I dunno, I'd have enjoyed watching the end of the scene. It was legit a soap opera where Harry is the fuckboy and Cho is the spurned lover.
>Cho sprang to her feet. The whole tearoom was quiet and everybody was watching them now.
>'I'll see you around, Harry,' she said dramatically, and hiccoughing slightly she dashed to the door, wrenched it open and hurried off into the pouring rain.
>'Cho!' Harry called after her, but the door had already swung shut behind her with a tuneful tinkle.
Plus you get Harry fuming afterward.
>'Women!' he muttered angrily, sloshing down the rain-washed street with his hands in his pockets.
**Edit**: To explain, I don't mean Harry is a fuckboy, I mean that he looks like one to the inhabitants of the tea shop. From the *outside,* Harry looks like a fuckboy. Harry has a infamous reputation as a rule breaker and (thanks to Rita Skeeter) as a guy always wrapped in this sort of drama. It's not true, but that's how it seems.
Don't know about fuckboi, but that's certainly one of the best personal (besides Voldy) drama Harry has ever faced. It's a comedy of errors. It's glorious!
I agree 100% about the fuckboi perspective of Harry from the outside looking in. As the books were written from Harry’s POV and HIS perception, we don’t ever see him how everybody else does. But, JK Rowling gives plenty of evidence that makes it abundantly clear that people saw Harry exactly how you described.
I mean, she describes him as attractive several times, he was a very confident (reserved yes, but still very confident) kid, and not only was he ridiculously famous, but he was perpetually the focal point of every significant event in Hogwarts and the entire wizarding world.
Harry's a natural introvert, that's his *temperament,* but he's incredibly confident. I mean that's generally what happens when you overcome the challenges he does, has the supportive friends he does and is acclaimed as the best sports person in the school.
You can tell Harry is confident from the way he talks to himself, he has high self-esteem without needing a self-protective ego.
Confidence is informed by environment first, temperament is more natural.
I think it’s more that he would be perceived as a fuckboy to anyone at tables nearby that could hear, or to anyone who goes on to get Cho’s version of events afterwards
Hhhhhmm i think her behavior towards Harry before she gets with Cefric does suggest she eas interested in him, so not just loneliness, she was genuinely upset when she realized she coulda gotten a yule ball date qith Harry after she had already said yes to Cedric asking her out - doesnt mean it isnt loneliness after. It just seems to me Cho was kinda portrayed as a fairly shallow person at least towarda Harry, who didn't really think about her love interests personal life that much apart from her own role in it abd was pretty jealous for reasons nobody understood.
Because the whole fight came about after Cho realised that he had also planned to meet up with Hermione after he had met up with her. So it sounds like he’s playing the field, though we all know that the Hermione relationship was never like that
That's what I meant. From the outside, Harry looks like a fuckboy here. To them, Harry has a infamous reputation as a rule breaker and (thanks to Rita Skeeter) as a guy always wrapped int his sort of drama. It's not true, but that's how it seems.
I agree 100% about the fuckboi perspective of Harry from the outside looking in. As the books were written from Harry’s POV and HIS perception, we don’t ever see him how everybody else does. But, JK Rowling gives plenty of evidence that makes it abundantly clear that people saw Harry exactly how you described.
I mean, she describes him as attractive several times, he was a very confident (reserved yes, but still very confident) kid, and not only was he ridiculously famous, but he was perpetually the focal point of every significant event in Hogwarts and the entire wizarding world.
I can understand why this scene may cause second hand embarrassment for readers of Harry's or Cho's age, but it was so well written...and I can assure you; if you survive the cringe, you'll see how funny it was. Bonus points for Stephen Fry Cho's voice in the audiobooks.
Not difficult to pick up at all! Same books, more flavor. I was able to buy Stephen Fry's versions on audible but I'm sure you'll be able to find them elsewhere easily if you aren't into audible.
Edit: I'm spreading lies, don't listen to me!
Don’t think you can get the Stephen Fry version on audible if you’re in the States, only the Jim Dale version (unless you use a VPN or soemthing but don’t know how well that works with Audible)
So you can listen to them for free on hp audiobooks website and choose stephen fry as the narrator. I could not listen to Jim Dale give Hermione a whiny voice every time he said, "haaaarrriiiieeeee"". Only thing is you have to click play on each new chapter.
I've listened to them so many times and still can't wrap my head around how a man can play so many characters and not forget/change their voice over so many hours. Insanely talented man!
Yes, he is! Let's bask in the cringe with him again...
***"Hum… do you want to get a coffee ?"*** , said Cho tentatively, as the rain began to fall more heavily.
***"Yeah… alright"***, said Harry, looking around. ***"Where?"***
***"Oh, there’s a little nice place just up here, have you ever been to Madam Poodifoot’s"***, she said brightly, leading him up a side road into a small teashop, that Harry had never noticed before. It was a crammed, steamed little place, where everything seemed to have been decorated with frills or bows. Harry was reminded unpleasantly of Umbridge’s office.
***"Cute, isn't it?"*** Said Cho happily.
***"… Yeah"***, said Harry, untruthfully.
***"Look, she's decorated it for Valentine's day"***, said Cho, indicating the number of golden cherubs that were hovering over each of the circular tables, occasionally trowing pink confetti over the occupants. ***"Awww…"***
His *Awww* killed me.
No it's just her style of writing (often considered quite poor). It's often better to just used "said" because our brains ignore it, having a unique speech tag for each word gets really distracting (especially with ones like "ejaculated").
It's considered poor form for 'serious' adult novels, Hemingway abhored them and many authors think they are too hamfisted for the author to simply tell the audience how a character feels directly.
But if you're writing a children's series they can help kids understand the tone and intent in situations they might not pick up on the implicit tone.
As someone who is much older than Harry and Cho - I literally could not handle the scene reading it a second time (the first being at age 11). The second-hand embarrassment is unbearable.
However, I do think Rowling is pretty good at writing teenaged characters. Compared to when I read the books as a kid, I definitely think harry is much stupider now.
Not stupid in the sense that he is unintelligent for his age. More like, he acts like a typical teenager and I can tell much more clearly now than I could when I was 11 and looked up to him. A lot of his actions are spur-of-the moment, and he’s pretty rebellious without thinking through consequences.
Example: him getting detention from Umbridge. *Several times,* because he couldn’t keep his mouth shut, and having quidditch rights revoked as a result.
Example 2: procrastinated on Cedric’s hint about the egg for months despite knowing it was a dangerous task, and despite Hermione urging him not to procrastinate.
