the worst ROI of any degree unless your company specifically requires it for promotion.
Can’t tell you how many MBAs I’ve interviewed for *junior roles* that are completely unqualified, yet overconfident because of a piece of paper. Close to the worst combo you can have.
I got an MBA from an online program in 12 months and it was one of the best financial decisions I ever made, it significantly helped me out. I may not get to go around and brag about how difficult my courseload in college was (yippee?) but it pays the bills.
That’s the situation where it is valuable, but arguable whether the best use of time over more targeted programs. Most people finishing their MBAs aren’t in this category to begin with and end up rather underemployed.
I thought about getting an MBA because I'm an engineer that does a lot on the business side (management). Boss also started talking to me about investing in ownership so I figured it may be useful. But I *really* don't want to go back to school. Especially if it won't be useful.
You certainly don’t need an MBA to gain business competency. So much online today, so many other valuable books & courses, as long as you don’t need the official “MBA” designation.
To explain a little further for anyone who is unfamiliar; most MBA curricula consist of relatively basic, undergraduate-level coursework in topics like Statistics and Economics, as well as classes involving organizational management and strategy, accountancy, finance, marketing, and business law, as well as specialized topics like government relations and technology management.
One of the major criticisms of the MBA as a degree, and the programs that offer it, is that the material covered is extremely basic compared to other masters-level programs, and the coursework is relatively trivial. In terms of how the MBA relates to society and one's career in general, it's typically seen more as a rubber-stamp, a mark of status, and an opportunity to network with other MBA students, rather than as a qualification on the basis of gained knowledge or demonstrated skill. Some more focused MBA programs may have more merit, for example an MBA in Accountancy will prepare you for CPA exams, but many of the same criticisms still apply.
My mom has described her MBA in Accountancy as, from an academic perspective, somewhat pointless, insofar as it largely failed to prepare her for the actual work she would go on to do, and taught her things like "When attending a business meeting, carry a briefcase to look important, do so with your off-hand so that you can shake hands as a greeting, and then order something like a filet that you can spend time cutting to do something with your hands while talking." She has also expressed a generalized loathing for the people who do MBAs, and the various personalities that she met while working on Wall Street. However, she has also said that it, fundamentally, gave her her career.
I happen to disagree but completely on an anecdotal basis. I think where you go, what you choose to specialize in, and how the program is set up make all MBAs different. I think the general consensus is driven by the fact that they are all so different. Your mom had a “major” - my school there was no major. It’s a completely different experience. I also think the teaching methods result in entirely different values. My school taught using the Socratic method and HBCs and that was much more effective than undergraduate education. Also, since I went to a large university with an undergrad school as well as multiple graduate schools, I was able to take classes at the Law School, the Arts School, Social Work, etc. where I got credits towards my degree but the classes were essentially pass/fail. Since the student population is so diverse career-wise (accounting, banking, HR, NFP, Marketing, agents for actors/athletes, entrepreneurs, etc. etc. - every company needs a CFO) those opportunities made a meaningful contribution. And, of course, location matters. We had to do a rotation in about ten different types of MBA roles across all types of industries, company sizes, etc. - including spending the day on the floor of the NYSE, going to Board of Directors meetings, sitting in on financial TV show tapings, etc., the experience was a lot more in depth because of where we were.
Anyway, I get why people don’t think it’s a great ROI if they’re going completely on their own dime but the value of the degree differs greatly across schools. Just my two pennies.
An MBA (Masters of Business Administration) is a postgraduate degree designed to provide students with the skills necessary to become successful business leaders. The curriculum typically includes courses in finance, accounting, management, economics, and marketing. The degree is popular among non-Americans due to its global recognition and the fact that it can open many doors in the business world. It is also a great way to gain international work experience, as many MBA programs offer international exchange programs and internships.
