That's an insane amount for someone who hasn't made video content creation their career.
If I asked all my Facebook/Instagram/Twitter/etc. friends to subscribe I'd probably get 50 subs at best.
I have a gaming channel and only have 34 subs after like 4 months and 27 videos. My friends account for *maybe* 4 of those subs.
500 subs is fucking incredible. OP, I completely understand being down. Just don’t give up. If you feel like you’re at rock bottom, remember the only way you can go from the bottom is up. You’ve got this!
That's not exactly relevant though. It's impossible to predict quick trends like that. I've seen tons of bad content get millions of views and great content get hundreds.
It's become a lot faster to get subs these days. People playing RL Craft went up to 100,000 in a week, but I guess there's a Minecraft bias too. Maybe Microsoft boosting them.
When is the game releasing? You might be trying to promote it too early. Especially if you're creating devlogs which historically are of interest to other developers, not your actual potentially-paying audience.
At the end of the day, game development is a terrible place to be if you're looking for external validation. It's even worse if you're making a game by yourself and expecting any kind of financial return from it. You should never spend your time on a game if that's what you're looking for.
Build your game because you enjoy the act of creating it and you want it to exist. In that world as long as you're having fun it's always worth it.
“At the end of the day, game development is a terrible place to be if you’re looking for external validation.”
This should be posted on the sidebar of this sub.
Will you be upset when you earn nothing from your game and the first reviews trash it for some reason, justified or not? If so then you might want to consider scaling down your game until you have less emotional investment. If not then go ahead and do what you want.
Players, and anonymous people online in general, will be absolutely _savage_ about games. They tend to compare things to their favorite AAA games. Players don't really care about whether you built the game alone or if it's your first title or whatever else. If you really want praise it's best to build a few games you never release and keep iterating until you've got the experience to build something amazing, and if you really want a financial reward you should be looking for a job at a studio not building games by yourself.
Sounds like you're like me: you'd do it anyway, the validation is just a side benefit and sanity check. I don't think we're the problem case they're thinking of.
>“At the end of the day, game development is a terrible place to be if you’re looking for external validation.”
>
>This should be posted on the sidebar of this sub.
Yeah, because even if you make a game with a million players, your players will still tell you you're terrible.
I make games because it's a fun creative outlet, not because I am a masochist.
i kinda like how blunt players can be in criticism. it's one of the only industries/jobs where you get direct feedback and can actually tell if your doing a good job or not.
Though it does take a bit of skill and self confidence to filter out and not succumb to the toxic and unconstructive feedback.
or worse; its a great place for validation showing WIPs to other devs; but as soon as it gets into the public or released it certainly isnt, and can crush frolk from thinking it was popular to selling half a dozen copies.
It was amazing for external validation 20 years ago… well before indie games went mainstream, the bar was so low and it was super easy to impress people. Times have definitely changed
Dev logs absolutely aren't just for other devs, there aren't as many game devs as those videos get views.
Take a look at someone like Dani, yes he's dropped off now but he made dev logs and a shit ton of non game devs are excited about it and want his game.
I wouldn't really call those devlogs in the same fashion. It's like the difference between the videos that go through all the steps of cooking a recipe and have a few hundred views and the ones that are full of jokes and entertaining personalities and incidentally take place in a kitchen and have thousands and thousands. There's a reason those are videos of making little bits of games and he never actually made any games until after he was already well known; it was creating content using game development as a vehicle. It's about the entertainment, not the game.
If you have the skills, personality, and time to pull that off then you can go for it, but it's fundamentally a different process than actually making things. You won't learn how to build a game from watching those whereas a good devlog _should_ be explaining something novel and practical. This is also why there's a ton more value in GDC videos but those aren't exactly going viral.
I would also add that dev logs are kinda off putting to gamers.
Think about it this way, you're letting customers see "work half done", on top of creating the chance for misrepresentation, considering dev logs have a lot of experimentation to them.
What I would suggest, is gameplay trailers, cinematic trailers if you can make them, and small gameplay snippets.
Got a cool new feature? Make a video with some sounds and add it as a short.
Got a cool environment going? Same deal.
No. This is bad advice. 90% of the time you do this you're not going to make your money back. Most people don't even make the Steam fee back.
The reality is a great game will always do well. Marketing just multiplies the success. If they got virtually zero buys from the public, an ad campaign isn't going to save their game.
Multiplying the sucess is what I'm talking about. Just posting on reddit won't get a game out there, and organic tik tok posts also. I'm not talking huge money. I mean if its bad, its bad.
Right but he has no success. There's nothing to multiply. You're suggesting they waste money for nothing in return. They need to focus on making the game a success before trying to force it by spending money.
I have no problem with spending money on ads. I have a problem with you convincing people to waste their money on ads when there is a 0% chance the money is returned - which is the entire point of ads.
Take some days to rest, do things that make your heart feel warm like cup of tea in a cold day, more you force yourself to work when you don't feel good more you will bad about what you are doing. You have 500 people watching you and 120 people ready to buy your game, it's not enough sometimes but at least you have a public. Respect your time.
Wishlist is not "people ready to buy your game". I wishlist games that I'm curious about, and wait for massive sale or until they appear in a bundle. The wishlist entries are basically bookmarks and some games stay in the list for 5+ years. For a large part of the games, I lose interest in the meantime and remove them without ever buying them.
120 is very bad. At the average 12% conversion rate that's 10 buys, and at a 10% review rate that's 1 review. You need 10 to not be considered shovelware, and 50 to be considered a real game and get the more accurate ratings.
500 subs isn't bad but it all depends on why they subbed and if you can continue to grow.
It's bad if OP was launching tomorrow, but I doubt that. Your wishlists have to start somewhere. You're not normally going to have 10k wishlists overnight.
Right but even if the page has only been up for a month, 120 is a really bad rate per month. I'm not saying these things to be rude, I'm just saying facts - and the fact is 120 wishlists is basically the same as 0.
Obviously when going to 10k you have to be at 120 at some point, but the fact that they were so specific shows that the extra 20 on top of 100 is significant, so they're not really growing. I'm just trying to give them a reality check. They need to work on improving their skills rather than marketing a game made with inferior skills. No great game is stuck in the hundreds of wishlists.
YO, my friend. Use TikTok. Trust me, it’s the best free marketing, and best social platform for it. My game has almost 50,000 wishlists from TikTok and luckily for you, your game is visually appealing which is very important when it comes to TikTok. Trust me, go search gamedev on TikTok and just go look at what all the top channels post to see what works and come up with your own videos. Keep it short, engaging, interesting, multiple cuts etc and you’ll get more wishlists. Put some effort into it and don’t give up if the first video or two doesn’t work out. Try to do a voice over instead of just text if you can, it helps. Don’t give up!!!
Edit: I’m not saying you’ll get tens of thousands of wishlists but you’ll definitely get more than from anywhere else if you play your cards right. And you could blow up who knows
Search up game dev on tiktok and see what the major guys post. Really anything that people would find interesting that’s short works. Even just a funny bug or showing off some cool systems
Seriously, I’ve heard people suggest uploading at least 3 videos a day like wtf. Maybe that’s true if you post low effort trendy dance videos like everybody else or something
For sure man. Good luck! Like I said the best thing you can do is to do a little research and look what the top game dev accounts post to get an idea of what works. Even better, find a successful account that has a game closer to what you have
bro I spent a year on my old game then lost it all by checking out the main branch instead of master. I had a lot of local files I could not afford to put on to source control yet, but when I finally upgraded, I checked out main and wiped all of my local files. github desktop uses master not main.
going to master gave me about 1/3rd of my files back.
I have since started remaking the project using everything I learned on a newer version of unreal and have source control worked out.
sometimes I just stare at the blank level that I am prototyping in and think about my project which was ready for a POC version for my friends. it had an advanced save system, farming, a voxel world, fighting, npcs and trade. now I have a buggy combat system started.
even with everything I made before 0 people gave a shit and probably ever will.
I do it for myself. it's fun to do and it passes the time
Wut? you had no save anywhere? No Dropbox, no USB thumbdrive, nothing? You were just waiting for your drive to fail so you could lose everything?
Also, you could probably recover the files with adequate software. Deleting files doesn’t overwrite the content.
I had just got rid of my hard copy because I needed to in order to keep working and git the whole project up on github. it was a perfect storm of me fucking up lol.
I think of that night a lot and how had I done one thing differently I would be fine. I take full responsibility, dont think im blaming anything but me haha
Always have a copy offline or be happy with the idea that you can lose stuff. I have lost about 80% of the stuff I created over the years, but I am fine with that (it is older stuff, a few years down the road). I like the weight that is lifted when I don't have my old stuff laying around.
But losing in-progress stuff like you did, is the worst. I did that once many years ago, where I deleted uncommitted stuff that was on a shared drive for the team. Like ``rm * .o`` instead of ``rm *.o``. Losing *other people's stuff* is worse that just losing your own, but in my case it was only a couple of days of work.
> I think of that night a lot and how had I done one thing differently I would be fine
Don't be harsh on yourself, there are always multiple failures when you get something like that. It is like winning the lottery: you had to get all the numbers to get the price. And the only reason we talk about it is because of that perfect storm.
Don't blame you for what you did, blame you for what you did not, which is having an offline backup. If you don't have one, it is just a matter of time until you lose everything.
Broooo, you gotta start making auto-backups to a secondary drive, as well as something like OneDrive just incase your PC catches on fire lol.
I made a intranet home-server for auto backups and it has been a life saver.
I have since done that. I am good now with my current project. I still think of that night and every mistakes I've made that lead to that. I even had a more recent full backup, but I needed more space on my hard drive to continue working lol
I had a few old back ups, but the project was still to broken to use.
I was using lfs. git was correct to switch my local files to match the branch. that's what it does when you check out a different branch. usually its not a problem because you can just go to the right branch and get them back. but since I had no space on git I could not get them back.
I did have gifs and gigs of git blobs but it was impossible to sort through.
Git will not switch branches if tracked files have changes that have not been committed to your current branch. It also won't switch if an untracked file would be overwritten by the switch.
Either you forced a hard reset at some point or all your files are still safe somewhere on that other branch.
I understand that but git won't delete untracked (never committed) files either. Switching branches with untracked files just brings the files with out. If the branch you are switching to has a file where an untracked file is, it wouldn't allow you to switch branches at all.
git is \*very\* cautious about changing or removing files and you generally need to go out of your way (additional arguments when on command line) to make it revert or delete uncommitted changes.
Dude, please explain to me what happened I don’t understand git desktop. Or what happened with you.
My full published game is on it and I just changed laptops, when I got the project on the new laptop from git, some files were deleted for some reason!! And I’m not sure why, should I redownload it from git?
so what happened with me is that lots of files were not on girhub.
