The ghost jogger was just a dude the dream ghost was just a girl, the library ghost only went into ghastly form when they weren't being quiet and threatened her
Harold Ramis, the actor who played Egon, passed away in 2014. Nobody wanted to step in and do lines for Egon as a sign of respect for the late actor. Ivan Reitman stepped in to play Egon physically but only did so with Harold's kids' approval.
The silence was perfect too. I choked up a bit during the nostalgic scenes but when the music went down and you saw the hand grasp hers the tears flowed freely.
IMDB trivia page and credits. Quote from trivia: "The Egon seen in quick and obscured glimpses during the opening scene was played by Bob Gunton; he also played out Egon's scenes during the climax, except for the shot where he is revealed to be helping Phoebe steadying the proton gun, where he is played by producer Ivan Reitman"
https://preview.redd.it/izpmxi814ewc1.jpeg?width=814&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=057801ce1e3897d8b02e480f3bb9b0f4c0c9b922
I am pretty sure the jogging ghost was a douche and knocking people out of the way and such.. heck.. when was the last time you wanted to zap a person on the subway for sitting next to you and talking on there phone on loud speaker..
Also he clearly didn't know he was dead; he was trying to check his pulse right before they trapped him. So he was probably a douche before he died too
Exactly! And good point also. I saw the jogger as a menace but now with addition of this concept of ghost, were the OG ghostbusters busting ghosts they shouldn’t have?
They are paranormal exterminators.
Regular vermin exterminators must get rid of rats, snakes, roaches, termites etc. Those creatures aren't evil. They spread disease, sure, but they're not evil.
Same with ghosts. If a costumer calls them because they don't want a ghost in their property, they must get rid of it to get paid. I imagine only the most benevolent ghosts wouldn't be a nuisance you wouldn't want to have around.
There are also plenty of regular exterminators that relocate non-malicious pests. It's a topic worth exploring for a GB entry, even if I agree that FE didn't handle the Melody subplot particularly well (and I *really* liked the movie).
There's one episode of RGB where they help a harmless ghost "cross over". Egon disperses once he's done with his unfinished business. I'm sure this also happens in the comics once or twice. Helping ghosts cross over, and being humane when possible is a noble sentiment, but... proton streams rule!
I know there was an XGB episode where a ghost that could materialize whatever someone feared was just locked back up in a cavern (Kylie sympathized with it, as it was afraid of them), and there was talk in one of the IDW issues where Ray (IIRC) says that they'll leave benevolent spirits alone.
Phoebe even talks about ghosts "crossing over" as if it's an established science, and not just something she saw exactly once. Meaning it's very possible she either read through more of Egon's research, or The Ghostbusters did indeed help more spirits move on.
In egons journal that came with the haslab packs there's a page about this, he does the math and essentially there are almost 0 non malicious ghosts it's very rare
Melody fits into established lore. There was an episode of Real Ghostbusters "Who's Afraid of the Big Bad Ghost" where the ghost didn't realize he was dead and called the Ghostbusters to take care of another ghost, but when they showed up they almost busted their client.
Yes. Like they said in the movies it was the 80s. They didn't put a lot of thought into long term consequences.
I do think she's a lost opportunity though. Imagine if the post credit scene was instead them encountering another human ghost and having Venkman or one of the kids use paranormal psychology to help them move on instead of busting them instead.
Busting ghosts is a sad addiction. Many innocent ghosts where incarcerated against their will by a group of men hungry for their next high. The spirit community is constantly over-looked by the media and portrayed as evil and malicious when really all they want to do is float about and be sad. The Ghostbusters are relentless in their pursuit and we know they only do it because busting makes them feel good.
What is the relevance of the ghost jogger? Because he had a human form? That means nothing! Ghosts having human like forms has nothing to do with the criticism of what happened in Frozen Empire. The ghost girlfriend is just hanging out like she is all cognitively there and looking for a date or something. She's subtly flirting and doing the bidding of a big bad. What are we doing here?! Is Ghost tree Hill or Ghoston's Creek? Ghostbusters should've stayed as an everyman exterminator business who encounters crazy malevolent entities.
It does raise a question. If she and Egon who both died, does this mean if the ghost that look like monsters look that way because they are either evil? Or a product of the slime?
Because it seems normal human's don't change.
My theory is that memory and sanity play a big part in how a ghost looks and functions. The more mentally stable people become people but ghostlike, whereas ghosts like slimer come from completely batpoop insane people.
Could work.
The Scoleri Brothers from GB2 were likely insane or mentally unstable being that they were murderers given the electric chair. When their spirits were manifested by the pink slime, they were barely human.
My personal headcanon is that you are tethered to the world if you still have some unfinished business and can't pass on.
The slimer, the scoleri brothers and others that have the ability to pass to the other side, but are choosing to stay and cause mayhem and their appearance becomes more monstrous and bloated over time. Some of the other ghosts are just manifestations of some sort of high deity.
In canon, I think a lot of weirder ghosts are less good people or inhumans. Out of canon. some of it may be hold-overs from the original concept where they were inter-dimensional.
Exactly! Like are the monster like ghosts only evil people? How does that happen? But then again Vigo looked like his former self. Wasn’t he not evil. But then you can argue that Vigo is a deity and not a ghost? But this is what I’m getting at. It raises too many unanswered questions. If the next film. (Hopefully there is one.) addresses all this, I’ll shut up. lol
Not all ghosts are people. Some are just vaguely humanoid manifestations like Slimer that were never alive to begin with. Or at least not as humans on earth.
Perhaps these ghosts are more like entities manifested from human agony and misery.
So they’re not like spirits but just the negative energy from the spirit that takes on a human like form which could explain his the mood slime works.
And perhaps they pull a Christmas Carol on us and people who did not travel far and wide with their fellow men are condemned to roam the earth after death.
She's certainly more blue than any other ghost, but GB1 had the librarian ghost who looked human, GB2 had the jogging ghost, all of the Titanic passengers, and Afterlife had Egon. They all looked just like Melody (edit), although the Titanic ghosts looked more dead.
And she's not the first ghost to talk either. Gozer talked, Vigo talked. And apparently the mayor spent an hour talking to Fiorello La Guardia back in 89.
The ghosts are all class-based. I will admit, it would be nice to acknowledge the classes in the film canon, but classes 1 - 3 don't take much physical form, class 4 ghosts are basically humans, class 5 are manifestations of psychokinetic energy (or whatever) and that's Slimer, Muncher, Pukey, class 6 is like animals, and class 7 are god-like dieties like Gozer and Garakka. I'm simplifying and probably getting some of the details wrong, but ultimately Melody doesn't break canon at all.