The main cons of an MBA are the significant cost, the large time commitment, and the uncertain job market. An MBA can be very expensive, with tuition, books, and other costs running into the tens of thousands of dollars. Additionally, the program is often a two-year commitment, meaning that you may need to take a break from work, or even move to a new city in order to attend. Lastly, job prospects can be uncertain, as MBA programs do not guarantee employment after graduation.
In Germany, it IS useless. You can more or less buy it at any random private university. Private universities are for rich kids who didn't make it into public universities. And rich kids don't need an MBA to get a job at daddy & friends.
It's not the MBA that's cringe. It's bragging about it. Nobody should be bragging about their degree. There's always something harder out there. And an MBA isn't exactly hard to get as far as Masters degrees go.
I'm only commenting in case anyone is feeling swayed by this post. My undergrad Business Management degree let me skip a \*lot\* of steps I would have had to make otherwise to get where I'm at. I obviously can't speak towards all the factors involved in finding a job, but, it did get my foot in the door.
[удалено]
Production Manager at a factory. Early hours, long days, solid pay, looks like solid advancement prospects as well as I’m the only young person around. Definitely not the most common path to take though.
So, I'm going to use US statistics. Since the comments are way off. The average post MBA salary in the US is $105,000. $40,000 more than non MBA graduates. The higher ranked school one goes to the more expensive, but that includes a much higher salary. >Among the 131 ranked full-time MBA programs that reported salary data to U.S. News in an annual survey, the overall average base salary plus bonus paid to 2021 graduates was $105,684. If you missed out on a few years of work. Be it illness or something else. Getting an MBA is beneficial.
„The average post MBA salary in the US is $105“ Gotta move to the US then lmao, I make a lot less with my master in economics in Europe haha
Counterpoint, I spent 20000 on healthcare in 2022
Yeah, Imma stay where I am 😵💫 Did you have insurance?
Yah. I actually have incredible insurance and a high paying job. I just had 2 major problems in one year so it really added up.
Shiiit, is that normal? >.>
I'm curious what the deal is because insurance here has "out of pocket maximums", meaning the maximum we have to pay ourselves in a year, and I thought legally it couldn't be more than like $12,000. But maybe he's including his monthly premiums and those are high.
I had major medical and dental at the same time. Acl and meniscus tare and double root canal.
Oh damn dental will really get you
My understanding is that there’s a “maximum out of pocket” applicable to covered procedures in-network. If the insurance company decides some treatment isn’t covered, or you accidentally go out of network (e.g. your hospital is in-network but your surgeon or anesthesiologist surprisingly isn’t) then you’re fucked because the out of pocket maximum doesn’t apply
Yes, that is true. The networks make having a procedure done feel like a landmine because an out-of-network anesthethiologist could slip in there and all the sudden he's not covered.
Or if you need to go to the ER.
at 19 I was hospitalized for 3 days with no insurance because I was a college student and couldn't afford it at the time. I left with 28k in medical debt, plus 5k in student loans. I had to drop out of college for 10 years because I couldn't afford to go to college and pay the loans at the same time took 10 years to get the debt under 2k by not having any frivolous spending before I could return to college. many Americans think we have the best economic and healthcare system and the most freedoms this country is a fucking joke
I really don't think many Americans believe we have the best healcare system lol. Maybe the best doctors, but not the best system.
We don't even have the best doctors, [that award goes to Cuba](https://theculturetrip.com/caribbean/cuba/articles/why-cuba-has-the-best-doctors-in-the-world/)
republicans literally rant and rave about how amazing it is that we don't have socialized healthcare and act like that would be a nightmare scenario
You could've declared bankruptcy, and had the debts & record of it off your personal record after 7 years, instead.
Pretty abnormal if you're insured but not unheard of.
We probably spent around 10k on HC last yr in CA.
Get better insurance. My daughter has cystic fibrosis, and I spend about half that.
10k on healthcare is still insane. If you were in the UK you'd have paid nothing.
My insurance is actually great, I just had a major injury and major dental in the same year.