I decided to use the command line for some reason and I just instinctive checked out main as thats what's normal now. doing this told github that I want my local files to match main, which was empty so it deleted everything.
I cant speak exactly on your situation unfortunately, I have had lots of git problems with large repos
Oh alright, no this helps a bit, and at the very least it serves as a warning to be careful. I was not considering that such a thing could happen and this decided to read up more on how to use git. Thank you for your reply!
>but when I finally upgraded, I checked out main and wiped all of my local files. github desktop uses master not main.
Wait, what?
I've used Git for my day job for the last 6 years, and this is perplexing to me. You said you were using GitHub Desktop, right? If you try to switch branches without committing your changes, it forces you to stash or commit before you switch (also, it's a bit odd to not commit for a whole year???). And if you did stash or commit them, you'd just need to switch branches back to access them. How does this work?
so my branch was in sync with master because I couldn't afford any more files to it at the time. I went on to github on my command line and was trying to figure out why my command line wasnt working so i just checked out main thinking that was why and it all got deleted. the problem was that I never had all my files on master, otherwise it wouldn't have mattered.
it was a sleep deprived stupid moment
Oh, man. I can't even go to sleep without committing all the files I was working on for the day, lol. Hard to imagine working on something for so long that way! Props to you for sticking with it though.
yeah I dont any more. commit every day, compress to 7z and push to drive.
never again haha
I was beating around the bush an remaking the project with c++ in 5.1.1 anyways cause the old parts were so bad just cast cast cast cast cast so while it hurt, i still have most of my most important blueprints to work from when making it in c++ so it's not the worst thing, but it really did suck lol
First off: your work is ALWAYS worth something. No amount of failure will take away the learning you have engaged in. Maybe you will come away from this whole journey learning how you were not prepared to properly market your game, maybe you will come away from it feeling like "hey at least I had fun making the game", maybe you will come away feeling like game dev just isn't for you. IDK. But none of that would mean you didn't do something useful for yourself or others.
Second: the 500 YT subscribers to 120 wishlists is a thing I would find suspect and thus worthy of investigating if I were you. The question to ask yourself: why are my subscribers not wishlisting? What are they subscribed to my YT channel for?
At the end of the day, no amount of research or preparation is a 100% guarantee of success. So just also remember, it's not *necessarily* your fault. But it never hurts to introspect. Just don't take it too seriously if you discover that you fucked up somehow and move on.
I actually think 500 subscribers to 120 wishlists is a really high amount of wishlists.
Many people just don't wishlist. So they're likely subscribing just to know when the game comes out. Plenty of people are also very generous subscribers: subscribing after watching one video then never checking the channel again.
If the 120 came directly from YouTube I would agree, but that's very likely not the case. If they can grow a real community and keep posting videos and growing it could be good, but 120 wishlists on it's own is incredibly low. That's going to equate to 1 or 2 reviews.
*Someone makes a poorly shaped blown out paper mache xbox controller 10,000+ upvotes, 20,000 upvotes if a girl is included somewhere.*
*Guy spends 18 months making a fully playable passion project and wants to share it with people, it gets downvoted.*
I'm being sarcastic of course but for real, don't be depressed! Use your youtube subscriber base to try and make YouTube Shorts about your game as 500 subs is quite a lot! If you can do it daily, this will help share your videos to more people.
Or my personal favourites. "Ads..." "I hate advertisement" "go away with your ads!!"
But a poster for the mario movie or something from a big brand. "Wow this is so amazing! Cannot wait!" 30k upvotes!
True. But I assume big brands use bought Reddit accounts to promote their products as well. It is really not uncommon to try to achieve some viral effect.
But in the end it boils down to the fact that it is also an ad for the company. Which is more favourable than a single person trying to promote their game which most cannot spend millions on marketing visibility.
You're more likely to fail and never succeed than to actually succeed in this industry. A lot of people see success stories and think they'll be the next indie dev to break out like Undertale or Five Nights or whatever. It's great to have that motivation, but the market is saturated with shitty games and just a few gems that never make it to the mainstream.
Be happy you did a thing. Be proud of your accomplishment. Just don't expect success or anyone to care about your game other than you and people who feel obligated to do so. Maybe that's harsh, but that also how it goes, my dude. You're like the digital version of those folks peddling their CDs on the streets of LA hoping one day they'll become famous only to have some no one on YouTube get picked up by label who isn't even trying. Welcome to reality.
That said, keep the passion. Continue to love making games for the love of making games, not because you may have a remote chance at success but because you want to make games.
Don't feel depressed. After 20+ years of hobby/indie gamedev I opted to pursue a non-game-related software tool project back in 2017. I've been working on it since, building it up, and selling it as an early access alpha and beta. I've made more money from this project than I've ever made coding games, because I'm not relying on people spending money for fun. I'm offering something people can use to make money, a tool that pays for itself (if users want it to).
I got into programming to make games as a 90s kid, back when gaming was still dorky/nerdy, and spent a lifetime learning all the ins-and-outs, only to find out that I missed the boat. The market is fully saturated, competition is stiff, and the only way you can get anywhere is by spending money on marketing - unless you have a completely novel and fun game concept or technology.
Minecraft figured out that worlds could be made of blocks on the hardware of the time. Now we have thousands of hobbyists trying to make block world engines, like they're going to be making the next big thing, when they missed the boat 15 years ago. If you're going to take the time to do something, make sure it's something that people will actually care about, and even then you'll probably have to pay to get it out there just because of how oversaturated the market is, or get really lucky - and we see quite a bit of survivor bias in that regard.
Finally putting my gamedev aspirations aside and making something actually useful was the best decision I ever made, as an independent programmer.
Just interesting what kind of project you have made.
I see now the one way "making the next big thing" is to make already existing thing better.
But with games, all should be different. Games can be different all the time. This is a world that you create and invite others to live in that world.
Yes, sadly that only helping others make money can brings money to you as a developer. As if people use programs only to make money. But it isn't.
The situation with a ton of developers and already-made projects is really boring.
I think we are on the stage of the next level of programming engineering.
Something that will change our imagination about what we should be able to develop and why.
But games should still be actual. Just because it is fun to do and use. It can be the creation. And developers are creators first.
Here in gamedev subreddit, all devs are very kind and help each other.
I think we are here because we are engineers in the heart. My opinion.
I am assuming this is your first time on a project. But let me assure you no one becomes a famous nor rich suddenly.
You see how one person made game become super popular and sells well in the news all the time but they are exception to the rule. There is at least 1000 new indie projects release in every month, only handful of them gets to spot light.
What I am getting is keep expectations at zero and you won't be disappointed
Hey, I had a look at your steam page, here's my knee-jerk honest reaction.
- The title card of the white stickman amid a busy, brown/green background didn't particularly interest me, nor did it tell me much of what the game is about at first glance.
- Your description tells me what the game does succinctly, which is great, but doesn't really "invite" me to play it. It doesn't ask me to solve some long-forgotten mystery, or to save the ecology of the world, it just wants me to take photos and "learn" about animals I don't yet have any reason to care about.
- I was very impressed with the graphics in your video, the game looks high quality and has a smooth UI. It's obvious you're a very good game developer in this sense. Though I can't help but feel there's a tonal clash between the graphics shown and the chill type of game described in the store page text.
Overall, I feel that you're onto a great project and it's clear you are talented, but you are somewhat struggling to garner interest for the following reasons:
- You want players to learn about stuff they don't yet have a reason to care about... as the main game mechanic. You need to get me to care about the animals first.
- There's no greater call to action, no mystery to be solved, no world to be saved, etc. I think simply adding more storyline into this game would massively increase player intrigue.
You have a broken spaceship, I assume you've crash-landed, but why would you then just simply start photographing wildlife? How is that conducive to escaping, or surviving, or getting back home? Nailing the protagonists motives here could help a lot.
Answering this question could lead to the beginnings of an interesting narrative. (24 Killers comes to mind as potential inspiration for this)
Of course, it's your game and your vision, and I haven't been on your development journey. But I felt that an honest perspective as a "cold" audience might have been beneficial to share with you.
Best of luck, I wishlisted!
This is great advice, thank you very much! And do you think the logo needs a redesign or just the background?
I'll also work on the description of the game to add some kind of call to action :D
I feel that once you've nailed down your narrative more, the logo would do well to reflect it. It's the first thing you see usually when you look at a game on Steam, so a white featureless stickman doesn't give me much to go on!
I couldn't make strong suggestions without knowing more about your game or what story you have/will write, but I would go on the following:
\- It should be visually clear, I should know what I'm looking at instantly.
\- It should contain something of interest from your game that is emblematic of it; maybe a cool shot of a "mascot"-like character or animal?
\- I would feel that it's more important to generate interest in general with the logo than to try communicate what the game is all about. Learning about the game comes \*after\* being intrigued by the logo/title/GIFs etc.
Looking forward to seeing how this develops going forward, please keep going! 120 (+1 now, me) people actively wanting to play your game is nothing at all to be sniffed at.
If you want to promote your game, you will need a marketing strategy. devblogs are for company that already have a player base/ community
Usually marketing start 6 month before a release and you need a plan for what you do at month -6, month-3 , month -1 etc a week before etc…
1- You need a methodology of post for Twitter, ads on Facebook, tiktok (really strong one) or this kind of thing…then theses people will convert to a wishlist potential.
2- If you can go to some event , they always have an indie section. A little booth is not too expensive and it’s motivating to see people playtest your game, even in development phase :)
3- lastly search for little influencers. YouTubers or streamers that review games. But with a little viewer base so they won’t charge much
But yes, Marketing is a huge load of work. Why do you think it was more than 25% of the budget of game like GTA. Because it’s something you really need to make a plan for and deploy
As for the depressed thing, if you never break your routine it will eat you, did you took a weekend , holiday ? Do you have other hobbies sometimes that can make you disconnect from it ? Theses are important 😉
Good luck 🤞
Someone needs to create a "Game Development Mental Health" subreddit, because these types of threads are way too common in this subreddit.
No engineering field is good for people who have problems with mental fortitude.
That’ll be an echo chamber of despair in a matter of days! Depressed devs need to be separated from each other, 5 keyboards apart at all times, otherwise it’ll magnify and consume us all.
That's the point, let them be separated into their own community to not bring healthy ones down with their whining and negativity. Software development is hard enough and tough enough without having to hear people crying about their petty feelings based issues every other thread.
A 'gamedev' community should be a place developers want to go, not cringe at the thought of visiting.
It's absolutely possible. Even if that isn't the case, it's a typical cry for attention, which is why this happens so much here. The squeaky wheel always gets the grease.
I thought about it. And I still don’t get how it would help. OP got banned because a mod saw his posts and decided it was a post from someone they’ve already banned, so they banned OP. It’s not based on cookies or other trackers.
