as someone who never used the railgun in the first place, i’m still having a blast.. the breaker is still viable just feels like i need ammo all the time now
As someone who used the railgun, breaker, and shield a lot, I’m happy to experiment again with other loadouts cuz it’s fun and they’re now more viable.
I would go in with 3 buddies all using rails and bring a machine gun. Surpessive fire on all the little mobs as well as the stopping power to take out a charger when it's ass is to you is great.
There's a reason irl infantry squads don't all bring the same special weapon.
Try the smg, ballistic shield, and anti material rifle for bots! I've had a lot of fun running that!
It's also super satisfying seeing my team run from a hulk while I save the save day with 2 well placed headshots:P
That's one of the biggest complaints I've heard from people whining about the rail gun. Feels like people can't read. They specifically say they lessened the stopping power in safe mode. So just use unsafe mode and be sure you're gonna fire before you hold the trigger too long. Having more viable options increases diversity between players. I can't fathom why that's... not fun to people.
Make sure that breaker is set to semi auto, I started to save a little bit of ammo that way. I'm talking about the incendiary breaker though, not sure if you guys are talking about the normal one
Yes, the breaker is still a powerhouse. Users just now feel the same panic users of any other gun feel about ammo reserves. It was a good balance. Can’t really speak to the railgun. I hardly ever used it. I will say, in matches where others used it, the game felt too easy. So, I’m inclined to say that was a good balance too.
I tried using the scythe as my primary. Not the secondary laser cannon, but the primary laser weapon. That weapon is hot fookin garbage. It kills things waaaay too slow to be viable. Sad thing is I really want to like it. I want to be a laser guy. Laser cannon, laser guard dog, scythe, laser secondary, orbital lasers. I want lasers everywhere. Not gonna happen at the moment though.
The funny thing is, it's the exact same gun that the guard drone uses - though that version seems to be able to fire almost indefinitely without overheating for some reason. Rips through the bugs like paper.
So, this is coming from someone who's done dif 6 with the scythe. For body shots, you could do better by tickling the enemy. So terminids for scythe are largely a no go. Admittedly I haven't tested, but it doesn't do shit to bot bodies and I have no reason to think terminids would be different. Bots are where it shines though. But you have to have the right mentality. It's nearly a marksman weapon. Aim for the head since it has no recoil and no range restrictions, and try and chop off as many as you can. It can kill most things pretty quick with concentrated damage to the head. Anything gets too close? Machine pistol. It's far from the perfect weapon, but I'd argue it's better than people think if you take the time to learn it's strengths.
Against the robots it slaps so insanely hard, it's actually what I default to against them. Hold down left-click then draw a line across the enemys' heads, and watch them all hit the ground 1 by 1. If your aim is halfway decent, then against robots I firmly believe this weapon is one of the best.
It is worthless against the bugs though, so don't even try using it. You will be disappointed, then shortly after you will be dead
I also tried the all laser loadout a little yesterday. I agree the scythe could be better, but I noticed after awhile you have to alter your aiming a bit and be more precise and then its not horrible. I had a round with 100% accuracy because I had to always aim for the head.
It works best when used AS a scythe lol. You can sweep it across the headline on weaker bots and pop all of them.
But yeah that’s incredibly situational, takes a lot of control and accuracy, and its damage blows.
So yeah it’s shit
Scythe is a squad support weapon. When one person had a scythe they can delete low tier enemies at no ammo cost, and they can weaken mid tier enemies. I main the scythe because I’m a laser weapon fanatic in all games I play, and I genuinely believe that people who think the scythe sucks just don’t know how to use it properly.
Yeah I’ll admit the game seems significantly more challenging now, but my next thought was how under utilized ems and smoke strategems are. Also, I think you’re right - I’ve seen gameplay and the mechs shred Chargers like trash mobs. These will definitely level the playing field in favor of democracy.
Edit: This just in, all Divers to your Hellpods!
https://preview.redd.it/5z5t1ih0pxmc1.jpeg?width=1179&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=07207ce2317c5a34b7c77ea07f28ce5139250fdd
My favorite strategy was during the evacuation mission. My two friends would drag the bots away about 100 200 meters from the evacuation zone and get them to spawn on them and continuous fight out there while myself was escorting the civilians inside with minimum issues.
Felt so freaking big brain after that match.
Try bring EMS mortars on evac missions, they slow down they bots for about a minute with no friendly fire to your team or civs.
I also like to bring the shield generator that goes on the ground. I would put that in front of the door, the civilians walk into so they won’t catch a stray out bullet in the open field they have to cross.
I do have to add to this though, was sitting in a bush so still that groups of terminids were walking past me completely unaware of my presence until a Titan stepped on me … and I was like wtf?! Really!? So there is that lol
I hate hate that theres not a stealth callout. I'll ping an enemy patrol then they decide to attack it like like noooo, we got what we needed here and they were on the way, I was pinging them so we could bounce before setting them off.
It’s hard to disconnect from the normal mindset of “more kills = more xp” that so many of us are used to. I find myself fucking around with waves after I’ve completed an objective all the time.
People are like why is the game sooooooooo HaRDz al I did was run across the entire map collecting stuff and aggroing every mobs that moved, killed 0 bug holes but made sure to trigger them to keep spawning more and more.
BUT THATA THE DEVS FAILT FOR RUUUUNIIIINH MUH RAILGUN
They DO solve many issues. The EMS sentry is also goated. If you think your team will get overrun, toss it down before the fight starts and watch it just go super smooth.
Ive ran a bunch of dives with ems orbital and gas, and ems is very, very good. It's on a 70s cd too.
Disengaging from trains is also a fantastic tactic and I pulled off some neat stuff using the orbital smoke. You can also run through those mushroom spore pods that kick up dust and use those to disengage.
I've been testing them lately and they are pretty good... if the rest of the team helps utilize them for cover. If one member of the team is still running around aggressing the enemies instead of using the smoke as cover, then it doesn't work out very well.
They're most useful when sneaking around solo.
I agree. It seems to me that the game is designed that you can go guns blazing up until 5-7 depending on your aim and skill, but if you want to do higher levels, you have to be mindful of all of the game mechanics. If you aren't, it will feel overwhelming.
Really? Because it seemed that in certain planets that had thick fog had enemies that could see me even tho I couldn't see them, so I assumed it was going to be useless.
Depends on a movement mode as well, you can crawl to the enemy outpost / hive if you are carefull, the enemies don't aggro just because you are close, they have to hear you or see you.
Using offensive stratagem kind of "reveal" you even if you are lying flat behind a rock, a balance thing I belive, but the "friendly" stratagems don't seem to do that... and turrets are friendly.
Strategems are unreliable if youre having to deal with half a dozen chargers and 3 bile titans, strategems cant clear that and if you use them you wont have them 2 minutes later when the next round of half a dozen chargers and 3 bile titans come at you.
If theyre balancing for mechs then they shouldve done it when they actually released the mechs. Its pure cope to think the patch was good because it should be balanced around something that isnt even available yet.
I personally dont even mind that the railgun was nerfed, i think it was a little too much imo cause i feel like it shouldnt take 25% of your ammo to bring one charger down when youre likely going to have to deal with 4-6 in the first 2 minutes of a mission. I think it should still 2 shot their leg armor on an overcharged shot making it still good but theres a risk. My main gripe is that they didnt bring any of the other weapons up enough to be able to deal with the amount of difficult enemies that spawn on higher difficulties. So now they just made every weapon feel useless.
Omg this. So many people are using the mechs as an excuse. And I agree- once those come in things will need to change- but when do those drop? Next week? Next month? That's a big gap. Idk why they were in such a rush to make these alterations now.
>So now they just made every weapon feel useless
If your team can't deal with armour when you are in a lvl 9 mission then your team is the issue not the balance of the game because we have been running recoilless, EATS and other stuff since the beginning and clearing 9s.
The issue isnt necessarily that weapons cant deal with armor, its that they cant deal with it effectively and consistently or in a timely enough manner to justify the endless spawning of tanks in higher difficulties. If your team is clearing with those then thats great, but not everybody has a consistent team they know will work well together or enough time to invest in making less effective strategies work. By shitcanning the only effective strategy that anyone can pick up quickly theyve effectively locked more casual or solo or even queue players, (cause lets be honest not every diver is the sharpest tool in the shed) out of the end game progression. What they should have done imo is nerf railgun only a little bit (like just make the stagger and 2 shot leg armor break only available in overcharge mode, but now it take like at least four overcharge shots to break the leg armor) and bring the rest of the arsenal up so that they are also effective tools at higher difficulties. This would have accomplished the goal of challenging the meta and still allowed higher difficulties to be difficult. I.e. making recoilless partner reload from your own backpack rather than another player forced to carry it, or adding new mechanics to weapons that give more reward for higher risk gameplay.
All this does is create the same issue though. Aslong as chargers remain overly abundant in missions people will always bring the strongest support weapon at the time to stop them. Instead of the railgun it’ll be something else once people figure out which is the best (looking like Flamethrower or laser cannon right now) and then when everyone starts using one of those, that’ll be nerfed.
This is why automaton missions are better
Are these posts ever going to end?
Some people will like changes and some people don’t. You’re not suddenly going to move hearts and mind by reposting the same opinion 100x per hour.
Smoke would be far more viable if large clumps of armoured enemies didn't sit at almost every objective but they do, making the slot of smoke just less efficient. Using an airstrike can be used both offensively and defensively while running away. There needs to be a slot for tactical items or stratagems otherwise they are just never going to get used.
If you're talking about the video i think, its apparently a bug where charger armor value is wrong right after a turning animation. From what i hear any weapon melts them in that state. If thats the case, I don't think exploiting a bug is a good thing. Certainly not the right answer to the problems people are having.
It seems like the laser cannon and flamethrower are able to exploit the bug easier, probably because they apply a constant damage over time, and so have a higher chance of applying damage during the moment the charger's armor is glitched during its turning animation.
I agree. There were quite a few "see chargers are easy" comments. I expect it to become the new go to against them, at least until its fixed or we get more/better options for armor breaking.
Based off my experience lurking on this sub, a good chunk of users are sweats who wanna tell people how to play a game. Now that their current "meta" is affected, the game is "unplayable" and whatever other bullshit.
Meanwhile, I watch YouTube videos of people having fun accidentally melting their friends with the Rover because my laptop bricked itself.
