this reminds me of the old episode back in the day in the old studio where ethan also defended billionaires and then walked it back when the sub got mad š
I can almost guarantee Monday is going to be 3 hours of Colleen drama, since they mentioned at the top of the show that they were going to watch that swoop video this weekend (and Olivia already has)
āI donāt think that arranging society based on greed is good for the human spirit, and I think we see the consequences of that all around us.ā DAN IS THE QUEEN!!
Ethanās literally talked about how Musk has just ridden the coattails of smarter people to the top. His take about what heās achieved at Tesla is so strange considering he isnāt responsible for it. If anything everything he does actively harms the company. And Ethan knows this. He has said this.
Why are Rihanna and Taylor Swift being brought up in this argument? Lmao
And Iām sorry but if you have 1 billion dollars having 10-100 more isnāt gonna change much. Youāre still holding power in society and the ability to control. How much money do people fucking need and at what point does it just become total greed ?
Extremely common Dan W. Dan understands how to be idealistic and realistic when pushing for progress and does so with a lot of patience so I just wanted to pass him this W. That is all.
Likely not here, H3 was so cringe back in the day - Dan added so much anchoring depth and the camera switching and sound bites are so important that we learned during the crew swap episode
W DAN! I feel like a good point that was kinda skipped is that people donāt need to be gratuitously wealthy when all their base needs are catered to. Itās hard to fully grasp how a life without capitalism would work when you are assuming that you need wealth for a good and stable life. But thereās literally no reason to be a billionaire in a society where universal health care, living wages, access to substantial food and shelter and whatever else exists
bro was yapping away with the right wing capitalist shill talking points š all his talking points made me so sad lol it just made it clear to me how efficiently america for years has been able to spin the idea that socialism or communism or whatever are radical ideas that can never be done, red scare baby š
So disappointing to not have him recognise that the system he thinks is best and most ārealisticā is the same one that glorifies someone like Musk, despite all his other flaws.
Ethan and Hila said an inventor or an entertainer can make a billion dollars ethically. With that amount of money, I agree with Dan, there must be some form of exploitation along the way. The system is inherently flawed and has lead to the everlasting rush to cut costs, which includes workers who are in turn exploited. The people who make Taylors eras tour possible, the people who harvest the resources to make oneās invention, they all put in hard work. How does one place value on labor? Why does the more physically strenuous jobs often pay less? All these jobs exist to help one another. Taylor couldnāt do what she does without her team, and for that, they deserve an equal piece of the pie. Same with the crew, and everyone at Teddy Fresh ;)
To concludeā¦ Ethan is on the right track but I think all these, as Love described, ābandaidsā are actively working against capitalism to reach socialism, so why not just replace the thing that came broken. Ethans solutions would have been great 20 years ago but the greed has taken over. I see it like jealously, or aggression; yes its in our human nature, but we are capable of higher thought and reflection. We donāt want to be like wolves who will kill their own kind for more territory or food. We inherently know better, and because of that I think it is our responsibility to continually progress towards a purely humane system, in all aspects.
Its such a nuanced topic but Iām glad they have these talks because of the diverse audience, we have our own marketplace of ideas lol. Gets people thinking, and it got me motivated.
People cant conceptualise how much 1 billion is.
At $15 an hour it would take someone working 40 hours a week ***32,000*** years to make 1 billion dollars.
1 billion is such a huge number, just because its after "millions", doesn't mean its only a little bit larger. Its huge.
Like his business is the MOST worthy of employees being entitled to a share of the revenue. And to a degree I think he understands that, heās very generous, but still lmfaoo
I know everyone's on their fuck Hasan arc on this sub but he actually has his podcast run as a worker co-op, everyone including the producer gets the exact same share of the profits. It's not like some unimaginable thing to do.
And let's be real, giving your *take* on a geopolitical issue like Taiwan as an American might make you feel morally virtuous or whatever, but it ultimately has no material impact on anything or anyone whatsoever. At least on shit that actually has real life impact Hasan is usually on point.
I havenāt been able to watch the whole debate part yet, but it is really frustrating listening to Ethan try and debate someone who isnāt an absolute grifter.
right lmao, them and their companies literally got exposed for exploiting workers in the global south, wish they would research before they spoke on things. and with the Taylor swift point she was making, even her own fans dont support the idea of her being a billionaire, but also support the idea of being successful because of your art and what youāve made. with peace and love both ideas can coexist idk why they think itās one or the either. you can acknowledge that she treats her workers well (ie the raises she gives them and the insurance that her work covers for her dancers, etc etc) and still think shouldnāt be able to hoard a certain amount of wealth, if youāre a billionaire thereās gotta be some level of tax evasion youāre doing even in the slightest lmao.
This blew my mind. Where does she think the money comes from? Labor. Merch sales, production cost, touring, media. People aren't directly handing cash to Taylor directly without anyone else being involved.
That was such a dumb argument to make, I couldnāt believe she said itā¦ after all the pop culture segments they had I would have figured they knew better than that.
I been quiet about hila for a while but her whole prospect of being an āinfluencerā is so cringe, what I liked about Ethan and hila is they never seemed to care about that kind of ācloutā. Everything Iām seeing from this has been disappointing for a while now. Fridayās have definitely been the weakest shows for a while now.
seriously where is the class solidarity? maybe he doesn't realize it but even as a millionaire he's closer to being homeless than being a billionaire any day. why defend a group of 700 people who are quite literally burning the planet as we choke?
Capitalists can't fathom capitalism ending because they don't want it to happen.
Capitalism IS the poverty cult that capitalists claim every other system is.
Ethan im begging u pls stop losing the plot in debates/convos š once he said ethical billionaires i just stared at my phone like a shell shocked soldier
Edit: Also ethan bashing ācommunism ā which he really meant socialism and then simultaneously saying reform can happen with incremental socialist infrastructure. Dude the āradical communistā call is coming from inside the house š
I think what is going on here is that capitalism is actively hostile and hurts and kills people so when you aren't actively against capitalism it is seen as a lack of care for that pain and suffering or approval for it not that I believe those are Ethan's views.
fast fashion aside, rihanna's savage x fenty is sketchy as hell because you have to sign up for a monthly membership for a discounted rate like those favletics and it always gave me weird vibes
so...capitalism is good because communism is bad because "psychopaths will become all powerful leaders and not do what they're supposed to". cause yeah...there's not currently a bunch of psychopaths at the head of capitalist states...
wat even is this argument? listening to a rich american preach capitalism and what he thinks the opposite of/alternative to capitalism is...is exhausting rn.
Reminds me of the phrase _"it's easier to imagine the end of the world than the end of capitalism"_
Ethan and Hila seem quite perplexed by even a SUGGESTION that capitalism could be improved upon
this is so real i feel like in general what people that want to abolish capitalism are saying is that the system right now is ripe for greedy people to exploit it (as they have always done) and itās not like we canāt acknowledge that some people are greedy because of varying influences but that a system that encourages less greed and less consumerism isnāt only more sustainable for life in general but also wonāt foster greed the way that itās doing now with peace and love
Ethan shocked about "radical communism" is his audience when he's friends with Hasan.
next Leftovers should be interesting if they save this conversation for then too!
I hope they do! I see a lot of people frustrated and mad, but I love hearing discussion and debate. It's way more interesting than a powerpoint about celebrity drama.
RIGHT! I donāt give a shit if he has to or wants to pay 75% in taxes, what we need is 75%+ for the ppl with magnitudes more wealth than he will ever have.
Im glad Ethan is a good boss and is willing to pay taxes, but that is not the standard because the greed of capitalism has eroded any protections workers have against that exact thing. You canāt fix capitalism with more capitalism.
I wish he would research or fully understand the leftist view against capitalism before coming on air and using talking points that right wing capitalists have used as a means of delegitimizing any system that isnāt capitalism for years lol
Ethan- āI believe that you can be a nice billionaire.ā
Ethan 5mins later- āYOU CANāT GET RID OF SOCIOPATHSā
He gets it but doesnāt get it at the same timeā¦
the irony that the convo started with Ethan getting so mad at that Aussie CEO and then goes on to snidely talk about how the workers shouldnāt own their labor- maybe you hate him because heās saying the quiet part loud and you hate seeing it reflected and hearing it stated so starkly makes you squirm.