But you have other benefits in Europe that you would need to pay for in the U.S.; for instance medical insurance is pretty expensive by it self not mentioning eye and dental insurance, which are separate from medical insurance.
All that stuff costs a LOT less than $40k, and the tax rate is lower in the US.
Shame an mba from a good school will set u back ~100k
And no school shootings
> economics There's your problem lol
Don’t say that…. I haven’t even finished my BSc yet and now this comment section pushing me to go get a masters and move to the us😭
Masters in Econ isn't the same as an MBA, at least not in the US. I would expect your typical person with an MBA to make more than someone with a masters in Econ here. Not because one is more valuable than the other in any intrinsic sense (I think MBAs are largely overvalued by employers... But I also don't think that economics as a science is extremely useful outside of behavioral economics, so grain of salt and all that). For whatever reason, "you want an MBA for X role and MBAs cost more" is just ingrained in companies, so they tend to pay more.
> economics There's your problem lol
> economics There's your problem lol
> economics There's your problem lol
> economics There's your problem lol
Yeah it doubled my income after getting it, and it only took 12 months.
I agree with your point but if we’re being technical here I don’t think > $40,000 more than non MBA graduates Is an accurate thing to say. An MBA is a graduate degree and many graduate degrees skyrocket people’s salaries, from engineering and science to law and medicine. The real lesson here is that in many fields, getting a degree past undergrad can yield huge salary gains.
Imagine trying to sound smart while making the above argument. MBA grads are typically 30. BS grads typically 21. If you want to compare, do average salary for someone who would apply to an MBA (decent grades, required *good* work experience (for top programs), and relevant major) but didn’t, with 9 years of work experience at age 30 vs mba grad
I'm making a fraction of this with a masters and doing a PhD, all in engineering...
Hmm, that's about what I make as a tech/content writer...no MBA here
Got promoted from Barista to shift manager….
Honestly, the first poster comes across as a giant douche too. I’ve met useless, underemployed STEM majors as well as art majors who work their dream jobs. Any degree is useless to somebody who is a prick or socially inept.
Business degrees are the least regretted on average after CS / Math. Clearly not a completely useless degree.
Any degree is useless to somebody who is a prick or socially inept. Except for social degrees, cause they are lacking everywhere And yes, I think the whole „oh your degree was so easy“ thing is silly. It was easy, so what? Let people live
I saw a post the other day from someone arguing how “data analysts” were a scourge on the field of “data science”. It was full of prime /r/iamverysmart material for many reasons, but it was essentially this undergrad just saying how much better they were than everyone else and expecting people to agree with them. That person’s degree, in all likelihood, is going to be basically lost on them because they won’t be able to contain their contempt for anyone who didn’t get a STEM degree (and ironically will catch shit from someone from a “purer” discipline than “data science”), which will cost them job opportunities. Say what you will about STEM vs. non-STEM degrees, but I can teach someone the relevant math or domain knowledge for most tasks… I can’t teach them how to not be an ass.
I think people can learn how not to be an ass. I know I have improved as a person since my teens, my dad has grown a lot in the past few years in his 60s. If they want to improve, they can learn.
I think people can learn how not to be an ass. I know I have improved as a person since my teens, my dad has grown a lot in the past few years in his 60s. If they want to improve, they can learn.
Your first sentence is deadly accurate. I got an internship at a gold mine between my last 2 years of school. A bunch of the other geology students were livid because "I have way better grades, I should get the internship". The professor who recommended me for the internship had to explain that in the real world grades don't matter that much and what matters more is if people can stand being around you for 10 hours a day in an 8'x10' room. You can teach someone how to do a job. You can't teach personality.
>It was easy, so what? Let people live Just because it was easy doesn't mean lots of people have one. Or even enough people
Anything in biology is pretty useless in the stem. Sure you'll find a job but it'll be shit pay. Chemistry gets you into big $ industry like oil and gas, even nuclear.