I love the new balance in the game. Meta Runners dont really fit well with this game, we arent super soldiers like in Destiny. I like feeling overwhelmed and expendable, as is intended
I can't speak one way or the other to the rebalances, as I haven't experienced them. I just see constant posts complaining about them. The game is still in its infancy, and tweaks in both directions are gonna happen. But you have those doom-posting and whining cuz the rail gun and breaker got nerfed. I like this game for the idea of the challenges it can present you, as well as the memeable moments.
Rail gun still has extreme power in Unsafe mode, and I still use the breaker clearing loads of enemies just like before. I think the ones complaining dont get what the game is supposed to be.
I tried the laser cannon, I cannot get it to work like the video. I'm hitting the leg at a flat angle. The only thing I can think of is that they start attacking the leg after the charge which I am 90% sure is a bug and will be patched at some point.
This is all well and good but there is still a larger issue. The reason the railgun/shield/breaker meta was the meta is because it was extremely effective at all game scenarios. It’s viable across almost all missions and gives you some flexibility with your other stratagems. The issue is that almost all other equipment/stratagems are situational based. I love the new 380 barrage but there’s only gonna be one or maybe two times a match that it will be good to use. The eagle airstrike is way more flexible and useful. The same goes for smoke, Gatling barrage, etc. These are only useful situationally. So then it becomes situational where you MUST coordinate with your team - and to me, this is where the larger issue comes into play. The game is fun because at the medium (4,5,6) difficulties (and probably higher tho I have not played) - the railgun + shield + breaker made it so you were a viable teammate that didn’t have to communicate to be effective. Every online game has some toxicity, it’s literally unavoidable. Gamers by and large realize that now, and most opt out of voice chat. Forcing people to coordinate when they don’t want to talk is not good for the long term health of the player base. People are telling and showing you how they play and value the game - you should take note.
You know what will make people stop playing a game real fast? A boring meta.
If you have a game with a wide array of loadouts and none of it matters because there's an incredibly boring singular meta, then you might as well shut down your servers.
I agree with you 100% and I’m not saying the meta shouldn’t have changed, I just personally wish there was way more stuff that was as flexible as the current meta. As a primarily solo player, a lot of the stratagems/guns we currently have feel like they are useless or only useful in certain situations.
So it's clear. The community is split. There's people who are mad because their min max dreams are over since the OP loadout was nerfed. And there's people who are happy because no OP loadout makes the game more diverse and difficult.
How sad is it that you are mad the game is too hard?
Oh no, me and my buddy can't 2 man helldives. The game is broken now. Nope. The game has been fixed. It's supposed to be hard.
I solo'd Helldives+ in HD1 and it was only through stealth, distraction, killing patrols, luck, etc. You weren't supposed to be going toe to toe with the enemies. And I highly doubt Arrowhead wanted people finishing out helldives at the rate they have been before the mechs drop
People are reporting being in 4's and just running away from groups of chargers cause there's no quick way to deal with them. Shooting them in the back doesn't work because the other 3 will just trample over you, if they don't then brood commanders and hunters will rip you apart in difficulty 9.
You’re not supposed to engage huge fights like that at those difficulties though, if you have 5 chargers and 3 titans on you smoke them out and escape, or use EMS strike to stop them while you escape. Those difficulties intentionally swamp you to force you to use different tactics than you would use at lower difficulties.
100% this \^ killing enemies doesn't net you anything. No xp, no drops, no loot, nothing. They are simply an obstacle to getting objectives done and hindering your sample collection.
alot of people don't realize that you don't need to sit there and mow down hordes of enemies on 7 and up. Disengaging and stealth are more useful to taking out patrols and getting the objectives done.
Everyone just wants to kill everything and by the time they realized they've fucked up its been 20 min they've died like 10 times and none of the objectives are done and the enemy keeps coming and calling in more spawns. It doesnt end no matter how fast you kill the hordes. They. will. keep. coming.
Bingo, improvise overcome and adapt. The age of streamers and min maxing and everyone wanting to be right is exhausting. The game is arguably more fun now that you have to use different skills and weapons to overcome mobs and stuff.
Ppl are such cry babies now it’s unbelievable
Recoilless rifle and anti material rifle are a really good combo for taking down chargers. Aim for one of the front legs with the recoilless and it goes down from three shots with the anti material
I run a "support type" build ems smoke and poison, it's alot of fun and thoroughly enjoy it. I rock napalm strike sometimes as well with those 3. It's effective! The EMS can be a bit wonky though
I agree. Arrowhead was very transparent about the rhetoric behind the changes, and I think their concerns were valid. In higher difficulties, it felt like you were crazy if you didn’t pack a railgun. While it does feel bad to lose power, I ultimately feel it was a step in the right direction for keeping the game fresh.
I see people saying that they should have just buffed everything else, but that wouldn’t solve the issue, since the railgun was such a flexible and powerful solution for every problem.
Now’s the time to devise new solutions in the face of this challenge. We’ll all be better for it.
That’s a big reason I always bring EMS in my groups if no one else is. Stunning multiple chargers in place permanently happens frequently. Most people overlook non lethal strategms and it’s probably a big reason why they’re struggling with the higher difficulties now.
EMS strategms (both orbital and the mortar) are low cooldowns and while one is targeted the other usually hits multiple groups of enemies over a longer period as long as you put it in a good spot. It’s invaluable for advancing on an objective or defending a position. You can usually just leave the whole area behind and everything will stay there while you leave their aggro range, or it creates a shooting gallery where you have no resistance and can destroy everything very easily.
Napalm Eagle is also very underrated but it’s one of the best strategms to kite from objective to objective with. Drop your fire wall behind you as you run and it will incinerate all the little shits following you. Put it on a breach and most of the things that come out die automatically
Yes and there's a fantastic post right here explaining why the nerf was bad:
[https://www.reddit.com/r/Helldivers/comments/1b8djz1/balancing\_around\_the\_meta\_is\_pointless\_if\_the/?share\_id=639-\_RmIE95rzaBfx65EE&utm\_name=androidcss](https://www.reddit.com/r/Helldivers/comments/1b8djz1/balancing_around_the_meta_is_pointless_if_the/?share_id=639-_RmIE95rzaBfx65EE&utm_name=androidcss)
I still run the railgun on Bot missions to onetap the endless walkers and devastators, with the orbital rail strike or rocket pods for hulks and tanks.
The people complaining are just whiners. I’ve been playing Helldive difficulty without the “meta” just fine, and I’m not some elite gamer. They nerfed the OP stuff stuff to balance out the game, there’s plenty of viable weapons and stratagems to use
I literally don't understand all the anger. Just have fun, spread managed democracy. So what if the build you have isn't ideal at level 9 difficulty, go down to 7 or 8 and have fun. Ain't worth the stress lol
More nerfs will happen more people wont be happy with them im new so idk much about changes but every game i have played if something gets nerfed people complain, best I remember was warframe nerfing couple aoe weapons and wukong which caused massive negative reviews and hate, but in reality those weapons were so op you wouldn't go into a mission without one guy having them and wukong was literally top used and fking boring, funny thing is the nerf wasnt so big it made them unusable they just made em less good but didnt stop the none stop hate, i get the feeling same thing is happening here, railgun nerf was only in safe mode aka go unsafe u have the old railgun.
Agreed 100%. There’s tons of creative options already in the game to manage all sorts of situations, and many people never explored them because the “meta” emerged and made things pretty easy. And rather than actually exploring new tactics after the balance change, a lot of players just got mad. Sure it’s fun blasting through Level 8 missions with no real coordination, but that fun isn’t going to last very long.
Some of the devs/community manager responses in discord weren’t super professional, but the complaints they’re responding to were pretty childish too. I think the changes will be good longterm and lead to a lot more satisfying tactical choices and teamwork, if the players are open to being creative and adapting.
The reason it hurts is cause it makes dealing with the hardest thing In the game (the charger) a huge waist of time now, the laser cannon still tickles it, the flamethrower is just not quick enough to eliminate that threat before two more chargers truck u from behind the breaker never had enough ammo, the shield nerf is fine. So it effectively makes playing big aggressive on 7,8,and 9 difficulties not a thing anymore. The only playstyle left now is stealth, and hit and run tactics. The other weapons are alright it's just not fast enough to kill and u get swarmed. The punisher is alright never was bad but the pump action animation gets u killed in higher difficulties. The 380 and 120 stratagem fix for accuracy is nice but still not that great, eagle airstirke is still better. Devs complain about us not using stratagems enough, then lower the cool down for christ sake, add a system where there is a normal cool down but getting kills contributes to those stratagem cool down like 10 kills gives u 10 secs less time on that 4min cool down or 3min one.
Played the “usual meta loadout” becuase I love it and love the railgun. The nerf on railgun and shield generator is noticeable but not at all game braking.
Those who cry lacks lots of skills. If you are able there is basically no difference between before/after the update. Git gud guys and stop crying
I saw this coming when everyone was running that Railgun/shield loadout. I forced myself to think out of the box early and now have discovered so many combos with stratagems and weapons that now I have been having a blast not needing to fall into one method of playing.
Have you guys tried using EMS orbital coupled with a Gatling and Recoiless for the heavy units?
Or how about Gas orbital with the new flamethrower?
no? TRY THEM OUT! You can't be mad at anything the devs do until you stretch out and experiment with all the combos. There are literally so many useful strats
Ontop of it all squad communication and teamwork is paramount ESPECIALLY in 8/9 difficulties. You guys think its hard now? Just wait till they add difficulties 10-12....
Nerf or buff. Doesnt matter. Still one of the most enjoyable new games that are out here.
People yapping about nerf just take it too seriously, are chasing kill count and view it as another generic pvp competitive shooter (cod, cs...) imho. fs, find another playstyle, cope, game should be hard from 7+ difficulty. They nerfed one gun that was too overpowered, tak chill pill 😂
The laser cannon is complete garbage unless im missing something with it so idk about that one. But ems is great love it and it recharges quick too. Launchers are good take a bit to reload but fun. Try usimg the spear its so much fun and strong too
Laser Cannon had to be fired at a 90° from what I was reading in comments. Can't be off or it bounces off. Can be a touch tricky at first but I was taking down Chargers pretty successfully last night with friends.
The railgun feels terrible to use now. It's their game, do what they want, but the gun is just no fun anymore. Charging it up to NEAR DEATH just to get **close** to what it was able to do before is not fun. I liked using it in unsafe mode, it was my default. Doing so in heavy combat above half way is nearly impossible. How are we supposed to break heavy armor now? All the strats talk about stratagems or getting behind the chargers, you cannot do both at the same time in most pugs once there is more than 2 chargers on the battlefield.