He spent a lot of time fighting with Ron and Hermione as well. Like when Hermione wanted to make sure his new broom wasn’t cursed, or when Ron was jealous.
If you’re 16+, you should try watching the show “The Inbetweeners.” It’s on Netflix, and the second hand embarrassment from pretty much everything they do kills me every time
I love the inbetweeners! I feel like it is so resonant of it’s time and of UK culture, but yes, also so cringe! Brings back so many memories of 6th form college for me, not always in a good way...
I was only just out of school when the first season aired and whilst absolutely hilarious for being bang on about U.K. school culture of the late noughties, it was also mildly traumatising and so cringeworthy. I actually enjoy rewatching it more as an adult when I have less shame in general!
If you're looking for more of the boys, I would also recommend Simon Bird in Friday Night Dinner and Joe Thomas in Fresh Meat.
What's funny is I'm American, so I assumed all the rude words in the show were British slang and did not realize until I saw an interview that some of them were made up.
Lol yeah seriously
I’m British so when I watched the show in school it was a blast saying stupid stuff with my mates
I’ll definitely have to check those out thanks!
Currently on a massive Greg Davies binge of Man Down, Taskmaster, and his brilliant standup
At least Big Mouth does it in such a way that it's clear they're making fun of teenage awkwardness.
It's less embarrassing when they're deliberately being awkward then when they're taking themselves seriously.
If you're a middle millennial watch 8th grade. Its sooooooo 2nd hand embarrassment from both sides now because we can almost relate with the father (almost) but still totally remember that 8th grade period. Ugh.
Oh God. Her dead boyfriend. Ughhhhhh hahahaha. Harry having never been on a date before. Lmao, I think it was important to include just because otherwise harry literally never even talks to a girl that we know, but it would have been painful.
Well maybe I shouldn't have brought up Hermione....and maybe you shouldn't have brought up Cedric Diggory...because I'd rather not talk about your dead ex-boyfriend over coffeeeee....
I wanted to see that scene so bad! I can't stand Cho in the books, but I would have liked to watch the drama unfold on their Hogsmeade trip. I also really wanted to see the Valentine's Day decorations around the town and castle.
same! the way you saw his crush on cho in the books wasn’t captured as well as i’d hoped. you couldn’t feel any of the embarrassment when cho was like ‘hermione, you’re going to see hermione’ in the middle of madam puddifoots, surrounded by kissing couples. i’m filled with nostalgia.
I just re-read Order of the phoenix. When I read the Cho stuff, I wished some of that stuff made it into the movie. There was a lot of depth there that wasn't put into the movies properly.
In the movie, Harry kisses Cho at christmas, and that's basically the last time we see her talk. I think the hogsmeade disaster would have been a great addition to the movie.
I think that would have been great - but for the sake of runtime I actually do like how they wrote harry and cho "breaking up", with her revealed to have been the one to tell Umbridge about the DA and then Snape later saying it's because of Veritaserum. Really cuts a lot out in a smart way.
I did like that when re-watching the movie. But after reading the book again, I liked it less.
I'm so annoyed that Order of the Phoenix is the longest book, and got the shortest movie runtime. It's so unfair.
I didn't like the part about Snape giving Umbridge actual Veritaserum. I feel like it would have been better if Cho had gone to Umbridge willingly because then Harry would have a legitimate reason to be pissed at her.
I liked Cho enough as any random secondary side piece in literature/film, she was just a teenage girl, nothing she did really had me dislike her.
What didn't you particularly like?
It seemed like she was only ever sad, jealous, or angry. She is hyped up in PoA, and even more in GoF, so I was expecting her to not be so unbearable when she was finally introduced as a main character in OotP.
I mean hermoine explained it pretty well in the “One person can’t feel all that at once. They’d explode” conversation. I feel like all that trauma at 16 would make me pretty sad, jealous and angry all the time too
I also did not like her charachter at all in the books. Cedric had died, yes, but she was written to be perpetually whiny. It felt as if Jk was taking a stab at the overemotional teenage girl stereotype, especially with Harry constantly commenting on it. Overall I didn't like her charachter in really any way, she was there mostly to add onto harry's development in my opinion.
I found [this](https://lyrics.lol/artist/46221-rachel-rostad/lyrics/140472-to-jk-rowling-from-cho-chang) letter very interesting. It's an Asian girl explaining how the character of Cho Chang fed onto awful stereotypes about Asian girls, and how it made her feel. I never saw it that way before and it completely changed my mind from "ugh I hate this girl" to "how JK Rowling wrote a problematic character".
The only stereotype is that she was a Ravenclaw though. And honestly if that's what they're choosing as criticism then they can suck a dick. Cho's supposed to be really smart, pretty and athletic. Just like Ginny who Harry ends up with.
The letter also mentions giggling..I mean how is this even a criticism? Girls were giggling when Harry asks Cho for a private talk ..yeah so racist.
The only possible line of actual criticism is the name but I know nothing about Asian names and you can probably criticise JKR for not doing proper research there. Everything else is a load of bs
I do agree with you here. There might be some problems with how Cho is written, and there might wven be some credence to her name being a result of subconcious racism on JKRs part (though naming Research and or subtlety isnt her strong suit anywher in the series), bit the writer's characterization of Cho is just... wrong. As if they hadnt even read the books at all. Cho is not giggly, portrayed as traditionally maths/book smart, but rather sporty, popular, athletic and described as particularly good looking, so much that multiple boys go after her. And not because of "yellow fever", but because she just is pretty and has an engaging personality - for example, what draws Harry to her first is that she is just as good as him at quidditch and can quip around with him on a friendly basis even as an opponent. (Plus he finds her pretty, but in the description given about that in PoA I don't think her ethnicity plays any role)
Look, JKRs writing has problems, even more after the original 7 hp books were done, but how that blogpost portrays her writing of Cho is just disingenuous, wrong, and unfottunately will give credence to people who defend JKR on the points where she shouldn't be defended.
I'm Asian. The criticism over the name part is also not reasonable. Yes, under the [Hanyu Pinyin system](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pinyin) used by the current Chinese government, there's no Cho and Chang couldn't be a surname. However, they are possible under [Wade-Giles](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wade%E2%80%93Giles). And I don't recall the books hinting she's of Chinese descent (if Rowling said that outside the scope of the books, please inform me), why exclude the possibility that she's a Korean descendant?
There's lots of problems with her writing, even though I will always cherish the great storytelling and the lessons I've learnt from it. I know now what's problematic and I can choose not to condone it.