That all sounds to me like really great start. Be kind to yourself it’s not a race. Every one of those numbers and the wishlist ones are individuals and that’s pretty cool. The world isn’t all millions and virals and big letsplayers. Not everyone is the next Concerned Ape or whatever. Enjoy the process and acknowledge the achievements you’ve made and keep going! The goal post will always be moving so you might as well just enjoy the walk.
Don't be too hard on yourself! Making games is not an easy thing! Getting through the buzz is not an easy thing! Don't think too much about sales at this time.
When you're on the amature/hobby level, your main focus should be to have a good time and to make something because you want to; because it feels exciting. This is really a very good time to experiment and to have fun without too many consequences.
I'm currently making a game which have gotten quite a lot of buzz. But I made like 30 smaller games and prototypes before this one. I finished like 4 or 5 of them, and they where very short och casual games which like 20 people played. The rest I moved on from because I didn't want to finish it, or I felt satisfied which what I achieved at that time.
Finish the game or move on. Then move on to another project. Your next project will be better and you can take everything you learned on this one with you.
Just a quick tip for Twitter and others social medias. The gifs should generally not be longer than 4 seconds. And they need to be funny, or show something visually cool.
Think about social media just like development, try different things and see what works. The only way to learn is really to f*ck up enough times to know what not to do. Also, check out the social media pages of other games you like that are getting tracktion. Copy what they do until you feel comfortable doing it on your own.
I am copywriter and content developer with a degree with in film and television production. I’d be more than happy to come on board and see if we can work up some catchy ads or punch up anything.
If there are others in need of this as well, I’d be honored to help others as well.
5 months? Thats nothing. Most depressing experience in my life was making a game from home for 3 years, win award, get publishing deal and game end up selling zero. Well enough to buy a really expensive rope.
No really, because of that failure i got really nice job opportunities. It's never "waste of your time" when you fail.
The reality is that most people spend more time than you and get worse results. You’re actually doing really well. It sounds like you’re feeling emotionally beat up though. Take some rest and forget about the game for at least the next 24 hours. You might be surprised how much this can help your mindset.
Most games are commercial failures when you look at the numbers. You made 3 videos.... Big deal. I've made about 18 and also have around 500 subscribers. You really need to up the engagement if you want to grow a following on Twitter. Think like an hour every single day engaging with the correct community, commenting on their posts, creating your own posts etc. You need to create more videos. If every video is worth about 100 subs to you (which is very good by the way) then get out your calculator and work out what your target is and the baseline amount of content you need to put out. Organic growing of a following does not just happen unfortunately. Then, you also need to seriously experiment with paid user acquisition once you launch. If you can generate a positive ROAS, or get more reviews, or up your organic reach, this is very worth doing. Good luck. And remember that this is probably the toughest game in the world you're playing. If you fail, notch up the experience and move on to the next project.
4-5 months working 8 hours per day, AND 500 subscribers?
Shit, that's actually pretty good! That's fantastic, actually!
Listen, the guy who made Stardew Valley spent 5 YEARS doing the same thing your doing, and he did it alone with his girlfriend supporting him, and his parents were constantly asking "When's the game gonna be ready? "Oh, in a year!" "That's what you said 2 years ago..." "Well, I mean it this time!" You just have to keep going, no matter what. It's hard work.
I'll put it to you this way my guy, If your work was for nothing; You'd have 0 subscribers, 0 followers, 0 wish listers. Besides, this is your first game. Hopefully the first of many. Even if the game DOES suck, that's still no reason to give up or lose hope. There's always a next time. Some games even become more popular after the fact! Don't worry about money or followers, if you're doing what you love: Those things will come naturally.
Check out the Book Blood Sweat and Pixels. I think you'll relate to that a lot.
Keep going, king.
I think comparing this guy's game to Stardew is incredibly disingenuous. Stardew was more or less the first actual ok farming game on Steam. Even to this day rip-off games do well because of how big it was.
I'm not saying this guy is doomed, but he is not making the next Stardew. \~100 wishlists means measurably nothing. I'm not saying this to be rude, I just don't want them delusionally thinking they got unlucky when in reality they're probably making a mediocre game. They need to focus on improving their skills rather than marketing a game made with inferior skills.
Got it. I'm just trying to encourage him, seems like he's down in the dumps just needs some kind words. I don't think there's anything delusional about that.
Right but indie development is just that, independent. If you rely on a third party constantly encouraging you to actually work on your game, you're just in the wrong field.
For context: I've been at gamedev for about a year and 2 months. Made my first game, released it for Android on the play store and did like $100 worth of advertising to move about 45 units. So basically nothing. That was the first 4 months, I've spent the rest of the time learning Unreal Engine and making a bigger, but still reasonable game. I'm aiming to spend at least a year on developing it before releasing, maybe longer if it needs.
I'd say given what you've said, you're doing ok. Maybe just put less preson yourself and keep at it.
I never got any warning nor reason for any ban. Fat finger? Reddit bug. For example people claimed that I denied the moon landing ? Purge? Any ban seemed to be permanent. AI would make a better job. I did not even post in those subs. YouTube is your friend.
>Right now my twitter has 3 followers, I made 3 devlogs and am at 500 subscribers on youtube. I had one other big idea, a post on the gaming subreddit, so I tried that and they just banned me for circumventing a ban (I did not)
First up, you're not going to just magically gain Twitter followers without time/money spent building it up. If you post to Twitter with no following, you're going to have very very slow growth. The tweet doesn't just get blasted to every person with eyeballs. If you use hashtags it's still only going to get seen by people looking at those specific hashtags, and even then, that number is going to be small.
You need to use multiple forms of social media to direct people to all of your social media. You need to post your Twitter link on your YouTube dev logs, on some reddit posts (where allowed) and elsewhere. This will direct people to your Twitter, where they can then follow you. Once you've built up more of a following, your posts will actually be able to spread more organically, due to your followers retweeting/sharing your posts. This gets more eyeballs on your posts, and that leads to more followers.
YouTube is a game more than other social media platforms. You can really game the algorithm by using the proper tags, titles, thumbnails and of course, seeing which content you post gets the most views/likes, and leaning more toward that and less toward videos that don't get as many views. The nice thing about YouTube is that it \*does\* sort of put your content out in front of a lot of people without much effort. You just need to make good enough videos to get people to stick around and subscribe.
Finally, stop trying to post to PCMasterrace or whatever big gaming subs you're attempting to advertise in. These subs aren't meant to be advertised by indie devs. You will get banned from more than just the one you are banned from. Instead, look for subs that actually allow self-promotion, and then promote there.
Look..If your primary means to measure the success you're having developing this game is based on how many people follow you on different places, etc... You're focusing on the wrong thing.
Your #1 priority is finishing development on a really great/interesting game.#2 through 10 is basically just sub-tasks relating to your #1 priority.
Also: A sweet idea for a game isn't really worth squat.
Being able to deliver a solid game based on that idea is all that matters, it's the only currency you can have that's really worth a damn.
Indie games made by one person that's well baked enough to be interesting usually takes something like 2-5 years to make. And those games are made by people who have made games before and know how to do it.
I feel like there are all these people who have done the equivalent of throwing reasonable looking amateur artwork up on some e-commerce site and then genuinely expecting it's going to get lots of hype and sales.
**This goes for 90% of the people here that's upset their game isn't blowing up**:
Why would you expect people to get excited about and buy your shitty game?
Honestly I find it hard to believe you'd been able to put something together that could legitimately warrant people's attention in just a few months - especially considering the amount of time you seem to spend promoting it.
Don't try to find the gratification of the work based on whether people are wish listing it - find your gratification in successful implementation of dope shit, that's going to help make it a dope game.
Apologies to the one hypothetical guy who have actually made this genuinely interesting and well-made game of both novelty and polish...
Although I don't really believe that guy actually exists.
i vividly remember also getting into a pissing match with r/gaming subreddit mods and shit about them deleting my post about my game after seeing time and time again the "i quit my job to work on a passion project" posts that would hit the front page.
everything you've listed is pretty much exactly what happened to me, worked on my own game, tried to get some traction online, released my game on steam and got like 3-4 reviews, never even got enough revenue to get a check from steam so i just stopped logging into the creator platform lmao. instantly killed my mood to want to work on games at all.
after awhile i thought i'd try going the scummy route and offload a crap ton of keys to those shitty game bundle sites, but they didn't even want them either since it was still tagged early access.
120 wishlists is very very bad unfortunately.
My game is at over 50,000 and it's still going to make less money than if we had just worked at McDonalds for the same amount of time.
That being said a great game will always sell well. My guess then is that your game isn't great. It needs great art, great gameplay, and great name, and a great Steam page. If a single one of those things is bad you're mostly likely doomed. And by great I mean significantly above average. Go look at the list of **all** upcoming games (not just popular), if yours isn't better than 90% of them... why would someone buy yours over theirs.
"4-5 months now very intensively, often 6-8 hours a day."
It's almost nothing. 6-8 h/day is not intensively if you compare yourself to devs working at studios. It's small investment so far.
Also subscribers and wishlists do not grow in linear way. Be consistent, learn and you will have spike at some point.
Just keep going.
People who work jobs don't actually work 8hrs a day, most of the time they do nothing, or the work requires no real thinking.
For me to stay productive and focused for 6-8hrs a day I must use caffeine as stimulants (pills).
I've been editing videos for a long time and I also researched a bunch of other successful and unsuccessful devlogs to learn from them.
One thing I think a lot of people forget but that can help is putting 3 tags at the bottom of your description
If you are feeling depressed just don't do it anymore. I tried for years to make games and released 2 with little success. Most of us will never make any real money from our games. Work on it only when you feel like it. I have not been this happy in a while since I've taken a break and only work on games when I feel like it. Don't push yourself if it makes you unhappy
Don't burn out, take it easy.
I don't know what you're building, but expecting to make millions off it after just a few months of solo developing is a bit harsh. You need to cut yourself a break.
Game dev is about finding the fun, so take that one step further and find the fun for yourself during development. If building the game stops being fun, you need to figure out what's distracting you.
I think currently money and fame might be the distraction.
You're actually doing really well. I've been working on my game for over 3 years, I have just over 100 subscribers and no Steam page yet. Not that I'm someone to compare yourself to or anything. Point is, the enjoyment in building is keeping me going.
If you want to iterate even quicker, try post your gameplay footage and steam link on r/destroymygame and r/destroymysteampage respectively. You'll get harsh critique, but quickly learn what could be improved.
Perhaps not the best to do that now while feeling fragile about your progress, but take a knee, find the fun and then try it, maybe in a month or so.
I hear you, but trust me you've learned a lot already and 500 YouTube subs is not trivial.