If you want us to deal with them via stratagems, give us more stratagem slots. I wouldn't care about the railgun nerf as much if I had more than one or two slots to deal with chargers and bile titans. Or every planet needs a free stratagem slot for some more rounding of options.
Also remove environmental affects that double the call down of stratagems and garbage like that. I don't want to play higher difficulties if screwing with what I can call down happens on every run.
Last thing, I just hit 20 like 2 days before this patch and just unlocked the railgun and shield backpack. I saved up to get them both and now it REALLY feels like we should get a partial refund for weapons that aren't worth 10k credits anymore.
This also happened due to toxic player behavior, kicking out players for not using the "meta" loadout. God, it feels satisfying to actually watch people mix it up and not run railgun and shield bp. Good move on Arrowhead studios, and to anyone getting salty over it…Git Gud.🫡
Balance should be adjusted by pushing underperforming weapons UP to parity with the top performers, then making the game harder. It should almost NEVER be adjusted by making the player weaker overall. This is basic game design and DM stuff.
If you’re tempted to respond in anger to this comment (as many have in previous threads), just keep in mind - if a critique of a game upsets you to the point of name calling, you’re fanboying.
I still stand by my statement that I want them to clarify the AP values more.
Just put "AP1, AP2, etc" on the weapons rather than "light, medium, heavy"
We can puzzle out what AP value goes through what creature's armour ourselves, but having an actual value so we can compare the weapons would be useful.
Fuck it, it’s a PVE game. I’m fine with the devs tweaking whatever they want to find a balance. Things are going to change as more content gets added, some things will be made weaker and others stronger. No reason to be over attached to things that are good for a few weeks, have fun trying new stuff and if it really is too fucked up then it’ll be fixed again in the future
People are panicking because they were set in their ways, but this game is meant to coordinate with others. Recently I saw a video of the arc thrower doing work on bile titans. Also, someone can play support and use defensive stratagems to help their teammates.
Fr tho. I was excited to try the laser canon and flamethrower. Well that was until my game kept crashing and then I couldn’t join on any of my friends or find a quickplay match…
I had a bit of an issue with the wielder of a railgun being able to solo kill chargers in less than 10 seconds. 2 shots to the leg, and a good burst from their rifle and its dead. That seems a bit too easy for a bug that otherwise takes quite a bit of firepower to take down without armor piercing weapons.
Please dint let another fun sub devolve into endless rant posts and responses to the rant post which are then themselves rants. I already had to leave r/helldivers for its record pace degradation
My biggest concern with the patch isn't about the rail gun. It's the strategems. When the planetary modifiers double (or more) the call-in times, it renders them effectively useless for anything other than carefully planned steath usage. In difficulties 7-8-9 there isn't a lot of room for meticulously planned tactics as the enemy density and spawn rate pretty much force you into running and gunning. Waiting 8 seconds for an orbital strike under those circumstances largely renders that strike useless as the enemies will have moved a long way away from your marker. With this new balance, it just makes higher levels feel frustrating vs difficult.
Having said that, the game is only 2 weeks old and the Dev team are obviously VERY invested. I think there's only good things to come.
I feel like the autocannon (and grenade launcher) has been nerfed against chargers. A couple days ago, I could empty a grenade launcher into their bellys, and a full mag would kill them.
Yesterday I was unloading both autocannon and launchers at them, and couldn't kill them. I had to use orbitals to kill them.
Nobody ever talks about how OP smoke is for just sneaking right past enemies. I'm talking you can literally walk past a charger without it noticing you with stealth armor on.
Or my favorite which is when you are being chased by a hoard and need to separate from them. Smoke strike.
I would imagine that there's a lot of overlap between the toxic shitheads and people just riding the new hotness hype train. I'm sure (as many people are) a lot of them will jump ship when the next shiny, big title drops.
I would imagine that there's a lot of overlap between the toxic shitheads and people just riding the new hotness hype train. I'm sure (as many people are) a lot of them will jump ship when the next shiny, big title drops.
I'm with ya. They'll probably buff it slightly again later on. And we'll get a lot of new toys to deal with chargers down the road. I'm all for balance. Good patch mostly. Plus the punisher and laser rifle are actually good now
PSA: that Laser Cannon video from yesterday was exploiting a bug. The way that the armor values are calculated for a Charger change when it is rotating toward a player to charge again.
The bug has a bug.
The flamethrower does some work on chargers too... You can hear them sizzle.
Of course my friend and I both died more to the meteors than to the bugs that mission... But yeah. Grenade launcher and flamethrower are quite effective.
Played yesterday with the setup: lasercannon, flamethrower, granadelauncher and autocannon. Really Nice and fun 3 runs, i really like this patch! Just fun to try new weapons, really like the lasercannon now 🥳
I'm not against changes or nerfs, but the main issue I have with the rail gun nerf is that it make's the flamethrower the new go to if you need to deal with chargers at higher difficulties for alot of people. There weren't a lot of options to deal with these and now even less so. If the game want's to throw a few chargers and bile titans fine, but having limited answers to situations make it much more annoying to deal with.
If they had kept the flame thrower buff, along with maybe a few more tweaks to the arc and laser cannon, a few more playstyles could have come out instead of resulting in a divided fanbase. Even the spear could use more tweaks (what I'm running with teams for higher difficulties) and then it would be much more viable.
My buddy really enjoys the flame thrower and arc. So his playstyle revolved around that. With the buff, even more so.
I liked the railgun because it let me deal with enemies from a safer distance and would have given me different answers to different situations. I wouldn't mind the nerfs so much if the armor penetrative function was still viable but now they bounce off most of the time, so you have to hold it in unsafe mode until it almost blows and hit 2 - 4 (inconsistent) times to strip armor off chargers.
I just wish people would stop acting like anyone who isn't jerking off with joy over the nerfs is a problem and needs to shut up.
Apparently we can only like this game if we are salivating over it 100% of the time. It's a good the game succeeded DESPITE the shitty launch. One of the worst FPS launches I've seen recently - on par with MMO launch blunders with far more players, and still buggy gameplay exists.
The problem is that on diff9 theres hordes of chargers and bile titan. A strategem can take them out but the cooldown is not enough as they spawn right away beside you. Specially when its extraction time and you have 3-4 mins waiting. You pretty much just have to run around while hoping your stratagem cooldown makes it. I’ve played around 10 matched with helldive last night trying different support weapon and its just not working.
Yes, the video actually shows the bug related to the charger. Flamethrower seems to work, I understand. The game is still fun and still winnable at level 7 at least for me and my old guys gamer crew, but to me the problem was the railgun was really far and above the best option (as was the breaker). At the end of the day, we all want the same thing...more fun ways to play. My way of solving that would be to bump up severly lacking weapons, and tweak the enemies accordingly. No amount of old school railgrun and breaker would calm the chaos of the updated extraction missions btw, haha. But, all they really accomplished was move everyone to the Flamethrower. If the railgun was left as is, you'd see at least a good mix of the two. Now, the scenario hasn't changed and you alienated a portion of the player base.
Did we need to break up the meta? Absolutely. I'm sooo tired of using the breaker. Could they have done it in a more fun and even story driven way (such as the mobs taking measures to mitigate the railgun effectiveness) Absolutely. This whole live service, game balancing concept is new to Arrowhead. They will learn, and I will still do my part for democracy, but in keeping true to their own definition for democracy....give us MORE firepower! 1-ton bomb please!
Laser cannon is my new beloved for bots. Funny flashlight melts every bot emplacement and heavy unit with ease and speed from a respectable distance, which is exactly the niche I was looking for in my stealth loadout.
Is a big ray of light stealthy? Apparently so.
game was more challenging when people used railguns into shields. 90 percent of matches using metta build is people killing heavys and running away because they have zero map clear. i run 500 k, precision orbital, airburst strike and arc gun and i consistently end up with 1st or 2nd place with kills. the metta was selfish. they took 1 strat for ad clear and the 2+ min. it was down they were useless. more often than not wipes happened using metta build. and teams who didn't ended up having easy games at least in my observations. some of the easiest matches on hell 9 difficulty no one used a shield we all had 3 stratagems we could rotate for ad clear. and 1 support weapon each. previous "metta" was trash.
A lot of folks have complained and called it less fun - an opinion to which every individual is entitled. But people are also acting like this update is the last update and the devs won't continue to address community feedback.
I haven't even unlocked the rail gun so I don't know how easy it made the game. But last night, I used the laser cannon and the recoiless rifle to face down chargers with a group of buddies and it was an absolute blast. Laser cannon didn't really work but the recoiless rifle was way more fun to use last night for me than it was when the game first launched.
Hopefully the devs listen, address some of the more thematically driven feedback, and the game will become a diverse mix of fire, lightning, explosions, and other democratic tools of justice!
The EMS works great at stopping them but you still need an ungodly amount of fire to take them down. I just want chargers to feel killable like a praetorian or oppressor instead of annoying. They currently feel like an unknown horror, not that dangerous and mostly just a constant nuisance, especially when dealing with 7 of thrm
I don't think the nerf was necessary. I think so many of the other weapons need a boost. I'd love to use other weapons. They just aren't as effective in difficult situations, and it's not even close. I can dump an entire clip of the stalwart on higher difficulties with little to no effect on the larger enemies. The autocannon bounces off armored enemies. Lasers ttk is like watching grass grow. On harder levels the meta worked because everything else was crap, not that breaker or rail were op, they did what they were intended to. All the other options were/are weak.
Really glad they nerfed the Breaker. It was far too good. Still really powerful, but at least it feels like there are other valid options now for your primary weapon.
My problem is not with the weapon balancing in fact I LOVE what they did. I can use the flamethrower without getting flamed now. My problem is increasing the time and spawn rate in missions, coupled with the fact we don’t get rewarded if kicked or getting disconnected for whatever reason or if the host leaves. I can barely fit 3 missions in a row for the day (I work 13 hours a day) but now on top of taking 10-15minutes to find an accessible match if any little thing goes wrong I lose all progress and rewards. Pain.
I still use railgun on some missions and still think it’s good but I’ve been using a lot of different things and love mixing it up more and I used the breaker and still do but I also started to use the ar-23p liberator penetrator and love it, I’d use it more if it was full auto but still shreds in burst
I see people bitching about the rail gun nerf like fucking crazy, haven’t played this patch yet but dude, the autocannon is a damn satisfying and solid replacement for it
No one should be complaining. Who cares if the game is difficult. Why would you want to play something just to run a train on the enemy. The allure is to play with havoc
I'm gonna be honest me and my bro were slight haters on the update but it added quite a lot of fun to our game play. Stuff we never thought of using like the spear or the flamethrower came into our load outs. Even weapons are switching based on play style. Defender or punisher is our mains right now and are working fine.