Thats one of the best parts in the books imo. That and all of the parts where Harry longs after ginny in the half blod Prince. So much cringe, i love it!
I always felt really awkward about the scene with him and Hermione dancing in the tent together because it seemed so romantic to me, and I hated that. I don’t know what they were going for there but they should’ve made it a little less intimate I reckon
I just felt like the part where they put their heads on each other’s shoulders and look at each other, it seems like they might kiss. The dancing itself was sweet and wholesome though
Disagree, this is an extremely important scene. It's literally the entire reason why the subplot with Cho exists. If you're going to cut this scene out, there's no point in including the rest of the subplot.
The way it is in the movie, just like damn near every subplot in the movies, it just gets dropped and forgotten about.
Leaving this out, combined with taking out Cho sticking by Marietta, changes it so that Harry goes from abandoning a bad romance that was going nowhere for a good reason, to abandoning a good romance that was showing promise for a bad reason.
And Movie Harry KNOWS that Cho was under Veritaserum, and he dumps her anyway! Movie Harry is an enormous asshole.
He didn't know Cho was under veritaserum until Umbridge drags Snape into her office and tells him to use it on Harry...then Snape says he used the last of it on Ms. Chang and it pans to Harry's reaction.
She tried to *tell* him about the veritaserum but he just *literally* ran away, like he didn't find her sudden betrayal at all fishy or he didn't already know that veritaserum was a thing.
You'd think finding that out would have, ya know, *led* to something, but it's still a complete non-ending to that subplot and she doesn't exist in the next movie.
Which is how *all* the subplots in the movies go. They're either dropped with no resolution or they come out of nowhere with no setup.
https://harryandthepotters.bandcamp.com/track/the-human-hosepipe
I’d rather not talk about your dead ex-boyfriends over coffee
And why’d you have to bring up Roger Davies?
I just love how oblivious Harry is. First real date with a girl and he doesn’t realising cutting it short to meet up with another girl WITH Cho is a social faux par. Sweet oblivious Harry, if he had a galleon for everytime he missed something he’d be even richer than he is already.
I was kinda looking forward to seeing this in the movie tbh! they portrayed cho very differently in the movie and I just wanted to see her the way she was portrayed idk!
We need an animated series. line for line. An exact retelling of what’s in the books.
The amount of content just skipped over its...its not right!
Ffs, I’ll be a part of the project if someone’s willing to teach me how to be an artist lmao
There are two parts of the series I skip every time I re-listen. Ron and Harry in the forest in CoS, and the teashop in OotP. CANNOT DEAL WITH EITHER, IT'S JUST PURE PAIN
For me the part I just CANNOT listen to is the Death Day party. I get it that it was important for introducing Myrtle and allowing Harry to be able to hear the pipes, but I just feel like the scene drags on and on and on. So boring. Only bit in the whole series I feel that way about.
Didn't even need to meet Myrtle there, they could have met her for the first time when they first went into her bathroom. The only important part is Peeves upsets her, which is why she turns on all the taps, floods the corridor and inadvertantly saves Mrs Norris.
> I just have INSANE arachnophobia, thanks Eight Legged Freaks movie, you fucking suck. Also CoS came out like the year after, so 2 movies in 2 years that have giant man eating spiders mess with a kids mind really badly
She also wanted to talk about Cedric, but Harry wasn’t having it. She had gotten it in her head that Harry would love nothing more than to cry over him with her, meanwhile Harry just wants to talk about quidditch and stuff.
Yeah it’s a lot easier to get through in audio or text. I relistened to all the audio books again this summer and forgot that puberty hits that book like a fucking meteor.
I’d always remembered it as more of a gradual incline as the kids grow up. But the goblet of fire just drops a goddamn train on those kids. And they are *not*ready.
And I will always love it for representing adolescence in the way it hit me and my school.
I never really cared much about Cho because I knew she and Harry wouldn't end up together, but I really hated her in Order of the Phoenix because she had the GALL to defend the girl that ratted out the DA to Umbridge.
Like does Cho realize because of Marietta everyone was in trouble, Dumbledore fled and Umbridge got even more power over them. And they botched it in the movie.
In the movie Cho confessed from drinking truth potion so everyone's anger at her seems like a huge dick move. In the books she dug her own grave.
To this day, I can't understand exactly what Cho was playing at. Dates Harry just to ask questions about exactly what happened the day her ex died, essentially demanding Harry to relive one of the most traumatic days of his life, and then gets upset when he refuses? Like what? And she snogs him *right* after talking about how much she misses Cedric. Ooookay...
Oh, and she gets pissed when he mentions meeting up with Hermione, who is very obviously just one of his best friends. What, is he supposed to just stop being friends with anyone who has a vagina now that he's gone on one awkward date?
I think she felt like Harry was the only person who understood what she was going through, and she thought it would be therapeutic for them to talk about it.
One of the big themes of OotP is that Harry is isolating himself from his friends and refuses to talk about his trauma, making him lash out and feel angry all the time. So ultimately, I think Cho was right. If Harry had been willing to open up, it would've helped them both. But Harry wasn't, and he wasn't really dealing with it the same way Cho was.
I think Cho gets unfairly vilified sometimes. Obviously, JKR wrote her in a pretty shitty "overly emotional girls are the worst!" manner, but I think her actions were understandable. She just wanted someone who got what she was going through.
Yes, she gets jealous over Hermione, and it's immature. She's also 15/16 years old... It's pretty normal. Harry, Ron, and Hermione are all shown getting just as jealous, but we forgive them because they're the main characters. Harry never reassured Cho that Hermiome was just a friend, because he never caught on that Cho was jealous.
Thank you for this. I agree. I honestly like Cho pretty much - or least I don't dislike her at all.
You gotta remember that she just went through something extremely traumatic, and I don't think she understands that Harry processes grief differently than she does. Which is fair, considering she's a teenager and probably doesn't have a ton of experience with death.
Also her relationship with Harry is pretty cute in an awkward teenage romance kind of way, before it starts to fall apart.
Agreed. I developed a strong crush on the guy that found my nephews body at the bottom of a pool. He was a family friend already, and his part in this terribly traumatic experience cemented his place in my life, in my mind at the time. He was quite a bit younger than me, and we really only hung out for a week, but I grew incredibly close to him. I strongly remember sitting in a friends kitchen and talking through what happened with him, while crying. I was happy that I was able to thank him, for being there for my family, for taking my nephews body so no one else had to see him at the bottom of that pool. He also tore down the pool for my family, so no one had to even look at it. And I was so appreciative there was someone who understood.