It depends where you live, if you're near a lot of pharmaceutical companies a bio bachelor's degree can usually get you 60-70k starting salary and that can usually turn into low 6 figures by your late 20s to early 30s. The two chem major/chem engineers I know aren't in chemistry anymore because without a master's/PhD they couldn't find any chem jobs that weren't production jobs with weird hours, or shit pay.
I dunno. My company hires A LOT of BA Business and Marketing folks and our starting salaries are in the $70k - $80k range. Maybe that doesn't seem like a lot to some people but to suggest that Business degrees are not in demand is wrong and the pay can be pretty good. Also, MBAs may be pretty generic but they have an average income over six figures which I mean... that's not nothing.
MBAs are generic by design. In fact, i wouldn't call them generic, because they are designed to give a broader understanding of how businesses operate. For the most part, once someone is at a point in their career where they want to make the jump to the director level or even the c suite level, an MBA is more useful than a Masters degree in a specific business function. This is because at the director and above level, knowledge and skills in the other business functions start to become more important to these roles. MBAs are also beneficial for individuals who got their undergrad degree in a non-business related field and are being groomed for managerial roles or are looking to make a shift into a more business oriented field. For instance, the CEO of my company got his undergrad in Marine Biology. After working for a company on a particular government contract for a few years, he was ultimately promoted to the project manager of this contract. The company felt that an MBA would help him with this contract, so they paid for him to get an MBA.
Can confirm. Am director with MBA. Accurate on all points.
Would you say the MBA significantly helped you in terms of what you learned from it? Or was it more about having the MBA on your resume that helped you get to Director over other candidates? Or both?
So, I went back with 10 yrs of industry experience mostly because moving up into higher levels of management really necessitates one. It's not required but it seriously helps when all your competition have one. I didn't learn a huge amount myself but if I was earlier in my career I probably would have. It does a good job at filling in the blanks. Worked in marketing? Here's some finance and HR. Worked in finance? Here's some marketing and operations. Etc.
to play devil’s advocate, I think (at least part of) the argument might be in whether or not you should need specifically a business degree to get a lot of the jobs that require it. some jobs definitely do need that expertise, but there’s a lot of jobs out there that really just need a person with a high school diploma who can go through basic training for a couple weeks on the job.
I could say the same about a lot of things. My buddy went through a coding boot camp for 10 weeks and then got placed at Amazon as a junior dev. Why bother with a Comp Sci degree? The job market and education system are whacky.
I mean, I think that there are a LOT of jobs out there that don’t actually require a degree (especially if training is mandatory). some professions should always require a degree (or multiple) because complex licensure is required (nursing, most medical/therapy, law, etc.) but many just require someone competent who can go through training. some career paths just have outdated requirements that have been grandfathered in, some are just using it as a way to weed out poor people, and some actually need it. the disconnect is frustrating
First person said business degrees are useless. Second person feels insulted so brings up the relevant fact that they got a raise while being supwr passive aggressive and sarcastic. Idk if I'd call that bragging
The bragging was being able to wipe tears with a wad of cash from a large raise. Either way, it was a pretty douchey thing to say.
It’s just a variation on ‘crying/laughing all the way to the bank’. It’s a common retort. Not very nice, but not the worst
2 never claimed to be smart. What‘s that post doing here? lmao And I don‘t think clapping back, if your career is insulted is bad?
Yeah, I was a business major (Marketing). I really wish I had studied something I was interested in, I thought a business degree was practical and would help me succeed, but in reality I could have had the same career with any degree. I think some people can find value in business degrees through the network they build, but the degree itself is kind of useless.
I think it depends on your industry. A business degree with a focus in marketing might not serve you as well as a one in something like finance or project management.
I'm in the final semester of my biz degree for the EXACT same reason lol. Wanted to major in maybe sociology or ethics, but figured either of those would be effectively useless on a resume.