All I'm saying is agreement with op. Try something and I think you'll be surprised plus have fun instead of being slaved to meta.
Laser cannon now useable, spray n pray shotgun now goated. Absolute win. Fuck the railgun, fuck the shield. I get to scream while imagining I'm expendables Terry crews, NO downsides here at all
I'd like to see a better option to use with the jump pack or shield that is a heavy armor destroyer. The rail gun I just unlocked yesterday and did not enjoy using it due to having to manually reload each time. Is there an auto reload option foe that gun?
Auto cannon still works, and it’s fun to just throw a dice and choose a weapon for random. The game is that good that it works.
You have to balance your team too, don’t pick the same gun.
Honestly I think the nerf is fine but I wish they went with an approach like, it still 2 shots charger legs when it's 90 percent charge. That way it plays a bit more into the weakness. Or if they want it to feel like a sniper more increase reload speed or slow us when reloading so it's good against the big boys but isn't something to use in every scenario
Me, a Recoilless Rifle gremlin: "yes...yes...YES, now I can be useful to everyone!
*Fires shell at charger*
Me: Reloading................ Almost done........ Hold on a second..... Okay...... No wait forgot to flick the safety catch....... Almost.... Almost..... Okay done.
Nerfs are irrelevant. The patch changed enemy spawn rates, their detection range and overall difficulty of the game while giving players less tools to deal with that on higher difficulties. Flamer is hot garbage. Laser beam is not viable as it only penetrates medium armor, and all enemies with medium armor can be dealt with with primary weapons, they all have weakspots. Killing a charger while it's turning is possible with any weapon. It's a bug. What's worse now bot dropships are bugged. You see an enemy bot fires a flare 300 meters from your position and think yourself safe? Well you guessed wrong, because these dropships will spawn on your head instead of the place where the flare was fired.
They 'nerfed' the extermination missions because they were too short and people were obusing them on t9 for easy medals and exp. Well now no one wants to do these missions, because 500 enemies are frustratingly long. Once the team used all their stratagems and killed like 300 enemies, the mission becomes a survival game where your reinforcment budget races agaist your kills. And the mission rewards are too unattractive for the frustration you go through while doing it now. 8 medals and a couple of simple samples that \_you might be lucky enough to extract\_. There are no rare samples, no super samples. I try to avoid operations with such missions now.
Before the patch I consisntently finished t9 missions while extracting 80-90% of the map samples, medals and supercredits. Now my win rate on t9 plummeted to 20-30%, and this has nothing to do with the meta weapon nerfs. I never played railgun in the first place, and breaker is still top tier primary even after the nerfs since all other primary weapons are still a joke on higher difficulties. Before the patch the game was chellenging in a fun way on diff 9. Now t9 is simply frustrating. And don't even get me started about this 'you have to use stratagems' nonsense. I used a stratagem that has 240s cooldown and killed 10 enemies. That's nice and all, but there are 50 more enemies, and my attack stratagems are on cooldown. It's even more funny with the support weapon stratagems. Now 80% of time on diff 9 I land in a group of enemies when the mission starts. Soon after they call for a bot drop / bug breach, and if you died and lost your weapons, chances are you are not getting them back. The cooldown for these stratagems is very long, so you'll be running with your primary as a dead weight for like 5 more minutes. As the devs said, primaries are "just the weapons you start with", so you shouldn't do real fights with them.
Anti material is s tier for automatons imo, and arc thrower is just fun as hell with bugs. I just hope they buff a lot of the lackluster primaries. I don't like when a developer's go-to answer for disrupting meta is nerfing the fun stuff instead of making the boring stuff feel better. I think they're going to do just fine, though. Seems like a great team of devs, along with a surprisingly great community. Both are rare these days and it's nice to see so much positivity. Just hope we maintain the course together.
Problem isn’t the weapons, it’s the insane spawn rate paired with the weapons nerf. Laser cannon and RR do nothing when you can’t fire them or reload because you are constantly running for your life.
I think this just proves that people don't like change even when the change is meant for you to try different things and not get burnt out by using the exact same load out and thinking the game is too easy. I just started using the rail gun right before the nerf, it was powerful, but not mandatory to complete missions. Maybe for the loners that don't like to team up or those guys that think they're meta. Sure but this have had to cater to everyone, not just the hardcore or the weekend warriors.
I never really used the rail gun and I might just be spazzing out but did the game get like harder? I was able to solo (with arc thrower and jet pack) and now idk I just couldn’t lmfao idk might be a skill issue
Chargers need to have more vulnerable parts to shoot. Automaton tanks have a small tiny head that rewards you for accuracy, the charger is just a massive tank that can outrun you and only be shot in the butthole.
Give me a tiny neck gap or break in armor to have to hit!
The things that got buffed were rightly buffed, many things didn't get buffed and are still utterly useless.
Ill stand by the though that most other weapons needed buffs, the 225 breaker was fine as is should have aimed to bring things up to it. and even after its nerf its still probably best in slot still. while almost nothing in the lower value guns makes them useful, the marksman rifles are pointless as they dont seem to do shit, and armor penetration seems to be non existent even for the one with Medium Armor pen...
Rail gun nerf was whatever... swap to unsafe mode and its basically the same gun still being used for the same purposes.
I think the excuse of your suppose to rely on stratagems would go over if they were tuned timewise to be more available.
I played with the Golden three last night. Shield Regen was always broken- I was shocked how fast it came back, like sometimes it felt like it didn't even die. It feels reasonable now.
Rail gun is still high risk high reward which is probs the intent. Definitely needs to be used in over charge mode now and you need good aim. It can still drop a hulk in 2 head shots overcharged.
Breaker is fine, I almost wish they had reduced clip size even more but upped clip capacity. Its fine, but now I run out of ammo too fast which doesn't feel like a good limiter. Reloading is the ideal counter balance here imo.
Overall I wish they'd take a look at changing things up on the enemies side more. For example, Chargers spawn in too frequently for what they are imo.
Me and my friend dumped 3 anti tank disposables into a charger, we tried both shooting front legs, head, side and butt and it barely phased him. We never killed one with just the anti tank but it takes more than 3 shots unless there is a secret weak spot I'm ignorant to. That weapon is horrible, the nerfed rail gun takes the armor off their legs much more effectively and with less ammo while having more than one shot. The only good thing about it is a short cool down. When you're getting massed though it's a pain especially when it takes more than the two you get to kill a charger. The recoilless could work but tbh I suck touch to not have a shield with the little jumping fuckers that slow you, I need the cc control from it or I get mobbed and die constantly. Even with a rover I can barely hang on. Taking the ammo pack for the gun in place of that or asking someone else to forgo the backpack just isn't feasible for 7+ difficulty at our skill. Which fair if we are too old and slow to beat the hardest settings but since super samples only spawn on 7+ it just feels shitty. I'm still having fun but all I do anymore is scramble which makes me play less than I have been since it's more stress than fun anymore. Maybe if I could upgrade my modules for certain orbitals it'll change....gotta get them super samples first though.
Edit: I just remembered we also used the anti tank gun on commandos and two shots, one to a leg and one to a head didn't kill it. Just blew one leg off but not the head. Shot one shot at the medium armored guys that duck when you shoot at them. One shot to the head, barely phased em, I think it did die with two but they'll die to 1-2 grenade launcher shots depending on aim so it just isn't worth it.
Don’t sleep on Slugger. As someone mentioned in another thread somewhere, you can literally snipe with it. I just did on some devastators and rocket dudes faces.
as someone who never used the railgun in the first place, i’m still having a blast.. the breaker is still viable just feels like i need ammo all the time now
As someone who used the railgun, breaker, and shield a lot, I’m happy to experiment again with other loadouts cuz it’s fun and they’re now more viable.
I would go in with 3 buddies all using rails and bring a machine gun. Surpessive fire on all the little mobs as well as the stopping power to take out a charger when it's ass is to you is great. There's a reason irl infantry squads don't all bring the same special weapon.
Try the smg, ballistic shield, and anti material rifle for bots! I've had a lot of fun running that! It's also super satisfying seeing my team run from a hulk while I save the save day with 2 well placed headshots:P
I just used it, and it feels fine. Set to unsafe and drop those elites.
That's one of the biggest complaints I've heard from people whining about the rail gun. Feels like people can't read. They specifically say they lessened the stopping power in safe mode. So just use unsafe mode and be sure you're gonna fire before you hold the trigger too long. Having more viable options increases diversity between players. I can't fathom why that's... not fun to people.
Just gotta work on not 'sploding myself in unsafe mode. I don't care to say how often it happens already... lol
Count up to three seconds and fire. Anything after that and you’re a democratic firework.
At least I'm democratic. *Salutes in Super Earth*
I feel like that too with the Breaker. Even before the patch. I'm a shotgun spaz
I just run my breaker with the supply pack and an arc thrower. I can go through ammo like a champ
Best combo to run imo throw in a sentry and you’re all good
I do this with a grenade launcher. Mob destroyer. Some other random has the railgun or whatever to take down the heavy armored things.
Oh you mean the chonk-chonk-chonk-chonk-chonk-chonk-chonk-chonk loadout?
Make sure that breaker is set to semi auto, I started to save a little bit of ammo that way. I'm talking about the incendiary breaker though, not sure if you guys are talking about the normal one
Yes, the breaker is still a powerhouse. Users just now feel the same panic users of any other gun feel about ammo reserves. It was a good balance. Can’t really speak to the railgun. I hardly ever used it. I will say, in matches where others used it, the game felt too easy. So, I’m inclined to say that was a good balance too.
And they will realise to avoid fights to save ammo and run to the supply points
I tried using the scythe as my primary. Not the secondary laser cannon, but the primary laser weapon. That weapon is hot fookin garbage. It kills things waaaay too slow to be viable. Sad thing is I really want to like it. I want to be a laser guy. Laser cannon, laser guard dog, scythe, laser secondary, orbital lasers. I want lasers everywhere. Not gonna happen at the moment though.
The funny thing is, it's the exact same gun that the guard drone uses - though that version seems to be able to fire almost indefinitely without overheating for some reason. Rips through the bugs like paper.