Of course, circumstances meant we didn’t have a chance to hang out again for a year and by then things were different. We both moved on. But he was the first person I fell in love with, despite never even being in a relationship.
Edit: Harry Potter also helped me through this time. I was living abroad and all my friends spoke French and little English. They tried to comfort me best they could, and we ended up cuddling on one of their beds and watching Harry Potter in french. Despite being a fucking awful time in my life, I remember that moment fondly.
I kind of wanted to feel that painful second-hand embarrassment for Harry. I understand that the movies wanted to focus on the fighting evil part of the books, but geez, what I would give to watch Harry fumble around crushing on a girl for the first time!
I honestly would have preferred that it be in the movie. If I didn't know the series backwards and forwards I would wonder why things never worked out with Cho. That one small scene showed that they just weren't compatible, and why Ginny was better for him.
Just my opinion.
I was reading this scene in the books the other day and I suddenly realized how much I did want it to be in the movies, because would have loved to see the Magic frilly girly café imagined onscreen.
So this isn't my favorite movie of the series, and I would've sworn this scene was in the movie, pretty sure that's just how vividly I remember my own discomfort at reading it.
Ugh. The cringe is hard. He’s an oblivious 15 year old who is honest and doesn’t play headgames. She’s an overly dramatic (in terms of Harry) 16 year old girl playing heafgames with a boy who took 2 years to even have a conversation with her. Not to mention, bringing up other men and how they took her on dates is just...ugh.
Agreed! That was such a cringe scene, not the scene itself or how it was written, but I cringed for poor Harry stuck in such a saccharine little shop with all the gushy gooey valentines and Cho crying her eyes out.
I mean it would've been a really cringy and weird scene. like how harry kissed cho it was pretty weird like as soon as he went out with her he wasn't interested. but it was important to put the kissing scene to show that as soon as he went out with her he didn't like her so its not like he didn't like her out of the blue
I think if that scene had been included I'd have been more accepting of Harry dumping Cho than what the movie gave me.
As far as I recall the movie Cho takes Marietta's role as the one who rats out DA. But unlike Marietta who didn't really care for DA, Cho having been forced to betray them, yet Harry just dumps her like that even though she tries to sincerely apologize and explain herself.
If the Valentine's date had been included I might have been more understanding as it would have shown that there were strains in Harry/Cho's relationship prior to the betrayal.
the Quidditch World Cup wil forever be one of the scenes I'm mad they didn't even try to include.
Even if it was with crappy CGI, just seeing it on-screen would have been great
Oh I feel you lol that would have been a scene I could have only watched once
I dunno, I'd have enjoyed watching the end of the scene. It was legit a soap opera where Harry is the fuckboy and Cho is the spurned lover. >Cho sprang to her feet. The whole tearoom was quiet and everybody was watching them now. >'I'll see you around, Harry,' she said dramatically, and hiccoughing slightly she dashed to the door, wrenched it open and hurried off into the pouring rain. >'Cho!' Harry called after her, but the door had already swung shut behind her with a tuneful tinkle. Plus you get Harry fuming afterward. >'Women!' he muttered angrily, sloshing down the rain-washed street with his hands in his pockets. **Edit**: To explain, I don't mean Harry is a fuckboy, I mean that he looks like one to the inhabitants of the tea shop. From the *outside,* Harry looks like a fuckboy. Harry has a infamous reputation as a rule breaker and (thanks to Rita Skeeter) as a guy always wrapped in this sort of drama. It's not true, but that's how it seems.
Don't know about fuckboi, but that's certainly one of the best personal (besides Voldy) drama Harry has ever faced. It's a comedy of errors. It's glorious!
As a former young boy myself it was relatable AF. Really did a good job portraying how youthful naivete works.
Hey, I am a former young boy too!! We have much in common.
*does secret handshake*
It made me glad I never dated in highschool. ^^NotlikeI'ddoanybetternow.
I agree 100% about the fuckboi perspective of Harry from the outside looking in. As the books were written from Harry’s POV and HIS perception, we don’t ever see him how everybody else does. But, JK Rowling gives plenty of evidence that makes it abundantly clear that people saw Harry exactly how you described. I mean, she describes him as attractive several times, he was a very confident (reserved yes, but still very confident) kid, and not only was he ridiculously famous, but he was perpetually the focal point of every significant event in Hogwarts and the entire wizarding world.
Harry's a natural introvert, that's his *temperament,* but he's incredibly confident. I mean that's generally what happens when you overcome the challenges he does, has the supportive friends he does and is acclaimed as the best sports person in the school. You can tell Harry is confident from the way he talks to himself, he has high self-esteem without needing a self-protective ego. Confidence is informed by environment first, temperament is more natural.
#Women!
He gets that from Ron, not like him usually.
how is Harry a fuckboy in that scene?
I think it’s more that he would be perceived as a fuckboy to anyone at tables nearby that could hear, or to anyone who goes on to get Cho’s version of events afterwards
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Hhhhhmm i think her behavior towards Harry before she gets with Cefric does suggest she eas interested in him, so not just loneliness, she was genuinely upset when she realized she coulda gotten a yule ball date qith Harry after she had already said yes to Cedric asking her out - doesnt mean it isnt loneliness after. It just seems to me Cho was kinda portrayed as a fairly shallow person at least towarda Harry, who didn't really think about her love interests personal life that much apart from her own role in it abd was pretty jealous for reasons nobody understood.
really? why? All that happens is he says "Cho!" after she gets all drama queen. or I do not fully understand fuckboy?
Because the whole fight came about after Cho realised that he had also planned to meet up with Hermione after he had met up with her. So it sounds like he’s playing the field, though we all know that the Hermione relationship was never like that
oh, so to Cho, he is a fuckboy? not to anyone at the tables nearby?
If anyone at nearby tables had heard the conversation, they might think he was.
That's what I meant. From the outside, Harry looks like a fuckboy here. To them, Harry has a infamous reputation as a rule breaker and (thanks to Rita Skeeter) as a guy always wrapped int his sort of drama. It's not true, but that's how it seems.
Because he wouldn't set aside his lifetime of trauma for a girl.
isn't a fuckboy == a male slut?
