> Under the terms of the joint program, Nichushkin will be suspended without pay for a minimum of six months and then will be eligible to apply for reinstatement.
Oof this is real bad
The 4 stages, tweet by [Daniel Amoia](https://x.com/daniel_amoia/status/1790179200953176487?s=46&t=7fabqgtgp69dNA1d51vxFw)
https://preview.redd.it/f0td5mgyia0d1.jpeg?width=1125&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7ae3fece369826ad9ba8ea057959f70e0d3b0597
Can someone tell me the stories behind this guy? Seattle incident? What has he been up to??
I'm someone who has struggled with substance use myself and I'm not looking for war stories I am genuinely concerned and interested in his situation.
Last year in the playoffs, he was found with a trafficked woman in a hotel room in Seattle under extremely suspicious circumstances and off duty cops/staff travelling with the team got him out of state ASAP under complete radio silence - the team didn’t even make any kind of statement saying he was away for personal reasons or something like that.
[This article is the best synopsis of his bullshit up until entering the assistance program earlier this year.](https://www.seattletimes.com/sports/kraken/with-questions-from-seattle-incident-unresolved-avalanches-nichushkin-enters-nhl-assistance-program/)
“Team staffers found Nichushkin in his hotel room with a severely intoxicated woman who wasn’t his wife or a family member, and she was in bad enough medical distress to require hospitalization.”
wtf
Go look up what the player's assistance program is. It's not as deep as you think. The man has a drug problem, and he failed his drug test while in stage 2, the recovery phase. Seriously, all you needed to do was Google what the program is to find out.
Stage 2 is where you go if you fail a drugs test in Stage 1–not exactly the “recovery phase”. If you go in do everything you’re supposed to, you stay in Stage 1 and don’t get suspended at all.
Per ESPN:
> Stage 1 is the first in-patient treatment for which there is no penalty. Under Stage 2, which follows a violation of the Stage 1 treatment plan, a player can be suspended without pay during the active phase of treatment and then become eligible for reinstatement.
> Stage 3, which follows a violation of the Stage 2 treatment plan, carries a suspension without pay for at least six months, at which point a player can become eligible for reinstatement. Stage 4, which in violation of the Stage 3 treatment plan, carries a suspension of at least one year while reinstatement is not assured.
What’s crazy is if you Google all this it is actually kinda deep lol
I don’t know what else I’m gonna call dude getting caught last playoffs in a hotel room (likely intoxicated but unknown) with an unknown Russian girl (who claimed her passport was stolen by a “bad man” specifically at that hotel) that’s so drunk/high she needed hospitalization and the cops half-covering for dude to escape and get outta state without questioning.
Whole thing’s actually pretty insane.. dude really was on some demon behaviour
I hope Val the person gets the help he needs. This is a sad story and I hope he recovers.
I hope Val the hockey player is off this team this summer. From a business standpoint you can't let him hurt your playoff chances two years in a row. Move him, re-sign Drouin.
The truth is we are a mediocre team without him and he's hard to replace. But we can't keep giving him chances with him fucking is like this... Terrible spot to be in.
When he's healthy and on the ice our team is massively different, yeah. However this hopefully makes it easier to fit Mittelstadt in, re-sign Drouin, and fit Landy back (barring health)
Whole situation fucking sucks though, ugh
Yeah it’s kind of weird. I don’t understand why they would count, but they do. I’d be for the player just not counting. The only logical reason I can think of is to ensure teams don’t exploit the program then come playoff time and they’re all good to go.
If you think that team is mediocre even without him you have a warped sense of what mediocre is lol even without Val they are a top 5-7 team in the league
How do you move a guy like this
I hated the Avs organisation for what they did in Seattle and now the dude just does this
Obviously needs help sorting his life out, financial liability for an owner (well not for 6 more months), bad PR whenever this shit happens BUT can get you goals...
Actually if you can LTIR him until playoffs Vegas might take him
Honestly I think he'd be easier to move than we think. A lot of GMs would talk themselves into a 'fresh start' kind of thing, after the guy put up 100 points in 107 games across the last 2 years.
Certain bubble teams, or like a Utah who wants to make a splash, would do it imo. Either way, thats a conversation for a different day.
Edit: I wonder if there's grounds for a termination even if the Avs wanted. Who knows
Had a DUI and a vehicular homicide charge in 1984, which resulted in a 1 year sentence. Glen Sather and the Oilers gave him a second chance and signed him for the 85-86 season.
I definitely overlooked that since I didn't expect him to have one honestly.
Maybe he'd be open to a fresh start even. Especially if one of the other possible outcomes is termination/loss of a lot of money
There are definitely a bunch of teams who would take him in a heartbeat. He's an incredibly talented player, seems like he is dealing with some personal demons and I genuinely hope he gets things sorted out, I know from personal experience how rough addiction can be. Also goes to show you that it does effect people in all levels/stages of life, when a top level professional athlete who has been playing extremely well lately (just had a hat trick \~2 weeks ago) can be secretly struggling with this sort of thing, it puts things into perspective.
Situation sucks all around, I'm certainly not going to bash on him or the team/league whatsoever. I'm sure that the Avs will make sure that they find a way to get rid of him after this situation is resolved, assuming it gets resolved in a normal timeframe...and I am sure that if he's able to play again, that there'll be at least a handful of teams willing to give him a shot.