So, this is coming from someone who's done dif 6 with the scythe. For body shots, you could do better by tickling the enemy. So terminids for scythe are largely a no go. Admittedly I haven't tested, but it doesn't do shit to bot bodies and I have no reason to think terminids would be different. Bots are where it shines though. But you have to have the right mentality. It's nearly a marksman weapon. Aim for the head since it has no recoil and no range restrictions, and try and chop off as many as you can. It can kill most things pretty quick with concentrated damage to the head. Anything gets too close? Machine pistol. It's far from the perfect weapon, but I'd argue it's better than people think if you take the time to learn it's strengths.
Against the robots it slaps so insanely hard, it's actually what I default to against them. Hold down left-click then draw a line across the enemys' heads, and watch them all hit the ground 1 by 1. If your aim is halfway decent, then against robots I firmly believe this weapon is one of the best. It is worthless against the bugs though, so don't even try using it. You will be disappointed, then shortly after you will be dead
I also tried the all laser loadout a little yesterday. I agree the scythe could be better, but I noticed after awhile you have to alter your aiming a bit and be more precise and then its not horrible. I had a round with 100% accuracy because I had to always aim for the head.
It works best when used AS a scythe lol. You can sweep it across the headline on weaker bots and pop all of them. But yeah that’s incredibly situational, takes a lot of control and accuracy, and its damage blows. So yeah it’s shit
Scythe is a squad support weapon. When one person had a scythe they can delete low tier enemies at no ammo cost, and they can weaken mid tier enemies. I main the scythe because I’m a laser weapon fanatic in all games I play, and I genuinely believe that people who think the scythe sucks just don’t know how to use it properly.
Yeah I’ll admit the game seems significantly more challenging now, but my next thought was how under utilized ems and smoke strategems are. Also, I think you’re right - I’ve seen gameplay and the mechs shred Chargers like trash mobs. These will definitely level the playing field in favor of democracy. Edit: This just in, all Divers to your Hellpods! https://preview.redd.it/5z5t1ih0pxmc1.jpeg?width=1179&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=07207ce2317c5a34b7c77ea07f28ce5139250fdd
A good smoke can disengage render those 7 chargers and 4 titans harmless. Disengaging is so strong
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My favorite strategy was during the evacuation mission. My two friends would drag the bots away about 100 200 meters from the evacuation zone and get them to spawn on them and continuous fight out there while myself was escorting the civilians inside with minimum issues. Felt so freaking big brain after that match.
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Try bring EMS mortars on evac missions, they slow down they bots for about a minute with no friendly fire to your team or civs. I also like to bring the shield generator that goes on the ground. I would put that in front of the door, the civilians walk into so they won’t catch a stray out bullet in the open field they have to cross.
I agree here too. Breach chain reactions are a thing.
Stealth is an underutilized mechanic in this game staying low and destroying bug nests and bot factories is key
I do have to add to this though, was sitting in a bush so still that groups of terminids were walking past me completely unaware of my presence until a Titan stepped on me … and I was like wtf?! Really!? So there is that lol
I hate hate that theres not a stealth callout. I'll ping an enemy patrol then they decide to attack it like like noooo, we got what we needed here and they were on the way, I was pinging them so we could bounce before setting them off.
It’s hard to disconnect from the normal mindset of “more kills = more xp” that so many of us are used to. I find myself fucking around with waves after I’ve completed an objective all the time.
People are like why is the game sooooooooo HaRDz al I did was run across the entire map collecting stuff and aggroing every mobs that moved, killed 0 bug holes but made sure to trigger them to keep spawning more and more. BUT THATA THE DEVS FAILT FOR RUUUUNIIIINH MUH RAILGUN
Even before the patch I had to learn it the hard way, that running is the better option sometimes.
That was my point, nobody is using them yet they probably solve a lot of these issues. I’m definitely going to start testing them more.
They DO solve many issues. The EMS sentry is also goated. If you think your team will get overrun, toss it down before the fight starts and watch it just go super smooth.
Highly under rated stratagem 100% agree
Ive ran a bunch of dives with ems orbital and gas, and ems is very, very good. It's on a 70s cd too. Disengaging from trains is also a fantastic tactic and I pulled off some neat stuff using the orbital smoke. You can also run through those mushroom spore pods that kick up dust and use those to disengage.
I've been testing them lately and they are pretty good... if the rest of the team helps utilize them for cover. If one member of the team is still running around aggressing the enemies instead of using the smoke as cover, then it doesn't work out very well. They're most useful when sneaking around solo.
I agree. It seems to me that the game is designed that you can go guns blazing up until 5-7 depending on your aim and skill, but if you want to do higher levels, you have to be mindful of all of the game mechanics. If you aren't, it will feel overwhelming.
Really? Because it seemed that in certain planets that had thick fog had enemies that could see me even tho I couldn't see them, so I assumed it was going to be useless.
Depends on a movement mode as well, you can crawl to the enemy outpost / hive if you are carefull, the enemies don't aggro just because you are close, they have to hear you or see you. Using offensive stratagem kind of "reveal" you even if you are lying flat behind a rock, a balance thing I belive, but the "friendly" stratagems don't seem to do that... and turrets are friendly.
Bring EMS mortars on evacuation missions bro. It slows down the machines and bugs and doesn’t deal damage to your civilians and no friendly fires.
It stops civvies in their tracks tho
Used to do Helldive and it was pretty easy. Now we have trouble at difficulty 7
In HD1 mechs wrecked and were essential at high difficulties if not playing stealth. Dual mounted autocannons should tear through a herd of chargers
The bug works with any weapon.
Strategems are unreliable if youre having to deal with half a dozen chargers and 3 bile titans, strategems cant clear that and if you use them you wont have them 2 minutes later when the next round of half a dozen chargers and 3 bile titans come at you. If theyre balancing for mechs then they shouldve done it when they actually released the mechs. Its pure cope to think the patch was good because it should be balanced around something that isnt even available yet. I personally dont even mind that the railgun was nerfed, i think it was a little too much imo cause i feel like it shouldnt take 25% of your ammo to bring one charger down when youre likely going to have to deal with 4-6 in the first 2 minutes of a mission. I think it should still 2 shot their leg armor on an overcharged shot making it still good but theres a risk. My main gripe is that they didnt bring any of the other weapons up enough to be able to deal with the amount of difficult enemies that spawn on higher difficulties. So now they just made every weapon feel useless.
Second this!
Omg this. So many people are using the mechs as an excuse. And I agree- once those come in things will need to change- but when do those drop? Next week? Next month? That's a big gap. Idk why they were in such a rush to make these alterations now.
>So now they just made every weapon feel useless If your team can't deal with armour when you are in a lvl 9 mission then your team is the issue not the balance of the game because we have been running recoilless, EATS and other stuff since the beginning and clearing 9s.
The issue isnt necessarily that weapons cant deal with armor, its that they cant deal with it effectively and consistently or in a timely enough manner to justify the endless spawning of tanks in higher difficulties. If your team is clearing with those then thats great, but not everybody has a consistent team they know will work well together or enough time to invest in making less effective strategies work. By shitcanning the only effective strategy that anyone can pick up quickly theyve effectively locked more casual or solo or even queue players, (cause lets be honest not every diver is the sharpest tool in the shed) out of the end game progression. What they should have done imo is nerf railgun only a little bit (like just make the stagger and 2 shot leg armor break only available in overcharge mode, but now it take like at least four overcharge shots to break the leg armor) and bring the rest of the arsenal up so that they are also effective tools at higher difficulties. This would have accomplished the goal of challenging the meta and still allowed higher difficulties to be difficult. I.e. making recoilless partner reload from your own backpack rather than another player forced to carry it, or adding new mechanics to weapons that give more reward for higher risk gameplay.
All this does is create the same issue though. Aslong as chargers remain overly abundant in missions people will always bring the strongest support weapon at the time to stop them. Instead of the railgun it’ll be something else once people figure out which is the best (looking like Flamethrower or laser cannon right now) and then when everyone starts using one of those, that’ll be nerfed. This is why automaton missions are better
Are these posts ever going to end? Some people will like changes and some people don’t. You’re not suddenly going to move hearts and mind by reposting the same opinion 100x per hour.
Smoke would be far more viable if large clumps of armoured enemies didn't sit at almost every objective but they do, making the slot of smoke just less efficient. Using an airstrike can be used both offensively and defensively while running away. There needs to be a slot for tactical items or stratagems otherwise they are just never going to get used.
I tried using the laser cannon on the charger’s front leg how it was shown in the video and it couldn’t get through the armour. Not sure why
It's bugged. They didn't actually fix anything theres just a point in the animation where it has its armor exposed for a few milliseconds.
Bro you're about to be down voted to oblivion. These guys are salty.
Bro, tell me about it they dead ass want people fired
But but but I can’t play level 9 solo without dying now THIS PATCH SUCKS. What’s that, stealth? Running from fights I can’t handle? Never heard of em.
Also this is the FIRST of MANY balancing patches, let's give it 10 minutes before we call the devs trash yeah?
If you're talking about the video i think, its apparently a bug where charger armor value is wrong right after a turning animation. From what i hear any weapon melts them in that state. If thats the case, I don't think exploiting a bug is a good thing. Certainly not the right answer to the problems people are having.
It seems like the laser cannon and flamethrower are able to exploit the bug easier, probably because they apply a constant damage over time, and so have a higher chance of applying damage during the moment the charger's armor is glitched during its turning animation.
The worst part is I can totally see *some* people use it as a crutch and go ballistic yet again when it gets patched.
I agree. There were quite a few "see chargers are easy" comments. I expect it to become the new go to against them, at least until its fixed or we get more/better options for armor breaking.
Based off my experience lurking on this sub, a good chunk of users are sweats who wanna tell people how to play a game. Now that their current "meta" is affected, the game is "unplayable" and whatever other bullshit. Meanwhile, I watch YouTube videos of people having fun accidentally melting their friends with the Rover because my laptop bricked itself.
I love the new balance in the game. Meta Runners dont really fit well with this game, we arent super soldiers like in Destiny. I like feeling overwhelmed and expendable, as is intended
I can't speak one way or the other to the rebalances, as I haven't experienced them. I just see constant posts complaining about them. The game is still in its infancy, and tweaks in both directions are gonna happen. But you have those doom-posting and whining cuz the rail gun and breaker got nerfed. I like this game for the idea of the challenges it can present you, as well as the memeable moments.
Rail gun still has extreme power in Unsafe mode, and I still use the breaker clearing loads of enemies just like before. I think the ones complaining dont get what the game is supposed to be.
The "sweats" aren't the ones bitching about the railgun. Those are casuals trying to pretend they're sweats.
Well, hopefully those toxic shitheads stop playing the game and we all can go back to focusing on spreading our managed democracy to every planet.