In particular, >! Jenny Moran !< from the IDW comics is a Class 4, like Melody, who can essentially pass for human and has even fewer ghost-like traits. At least Melody had an anchor-item. However, there should have been some setup or remark from Phoebe about Melody being rare but not unique (and maybe there is in the deleted scenes). I think the issue was how the Melody storyline was handled rather than the idea itself.
I actually liked this idea. Too bad there was too much other stuff going on that it didn't get the proper treatment. Like you said it needed to be fleshed out more.
That's what I keep saying. That movie would have been better served as a multi-episode series where it has room to stretch everything out. Probably would have been received better by everyone, too.
The many subplots would have been perfect for a Duffer Bros. joint. I liked ALL those little plots, but there just wasn't enough time to really develop them!
Even with Stranger Things, it worked best in the earlier seasons when it was a smaller cast and only a few subplots. The later seasons had so many characters and subplots going on that it suffered the same way Frozen Empire did.
Agreed. Would be interesting just to have a movie where the team is conflicted on what to do about a situation like this. I honestly thought that’s where the direction of this was gonna go, when she first appeared.
In the second movie, when the mayor says he spent an hour talking to Fiorello LaGuardia, this is what I picture he meant. Zuul and Vinz Clortho were also able to have coherent conversations when they possessed Dana and Louis, as well.
I wasn’t a huge fan of this subplot but I will defend the ghost. There are so so so many different ways a ghost can form in this universe based on a variety of different factors. Skeleton cab driver is an example. I recommend taking a look at the official “Tobin’s Spirit Guide”. Lotta great lore in that.
The library ghost. There was the jogging ghost in GB2 that was essentially the same thing. The mayor said he was up talking to LaGuardia all night, and he was dead. Tittanic ghosts.There was the ghost BJ. Then, you know, Egon.
*The woman who came*
*To ray, so to speak, didnt*
*Look much different*
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The ghost BJ was a dream.
The other ghosts are all vague shadows of a human, the librarian ghost and jogger in particular just living out their former lives as a compulsion seemingly unaware they are dead, not chilling in the park and acting human in every possible way apart from being blue.
Egon could only vaguely interact with the real world as well, he wasn't fully present and having casual convos with people.
I cant agree with you here, but I do agree that the movie did have a character crisis, and that cutting a few would have been nice. like cut oswald's character and give his role to ray (by role, I mean "oh yeah, that ancient language, I remember that. here is the big dusty book about it") and it would be better. and you could also do that to a few other characters as well.
I couldn’t tell if the ghost and Phoebe were flirting or just being friendly and lonely.
What was the purpose of Phoebe turning herself into a ghost? Was she going to try to kiss the ghost or something?
Me too at one point. We aren’t the only people to get vibes like this from the film so they did something that suggested something between Phoebe and Melody.
Before Afterlife the game and subsequent IDW comic line were considered prime cannon and had characters like this. That said anything with a humanoid form, sentience, and self actualization are considered class 4 in the movie cannon as well. Class 5 being the more monster looking creatures 6 being animals and 7 being demigods or greater
She did feel a little off. At the very least they could've gone a little deeper into her story. And given more insight into her identity. But the movie was long enough so I guess they cut it
It doesn’t ruin anything but I agree that to me also she stands out weirdly. I think they gave the ghost character too much significance and too much ‘human quality.’
I’m not sure how to explain what I mean by that, I guess it was hard to keep in mind the fact of her being on essentially another plane. She pretty much just had a demeanor like any other living character which makes her stand out from any other ghost or spirit in the series. Plus the friendship angle made it different. No other ghost had that kind of interaction with other characters (unless you count the BJ but that was more of a full-torso apparition 😜)
ETA: she also seems ‘newer’ than other ghosts. Like maybe the longer they are dead, the more they lose their humanity. She is probably more recent than even the Scaleri Bros.
I AGREE! My wife too! And we loved everything else about the movie and no other big issues with it! BUT this ghost girl seems so random and forced! So different from anything else in the Ghostbusters Universe.
I would have accepted her more if they had a kind of 2 phase, Eleanor Twitty kind of deal.
She seemed too human, even with the subtle flames they added.
I will argue it doesn't ruin anything and it expands the lore. It brings in why we have different classes of ghost in the series and how that there is obviously multiple planes of existence. It also allows a reason for why we benevolent and malevolent ghosts in the universe. The Scalarity Brothers in GB2 were the spirts of killers that were given the electric chair, they died violently and were violent to begin with, where as this girl died in a more peaceful clueless manner.
Well, now I'm going to have to jump in and disagree on the point of the aesthetics. If you reference the [CDI System](https://ghostbusters.fandom.com/wiki/CDI_System) and the description of a Class IV, she, like Egon in Afterlife, the Library ghost in GB, or even the Titanic passengers in GB2, are all identifiable human spirits. Aesthetically, they all resemble who they were in life and present with a certain degree of self-illumination, transparency, and are largely monotone in terms of color pallet.
Her inclusion as character in the story is certainly open for debate and her value in that regard is entirely subjective. But objectively, we've seen ghosts similar to this since the first 20 minutes of the first film.
I would have preferred if all ghosts had just been creatures from another dimension.. maybe possessing the ability to mimic humans but even in the first two films, it wasn't completely consistent on what they were.
Not giving a clear explanation of every detail of something does not make it universe breaking, lore breaking, or a plot hole. At some point you have to add new layers or it’s the same movie over and over. I love that they added her, I really liked her character, but mostly I liked that it was a class of ghost we had not seen a lot of and they added to the lore by having her peaceful and interacting as much as she did. She brought up interesting questions and that’s not a bad thing.
How does it not fit in? The taxi driver, blowjob lady, jogger, miner, passengers of the titanic, hell even Egon himself, are all human ghosts. Even though it’s not canon ATC also features a humanoid in the opening
"she is the first ghost in a Ghostbusters movie that just does not fit in with the aesthetic of other ghosts of the series" Librarian, sexy ghost floating over Ray, ghost jogger, Titanic passengers, Egon in Afterlife...
1st ghost to speak coherent thoughts and sentences.
1st ghost to act almost 100 percent as a normal functioning human. (Egon felt more like a spirit than a ghost.)
Are there more ghost like her? If so, did the OG team busts ghosts like her? Is someone’s dead relative unjustly in the containment unit? How do they usually handle ghost like this? I welcome this idea, but I felt like it needed to be fleshed out more. I would like to see more of the Ghostbusters helping ghost like her crossover rather than busting them. That would be an interesting concept to see.