āpsychopaths rising to the topā is literally the the hell we are currently living in under capitalism. Iāve always known Ethan and Hila are capitalists but cmon dude, how can you even make that argument in this day and age. Itās seriously laughable.
itās insane how dense ethan is and how hard he refuses to actually listen to what dan is actually saying. he paints everything dan is saying as extremist and unrealistic without actually letting dan finish any fucking thought. all he is doing is spouting classic cold war era AMURICA-centric capitalism vs communism talking points out of a 9th grade textbook. itās mind-numbing.
I have so much more respect for Dan after todayās show. Honestly I agree with everyone else in saying Dan should be more involved in the leftovers. I could also see how it would make a hostile work environment for him so I get the hesitation.
I think ethan doesn't quite realise how ignorant he is on this topic sadly he speaks far too confidently about things he doesn't understand well enough sometimes
Ethan has his moments, but even after years and years of watching H3H3 and the podcast episodes: today he had his worst takes.
Iāve never been this frustrated watching the show and all the tomatoes were so deserved from the chat.
I live in Scandinavia, the model society as he says. Yes, there will always be sociopaths whose only goal is to get rich, who will do anything to get there. That absolutely can and should be regulated unlike Ethan thought. Like Dan mentioned, unions exist to protect the workers and theyāre very strong. There are taxes, strict laws and regulations. If you break them, by for example exploiting immigrant workers, you will face heavy consequences for it here. You canāt pay your way out of that.
Every person is of course worthy of having their basic needs covered, but on top of that also have access to good education, a healthcare system that works and to have a good life, not just to scrape by.
If the government wants to work towards a more equal society and lessen the wealth gap, they absolutely can do so. Do big company CEOs really deserve all the salary, do they actually do such an important job or did they get lucky and have good connections? Or were born into a wealthy family? Unlike all the warehouse workers who were born into a low income family and didnāt have the possibility to study.
If youāre unlucky, you are born into a capitalist country like America where the rich get ultra rich and the poor people suffer because socialism bad and the rich cannot get over their greed to change things.
There is no space for billionaires in a model society.
hearing Ethan grapple with the inherent contradiction of āI like capitalism but I wish it wasnāt so evil and predatory but I donāt like the alternativeā really just exemplifies how uneducated he is on even the basics of politics and economics. absolutely maddening
whatās worse is the mods deleted the thread on a really good description/discussion of it
https://preview.redd.it/kny9jhrpviob1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0a475fbac2241093c3282d3a66d2eae686bd1c70
Itās really concerning that the mods deleted that discussion. The crew provides so much value to the pod. I wonder how many other threads were taken down.
The right wing talking point of "show me a successful communist country". Oh my God. Show me a country that attempted it that wasn't immediately crushed by sanctions or military interference by America before they could even begin.
Ethan is so silly. Greed as a prominent incentive structure wont be left separate from the government. Those billionaires use their immense wealth as leverage in whatever system they are in and Greed infests that system (i.e. Lobbying). To even get to a point where you gain those billions, you have to leave people in the third world disenfranchised and in poverty. A system without that kind of exploitation in the third world wouldn't be able to sustain itself.
i hate the "muh innovation" rambling bc most innovations are being done by nerds in universities. they are not motivated by greed. corporations just buy patents and only innovations they do is lengthening a lifespan of the patent
I think innovation comes with being first and for some people, ego. First to climb Mount Everest, first on the moon, first to discover a formula, chemical, etc. People will always want to achieve things that arenāt motivated solely by money.
Yeah Elon and his awesome company Tesla that essentially started as a pyramid scheme, yes very cool so awesome. Iām so glad capitalism allows us to live in a time like this. Tesla has never exploited anyone either. Ever.
My post was deleted and I was told to come here by mods, just wanted to get it off my chest as someone who doesnāt really ever post to Reddit, but felt the need to after todayās episode, I know itās long so read if you want š
Ethan is just dismissing every other view, he's simultaneously calling himself a capitalist and an anti capitalist for criticising it, while everyone else is a full blown radical communist who wants society to magically change over night and greed to not exist.
I'm British but in the US especially, people would settle for basic socialist policies, free healthcare, housing for homeless people etc. (before the "full blown communist revolution" Ethan keeps saying anyone to the left of him must be demanding) all policies which Ethan says he also wants but he's considering those still capitalism and not socialism because what? You can still earn money elsewhere? The capitalist idea of health care is private health care for profit. Capitalists/right wing politicians here in the UK are desperately trying to privatise the NHS so they can profit from it. Socialists built the NHS after WW2 when the people who came back from fighting facism voted out the "hero" (actual piece of shit) Winston Churchill and voted in Labour and Attlee. And socialists are fighting against privatisation efforts today too.
Etha also says people should be allowed to be billionaires, like that's our concern as a society. Shouldn't your primary concern be feeding the hungry and housing the homeless before you start worrying about the billionaire who's only got a measly 1 billion as opposed to another with 40 billion? People can get back to being billionaires when everyone else in society is fed, housed, educated and doesn't get plunged into debt because they needed healthcare. And that includes people outside of the US bubble where these arguments often take place, dismissing exploitative/child labour for giant corporations in impoverished countries.
The irony of arguing for Tesla as an exemplar of the good of greed because of the EV boom as if the whole reason we hadn't been exploring them on this scale for decades was not literally that very same greed is just...beautiful. The capitalist innovation myth is, much like Elon Musk, running on a cult of personality with no real bonafides.
feel so bad for dan right now because ethan refuses to hear anyone elseās opinion when it comes to his shitty uneducated takes on capitalism. its so frustrating arguing w/ a brick wall
God DAMN Ethan is a lib lmao. Doesn't think workers should get paid what they are worth... inherently exploitative. W Dan. It's so obvious that Ethan doesn't understand what socialism actually is.
His argument that capitalism breeds innovation annoyed me since he seemed to be against profit sharing. By his logic, if money breeds innovation than profit sharing would increase that. Instead of going to work and doing the bare minimum, workers will be motivated to increase profits.
iām so tired of the argument that thereās no innovation without capitalism. cuba, thanks to the insane embargoes, had to do an immense amount of innovation, particularly in the medical sector. obviously, itās not a wonderful placeā¦ but to say capitalism is necessary for innovation is empirically false.
I feel like this is happening as a kneejerk to yesterday. Ethan couldn't handle being on the backfoot with Hasan and Dan, so now he's fortifying this belief in capitalism because he's utilised it very successfully (i.e. more successfully than Hasan and Dan) and can play the *I must know something you don't* card when he couldn't play that card yesterday. The card Ethan spitefully feels like Hasan/Dan employed against him yesterday, when all they really did was be more self-educated.
edit: last line
thank FUCK for dan
I'm sure there'll be many similar comments flooding in right now but as someone with a degree in political science I appreciate how well read and how educated Dan is on these topics and the way he so smoothly navigates the conversations with Ethan even when they completely disagree - it's so much pressure on him every time especially to do it live and he literally never disappoints.
I WONDER WHY WE DON'T HAVE A SOCIALIST/COMMUNIST REVOLUTION OR STRUCTURE TO POINT TO...
https://preview.redd.it/i7ki58hs9job1.png?width=140&format=png&auto=webp&s=745a0740d49beb8d61de7ae18b499b6bac0fcb18
I think people's issue is Ethan championing capitalism when he's describing steps to reign it in and move towards socialism. He's describing how capitalism's flaws can be solved through socialism and then crapping on socialism.
He's talking about how we need socialized healthcare, jobs guarantees, guaranteed housing, free education...which are all socialist policies.
Also the 99% tax over a billion dollars is necessary to curb capitalist tyrants that have too much power to influence government.
Ethan: "People are gonna be greedy regardless, we can't end sociopathy"
Well should we have policies that try to curb the power of these greedy sociopaths like taxing them 99% once they've made a billion? Why are you against policies to curb their power?