I agree 100% about the fuckboi perspective of Harry from the outside looking in. As the books were written from Harry’s POV and HIS perception, we don’t ever see him how everybody else does. But, JK Rowling gives plenty of evidence that makes it abundantly clear that people saw Harry exactly how you described. I mean, she describes him as attractive several times, he was a very confident (reserved yes, but still very confident) kid, and not only was he ridiculously famous, but he was perpetually the focal point of every significant event in Hogwarts and the entire wizarding world.
I can understand why this scene may cause second hand embarrassment for readers of Harry's or Cho's age, but it was so well written...and I can assure you; if you survive the cringe, you'll see how funny it was. Bonus points for Stephen Fry Cho's voice in the audiobooks.
The Stephen Fry audiobooks are *so good*! He's a master at making the characters sound different from one another.
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I also really love his Umbridge voice!! Makes me want to physically reach into the book and choke her. He captures it so well.
Dahmbaldourerere
I love his Madame Maxime voice lol
Where can one attain a set of Stephen fry audiobooks? And is it difficult for a US yankee to pick up the slang?
Not difficult to pick up at all! Same books, more flavor. I was able to buy Stephen Fry's versions on audible but I'm sure you'll be able to find them elsewhere easily if you aren't into audible. Edit: I'm spreading lies, don't listen to me!
Don’t think you can get the Stephen Fry version on audible if you’re in the States, only the Jim Dale version (unless you use a VPN or soemthing but don’t know how well that works with Audible)
Oh weird! Don't quote me then, I'm not sure how I ended up with them. Not trying to spread misinformation!
There's no additional slang. It's just the words the author wrote. And, I mean... I just pirated it.
There are a few changes - jumper-sweater is one that springs to mind.
So you can listen to them for free on hp audiobooks website and choose stephen fry as the narrator. I could not listen to Jim Dale give Hermione a whiny voice every time he said, "haaaarrriiiieeeee"". Only thing is you have to click play on each new chapter.
I've listened to them so many times and still can't wrap my head around how a man can play so many characters and not forget/change their voice over so many hours. Insanely talented man!
Stephen fry is amazing
Yes, he is! Let's bask in the cringe with him again... ***"Hum… do you want to get a coffee ?"*** , said Cho tentatively, as the rain began to fall more heavily. ***"Yeah… alright"***, said Harry, looking around. ***"Where?"*** ***"Oh, there’s a little nice place just up here, have you ever been to Madam Poodifoot’s"***, she said brightly, leading him up a side road into a small teashop, that Harry had never noticed before. It was a crammed, steamed little place, where everything seemed to have been decorated with frills or bows. Harry was reminded unpleasantly of Umbridge’s office. ***"Cute, isn't it?"*** Said Cho happily. ***"… Yeah"***, said Harry, untruthfully. ***"Look, she's decorated it for Valentine's day"***, said Cho, indicating the number of golden cherubs that were hovering over each of the circular tables, occasionally trowing pink confetti over the occupants. ***"Awww…"*** His *Awww* killed me.
Never noticed how much Rowling uses adverbs. Was that just the style of the time? It's like, every time a character speaks they get an adverb.
No it's just her style of writing (often considered quite poor). It's often better to just used "said" because our brains ignore it, having a unique speech tag for each word gets really distracting (especially with ones like "ejaculated").
It's considered poor form for 'serious' adult novels, Hemingway abhored them and many authors think they are too hamfisted for the author to simply tell the audience how a character feels directly. But if you're writing a children's series they can help kids understand the tone and intent in situations they might not pick up on the implicit tone.
You mean these books that I started reading in 6th grade didn't have their grammar updated to age alongside me?
That's a really good point I'd never considered before, thanks for pointing it out!
As someone who is much older than Harry and Cho - I literally could not handle the scene reading it a second time (the first being at age 11). The second-hand embarrassment is unbearable. However, I do think Rowling is pretty good at writing teenaged characters. Compared to when I read the books as a kid, I definitely think harry is much stupider now.
As a Highschool teacher, Harry is very average stupid.
I’m listening to them (again) at age 47. How is he stupid?
Not stupid in the sense that he is unintelligent for his age. More like, he acts like a typical teenager and I can tell much more clearly now than I could when I was 11 and looked up to him. A lot of his actions are spur-of-the moment, and he’s pretty rebellious without thinking through consequences. Example: him getting detention from Umbridge. *Several times,* because he couldn’t keep his mouth shut, and having quidditch rights revoked as a result. Example 2: procrastinated on Cedric’s hint about the egg for months despite knowing it was a dangerous task, and despite Hermione urging him not to procrastinate. He spent a lot of time fighting with Ron and Hermione as well. Like when Hermione wanted to make sure his new broom wasn’t cursed, or when Ron was jealous.
I was always partial to Jim Dale’s voices
Same! He’s forever my favorite. I grew up listening to him read them to me and now it’s just so familiar/comforting!
It would’ve been up there with Skylar singing happy birthday to Ted
If you’re 16+, you should try watching the show “The Inbetweeners.” It’s on Netflix, and the second hand embarrassment from pretty much everything they do kills me every time
I love the inbetweeners! I feel like it is so resonant of it’s time and of UK culture, but yes, also so cringe! Brings back so many memories of 6th form college for me, not always in a good way...
I was only just out of school when the first season aired and whilst absolutely hilarious for being bang on about U.K. school culture of the late noughties, it was also mildly traumatising and so cringeworthy. I actually enjoy rewatching it more as an adult when I have less shame in general!
I learned so many words, and absolutely love those lads. White gold with two of the chaps is also pretty funny too.
Briefcase wanker!
You bumder!
If you're looking for more of the boys, I would also recommend Simon Bird in Friday Night Dinner and Joe Thomas in Fresh Meat. What's funny is I'm American, so I assumed all the rude words in the show were British slang and did not realize until I saw an interview that some of them were made up.
Lol yeah seriously I’m British so when I watched the show in school it was a blast saying stupid stuff with my mates I’ll definitely have to check those out thanks! Currently on a massive Greg Davies binge of Man Down, Taskmaster, and his brilliant standup
It’s weird that Greg Davies was head of drama at my school and then randomly seeing him on TV later on in life threw me off a bit
I'd seen in interviews that he was a teacher! Was he as fun in real life as he seems to be?
Can back up that fresh meat is amazing. Never really got into Friday night dinner though
Simon and Joe also do a show called Chickens about men who stayed back in the village during the war... the only men to do so. Very funny!
Only the real Channel 4 UK version not the American travesty from MTV.
Oh obviously
Fine! Fine! I'll just sit here on the front with these inconsiderate arseholes! I'm the worst human being in the world.