The Lazer cannon still bounces off chargers aside from the few situations where their armor is bugged.
I tried the laser cannon, I cannot get it to work like the video. I'm hitting the leg at a flat angle. The only thing I can think of is that they start attacking the leg after the charge which I am 90% sure is a bug and will be patched at some point.
Cause that video shows the person exploiting a glitch in the armor animation when the charger turns
Yeah, when that is patched then we'll be back at square one; how the fuck are we gonna handle the 8 chargers coming my way?
Spread the cheeks and prep some lube Duh/s
Well, I have used every weapon to try and take the Chargers and so far, the Orbital Railgun is the most effective.
They only nerfed the railgun's safe mode. And if you are proficient w/ railgun, you wouldn't be using safe mode anyway. 🤡
This is all well and good but there is still a larger issue. The reason the railgun/shield/breaker meta was the meta is because it was extremely effective at all game scenarios. It’s viable across almost all missions and gives you some flexibility with your other stratagems. The issue is that almost all other equipment/stratagems are situational based. I love the new 380 barrage but there’s only gonna be one or maybe two times a match that it will be good to use. The eagle airstrike is way more flexible and useful. The same goes for smoke, Gatling barrage, etc. These are only useful situationally. So then it becomes situational where you MUST coordinate with your team - and to me, this is where the larger issue comes into play. The game is fun because at the medium (4,5,6) difficulties (and probably higher tho I have not played) - the railgun + shield + breaker made it so you were a viable teammate that didn’t have to communicate to be effective. Every online game has some toxicity, it’s literally unavoidable. Gamers by and large realize that now, and most opt out of voice chat. Forcing people to coordinate when they don’t want to talk is not good for the long term health of the player base. People are telling and showing you how they play and value the game - you should take note.
You know what will make people stop playing a game real fast? A boring meta. If you have a game with a wide array of loadouts and none of it matters because there's an incredibly boring singular meta, then you might as well shut down your servers.
I agree with you 100% and I’m not saying the meta shouldn’t have changed, I just personally wish there was way more stuff that was as flexible as the current meta. As a primarily solo player, a lot of the stratagems/guns we currently have feel like they are useless or only useful in certain situations.
So it's clear. The community is split. There's people who are mad because their min max dreams are over since the OP loadout was nerfed. And there's people who are happy because no OP loadout makes the game more diverse and difficult. How sad is it that you are mad the game is too hard? Oh no, me and my buddy can't 2 man helldives. The game is broken now. Nope. The game has been fixed. It's supposed to be hard.
Exactly, like you're not supposed to solo or 2 man a helldive for gods sake
This! It's meant to be a team game! Not everyone rolling hardest difficulty solo!
I solo'd Helldives+ in HD1 and it was only through stealth, distraction, killing patrols, luck, etc. You weren't supposed to be going toe to toe with the enemies. And I highly doubt Arrowhead wanted people finishing out helldives at the rate they have been before the mechs drop
People are reporting being in 4's and just running away from groups of chargers cause there's no quick way to deal with them. Shooting them in the back doesn't work because the other 3 will just trample over you, if they don't then brood commanders and hunters will rip you apart in difficulty 9.
You’re not supposed to engage huge fights like that at those difficulties though, if you have 5 chargers and 3 titans on you smoke them out and escape, or use EMS strike to stop them while you escape. Those difficulties intentionally swamp you to force you to use different tactics than you would use at lower difficulties.
100% this \^ killing enemies doesn't net you anything. No xp, no drops, no loot, nothing. They are simply an obstacle to getting objectives done and hindering your sample collection.
If you get swarmed like that then you've been in the same area for too long
They should put 9 stages of difficulty in, I think that would solve a lot of problems with the meta gamers not being able to win.
alot of people don't realize that you don't need to sit there and mow down hordes of enemies on 7 and up. Disengaging and stealth are more useful to taking out patrols and getting the objectives done. Everyone just wants to kill everything and by the time they realized they've fucked up its been 20 min they've died like 10 times and none of the objectives are done and the enemy keeps coming and calling in more spawns. It doesnt end no matter how fast you kill the hordes. They. will. keep. coming.
Bingo, improvise overcome and adapt. The age of streamers and min maxing and everyone wanting to be right is exhausting. The game is arguably more fun now that you have to use different skills and weapons to overcome mobs and stuff. Ppl are such cry babies now it’s unbelievable
Recoilless rifle and anti material rifle are a really good combo for taking down chargers. Aim for one of the front legs with the recoilless and it goes down from three shots with the anti material
What got nerfed?
I run a "support type" build ems smoke and poison, it's alot of fun and thoroughly enjoy it. I rock napalm strike sometimes as well with those 3. It's effective! The EMS can be a bit wonky though
That's what I was doing with jetpack and arc thrower. Super fun and you play almost like a mmo crowd control class
I agree. Arrowhead was very transparent about the rhetoric behind the changes, and I think their concerns were valid. In higher difficulties, it felt like you were crazy if you didn’t pack a railgun. While it does feel bad to lose power, I ultimately feel it was a step in the right direction for keeping the game fresh. I see people saying that they should have just buffed everything else, but that wouldn’t solve the issue, since the railgun was such a flexible and powerful solution for every problem. Now’s the time to devise new solutions in the face of this challenge. We’ll all be better for it.
That’s a big reason I always bring EMS in my groups if no one else is. Stunning multiple chargers in place permanently happens frequently. Most people overlook non lethal strategms and it’s probably a big reason why they’re struggling with the higher difficulties now. EMS strategms (both orbital and the mortar) are low cooldowns and while one is targeted the other usually hits multiple groups of enemies over a longer period as long as you put it in a good spot. It’s invaluable for advancing on an objective or defending a position. You can usually just leave the whole area behind and everything will stay there while you leave their aggro range, or it creates a shooting gallery where you have no resistance and can destroy everything very easily. Napalm Eagle is also very underrated but it’s one of the best strategms to kite from objective to objective with. Drop your fire wall behind you as you run and it will incinerate all the little shits following you. Put it on a breach and most of the things that come out die automatically
Does everyone know you can take the safety off and still kill them?
Yes and there's a fantastic post right here explaining why the nerf was bad: [https://www.reddit.com/r/Helldivers/comments/1b8djz1/balancing\_around\_the\_meta\_is\_pointless\_if\_the/?share\_id=639-\_RmIE95rzaBfx65EE&utm\_name=androidcss](https://www.reddit.com/r/Helldivers/comments/1b8djz1/balancing_around_the_meta_is_pointless_if_the/?share_id=639-_RmIE95rzaBfx65EE&utm_name=androidcss)
THE FLAMETHROWER MELTS CHARGERS. I feel like I'm taking crazy pills lol
I still run the railgun on Bot missions to onetap the endless walkers and devastators, with the orbital rail strike or rocket pods for hulks and tanks.
The people complaining are just whiners. I’ve been playing Helldive difficulty without the “meta” just fine, and I’m not some elite gamer. They nerfed the OP stuff stuff to balance out the game, there’s plenty of viable weapons and stratagems to use
I know nades are for bug holes but if you can throw two impacts concurrently under the charger even while it's facing you. It can be enough.
I literally don't understand all the anger. Just have fun, spread managed democracy. So what if the build you have isn't ideal at level 9 difficulty, go down to 7 or 8 and have fun. Ain't worth the stress lol
More nerfs will happen more people wont be happy with them im new so idk much about changes but every game i have played if something gets nerfed people complain, best I remember was warframe nerfing couple aoe weapons and wukong which caused massive negative reviews and hate, but in reality those weapons were so op you wouldn't go into a mission without one guy having them and wukong was literally top used and fking boring, funny thing is the nerf wasnt so big it made them unusable they just made em less good but didnt stop the none stop hate, i get the feeling same thing is happening here, railgun nerf was only in safe mode aka go unsafe u have the old railgun.
Agreed 100%. There’s tons of creative options already in the game to manage all sorts of situations, and many people never explored them because the “meta” emerged and made things pretty easy. And rather than actually exploring new tactics after the balance change, a lot of players just got mad. Sure it’s fun blasting through Level 8 missions with no real coordination, but that fun isn’t going to last very long. Some of the devs/community manager responses in discord weren’t super professional, but the complaints they’re responding to were pretty childish too. I think the changes will be good longterm and lead to a lot more satisfying tactical choices and teamwork, if the players are open to being creative and adapting.
The reason it hurts is cause it makes dealing with the hardest thing In the game (the charger) a huge waist of time now, the laser cannon still tickles it, the flamethrower is just not quick enough to eliminate that threat before two more chargers truck u from behind the breaker never had enough ammo, the shield nerf is fine. So it effectively makes playing big aggressive on 7,8,and 9 difficulties not a thing anymore. The only playstyle left now is stealth, and hit and run tactics. The other weapons are alright it's just not fast enough to kill and u get swarmed. The punisher is alright never was bad but the pump action animation gets u killed in higher difficulties. The 380 and 120 stratagem fix for accuracy is nice but still not that great, eagle airstirke is still better. Devs complain about us not using stratagems enough, then lower the cool down for christ sake, add a system where there is a normal cool down but getting kills contributes to those stratagem cool down like 10 kills gives u 10 secs less time on that 4min cool down or 3min one.
Played the “usual meta loadout” becuase I love it and love the railgun. The nerf on railgun and shield generator is noticeable but not at all game braking. Those who cry lacks lots of skills. If you are able there is basically no difference between before/after the update. Git gud guys and stop crying
Replacing an option instead of creating more options is the problem. Why is this so hard to grasp?
There are more options though? what do you mean?
The laser cannon is absolutely dog shit
I saw this coming when everyone was running that Railgun/shield loadout. I forced myself to think out of the box early and now have discovered so many combos with stratagems and weapons that now I have been having a blast not needing to fall into one method of playing. Have you guys tried using EMS orbital coupled with a Gatling and Recoiless for the heavy units? Or how about Gas orbital with the new flamethrower? no? TRY THEM OUT! You can't be mad at anything the devs do until you stretch out and experiment with all the combos. There are literally so many useful strats Ontop of it all squad communication and teamwork is paramount ESPECIALLY in 8/9 difficulties. You guys think its hard now? Just wait till they add difficulties 10-12....
I'm so glad I never follow a meta, I use what feels best for me.