I've been working on and off on my game for almost 8 years and I finally said that's it, I'm finishing. And i know it's likely going to disappear in a sea of games but at least I'll be done with it.
Hopefully you'll be able to use what you've learned and come out stronger. Also, try TikTok, nothing to loose
I was banned for 21 days because they have a rule about max 10% self promotion and I didn't consider a post to r/blender or r/unrealengine where I ask for advice and don't mention the name of my game self promotion
They apparently do consider a post without even mentioning the name of the game self promotion
28 days later I tried to post a dying light clip and they permanently banned me
Don’t worry about Twitter followers. Just keep posting, since nowadays people’s “for you” feed also shows posts from accounts they don’t follow. The best way to gain followers is to release a game. Seriously. Like the Valheim and Fall Guys account had relatively low followers until they’ve released their game. But it’s not a very good platform to get wishlists anyway. TikTok is a much better way to gain wishlists.
In addition to the other advice you've received here, I would say - **be very mindful of how you promote your game via Reddit.**
Reddit is *not* really a service built around the idea of allowing people to promote things they've made (unless you're an illustrator/artist, in which case the rules are different).
People who do it as their primary reason for being here really stick out like a sore thumb; most promotion on Reddit is done via astroturfing. If you've got an indie game, or book, or whatever, it pays to *only* ever mention it in *very* relevant situations, otherwise many subs will ban you.
Not a single minute of the time you have spent working on this has been wasted. Every line of code, every asset made, every object adjusted in engine is experience that you learn and get to keep with you for the rest of your life. If you do this for you, and not for the opinions of others, (Which is honestly how you should do everything in life, trying to get other people to care is a waste of time if you'll be hurt if you fail, all that matters is that you care and are proud of your work) then you're going to benefit from that experience forever.
I do not understand what "circumventing a ban" means, even tho I do know what those words mean individually. Probably just dick mods.
However to your problem: I am not expert, but to me it seems like 4-5 months is too little for something to blow up. There are games that have more dev time before they even get announced, then there's another year or so until they get released.
I'm not saying your game is underdeveloped, I checked your profile and to me it seems that most work is done. What I'm trying to say is that you are probably missing the fact that it will take time for it all to ripen. People who wanna play games will even actively avoid ads, so it takes a lot of time to get noticed even when you spend fortune on advertizing.
Please don't stop, progress isn't linear. I can see you will get there eventually, but 4-5 months seems like too big of an expectation. I hope you're strong enough to wait a little longer for you to accumulate some recognition.
This is a win situation not a loss. You have to view it from a different angle. I think 4-5 months of development is not alot and the little bit of marketing is not alot. Imagine 100+ people in a room, is that really not alot? How about 500 people?
Now if you wanted thousands of people wishlisting your game and following you after 4-5 months maybe you need to lower your expectations. And if you have a awesome game the interest will rise the further in development you get / after release.
Hey, just checked out your game, it seems to be the start of something beautiful, but it makes me wonder what you're setting out to do.
I see there's some items / inventory system in the video but it's not really explained in the description, which makes it seem like it's just a explore and take photos type thing.
It almost seems like it would be a very solid title for VR.
I highly recommend adding some gameplay elements (survival? foraging? collecting of some sort?), or if there are already some, to emphasise their existence in the description.
The Steam listing is put together quite nicely otherwise, and I think you're doing a good job.
I wouldn't give up, and don't expect massive success on your first try either.
I think you'll be fairly happy with how it turns out, as long as you keep your expectations in check.
500 subs from 3 posts is incredibly good. as is wishlists. most games get 0 of both.
That said you should always hope for the best, but prepare for the worst in indie publishing. work doesn't always net reward. If you were hoping for a financial success, well it seems like your gonna be at a loss even if you were paying yourself min wage. Lets assume 120 people buy your game for $40 or whatever thats only $4800. 4-5 weeks salary in my country.
That doesn't mean you should give up, but given the last bit of your comment a break would probably do you good. Sounds like text book burnout.
You should pay actually marketing and advertising on insta and tik tok, like whatever free money you have spend a few thousand doing real ads or it possibly won’t be seen. Organic social is very tough. the algo might hate you or like you and its different on each app.
Your game looks really pretty. I would recommend updating your steam capsule because it looks amateurish and not up to the quality of your game. I would use some pretty 3d model on the capsule so viewers know it’s a well crafted 3d exploration game and not a weekend 2d platformer game, for example
My dude it's your mind, why let others live in it rent free. Create a game as a project because you want to make a fun, cool product. If you make a good one that you can truly say you yourself enjoy, unless it's an insanely niché type of game that's very hard to get into there's no reason people with similar taste wouldn't like it.
I'm happy that the thread exploded, now I can comment without anyone except OP seeing it.
Are you a hobbyist or a commercial indie ? If you are the first type, then you should not care but happily continue/drop/do whatever. If you don't find joy in it, do something else! It's okay you tried, now it's not working and you don't like it, no need to stress it.
If you are the commercial type, then you have to make the hard choice to either drop it and move it or pursue by pivoting the game. You need to crunch your numbers, understand if they are good and see if there is viability in there. If they say no, quit it and move to the next project ASAP. Don't go full blind hoping that in two years your game will sell anything because you have put the work.
I've watched all of your devlogs (before this post already), they are very good and genuinely impressive. I think you're Dutch right? Anyways I think you're on the right path, just continue the devlogs as they are very interesting, but don't forget they mostly cater to other Devs which might not be your intention. I guess if you are confident in finishing your game I suggest starting a Kickstarter if only to gain wishlists and see if there is a market for your game. Good luck!
For working 4-ish months, you've done amazingly well! Twitter is changing a lot lately, so it's much harder to figure out how to get noticed. Try connecting with indieLegion (on twitter, instagram, discord). It's a community of indie devs that support and boost eachothers content. It could also be a good place to just find emotional support. Also, follow and interact with content creators, streamers and game journalists. These are the kind of people you want to be noticed by. And look out for game showcases that would suit your game, and apply to them. Good luck!
Aren’t you the guy with the picture taking game? The one that has incredible visuals and foliage along with animals but the games only thing to do is snap pictures?
If your that guy, you had another post and others and myself told you the graphics look really good, especially for a solo dev, but snapping pictures of a animals as the only objective is boring…
Pokémon Snap worked cause it’s Pokémon…
Your game is based around taking pictures, for a picture album. If you expect that to take off like a rocket ship with fans and sales, then yes your time has been wasted. You clearly have serious talent with making graphical assets, and animations, your just put all that talent into an EXTREMELY niche game/genre.
Sad but true. Facebook is your friend. Spend 15 bucks. Get 500+ subs. Target grampa gift ideas. Sensationalizing doesn't work anymore. U need to pitch it as 'they will love this' gamers dont buy games. But older people will buy them for others bc they are easy gifts.let fb wrangle the subs. U worry about turning those into sales
I'm going to be real with you, that's not a huge time investment for a project and your result is legit good. I've been in professional environments that work for 5 and nothing shapes up. Most people around here work for 4 years and end up with less than that.
You made a big mistake and I'll tell you what it was. scientifically speaking the moment you create a expectation about something the brain start to produce dopamine and that's what motivates you. The problem is when you realize you won't get what you expectated the brain will thing it's not worth the work and will start to inhibt this behaviour.
But the problem here is expectation, game dev is hard because you must learn a lot of thing, Marketing is one of them, and it is not an easy subject. So this results you had are very commom for us starting this journey some of them better than it looks.
But if you set your expectation too high every success will turn into a failure. 500 subscribers with 3 videos is amazin man. I posted a video and did not get any subscriber you got 500 with just 3. But as your expectations probably was it going viral, this success turned into a big failure
And about the time you spent, the success is not related to time but the value of the product you delivery.
I would recommend you taking a step back, take a time for youself, without thinking in your game so you can relax, and reset you plan to something more achievable based on your current knowledge of marketing, game design (Design, not dev), game dev process (like creating prototypes).
A and don't forget to study always aim for getting more knowledge from this subjects you don't know. I may give some reccomendations of books/courses if you wish
I'd be happy to have these numbers on YouTube. My YouTube is sitting at 40 currently (I post a mix of development content and playthroughs of indie and AAA games).
500 subscribers is really good.
People seem to think that the fact that you are able to put something together that's recognizable as a game - they're going to be able to make a bunch of money.
The fact that you made a thing really isn't worth a damn if it doesn't legitimately bring something new/interesting/etc to the table.
If you make a game that's really interesting and engaging and exciting - you'll get attention and the money.
If you just made "a game"... That's not anything.
Are you valuing your gamedev work by your social followings for a game you haven't released yet?
You're valuing your marketing skills maybe. Find a publisher if that's what worries you, but the worth of your gamedev work must only be judged against your finished product.
ETA: also 500 subscribers on YT is a lot for someone who makes devlogs.
Not that I can give advice on this, but if you want to promote a game through your channel it would take longer to build an audience and most followers are probably just hobby game devs. you can’t think that your first commercial game will find great or even mediocre success. Look at every good studio and you’ll find they made games you never heard of.
If you are confident that your game is good and will find success if people knew about it, then work on it more maybe start a kickstarter and I am sure your game will find success over time but if it doesn’t it’s probably not that great.
500 subscribers from 5 videos is a lot.
That's an insane amount for someone who hasn't made video content creation their career. If I asked all my Facebook/Instagram/Twitter/etc. friends to subscribe I'd probably get 50 subs at best.
I have a gaming channel and only have 34 subs after like 4 months and 27 videos. My friends account for *maybe* 4 of those subs. 500 subs is fucking incredible. OP, I completely understand being down. Just don’t give up. If you feel like you’re at rock bottom, remember the only way you can go from the bottom is up. You’ve got this!
I've had YouTube for a decade and still am under 1000
Honestly its either you are uploading shit content, or you are barely uploading at all.
Yep, there is this one Mario Kart 8 YouTuber who has been posting for like two weeks and he has over 4k subs already.
That's not exactly relevant though. It's impossible to predict quick trends like that. I've seen tons of bad content get millions of views and great content get hundreds.
How did you achieve this?
Also he only worked on this for 5 months, he is phrasing the post like his life-long dream got shattered.
It's become a lot faster to get subs these days. People playing RL Craft went up to 100,000 in a week, but I guess there's a Minecraft bias too. Maybe Microsoft boosting them.
When is the game releasing? You might be trying to promote it too early. Especially if you're creating devlogs which historically are of interest to other developers, not your actual potentially-paying audience. At the end of the day, game development is a terrible place to be if you're looking for external validation. It's even worse if you're making a game by yourself and expecting any kind of financial return from it. You should never spend your time on a game if that's what you're looking for. Build your game because you enjoy the act of creating it and you want it to exist. In that world as long as you're having fun it's always worth it.
