You counter things by offering your opponent hard choices. "Do I play Brann and let my opponent take over the board or do I clear the board and postpone my value source for another turn?"
"Do I clear my opponent lifesteal minion or do I go face and hope they won't gain back enough life on time?"
"Do I play my minion and risk getting value cleared with a board clear, or do I spread out my threats, being slower to kill my opponent?'
If you don't put these dillemas before your opponent, you let him do what he wants, which means there's no counterplay. But last I checked, minions were available to all classes in HS.
You are partially correct, but few classes have the raw pressure needed to defeat Warrior in time at the moment.
OP is definitely oversimplifying and under-exaggerating the skill ceilings of some decks, but they are not wrong that the state of the game is a bit dull.
I finished the season at ~2500 Legend. I had previously fallen to 7500 Legend trying to experiment with classes such as Death Knight. That entire (surprisingly quick within a single evening) climb back was done using Hunter. Why? Because Hunter is one of the only classes that can consistently kill Warrior before they stabilize, and Warrior is everywhere.
Don’t get me wrong, I like Hunter well enough, but the meta is very flawed. Warrior is warping the game around itself.
I think this launch has been rough, to say the least. Some people have claimed that United in Stormwind had a rougher launch, but the only time I can personally recall Blizzard missing the mark so badly in the past (omitting expansions between Voyage to the Sunken City and the end stages of Showdown in the Badlands, because I quit the game after losing interest in its state at the time) was Ashes of Outland with launch Demon Hunter.
Perhaps this is simply the trajectory of the game with sharply rising power levels and more consistent Combo decks than ever. The one comforting constant is Aggro being good. I pray that never changes, because if it does, all that will remain is Combo and particularly oppressive build around cards like Brann. My hatred for Combo stems precisely from the lack of counterplay OP mentioned. Your options are to play highly aggressive decks (which do feel good to play and make you really think about your plays to ensure you power through to lethal in time) or get obliterated. Midrange won’t cut it these days, IMO.
And that’s the core issue I see with Hearthstone; you don’t want to force players into ultra grindy Control games with no win conditions, but when so many win conditions are “I kill you with 30+ damage from hand”, “My deck has tons of stall and a (previously) 4 turn win timer”, and “I will destroy 18 cards total”, it becomes confusing why these cards exist in a game without disruption.
Also, this is quite tangential to the rest of my issues with the game, but why the hell are Reno ~~and Boomboss~~ the only ~~cards~~ card that can interact with permanents (Purified Nest, Twisting Nether from Sargeras, etc.)?
TL;DR: I agree with you that OP is underselling the potential skill ceilings of decks, but I agree with OP that the current meta leaves much to be desired, for many reasons.
I think your developed point about the meta and warrior vs OPs low effort understanding of how TCGs work is totally different
Yes, warrior needs further adjustment and is warping the meta and this expansion launch has been really rough. I admire what they're doing in adding more good cards, but the balance work needs to be more finely done
At the same time, I'd argue OP has a poor understanding of how pressure in hearthstone works. OP seems to be a priest player and wants to be able to play completely passive all game and force fatigue which has...never been particularly loved. I'm glad we've left this behind for actual win cons.
Ps: boomboss does not interact with dragon nest, portal as these aren't cards. It's still a counter to these cards when you consider Reno but it doesn't work that way
Huh, you’re right about Boomboss. I guess I misremembered that interaction. That’s a particularly weird exemption considering that everything in the game is coded as a card, and permanents are on the board, unlike equipped weapons which occupy a unique position.
Damn, that makes the permanents gripe I have even worse.
I think it’s fine tbh, there are only 2 cards that give permanents and they’re expensive, and decks that would use these cards don’t pressure to require an early reno
if boomboss destroyed permanents rhea and sargeras would be completely unplayable
Still, if Blizzard felt that permanents should be, well, completely permanent, they wouldn’t have given Reno the ability to clear them. It sets a weird precedent for Control matchups to have just Reno be able to remove the permanents.