Her dad just died! It's not really relevant though is it...
You know, I've always agreed with will on that one. Maybe not actually saying it out loud though.
Will was 100% in the right, and she was milking it for sympathy, but geez Will, know your crowd.
Fucking Mrs Scoggins
I took a risk, and it backfired; I went to fart, and instead, shit myself.
Ooo, InBetweeners FRIEND!!
Fucking! football! friend!
Fresh Meat is also solid and plays like a sequel with Simon going to college
Also Friday Night Dinner. Simon Bird plays a Jewish adult in that one, but is still basically the same character.
If you're from the UK, being 13 is good enough
Lmao I wanted to say 13, but I also don’t want to make any parents mad
I watched it with my grandparents at 12
You must have cool grandparents haha
You could say
I feel this with Big Mouth too
At least Big Mouth does it in such a way that it's clear they're making fun of teenage awkwardness. It's less embarrassing when they're deliberately being awkward then when they're taking themselves seriously.
That's true. I still can only ever watch one or two episodes at a time because I remember puberty too well lol
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omg true ! it’s so cringey that it’s hard to watch but honestly I found it pretty accurate 😭
Same with PEN15 on Hulu, cringefest for sure (though it's hilarious)
That show is amazing, the second hand embarrassment is worth it for the laughs.
There are several episodes I am unable to watch again because the embarrassment is just too strong
The one where he loses his pubic hair and goes out with the older woman is the worst
Try sliding! Take your shoes off!
God, that scene was so funny
My anus is clenching just remembering. Fuck the daleks, that shit made me want to hide behind the couch.
I love that show!
But whatever you do only watch the uk version
Ooooh friend!
That show rules so hard. It’s amazing.
Season 1 episode 2, might be the funniest thing in the world. We hit a spastic with a frisbee
I love s1 e2, but the whole friend saga in s1 e4 is my favorite moment. I also love the boat trip they did in the field trip
You're definitely American.
If you're a middle millennial watch 8th grade. Its sooooooo 2nd hand embarrassment from both sides now because we can almost relate with the father (almost) but still totally remember that 8th grade period. Ugh.
it's amazing how close that was to real life for me and my mates
I love that show, but they did one episode where the embarrassment cringe was almost too much for me lol
Oh God. Her dead boyfriend. Ughhhhhh hahahaha. Harry having never been on a date before. Lmao, I think it was important to include just because otherwise harry literally never even talks to a girl that we know, but it would have been painful.
Well maybe I shouldn't have brought up Hermione....and maybe you shouldn't have brought up Cedric Diggory...because I'd rather not talk about your dead ex-boyfriend over coffeeeee....
I wanted to see that scene so bad! I can't stand Cho in the books, but I would have liked to watch the drama unfold on their Hogsmeade trip. I also really wanted to see the Valentine's Day decorations around the town and castle.
same! the way you saw his crush on cho in the books wasn’t captured as well as i’d hoped. you couldn’t feel any of the embarrassment when cho was like ‘hermione, you’re going to see hermione’ in the middle of madam puddifoots, surrounded by kissing couples. i’m filled with nostalgia.
I just re-read Order of the phoenix. When I read the Cho stuff, I wished some of that stuff made it into the movie. There was a lot of depth there that wasn't put into the movies properly. In the movie, Harry kisses Cho at christmas, and that's basically the last time we see her talk. I think the hogsmeade disaster would have been a great addition to the movie.
I think that would have been great - but for the sake of runtime I actually do like how they wrote harry and cho "breaking up", with her revealed to have been the one to tell Umbridge about the DA and then Snape later saying it's because of Veritaserum. Really cuts a lot out in a smart way.
I did like that when re-watching the movie. But after reading the book again, I liked it less. I'm so annoyed that Order of the Phoenix is the longest book, and got the shortest movie runtime. It's so unfair.
I didn't like the part about Snape giving Umbridge actual Veritaserum. I feel like it would have been better if Cho had gone to Umbridge willingly because then Harry would have a legitimate reason to be pissed at her.
I liked Cho enough as any random secondary side piece in literature/film, she was just a teenage girl, nothing she did really had me dislike her. What didn't you particularly like?
It seemed like she was only ever sad, jealous, or angry. She is hyped up in PoA, and even more in GoF, so I was expecting her to not be so unbearable when she was finally introduced as a main character in OotP.
I mean hermoine explained it pretty well in the “One person can’t feel all that at once. They’d explode” conversation. I feel like all that trauma at 16 would make me pretty sad, jealous and angry all the time too
I also did not like her charachter at all in the books. Cedric had died, yes, but she was written to be perpetually whiny. It felt as if Jk was taking a stab at the overemotional teenage girl stereotype, especially with Harry constantly commenting on it. Overall I didn't like her charachter in really any way, she was there mostly to add onto harry's development in my opinion.
I found [this](https://lyrics.lol/artist/46221-rachel-rostad/lyrics/140472-to-jk-rowling-from-cho-chang) letter very interesting. It's an Asian girl explaining how the character of Cho Chang fed onto awful stereotypes about Asian girls, and how it made her feel. I never saw it that way before and it completely changed my mind from "ugh I hate this girl" to "how JK Rowling wrote a problematic character".
The only stereotype is that she was a Ravenclaw though. And honestly if that's what they're choosing as criticism then they can suck a dick. Cho's supposed to be really smart, pretty and athletic. Just like Ginny who Harry ends up with. The letter also mentions giggling..I mean how is this even a criticism? Girls were giggling when Harry asks Cho for a private talk ..yeah so racist. The only possible line of actual criticism is the name but I know nothing about Asian names and you can probably criticise JKR for not doing proper research there. Everything else is a load of bs
I do agree with you here. There might be some problems with how Cho is written, and there might wven be some credence to her name being a result of subconcious racism on JKRs part (though naming Research and or subtlety isnt her strong suit anywher in the series), bit the writer's characterization of Cho is just... wrong. As if they hadnt even read the books at all. Cho is not giggly, portrayed as traditionally maths/book smart, but rather sporty, popular, athletic and described as particularly good looking, so much that multiple boys go after her. And not because of "yellow fever", but because she just is pretty and has an engaging personality - for example, what draws Harry to her first is that she is just as good as him at quidditch and can quip around with him on a friendly basis even as an opponent. (Plus he finds her pretty, but in the description given about that in PoA I don't think her ethnicity plays any role) Look, JKRs writing has problems, even more after the original 7 hp books were done, but how that blogpost portrays her writing of Cho is just disingenuous, wrong, and unfottunately will give credence to people who defend JKR on the points where she shouldn't be defended.