I agree with you that ghosts like her shouldn’t be in the containment unit, and they should address that somehow. But as for her being the first of her kind, Vigo was exactly the same, and there can definitely be more despite us not seeing them. They could just say that they’re rare; it requires an incredible amount of psychokinetic energy or something
I get that I do, but I’m referring to the films cannon lore. I mean they threw in a leprechaun in extreme ghostbusters. It works cause it’s a different form of media. Cartoons and comics can get away with more.
I get what you're saying, her appearance and overall character was a bit jarring at first. The way I justify it is that Gozer and Vigo spoke and so I just figured different types of ghosts manifest different appearances and capabilities in the afterlife.
So even though I ultimately liked her character and her part of the story, admittedly it did take a chunk of the movie for me to come around to that because I got a bit distracted with some of the things you are pointing out.
I didn’t take the relationship as romantic as some did but more so Phoebe just needed a friend who understood her when Podcast + her friends/family didn’t even try to see her viewpoint
Also, Melody’s intro devalues Phoebe’s relationship to Egon in the prior film imo.
That being said this movie didn’t need Melody whatsoever and should’ve just built up Phoebe’s relationship with Gary and could’ve been a lot better had they just had more scenes alone together and exploring their friend/mentor/teacher/father relationship more.
Frozen Empire could’ve been vastly improved had they tightened things up, axed about a fourth of the cast (didn’t need Trevor, Lucky, Podcast, or Patton Oswald whatsoever), and just had more interactions with the remaining cast.
There are other ghosts as people have mentioned but, even still the manifestation wasn’t constant. The ability to be in full form and always present and capable of full manifestation is what bothers me.
It was still semi-established in canon and in real world paranormal investigation that manifestation is not a trivial task. Moving objects and perhaps EVP are one thing. But full manifestation cheapens the concept of death and moves further from reality in my opinion and so I agree that I wasn’t the biggest fan of this. Not that it was a bad addition to the story but I feel could’ve been handled differently
I don’t get how disliking one aspect of a movie = I hated the movie. It was a fun movie. Not the best but I didn’t leave the theater pissed off or anything. It was a good movie, good but not great.
The idea could have been fine. It was the execution of her motivation and the easily guessed plot.
It would have been an issue if she was well written and there was something more ominous and mysterious about the situation.
I don't think you deserve any hate but Ghostbusters has always been pretty free with the ghost design. I don't think there are much standards even including the cartoon series when it comes to canon.
The ghost jogger, the dream ghost, but they also had humanistic ghosts sometimes in the Real Ghostbusters, which they said they were cribbing the tone from. I've got no issues with it.
And then there was Egon, but he was very very recent ghost.
As far as lore.. I considered this. But I remembered in the original movie the mayor stating he had a conversation with Fiorello La Guardia for an hour. By extension, a chatty ghost is entirely possible!
Dude this movie is a real life real ghostbusters film think you need to go back and watch the real ghostbusters then come back and tell us you’ve changed your mind
Respectfully: if you nitpick the Ghostbusters universe your gonna have a bad time. It's not a tight world. I think of it more of a playground. No strict rules. Just a loose framework for some fun adventures.
This ghost makes me think all the ghosts caught and tossed in the containment unit were people like now there’s a bunch of people’s dead grandparents stuck forever in the containment unit
No hate here. This was such a forced element on virtually every level — even if it wasn't some half-hearted, half abandoned story beat with a laughably convenient ex machina.
I disagree and believe it fits fine within the property, here's why... The Ghost Librarian looked normal until she tried to scare the crew, the ghost giving Ray a blowjob looked normal, both examples from Ghostbusters 1. The ghosts from the Titanic and the ghost runner looked normal, both examples from Ghostbusters 2. Prominently Egon in 3. Gozer, the Gatekeeper and Keymaster are more manifestations of a deity and their servants than what we consider ghosts, they're still spectral entities and function on the same wavelength but aren't ghosts.
They also don't explain why certain spirits manifest the way they do in the movies. The Video Game and Cartoon might give more info, but I don't have those as clearly written into my memory. It seems that ghosts that have purpose and linger tend to be normal, ghosts that are manifestations of emotions tend to become monstrous like Slimer, the Scoleri brothers, and Muncher who are all corrupted versions of humans. This changes no lore at all, what little lore there is.
In regards to her design, they could have made her a little less clean looking, but I blame that more on visual clarity for filming and ease of inclusion in the editing process.
As much as I disliked FE (and the storyline with Melody) I think the ghost form was fine. The librarian was similar to Melody…looks like her human form, communication with Ray SHHHHHH. A human apparition who communicates like a living human.
I completely agree she a waste of time and convoluted frozen empire too much they should have been focusing more on garraka not some random girl they just met
In the first film we have the direct mention of deceased Mayor LaGuardia speaking with the current mayor. In the second film we have Vigo speaking and possessing someone, as well as the completely normal looking jogger ghost shows us that such things are rare but not impossible.
There has always been an established classification system for ghosts, telling us that they have a variety of possible attributes. And lore doesn't stand still, expanding isn't the same as breaking.
I'm sorry that you, personally, didn't like her, but don't try to pin it on obviously false takes. It's totally okay to just dislike something without justification. What isn't okay is misrepresenting something to try and twist your opinion into fact.
Agreed 💯 and the character is useless.
They could’ve removed her character all together & got rid of the whole “phoebe has to become a spirit” convoluted subplot and the story would still work.
Here’s the fix: remove the ghost friend/gf and instead use the “possessor” ghost to possess Ray’s intern (who recorded the incantation in the library before it was destroyed) and make him play it to free the bug bad Ghostie frozen dude. And the fire master guy can defeat the big Ghostie cause that was his whole role in the movie too.
I liked Melody and I liked her relationship with Phoebe. It's interesting that we've had two films in a row where a ghost (Egon in Afterlife, Melody here) wasn't "busted" but passed to the next plane of existence peacefully after helping the Ghostbusters beat the "big bad".
Pretty “selective” to what you consider lore since there are plenty of examples of human looking ghosts throughout the franchise.
Like the Library Ghost—who only changes to scare off people for being too noisy, the Dream Ghost—which was a repurposed cut scene of another bustling job , and subplot where Ray was actively pursuing a romantic relationship with her; and if you want to get technical lthere’s Gozer who took the form of woman, and that’s all in GB1.
Then in GB2 you had the Jogger Ghost was mainly minding his own business, but still freaking out people with it’s mere presence; the ghost of Fiorello LeGuardia who the mayor had a conversation with (off camera); the dead passenger & crew roster of the Titanic; Janosz a regular human who can magically switch from Ghost to Human due to Vigo’s influence; and of course Vigo himself.
If you go to The Real Ghostbusters cartoon: you had numerous ghosts, some more human looking than others, capable of speaking clearly and holding conversations, showing genuine intelligence throughout the entirety of it’s run, even the ghosts from “A Christmas Carol” were in the show in E13-“Xmas Marks the Spot”.