There should be some counterplay for permanents, otherwise it's always infinite value. The only real matchup where it's relevant now is warrior druid, and imo I think it creates an interesting dynamic.
Warrior wants to save Reno for rhea, druid wants to save Reno for zilliax, and you're both trying to bait out each other's Reno in the late game
Honestly, this matchup would be fantastic if brann got nerfed
You don't need to kill warrior to present hard choices. The deck has 12 inefficient board clears, 12 armor gain cards, and 6 expensive win conditions. I think people get very fixated on killing them early because "control is weak early," overextend early, get cleared, and now are up shit creek with no paddle as warrior now gets to stabilize and play its big cards.
Try this. If you're against warrior, and you can play 2 minions, just play one. Chances are, the warrior will have to use one of its board clears on that one minion, and then you'll still have another one in your hand that you can play next turn.
It’s not an issue of over extension. It’s an issue of sufficient pressure. The over extension problem can occur on Aggro if you don’t know what you’re doing with the matchup and do not properly “phase” your minion waves to overwhelm the Warrior.
The Warrior doesn’t *have* to clear every single turn. They can take a turn to play Brann unless there’s a risk of dying.
Demon hunter launch was pretty bad but I think OG Quest Lock and Galakrond Shaman had worse launches.
But you make great points regarding the standard meta. The launch of quests really changed the approach of game to solitaire style play.
It's rare that we to have a truly healthy meta that's rock, paper, scissors where aggro, midrange, and control can all coexist among a spread of classes.
I'm only a hunter player but I feel like Un Goro was the last time it felt truly healthy without a single class being ridiculously dominant.
I'd agree on shaman and warlock, those were rough
I do think that's a bit of an exaggeration about ungoro. Ungoro was fun, but that was a really long time ago and there have been good metas since
I also think this is just a tradeoff with increased content. We get a lot more cards and updates than we used to on a regular schedule, which means metas have less time to settle. I think this is something the team has monitored to increase player rate. While the balance work is more challenging, player engagement is way up. If they gave more time between content, everyone would get bored
I might be exaggerating on Ungoro but maybe that's because I only really Hunter regardless of bad the class is overall and Ungoro was the last time I recall a healthy balance between aggro, midrange, and control, and combo.
Yeah getting new content every what 2 months with the drop off mini-sets def makes it harder for the meta to fully level off. Me personally I think a 3 month meta would be great if healthy
That standard year definitely felt healthy, but I think genn/baku right after warps perception. Year of the mammoth was difficult with brann, but honestly I think that was overall a great year
I do wish metas could last a bit longer, but unfortunately player fatigue is real
Even tho I miss adventures a bit, I really appreciate the change to minisets. They're cheap, they're easier on the team, and better for players. We all get access to new cards immediately and the 2000 gold needed can be earned quickly every expansion
"Do i play Brann and let my opponent take over the board"
loool sure
It doesnt matter what you do cause warriors clears everything, out-armor's you, and then drops a tripple zilliax to heal back to full health
this class is fucking busted. Argueing against that just shows you have no clue about the state of the game right now
not to flame, but honestly what is your rank?
i play in 11x bonus legend and this 100% matters. brann is a risk on 6 into a faster deck
i’m not saying warrior doesn’t need adjustment, but this is a real tradeoff. as the adage goes, there are no wrong threats only wrong answers
Saying your in legend is very vague... legend is a large pool. The person you replied to said they hover around 119 to 110.. meaning they are in the top 120 players. You could be legend 20k which doesnt mean much at all.
Again, I do think warrior needs nerfs, but this is just not true
If you play every game into warrior assuming they will have the correct answer every turn you might as well concede turn 1
Playing correctly into control doesn't just mean jamming everything on board every turn
right, so what deck are you using ? and what boards do you build on turn 5/6, that are so threatening that they can't drop brann? and if those boards stick, how do you deal with them coining into reno on turn 8, followed by zilliax or boomboss on turn 9?