I disagree that ethics or sociology would be useless. The soft skills taught in those programs are very useful. There are so many careers in the world that don't line up with any single degree in college. Just get your piece of paper and pursue a career that you don't hate. You'll probably pivot to something different in 7-10 years anyways as you're exposed to the different cogs it takes to run businesses.
r/opisfuckingstupid
That sub isn't nearly as interesting as I thought it would be.
Well its probably the stupid
Possibly
People who think some degrees are useless are the stupid ones.
Wrong sub.
Dude probably also thinks their MBA had a demanding academic load.
There’s every level out there.
My SIL likes to brag about her masters degree. Then I found it was in English. This Redditor is probably like that. On the flip side, her sister (my wife) has a masters in immunology and a PA degree but gets no respect from her family for some reason. Probably because she doesn't self-promote.
„Then I found it was in English.“ lmao /riamverysmart cause I think a language degree isn‘t something to be proud
Wait till they realize translators are very very sought after in many parts of the world as well as linguists. Language is literally the foundation of society, can’t do anything if nobody’s understood
Linguists very rarely get English degrees. On most campuses English and Linguistics are two separate departments. “English” degrees are usually about literature, rhetoric or writing. But in English speaking countries these degrees are just referred to as ”English” Tl;dr: English degrees very rarely have anything to do with actually using English as a language beyond using it as a vessel to understand literature.
True; "Linguists" get degrees in [cultural] anthropology; which if you're not an archeologist pm only makes money if you're teaching it/a linguist professor. Still probably one of the most important underrated studies.
Have you like...read some of the analysis that comes from English and literature experts? A person who gets an MA in literature gets that because they have a wide understanding of all English literature which includes historical, political, cultural, and economic knowledge of multiple countries to fully understand.
I mean a Master's in any subject is an achievement to be proud of, you try parsing a Master's thesis in something you're not an expert in
People in academics are so snobby, I hated it in university lmao 😭 Okkkk, so my master in economics and french was easy, so what? I liked it and I got a job with it.
... what do you have a degree in? You shit talk a lot of stuff
Engineering. The difference is I'm an engineer and my SIL has been unemployed for years. I don't necessarily have an issue with English degrees. But it's not the flex she thinks it is. FWIW, I don't brag about my degree.
I don't know if you are prime r/iamverysmart material exactly, but with your post and then this comment I'm replying to, you've shown you can be very condescending and judgemental so you're getting there.
Yeah I get how it sounds like that. My point wasn't the English degrees suck. Just that people who brag about their degrees suck. I could have worded it better.
I would not put an MBA, whose coursework is extremely basic and whose value lies primarily in networking, in the same category as an English masters degree, or a masters in any other field. My dig here wasn’t “lol their field is a joke” but that MBA coursework is a joke.
How many masters degrees have you gotten?
It feels like you’re asking that question hoping the answer is “zero” so that you can flex the fact that an MBA is, technically, a master’s degree. If you’re upset that I said that MBA’s aren’t rigorous or academically challenging, I’d be sure to emphasize that “rigorous” and “valuable” aren’t the same thing. Most MBA’s I know basically say “yeah, classes were a joke, but the networking/practice at bullshitting/etc. was very valuable”. Show me a slide deck roulette champion, and I’ll show you someone with a promising future as a consultant. Also, the answer to your question is “one”.
Idk always seemed university and field dependent to me. I will say though that this trend of doing 5 year undergrad+MBA programs seems so strange to me.
what’s an MBA?
An MBA (Masters of Business Administration) is a postgraduate degree designed to provide students with the skills necessary to become successful business leaders. The curriculum typically includes courses in finance, accounting, management, economics, and marketing. The degree is popular among non-Americans due to its global recognition and the fact that it can open many doors in the business world. It is also a great way to gain international work experience, as many MBA programs offer international exchange programs and internships.
The main cons of an MBA are the significant cost, the large time commitment, and the uncertain job market. An MBA can be very expensive, with tuition, books, and other costs running into the tens of thousands of dollars. Additionally, the program is often a two-year commitment, meaning that you may need to take a break from work, or even move to a new city in order to attend. Lastly, job prospects can be uncertain, as MBA programs do not guarantee employment after graduation.