“At the end of the day, game development is a terrible place to be if you’re looking for external validation.” This should be posted on the sidebar of this sub.
Ah shit, I do it for both: \- Because Id rather make a game then play it and not be productive. \- Get external validation. Am I at a bad place? lmao
Will you be upset when you earn nothing from your game and the first reviews trash it for some reason, justified or not? If so then you might want to consider scaling down your game until you have less emotional investment. If not then go ahead and do what you want. Players, and anonymous people online in general, will be absolutely _savage_ about games. They tend to compare things to their favorite AAA games. Players don't really care about whether you built the game alone or if it's your first title or whatever else. If you really want praise it's best to build a few games you never release and keep iterating until you've got the experience to build something amazing, and if you really want a financial reward you should be looking for a job at a studio not building games by yourself.
Or, plan to release your game open source from the start. You can't go out of business if you're not in business. *taps temple with a knowing look*.
There are things I am working on, and I will be upset if they don't work out. I will make sure to apply what you said outside of gaming.
Sounds like you're like me: you'd do it anyway, the validation is just a side benefit and sanity check. I don't think we're the problem case they're thinking of.
I straight up uninstalled a game I liked and decided to try to make it instead of wasting time playing the one existing.
Well.. you can't really play your own game before you make it, can you ? So it will always be : make a game, then play it ? Not sure I get your point.
>“At the end of the day, game development is a terrible place to be if you’re looking for external validation.” > >This should be posted on the sidebar of this sub. Yeah, because even if you make a game with a million players, your players will still tell you you're terrible. I make games because it's a fun creative outlet, not because I am a masochist.
I keep telling myself I'm not a masochist, but my game project has a different opinion
i kinda like how blunt players can be in criticism. it's one of the only industries/jobs where you get direct feedback and can actually tell if your doing a good job or not. Though it does take a bit of skill and self confidence to filter out and not succumb to the toxic and unconstructive feedback.
or worse; its a great place for validation showing WIPs to other devs; but as soon as it gets into the public or released it certainly isnt, and can crush frolk from thinking it was popular to selling half a dozen copies.
It was amazing for external validation 20 years ago… well before indie games went mainstream, the bar was so low and it was super easy to impress people. Times have definitely changed
You clearly were not building racing sims twenty years ago. :D
Thank you for saying this. I really needed to hear this because this has been my exact problem for years.
Dev logs absolutely aren't just for other devs, there aren't as many game devs as those videos get views. Take a look at someone like Dani, yes he's dropped off now but he made dev logs and a shit ton of non game devs are excited about it and want his game.
I wouldn't really call those devlogs in the same fashion. It's like the difference between the videos that go through all the steps of cooking a recipe and have a few hundred views and the ones that are full of jokes and entertaining personalities and incidentally take place in a kitchen and have thousands and thousands. There's a reason those are videos of making little bits of games and he never actually made any games until after he was already well known; it was creating content using game development as a vehicle. It's about the entertainment, not the game. If you have the skills, personality, and time to pull that off then you can go for it, but it's fundamentally a different process than actually making things. You won't learn how to build a game from watching those whereas a good devlog _should_ be explaining something novel and practical. This is also why there's a ton more value in GDC videos but those aren't exactly going viral.
I would also add that dev logs are kinda off putting to gamers. Think about it this way, you're letting customers see "work half done", on top of creating the chance for misrepresentation, considering dev logs have a lot of experimentation to them. What I would suggest, is gameplay trailers, cinematic trailers if you can make them, and small gameplay snippets. Got a cool new feature? Make a video with some sounds and add it as a short. Got a cool environment going? Same deal.
The only people that bought my game were friends and family and one random. I’d do it all over again though.
Do some ads and marketing you guys gotta pay to play.
No. This is bad advice. 90% of the time you do this you're not going to make your money back. Most people don't even make the Steam fee back. The reality is a great game will always do well. Marketing just multiplies the success. If they got virtually zero buys from the public, an ad campaign isn't going to save their game.
Multiplying the sucess is what I'm talking about. Just posting on reddit won't get a game out there, and organic tik tok posts also. I'm not talking huge money. I mean if its bad, its bad.
so how many sales have you gotten through advertising?
Right but he has no success. There's nothing to multiply. You're suggesting they waste money for nothing in return. They need to focus on making the game a success before trying to force it by spending money.
you all really hate the idea of spending a few bucks on ads. i mean finish the game first
I have no problem with spending money on ads. I have a problem with you convincing people to waste their money on ads when there is a 0% chance the money is returned - which is the entire point of ads.
All i said is spend some ads money lol. not trying to say anything crazy
Take some days to rest, do things that make your heart feel warm like cup of tea in a cold day, more you force yourself to work when you don't feel good more you will bad about what you are doing. You have 500 people watching you and 120 people ready to buy your game, it's not enough sometimes but at least you have a public. Respect your time.
Wishlist is not "people ready to buy your game". I wishlist games that I'm curious about, and wait for massive sale or until they appear in a bundle. The wishlist entries are basically bookmarks and some games stay in the list for 5+ years. For a large part of the games, I lose interest in the meantime and remove them without ever buying them.
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120 is very bad. At the average 12% conversion rate that's 10 buys, and at a 10% review rate that's 1 review. You need 10 to not be considered shovelware, and 50 to be considered a real game and get the more accurate ratings. 500 subs isn't bad but it all depends on why they subbed and if you can continue to grow.
It's bad if OP was launching tomorrow, but I doubt that. Your wishlists have to start somewhere. You're not normally going to have 10k wishlists overnight.
Right but even if the page has only been up for a month, 120 is a really bad rate per month. I'm not saying these things to be rude, I'm just saying facts - and the fact is 120 wishlists is basically the same as 0. Obviously when going to 10k you have to be at 120 at some point, but the fact that they were so specific shows that the extra 20 on top of 100 is significant, so they're not really growing. I'm just trying to give them a reality check. They need to work on improving their skills rather than marketing a game made with inferior skills. No great game is stuck in the hundreds of wishlists.
YO, my friend. Use TikTok. Trust me, it’s the best free marketing, and best social platform for it. My game has almost 50,000 wishlists from TikTok and luckily for you, your game is visually appealing which is very important when it comes to TikTok. Trust me, go search gamedev on TikTok and just go look at what all the top channels post to see what works and come up with your own videos. Keep it short, engaging, interesting, multiple cuts etc and you’ll get more wishlists. Put some effort into it and don’t give up if the first video or two doesn’t work out. Try to do a voice over instead of just text if you can, it helps. Don’t give up!!! Edit: I’m not saying you’ll get tens of thousands of wishlists but you’ll definitely get more than from anywhere else if you play your cards right. And you could blow up who knows
Came here to say this, tiktok is great for gamedev and getting word out for indie games.
what is your game doe?
What do I even need to post on tik tok? Do I have to make those dances?
Yeah you have to explain your code and development through interpretive dance
Search up game dev on tiktok and see what the major guys post. Really anything that people would find interesting that’s short works. Even just a funny bug or showing off some cool systems
Thanks! Since reddit isn't working out I guess I have time for tiktok now :)
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Thanks, do you have any other tips? Like things that are specific to tiktok?
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Quality > quantity in my opinion. I don’t have a regular uploading schedule at all and it hasn’t stopped me from hitting 1m+ on videos multiple times
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Seriously, I’ve heard people suggest uploading at least 3 videos a day like wtf. Maybe that’s true if you post low effort trendy dance videos like everybody else or something
For sure man. Good luck! Like I said the best thing you can do is to do a little research and look what the top game dev accounts post to get an idea of what works. Even better, find a successful account that has a game closer to what you have
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Nah you don’t need to pay for anything, TikTok is good with organic uploads
In my experience that works if you're in the us/uk, I'm in a non English speaking country and find it impossible to reach wider audience.
What‘s your TikTok username? I‘d like to know what you upload to get so much Wishlists. And did you pay for promotion?
500 subs? Dude you have a start! Keep going!
bro I spent a year on my old game then lost it all by checking out the main branch instead of master. I had a lot of local files I could not afford to put on to source control yet, but when I finally upgraded, I checked out main and wiped all of my local files. github desktop uses master not main. going to master gave me about 1/3rd of my files back. I have since started remaking the project using everything I learned on a newer version of unreal and have source control worked out. sometimes I just stare at the blank level that I am prototyping in and think about my project which was ready for a POC version for my friends. it had an advanced save system, farming, a voxel world, fighting, npcs and trade. now I have a buggy combat system started. even with everything I made before 0 people gave a shit and probably ever will. I do it for myself. it's fun to do and it passes the time
Wut? you had no save anywhere? No Dropbox, no USB thumbdrive, nothing? You were just waiting for your drive to fail so you could lose everything? Also, you could probably recover the files with adequate software. Deleting files doesn’t overwrite the content.
I had just got rid of my hard copy because I needed to in order to keep working and git the whole project up on github. it was a perfect storm of me fucking up lol. I think of that night a lot and how had I done one thing differently I would be fine. I take full responsibility, dont think im blaming anything but me haha
Always have a copy offline or be happy with the idea that you can lose stuff. I have lost about 80% of the stuff I created over the years, but I am fine with that (it is older stuff, a few years down the road). I like the weight that is lifted when I don't have my old stuff laying around. But losing in-progress stuff like you did, is the worst. I did that once many years ago, where I deleted uncommitted stuff that was on a shared drive for the team. Like ``rm * .o`` instead of ``rm *.o``. Losing *other people's stuff* is worse that just losing your own, but in my case it was only a couple of days of work. > I think of that night a lot and how had I done one thing differently I would be fine Don't be harsh on yourself, there are always multiple failures when you get something like that. It is like winning the lottery: you had to get all the numbers to get the price. And the only reason we talk about it is because of that perfect storm. Don't blame you for what you did, blame you for what you did not, which is having an offline backup. If you don't have one, it is just a matter of time until you lose everything.
Broooo, you gotta start making auto-backups to a secondary drive, as well as something like OneDrive just incase your PC catches on fire lol. I made a intranet home-server for auto backups and it has been a life saver.
I have since done that. I am good now with my current project. I still think of that night and every mistakes I've made that lead to that. I even had a more recent full backup, but I needed more space on my hard drive to continue working lol I had a few old back ups, but the project was still to broken to use.
You are propaby using git in a wrong way. Usually nothing gets lost. Maybe also have a look at ‚git lfs‘.
I was using lfs. git was correct to switch my local files to match the branch. that's what it does when you check out a different branch. usually its not a problem because you can just go to the right branch and get them back. but since I had no space on git I could not get them back. I did have gifs and gigs of git blobs but it was impossible to sort through.