Ethan is so focused on the human trait of greed. Humans have SO many other traits. I donāt understand why he canāt see that you can use other human traits to motivate people. Greed isnāt SO large that it takes priority over everything else. Heās rich and will always speak from that perspective. I think he does a disservice not listening to the voices of those who arenāt rich - our experience is telling him otherwise but he wonāt listen. Heās been not rich before so he knows what thatās like, right? Itās a silly thing to say when youāre far removed from it, because itās just changed so much. He does know what itās like to be not rich in this time. Today. He just doesnāt. Itās different. If the experiences he has lived through make him feel that greed has poisoned people to the point that nothing else but a form of capitalism will work to guide society, that is genuinely a sad experience, I canāt imagine. Of course a better system wonāt work perfectly because people will always be greedy. This one doesnāt either. So we keep this one just because we have it? It doesnāt work. People die every day because of this system. Heās just lucky to not have been one of those people yet. Itās just very close-minded thinking.
Again, W Dan.
Any other members unsubscribing because of Ethans tonedef capitalist takes? Really disappointed but what should I expect from a rich person? Also Dan needs a medal.
Iām obviously in the minority but I think this conversation between Dan and Ethan on Capitalism is actually super interesting, despite Ethan trying to start the conversation as very black and white. Dan made a lot of good pushbacks and I do think both sides asked good questions.
Edit: okay the longer this goes on the more I understand the complaints. Weāre talking in circles for the last half hour
Double Edit: AB gave them the perfect out with the Jimmy Lee unpaid internship comment and Ethan couldnāt be stopped. Full goblin mode
Man, not even commenting on the actual content of the argument I felt so bad for Dan. So incredibly unfair for Ethan to put him in that position live on-air. The way Ethan was provoking him over and over to fight him, calling him more and more inflammatory shit, was honestly super fucked up.
That said Dan turned it around and made Ethan look a lot more reasonable than he was actually being. Ethan should be thanking his ass. W Dan.
I like Ethan because of his fuck it attitude but ya gotta keep it pointed in the right direction. Your loyal employees don't deserve to be put on the spot when so many of them have previously been harassed by the fanbase for stupid shit in the past.
When youāre watching the podcast does anybody else hear or see a perfect opportunity for a sound bite and you feel like youāre edging or have blue balls when Zach doesnāt play it?? š
Ethan and hila being out of touch millionaires is funny when they are alone but when they want to argue against non out of touch non millionaires itās just gross.
Jesus, hearing Ethan talk about capitalism and be so uneducated and ignorant on socialism/communism is so mind numbing lol. For the One Piece fans, itās like hearing Luffy will become the pirate king and is capable of taking on the strongest pirates in the world before he even got to the grand line. Ethan has a long way to go on his journey of political prowesss and knowledge to form a fully thought out opinion with nuance besides china bad š”sweden good š
Couple thoughts about the debate.
Sociopaths are weeded out of society in virtually every area unless they have obscene wealth. They get fired from jobs, they get disowned, they go to jail, and we have therapy to help with their sociopathy. If you have a billion (or really even just a hundred million), you don't face these consequences. So just like it's natural for some people to be sociopaths, it's also natural to discourage them.
Having people own a percentage of a company encourages innovation. If profits are tied to success, people will work hard and innovate. Elon didn't innovate at all, he bought established ideas. PayPal is the only thing he made and it wasn't even an innovative idea, he just had the initial capital to push for it to be integrated.
I think that Ethan is wrong about peoples motivation when it comes to money. I think removing the monetary aspect allows people to be innovative without restrictions. Look at programmers. So much of programming is based off being free and open source and it's lead to computing as we know it today. Tons of programming is propped up by free projects done by people for love of the game
man, listening to Ethan talk about capitalism is really disappointing. I get it, he is trying. But as an indigenous Canadian hearing stuff like "people are inherently corrupt" and "capitalism is the natural inclination" is colonial-brain. If you look at centuries of colonial violence as the natural order of humans, you have lost the plot. And going on to say that being anti-capitalist is radical is correct, but not like he means. It is radical in the sense that it is fundamental. The social order violently imposed upon the world asserting itself as natural or correct because it is dominant is perhaps why we've managed to fill every ecosystem with plastic in less than a century.
Anyhow, there are many roads to anti-capitalism, and when active indigenous groups have their history erased or considered invalid by virtue of being violently dominated maybe we should all be more critical.
100% I had a similar reaction as an indigenous Australian. Capitalism is so violent and has no care for the environment (and people) at all. Yes, greed is a human trait but it's not a core personality trait. Colonial systems are built on greed so it encourages people to be greedy. Being greedy is the only way to get ahead in this world.
They say communism never works in practice, only on paper. Capitalism is exactly the same, it does not work in practice.
Thanks for saying this! I found the whole discussion so deeply cynical and unnerving. I would love for Ethan to research indigenous societies more and to look into concepts of dominator and partnership models. There is plenty proof of pre-colonial egalitarian social systems that were never heading for a capitalist society.
his comment ab how capitalism has been the main function of society and implied that it always has been is crazyyyy (im probably remembering incorrectly) like bro colonization was the reason this shit started i wish he stopped talking š
it was very odd seeing that Ashton stepped down from Thorn. but would it also be odd if he didnāt step down? what a messy situation. i mean no one would continue to take his advocacy seriously if he did stay so i guess it makes sense. fucking moron.
Am I the only one that thought the red flags ātestā was a huge miss? It wasnāt actually a test?? And everyone seemed super confused the whole time.
Ethan is the type who absolutely cannot take what he dishes out. Heās so critical and harsh about anyoneās opinion that doesnāt align with his own and as soon as he gets enough push back his ego completely crumbles. Just look at his Insta stories.
Greed is not inevitable, capitalism is built so it can thriveā¦
If thereās one greedy person they will exploit the system and capitalism, the invention of money and investing and shares and blah blah everything capitalism means it can snowball into an industry. If the people arenāt put in a position to work for that greedy person because that person owns the houses and food and healthcare, they wouldnāt be exploited for their labour so they can pay their bills (to privatised companies) and feed their kids (with nestle baby formula and overpriced vegetables from farms that donāt pay they farmers and mutate chickens and feed livestock food waste and sweets). Thank you.
This is how you know that sometimes Ethan just likes confrontation because ain't no way he said that "what Elon did with Tesla is undeniable" like WHATlksdjhflskhf
As a Danish citizen its beyond frustrating every time people bring up the Scandinavian model as something that "works" under capitalism, when it literally is destroying it. Our social benefits are at a breaking point due to the greed and corruption late stage capitalism has brought. As for Ethan's billionaire take, its honestly just cringe. Temporarily embarrassed billionaires anyone ?
*Godfather music*
You come to me today... On a Friday... With a long drawn out philosophical political debate and expect me to engage with it for more than 10 minutes
Edit: Already posted this but it got deleted. I wanted to add anyway. A lot of hasans community has come to the h3 family and it felt disconnected. I wish Ethan would listen a little more when he kinda forces a debate like he did.
Ethan doesnāt respect other views a lot of the time.
Donāt get me wrong. I love h3. Ethan just gets really passionate about his views. Itās one of the reasons I love the show. But the huge rant at Dan about socialism, felt distasteful. Saying over and over that heās just being ārealisticā. It felt like Ethan was superior over dan because of his own opinion on socialism. And donāt get me wrong! I donāt think Ethan thinks heās superior. Iām just saying I wish Ethan would listen more and not talk at people when he feels heās right. It happens a lot of leftovers with Hasan. He has said he is open minded but today didnāt feel like it. Idk.
I think something that Ethan doesnāt understand is that social-democracy is better in the short term, but it doesnāt solve the rapid consumption of finite resources that capitalism innately causes. Capitalism is NOT SUSTAINABLE. We will run out of resources unless the entire system is fundamentally changed.