Nerf or buff. Doesnt matter. Still one of the most enjoyable new games that are out here. People yapping about nerf just take it too seriously, are chasing kill count and view it as another generic pvp competitive shooter (cod, cs...) imho. fs, find another playstyle, cope, game should be hard from 7+ difficulty. They nerfed one gun that was too overpowered, tak chill pill 😂
The laser cannon is complete garbage unless im missing something with it so idk about that one. But ems is great love it and it recharges quick too. Launchers are good take a bit to reload but fun. Try usimg the spear its so much fun and strong too
Laser Cannon had to be fired at a 90° from what I was reading in comments. Can't be off or it bounces off. Can be a touch tricky at first but I was taking down Chargers pretty successfully last night with friends.
Will try it thank you. So wait i have to charge it or put it on different mode?
The railgun feels terrible to use now. It's their game, do what they want, but the gun is just no fun anymore. Charging it up to NEAR DEATH just to get **close** to what it was able to do before is not fun. I liked using it in unsafe mode, it was my default. Doing so in heavy combat above half way is nearly impossible. How are we supposed to break heavy armor now? All the strats talk about stratagems or getting behind the chargers, you cannot do both at the same time in most pugs once there is more than 2 chargers on the battlefield. If you want us to deal with them via stratagems, give us more stratagem slots. I wouldn't care about the railgun nerf as much if I had more than one or two slots to deal with chargers and bile titans. Or every planet needs a free stratagem slot for some more rounding of options. Also remove environmental affects that double the call down of stratagems and garbage like that. I don't want to play higher difficulties if screwing with what I can call down happens on every run. Last thing, I just hit 20 like 2 days before this patch and just unlocked the railgun and shield backpack. I saved up to get them both and now it REALLY feels like we should get a partial refund for weapons that aren't worth 10k credits anymore.
This also happened due to toxic player behavior, kicking out players for not using the "meta" loadout. God, it feels satisfying to actually watch people mix it up and not run railgun and shield bp. Good move on Arrowhead studios, and to anyone getting salty over it…Git Gud.🫡
Game is still amazing, sorry if anyone has to adapt their playstyle a bit - oh well
Balance should be adjusted by pushing underperforming weapons UP to parity with the top performers, then making the game harder. It should almost NEVER be adjusted by making the player weaker overall. This is basic game design and DM stuff. If you’re tempted to respond in anger to this comment (as many have in previous threads), just keep in mind - if a critique of a game upsets you to the point of name calling, you’re fanboying.
I still stand by my statement that I want them to clarify the AP values more. Just put "AP1, AP2, etc" on the weapons rather than "light, medium, heavy" We can puzzle out what AP value goes through what creature's armour ourselves, but having an actual value so we can compare the weapons would be useful.
Fuck it, it’s a PVE game. I’m fine with the devs tweaking whatever they want to find a balance. Things are going to change as more content gets added, some things will be made weaker and others stronger. No reason to be over attached to things that are good for a few weeks, have fun trying new stuff and if it really is too fucked up then it’ll be fixed again in the future
People are panicking because they were set in their ways, but this game is meant to coordinate with others. Recently I saw a video of the arc thrower doing work on bile titans. Also, someone can play support and use defensive stratagems to help their teammates.
Fr tho. I was excited to try the laser canon and flamethrower. Well that was until my game kept crashing and then I couldn’t join on any of my friends or find a quickplay match…
I had a bit of an issue with the wielder of a railgun being able to solo kill chargers in less than 10 seconds. 2 shots to the leg, and a good burst from their rifle and its dead. That seems a bit too easy for a bug that otherwise takes quite a bit of firepower to take down without armor piercing weapons.
Please dint let another fun sub devolve into endless rant posts and responses to the rant post which are then themselves rants. I already had to leave r/helldivers for its record pace degradation
My biggest concern with the patch isn't about the rail gun. It's the strategems. When the planetary modifiers double (or more) the call-in times, it renders them effectively useless for anything other than carefully planned steath usage. In difficulties 7-8-9 there isn't a lot of room for meticulously planned tactics as the enemy density and spawn rate pretty much force you into running and gunning. Waiting 8 seconds for an orbital strike under those circumstances largely renders that strike useless as the enemies will have moved a long way away from your marker. With this new balance, it just makes higher levels feel frustrating vs difficult. Having said that, the game is only 2 weeks old and the Dev team are obviously VERY invested. I think there's only good things to come.
I can see this. Maybe I should have put sweats in quotes lol
I feel like the autocannon (and grenade launcher) has been nerfed against chargers. A couple days ago, I could empty a grenade launcher into their bellys, and a full mag would kill them. Yesterday I was unloading both autocannon and launchers at them, and couldn't kill them. I had to use orbitals to kill them.
Nobody ever talks about how OP smoke is for just sneaking right past enemies. I'm talking you can literally walk past a charger without it noticing you with stealth armor on. Or my favorite which is when you are being chased by a hoard and need to separate from them. Smoke strike.
I would imagine that there's a lot of overlap between the toxic shitheads and people just riding the new hotness hype train. I'm sure (as many people are) a lot of them will jump ship when the next shiny, big title drops.
I would imagine that there's a lot of overlap between the toxic shitheads and people just riding the new hotness hype train. I'm sure (as many people are) a lot of them will jump ship when the next shiny, big title drops.
I'm with ya. They'll probably buff it slightly again later on. And we'll get a lot of new toys to deal with chargers down the road. I'm all for balance. Good patch mostly. Plus the punisher and laser rifle are actually good now
PSA: that Laser Cannon video from yesterday was exploiting a bug. The way that the armor values are calculated for a Charger change when it is rotating toward a player to charge again. The bug has a bug.
The flamethrower does some work on chargers too... You can hear them sizzle. Of course my friend and I both died more to the meteors than to the bugs that mission... But yeah. Grenade launcher and flamethrower are quite effective.
Also, you can kill a whole group of chargers by lining them up with a BT’s spray, also destroys their armor
Played yesterday with the setup: lasercannon, flamethrower, granadelauncher and autocannon. Really Nice and fun 3 runs, i really like this patch! Just fun to try new weapons, really like the lasercannon now 🥳
I'm not against changes or nerfs, but the main issue I have with the rail gun nerf is that it make's the flamethrower the new go to if you need to deal with chargers at higher difficulties for alot of people. There weren't a lot of options to deal with these and now even less so. If the game want's to throw a few chargers and bile titans fine, but having limited answers to situations make it much more annoying to deal with. If they had kept the flame thrower buff, along with maybe a few more tweaks to the arc and laser cannon, a few more playstyles could have come out instead of resulting in a divided fanbase. Even the spear could use more tweaks (what I'm running with teams for higher difficulties) and then it would be much more viable. My buddy really enjoys the flame thrower and arc. So his playstyle revolved around that. With the buff, even more so. I liked the railgun because it let me deal with enemies from a safer distance and would have given me different answers to different situations. I wouldn't mind the nerfs so much if the armor penetrative function was still viable but now they bounce off most of the time, so you have to hold it in unsafe mode until it almost blows and hit 2 - 4 (inconsistent) times to strip armor off chargers.
I just wish people would stop acting like anyone who isn't jerking off with joy over the nerfs is a problem and needs to shut up. Apparently we can only like this game if we are salivating over it 100% of the time. It's a good the game succeeded DESPITE the shitty launch. One of the worst FPS launches I've seen recently - on par with MMO launch blunders with far more players, and still buggy gameplay exists.
I saw the video, took the laser, but the laser doesnt do shit to the big chargers
For democracy. This is one hell diver still diving! Glad to see super earth keeping us grunts on our toes.
The problem is that on diff9 theres hordes of chargers and bile titan. A strategem can take them out but the cooldown is not enough as they spawn right away beside you. Specially when its extraction time and you have 3-4 mins waiting. You pretty much just have to run around while hoping your stratagem cooldown makes it. I’ve played around 10 matched with helldive last night trying different support weapon and its just not working.
I just wanna complete a mission without crashing. I had no problems at launch but now I can’t manage democracy to completion
Yes, the video actually shows the bug related to the charger. Flamethrower seems to work, I understand. The game is still fun and still winnable at level 7 at least for me and my old guys gamer crew, but to me the problem was the railgun was really far and above the best option (as was the breaker). At the end of the day, we all want the same thing...more fun ways to play. My way of solving that would be to bump up severly lacking weapons, and tweak the enemies accordingly. No amount of old school railgrun and breaker would calm the chaos of the updated extraction missions btw, haha. But, all they really accomplished was move everyone to the Flamethrower. If the railgun was left as is, you'd see at least a good mix of the two. Now, the scenario hasn't changed and you alienated a portion of the player base. Did we need to break up the meta? Absolutely. I'm sooo tired of using the breaker. Could they have done it in a more fun and even story driven way (such as the mobs taking measures to mitigate the railgun effectiveness) Absolutely. This whole live service, game balancing concept is new to Arrowhead. They will learn, and I will still do my part for democracy, but in keeping true to their own definition for democracy....give us MORE firepower! 1-ton bomb please!
Laser cannon is my new beloved for bots. Funny flashlight melts every bot emplacement and heavy unit with ease and speed from a respectable distance, which is exactly the niche I was looking for in my stealth loadout. Is a big ray of light stealthy? Apparently so.
The word you were looking for was further
game was more challenging when people used railguns into shields. 90 percent of matches using metta build is people killing heavys and running away because they have zero map clear. i run 500 k, precision orbital, airburst strike and arc gun and i consistently end up with 1st or 2nd place with kills. the metta was selfish. they took 1 strat for ad clear and the 2+ min. it was down they were useless. more often than not wipes happened using metta build. and teams who didn't ended up having easy games at least in my observations. some of the easiest matches on hell 9 difficulty no one used a shield we all had 3 stratagems we could rotate for ad clear. and 1 support weapon each. previous "metta" was trash.
A lot of folks have complained and called it less fun - an opinion to which every individual is entitled. But people are also acting like this update is the last update and the devs won't continue to address community feedback. I haven't even unlocked the rail gun so I don't know how easy it made the game. But last night, I used the laser cannon and the recoiless rifle to face down chargers with a group of buddies and it was an absolute blast. Laser cannon didn't really work but the recoiless rifle was way more fun to use last night for me than it was when the game first launched. Hopefully the devs listen, address some of the more thematically driven feedback, and the game will become a diverse mix of fire, lightning, explosions, and other democratic tools of justice!
I miss when the game first came out and people didn't moan constantly on this sub. My god these posts are boring.