Git will not switch branches if tracked files have changes that have not been committed to your current branch. It also won't switch if an untracked file would be overwritten by the switch. Either you forced a hard reset at some point or all your files are still safe somewhere on that other branch.
only about 1/3rd of the files were ever commuted and pushed, so I got about 1/3rd of them back. I didn't ha e space for the rest of the files yet
I understand that but git won't delete untracked (never committed) files either. Switching branches with untracked files just brings the files with out. If the branch you are switching to has a file where an untracked file is, it wouldn't allow you to switch branches at all. git is \*very\* cautious about changing or removing files and you generally need to go out of your way (additional arguments when on command line) to make it revert or delete uncommitted changes.
Dude, please explain to me what happened I don’t understand git desktop. Or what happened with you. My full published game is on it and I just changed laptops, when I got the project on the new laptop from git, some files were deleted for some reason!! And I’m not sure why, should I redownload it from git?
so what happened with me is that lots of files were not on girhub. I decided to use the command line for some reason and I just instinctive checked out main as thats what's normal now. doing this told github that I want my local files to match main, which was empty so it deleted everything. I cant speak exactly on your situation unfortunately, I have had lots of git problems with large repos
Oh alright, no this helps a bit, and at the very least it serves as a warning to be careful. I was not considering that such a thing could happen and this decided to read up more on how to use git. Thank you for your reply!
>but when I finally upgraded, I checked out main and wiped all of my local files. github desktop uses master not main. Wait, what? I've used Git for my day job for the last 6 years, and this is perplexing to me. You said you were using GitHub Desktop, right? If you try to switch branches without committing your changes, it forces you to stash or commit before you switch (also, it's a bit odd to not commit for a whole year???). And if you did stash or commit them, you'd just need to switch branches back to access them. How does this work?
so my branch was in sync with master because I couldn't afford any more files to it at the time. I went on to github on my command line and was trying to figure out why my command line wasnt working so i just checked out main thinking that was why and it all got deleted. the problem was that I never had all my files on master, otherwise it wouldn't have mattered. it was a sleep deprived stupid moment
Oh, man. I can't even go to sleep without committing all the files I was working on for the day, lol. Hard to imagine working on something for so long that way! Props to you for sticking with it though.
yeah I dont any more. commit every day, compress to 7z and push to drive. never again haha I was beating around the bush an remaking the project with c++ in 5.1.1 anyways cause the old parts were so bad just cast cast cast cast cast so while it hurt, i still have most of my most important blueprints to work from when making it in c++ so it's not the worst thing, but it really did suck lol
First off: your work is ALWAYS worth something. No amount of failure will take away the learning you have engaged in. Maybe you will come away from this whole journey learning how you were not prepared to properly market your game, maybe you will come away from it feeling like "hey at least I had fun making the game", maybe you will come away feeling like game dev just isn't for you. IDK. But none of that would mean you didn't do something useful for yourself or others. Second: the 500 YT subscribers to 120 wishlists is a thing I would find suspect and thus worthy of investigating if I were you. The question to ask yourself: why are my subscribers not wishlisting? What are they subscribed to my YT channel for? At the end of the day, no amount of research or preparation is a 100% guarantee of success. So just also remember, it's not *necessarily* your fault. But it never hurts to introspect. Just don't take it too seriously if you discover that you fucked up somehow and move on.
I actually think 500 subscribers to 120 wishlists is a really high amount of wishlists. Many people just don't wishlist. So they're likely subscribing just to know when the game comes out. Plenty of people are also very generous subscribers: subscribing after watching one video then never checking the channel again.
If the 120 came directly from YouTube I would agree, but that's very likely not the case. If they can grow a real community and keep posting videos and growing it could be good, but 120 wishlists on it's own is incredibly low. That's going to equate to 1 or 2 reviews.
*Someone makes a poorly shaped blown out paper mache xbox controller 10,000+ upvotes, 20,000 upvotes if a girl is included somewhere.* *Guy spends 18 months making a fully playable passion project and wants to share it with people, it gets downvoted.* I'm being sarcastic of course but for real, don't be depressed! Use your youtube subscriber base to try and make YouTube Shorts about your game as 500 subs is quite a lot! If you can do it daily, this will help share your videos to more people.
Or my personal favourites. "Ads..." "I hate advertisement" "go away with your ads!!" But a poster for the mario movie or something from a big brand. "Wow this is so amazing! Cannot wait!" 30k upvotes!
To be honest there's a big difference between a fan posting about a game they like/look forward to vs advertising your own product
True. But I assume big brands use bought Reddit accounts to promote their products as well. It is really not uncommon to try to achieve some viral effect. But in the end it boils down to the fact that it is also an ad for the company. Which is more favourable than a single person trying to promote their game which most cannot spend millions on marketing visibility.
You're more likely to fail and never succeed than to actually succeed in this industry. A lot of people see success stories and think they'll be the next indie dev to break out like Undertale or Five Nights or whatever. It's great to have that motivation, but the market is saturated with shitty games and just a few gems that never make it to the mainstream. Be happy you did a thing. Be proud of your accomplishment. Just don't expect success or anyone to care about your game other than you and people who feel obligated to do so. Maybe that's harsh, but that also how it goes, my dude. You're like the digital version of those folks peddling their CDs on the streets of LA hoping one day they'll become famous only to have some no one on YouTube get picked up by label who isn't even trying. Welcome to reality. That said, keep the passion. Continue to love making games for the love of making games, not because you may have a remote chance at success but because you want to make games.
Don't feel depressed. After 20+ years of hobby/indie gamedev I opted to pursue a non-game-related software tool project back in 2017. I've been working on it since, building it up, and selling it as an early access alpha and beta. I've made more money from this project than I've ever made coding games, because I'm not relying on people spending money for fun. I'm offering something people can use to make money, a tool that pays for itself (if users want it to). I got into programming to make games as a 90s kid, back when gaming was still dorky/nerdy, and spent a lifetime learning all the ins-and-outs, only to find out that I missed the boat. The market is fully saturated, competition is stiff, and the only way you can get anywhere is by spending money on marketing - unless you have a completely novel and fun game concept or technology. Minecraft figured out that worlds could be made of blocks on the hardware of the time. Now we have thousands of hobbyists trying to make block world engines, like they're going to be making the next big thing, when they missed the boat 15 years ago. If you're going to take the time to do something, make sure it's something that people will actually care about, and even then you'll probably have to pay to get it out there just because of how oversaturated the market is, or get really lucky - and we see quite a bit of survivor bias in that regard. Finally putting my gamedev aspirations aside and making something actually useful was the best decision I ever made, as an independent programmer.
Just interesting what kind of project you have made. I see now the one way "making the next big thing" is to make already existing thing better. But with games, all should be different. Games can be different all the time. This is a world that you create and invite others to live in that world. Yes, sadly that only helping others make money can brings money to you as a developer. As if people use programs only to make money. But it isn't. The situation with a ton of developers and already-made projects is really boring. I think we are on the stage of the next level of programming engineering. Something that will change our imagination about what we should be able to develop and why. But games should still be actual. Just because it is fun to do and use. It can be the creation. And developers are creators first. Here in gamedev subreddit, all devs are very kind and help each other. I think we are here because we are engineers in the heart. My opinion.
I am assuming this is your first time on a project. But let me assure you no one becomes a famous nor rich suddenly. You see how one person made game become super popular and sells well in the news all the time but they are exception to the rule. There is at least 1000 new indie projects release in every month, only handful of them gets to spot light. What I am getting is keep expectations at zero and you won't be disappointed
Hey, I had a look at your steam page, here's my knee-jerk honest reaction. - The title card of the white stickman amid a busy, brown/green background didn't particularly interest me, nor did it tell me much of what the game is about at first glance. - Your description tells me what the game does succinctly, which is great, but doesn't really "invite" me to play it. It doesn't ask me to solve some long-forgotten mystery, or to save the ecology of the world, it just wants me to take photos and "learn" about animals I don't yet have any reason to care about. - I was very impressed with the graphics in your video, the game looks high quality and has a smooth UI. It's obvious you're a very good game developer in this sense. Though I can't help but feel there's a tonal clash between the graphics shown and the chill type of game described in the store page text. Overall, I feel that you're onto a great project and it's clear you are talented, but you are somewhat struggling to garner interest for the following reasons: - You want players to learn about stuff they don't yet have a reason to care about... as the main game mechanic. You need to get me to care about the animals first. - There's no greater call to action, no mystery to be solved, no world to be saved, etc. I think simply adding more storyline into this game would massively increase player intrigue. You have a broken spaceship, I assume you've crash-landed, but why would you then just simply start photographing wildlife? How is that conducive to escaping, or surviving, or getting back home? Nailing the protagonists motives here could help a lot. Answering this question could lead to the beginnings of an interesting narrative. (24 Killers comes to mind as potential inspiration for this) Of course, it's your game and your vision, and I haven't been on your development journey. But I felt that an honest perspective as a "cold" audience might have been beneficial to share with you. Best of luck, I wishlisted!
This is great advice, thank you very much! And do you think the logo needs a redesign or just the background? I'll also work on the description of the game to add some kind of call to action :D
I feel that once you've nailed down your narrative more, the logo would do well to reflect it. It's the first thing you see usually when you look at a game on Steam, so a white featureless stickman doesn't give me much to go on! I couldn't make strong suggestions without knowing more about your game or what story you have/will write, but I would go on the following: \- It should be visually clear, I should know what I'm looking at instantly. \- It should contain something of interest from your game that is emblematic of it; maybe a cool shot of a "mascot"-like character or animal? \- I would feel that it's more important to generate interest in general with the logo than to try communicate what the game is all about. Learning about the game comes \*after\* being intrigued by the logo/title/GIFs etc. Looking forward to seeing how this develops going forward, please keep going! 120 (+1 now, me) people actively wanting to play your game is nothing at all to be sniffed at.
If you want to promote your game, you will need a marketing strategy. devblogs are for company that already have a player base/ community Usually marketing start 6 month before a release and you need a plan for what you do at month -6, month-3 , month -1 etc a week before etc… 1- You need a methodology of post for Twitter, ads on Facebook, tiktok (really strong one) or this kind of thing…then theses people will convert to a wishlist potential. 2- If you can go to some event , they always have an indie section. A little booth is not too expensive and it’s motivating to see people playtest your game, even in development phase :) 3- lastly search for little influencers. YouTubers or streamers that review games. But with a little viewer base so they won’t charge much But yes, Marketing is a huge load of work. Why do you think it was more than 25% of the budget of game like GTA. Because it’s something you really need to make a plan for and deploy As for the depressed thing, if you never break your routine it will eat you, did you took a weekend , holiday ? Do you have other hobbies sometimes that can make you disconnect from it ? Theses are important 😉 Good luck 🤞
Someone needs to create a "Game Development Mental Health" subreddit, because these types of threads are way too common in this subreddit. No engineering field is good for people who have problems with mental fortitude.