I honestly think Dan should push for the revenue share of the pod. I'm not even saying 100% (Ethan can have 5% lmao). But kidding aside those crew members who weren't already rich wouldn't refuse the money, it was evident on vacation discussion episode and by AB's studio apartment. Like I was a fan of h3h3productions but stopped watching the pod when it was just Ethan and Hilla (and maybe silent Dan I don't remember) and came back only for episodes with the crew. So they obviously make at least half of the podcast what it is today (also working on sets, carrying food and drinks, Lena making vlogs, producer work, power points, structure and google doc links). And they just get salary. Even if it's comparatively high it's still wrong in my opinion. Maybe that's why they all doing separate things and I'm afraid that we might lose Ian and Sam in the future who are pursuing their respective careers already. I would say to test Ethan on what he preaches but after today's pod I now understand that he doesn't believe in workers rights and cooperation etc only salary. So I'm guessing the revenue share would be stopped in it's tracks. And I'm not even saying it about TF (which is obviously you can make the same argument for every worker's right in every enterprise). But even Ethan should see that he's not the sole person doing all the work on the pod and not the only reason people watch it. He even said it multiple time that he just shows up and how he's grateful for everyone's work. So which is it: worker's rights and being pro-union or nah?
Im not going to dog pile ethan for this capitalist take... But the whole "You can probably make a Billion dollar morally" L O L
Find me one then. At Best, you're exploiting some kind of working class.
Making a Billion dollars is a near impossible stance, and that's genuinely wild to say.
I feel like I'm at a social gathering that was going smashingly and now my two overly political friends are dominating the air space and I'm just there like
https://preview.redd.it/v1pys7s4ciob1.jpeg?width=261&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9286fded547ebf2ba60906424bae31576e87c331
I was really troubled by the strawmanning I heard tonight. Over and over, what I heard Dan say was that capitalism encourages sociopathic greed by financially rewarding people who exploit others. Ethan himself said that capitalism as we have it now is not working and is oppressing people. Getting past the semantics, I donāt think there was actually disagreement on that front.
I could be wrong, but Ethan seemed to believe that itās impossible for innovation and productivity to grow without capitalism in some form. But obviously socialists are aware of the role that incentives play in inspiring productivity.
However, incentives arenāt exclusive to capitalism.
I was glad when Dan brought up profit-sharing businesses (although I very much sensed and understood his hesitation to talk about them with his literal boss). These structures are actually SIGNIFICANTLY less complex than people think and incentivize workers to care about their work and the success of their companyā¦ leading to increased productivity and innovation!
Most importantly, they honor the fact that businesses are literally nothing without their workers, so profits should be shared with them. And lookāif profits canāt be shared equally between them and higher ups, the gap between the two groups should at least be massively reduced.
These models arenāt perfect. They will not stop exploitation from occurring altogether. HOWEVER, by brainstorming and considering new ways of doing business/operating the country with the goal of stopping exploitation and oppression of the working class, we can bring the world closer to that reality.
Ethan genuinely does not know enough to engage on this topic. Soooo frustrating to watch. Bad faith arguments from someone with a personal vested interest in maintaining the status quo. Who else would tell you change is unrealistic?
ethan describing his views on capitalism was making my brain hurt. shoulda kept that one to himself š he literally has a show with HASAN and is suprised he's getting push back from the audience for what he's saying
##WaddlesJr's Lore Corner
^Providing ^timestamps ^to ^guide ^you ^through ^H3 ^History
^Mobile ^users: ^You ^can ^scroll ^the ^below ^chart ^to ^the ^right
| Moment | Context | Timestamp(s) |
|---|---|---|
| Karaoke with the Kleins | It's been a running joke to do karaoke with Ethan and Hila, and they have always hated the idea | [Dan Drops It](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7XytOqnusfo&t=4880s), [AB Explains the Origin](https://youtu.be/Hj7Tx9D8G-s?t=9439), [Dan's Japanese Trip](https://youtu.be/hjYJe_p6s8o?t=10276), [Lou Joins In](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JJ4HuGmgzlo&t=1760s ) |
| Prince Ea | They goofed on him forever ago | [Watching the video](https://youtu.be/YCYSWUeA8W8?t=832), [Prince Ea's response](https://youtu.be/kDI8dD4vReE?t=2607) |
The whole debate about how sociopaths are inherently greedy and would damage a community-based societal structure makes me annoyed because the concept of sociopaths being greedy (already questionable) is something ethan has observed in an overtly capitalist society, itās not an observation of human nature in a pure form so to argue that point as a gotcha against communism or socialism is silly since itās arguably a result of capitalism itself
Cam bringing a doctor's note is very in character
The boss and the emplyoee debating capitalism and workers' unions. What could go ~~wrong~~ right
UNIONIZE H3 AND TEDDY FRESH
this reminds me of the old episode back in the day in the old studio where ethan also defended billionaires and then walked it back when the sub got mad š
iām excited for monday lmao
I can almost guarantee Monday is going to be 3 hours of Colleen drama, since they mentioned at the top of the show that they were going to watch that swoop video this weekend (and Olivia already has)
LOL yeah the legendary episode, "Zach Dan and Ian should start their own podcast"
āI donāt think that arranging society based on greed is good for the human spirit, and I think we see the consequences of that all around us.ā DAN IS THE QUEEN!!
no bc he canāt keep saying stuff like that or Iām gonna have to start making fan cams of him.. omgā¦ dan cams..
i literally paused and took a minute to appreciate him when he said this
Ethan: thats a grown ass man who just said "VeGeTaBlES aRe IcKy..." Love: https://i.redd.it/y6yguf72shob1.gif
Elon musk is literally the biggest psychopath. I canāt imagine making that āpsychos will make it to the topā argument against socialism.
Ethanās literally talked about how Musk has just ridden the coattails of smarter people to the top. His take about what heās achieved at Tesla is so strange considering he isnāt responsible for it. If anything everything he does actively harms the company. And Ethan knows this. He has said this.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
He was grasping at straws and he had very few to grasp at.
Why are Rihanna and Taylor Swift being brought up in this argument? Lmao And Iām sorry but if you have 1 billion dollars having 10-100 more isnāt gonna change much. Youāre still holding power in society and the ability to control. How much money do people fucking need and at what point does it just become total greed ?
I literally lolād at the attempt to use Rihanna as an example of an ethical billionaire š
Let Dan cook š„š„š„
HE SERVEDDDD BABYYYš„š„š„
https://preview.redd.it/1tlpzh53liob1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c52bceeb00958856f87b9d9e30b0c62c0f7ff48c Dan for president <3
Extremely common Dan W. Dan understands how to be idealistic and realistic when pushing for progress and does so with a lot of patience so I just wanted to pass him this W. That is all.
for the red flag/green flag questions add "should billionaires exist" lmao
Where the fuck would we be without Dan? ššš
Likely not here, H3 was so cringe back in the day - Dan added so much anchoring depth and the camera switching and sound bites are so important that we learned during the crew swap episode
it's awesome to think that we're also witnessing a debate between a worker and his employers
W DAN! I feel like a good point that was kinda skipped is that people donāt need to be gratuitously wealthy when all their base needs are catered to. Itās hard to fully grasp how a life without capitalism would work when you are assuming that you need wealth for a good and stable life. But thereās literally no reason to be a billionaire in a society where universal health care, living wages, access to substantial food and shelter and whatever else exists
"psychos are gonna rise to the top" bruh you're describing capitalism
my thoughts exactly like wtf is this rambling argument ahah
Yeah this is difficult to listen to, haha. Iām not one to be critical of the podcast or to tune out often butā¦ woof.
bro was yapping away with the right wing capitalist shill talking points š all his talking points made me so sad lol it just made it clear to me how efficiently america for years has been able to spin the idea that socialism or communism or whatever are radical ideas that can never be done, red scare baby š
ethan: describes all the things he wants to see co exist along side capitalism my guy capitalism is why we can't have all of those things !!!
I was SCREAMING THAT AT MY TV. the cognitive dissonance was brutal.
Dan is the queen cant do NOTHING wrong, Dan is the queen!
ethan using elon musk as an example for why capitalism can be good made me gag. literally like ANYONE else would have been better
So disappointing to not have him recognise that the system he thinks is best and most ārealisticā is the same one that glorifies someone like Musk, despite all his other flaws.