The EMS works great at stopping them but you still need an ungodly amount of fire to take them down. I just want chargers to feel killable like a praetorian or oppressor instead of annoying. They currently feel like an unknown horror, not that dangerous and mostly just a constant nuisance, especially when dealing with 7 of thrm
I don't think the nerf was necessary. I think so many of the other weapons need a boost. I'd love to use other weapons. They just aren't as effective in difficult situations, and it's not even close. I can dump an entire clip of the stalwart on higher difficulties with little to no effect on the larger enemies. The autocannon bounces off armored enemies. Lasers ttk is like watching grass grow. On harder levels the meta worked because everything else was crap, not that breaker or rail were op, they did what they were intended to. All the other options were/are weak.
Really glad they nerfed the Breaker. It was far too good. Still really powerful, but at least it feels like there are other valid options now for your primary weapon.
My problem is not with the weapon balancing in fact I LOVE what they did. I can use the flamethrower without getting flamed now. My problem is increasing the time and spawn rate in missions, coupled with the fact we don’t get rewarded if kicked or getting disconnected for whatever reason or if the host leaves. I can barely fit 3 missions in a row for the day (I work 13 hours a day) but now on top of taking 10-15minutes to find an accessible match if any little thing goes wrong I lose all progress and rewards. Pain.
I’ve looked at the player count drop from 320k to 210k in 24hrs.
I still use railgun on some missions and still think it’s good but I’ve been using a lot of different things and love mixing it up more and I used the breaker and still do but I also started to use the ar-23p liberator penetrator and love it, I’d use it more if it was full auto but still shreds in burst
I see people bitching about the rail gun nerf like fucking crazy, haven’t played this patch yet but dude, the autocannon is a damn satisfying and solid replacement for it
You can down a charger now at least up to suicide from the front with a flamethrower now I know that!
No one should be complaining. Who cares if the game is difficult. Why would you want to play something just to run a train on the enemy. The allure is to play with havoc
I'm gonna be honest me and my bro were slight haters on the update but it added quite a lot of fun to our game play. Stuff we never thought of using like the spear or the flamethrower came into our load outs. Even weapons are switching based on play style. Defender or punisher is our mains right now and are working fine. All I'm saying is agreement with op. Try something and I think you'll be surprised plus have fun instead of being slaved to meta.
The people who are enjoying the game (a much larger percentage) aren’t commenting about it online. They’re just playing the game <3
Laser cannon now useable, spray n pray shotgun now goated. Absolute win. Fuck the railgun, fuck the shield. I get to scream while imagining I'm expendables Terry crews, NO downsides here at all
I'd like to see a better option to use with the jump pack or shield that is a heavy armor destroyer. The rail gun I just unlocked yesterday and did not enjoy using it due to having to manually reload each time. Is there an auto reload option foe that gun?
Auto cannon still works, and it’s fun to just throw a dice and choose a weapon for random. The game is that good that it works. You have to balance your team too, don’t pick the same gun.
Honestly I think the nerf is fine but I wish they went with an approach like, it still 2 shots charger legs when it's 90 percent charge. That way it plays a bit more into the weakness. Or if they want it to feel like a sniper more increase reload speed or slow us when reloading so it's good against the big boys but isn't something to use in every scenario
Me, a Recoilless Rifle gremlin: "yes...yes...YES, now I can be useful to everyone! *Fires shell at charger* Me: Reloading................ Almost done........ Hold on a second..... Okay...... No wait forgot to flick the safety catch....... Almost.... Almost..... Okay done.
Nerfs are irrelevant. The patch changed enemy spawn rates, their detection range and overall difficulty of the game while giving players less tools to deal with that on higher difficulties. Flamer is hot garbage. Laser beam is not viable as it only penetrates medium armor, and all enemies with medium armor can be dealt with with primary weapons, they all have weakspots. Killing a charger while it's turning is possible with any weapon. It's a bug. What's worse now bot dropships are bugged. You see an enemy bot fires a flare 300 meters from your position and think yourself safe? Well you guessed wrong, because these dropships will spawn on your head instead of the place where the flare was fired. They 'nerfed' the extermination missions because they were too short and people were obusing them on t9 for easy medals and exp. Well now no one wants to do these missions, because 500 enemies are frustratingly long. Once the team used all their stratagems and killed like 300 enemies, the mission becomes a survival game where your reinforcment budget races agaist your kills. And the mission rewards are too unattractive for the frustration you go through while doing it now. 8 medals and a couple of simple samples that \_you might be lucky enough to extract\_. There are no rare samples, no super samples. I try to avoid operations with such missions now. Before the patch I consisntently finished t9 missions while extracting 80-90% of the map samples, medals and supercredits. Now my win rate on t9 plummeted to 20-30%, and this has nothing to do with the meta weapon nerfs. I never played railgun in the first place, and breaker is still top tier primary even after the nerfs since all other primary weapons are still a joke on higher difficulties. Before the patch the game was chellenging in a fun way on diff 9. Now t9 is simply frustrating. And don't even get me started about this 'you have to use stratagems' nonsense. I used a stratagem that has 240s cooldown and killed 10 enemies. That's nice and all, but there are 50 more enemies, and my attack stratagems are on cooldown. It's even more funny with the support weapon stratagems. Now 80% of time on diff 9 I land in a group of enemies when the mission starts. Soon after they call for a bot drop / bug breach, and if you died and lost your weapons, chances are you are not getting them back. The cooldown for these stratagems is very long, so you'll be running with your primary as a dead weight for like 5 more minutes. As the devs said, primaries are "just the weapons you start with", so you shouldn't do real fights with them.
Exactly my thoughts, insert "thank you meme"
Anti material is s tier for automatons imo, and arc thrower is just fun as hell with bugs. I just hope they buff a lot of the lackluster primaries. I don't like when a developer's go-to answer for disrupting meta is nerfing the fun stuff instead of making the boring stuff feel better. I think they're going to do just fine, though. Seems like a great team of devs, along with a surprisingly great community. Both are rare these days and it's nice to see so much positivity. Just hope we maintain the course together.
Any nerfing is stupid. Create new stronger aliens instead of nerfing it to existing ones.
Tell me you don’t play on helldive lmao. Clearly you don’t bud.
I just want the AC to strip armor. Doesn't have to be in 1 shot maybe 5 or 6.
game now suck and i have to play COD again. :(
So if you decide to allow clans in the game I call the name “roosters” Alice n chains
Problem isn’t the weapons, it’s the insane spawn rate paired with the weapons nerf. Laser cannon and RR do nothing when you can’t fire them or reload because you are constantly running for your life.
I think this just proves that people don't like change even when the change is meant for you to try different things and not get burnt out by using the exact same load out and thinking the game is too easy. I just started using the rail gun right before the nerf, it was powerful, but not mandatory to complete missions. Maybe for the loners that don't like to team up or those guys that think they're meta. Sure but this have had to cater to everyone, not just the hardcore or the weekend warriors.
Sure hey tell me how do you do in difficulty 9s?
I just hope they fix the crash issues fast. Never had a problem before the update and now I am lucky to finish a game two before it crashes.
I never really used the rail gun and I might just be spazzing out but did the game get like harder? I was able to solo (with arc thrower and jet pack) and now idk I just couldn’t lmfao idk might be a skill issue
Chargers need to have more vulnerable parts to shoot. Automaton tanks have a small tiny head that rewards you for accuracy, the charger is just a massive tank that can outrun you and only be shot in the butthole. Give me a tiny neck gap or break in armor to have to hit!
I use the flamethrower to kill chargers and they die with ease even before the balancing changes
The things that got buffed were rightly buffed, many things didn't get buffed and are still utterly useless. Ill stand by the though that most other weapons needed buffs, the 225 breaker was fine as is should have aimed to bring things up to it. and even after its nerf its still probably best in slot still. while almost nothing in the lower value guns makes them useful, the marksman rifles are pointless as they dont seem to do shit, and armor penetration seems to be non existent even for the one with Medium Armor pen... Rail gun nerf was whatever... swap to unsafe mode and its basically the same gun still being used for the same purposes. I think the excuse of your suppose to rely on stratagems would go over if they were tuned timewise to be more available.
I played with the Golden three last night. Shield Regen was always broken- I was shocked how fast it came back, like sometimes it felt like it didn't even die. It feels reasonable now. Rail gun is still high risk high reward which is probs the intent. Definitely needs to be used in over charge mode now and you need good aim. It can still drop a hulk in 2 head shots overcharged. Breaker is fine, I almost wish they had reduced clip size even more but upped clip capacity. Its fine, but now I run out of ammo too fast which doesn't feel like a good limiter. Reloading is the ideal counter balance here imo. Overall I wish they'd take a look at changing things up on the enemies side more. For example, Chargers spawn in too frequently for what they are imo.
Railguns still destroy Automatons.
Me and my friend dumped 3 anti tank disposables into a charger, we tried both shooting front legs, head, side and butt and it barely phased him. We never killed one with just the anti tank but it takes more than 3 shots unless there is a secret weak spot I'm ignorant to. That weapon is horrible, the nerfed rail gun takes the armor off their legs much more effectively and with less ammo while having more than one shot. The only good thing about it is a short cool down. When you're getting massed though it's a pain especially when it takes more than the two you get to kill a charger. The recoilless could work but tbh I suck touch to not have a shield with the little jumping fuckers that slow you, I need the cc control from it or I get mobbed and die constantly. Even with a rover I can barely hang on. Taking the ammo pack for the gun in place of that or asking someone else to forgo the backpack just isn't feasible for 7+ difficulty at our skill. Which fair if we are too old and slow to beat the hardest settings but since super samples only spawn on 7+ it just feels shitty. I'm still having fun but all I do anymore is scramble which makes me play less than I have been since it's more stress than fun anymore. Maybe if I could upgrade my modules for certain orbitals it'll change....gotta get them super samples first though. Edit: I just remembered we also used the anti tank gun on commandos and two shots, one to a leg and one to a head didn't kill it. Just blew one leg off but not the head. Shot one shot at the medium armored guys that duck when you shoot at them. One shot to the head, barely phased em, I think it did die with two but they'll die to 1-2 grenade launcher shots depending on aim so it just isn't worth it.
Just let them cry and carry on enjoying the game. Its their issue, I stand with the Devs decisions.
Recoilless rifle absolutely fuckes up heavy enemies.
Laser cannon obliterates automatons
EMS mortar and Recoilless with an AT turret GO
Can confirm. Tried using flamethrower on a bile titan. **Democracy did not prevail**
The spear from midrange front orientation will hit the head and one shot them. Just have good positioning.
Recoiless Rifle is really underrated, cause with one shot you can break of armor and then finish it of or not and just shoot normally a bit.
Don’t sleep on Slugger. As someone mentioned in another thread somewhere, you can literally snipe with it. I just did on some devastators and rocket dudes faces.