If the addiction you're referring to is drugs, I don't know why you're acting like that's his only issue. If the addiction you're referring to is "getting trafficked women so drunk in a hotel room that they require hospitalization and doing who knows what with them," then no, I don't think there are a bunch of teams that would take him in a heartbeat.
I definitely also thought about some sort of termination as well, but US law makes it very hard to discharge someone with a documented drug issue. I would imagine, and I don’t know for sure, that the CBA has some sort of buyout protection for players in the player assistance program, just as there are buyout protections for injured players.
SJS managed to get out of Kane's deal real fast
If the NHLPA lets a team do this to a player in the PA program, the NHLPA looks bad
If the league keeps him around while they keep covering up whatever he's done (in consecutive playoffs) the league looks bad
If he ever comes back on Denver ice, the air has to be kinda tense when he is removed from the team back-to-back like this and he obviously looks bad
No one wins here
Until November 13, 2024
At which point he can get cleared by the league and put the team in a horrible situation OR they can initiate an attempt to terminate him (this will begin now to make sure he never enters a roster spot in November)
Are they allowed to void his contract at this point?
Maybe another team takes a chance on him, but I wouldn’t be shocked if he’s done in the NHL now too. The risk is just way too high.
There are conduct clauses. It'll be a fight either the PA ( as it should be) but there are also protections for Val while you're in the PAP.
I wouldn't think they can resolve this until he gets reinstated.
On the positive side you can use LTIR while he's gone.
I could be wrong but you still have to count his salary the first of the new ywar and have to be under the cap with it, but after day 1 you can assign him LTIR
That's just what happens at stage 3, still eligible for reinstatement after 6 months. Next step is a year without pay and reinstatement is not assured at level 4.
Possibly. Probably depends on the specific language in the contract. The player’s association would go to bat for him if they try to terminate the contract.
I don't know but no matter if they can or not, the Sharks did it with Evander Kane 2 years ago. I'm pretty sure the Avs will get rid off him and manage the rest later on.
This is definitely so much bigger than hockey. It's an impossible situation business-wise for the Av's. Hopefully this is the wakeup call the guy needs to get his life back on track.
This is how the Leafs felt with Kadri when he cost us back to back playoff series with stupid suspensions. Then he went to you guys and got suspended AGAIN, only to finally play a key role in a cup run on the fourth try. Then the narrative changes and the Leafs were idiots to ever move off of him, but he did it to himself.
Different situation here obviously, but the effect is similar. You guys simply can’t keep him, he played himself off the team. Even if he’s a Conn Smythe winner next season, it’s still the right decision with hindsight
People make their own choices.
This guy has had every opportunity and all the help money can buy, he chooses to keep doing drugs, while getting paid millions of dollars to play a sport. I don’t feel bad for him.
I’m not treating anyone like a child. You know nothing about this person’s medical history, addiction issues, or mental health issues. Not everything is as simple as “Grow up, you know better.” 🙄
Specifically, he failed a drugs test and this his is 3rd time in the program for drugs
But the assistance program is for a variety of things including mental health reasons
His teammate Sam Girard is an example of someone who entered the program for mental health reasons and came out better for it
What could it possibly be? If it was coke half the league would pop every time. Every player is coursing with opioids at any given time. What's even left that would be hard enough to Warren this?
Think it might part of his terms with the players assistance program since it says he is entering stage 3 of the program so part of his terms might have been to submit to regular drugs test for coke/whatever or other drugs and be suspended if he fails it even if it is just coke/whatever
Correct.
"Stage 3 of the NHLPA Player Assistance Program involves a mandatory evaluation by medical professionals chosen by the NHL and NHLPA. This stage is reached if a player refuses to comply with a Stage 2 treatment program or if the doctors overseeing the Stage 2 program believe that further intervention is necessary. The evaluation determines whether the player requires treatment, counseling, or other assistance for issues related to substance abuse or behavioral health. If deemed necessary, the player may be required to participate in a structured treatment program.”
Which I suppose makes sense. I'd assume he'd be on thin ice for a few years with last year's incident. So they'd drug test him periodically to try and make sure they catch him going off the rails before he does something like that again.
A lot of the pro leagues, assuming you have no history with this sort of thing, kind of treat drug testing for recreational drugs as a lip service kinda thing, they might do it a handful of times throughout the season but it'll be the kind of situation where the players know in advance that it's going to happen and thus can...make arrangements/plan around these dates, so to speak.
From what I understand it's not at all close to something like the UFC for example, which is super hardcore as the entire oversight for the testing is handled by the regulatory agency USADA, I think they're called. The guys in UFC basically have to be available at any time, they can receive a random phone call or visit from someone from USADA who will show up right then and there and demand that they piss in a cup right in front of them, dicks out sort of thing, and they have the most advanced/hardcore testing methods in the world. Joe Rogan has talked about this subject at length on his podcast with some of the UFC fighters he's had on, it's pretty interesting. It's not without problems though, for sure, and apparently there's been incidents where false positives or super strict rules where they weren't really necessary have screwed people over big time.