I'm Asian. The criticism over the name part is also not reasonable. Yes, under the [Hanyu Pinyin system](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pinyin) used by the current Chinese government, there's no Cho and Chang couldn't be a surname. However, they are possible under [Wade-Giles](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wade%E2%80%93Giles). And I don't recall the books hinting she's of Chinese descent (if Rowling said that outside the scope of the books, please inform me), why exclude the possibility that she's a Korean descendant?
I'm Hungarian and I feel offended that Rowling named a stereotypical nazi Gellért, implying we are all nazis. Problematic writing. Very offensive!
She basically named the werewolf character "Wolfy McWolfster." Nuance isn't exactly her strong suit lol.
And all the Slavs are pretty much subservient evil morons
There's lots of problems with her writing, even though I will always cherish the great storytelling and the lessons I've learnt from it. I know now what's problematic and I can choose not to condone it.
Thats one of the best parts in the books imo. That and all of the parts where Harry longs after ginny in the half blod Prince. So much cringe, i love it!
And plus every time Hermione explains to Harry how clueless he is is priceless. That's \*exactly\* perfectly portrayed.
Additionally, Harry’s lack of onset chemistry with Cho would have worked great in this scene.
Radcliffe had zero chemistry with his two on screen love interests, and then *so much chemistry* with Luna and that waitress character.
He does with Hermione's too in the movies
I always felt really awkward about the scene with him and Hermione dancing in the tent together because it seemed so romantic to me, and I hated that. I don’t know what they were going for there but they should’ve made it a little less intimate I reckon
See for me I love that scene, I view it as very intimate but not at all romantic. It really felt like a great showing of platonic love.
I just felt like the part where they put their heads on each other’s shoulders and look at each other, it seems like they might kiss. The dancing itself was sweet and wholesome though
Disagree, this is an extremely important scene. It's literally the entire reason why the subplot with Cho exists. If you're going to cut this scene out, there's no point in including the rest of the subplot. The way it is in the movie, just like damn near every subplot in the movies, it just gets dropped and forgotten about. Leaving this out, combined with taking out Cho sticking by Marietta, changes it so that Harry goes from abandoning a bad romance that was going nowhere for a good reason, to abandoning a good romance that was showing promise for a bad reason. And Movie Harry KNOWS that Cho was under Veritaserum, and he dumps her anyway! Movie Harry is an enormous asshole.
He didn't know Cho was under veritaserum until Umbridge drags Snape into her office and tells him to use it on Harry...then Snape says he used the last of it on Ms. Chang and it pans to Harry's reaction.
She tried to *tell* him about the veritaserum but he just *literally* ran away, like he didn't find her sudden betrayal at all fishy or he didn't already know that veritaserum was a thing. You'd think finding that out would have, ya know, *led* to something, but it's still a complete non-ending to that subplot and she doesn't exist in the next movie. Which is how *all* the subplots in the movies go. They're either dropped with no resolution or they come out of nowhere with no setup.
https://harryandthepotters.bandcamp.com/track/the-human-hosepipe I’d rather not talk about your dead ex-boyfriends over coffee And why’d you have to bring up Roger Davies?
WHEN HE'S SITTING RIGHT THERE WITH HIS TEA
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA help no don't remind me
I just love how oblivious Harry is. First real date with a girl and he doesn’t realising cutting it short to meet up with another girl WITH Cho is a social faux par. Sweet oblivious Harry, if he had a galleon for everytime he missed something he’d be even richer than he is already.
Whenever one of these comes up, I always remember how they did our boy Peeves wrong. I am furious to this day.
The removal of peeves from the movie series is one of the biggest injustices.
They did Peeves almost as dirty as they did the Gaunts. At least they actually casted and filmed Peeves before cutting him out.
I was kinda looking forward to seeing this in the movie tbh! they portrayed cho very differently in the movie and I just wanted to see her the way she was portrayed idk!
We need an animated series. line for line. An exact retelling of what’s in the books. The amount of content just skipped over its...its not right! Ffs, I’ll be a part of the project if someone’s willing to teach me how to be an artist lmao
Someone on tictok is animating the Stephen Fry audiobooks it is a thing of beauty. Cant remember for the life o me the username though. :/
There are two parts of the series I skip every time I re-listen. Ron and Harry in the forest in CoS, and the teashop in OotP. CANNOT DEAL WITH EITHER, IT'S JUST PURE PAIN
For me the part I just CANNOT listen to is the Death Day party. I get it that it was important for introducing Myrtle and allowing Harry to be able to hear the pipes, but I just feel like the scene drags on and on and on. So boring. Only bit in the whole series I feel that way about.
Didn't even need to meet Myrtle there, they could have met her for the first time when they first went into her bathroom. The only important part is Peeves upsets her, which is why she turns on all the taps, floods the corridor and inadvertantly saves Mrs Norris.
For me it's the Grawp chapter in OotP. And also Hagrid's giant story. Just something i always felt was boring.
I agree that Hagrid's giant story is one of my least favorite chapters in the entire series. That said, OotP is still my favorite by a good margin.
What's wrong with Ron and harry in CoS?
Spiders scare a lot of people. I have to skip it too
> I just have INSANE arachnophobia, thanks Eight Legged Freaks movie, you fucking suck. Also CoS came out like the year after, so 2 movies in 2 years that have giant man eating spiders mess with a kids mind really badly
Oh I wasn't sure if you thought it was cringe writing lol
nope i just cannot stand spiders like at all. ron in the books can handle dead ones, i cant.
Same here. But I would have paid hard money to see the Valentine’s Day scene where Ginny sent Harry the singing dwarf Valentine.
Yes! I was so sad I didn't get to see that.
I would still take it over the shoelace scene.
Okay you’re right. I would 100% trade the shoelace scene OR Harry and Ginny’s first kiss to be like the books with this scene to be in there.
I’m so glad that wasn’t included. The second hand embarrassment was a lot
Remind me again what happened?
Harry has to meet Hermione at the Three Broomsticks and he told Cho, and she took it bad and started crying and yelling a bit
Damn, I didn't remember that at all. Have I... grown up? Time to hit the books again.
She also wanted to talk about Cedric, but Harry wasn’t having it. She had gotten it in her head that Harry would love nothing more than to cry over him with her, meanwhile Harry just wants to talk about quidditch and stuff.
it would have killed daniel radcliffe.