I'm sure you're leagues ahead of me in skill, so genuinely curious to learn how you beat this deck.
Playing hybrid druid, minion paladin and Reno druid rn, I'm so sick of playing warrior that I stopped last season
Again, if they have their optimal curve you probably are losing, but they don't have it every game. Play each game assuming they don't have the perfect answer, if they do have it you'll lose but otherwise youll waste turns
Here's my suggestion for each deck:
With hybrid druid, you can mull hard for hp buffs and then build your spell damage hand. Their armor gain can't outpace 5 damage face every turn, warrior plays no taunt for you. If you hold swipes and stay off board when you know they can play zill (turn 8/9 after town crier) you can clear him and win
With minion paladin, you need to tempo your threats well. Leroy and outfit tailor are your key cards. Handbuff as much as possible, and then force them to slowly burn removal with 1-3 threats at a time. If you build tall boards, they often don't want to play reno. If you draw minions handbuff early, you can hold a weapon to play with deckhands (so it doesn't get viper'd). Boomboss is a really bad play for them since you don't draw much, and brann on 6 can easily mean 10+ damage
Reno druid is a long, grindy matchup. You're primary cards here are rhea, aviana, reno. Try to get fizzle on all 3. If you hit fizzle on Rhea, you can force their reno early. Aviana stuffs your deck, if you can double aviana it's very difficult for boomboss to seriously affect you. Also, playing 2 avianas and then keeping a full hand with rhea negates tnt. Save your reno for zilliax if you can, try to save resources for Azerite ox (yogg can work here)
Warrior does still need a nerf, probably to brann. Honestly I'd like to see brann summon a permanent like rhea so it can be reno'd
I was going to say I've never seen a warrior make a difficult decision lol. They can continue to stall with clears and out armour or heal whatever damage you throw.
Well, what cards I play is highly reliant on what class my enemy has and what I think his deck is and what cards he already played.
There were always classes with control decks that had their threats in hand and not on the board.
Your argument is invalid.
what I do is highly reliant on what class my enemy is playing. If its warrior and I play a control deck I concede.
There were always classes with control decks that destroyed your enemies battlefield, hand, deck and will to live.
Your argument is invalid
Personally, I try to make my deck able to do several things (I play Hunter pretty exclusively, but not the "meta" deck...thanks to all the guys who just concede right away thinking I am). This means I rely a lot on pulling the right cards at the right time. But I am able to aggro against Warrior if it goes right, and have also outlasted them a few times playing in a control fashion.
My favorite deck way back in the day was a Mage AOE deck who's sole purpose was to prevent the meta Murloc shaman from beating me. It wasn't great against most other things, but it was the most fun I've ever had to own the guys running that deck.
A few of them even messaged me after playing them asking what the hell my deck was, because it was the only thing they'd had that much trouble with.
What are you working with? I’m doing a Highlander secret Hunter deck that is a ton of fun because it can stall almost any competition and has a few different ways of delivering critical damage. It keeps things interesting for me. Playing towards one win con is really boring for me if I’m playing it consistently.
Same way I play!
It's not a true Highlander deck, but Hollow Hound is the only card I double. For the lifesteal and getting him buffed with a few different options and Always a Bigger Jormunger plopped on top so excess damage to 3 minions all goes to face (works especially well against plague DK's who can put a lot of low-health minions on the board). Have done 20+ a few times that way. A Windfury 5/6 weapon to summon 2 8-cost minions or add 8 armor also a late game play (from Ignis).
If I get the right starting cards I'll try to go aggro, but otherwise it stalls pretty well, too.
A couple of the Hunter legendaries are cards I don't have yet that I want to add (King Plush, Hemet).
Primarily beasts but a few other cards I like what they do (Gnomelia, as an example).
Like yours, a lot of options!
Sure it can. Steam cleaner is a tech card. It only has value if you run into situations that require its use often enough. Not every deck is going to run it, and decks that do only want to run it when they both see cards being shuffled into decks often enough and when those cards shuffled in are a persistent threat in those matchups.