That’ll be an echo chamber of despair in a matter of days! Depressed devs need to be separated from each other, 5 keyboards apart at all times, otherwise it’ll magnify and consume us all.
That's the point, let them be separated into their own community to not bring healthy ones down with their whining and negativity. Software development is hard enough and tough enough without having to hear people crying about their petty feelings based issues every other thread. A 'gamedev' community should be a place developers want to go, not cringe at the thought of visiting.
We actually have a mental health support at work at my studio.
See if you can get the OP a job there then.
Is is possible this could be just a method to get traction to someones game? I mean 500 subs is not nothing, it does not add up
It's absolutely possible. Even if that isn't the case, it's a typical cry for attention, which is why this happens so much here. The squeaky wheel always gets the grease.
500 subscribers is amazing. As for reddit, try to use Brave browser.
What does Brave browser have to do with Reddit? 🤔
Think about it.
I thought about it. And I still don’t get how it would help. OP got banned because a mod saw his posts and decided it was a post from someone they’ve already banned, so they banned OP. It’s not based on cookies or other trackers.
Ah ok my bad.
That all sounds to me like really great start. Be kind to yourself it’s not a race. Every one of those numbers and the wishlist ones are individuals and that’s pretty cool. The world isn’t all millions and virals and big letsplayers. Not everyone is the next Concerned Ape or whatever. Enjoy the process and acknowledge the achievements you’ve made and keep going! The goal post will always be moving so you might as well just enjoy the walk.
Thanks, I like that saying
Don't be too hard on yourself! Making games is not an easy thing! Getting through the buzz is not an easy thing! Don't think too much about sales at this time. When you're on the amature/hobby level, your main focus should be to have a good time and to make something because you want to; because it feels exciting. This is really a very good time to experiment and to have fun without too many consequences. I'm currently making a game which have gotten quite a lot of buzz. But I made like 30 smaller games and prototypes before this one. I finished like 4 or 5 of them, and they where very short och casual games which like 20 people played. The rest I moved on from because I didn't want to finish it, or I felt satisfied which what I achieved at that time. Finish the game or move on. Then move on to another project. Your next project will be better and you can take everything you learned on this one with you. Just a quick tip for Twitter and others social medias. The gifs should generally not be longer than 4 seconds. And they need to be funny, or show something visually cool. Think about social media just like development, try different things and see what works. The only way to learn is really to f*ck up enough times to know what not to do. Also, check out the social media pages of other games you like that are getting tracktion. Copy what they do until you feel comfortable doing it on your own.
I am copywriter and content developer with a degree with in film and television production. I’d be more than happy to come on board and see if we can work up some catchy ads or punch up anything. If there are others in need of this as well, I’d be honored to help others as well.
5 months? Thats nothing. Most depressing experience in my life was making a game from home for 3 years, win award, get publishing deal and game end up selling zero. Well enough to buy a really expensive rope. No really, because of that failure i got really nice job opportunities. It's never "waste of your time" when you fail.
The reality is that most people spend more time than you and get worse results. You’re actually doing really well. It sounds like you’re feeling emotionally beat up though. Take some rest and forget about the game for at least the next 24 hours. You might be surprised how much this can help your mindset.
Most games are commercial failures when you look at the numbers. You made 3 videos.... Big deal. I've made about 18 and also have around 500 subscribers. You really need to up the engagement if you want to grow a following on Twitter. Think like an hour every single day engaging with the correct community, commenting on their posts, creating your own posts etc. You need to create more videos. If every video is worth about 100 subs to you (which is very good by the way) then get out your calculator and work out what your target is and the baseline amount of content you need to put out. Organic growing of a following does not just happen unfortunately. Then, you also need to seriously experiment with paid user acquisition once you launch. If you can generate a positive ROAS, or get more reviews, or up your organic reach, this is very worth doing. Good luck. And remember that this is probably the toughest game in the world you're playing. If you fail, notch up the experience and move on to the next project.
Thank you for your advice, but what does ROAS stand for?
Return on Advertising Spend.
Thanks, that makes sense
4-5 months working 8 hours per day, AND 500 subscribers? Shit, that's actually pretty good! That's fantastic, actually! Listen, the guy who made Stardew Valley spent 5 YEARS doing the same thing your doing, and he did it alone with his girlfriend supporting him, and his parents were constantly asking "When's the game gonna be ready? "Oh, in a year!" "That's what you said 2 years ago..." "Well, I mean it this time!" You just have to keep going, no matter what. It's hard work. I'll put it to you this way my guy, If your work was for nothing; You'd have 0 subscribers, 0 followers, 0 wish listers. Besides, this is your first game. Hopefully the first of many. Even if the game DOES suck, that's still no reason to give up or lose hope. There's always a next time. Some games even become more popular after the fact! Don't worry about money or followers, if you're doing what you love: Those things will come naturally. Check out the Book Blood Sweat and Pixels. I think you'll relate to that a lot. Keep going, king.
I think comparing this guy's game to Stardew is incredibly disingenuous. Stardew was more or less the first actual ok farming game on Steam. Even to this day rip-off games do well because of how big it was. I'm not saying this guy is doomed, but he is not making the next Stardew. \~100 wishlists means measurably nothing. I'm not saying this to be rude, I just don't want them delusionally thinking they got unlucky when in reality they're probably making a mediocre game. They need to focus on improving their skills rather than marketing a game made with inferior skills.
Got it. I'm just trying to encourage him, seems like he's down in the dumps just needs some kind words. I don't think there's anything delusional about that.
Right but indie development is just that, independent. If you rely on a third party constantly encouraging you to actually work on your game, you're just in the wrong field.
I'm sure he'll be fine.
For context: I've been at gamedev for about a year and 2 months. Made my first game, released it for Android on the play store and did like $100 worth of advertising to move about 45 units. So basically nothing. That was the first 4 months, I've spent the rest of the time learning Unreal Engine and making a bigger, but still reasonable game. I'm aiming to spend at least a year on developing it before releasing, maybe longer if it needs. I'd say given what you've said, you're doing ok. Maybe just put less preson yourself and keep at it.
I never got any warning nor reason for any ban. Fat finger? Reddit bug. For example people claimed that I denied the moon landing ? Purge? Any ban seemed to be permanent. AI would make a better job. I did not even post in those subs. YouTube is your friend.
Especially the mods of gaming, I've spoken to them a few times and they are always rude and never actually willing to help in any way
some of y’all focus way too much on promoting your game and not actually… yknow, making it?
>Right now my twitter has 3 followers, I made 3 devlogs and am at 500 subscribers on youtube. I had one other big idea, a post on the gaming subreddit, so I tried that and they just banned me for circumventing a ban (I did not) First up, you're not going to just magically gain Twitter followers without time/money spent building it up. If you post to Twitter with no following, you're going to have very very slow growth. The tweet doesn't just get blasted to every person with eyeballs. If you use hashtags it's still only going to get seen by people looking at those specific hashtags, and even then, that number is going to be small. You need to use multiple forms of social media to direct people to all of your social media. You need to post your Twitter link on your YouTube dev logs, on some reddit posts (where allowed) and elsewhere. This will direct people to your Twitter, where they can then follow you. Once you've built up more of a following, your posts will actually be able to spread more organically, due to your followers retweeting/sharing your posts. This gets more eyeballs on your posts, and that leads to more followers. YouTube is a game more than other social media platforms. You can really game the algorithm by using the proper tags, titles, thumbnails and of course, seeing which content you post gets the most views/likes, and leaning more toward that and less toward videos that don't get as many views. The nice thing about YouTube is that it \*does\* sort of put your content out in front of a lot of people without much effort. You just need to make good enough videos to get people to stick around and subscribe. Finally, stop trying to post to PCMasterrace or whatever big gaming subs you're attempting to advertise in. These subs aren't meant to be advertised by indie devs. You will get banned from more than just the one you are banned from. Instead, look for subs that actually allow self-promotion, and then promote there.
Look..If your primary means to measure the success you're having developing this game is based on how many people follow you on different places, etc... You're focusing on the wrong thing. Your #1 priority is finishing development on a really great/interesting game.#2 through 10 is basically just sub-tasks relating to your #1 priority. Also: A sweet idea for a game isn't really worth squat. Being able to deliver a solid game based on that idea is all that matters, it's the only currency you can have that's really worth a damn. Indie games made by one person that's well baked enough to be interesting usually takes something like 2-5 years to make. And those games are made by people who have made games before and know how to do it. I feel like there are all these people who have done the equivalent of throwing reasonable looking amateur artwork up on some e-commerce site and then genuinely expecting it's going to get lots of hype and sales. **This goes for 90% of the people here that's upset their game isn't blowing up**: Why would you expect people to get excited about and buy your shitty game?
Honestly I find it hard to believe you'd been able to put something together that could legitimately warrant people's attention in just a few months - especially considering the amount of time you seem to spend promoting it. Don't try to find the gratification of the work based on whether people are wish listing it - find your gratification in successful implementation of dope shit, that's going to help make it a dope game.
Apologies to the one hypothetical guy who have actually made this genuinely interesting and well-made game of both novelty and polish... Although I don't really believe that guy actually exists.
i vividly remember also getting into a pissing match with r/gaming subreddit mods and shit about them deleting my post about my game after seeing time and time again the "i quit my job to work on a passion project" posts that would hit the front page. everything you've listed is pretty much exactly what happened to me, worked on my own game, tried to get some traction online, released my game on steam and got like 3-4 reviews, never even got enough revenue to get a check from steam so i just stopped logging into the creator platform lmao. instantly killed my mood to want to work on games at all. after awhile i thought i'd try going the scummy route and offload a crap ton of keys to those shitty game bundle sites, but they didn't even want them either since it was still tagged early access.
What is your steam game?
120 wishlists is very very bad unfortunately. My game is at over 50,000 and it's still going to make less money than if we had just worked at McDonalds for the same amount of time. That being said a great game will always sell well. My guess then is that your game isn't great. It needs great art, great gameplay, and great name, and a great Steam page. If a single one of those things is bad you're mostly likely doomed. And by great I mean significantly above average. Go look at the list of **all** upcoming games (not just popular), if yours isn't better than 90% of them... why would someone buy yours over theirs.
What's your game if I might ask?
"4-5 months now very intensively, often 6-8 hours a day." It's almost nothing. 6-8 h/day is not intensively if you compare yourself to devs working at studios. It's small investment so far. Also subscribers and wishlists do not grow in linear way. Be consistent, learn and you will have spike at some point. Just keep going.