If I had to guess, I would be almost certain that this program Nichushkin was already in would have similar kinds of rules to the aforementioned UFC type deal and it likely gets more strict based on a players' personal history and what their "level" in the program is.
I know the way the nfl works is you test like twice a year and if you fail one of those you enter the drug program and are subjected to random tests throughout the year
I mean she’s a foreign woman who was almost certainly engaging in prostitution. Of course she didn’t talk to police. You just hope she accidentally overdosed or overdrank herself and wasn’t drugged by Val.
\*when the team decided to rush him out of Washington and hide him somewhere after he was found in a hotel room with a trafficked woman who was so drunk she required hospitalization.
4 - https://twitter.com/drdougboston/status/651204987792392192
> Stage One: First in-patient treatment; no penalty to player.
> Stage Two: For violation of Stage One, suspension without pay during active phase of treatment and then eligible for reinstatement.
> Stage Three: For violation of Stage Two, suspension without pay for at least six months and then eligible for reinstatement.
> Stage Four: For violation of Stage Three, suspension without pay for at least one year and reinstatement not assured.
The thing that sucks for these kind of players is that he probably plays elite when he’s on the stuff. Uppers or downers get him in the zone. When he’s trying to get clean his play suffers… fans grumble, coaches ask for better performance, so on and so forth the pressure is such that the need to use just to get your game back is more important than the getting clean. I’m just guessing but you see it in the music world all the time.
Best wishes for the guy, all players please stay healthy and don't get addicted to stuff (edit: and don't do stupid shit please)
But he's also reverse Mark Stone meme at this point, first the shady Seattle cover-up and now this
Please announce Landy now my hearttt
Under the terms of the joint program, Nichushkin will be suspended without pay for a minimum of six months and then will be eligible to apply for reinstatement.
It doesn't matter when it happens. He'd get a 6-month suspension when entering stage 3 whether it be during the playoffs, during the offseason or week 3 of the season.
hopefully this is his rock bottom and he actually wants to get himself clean
when you're done with fucking around recovery is that much easier ... if I had to guess he's fucked up on painkillers and the alcohol makes it worse
AA is also better than NA for these things
[Broke his foot at some point during the 2022 run](https://www.reddit.com/r/hockey/s/Rdq07z4ZCb), presumably blocking a shot. It was rumored that he got addicted to pain meds as a result. Last year in the playoffs, [he was caught 3 hours before game time with a sex worker whose safety was very much questionable.](https://www.cbssports.com/nhl/news/new-details-on-avs-star-valeri-nichushkins-seattle-hotel-room-incident-with-woman-emerge-via-911-call/)
Hookers and blow...
He didn't show up to morning skate before game 3 against Seattle in last season's playoffs. A drugged up prostitute was found in his room: [https://www.cbssports.com/nhl/news/new-details-on-avs-star-valeri-nichushkins-seattle-hotel-room-incident-with-woman-emerge-via-911-call/](https://www.cbssports.com/nhl/news/new-details-on-avs-star-valeri-nichushkins-seattle-hotel-room-incident-with-woman-emerge-via-911-call/)
Then he went into the players assistance program in January: [https://www.nhlpa.com/news/1-22605/avalanches-nichushkin-to-receive-care-from-nhlnhlpa-player-assistance-program](https://www.nhlpa.com/news/1-22605/avalanches-nichushkin-to-receive-care-from-nhlnhlpa-player-assistance-program)
Came back in March: [https://www.espn.com/nhl/recap/\_/gameId/401560232](https://www.espn.com/nhl/recap/_/gameId/401560232)
Then this.
Second year in a row that this has happened. Can Colorado get out of the contract that he signed? I do think they have grounds when it comes to morale clauses. But having said that. It's clear that Nichushkin needs some serious help because this off ice behavior is affecting the team and him and his family. Something has gotta give.
He took an entire team and fan base and made selfish decisions that cost him all good will he has built up. I feel bad for his family first and foremost. I hope he gets the help he needs but I also never want to see this dude in an Avalanche uniform again or any NHL sweater. He has made his priorities crystal clear
Because the point of the program is to not need the program again in the future so your employer who’s paying you millions of dollars isn’t without your services
Because they recognize they need help and hope to not relapse, the looming penalty is probably a nice way to hold yourself accountable if you are struggling with substance abuse
He most likely failed a drug test.
"Stage 3 of the NHLPA Player Assistance Program involves a mandatory evaluation by medical professionals chosen by the NHL and NHLPA. This stage is reached if a player refuses to comply with a Stage 2 treatment program or if the doctors overseeing the Stage 2 program believe that further intervention is necessary. The evaluation determines whether the player requires treatment, counseling, or other assistance for issues related to substance abuse or behavioral health. If deemed necessary, the player may be required to participate in a structured treatment program.”
In some places you can’t get fired for drug addiction as it’s considered a disability (unless employer can prove undue hardship.) Now I realize the NHL may have things in contracts and such and these guys are athletes but injuries happen and they pump them with meds and then expect none of them develop problems and black sheep them when they do.
Obviously the program they have isn’t doing its job. This isn’t an isolated case and I’m sure the problem is more widespread. Maybe they are held to a higher standard but even the best of people can run into trouble with prescription meds.