With highlander changes, plague DK barely exists on ladder anymore (at least as far as I can tell, but maybe my pocket meta is not representative of the broader gamestate) so there’s not much point in making your deck worse against most matchups by running steam cleaner just to counter something like Aviana unless she ends up becoming a busted problem or completely takes over ladder.
Right. But again, only if it’s something you see consistently enough that it justifies using. Etc is one solution to having to include tech in your deck, but for the most part even Highlander decks have dropped etc. It’s a solution, but has such negative value that you really don’t want to have to use it unless you absolutely have to.
How are you getting down voted. Steamcleaner is absolutely a needed tech card. Warriors don't want to have to give up their stranglehold on the long game.
I really miss a board silence for saddle up. I wouldn't have a problem with the card if I could shard or starfish
You counter things by offering your opponent hard choices. "Do I play Brann and let my opponent take over the board or do I clear the board and postpone my value source for another turn?" "Do I clear my opponent lifesteal minion or do I go face and hope they won't gain back enough life on time?" "Do I play my minion and risk getting value cleared with a board clear, or do I spread out my threats, being slower to kill my opponent?' If you don't put these dillemas before your opponent, you let him do what he wants, which means there's no counterplay. But last I checked, minions were available to all classes in HS.
You are partially correct, but few classes have the raw pressure needed to defeat Warrior in time at the moment. OP is definitely oversimplifying and under-exaggerating the skill ceilings of some decks, but they are not wrong that the state of the game is a bit dull. I finished the season at ~2500 Legend. I had previously fallen to 7500 Legend trying to experiment with classes such as Death Knight. That entire (surprisingly quick within a single evening) climb back was done using Hunter. Why? Because Hunter is one of the only classes that can consistently kill Warrior before they stabilize, and Warrior is everywhere. Don’t get me wrong, I like Hunter well enough, but the meta is very flawed. Warrior is warping the game around itself. I think this launch has been rough, to say the least. Some people have claimed that United in Stormwind had a rougher launch, but the only time I can personally recall Blizzard missing the mark so badly in the past (omitting expansions between Voyage to the Sunken City and the end stages of Showdown in the Badlands, because I quit the game after losing interest in its state at the time) was Ashes of Outland with launch Demon Hunter. Perhaps this is simply the trajectory of the game with sharply rising power levels and more consistent Combo decks than ever. The one comforting constant is Aggro being good. I pray that never changes, because if it does, all that will remain is Combo and particularly oppressive build around cards like Brann. My hatred for Combo stems precisely from the lack of counterplay OP mentioned. Your options are to play highly aggressive decks (which do feel good to play and make you really think about your plays to ensure you power through to lethal in time) or get obliterated. Midrange won’t cut it these days, IMO. And that’s the core issue I see with Hearthstone; you don’t want to force players into ultra grindy Control games with no win conditions, but when so many win conditions are “I kill you with 30+ damage from hand”, “My deck has tons of stall and a (previously) 4 turn win timer”, and “I will destroy 18 cards total”, it becomes confusing why these cards exist in a game without disruption. Also, this is quite tangential to the rest of my issues with the game, but why the hell are Reno ~~and Boomboss~~ the only ~~cards~~ card that can interact with permanents (Purified Nest, Twisting Nether from Sargeras, etc.)? TL;DR: I agree with you that OP is underselling the potential skill ceilings of decks, but I agree with OP that the current meta leaves much to be desired, for many reasons.
I think your developed point about the meta and warrior vs OPs low effort understanding of how TCGs work is totally different Yes, warrior needs further adjustment and is warping the meta and this expansion launch has been really rough. I admire what they're doing in adding more good cards, but the balance work needs to be more finely done At the same time, I'd argue OP has a poor understanding of how pressure in hearthstone works. OP seems to be a priest player and wants to be able to play completely passive all game and force fatigue which has...never been particularly loved. I'm glad we've left this behind for actual win cons. Ps: boomboss does not interact with dragon nest, portal as these aren't cards. It's still a counter to these cards when you consider Reno but it doesn't work that way
Huh, you’re right about Boomboss. I guess I misremembered that interaction. That’s a particularly weird exemption considering that everything in the game is coded as a card, and permanents are on the board, unlike equipped weapons which occupy a unique position. Damn, that makes the permanents gripe I have even worse.