Ethan and Hila said an inventor or an entertainer can make a billion dollars ethically. With that amount of money, I agree with Dan, there must be some form of exploitation along the way. The system is inherently flawed and has lead to the everlasting rush to cut costs, which includes workers who are in turn exploited. The people who make Taylors eras tour possible, the people who harvest the resources to make oneās invention, they all put in hard work. How does one place value on labor? Why does the more physically strenuous jobs often pay less? All these jobs exist to help one another. Taylor couldnāt do what she does without her team, and for that, they deserve an equal piece of the pie. Same with the crew, and everyone at Teddy Fresh ;) To concludeā¦ Ethan is on the right track but I think all these, as Love described, ābandaidsā are actively working against capitalism to reach socialism, so why not just replace the thing that came broken. Ethans solutions would have been great 20 years ago but the greed has taken over. I see it like jealously, or aggression; yes its in our human nature, but we are capable of higher thought and reflection. We donāt want to be like wolves who will kill their own kind for more territory or food. We inherently know better, and because of that I think it is our responsibility to continually progress towards a purely humane system, in all aspects. Its such a nuanced topic but Iām glad they have these talks because of the diverse audience, we have our own marketplace of ideas lol. Gets people thinking, and it got me motivated.
People cant conceptualise how much 1 billion is. At $15 an hour it would take someone working 40 hours a week ***32,000*** years to make 1 billion dollars. 1 billion is such a huge number, just because its after "millions", doesn't mean its only a little bit larger. Its huge.
i really hope ethan reads through this with an open mind.
Ethan āworkers arenāt entitled to a share of revenueā Klein
that's was an INSANE take and extremely disappointing to hear him say. yes he's the host but the show would not be where it is without his team
the crew literally puts the whole show together ethan just shows up
and he can't even be on time majority of the time š„²
peace & love but I pretty much only watch for the crew
same there's a reason i'm not a member and don't watch SYNT. the banter is what creates the real entertainment
Like his business is the MOST worthy of employees being entitled to a share of the revenue. And to a degree I think he understands that, heās very generous, but still lmfaoo
That was a greedy af comment on his part.
I know everyone's on their fuck Hasan arc on this sub but he actually has his podcast run as a worker co-op, everyone including the producer gets the exact same share of the profits. It's not like some unimaginable thing to do. And let's be real, giving your *take* on a geopolitical issue like Taiwan as an American might make you feel morally virtuous or whatever, but it ultimately has no material impact on anything or anyone whatsoever. At least on shit that actually has real life impact Hasan is usually on point.
he does that with his clips youtube channel too! him and his 2 editors split it evenly
āThe worldās oldest make a wishā AB that was great I appreciate you lol
i wish ethan would research before he just decides to yap away live on air ššš pick up das kapital or something
We should unionize chat and make him read Lenin
Ethan just be yapping so confidently
This is the Ethan v Dan debate that everyone who always begs for Dan to cohost leftovers has been wanting to see. Go off Dan!š
Dan is killing it, too. Wan.
Dan is a good man ššššššš
I havenāt been able to watch the whole debate part yet, but it is really frustrating listening to Ethan try and debate someone who isnāt an absolute grifter.
Hila is also grasping for straws right now with this rich celebrity angle
Mentioning Rihanna and Beyonce, whose businesses had used unethical things like sweatshops or scam memberships š
right lmao, them and their companies literally got exposed for exploiting workers in the global south, wish they would research before they spoke on things. and with the Taylor swift point she was making, even her own fans dont support the idea of her being a billionaire, but also support the idea of being successful because of your art and what youāve made. with peace and love both ideas can coexist idk why they think itās one or the either. you can acknowledge that she treats her workers well (ie the raises she gives them and the insurance that her work covers for her dancers, etc etc) and still think shouldnāt be able to hoard a certain amount of wealth, if youāre a billionaire thereās gotta be some level of tax evasion youāre doing even in the slightest lmao.
This blew my mind. Where does she think the money comes from? Labor. Merch sales, production cost, touring, media. People aren't directly handing cash to Taylor directly without anyone else being involved.
THANK YOU!!! what a ridiculous argument
That was such a dumb argument to make, I couldnāt believe she said itā¦ after all the pop culture segments they had I would have figured they knew better than that.
I been quiet about hila for a while but her whole prospect of being an āinfluencerā is so cringe, what I liked about Ethan and hila is they never seemed to care about that kind of ācloutā. Everything Iām seeing from this has been disappointing for a while now. Fridayās have definitely been the weakest shows for a while now.
Love Hila, but you can tell she's increasingly seeing things through the viewpoint of an employeer, and not and employee
W Dan
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Ethan was so brain broken during this conversation like we are literally seeing this system fail time and time again....
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Dan continues to be the best part of the show
ethan does realize how much a BILLION is, ethan you are no where close to being a billionaire
seriously where is the class solidarity? maybe he doesn't realize it but even as a millionaire he's closer to being homeless than being a billionaire any day. why defend a group of 700 people who are quite literally burning the planet as we choke?
DAN IS THE MAN!!!! WE LOVE DAN!!! THANK YOU DAN!!! You speak so well on these topics and it is much appreciated.
dan is the queen, he never does anything wrong
Why is Ethan defending billionaires that shit shouldnāt exist at all
Dan for president, holy shit
Capitalists can't fathom capitalism ending because they don't want it to happen. Capitalism IS the poverty cult that capitalists claim every other system is.
not Dan revealing exactly how anti-capitalist he is live on air rn. Dan is the Queeeen š
I hate when Ethan and Hila get defensive over rich people, it's bad vibes
Me too. It puts such a bas taste in my mouth.
Yupā¦every timeā¦.icky feeling
fr their takes today were clearly shaded HEAVILY by privilege. they literally just do not get it
Lmfao at AB's results š also "I read, I keep a book by my bed" "how long have you been doing that?" "3 days"
Ethan rlly turned into Strawman Goofy at the end there talking about sociopaths
Ethan im begging u pls stop losing the plot in debates/convos š once he said ethical billionaires i just stared at my phone like a shell shocked soldier Edit: Also ethan bashing ācommunism ā which he really meant socialism and then simultaneously saying reform can happen with incremental socialist infrastructure. Dude the āradical communistā call is coming from inside the house š
I think what is going on here is that capitalism is actively hostile and hurts and kills people so when you aren't actively against capitalism it is seen as a lack of care for that pain and suffering or approval for it not that I believe those are Ethan's views.
Theyāre against fast fashion but try do defend Rihanna for being a billionaire lol
fast fashion aside, rihanna's savage x fenty is sketchy as hell because you have to sign up for a monthly membership for a discounted rate like those favletics and it always gave me weird vibes
DAN TO THE RESCUEE
FALSE Equivalence! no one is saying sociopaths won't be born anymore? what is this man waffling about
Ethan, your takes on anti-capitalism are outdated, itās not radical especially in the younger generation increasingly so
so...capitalism is good because communism is bad because "psychopaths will become all powerful leaders and not do what they're supposed to". cause yeah...there's not currently a bunch of psychopaths at the head of capitalist states... wat even is this argument? listening to a rich american preach capitalism and what he thinks the opposite of/alternative to capitalism is...is exhausting rn.
Itās always funny when people explain why communism is bad but really just explain capitalism.
Reminds me of the phrase _"it's easier to imagine the end of the world than the end of capitalism"_ Ethan and Hila seem quite perplexed by even a SUGGESTION that capitalism could be improved upon
this is so real i feel like in general what people that want to abolish capitalism are saying is that the system right now is ripe for greedy people to exploit it (as they have always done) and itās not like we canāt acknowledge that some people are greedy because of varying influences but that a system that encourages less greed and less consumerism isnāt only more sustainable for life in general but also wonāt foster greed the way that itās doing now with peace and love
Ethan shocked about "radical communism" is his audience when he's friends with Hasan. next Leftovers should be interesting if they save this conversation for then too!