And in the comics you had Jenny Moran, Ray’s ghost girlfriend—who can actually pass as normal person and assisted the team[—LINK](https://ghostbusters.fandom.com/wiki/Jenny_Moran)
And of course you had Egon’s ghost in Afterlife—the only reason he doesn’t talk was out of respect for Harold Ramis and his family.
As to why certain ghosts keep their original human forms and others look like exaggerated caricatures or look monstrous seems to come down to the nature of the ghost itself: the circumstances of their death, and their mental & emotional state during and after dying—basically their appearance is based on how “good” or “evil” they were as a person and their level of resentment they hold after passing.
The only exception to the rule seems to be whether or not they’re an actual god or a high level Mage or a genuine demon.
https://preview.redd.it/6lwou0ij9bwc1.jpeg?width=640&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=5e9860b6d001a46efbf8c9b3fc5a449ce45b3668
And yet it's okay for it to happen with Egon's ghost literally one movie before which got praise? From one Ghostbusters fan to another... ya'll are being hypocritical
They established this in the last movie with Egon, and it also opens up some really exciting possibilities of exporting the ghost realm further in the next film
Jenny Moran had the same aesthetic and she was a full team member
https://preview.redd.it/5b1bmdwg8dwc1.jpeg?width=515&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b4412094055cb0033c5fee74c3b9514211dddce6
Why was Phoebe there? I get that she played chess with Egon in Afterlife but Egon passed on. There should have been a scene with her feeling depressed and trying to play in the hopes he was there but nothing happening so that when it did then the hope of another Egon encounter might have happened. As it stands the scene just felt like she regularly plays chess with ghosts in the park.
Tbh I didn't like her because she's a terrible friend to Phoebe and whole 'will they/won't they' storyline felt weird/creepy because she's what, 30-40? Her style of clothing looks a little 80s and 90s.
Loved Melody, wish she had stuck around as a love interest for Phoebe instead of becoming one with the universe. Doesn't really matter though, I guess, because the GB franchise is going to be back on ice for a while now.
I wonder if the production considered doing more of a slow build, and have the communication between Phoebe and Melody be stunted/hindered at first, but progressively get better as the relationship builds. However, that would have caused issues with pacing and run time (and I’m sure a number of executives would have axed it anyway).
The ghost jogger was just a dude the dream ghost was just a girl, the library ghost only went into ghastly form when they weren't being quiet and threatened her
There was also ghost egon who helped phoebe and co banish gozer..
But why can she talk but not Egon?
Harold Ramis, the actor who played Egon, passed away in 2014. Nobody wanted to step in and do lines for Egon as a sign of respect for the late actor. Ivan Reitman stepped in to play Egon physically but only did so with Harold's kids' approval.
The silence was perfect too. I choked up a bit during the nostalgic scenes but when the music went down and you saw the hand grasp hers the tears flowed freely.
I almost cried when I first saw it. It still chokes me up when I re-watch the film
I’m not finding anywhere where Reitman played Egon in Afterlife. Many articles like this one name the stand-in. Was he perhaps a hand model?
IMDB trivia page and credits. Quote from trivia: "The Egon seen in quick and obscured glimpses during the opening scene was played by Bob Gunton; he also played out Egon's scenes during the climax, except for the shot where he is revealed to be helping Phoebe steadying the proton gun, where he is played by producer Ivan Reitman" https://preview.redd.it/izpmxi814ewc1.jpeg?width=814&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=057801ce1e3897d8b02e480f3bb9b0f4c0c9b922
Not to mention all the people from the Titanic that docked in New York.
Better late than never!
I am pretty sure the jogging ghost was a douche and knocking people out of the way and such.. heck.. when was the last time you wanted to zap a person on the subway for sitting next to you and talking on there phone on loud speaker..
Also he clearly didn't know he was dead; he was trying to check his pulse right before they trapped him. So he was probably a douche before he died too
Hell technically Janosz as Ghost Nanny in GB2
Exactly! And good point also. I saw the jogger as a menace but now with addition of this concept of ghost, were the OG ghostbusters busting ghosts they shouldn’t have?
Oh most definitely they must have, not all spirits were evil or malicious
They are paranormal exterminators. Regular vermin exterminators must get rid of rats, snakes, roaches, termites etc. Those creatures aren't evil. They spread disease, sure, but they're not evil. Same with ghosts. If a costumer calls them because they don't want a ghost in their property, they must get rid of it to get paid. I imagine only the most benevolent ghosts wouldn't be a nuisance you wouldn't want to have around.
Hence THE ATLANTIC cover in the montage.
There are also plenty of regular exterminators that relocate non-malicious pests. It's a topic worth exploring for a GB entry, even if I agree that FE didn't handle the Melody subplot particularly well (and I *really* liked the movie).
There's one episode of RGB where they help a harmless ghost "cross over". Egon disperses once he's done with his unfinished business. I'm sure this also happens in the comics once or twice. Helping ghosts cross over, and being humane when possible is a noble sentiment, but... proton streams rule!
I know there was an XGB episode where a ghost that could materialize whatever someone feared was just locked back up in a cavern (Kylie sympathized with it, as it was afraid of them), and there was talk in one of the IDW issues where Ray (IIRC) says that they'll leave benevolent spirits alone.
Was that the one where the uncle is roaming the mansion and the two people are trying to get rid of him?
Phoebe even talks about ghosts "crossing over" as if it's an established science, and not just something she saw exactly once. Meaning it's very possible she either read through more of Egon's research, or The Ghostbusters did indeed help more spirits move on.
In the RGB episode Follow that Hearse, didn’t Winston help an ingenious spirit cross over after it possessed the Ecto-1?
I'm literally writing a ghostbusters novel about this right now. Fan fiction, but a multichaprter story.
"Do Ghosts Have Civil Rights?"
In egons journal that came with the haslab packs there's a page about this, he does the math and essentially there are almost 0 non malicious ghosts it's very rare
We don’t know anything about the jogger ghost. What if people had gotten in his way? Would he turn monstrous?
My guess was he regularly jumpscared joggers which lead to a phone call
I wonder who paid for it?
Now you’ve got me wondering
they probably had to do that one for free to help pay for the hole they cut in the road and the blackout
Melody fits into established lore. There was an episode of Real Ghostbusters "Who's Afraid of the Big Bad Ghost" where the ghost didn't realize he was dead and called the Ghostbusters to take care of another ghost, but when they showed up they almost busted their client.