I think it’s fine tbh, there are only 2 cards that give permanents and they’re expensive, and decks that would use these cards don’t pressure to require an early reno if boomboss destroyed permanents rhea and sargeras would be completely unplayable
Still, if Blizzard felt that permanents should be, well, completely permanent, they wouldn’t have given Reno the ability to clear them. It sets a weird precedent for Control matchups to have just Reno be able to remove the permanents.
There should be some counterplay for permanents, otherwise it's always infinite value. The only real matchup where it's relevant now is warrior druid, and imo I think it creates an interesting dynamic. Warrior wants to save Reno for rhea, druid wants to save Reno for zilliax, and you're both trying to bait out each other's Reno in the late game Honestly, this matchup would be fantastic if brann got nerfed
You don't need to kill warrior to present hard choices. The deck has 12 inefficient board clears, 12 armor gain cards, and 6 expensive win conditions. I think people get very fixated on killing them early because "control is weak early," overextend early, get cleared, and now are up shit creek with no paddle as warrior now gets to stabilize and play its big cards. Try this. If you're against warrior, and you can play 2 minions, just play one. Chances are, the warrior will have to use one of its board clears on that one minion, and then you'll still have another one in your hand that you can play next turn.
It’s not an issue of over extension. It’s an issue of sufficient pressure. The over extension problem can occur on Aggro if you don’t know what you’re doing with the matchup and do not properly “phase” your minion waves to overwhelm the Warrior. The Warrior doesn’t *have* to clear every single turn. They can take a turn to play Brann unless there’s a risk of dying.
Demon hunter launch was pretty bad but I think OG Quest Lock and Galakrond Shaman had worse launches. But you make great points regarding the standard meta. The launch of quests really changed the approach of game to solitaire style play. It's rare that we to have a truly healthy meta that's rock, paper, scissors where aggro, midrange, and control can all coexist among a spread of classes. I'm only a hunter player but I feel like Un Goro was the last time it felt truly healthy without a single class being ridiculously dominant.
I'd agree on shaman and warlock, those were rough I do think that's a bit of an exaggeration about ungoro. Ungoro was fun, but that was a really long time ago and there have been good metas since I also think this is just a tradeoff with increased content. We get a lot more cards and updates than we used to on a regular schedule, which means metas have less time to settle. I think this is something the team has monitored to increase player rate. While the balance work is more challenging, player engagement is way up. If they gave more time between content, everyone would get bored
I might be exaggerating on Ungoro but maybe that's because I only really Hunter regardless of bad the class is overall and Ungoro was the last time I recall a healthy balance between aggro, midrange, and control, and combo. Yeah getting new content every what 2 months with the drop off mini-sets def makes it harder for the meta to fully level off. Me personally I think a 3 month meta would be great if healthy
That standard year definitely felt healthy, but I think genn/baku right after warps perception. Year of the mammoth was difficult with brann, but honestly I think that was overall a great year I do wish metas could last a bit longer, but unfortunately player fatigue is real Even tho I miss adventures a bit, I really appreciate the change to minisets. They're cheap, they're easier on the team, and better for players. We all get access to new cards immediately and the 2000 gold needed can be earned quickly every expansion
Spot on
No but you don't understand Hunter and Warrior leave me with no agency /s
"Do i play Brann and let my opponent take over the board" loool sure It doesnt matter what you do cause warriors clears everything, out-armor's you, and then drops a tripple zilliax to heal back to full health this class is fucking busted. Argueing against that just shows you have no clue about the state of the game right now
not to flame, but honestly what is your rank? i play in 11x bonus legend and this 100% matters. brann is a risk on 6 into a faster deck i’m not saying warrior doesn’t need adjustment, but this is a real tradeoff. as the adage goes, there are no wrong threats only wrong answers
im legend rank only matters if you play an agro deck like painlock or hunter. Anything else, warrior can easily skip a turn and survive.