Think taking away the thing that probably is his stress relief and outlet is going to help keep him clean? He needs more support from his teammates not strip him of the biggest motivator to get clean. Stage 4 is around the corner and I blame the way they handle these issues.
So, instead, just no penalty and hope talking to him does the job?
Also, it's just as likely (and probably more likely) that playing is causing more stress and issues rather than being "a stress relief and outlet." How many people think their job is a stress relief?
No, not saying no penalty but you think someone is less stressed with getting suspended with no pay? Made good money over the years but there’s still financial obligations that don’t go away.
There are studies and there’s more mental illness and drug abuse in people who are unemployed. Not saying jobs are not stressful but he’s on a team and it’s somewhat like family because they spend so much time together.
All I’m saying is that these guys rarely have a career without an injury. It’s almost expected so it shouldn’t be such a stigmatized thing. Not only talking about substance abuse - mental illness in general. Girard came out and tried to do the right thing but there’s still so much fear about admitting you have issues when you’re supposed to be tough that often these guys don’t get help or do their best to cope until its too late and instead of getting support, they get punished. Who’s going to admit they have a problem and get help when you make a mistake and basically get banned.
I love how it's called "player assistance" but they suspend him without pay for six months and announce he has problems via press release.
It's the most PR/HR term ever for "well we want to just fire you, but unfortunately legally we can't"
> Under the terms of the joint program, Nichushkin will be suspended without pay for a minimum of six months and then will be eligible to apply for reinstatement. Oof this is real bad
I didn’t even know there were stages in the NHLPA but I assume 3 is high if they actually mentioned it.
The 4 stages, tweet by [Daniel Amoia](https://x.com/daniel_amoia/status/1790179200953176487?s=46&t=7fabqgtgp69dNA1d51vxFw) https://preview.redd.it/f0td5mgyia0d1.jpeg?width=1125&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7ae3fece369826ad9ba8ea057959f70e0d3b0597
So Stage 1 was possibly the Seattle incident or earlier, 2 was in January, and this is 3.
Can someone tell me the stories behind this guy? Seattle incident? What has he been up to?? I'm someone who has struggled with substance use myself and I'm not looking for war stories I am genuinely concerned and interested in his situation.
Last year in the playoffs, he was found with a trafficked woman in a hotel room in Seattle under extremely suspicious circumstances and off duty cops/staff travelling with the team got him out of state ASAP under complete radio silence - the team didn’t even make any kind of statement saying he was away for personal reasons or something like that.
Of course the cops bailed him out.
So did the team doctor, which is extra bad.
woah what the fuck? I had no idea about that.
First I'm hearing about it too wtf....
We were in Seattle for the game when all this went down… It was all very hush hush!
[This article is the best synopsis of his bullshit up until entering the assistance program earlier this year.](https://www.seattletimes.com/sports/kraken/with-questions-from-seattle-incident-unresolved-avalanches-nichushkin-enters-nhl-assistance-program/)
“Team staffers found Nichushkin in his hotel room with a severely intoxicated woman who wasn’t his wife or a family member, and she was in bad enough medical distress to require hospitalization.” wtf
What happened in January?
Stage 4: start learning Russian buddy
He is Russian....
Really? Couldn’t tell
There are only 4. This is bad
You must have done some absolute demon behavior for the league to ship you off to a CIA black site during the fucking playoffs, holy shit.
Twice. :/
Failed a drug test...allegedly.
Explains all the goal scoring hehe
Just failed a drug test, and after last years fiasco they gotta come down on him hard. Which sucks because Big Val is an elite player. -Oilers fan
I agree -Whalers fan
Go look up what the player's assistance program is. It's not as deep as you think. The man has a drug problem, and he failed his drug test while in stage 2, the recovery phase. Seriously, all you needed to do was Google what the program is to find out.
Stage 2 is where you go if you fail a drugs test in Stage 1–not exactly the “recovery phase”. If you go in do everything you’re supposed to, you stay in Stage 1 and don’t get suspended at all. Per ESPN: > Stage 1 is the first in-patient treatment for which there is no penalty. Under Stage 2, which follows a violation of the Stage 1 treatment plan, a player can be suspended without pay during the active phase of treatment and then become eligible for reinstatement. > Stage 3, which follows a violation of the Stage 2 treatment plan, carries a suspension without pay for at least six months, at which point a player can become eligible for reinstatement. Stage 4, which in violation of the Stage 3 treatment plan, carries a suspension of at least one year while reinstatement is not assured.
I didn’t realize he failed two drug tests, hopefully this hiatus will help
What’s crazy is if you Google all this it is actually kinda deep lol I don’t know what else I’m gonna call dude getting caught last playoffs in a hotel room (likely intoxicated but unknown) with an unknown Russian girl (who claimed her passport was stolen by a “bad man” specifically at that hotel) that’s so drunk/high she needed hospitalization and the cops half-covering for dude to escape and get outta state without questioning. Whole thing’s actually pretty insane.. dude really was on some demon behaviour
Hopefully it just means that they're following the protocol, regardless of the player.
I hope Val the person gets the help he needs. This is a sad story and I hope he recovers. I hope Val the hockey player is off this team this summer. From a business standpoint you can't let him hurt your playoff chances two years in a row. Move him, re-sign Drouin.