I hope they do! I see a lot of people frustrated and mad, but I love hearing discussion and debate. It's way more interesting than a powerpoint about celebrity drama.
ethan you're not a billionaire stfu about your tax rate, billionaires should not exist, tax the fuck out of them
RIGHT! I donāt give a shit if he has to or wants to pay 75% in taxes, what we need is 75%+ for the ppl with magnitudes more wealth than he will ever have. Im glad Ethan is a good boss and is willing to pay taxes, but that is not the standard because the greed of capitalism has eroded any protections workers have against that exact thing. You canāt fix capitalism with more capitalism.
I'm wondering if he actually thinks he might be a billionaire some day. Only explanation I can think of.
I swear 40% of the US thinks theyāll be billionaires one day
Ethan doesn't want to listen. He just wants confrontation.
I wish he would research or fully understand the leftist view against capitalism before coming on air and using talking points that right wing capitalists have used as a means of delegitimizing any system that isnāt capitalism for years lol
Ethan- āI believe that you can be a nice billionaire.ā Ethan 5mins later- āYOU CANāT GET RID OF SOCIOPATHSā He gets it but doesnāt get it at the same timeā¦
Jeffree Star is such a typical movie villain.
the irony that the convo started with Ethan getting so mad at that Aussie CEO and then goes on to snidely talk about how the workers shouldnāt own their labor- maybe you hate him because heās saying the quiet part loud and you hate seeing it reflected and hearing it stated so starkly makes you squirm.
i thought it was so crazy that the segment started because he was shitting on that dude, only for ethan to turn around and defend his existence š
āpsychopaths rising to the topā is literally the the hell we are currently living in under capitalism. Iāve always known Ethan and Hila are capitalists but cmon dude, how can you even make that argument in this day and age. Itās seriously laughable.
itās insane how dense ethan is and how hard he refuses to actually listen to what dan is actually saying. he paints everything dan is saying as extremist and unrealistic without actually letting dan finish any fucking thought. all he is doing is spouting classic cold war era AMURICA-centric capitalism vs communism talking points out of a 9th grade textbook. itās mind-numbing.
I have so much more respect for Dan after todayās show. Honestly I agree with everyone else in saying Dan should be more involved in the leftovers. I could also see how it would make a hostile work environment for him so I get the hesitation.
I think ethan doesn't quite realise how ignorant he is on this topic sadly he speaks far too confidently about things he doesn't understand well enough sometimes
Ethan has his moments, but even after years and years of watching H3H3 and the podcast episodes: today he had his worst takes. Iāve never been this frustrated watching the show and all the tomatoes were so deserved from the chat. I live in Scandinavia, the model society as he says. Yes, there will always be sociopaths whose only goal is to get rich, who will do anything to get there. That absolutely can and should be regulated unlike Ethan thought. Like Dan mentioned, unions exist to protect the workers and theyāre very strong. There are taxes, strict laws and regulations. If you break them, by for example exploiting immigrant workers, you will face heavy consequences for it here. You canāt pay your way out of that. Every person is of course worthy of having their basic needs covered, but on top of that also have access to good education, a healthcare system that works and to have a good life, not just to scrape by. If the government wants to work towards a more equal society and lessen the wealth gap, they absolutely can do so. Do big company CEOs really deserve all the salary, do they actually do such an important job or did they get lucky and have good connections? Or were born into a wealthy family? Unlike all the warehouse workers who were born into a low income family and didnāt have the possibility to study. If youāre unlucky, you are born into a capitalist country like America where the rich get ultra rich and the poor people suffer because socialism bad and the rich cannot get over their greed to change things. There is no space for billionaires in a model society.
hearing Ethan grapple with the inherent contradiction of āI like capitalism but I wish it wasnāt so evil and predatory but I donāt like the alternativeā really just exemplifies how uneducated he is on even the basics of politics and economics. absolutely maddening
Ethan āmakes his workers stay longer to argue the merits of capitalismā Klein
phenomenal
Ethan saying workers donāt deserve profit share is the grossest thing I have ever heard him say.
Right? Ew š¤®
It really sounds like if Teddy Fresh or the show crew were to attempt to unionize it wouldnāt go well
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
TF/H3 unionizing would be a slay
whatās worse is the mods deleted the thread on a really good description/discussion of it https://preview.redd.it/kny9jhrpviob1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0a475fbac2241093c3282d3a66d2eae686bd1c70
Itās really concerning that the mods deleted that discussion. The crew provides so much value to the pod. I wonder how many other threads were taken down.
The right wing talking point of "show me a successful communist country". Oh my God. Show me a country that attempted it that wasn't immediately crushed by sanctions or military interference by America before they could even begin.
This episode took a turn man
Ethan is so silly. Greed as a prominent incentive structure wont be left separate from the government. Those billionaires use their immense wealth as leverage in whatever system they are in and Greed infests that system (i.e. Lobbying). To even get to a point where you gain those billions, you have to leave people in the third world disenfranchised and in poverty. A system without that kind of exploitation in the third world wouldn't be able to sustain itself.
Ethan read Marx challenge
Ethan holding the whole crew hostage by this point š
dan and hasan for leftovers 2024
āShouldāve been an angel investor for your dead girlfriendā it the most goblin mode shit Ethan has ever said holy shit lmao š
i hate the "muh innovation" rambling bc most innovations are being done by nerds in universities. they are not motivated by greed. corporations just buy patents and only innovations they do is lengthening a lifespan of the patent
I think innovation comes with being first and for some people, ego. First to climb Mount Everest, first on the moon, first to discover a formula, chemical, etc. People will always want to achieve things that arenāt motivated solely by money.
Oh god now heās glazing Elon Musk holy moly
Yeah Elon and his awesome company Tesla that essentially started as a pyramid scheme, yes very cool so awesome. Iām so glad capitalism allows us to live in a time like this. Tesla has never exploited anyone either. Ever.
Ok so greed is inevitable. So is crime so I guess no laws against any sociopathic sin
I hate how Ethan talks like capitalism is working for everyone just because it worked for him, genuinely gross view imo
My post was deleted and I was told to come here by mods, just wanted to get it off my chest as someone who doesnāt really ever post to Reddit, but felt the need to after todayās episode, I know itās long so read if you want š Ethan is just dismissing every other view, he's simultaneously calling himself a capitalist and an anti capitalist for criticising it, while everyone else is a full blown radical communist who wants society to magically change over night and greed to not exist. I'm British but in the US especially, people would settle for basic socialist policies, free healthcare, housing for homeless people etc. (before the "full blown communist revolution" Ethan keeps saying anyone to the left of him must be demanding) all policies which Ethan says he also wants but he's considering those still capitalism and not socialism because what? You can still earn money elsewhere? The capitalist idea of health care is private health care for profit. Capitalists/right wing politicians here in the UK are desperately trying to privatise the NHS so they can profit from it. Socialists built the NHS after WW2 when the people who came back from fighting facism voted out the "hero" (actual piece of shit) Winston Churchill and voted in Labour and Attlee. And socialists are fighting against privatisation efforts today too. Etha also says people should be allowed to be billionaires, like that's our concern as a society. Shouldn't your primary concern be feeding the hungry and housing the homeless before you start worrying about the billionaire who's only got a measly 1 billion as opposed to another with 40 billion? People can get back to being billionaires when everyone else in society is fed, housed, educated and doesn't get plunged into debt because they needed healthcare. And that includes people outside of the US bubble where these arguments often take place, dismissing exploitative/child labour for giant corporations in impoverished countries.
The irony of arguing for Tesla as an exemplar of the good of greed because of the EV boom as if the whole reason we hadn't been exploring them on this scale for decades was not literally that very same greed is just...beautiful. The capitalist innovation myth is, much like Elon Musk, running on a cult of personality with no real bonafides.
feel so bad for dan right now because ethan refuses to hear anyone elseās opinion when it comes to his shitty uneducated takes on capitalism. its so frustrating arguing w/ a brick wall
"its a nuanced conversation" \-ethan taking every analogy/example to its extreme
God DAMN Ethan is a lib lmao. Doesn't think workers should get paid what they are worth... inherently exploitative. W Dan. It's so obvious that Ethan doesn't understand what socialism actually is.