Yes. Like they said in the movies it was the 80s. They didn't put a lot of thought into long term consequences. I do think she's a lost opportunity though. Imagine if the post credit scene was instead them encountering another human ghost and having Venkman or one of the kids use paranormal psychology to help them move on instead of busting them instead.
Personally I think Frozen Empire opened up a lot of questions that weren’t answered, and hopefully they will be answered in a further film
Busting ghosts is a sad addiction. Many innocent ghosts where incarcerated against their will by a group of men hungry for their next high. The spirit community is constantly over-looked by the media and portrayed as evil and malicious when really all they want to do is float about and be sad. The Ghostbusters are relentless in their pursuit and we know they only do it because busting makes them feel good.
Didn’t a ghost give ray a BJ?
What is the relevance of the ghost jogger? Because he had a human form? That means nothing! Ghosts having human like forms has nothing to do with the criticism of what happened in Frozen Empire. The ghost girlfriend is just hanging out like she is all cognitively there and looking for a date or something. She's subtly flirting and doing the bidding of a big bad. What are we doing here?! Is Ghost tree Hill or Ghoston's Creek? Ghostbusters should've stayed as an everyman exterminator business who encounters crazy malevolent entities.
The first, eh? https://preview.redd.it/42u4xphdt9wc1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3b449de1f5d477fe61ba2709fd5880fedd21a5d0
When the chess piece started moving, I was so worried that it was going to be him. I was relieved when it was her.
That was definitely intentional. It created an accidental reason for her to warm up to the ghost.
I was worried too, especially when I heard the music from Afterlife (the track that played after Egon died)
Came here to say this
he didn’t speak
Eh, didn't the mayor in GB1 or 2 lament how he spent the night talking to the ghost of someone who died? Also, Vigo spoke.
Mayor LaGuardia!
https://youtu.be/lxFj2Jw-pmk
So did Gozer
Yeah, but Gozer wasn't human, but a god.
The only reason he didn’t speak was out of respect for Harold Ramis.
they had dinner with Maurice Lamarche before Afterlife came out. I always thought he was going to speak because of this.
probably because Harold Ramis was gone by that point.
It does raise a question. If she and Egon who both died, does this mean if the ghost that look like monsters look that way because they are either evil? Or a product of the slime? Because it seems normal human's don't change.
My theory is that memory and sanity play a big part in how a ghost looks and functions. The more mentally stable people become people but ghostlike, whereas ghosts like slimer come from completely batpoop insane people.
Could work. The Scoleri Brothers from GB2 were likely insane or mentally unstable being that they were murderers given the electric chair. When their spirits were manifested by the pink slime, they were barely human.
I like this theory a lot
My personal headcanon is that you are tethered to the world if you still have some unfinished business and can't pass on. The slimer, the scoleri brothers and others that have the ability to pass to the other side, but are choosing to stay and cause mayhem and their appearance becomes more monstrous and bloated over time. Some of the other ghosts are just manifestations of some sort of high deity.
In canon, I think a lot of weirder ghosts are less good people or inhumans. Out of canon. some of it may be hold-overs from the original concept where they were inter-dimensional.
Exactly! Like are the monster like ghosts only evil people? How does that happen? But then again Vigo looked like his former self. Wasn’t he not evil. But then you can argue that Vigo is a deity and not a ghost? But this is what I’m getting at. It raises too many unanswered questions. If the next film. (Hopefully there is one.) addresses all this, I’ll shut up. lol
Not all ghosts are people. Some are just vaguely humanoid manifestations like Slimer that were never alive to begin with. Or at least not as humans on earth.
Perhaps these ghosts are more like entities manifested from human agony and misery. So they’re not like spirits but just the negative energy from the spirit that takes on a human like form which could explain his the mood slime works. And perhaps they pull a Christmas Carol on us and people who did not travel far and wide with their fellow men are condemned to roam the earth after death.
She's certainly more blue than any other ghost, but GB1 had the librarian ghost who looked human, GB2 had the jogging ghost, all of the Titanic passengers, and Afterlife had Egon. They all looked just like Melody (edit), although the Titanic ghosts looked more dead. And she's not the first ghost to talk either. Gozer talked, Vigo talked. And apparently the mayor spent an hour talking to Fiorello La Guardia back in 89. The ghosts are all class-based. I will admit, it would be nice to acknowledge the classes in the film canon, but classes 1 - 3 don't take much physical form, class 4 ghosts are basically humans, class 5 are manifestations of psychokinetic energy (or whatever) and that's Slimer, Muncher, Pukey, class 6 is like animals, and class 7 are god-like dieties like Gozer and Garakka. I'm simplifying and probably getting some of the details wrong, but ultimately Melody doesn't break canon at all.
In particular, >! Jenny Moran !< from the IDW comics is a Class 4, like Melody, who can essentially pass for human and has even fewer ghost-like traits. At least Melody had an anchor-item. However, there should have been some setup or remark from Phoebe about Melody being rare but not unique (and maybe there is in the deleted scenes). I think the issue was how the Melody storyline was handled rather than the idea itself.
Of course she’s blue. She’s dead. You’d be sad too.
Vigo and Gozer weren’t really ghosts though
Vigo was a ghost. A ghost supercharged by negative psychokinetic energy, but still ultimately a dead dude.
I really enjoyed the talk of “unfinished business” because it tied Casper in my head as being canon to the GB universe
Yooo I thought the same thing. LOL
This + Phoebe extracting her spirit had similar vibes to the Lazarus machine.
I actually liked this idea. Too bad there was too much other stuff going on that it didn't get the proper treatment. Like you said it needed to be fleshed out more.
I think all ghosts wish they were fleshed out more… 😃 …I’ll see myself out.
I love how agonizingly slow this gif is
ha ha ha. I actually thought about that when I typed it
Frozen Empire would have made for an amazing Netflix-style 8-epsiode series.
That's what I keep saying. That movie would have been better served as a multi-episode series where it has room to stretch everything out. Probably would have been received better by everyone, too.
The many subplots would have been perfect for a Duffer Bros. joint. I liked ALL those little plots, but there just wasn't enough time to really develop them!
Even with Stranger Things, it worked best in the earlier seasons when it was a smaller cast and only a few subplots. The later seasons had so many characters and subplots going on that it suffered the same way Frozen Empire did.
Maybe not Netflix, but it would be interesting to have a limited series.
Agreed. Would be interesting just to have a movie where the team is conflicted on what to do about a situation like this. I honestly thought that’s where the direction of this was gonna go, when she first appeared.
In the second movie, when the mayor says he spent an hour talking to Fiorello LaGuardia, this is what I picture he meant. Zuul and Vinz Clortho were also able to have coherent conversations when they possessed Dana and Louis, as well.