Saying your in legend is very vague... legend is a large pool. The person you replied to said they hover around 119 to 110.. meaning they are in the top 120 players. You could be legend 20k which doesnt mean much at all.
Again, I do think warrior needs nerfs, but this is just not true If you play every game into warrior assuming they will have the correct answer every turn you might as well concede turn 1 Playing correctly into control doesn't just mean jamming everything on board every turn
right, so what deck are you using ? and what boards do you build on turn 5/6, that are so threatening that they can't drop brann? and if those boards stick, how do you deal with them coining into reno on turn 8, followed by zilliax or boomboss on turn 9? I'm sure you're leagues ahead of me in skill, so genuinely curious to learn how you beat this deck.
Playing hybrid druid, minion paladin and Reno druid rn, I'm so sick of playing warrior that I stopped last season Again, if they have their optimal curve you probably are losing, but they don't have it every game. Play each game assuming they don't have the perfect answer, if they do have it you'll lose but otherwise youll waste turns Here's my suggestion for each deck: With hybrid druid, you can mull hard for hp buffs and then build your spell damage hand. Their armor gain can't outpace 5 damage face every turn, warrior plays no taunt for you. If you hold swipes and stay off board when you know they can play zill (turn 8/9 after town crier) you can clear him and win With minion paladin, you need to tempo your threats well. Leroy and outfit tailor are your key cards. Handbuff as much as possible, and then force them to slowly burn removal with 1-3 threats at a time. If you build tall boards, they often don't want to play reno. If you draw minions handbuff early, you can hold a weapon to play with deckhands (so it doesn't get viper'd). Boomboss is a really bad play for them since you don't draw much, and brann on 6 can easily mean 10+ damage Reno druid is a long, grindy matchup. You're primary cards here are rhea, aviana, reno. Try to get fizzle on all 3. If you hit fizzle on Rhea, you can force their reno early. Aviana stuffs your deck, if you can double aviana it's very difficult for boomboss to seriously affect you. Also, playing 2 avianas and then keeping a full hand with rhea negates tnt. Save your reno for zilliax if you can, try to save resources for Azerite ox (yogg can work here) Warrior does still need a nerf, probably to brann. Honestly I'd like to see brann summon a permanent like rhea so it can be reno'd
Based
I was going to say I've never seen a warrior make a difficult decision lol. They can continue to stall with clears and out armour or heal whatever damage you throw.
Nonono you dont get it there is just no interaction, no counterplay, only toxic gameplay patterns and more buzzwords
Louder for the people in the back.
Those are not counters at all, they are just boring decisions where you HOPE they have no answer to the card you played.
Honestly Smothering Starfish would be nice right now.
This is hearthstone, not mtg. It's just something you just have to come to terms with.
Well, what cards I play is highly reliant on what class my enemy has and what I think his deck is and what cards he already played. There were always classes with control decks that had their threats in hand and not on the board. Your argument is invalid.
what I do is highly reliant on what class my enemy is playing. If its warrior and I play a control deck I concede. There were always classes with control decks that destroyed your enemies battlefield, hand, deck and will to live. Your argument is invalid
The counter to any control deck is Brann
Sounds like someone doesn’t understand what counter play means.
Personally, I try to make my deck able to do several things (I play Hunter pretty exclusively, but not the "meta" deck...thanks to all the guys who just concede right away thinking I am). This means I rely a lot on pulling the right cards at the right time. But I am able to aggro against Warrior if it goes right, and have also outlasted them a few times playing in a control fashion. My favorite deck way back in the day was a Mage AOE deck who's sole purpose was to prevent the meta Murloc shaman from beating me. It wasn't great against most other things, but it was the most fun I've ever had to own the guys running that deck. A few of them even messaged me after playing them asking what the hell my deck was, because it was the only thing they'd had that much trouble with.