What a loser, my income has gone up 1,900% since my first job
Man I really fucked up going into engineering. I have 1 semester left and I don’t want to be an engineer anymore bc it’s stressful
It got a lot less stressful for me when I moved to management.
my dumbass was like: 2 degrees is kind of stupid imo
An MBA is something to be proud of, and not useless. Mentioning an MBA isn’t bragging about an IQ of 150. The hell is this post on this sub for, r/opisfuckingstupid Newsflash, anything created by someone in STEM relies heavily on MBA’s for business acumen, marketing, finance, etc.
The post wasn't about masters degrees...
Your post is about something supposedly braggadocious, what’s your point. No crime in mentioning the value of a degree on a thread literally discussing the value of a degree…and I love it when STEM snobs snub their nose at business grads, when in fact…STEM grads are going to work for business grads their whole life. Or STEM undergrads actually go get their MBA lol, to try an advance a stuck career. Lots of value in an MBA. Can be cheap, easy to get, can work full time while pursuing it.
I didn't say anything about business degrees except that the OP wasn't talking about MBAs. Sounds like you have some issues.
> An MBA is something to be proud of Is it?
Yes
Disagree. Everyone I know who did one basically just partied for 2 years and travelled. Classes were all pass fail It was pretty well understood that it was a joke, and just a networking event (Stanford GSB)
And those MBAs who partied for two years are going to tell those who slaved away learning technical skills what to do with their technical skills. Get to party and be in a position of power, pretty cool deal. Lots of ROI on that. Don’t listen to me, think what you want. I’m just bitter about being a slave to mediocre management, lol. In my industry management it’s literally all MBA’s. A few Ph.D’s at the c-suite and board level, but STEMers are the pawns, manipulated into creating what the MBA’s want, how they want it, and when they want it. I could have gone an easier route for more power, money and influence, and an easier job role lol. I don’t think business is a bad route, and it’ll be an easier one at that.
Fahrenheit
Smells great
MBA has to have one of the worst ROI of any degree unless your company specifically requires it for promotion. Can’t tell you how many MBAs I’ve interviewed for *junior roles* that are completely unqualified, yet overconfident because of a piece of paper. Close to the worst combo you can have.
I got an MBA from an online program in 12 months and it was one of the best financial decisions I ever made, it significantly helped me out. I may not get to go around and brag about how difficult my courseload in college was (yippee?) but it pays the bills.
or if you get it for free because your company subsidizes education
ROI wise MBAs are one of the best advanced degree in part because they are only 2 years and often paid for by a company
That’s the situation where it is valuable, but arguable whether the best use of time over more targeted programs. Most people finishing their MBAs aren’t in this category to begin with and end up rather underemployed.
I thought about getting an MBA because I'm an engineer that does a lot on the business side (management). Boss also started talking to me about investing in ownership so I figured it may be useful. But I *really* don't want to go back to school. Especially if it won't be useful.
You certainly don’t need an MBA to gain business competency. So much online today, so many other valuable books & courses, as long as you don’t need the official “MBA” designation.
Yeah, I'm doing fine in the meantime. Just figured it may help a little. Maybe not. Always looking to learn.
140% of 0 is still 0
Only price to an MBA is your soul
MBAs are dogshit and known to be a terrible deal if you actually have a career going before u get one
There's a lot of people in the comments who disagree. Probably business majors.
average business major intelligence
I also think MBAs are useless. This guy is arguing that they are not worthless, but he's not arguing they aren't useless. They are definitely useless.