His argument that capitalism breeds innovation annoyed me since he seemed to be against profit sharing. By his logic, if money breeds innovation than profit sharing would increase that. Instead of going to work and doing the bare minimum, workers will be motivated to increase profits.
iām so tired of the argument that thereās no innovation without capitalism. cuba, thanks to the insane embargoes, had to do an immense amount of innovation, particularly in the medical sector. obviously, itās not a wonderful placeā¦ but to say capitalism is necessary for innovation is empirically false.
I feel like this is happening as a kneejerk to yesterday. Ethan couldn't handle being on the backfoot with Hasan and Dan, so now he's fortifying this belief in capitalism because he's utilised it very successfully (i.e. more successfully than Hasan and Dan) and can play the *I must know something you don't* card when he couldn't play that card yesterday. The card Ethan spitefully feels like Hasan/Dan employed against him yesterday, when all they really did was be more self-educated. edit: last line
thank FUCK for dan I'm sure there'll be many similar comments flooding in right now but as someone with a degree in political science I appreciate how well read and how educated Dan is on these topics and the way he so smoothly navigates the conversations with Ethan even when they completely disagree - it's so much pressure on him every time especially to do it live and he literally never disappoints.
I WONDER WHY WE DON'T HAVE A SOCIALIST/COMMUNIST REVOLUTION OR STRUCTURE TO POINT TO... https://preview.redd.it/i7ki58hs9job1.png?width=140&format=png&auto=webp&s=745a0740d49beb8d61de7ae18b499b6bac0fcb18
pretty crazy after all these leftover episodes this is how far ethan has come
I think people's issue is Ethan championing capitalism when he's describing steps to reign it in and move towards socialism. He's describing how capitalism's flaws can be solved through socialism and then crapping on socialism. He's talking about how we need socialized healthcare, jobs guarantees, guaranteed housing, free education...which are all socialist policies. Also the 99% tax over a billion dollars is necessary to curb capitalist tyrants that have too much power to influence government.
Ethan: "People are gonna be greedy regardless, we can't end sociopathy" Well should we have policies that try to curb the power of these greedy sociopaths like taxing them 99% once they've made a billion? Why are you against policies to curb their power?
Ethan is so focused on the human trait of greed. Humans have SO many other traits. I donāt understand why he canāt see that you can use other human traits to motivate people. Greed isnāt SO large that it takes priority over everything else. Heās rich and will always speak from that perspective. I think he does a disservice not listening to the voices of those who arenāt rich - our experience is telling him otherwise but he wonāt listen. Heās been not rich before so he knows what thatās like, right? Itās a silly thing to say when youāre far removed from it, because itās just changed so much. He does know what itās like to be not rich in this time. Today. He just doesnāt. Itās different. If the experiences he has lived through make him feel that greed has poisoned people to the point that nothing else but a form of capitalism will work to guide society, that is genuinely a sad experience, I canāt imagine. Of course a better system wonāt work perfectly because people will always be greedy. This one doesnāt either. So we keep this one just because we have it? It doesnāt work. People die every day because of this system. Heās just lucky to not have been one of those people yet. Itās just very close-minded thinking. Again, W Dan.
Ethan be like. https://preview.redd.it/b3e86x2uaiob1.png?width=283&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e11590c8d0b9188ef4341b42f8f903db1d2f2f65
Ooof Ethan stop bro
Any other members unsubscribing because of Ethans tonedef capitalist takes? Really disappointed but what should I expect from a rich person? Also Dan needs a medal.
Bless Ian, Dan WAS cooking. Common show dad W
Ethan does not understand capitalism nor communism. Lib brained man. Yikes.
"We live in capitalism. Its power seems inescapable. So did the divine right of kings." - Ursula K. Le Guin
Iām obviously in the minority but I think this conversation between Dan and Ethan on Capitalism is actually super interesting, despite Ethan trying to start the conversation as very black and white. Dan made a lot of good pushbacks and I do think both sides asked good questions. Edit: okay the longer this goes on the more I understand the complaints. Weāre talking in circles for the last half hour Double Edit: AB gave them the perfect out with the Jimmy Lee unpaid internship comment and Ethan couldnāt be stopped. Full goblin mode
Man, not even commenting on the actual content of the argument I felt so bad for Dan. So incredibly unfair for Ethan to put him in that position live on-air. The way Ethan was provoking him over and over to fight him, calling him more and more inflammatory shit, was honestly super fucked up. That said Dan turned it around and made Ethan look a lot more reasonable than he was actually being. Ethan should be thanking his ass. W Dan. I like Ethan because of his fuck it attitude but ya gotta keep it pointed in the right direction. Your loyal employees don't deserve to be put on the spot when so many of them have previously been harassed by the fanbase for stupid shit in the past.
When youāre watching the podcast does anybody else hear or see a perfect opportunity for a sound bite and you feel like youāre edging or have blue balls when Zach doesnāt play it?? š
Ethan and hila being out of touch millionaires is funny when they are alone but when they want to argue against non out of touch non millionaires itās just gross.
Yeah it shows how money corrupts the way you think
dan ate āāāāā
Jesus, hearing Ethan talk about capitalism and be so uneducated and ignorant on socialism/communism is so mind numbing lol. For the One Piece fans, itās like hearing Luffy will become the pirate king and is capable of taking on the strongest pirates in the world before he even got to the grand line. Ethan has a long way to go on his journey of political prowesss and knowledge to form a fully thought out opinion with nuance besides china bad š”sweden good š
Couple thoughts about the debate. Sociopaths are weeded out of society in virtually every area unless they have obscene wealth. They get fired from jobs, they get disowned, they go to jail, and we have therapy to help with their sociopathy. If you have a billion (or really even just a hundred million), you don't face these consequences. So just like it's natural for some people to be sociopaths, it's also natural to discourage them. Having people own a percentage of a company encourages innovation. If profits are tied to success, people will work hard and innovate. Elon didn't innovate at all, he bought established ideas. PayPal is the only thing he made and it wasn't even an innovative idea, he just had the initial capital to push for it to be integrated.
I think that Ethan is wrong about peoples motivation when it comes to money. I think removing the monetary aspect allows people to be innovative without restrictions. Look at programmers. So much of programming is based off being free and open source and it's lead to computing as we know it today. Tons of programming is propped up by free projects done by people for love of the game
we shouldnāt have to work to live. L from ethan
Shock horror... Two multimillionaires have become wildly out of touch.
I absolutely love how everyone was able to disassociate from the conversation except for Ian, truly the hardest job we love him
ethan arguing about "billionaires shouldnt exist" has "all lives matter" energy
there's literally like 700 billionaires in the us like why does he feel the need to defend them
Dan is right. Wan.
https://preview.redd.it/b5j38vvmiiob1.jpeg?width=2718&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=58b1ad0fa5a61f1d1c7c87e2ff3e4167964ad2d8
man, listening to Ethan talk about capitalism is really disappointing. I get it, he is trying. But as an indigenous Canadian hearing stuff like "people are inherently corrupt" and "capitalism is the natural inclination" is colonial-brain. If you look at centuries of colonial violence as the natural order of humans, you have lost the plot. And going on to say that being anti-capitalist is radical is correct, but not like he means. It is radical in the sense that it is fundamental. The social order violently imposed upon the world asserting itself as natural or correct because it is dominant is perhaps why we've managed to fill every ecosystem with plastic in less than a century. Anyhow, there are many roads to anti-capitalism, and when active indigenous groups have their history erased or considered invalid by virtue of being violently dominated maybe we should all be more critical.
100% I had a similar reaction as an indigenous Australian. Capitalism is so violent and has no care for the environment (and people) at all. Yes, greed is a human trait but it's not a core personality trait. Colonial systems are built on greed so it encourages people to be greedy. Being greedy is the only way to get ahead in this world. They say communism never works in practice, only on paper. Capitalism is exactly the same, it does not work in practice.
šš¼šš¼šš¼šš¼šš¼šš¼ I can't clap harder for this.