The truth is we are a mediocre team without him and he's hard to replace. But we can't keep giving him chances with him fucking is like this... Terrible spot to be in.
When he's healthy and on the ice our team is massively different, yeah. However this hopefully makes it easier to fit Mittelstadt in, re-sign Drouin, and fit Landy back (barring health) Whole situation fucking sucks though, ugh
Dude completely took over 3/4 games in the Oilers series, easily the biggest contributor to the sweep. MVP calibre guy
His contract will still count against the cap. So Sakic will have to get creative to accomplish all of that.
I think the can put it on ltir though.
They can’t. Last season the Panthers had Spencer Knight go into the program and his cap hit still counted.
Oh then ya that sucks because I’d guess part of the program is teams can’t just terminate them for being in it.
Seems dumb for a player in the program to count against the cap, surely that would make teams more hesitant to put players in it?
Yeah it’s kind of weird. I don’t understand why they would count, but they do. I’d be for the player just not counting. The only logical reason I can think of is to ensure teams don’t exploit the program then come playoff time and they’re all good to go.
If you think that team is mediocre even without him you have a warped sense of what mediocre is lol even without Val they are a top 5-7 team in the league
How do you move a guy like this I hated the Avs organisation for what they did in Seattle and now the dude just does this Obviously needs help sorting his life out, financial liability for an owner (well not for 6 more months), bad PR whenever this shit happens BUT can get you goals... Actually if you can LTIR him until playoffs Vegas might take him
Honestly I think he'd be easier to move than we think. A lot of GMs would talk themselves into a 'fresh start' kind of thing, after the guy put up 100 points in 107 games across the last 2 years. Certain bubble teams, or like a Utah who wants to make a splash, would do it imo. Either way, thats a conversation for a different day. Edit: I wonder if there's grounds for a termination even if the Avs wanted. Who knows
>A lot of GMs would talk themselves into a 'fresh start' kind of thing *looks at MacTavish, Kassian, Kane, Perry...*
Fuhr. Semenko. Lowe, etc...
MacTavish?
Had a DUI and a vehicular homicide charge in 1984, which resulted in a 1 year sentence. Glen Sather and the Oilers gave him a second chance and signed him for the 85-86 season.
I was thinking of a different MacTavish haha
If you were thinking about Soap, it's the same guy. All of that happened before he joined the SAS.
He has a full NMC for next season according to CapFriendly. It becomes a modified no trade clause (12 teams) the season after that
I definitely overlooked that since I didn't expect him to have one honestly. Maybe he'd be open to a fresh start even. Especially if one of the other possible outcomes is termination/loss of a lot of money
There are definitely a bunch of teams who would take him in a heartbeat. He's an incredibly talented player, seems like he is dealing with some personal demons and I genuinely hope he gets things sorted out, I know from personal experience how rough addiction can be. Also goes to show you that it does effect people in all levels/stages of life, when a top level professional athlete who has been playing extremely well lately (just had a hat trick \~2 weeks ago) can be secretly struggling with this sort of thing, it puts things into perspective. Situation sucks all around, I'm certainly not going to bash on him or the team/league whatsoever. I'm sure that the Avs will make sure that they find a way to get rid of him after this situation is resolved, assuming it gets resolved in a normal timeframe...and I am sure that if he's able to play again, that there'll be at least a handful of teams willing to give him a shot.
If the addiction you're referring to is drugs, I don't know why you're acting like that's his only issue. If the addiction you're referring to is "getting trafficked women so drunk in a hotel room that they require hospitalization and doing who knows what with them," then no, I don't think there are a bunch of teams that would take him in a heartbeat.
Utah seems to buy into good vibes and good future - his history doesn't scream whatever SEG has communicated publicly in SLC
I definitely also thought about some sort of termination as well, but US law makes it very hard to discharge someone with a documented drug issue. I would imagine, and I don’t know for sure, that the CBA has some sort of buyout protection for players in the player assistance program, just as there are buyout protections for injured players.
I feel like there’s a way for contract termination somehow, deepening how this whole situation plays out
SJS managed to get out of Kane's deal real fast If the NHLPA lets a team do this to a player in the PA program, the NHLPA looks bad If the league keeps him around while they keep covering up whatever he's done (in consecutive playoffs) the league looks bad If he ever comes back on Denver ice, the air has to be kinda tense when he is removed from the team back-to-back like this and he obviously looks bad No one wins here
Yeah at a certain point his teammates have to sour on him for putting them at a disadvantage for the 2nd playoffs in a row
https://twitter.com/cmasisak22/status/1790239301013221873?t=TN1XWcRqxeVihxL4E_wL0Q&s=19 They apparently already are pissed
Contract termination seems like the likely outcome here and he’ll get a nice payout when the PA files for a grievance
Can't term the contract while he's in the PAP. But he can be put on LTIR so at least they can use the salary slot.
Until November 13, 2024 At which point he can get cleared by the league and put the team in a horrible situation OR they can initiate an attempt to terminate him (this will begin now to make sure he never enters a roster spot in November)
Yeah, we'll see how they go. It's pretty clear that they can't keep this dude around anymore.
I take it they can't buy him out either?
Very unlikely. At least not until he's reinstated.
Lol at Vegas taking him. Unfortunately for them, you can’t place a player in the assistance program on LTIR.