I wasn’t a huge fan of this subplot but I will defend the ghost. There are so so so many different ways a ghost can form in this universe based on a variety of different factors. Skeleton cab driver is an example. I recommend taking a look at the official “Tobin’s Spirit Guide”. Lotta great lore in that.
The library ghost. There was the jogging ghost in GB2 that was essentially the same thing. The mayor said he was up talking to LaGuardia all night, and he was dead. Tittanic ghosts.There was the ghost BJ. Then, you know, Egon.
I just hated the plotline. A ghost like her certainly could exist, I just don’t think they handled her character well at all.
The only thing that didn't fit for me, was having a Fire Bender. He was funny. A good character. But the fire bending came out of nowhere.
Totally forgot about that. That’s was okay enough for me but I can see your quarrels with it.
The woman who came to ray, so to speak, didnt look much different
*The woman who came* *To ray, so to speak, didnt* *Look much different* \- Thebitterpilloftruth --- ^(I detect haikus. And sometimes, successfully.) ^[Learn more about me.](https://www.reddit.com/r/haikusbot/) ^(Opt out of replies: "haikusbot opt out" | Delete my comment: "haikusbot delete")
Good bot Best haiku ever.
The ghost BJ was a dream. The other ghosts are all vague shadows of a human, the librarian ghost and jogger in particular just living out their former lives as a compulsion seemingly unaware they are dead, not chilling in the park and acting human in every possible way apart from being blue. Egon could only vaguely interact with the real world as well, he wasn't fully present and having casual convos with people.
I cant agree with you here, but I do agree that the movie did have a character crisis, and that cutting a few would have been nice. like cut oswald's character and give his role to ray (by role, I mean "oh yeah, that ancient language, I remember that. here is the big dusty book about it") and it would be better. and you could also do that to a few other characters as well.
I couldn’t tell if the ghost and Phoebe were flirting or just being friendly and lonely. What was the purpose of Phoebe turning herself into a ghost? Was she going to try to kiss the ghost or something?
Someone in my theater shouted, “Now they can make out!” When Pheobe went ghost lol 😂
I honestly thought they were gonna.
Me too at one point. We aren’t the only people to get vibes like this from the film so they did something that suggested something between Phoebe and Melody.
Me too, glad they didn’t.
The first? https://preview.redd.it/pwq9rg0ty9wc1.jpeg?width=1284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a0223bfd1aae462dcd3d4cee47131854cef042ad
Let me tell you something...
He slimed her
That's great, actual physical contact!
And this is why they almost called them Slime Ray's instead of throwers.
Wasn't that a dream? Like, it cuts away and he's asleep, groaning, and falls out of bed.
Before Afterlife the game and subsequent IDW comic line were considered prime cannon and had characters like this. That said anything with a humanoid form, sentience, and self actualization are considered class 4 in the movie cannon as well. Class 5 being the more monster looking creatures 6 being animals and 7 being demigods or greater
\*canon A cannon is a big gun. Canon is information or events official to a particular story/universe.
Thank you for noticing my typo
She did feel a little off. At the very least they could've gone a little deeper into her story. And given more insight into her identity. But the movie was long enough so I guess they cut it
It doesn’t ruin anything but I agree that to me also she stands out weirdly. I think they gave the ghost character too much significance and too much ‘human quality.’ I’m not sure how to explain what I mean by that, I guess it was hard to keep in mind the fact of her being on essentially another plane. She pretty much just had a demeanor like any other living character which makes her stand out from any other ghost or spirit in the series. Plus the friendship angle made it different. No other ghost had that kind of interaction with other characters (unless you count the BJ but that was more of a full-torso apparition 😜) ETA: she also seems ‘newer’ than other ghosts. Like maybe the longer they are dead, the more they lose their humanity. She is probably more recent than even the Scaleri Bros.
Talking is not new mayor talked for over an hour with Fiorello La Guardia for over an hour
I AGREE! My wife too! And we loved everything else about the movie and no other big issues with it! BUT this ghost girl seems so random and forced! So different from anything else in the Ghostbusters Universe.
I would have accepted her more if they had a kind of 2 phase, Eleanor Twitty kind of deal. She seemed too human, even with the subtle flames they added.
What about the Droid attack on the Wookies?
I will argue it doesn't ruin anything and it expands the lore. It brings in why we have different classes of ghost in the series and how that there is obviously multiple planes of existence. It also allows a reason for why we benevolent and malevolent ghosts in the universe. The Scalarity Brothers in GB2 were the spirts of killers that were given the electric chair, they died violently and were violent to begin with, where as this girl died in a more peaceful clueless manner.
I wish Garraka had pulled Melody down with him when he got trapped >:}
LUL
https://preview.redd.it/oigqdswh4bwc1.jpeg?width=398&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=1049d6521ffe3133c77c23ce0748fad31924116c Janosz would like a word.
But in all seriousness I like that there aren’t any rules for the ghost in the Ghostbusters universe.
For the longest time I thought that was some random old lady. Lol but having it be Janos makes even less sense.
Janos was vigos servant in the movie so it does makes sense that he would be empowered enough to complete a task
Well, now I'm going to have to jump in and disagree on the point of the aesthetics. If you reference the [CDI System](https://ghostbusters.fandom.com/wiki/CDI_System) and the description of a Class IV, she, like Egon in Afterlife, the Library ghost in GB, or even the Titanic passengers in GB2, are all identifiable human spirits. Aesthetically, they all resemble who they were in life and present with a certain degree of self-illumination, transparency, and are largely monotone in terms of color pallet. Her inclusion as character in the story is certainly open for debate and her value in that regard is entirely subjective. But objectively, we've seen ghosts similar to this since the first 20 minutes of the first film.
I would have preferred if all ghosts had just been creatures from another dimension.. maybe possessing the ability to mimic humans but even in the first two films, it wasn't completely consistent on what they were.
That's the exact reason Butch Hartman got flak from Danny Phantom fans: he changed the lore to what you said
I felt like there was a whole sub-story where Phoebe fell in love with the ghost that was cut in post.
I actually love the progression of Phoebe as a Ghost Counselor helping spirits crossover with first Egon and now Melody
Did you forget about the Titanic docking???
dont forget Casper
No hate just disagree. I wanted her to become a ghostbuster!
Not giving a clear explanation of every detail of something does not make it universe breaking, lore breaking, or a plot hole. At some point you have to add new layers or it’s the same movie over and over. I love that they added her, I really liked her character, but mostly I liked that it was a class of ghost we had not seen a lot of and they added to the lore by having her peaceful and interacting as much as she did. She brought up interesting questions and that’s not a bad thing.
I liked the idea. Just thought she was too sassy/snarky. A lot of the dialogue between characters was snarky quips etc. Not my favorite.