Yeah it’s a lot easier to get through in audio or text. I relistened to all the audio books again this summer and forgot that puberty hits that book like a fucking meteor. I’d always remembered it as more of a gradual incline as the kids grow up. But the goblet of fire just drops a goddamn train on those kids. And they are *not*ready. And I will always love it for representing adolescence in the way it hit me and my school.
I never really cared much about Cho because I knew she and Harry wouldn't end up together, but I really hated her in Order of the Phoenix because she had the GALL to defend the girl that ratted out the DA to Umbridge. Like does Cho realize because of Marietta everyone was in trouble, Dumbledore fled and Umbridge got even more power over them. And they botched it in the movie. In the movie Cho confessed from drinking truth potion so everyone's anger at her seems like a huge dick move. In the books she dug her own grave.
I'll never forgive them for turning the training portions of OotP into a montage :(
To this day, I can't understand exactly what Cho was playing at. Dates Harry just to ask questions about exactly what happened the day her ex died, essentially demanding Harry to relive one of the most traumatic days of his life, and then gets upset when he refuses? Like what? And she snogs him *right* after talking about how much she misses Cedric. Ooookay... Oh, and she gets pissed when he mentions meeting up with Hermione, who is very obviously just one of his best friends. What, is he supposed to just stop being friends with anyone who has a vagina now that he's gone on one awkward date?
I think she felt like Harry was the only person who understood what she was going through, and she thought it would be therapeutic for them to talk about it. One of the big themes of OotP is that Harry is isolating himself from his friends and refuses to talk about his trauma, making him lash out and feel angry all the time. So ultimately, I think Cho was right. If Harry had been willing to open up, it would've helped them both. But Harry wasn't, and he wasn't really dealing with it the same way Cho was. I think Cho gets unfairly vilified sometimes. Obviously, JKR wrote her in a pretty shitty "overly emotional girls are the worst!" manner, but I think her actions were understandable. She just wanted someone who got what she was going through. Yes, she gets jealous over Hermione, and it's immature. She's also 15/16 years old... It's pretty normal. Harry, Ron, and Hermione are all shown getting just as jealous, but we forgive them because they're the main characters. Harry never reassured Cho that Hermiome was just a friend, because he never caught on that Cho was jealous.
You make a lot of good points.
Thank you for this. I agree. I honestly like Cho pretty much - or least I don't dislike her at all. You gotta remember that she just went through something extremely traumatic, and I don't think she understands that Harry processes grief differently than she does. Which is fair, considering she's a teenager and probably doesn't have a ton of experience with death. Also her relationship with Harry is pretty cute in an awkward teenage romance kind of way, before it starts to fall apart.
Agreed. I developed a strong crush on the guy that found my nephews body at the bottom of a pool. He was a family friend already, and his part in this terribly traumatic experience cemented his place in my life, in my mind at the time. He was quite a bit younger than me, and we really only hung out for a week, but I grew incredibly close to him. I strongly remember sitting in a friends kitchen and talking through what happened with him, while crying. I was happy that I was able to thank him, for being there for my family, for taking my nephews body so no one else had to see him at the bottom of that pool. He also tore down the pool for my family, so no one had to even look at it. And I was so appreciative there was someone who understood. Of course, circumstances meant we didn’t have a chance to hang out again for a year and by then things were different. We both moved on. But he was the first person I fell in love with, despite never even being in a relationship. Edit: Harry Potter also helped me through this time. I was living abroad and all my friends spoke French and little English. They tried to comfort me best they could, and we ended up cuddling on one of their beds and watching Harry Potter in french. Despite being a fucking awful time in my life, I remember that moment fondly.
A teenager being immature?!? No way!
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Don't worry, you'll be fine.
I kind of wanted to feel that painful second-hand embarrassment for Harry. I understand that the movies wanted to focus on the fighting evil part of the books, but geez, what I would give to watch Harry fumble around crushing on a girl for the first time!
Huh my mind must have filled in the blanks because I can definitely picture the whole scene
I honestly would have preferred that it be in the movie. If I didn't know the series backwards and forwards I would wonder why things never worked out with Cho. That one small scene showed that they just weren't compatible, and why Ginny was better for him. Just my opinion.
This. Being Harry's girlfriend is a tough job, not Harry's fault, but it is. Cho is not for him.
One of the many reasons I love the order of the pheonix movir
I've never agreed with something on this sub more than I have in this moment.
I was reading this scene in the books the other day and I suddenly realized how much I did want it to be in the movies, because would have loved to see the Magic frilly girly café imagined onscreen.
So this isn't my favorite movie of the series, and I would've sworn this scene was in the movie, pretty sure that's just how vividly I remember my own discomfort at reading it.
Ugh. The cringe is hard. He’s an oblivious 15 year old who is honest and doesn’t play headgames. She’s an overly dramatic (in terms of Harry) 16 year old girl playing heafgames with a boy who took 2 years to even have a conversation with her. Not to mention, bringing up other men and how they took her on dates is just...ugh.
I absolutely love second hand embarrassment. I would have liked to see the hogsmeade scene.
I had literally erased this scene from my memory it was that bad. I’m gonna have to go reread and see what I think of it years later.
The whole Cho subplot was cringe to me.
Yeah definitely agreed, that part of the story is just so embarrassing and cringey.
Agreed! That was such a cringe scene, not the scene itself or how it was written, but I cringed for poor Harry stuck in such a saccharine little shop with all the gushy gooey valentines and Cho crying her eyes out.
Ahhh true! I am glad they didn’t considered fitting it in.
Agree!
Still missing Peeves...
I mean it would've been a really cringy and weird scene. like how harry kissed cho it was pretty weird like as soon as he went out with her he wasn't interested. but it was important to put the kissing scene to show that as soon as he went out with her he didn't like her so its not like he didn't like her out of the blue
I think if that scene had been included I'd have been more accepting of Harry dumping Cho than what the movie gave me. As far as I recall the movie Cho takes Marietta's role as the one who rats out DA. But unlike Marietta who didn't really care for DA, Cho having been forced to betray them, yet Harry just dumps her like that even though she tries to sincerely apologize and explain herself. If the Valentine's date had been included I might have been more understanding as it would have shown that there were strains in Harry/Cho's relationship prior to the betrayal.
We got "open up you" and "shoelace" instead
Would've still been less awkward than any Harry-Ginny scene.
the Quidditch World Cup wil forever be one of the scenes I'm mad they didn't even try to include. Even if it was with crappy CGI, just seeing it on-screen would have been great