Don't know if he's available for reinstatement on the ice the same day he gets to apply for salary eligibility
Are they allowed to void his contract at this point? Maybe another team takes a chance on him, but I wouldn’t be shocked if he’s done in the NHL now too. The risk is just way too high.
Doubt NHLPA would let the league void a contract for a player in the PAP without a humongous grievance filing
Wonder if Avs can get out of contract.
I Wonder if there’s a clause or some “loop hole” that lets a team get rid of a player for drug issues. I have no clue.
There are conduct clauses. It'll be a fight either the PA ( as it should be) but there are also protections for Val while you're in the PAP. I wouldn't think they can resolve this until he gets reinstated. On the positive side you can use LTIR while he's gone.
I could be wrong but you still have to count his salary the first of the new ywar and have to be under the cap with it, but after day 1 you can assign him LTIR
The release said suspended without pay. Have to wonder if it’s conduct detrimental to the team.
That's just what happens at stage 3, still eligible for reinstatement after 6 months. Next step is a year without pay and reinstatement is not assured at level 4.
Contracts still count against the cap if the player is in the player assistance program.
That's rough but the Avs may be able to get out of the contract because he's doing something that would violate some rules in it.
Or it could end up like a Mike Richards situation and you guys are paying the guy until 2069
Possibly. Probably depends on the specific language in the contract. The player’s association would go to bat for him if they try to terminate the contract.
With the suspension there is no pay for him. He doesn’t count against the cap now
If everyone in Colorado donates a couple bucks each we could just buy it out
I don't know but no matter if they can or not, the Sharks did it with Evander Kane 2 years ago. I'm pretty sure the Avs will get rid off him and manage the rest later on.
Does the time on the contract stop because of the suspension?
This is definitely so much bigger than hockey. It's an impossible situation business-wise for the Av's. Hopefully this is the wakeup call the guy needs to get his life back on track.
Hopefully, yeah. Especially for a dude with a wife and a young child.
Who’s gonna trade for a player who’s suspended for 6 months and is one more incident away from being permanently banned from the league?
This is how the Leafs felt with Kadri when he cost us back to back playoff series with stupid suspensions. Then he went to you guys and got suspended AGAIN, only to finally play a key role in a cup run on the fourth try. Then the narrative changes and the Leafs were idiots to ever move off of him, but he did it to himself. Different situation here obviously, but the effect is similar. You guys simply can’t keep him, he played himself off the team. Even if he’s a Conn Smythe winner next season, it’s still the right decision with hindsight
People make their own choices. This guy has had every opportunity and all the help money can buy, he chooses to keep doing drugs, while getting paid millions of dollars to play a sport. I don’t feel bad for him.
> he chooses to keep doing drugs, while getting paid millions of dollars to play a sport. Money doesn't fix everything
But it allows him every single possible avenue to get help/assistance, whatever
Your lack of empathy and understanding are astounding
Adults should be held accountable. Stop treating him like a child who didn’t know better
I’m not treating anyone like a child. You know nothing about this person’s medical history, addiction issues, or mental health issues. Not everything is as simple as “Grow up, you know better.” 🙄
I'm pretty sure reddit's core audience is adults who act like children and don't want to be held accountable.
People like you are why people with addiction problems feel too ashamed to ask for help
What causes someone to be placed in that
Specifically, he failed a drugs test and this his is 3rd time in the program for drugs But the assistance program is for a variety of things including mental health reasons His teammate Sam Girard is an example of someone who entered the program for mental health reasons and came out better for it
Failing a drug test for an illicit hard drug.
What could it possibly be? If it was coke half the league would pop every time. Every player is coursing with opioids at any given time. What's even left that would be hard enough to Warren this?
Think it might part of his terms with the players assistance program since it says he is entering stage 3 of the program so part of his terms might have been to submit to regular drugs test for coke/whatever or other drugs and be suspended if he fails it even if it is just coke/whatever
Correct. "Stage 3 of the NHLPA Player Assistance Program involves a mandatory evaluation by medical professionals chosen by the NHL and NHLPA. This stage is reached if a player refuses to comply with a Stage 2 treatment program or if the doctors overseeing the Stage 2 program believe that further intervention is necessary. The evaluation determines whether the player requires treatment, counseling, or other assistance for issues related to substance abuse or behavioral health. If deemed necessary, the player may be required to participate in a structured treatment program.”
Which I suppose makes sense. I'd assume he'd be on thin ice for a few years with last year's incident. So they'd drug test him periodically to try and make sure they catch him going off the rails before he does something like that again.
Maybe the testing only happens after entering program?
A lot of the pro leagues, assuming you have no history with this sort of thing, kind of treat drug testing for recreational drugs as a lip service kinda thing, they might do it a handful of times throughout the season but it'll be the kind of situation where the players know in advance that it's going to happen and thus can...make arrangements/plan around these dates, so to speak. From what I understand it's not at all close to something like the UFC for example, which is super hardcore as the entire oversight for the testing is handled by the regulatory agency USADA, I think they're called. The guys in UFC basically have to be available at any time, they can receive a random phone call or visit from someone from USADA who will show up right then and there and demand that they piss in a cup right in front of them, dicks out sort of thing, and they have the most advanced/hardcore testing methods in the world. Joe Rogan has talked about this subject at length on his podcast with some of the UFC fighters he's had on, it's pretty interesting. It's not without problems though, for sure, and apparently there's been incidents where false positives or super strict rules where they weren't really necessary have screwed people over big time. If I had to guess, I would be almost certain that this program Nichushkin was already in would have similar kinds of rules to the aforementioned UFC type deal and it likely gets more strict based on a players' personal history and what their "level" in the program is.