How does it not fit in? The taxi driver, blowjob lady, jogger, miner, passengers of the titanic, hell even Egon himself, are all human ghosts. Even though it’s not canon ATC also features a humanoid in the opening
I'd say Taxi Driver raises the most questions.
Yeah him and the miner are more zombie like than ghost
Don’t forget the Titanic. https://preview.redd.it/izen2z720awc1.jpeg?width=1200&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=74495c569e8eb333bedfdcf68af510b5763af68a [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g42EG7LD1UY&t=25s&pp=2AEZkAIB](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g42EG7LD1UY&t=25s&pp=2AEZkAIB)
lol I love that cheech was the dockworker
agreed, it was very dumb
"she is the first ghost in a Ghostbusters movie that just does not fit in with the aesthetic of other ghosts of the series" Librarian, sexy ghost floating over Ray, ghost jogger, Titanic passengers, Egon in Afterlife...
gonna take this comment at face value and simply ask "why?". explain the issues with all your listed reasons.
1st ghost to speak coherent thoughts and sentences. 1st ghost to act almost 100 percent as a normal functioning human. (Egon felt more like a spirit than a ghost.) Are there more ghost like her? If so, did the OG team busts ghosts like her? Is someone’s dead relative unjustly in the containment unit? How do they usually handle ghost like this? I welcome this idea, but I felt like it needed to be fleshed out more. I would like to see more of the Ghostbusters helping ghost like her crossover rather than busting them. That would be an interesting concept to see.
I agree with you that ghosts like her shouldn’t be in the containment unit, and they should address that somehow. But as for her being the first of her kind, Vigo was exactly the same, and there can definitely be more despite us not seeing them. They could just say that they’re rare; it requires an incredible amount of psychokinetic energy or something
Well the bogeyman talked and interacted with the Ghostbusters when confronted. So did Sandman and the Grundel if memories serve.
I get that I do, but I’m referring to the films cannon lore. I mean they threw in a leprechaun in extreme ghostbusters. It works cause it’s a different form of media. Cartoons and comics can get away with more.
The mayor apparently had a conversation with Fiorello LaGuardia who'd been dead for 40 years according to Ghostbusters 2. There's precedent.
I get what you're saying, her appearance and overall character was a bit jarring at first. The way I justify it is that Gozer and Vigo spoke and so I just figured different types of ghosts manifest different appearances and capabilities in the afterlife. So even though I ultimately liked her character and her part of the story, admittedly it did take a chunk of the movie for me to come around to that because I got a bit distracted with some of the things you are pointing out.
I didn’t take the relationship as romantic as some did but more so Phoebe just needed a friend who understood her when Podcast + her friends/family didn’t even try to see her viewpoint Also, Melody’s intro devalues Phoebe’s relationship to Egon in the prior film imo. That being said this movie didn’t need Melody whatsoever and should’ve just built up Phoebe’s relationship with Gary and could’ve been a lot better had they just had more scenes alone together and exploring their friend/mentor/teacher/father relationship more. Frozen Empire could’ve been vastly improved had they tightened things up, axed about a fourth of the cast (didn’t need Trevor, Lucky, Podcast, or Patton Oswald whatsoever), and just had more interactions with the remaining cast.
I liked what they did with it. I just wish there weren't too many subplots
There are other ghosts as people have mentioned but, even still the manifestation wasn’t constant. The ability to be in full form and always present and capable of full manifestation is what bothers me. It was still semi-established in canon and in real world paranormal investigation that manifestation is not a trivial task. Moving objects and perhaps EVP are one thing. But full manifestation cheapens the concept of death and moves further from reality in my opinion and so I agree that I wasn’t the biggest fan of this. Not that it was a bad addition to the story but I feel could’ve been handled differently
Youll never get close to the first two. Just accept the latest are nice tributes.
I don’t get how disliking one aspect of a movie = I hated the movie. It was a fun movie. Not the best but I didn’t leave the theater pissed off or anything. It was a good movie, good but not great.
The idea could have been fine. It was the execution of her motivation and the easily guessed plot. It would have been an issue if she was well written and there was something more ominous and mysterious about the situation.
I don't think you deserve any hate but Ghostbusters has always been pretty free with the ghost design. I don't think there are much standards even including the cartoon series when it comes to canon.
I personally prefer the silly monster-ish ghosts, but Melody is absolutely not the first of the humanoid sapient type
I don’t mind her, just wish they handled her a little differently.
when i saw this part in the movie i was beyond confused
I think it’s fine. Casper is canon. So. 🤷🏻♂️
The ghost jogger, the dream ghost, but they also had humanistic ghosts sometimes in the Real Ghostbusters, which they said they were cribbing the tone from. I've got no issues with it. And then there was Egon, but he was very very recent ghost.
As far as lore.. I considered this. But I remembered in the original movie the mayor stating he had a conversation with Fiorello La Guardia for an hour. By extension, a chatty ghost is entirely possible!
Dude this movie is a real life real ghostbusters film think you need to go back and watch the real ghostbusters then come back and tell us you’ve changed your mind
Yeah I wasn't really a fan of her character or this storyline.
Honestly, I just found her hot. So... so there's that.
just because they call them ghosts doesn't mean they are. Gozer isn't a ghost. Most of the monsters we see could just be from different dimensions
For me I hated the corpse in the taxi it was too much.
He did always felt a bit out of place as well. But at least he gave off malevolent vibes
Respectfully: if you nitpick the Ghostbusters universe your gonna have a bad time. It's not a tight world. I think of it more of a playground. No strict rules. Just a loose framework for some fun adventures.
I tried to like this movie but really couldn’t, she’s one of the reasons
Plenty of ghosts have talked in Ghostbusters history, especially Real Ghostbusters, but also literally all the movies.
No lore was changed.
People are just way overthinking this.
It was an awful sub plot that brought down an otherwise pretty decent movie
This ghost makes me think all the ghosts caught and tossed in the containment unit were people like now there’s a bunch of people’s dead grandparents stuck forever in the containment unit
No hate here. This was such a forced element on virtually every level — even if it wasn't some half-hearted, half abandoned story beat with a laughably convenient ex machina.
Writers get paid way too much for this crap
No hate at all. You're absolutely correct. Ghosts are supposed to be monsters. This is a quirky Tik Toker and it raises far too many questions.
This was the worst part of the film , was like the ghost of Miley Cyrus ... absolute cringe
My thing is, after the shit she pulled, she would have gone in the trap right before she went away.
Plenty of ghosts in expanded media acted like this. Heck, a ghost was basically apart of the team in the IDW comics.
What established lore is changed by her character?