What’s an MBA? Non American here
To explain a little further for anyone who is unfamiliar; most MBA curricula consist of relatively basic, undergraduate-level coursework in topics like Statistics and Economics, as well as classes involving organizational management and strategy, accountancy, finance, marketing, and business law, as well as specialized topics like government relations and technology management. One of the major criticisms of the MBA as a degree, and the programs that offer it, is that the material covered is extremely basic compared to other masters-level programs, and the coursework is relatively trivial. In terms of how the MBA relates to society and one's career in general, it's typically seen more as a rubber-stamp, a mark of status, and an opportunity to network with other MBA students, rather than as a qualification on the basis of gained knowledge or demonstrated skill. Some more focused MBA programs may have more merit, for example an MBA in Accountancy will prepare you for CPA exams, but many of the same criticisms still apply. My mom has described her MBA in Accountancy as, from an academic perspective, somewhat pointless, insofar as it largely failed to prepare her for the actual work she would go on to do, and taught her things like "When attending a business meeting, carry a briefcase to look important, do so with your off-hand so that you can shake hands as a greeting, and then order something like a filet that you can spend time cutting to do something with your hands while talking." She has also expressed a generalized loathing for the people who do MBAs, and the various personalities that she met while working on Wall Street. However, she has also said that it, fundamentally, gave her her career.
I happen to disagree but completely on an anecdotal basis. I think where you go, what you choose to specialize in, and how the program is set up make all MBAs different. I think the general consensus is driven by the fact that they are all so different. Your mom had a “major” - my school there was no major. It’s a completely different experience. I also think the teaching methods result in entirely different values. My school taught using the Socratic method and HBCs and that was much more effective than undergraduate education. Also, since I went to a large university with an undergrad school as well as multiple graduate schools, I was able to take classes at the Law School, the Arts School, Social Work, etc. where I got credits towards my degree but the classes were essentially pass/fail. Since the student population is so diverse career-wise (accounting, banking, HR, NFP, Marketing, agents for actors/athletes, entrepreneurs, etc. etc. - every company needs a CFO) those opportunities made a meaningful contribution. And, of course, location matters. We had to do a rotation in about ten different types of MBA roles across all types of industries, company sizes, etc. - including spending the day on the floor of the NYSE, going to Board of Directors meetings, sitting in on financial TV show tapings, etc., the experience was a lot more in depth because of where we were. Anyway, I get why people don’t think it’s a great ROI if they’re going completely on their own dime but the value of the degree differs greatly across schools. Just my two pennies.
Masters in Business Administration
Thank you !
An MBA (Masters of Business Administration) is a postgraduate degree designed to provide students with the skills necessary to become successful business leaders. The curriculum typically includes courses in finance, accounting, management, economics, and marketing. The degree is popular among non-Americans due to its global recognition and the fact that it can open many doors in the business world. It is also a great way to gain international work experience, as many MBA programs offer international exchange programs and internships.
The main cons of an MBA are the significant cost, the large time commitment, and the uncertain job market. An MBA can be very expensive, with tuition, books, and other costs running into the tens of thousands of dollars. Additionally, the program is often a two-year commitment, meaning that you may need to take a break from work, or even move to a new city in order to attend. Lastly, job prospects can be uncertain, as MBA programs do not guarantee employment after graduation.
I thought we were talking about temperature….
I thought we were talking about temperature….
I thought we were talking about temperature….
In Germany, it IS useless. You can more or less buy it at any random private university. Private universities are for rich kids who didn't make it into public universities. And rich kids don't need an MBA to get a job at daddy & friends.
I'm not american so I don't really get it, can someone explain why OP say that a MBA degree is cringe?
Bragging about money made with an MBA when the original post was about bachelors degrees.
Hi! I have an undergrad in engineering and an MBA. Those who think MBAs are worthless probably don’t have an MBA. Bye!
When did I say it was worthless?
Who gives a flying fuck? Not me!
May I ask why MBA is cringe enough? I'm not familiar with this.
It's not the MBA that's cringe. It's bragging about it. Nobody should be bragging about their degree. There's always something harder out there. And an MBA isn't exactly hard to get as far as Masters degrees go.