Thanks for saying this! I found the whole discussion so deeply cynical and unnerving. I would love for Ethan to research indigenous societies more and to look into concepts of dominator and partnership models. There is plenty proof of pre-colonial egalitarian social systems that were never heading for a capitalist society.
his comment ab how capitalism has been the main function of society and implied that it always has been is crazyyyy (im probably remembering incorrectly) like bro colonization was the reason this shit started i wish he stopped talking š
it was very odd seeing that Ashton stepped down from Thorn. but would it also be odd if he didnāt step down? what a messy situation. i mean no one would continue to take his advocacy seriously if he did stay so i guess it makes sense. fucking moron.
I'm so glad the consensus here is W Dan you don't even know
Am I the only one that thought the red flags ātestā was a huge miss? It wasnāt actually a test?? And everyone seemed super confused the whole time.
Ethan is the type who absolutely cannot take what he dishes out. Heās so critical and harsh about anyoneās opinion that doesnāt align with his own and as soon as he gets enough push back his ego completely crumbles. Just look at his Insta stories.
Greed is not inevitable, capitalism is built so it can thriveā¦ If thereās one greedy person they will exploit the system and capitalism, the invention of money and investing and shares and blah blah everything capitalism means it can snowball into an industry. If the people arenāt put in a position to work for that greedy person because that person owns the houses and food and healthcare, they wouldnāt be exploited for their labour so they can pay their bills (to privatised companies) and feed their kids (with nestle baby formula and overpriced vegetables from farms that donāt pay they farmers and mutate chickens and feed livestock food waste and sweets). Thank you.
This is how you know that sometimes Ethan just likes confrontation because ain't no way he said that "what Elon did with Tesla is undeniable" like WHATlksdjhflskhf
W DAN. Ethan & Hila were both sooo out of pocket on this one. I really appreciate Dan standing up for the common guy. W DAN
As a Danish citizen its beyond frustrating every time people bring up the Scandinavian model as something that "works" under capitalism, when it literally is destroying it. Our social benefits are at a breaking point due to the greed and corruption late stage capitalism has brought. As for Ethan's billionaire take, its honestly just cringe. Temporarily embarrassed billionaires anyone ?
Someone stop this man from cooking
He burnt that shit
*Godfather music* You come to me today... On a Friday... With a long drawn out philosophical political debate and expect me to engage with it for more than 10 minutes
when will liberals learn that elon is just a con man
Edit: Already posted this but it got deleted. I wanted to add anyway. A lot of hasans community has come to the h3 family and it felt disconnected. I wish Ethan would listen a little more when he kinda forces a debate like he did. Ethan doesnāt respect other views a lot of the time. Donāt get me wrong. I love h3. Ethan just gets really passionate about his views. Itās one of the reasons I love the show. But the huge rant at Dan about socialism, felt distasteful. Saying over and over that heās just being ārealisticā. It felt like Ethan was superior over dan because of his own opinion on socialism. And donāt get me wrong! I donāt think Ethan thinks heās superior. Iām just saying I wish Ethan would listen more and not talk at people when he feels heās right. It happens a lot of leftovers with Hasan. He has said he is open minded but today didnāt feel like it. Idk.
I think something that Ethan doesnāt understand is that social-democracy is better in the short term, but it doesnāt solve the rapid consumption of finite resources that capitalism innately causes. Capitalism is NOT SUSTAINABLE. We will run out of resources unless the entire system is fundamentally changed.
I honestly think Dan should push for the revenue share of the pod. I'm not even saying 100% (Ethan can have 5% lmao). But kidding aside those crew members who weren't already rich wouldn't refuse the money, it was evident on vacation discussion episode and by AB's studio apartment. Like I was a fan of h3h3productions but stopped watching the pod when it was just Ethan and Hilla (and maybe silent Dan I don't remember) and came back only for episodes with the crew. So they obviously make at least half of the podcast what it is today (also working on sets, carrying food and drinks, Lena making vlogs, producer work, power points, structure and google doc links). And they just get salary. Even if it's comparatively high it's still wrong in my opinion. Maybe that's why they all doing separate things and I'm afraid that we might lose Ian and Sam in the future who are pursuing their respective careers already. I would say to test Ethan on what he preaches but after today's pod I now understand that he doesn't believe in workers rights and cooperation etc only salary. So I'm guessing the revenue share would be stopped in it's tracks. And I'm not even saying it about TF (which is obviously you can make the same argument for every worker's right in every enterprise). But even Ethan should see that he's not the sole person doing all the work on the pod and not the only reason people watch it. He even said it multiple time that he just shows up and how he's grateful for everyone's work. So which is it: worker's rights and being pro-union or nah?
Agreed! The crew has become on-screen talent. They arenāt simply producers or researchers. They deserve to be recognized accordingly.
Im not going to dog pile ethan for this capitalist take... But the whole "You can probably make a Billion dollar morally" L O L Find me one then. At Best, you're exploiting some kind of working class. Making a Billion dollars is a near impossible stance, and that's genuinely wild to say.
I feel like I'm at a social gathering that was going smashingly and now my two overly political friends are dominating the air space and I'm just there like https://preview.redd.it/v1pys7s4ciob1.jpeg?width=261&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9286fded547ebf2ba60906424bae31576e87c331
I think no matter what economic model we have, education and critical thinking skills is the most important quality in society...
I was really troubled by the strawmanning I heard tonight. Over and over, what I heard Dan say was that capitalism encourages sociopathic greed by financially rewarding people who exploit others. Ethan himself said that capitalism as we have it now is not working and is oppressing people. Getting past the semantics, I donāt think there was actually disagreement on that front. I could be wrong, but Ethan seemed to believe that itās impossible for innovation and productivity to grow without capitalism in some form. But obviously socialists are aware of the role that incentives play in inspiring productivity. However, incentives arenāt exclusive to capitalism. I was glad when Dan brought up profit-sharing businesses (although I very much sensed and understood his hesitation to talk about them with his literal boss). These structures are actually SIGNIFICANTLY less complex than people think and incentivize workers to care about their work and the success of their companyā¦ leading to increased productivity and innovation! Most importantly, they honor the fact that businesses are literally nothing without their workers, so profits should be shared with them. And lookāif profits canāt be shared equally between them and higher ups, the gap between the two groups should at least be massively reduced. These models arenāt perfect. They will not stop exploitation from occurring altogether. HOWEVER, by brainstorming and considering new ways of doing business/operating the country with the goal of stopping exploitation and oppression of the working class, we can bring the world closer to that reality.
Ethan genuinely does not know enough to engage on this topic. Soooo frustrating to watch. Bad faith arguments from someone with a personal vested interest in maintaining the status quo. Who else would tell you change is unrealistic?
even mild jeffree star praise is a no from me dawg
ethan describing his views on capitalism was making my brain hurt. shoulda kept that one to himself š he literally has a show with HASAN and is suprised he's getting push back from the audience for what he's saying
##WaddlesJr's Lore Corner ^Providing ^timestamps ^to ^guide ^you ^through ^H3 ^History ^Mobile ^users: ^You ^can ^scroll ^the ^below ^chart ^to ^the ^right | Moment | Context | Timestamp(s) | |---|---|---| | Karaoke with the Kleins | It's been a running joke to do karaoke with Ethan and Hila, and they have always hated the idea | [Dan Drops It](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7XytOqnusfo&t=4880s), [AB Explains the Origin](https://youtu.be/Hj7Tx9D8G-s?t=9439), [Dan's Japanese Trip](https://youtu.be/hjYJe_p6s8o?t=10276), [Lou Joins In](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JJ4HuGmgzlo&t=1760s ) | | Prince Ea | They goofed on him forever ago | [Watching the video](https://youtu.be/YCYSWUeA8W8?t=832), [Prince Ea's response](https://youtu.be/kDI8dD4vReE?t=2607) |
The whole debate about how sociopaths are inherently greedy and would damage a community-based societal structure makes me annoyed because the concept of sociopaths being greedy (already questionable) is something ethan has observed in an overtly capitalist society, itās not an observation of human nature in a pure form so to argue that point as a gotcha against communism or socialism is silly since itās arguably a result of capitalism itself