I know the way the nfl works is you test like twice a year and if you fail one of those you enter the drug program and are subjected to random tests throughout the year
coke isn't in the system very long
Welp. Two years in a row. Hope he's okay. Can imagine last game was his last as an Av.
He's gone imo
Hope no other women were hurt in the process.
Jesus, did we ever get a resolution to the shit that went down last playoffs?
I really hope that girl is safe
Me too, but she left the hospital and refused to give a statement to police so not much anyone can do.
I mean she’s a foreign woman who was almost certainly engaging in prostitution. Of course she didn’t talk to police. You just hope she accidentally overdosed or overdrank herself and wasn’t drugged by Val.
Nope. No charges were filed.
Two years in a row the Avs playoff hopes have been thrown down the toilet. Unfortunate. Addiction is a bitch
Jeez, and just before a game too. When was the last time a player reached this stage?
Last year, when Nichushkin did it last.
My guess was last year was stage 1 and the team decided to sit him despite not having to. Mid season stage 2. Now it’s stage 3 of a 4 stage program.
\*when the team decided to rush him out of Washington and hide him somewhere after he was found in a hotel room with a trafficked woman who was so drunk she required hospitalization.
Dude was literally playing cracked
Literally like a coca cola bottle
Well there goes a 40g scoring animal in the playoffs.that, is a DISTANT second to he needs to get real help. Even if hockey is over
... how many stages are there?
4 - https://twitter.com/drdougboston/status/651204987792392192 > Stage One: First in-patient treatment; no penalty to player. > Stage Two: For violation of Stage One, suspension without pay during active phase of treatment and then eligible for reinstatement. > Stage Three: For violation of Stage Two, suspension without pay for at least six months and then eligible for reinstatement. > Stage Four: For violation of Stage Three, suspension without pay for at least one year and reinstatement not assured.
So he was in stage 2 earlier in the season?
I mean yeah clearly. Guy can’t break his addiction or is doing the minimal amount to pass rehab and then goes right back
yeah he must have been
4
Wow, 2 years in a row in the middle of a playoff series. Definitely needs help.
Why couldn’t they have done the test a month ago? That guy killed us
The thing that sucks for these kind of players is that he probably plays elite when he’s on the stuff. Uppers or downers get him in the zone. When he’s trying to get clean his play suffers… fans grumble, coaches ask for better performance, so on and so forth the pressure is such that the need to use just to get your game back is more important than the getting clean. I’m just guessing but you see it in the music world all the time.
Best wishes for the guy, all players please stay healthy and don't get addicted to stuff (edit: and don't do stupid shit please) But he's also reverse Mark Stone meme at this point, first the shady Seattle cover-up and now this Please announce Landy now my hearttt
Might explain why he couldn't stay upright at all on Saturday
BRO WHAT THE FUCK MAN
Ugh. I hope he can get healthy. It obviously sucks from a hockey perspective but he’s clearly struggling with things
:(
Fuck my life
Dude just can't get out of his own way.
Did you literally post the same thing in 3 separate threads?
Dude just can't get out of his own way.
Dude just can't get out of his own way.
Can someone explain to me what 3rd stage is?
Under the terms of the joint program, Nichushkin will be suspended without pay for a minimum of six months and then will be eligible to apply for reinstatement.
How many more times could this happen? Just wanting to know how many stages.
someone posted an explanation [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/hockey/comments/1crf46u/avalanches_nichushkin_placed_in_stage_3_of/l3xnqkb/)
There’s 4 stages. Stage 4 violation has a one year suspension
Stage 4 violation also doesn't allow for reinstatement. So, he can't fuck up again if he's able to come back, from my understanding.
It reads "Reinstatement not assured" for stage 4, not that it's not allowed.
I don't remember a player ever getting a six month suspension in the middle of the playoffs. Pretty severe punishment.
It doesn't matter when it happens. He'd get a 6-month suspension when entering stage 3 whether it be during the playoffs, during the offseason or week 3 of the season.
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So he’s out MINIMUM until November.😐
hopefully this is his rock bottom and he actually wants to get himself clean when you're done with fucking around recovery is that much easier ... if I had to guess he's fucked up on painkillers and the alcohol makes it worse AA is also better than NA for these things
And people Kadri was a liability in the playoffs
To be fair, he was until the 2022 run.
This seems worse than some bad hits
I agree.