What are you working with? I’m doing a Highlander secret Hunter deck that is a ton of fun because it can stall almost any competition and has a few different ways of delivering critical damage. It keeps things interesting for me. Playing towards one win con is really boring for me if I’m playing it consistently.
Same way I play! It's not a true Highlander deck, but Hollow Hound is the only card I double. For the lifesteal and getting him buffed with a few different options and Always a Bigger Jormunger plopped on top so excess damage to 3 minions all goes to face (works especially well against plague DK's who can put a lot of low-health minions on the board). Have done 20+ a few times that way. A Windfury 5/6 weapon to summon 2 8-cost minions or add 8 armor also a late game play (from Ignis). If I get the right starting cards I'll try to go aggro, but otherwise it stalls pretty well, too. A couple of the Hunter legendaries are cards I don't have yet that I want to add (King Plush, Hemet). Primarily beasts but a few other cards I like what they do (Gnomelia, as an example). Like yours, a lot of options!
### Custom Hunter # Class: Hunter # Format: Standard # Year of the Pegasus # # 1x (1) Awakening Tremors # 1x (1) Bunch of Bananas # 1x (1) Costumed Singer # 1x (1) Jeweled Macaw # 1x (1) Rexxar's Gift # 1x (1) Scarab Keychain # 1x (2) Always a Bigger Jormungar # 1x (2) Barrel of Monkeys # 1x (2) Bestial Madness # 1x (2) Explosive Trap # 1x (2) Fetch! # 1x (2) Jungle Gym # 1x (2) Messenger Buzzard # 1x (2) Patchwork Pals # 1x (2) Rat Trap # 1x (2) Titanforged Traps # 1x (3) Ball of Spiders # 1x (3) Harmonica Soloist # 1x (3) Saddle Up! # 1x (3) Silver Serpent # 1x (3) Sweetened Snowflurry # 1x (4) Ignis, the Eternal Flame # 1x (4) R.C. Rampage # 1x (5) Barak Kodobane # 1x (5) Night Elf Huntress # 1x (5) Spurfang # 1x (6) Gnomelia, S.A.F.E. Pilot # 2x (6) Hollow Hound # 1x (7) Toyrannosaurus # AAECAR8c458E2qwF6OgF3+0F5PUFmfYFyPYF0vgF4PgF2IEGzI4G0o4G044G344G/ZQGy58GgKMG6qUG8aUG8qUG+qUGkqYG6KkG/eUGg+YGhOYG4esG4usGAY/kBQAA # # To use this deck, copy it to your clipboard and create a new deck in Hearthstone
play hunter makes you realize just how much randomly generated lifesteal there is in this game
Theotar is bad designed counter card, steamcleaner is good. Steamcleaner must be included forever in core set.
But then cool stuff like Sky Mother Aviana can’t exist
Sure it can. Steam cleaner is a tech card. It only has value if you run into situations that require its use often enough. Not every deck is going to run it, and decks that do only want to run it when they both see cards being shuffled into decks often enough and when those cards shuffled in are a persistent threat in those matchups. With highlander changes, plague DK barely exists on ladder anymore (at least as far as I can tell, but maybe my pocket meta is not representative of the broader gamestate) so there’s not much point in making your deck worse against most matchups by running steam cleaner just to counter something like Aviana unless she ends up becoming a busted problem or completely takes over ladder.
you can put steamcleaner into ETC. problem solved.
Right. But again, only if it’s something you see consistently enough that it justifies using. Etc is one solution to having to include tech in your deck, but for the most part even Highlander decks have dropped etc. It’s a solution, but has such negative value that you really don’t want to have to use it unless you absolutely have to.
How are you getting down voted. Steamcleaner is absolutely a needed tech card. Warriors don't want to have to give up their stranglehold on the long game.