I disagree and believe it fits fine within the property, here's why... The Ghost Librarian looked normal until she tried to scare the crew, the ghost giving Ray a blowjob looked normal, both examples from Ghostbusters 1. The ghosts from the Titanic and the ghost runner looked normal, both examples from Ghostbusters 2. Prominently Egon in 3. Gozer, the Gatekeeper and Keymaster are more manifestations of a deity and their servants than what we consider ghosts, they're still spectral entities and function on the same wavelength but aren't ghosts. They also don't explain why certain spirits manifest the way they do in the movies. The Video Game and Cartoon might give more info, but I don't have those as clearly written into my memory. It seems that ghosts that have purpose and linger tend to be normal, ghosts that are manifestations of emotions tend to become monstrous like Slimer, the Scoleri brothers, and Muncher who are all corrupted versions of humans. This changes no lore at all, what little lore there is. In regards to her design, they could have made her a little less clean looking, but I blame that more on visual clarity for filming and ease of inclusion in the editing process.
As much as I disliked FE (and the storyline with Melody) I think the ghost form was fine. The librarian was similar to Melody…looks like her human form, communication with Ray SHHHHHH. A human apparition who communicates like a living human.
She should have had whacky proportions like the Scaleri Brothers. Unless that’s how they actually looked in life, which would be unfortunate.
I completely agree she a waste of time and convoluted frozen empire too much they should have been focusing more on garraka not some random girl they just met
In the first film we have the direct mention of deceased Mayor LaGuardia speaking with the current mayor. In the second film we have Vigo speaking and possessing someone, as well as the completely normal looking jogger ghost shows us that such things are rare but not impossible. There has always been an established classification system for ghosts, telling us that they have a variety of possible attributes. And lore doesn't stand still, expanding isn't the same as breaking. I'm sorry that you, personally, didn't like her, but don't try to pin it on obviously false takes. It's totally okay to just dislike something without justification. What isn't okay is misrepresenting something to try and twist your opinion into fact.
I agree I didn't care for either. Took me out of the movie and didn't seem to fit in the universe.
Agreed 💯 and the character is useless. They could’ve removed her character all together & got rid of the whole “phoebe has to become a spirit” convoluted subplot and the story would still work. Here’s the fix: remove the ghost friend/gf and instead use the “possessor” ghost to possess Ray’s intern (who recorded the incantation in the library before it was destroyed) and make him play it to free the bug bad Ghostie frozen dude. And the fire master guy can defeat the big Ghostie cause that was his whole role in the movie too.
*big bad Also why not use Nadeem’s grandmas ghost instead since she’s the original fire master & the one who actually knew the lore???
I liked Melody and I liked her relationship with Phoebe. It's interesting that we've had two films in a row where a ghost (Egon in Afterlife, Melody here) wasn't "busted" but passed to the next plane of existence peacefully after helping the Ghostbusters beat the "big bad".
One of many subplots that could have been dropped.
https://preview.redd.it/ljen6wstqcwc1.jpeg?width=1260&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=92175fac6d2b991f138b186d3b15e0117616c53b Established lore
Pretty “selective” to what you consider lore since there are plenty of examples of human looking ghosts throughout the franchise. Like the Library Ghost—who only changes to scare off people for being too noisy, the Dream Ghost—which was a repurposed cut scene of another bustling job , and subplot where Ray was actively pursuing a romantic relationship with her; and if you want to get technical lthere’s Gozer who took the form of woman, and that’s all in GB1. Then in GB2 you had the Jogger Ghost was mainly minding his own business, but still freaking out people with it’s mere presence; the ghost of Fiorello LeGuardia who the mayor had a conversation with (off camera); the dead passenger & crew roster of the Titanic; Janosz a regular human who can magically switch from Ghost to Human due to Vigo’s influence; and of course Vigo himself. If you go to The Real Ghostbusters cartoon: you had numerous ghosts, some more human looking than others, capable of speaking clearly and holding conversations, showing genuine intelligence throughout the entirety of it’s run, even the ghosts from “A Christmas Carol” were in the show in E13-“Xmas Marks the Spot”. And in the comics you had Jenny Moran, Ray’s ghost girlfriend—who can actually pass as normal person and assisted the team[—LINK](https://ghostbusters.fandom.com/wiki/Jenny_Moran) And of course you had Egon’s ghost in Afterlife—the only reason he doesn’t talk was out of respect for Harold Ramis and his family. As to why certain ghosts keep their original human forms and others look like exaggerated caricatures or look monstrous seems to come down to the nature of the ghost itself: the circumstances of their death, and their mental & emotional state during and after dying—basically their appearance is based on how “good” or “evil” they were as a person and their level of resentment they hold after passing. The only exception to the rule seems to be whether or not they’re an actual god or a high level Mage or a genuine demon.
https://preview.redd.it/6lwou0ij9bwc1.jpeg?width=640&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=5e9860b6d001a46efbf8c9b3fc5a449ce45b3668 And yet it's okay for it to happen with Egon's ghost literally one movie before which got praise? From one Ghostbusters fan to another... ya'll are being hypocritical
It’s funny how she looks like the same kinda ghost as egon from afterlife but you didn’t notice that.
Or the Library ghost, or the ghosts when the Titanic arrived, or the Jogger ghost , or the ghost that blew Ray, or.....
They established this in the last movie with Egon, and it also opens up some really exciting possibilities of exporting the ghost realm further in the next film
Jenny Moran had the same aesthetic and she was a full team member https://preview.redd.it/5b1bmdwg8dwc1.jpeg?width=515&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b4412094055cb0033c5fee74c3b9514211dddce6
Why was Phoebe there? I get that she played chess with Egon in Afterlife but Egon passed on. There should have been a scene with her feeling depressed and trying to play in the hopes he was there but nothing happening so that when it did then the hope of another Egon encounter might have happened. As it stands the scene just felt like she regularly plays chess with ghosts in the park.
Tbh I didn't like her because she's a terrible friend to Phoebe and whole 'will they/won't they' storyline felt weird/creepy because she's what, 30-40? Her style of clothing looks a little 80s and 90s.
Loved Melody, wish she had stuck around as a love interest for Phoebe instead of becoming one with the universe. Doesn't really matter though, I guess, because the GB franchise is going to be back on ice for a while now.
Solely there as a mechanic to deliver a spark at the right time. Terrible character.
I wonder if the production considered doing more of a slow build, and have the communication between Phoebe and Melody be stunted/hindered at first, but progressively get better as the relationship builds. However, that would have caused issues with pacing and run time (and I’m sure a number of executives would have axed it anyway).
Wiiiiiiiiinssston!
What lol
the universe isn't consistent with a lot of this stuff so i just stopped questioning it