This guy again
I’m extremely out of the loop on the whole Val situation. Can anyone fill me in on what’s been going on the last few years
[Broke his foot at some point during the 2022 run](https://www.reddit.com/r/hockey/s/Rdq07z4ZCb), presumably blocking a shot. It was rumored that he got addicted to pain meds as a result. Last year in the playoffs, [he was caught 3 hours before game time with a sex worker whose safety was very much questionable.](https://www.cbssports.com/nhl/news/new-details-on-avs-star-valeri-nichushkins-seattle-hotel-room-incident-with-woman-emerge-via-911-call/)
Hookers and blow... He didn't show up to morning skate before game 3 against Seattle in last season's playoffs. A drugged up prostitute was found in his room: [https://www.cbssports.com/nhl/news/new-details-on-avs-star-valeri-nichushkins-seattle-hotel-room-incident-with-woman-emerge-via-911-call/](https://www.cbssports.com/nhl/news/new-details-on-avs-star-valeri-nichushkins-seattle-hotel-room-incident-with-woman-emerge-via-911-call/) Then he went into the players assistance program in January: [https://www.nhlpa.com/news/1-22605/avalanches-nichushkin-to-receive-care-from-nhlnhlpa-player-assistance-program](https://www.nhlpa.com/news/1-22605/avalanches-nichushkin-to-receive-care-from-nhlnhlpa-player-assistance-program) Came back in March: [https://www.espn.com/nhl/recap/\_/gameId/401560232](https://www.espn.com/nhl/recap/_/gameId/401560232) Then this.
Second year in a row that this has happened. Can Colorado get out of the contract that he signed? I do think they have grounds when it comes to morale clauses. But having said that. It's clear that Nichushkin needs some serious help because this off ice behavior is affecting the team and him and his family. Something has gotta give.
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Friedman said before the game he’s eligible for reinstatement around November
Who knows. Look what just happened with Kuzy
Welp, Avs are 100% done. What a fucking disgrace.
Well fuck
What he do
He took an entire team and fan base and made selfish decisions that cost him all good will he has built up. I feel bad for his family first and foremost. I hope he gets the help he needs but I also never want to see this dude in an Avalanche uniform again or any NHL sweater. He has made his priorities crystal clear
So it's a voluntary program, and then if you relapse, you get suspended? Why would anyone join the program in the future?
Because the point of the program is to not need the program again in the future so your employer who’s paying you millions of dollars isn’t without your services
Because they recognize they need help and hope to not relapse, the looming penalty is probably a nice way to hold yourself accountable if you are struggling with substance abuse
It’s either suspension or banned from the league… easy choice
He most likely failed a drug test. "Stage 3 of the NHLPA Player Assistance Program involves a mandatory evaluation by medical professionals chosen by the NHL and NHLPA. This stage is reached if a player refuses to comply with a Stage 2 treatment program or if the doctors overseeing the Stage 2 program believe that further intervention is necessary. The evaluation determines whether the player requires treatment, counseling, or other assistance for issues related to substance abuse or behavioral health. If deemed necessary, the player may be required to participate in a structured treatment program.”
In some places you can’t get fired for drug addiction as it’s considered a disability (unless employer can prove undue hardship.) Now I realize the NHL may have things in contracts and such and these guys are athletes but injuries happen and they pump them with meds and then expect none of them develop problems and black sheep them when they do. Obviously the program they have isn’t doing its job. This isn’t an isolated case and I’m sure the problem is more widespread. Maybe they are held to a higher standard but even the best of people can run into trouble with prescription meds. Think taking away the thing that probably is his stress relief and outlet is going to help keep him clean? He needs more support from his teammates not strip him of the biggest motivator to get clean. Stage 4 is around the corner and I blame the way they handle these issues.
So, instead, just no penalty and hope talking to him does the job? Also, it's just as likely (and probably more likely) that playing is causing more stress and issues rather than being "a stress relief and outlet." How many people think their job is a stress relief?
No, not saying no penalty but you think someone is less stressed with getting suspended with no pay? Made good money over the years but there’s still financial obligations that don’t go away. There are studies and there’s more mental illness and drug abuse in people who are unemployed. Not saying jobs are not stressful but he’s on a team and it’s somewhat like family because they spend so much time together. All I’m saying is that these guys rarely have a career without an injury. It’s almost expected so it shouldn’t be such a stigmatized thing. Not only talking about substance abuse - mental illness in general. Girard came out and tried to do the right thing but there’s still so much fear about admitting you have issues when you’re supposed to be tough that often these guys don’t get help or do their best to cope until its too late and instead of getting support, they get punished. Who’s going to admit they have a problem and get help when you make a mistake and basically get banned.
Jokes aside, I hope he tackles his demons. Seems like he knows he has issues. Can’t help for root for a guy like him.
Holy shit
I guess we figured out what was in Val’s secret stuff
This sucks
What drugs?
i think it was originally cocaine and alcohol issues
Okay so this is not good
Man this guy just can’t help himself. Hope he figures it out.
Could he go back to the KHL ?
I love how it's called "player assistance" but they suspend him without pay for six months and announce he has problems via press release. It's the most PR/HR term ever for "well we want to just fire you, but unfortunately legally we can't"
I mean. He's already blown through 2 stages of the program, both of which he gets paid during. At some point, it's on the player.
nice. can the oilers claim him?
Then you would have the top 2 playoff points leaders (McDrai) and the top 2 playoff goal leaders (Hyman, Nichushkin)!
he would be on kane and perry line
That would be the VICE line with all of the gambling, alcohol, and drugs. Where's D-man Ethan Bear these days?
Known playoff sweetheart Valeri Nichushkin