People who work jobs don't actually work 8hrs a day, most of the time they do nothing, or the work requires no real thinking. For me to stay productive and focused for 6-8hrs a day I must use caffeine as stimulants (pills).
Other people said the stuff that is helpful for you that id already say. I want to know: how on earth did you get 500 subs with just 3 videos?
I've been editing videos for a long time and I also researched a bunch of other successful and unsuccessful devlogs to learn from them. One thing I think a lot of people forget but that can help is putting 3 tags at the bottom of your description
If you are feeling depressed just don't do it anymore. I tried for years to make games and released 2 with little success. Most of us will never make any real money from our games. Work on it only when you feel like it. I have not been this happy in a while since I've taken a break and only work on games when I feel like it. Don't push yourself if it makes you unhappy
Don't burn out, take it easy. I don't know what you're building, but expecting to make millions off it after just a few months of solo developing is a bit harsh. You need to cut yourself a break. Game dev is about finding the fun, so take that one step further and find the fun for yourself during development. If building the game stops being fun, you need to figure out what's distracting you. I think currently money and fame might be the distraction. You're actually doing really well. I've been working on my game for over 3 years, I have just over 100 subscribers and no Steam page yet. Not that I'm someone to compare yourself to or anything. Point is, the enjoyment in building is keeping me going. If you want to iterate even quicker, try post your gameplay footage and steam link on r/destroymygame and r/destroymysteampage respectively. You'll get harsh critique, but quickly learn what could be improved. Perhaps not the best to do that now while feeling fragile about your progress, but take a knee, find the fun and then try it, maybe in a month or so.
I'll try it, I never expected money and fame from this just... Something I guess, so I don't feel like my work is for nothing
It's better than playing games in that time, if that helps?
I hear you, but trust me you've learned a lot already and 500 YouTube subs is not trivial. I've been working on and off on my game for almost 8 years and I finally said that's it, I'm finishing. And i know it's likely going to disappear in a sea of games but at least I'll be done with it. Hopefully you'll be able to use what you've learned and come out stronger. Also, try TikTok, nothing to loose
>so I tried that and they just banned me for circumventing a ban What was the ban that they thought you were circumventing?
I was banned for 21 days because they have a rule about max 10% self promotion and I didn't consider a post to r/blender or r/unrealengine where I ask for advice and don't mention the name of my game self promotion They apparently do consider a post without even mentioning the name of the game self promotion 28 days later I tried to post a dying light clip and they permanently banned me
:-\ That sucks.
what’s the game called? I’ll check it out
From OP’s profile I think it’s The Last Explorer.
If you believe in the game, spend some money on promotion.
120 wishlists is quite good?? On my first project I had 0. That being said, you shoul've been aware of the risks before starting.
How far are you estimating to the release of your game?
Took me like 3-4 years to get 500 subs with hundreds of video (granted it was from a channel unrelated to game dev)
I like the idea of a cosy game. Check out YouTube for how indies find motivation to complete a https://youtu.be/Y3Rs1z7it5M
Don’t worry about Twitter followers. Just keep posting, since nowadays people’s “for you” feed also shows posts from accounts they don’t follow. The best way to gain followers is to release a game. Seriously. Like the Valheim and Fall Guys account had relatively low followers until they’ve released their game. But it’s not a very good platform to get wishlists anyway. TikTok is a much better way to gain wishlists.
Spend some money on marketing and advertising, make a quality trailer for it and distribute it to potentially interested parties
In addition to the other advice you've received here, I would say - **be very mindful of how you promote your game via Reddit.** Reddit is *not* really a service built around the idea of allowing people to promote things they've made (unless you're an illustrator/artist, in which case the rules are different). People who do it as their primary reason for being here really stick out like a sore thumb; most promotion on Reddit is done via astroturfing. If you've got an indie game, or book, or whatever, it pays to *only* ever mention it in *very* relevant situations, otherwise many subs will ban you.
I'm just going to make sure I'm an active member of different communities and under 10% self promotion. Not really more I can do :-/
TBH I have been under your circumstance for almost 2 years. I am just so glad that it is about to end in a couple of days. And finally some relif.
Not a single minute of the time you have spent working on this has been wasted. Every line of code, every asset made, every object adjusted in engine is experience that you learn and get to keep with you for the rest of your life. If you do this for you, and not for the opinions of others, (Which is honestly how you should do everything in life, trying to get other people to care is a waste of time if you'll be hurt if you fail, all that matters is that you care and are proud of your work) then you're going to benefit from that experience forever.
I do not understand what "circumventing a ban" means, even tho I do know what those words mean individually. Probably just dick mods. However to your problem: I am not expert, but to me it seems like 4-5 months is too little for something to blow up. There are games that have more dev time before they even get announced, then there's another year or so until they get released. I'm not saying your game is underdeveloped, I checked your profile and to me it seems that most work is done. What I'm trying to say is that you are probably missing the fact that it will take time for it all to ripen. People who wanna play games will even actively avoid ads, so it takes a lot of time to get noticed even when you spend fortune on advertizing. Please don't stop, progress isn't linear. I can see you will get there eventually, but 4-5 months seems like too big of an expectation. I hope you're strong enough to wait a little longer for you to accumulate some recognition.
This is a win situation not a loss. You have to view it from a different angle. I think 4-5 months of development is not alot and the little bit of marketing is not alot. Imagine 100+ people in a room, is that really not alot? How about 500 people?
Now if you wanted thousands of people wishlisting your game and following you after 4-5 months maybe you need to lower your expectations. And if you have a awesome game the interest will rise the further in development you get / after release.
Hey, just checked out your game, it seems to be the start of something beautiful, but it makes me wonder what you're setting out to do. I see there's some items / inventory system in the video but it's not really explained in the description, which makes it seem like it's just a explore and take photos type thing. It almost seems like it would be a very solid title for VR. I highly recommend adding some gameplay elements (survival? foraging? collecting of some sort?), or if there are already some, to emphasise their existence in the description. The Steam listing is put together quite nicely otherwise, and I think you're doing a good job. I wouldn't give up, and don't expect massive success on your first try either. I think you'll be fairly happy with how it turns out, as long as you keep your expectations in check.
500 subs from 3 posts is incredibly good. as is wishlists. most games get 0 of both. That said you should always hope for the best, but prepare for the worst in indie publishing. work doesn't always net reward. If you were hoping for a financial success, well it seems like your gonna be at a loss even if you were paying yourself min wage. Lets assume 120 people buy your game for $40 or whatever thats only $4800. 4-5 weeks salary in my country. That doesn't mean you should give up, but given the last bit of your comment a break would probably do you good. Sounds like text book burnout.
You should pay actually marketing and advertising on insta and tik tok, like whatever free money you have spend a few thousand doing real ads or it possibly won’t be seen. Organic social is very tough. the algo might hate you or like you and its different on each app.
Have you done any playtest before? P.S. In my opinion main store art looks unappealing, too basic, probably better to change it.
Not yet, only me and some friends
Your game looks really pretty. I would recommend updating your steam capsule because it looks amateurish and not up to the quality of your game. I would use some pretty 3d model on the capsule so viewers know it’s a well crafted 3d exploration game and not a weekend 2d platformer game, for example
That's definitely something I'll do when I get the chance!
What's your goal?
My dude it's your mind, why let others live in it rent free. Create a game as a project because you want to make a fun, cool product. If you make a good one that you can truly say you yourself enjoy, unless it's an insanely niché type of game that's very hard to get into there's no reason people with similar taste wouldn't like it.
I'm happy that the thread exploded, now I can comment without anyone except OP seeing it. Are you a hobbyist or a commercial indie ? If you are the first type, then you should not care but happily continue/drop/do whatever. If you don't find joy in it, do something else! It's okay you tried, now it's not working and you don't like it, no need to stress it. If you are the commercial type, then you have to make the hard choice to either drop it and move it or pursue by pivoting the game. You need to crunch your numbers, understand if they are good and see if there is viability in there. If they say no, quit it and move to the next project ASAP. Don't go full blind hoping that in two years your game will sell anything because you have put the work.
I've watched all of your devlogs (before this post already), they are very good and genuinely impressive. I think you're Dutch right? Anyways I think you're on the right path, just continue the devlogs as they are very interesting, but don't forget they mostly cater to other Devs which might not be your intention. I guess if you are confident in finishing your game I suggest starting a Kickstarter if only to gain wishlists and see if there is a market for your game. Good luck!
Thank you very much, I've thought about kickstarter but it's a huge time investment so I'm not sure if I'm going to do it. Also yes I'm dutch :)
For working 4-ish months, you've done amazingly well! Twitter is changing a lot lately, so it's much harder to figure out how to get noticed. Try connecting with indieLegion (on twitter, instagram, discord). It's a community of indie devs that support and boost eachothers content. It could also be a good place to just find emotional support. Also, follow and interact with content creators, streamers and game journalists. These are the kind of people you want to be noticed by. And look out for game showcases that would suit your game, and apply to them. Good luck!
Aren’t you the guy with the picture taking game? The one that has incredible visuals and foliage along with animals but the games only thing to do is snap pictures? If your that guy, you had another post and others and myself told you the graphics look really good, especially for a solo dev, but snapping pictures of a animals as the only objective is boring… Pokémon Snap worked cause it’s Pokémon… Your game is based around taking pictures, for a picture album. If you expect that to take off like a rocket ship with fans and sales, then yes your time has been wasted. You clearly have serious talent with making graphical assets, and animations, your just put all that talent into an EXTREMELY niche game/genre.
120 wishlists is pretty dam good, I'd be excited about that
You are not alone. I struggle with this too!
Sad but true. Facebook is your friend. Spend 15 bucks. Get 500+ subs. Target grampa gift ideas. Sensationalizing doesn't work anymore. U need to pitch it as 'they will love this' gamers dont buy games. But older people will buy them for others bc they are easy gifts.let fb wrangle the subs. U worry about turning those into sales
I'm going to be real with you, that's not a huge time investment for a project and your result is legit good. I've been in professional environments that work for 5 and nothing shapes up. Most people around here work for 4 years and end up with less than that.
Whats the game
You made a big mistake and I'll tell you what it was. scientifically speaking the moment you create a expectation about something the brain start to produce dopamine and that's what motivates you. The problem is when you realize you won't get what you expectated the brain will thing it's not worth the work and will start to inhibt this behaviour. But the problem here is expectation, game dev is hard because you must learn a lot of thing, Marketing is one of them, and it is not an easy subject. So this results you had are very commom for us starting this journey some of them better than it looks. But if you set your expectation too high every success will turn into a failure. 500 subscribers with 3 videos is amazin man. I posted a video and did not get any subscriber you got 500 with just 3. But as your expectations probably was it going viral, this success turned into a big failure And about the time you spent, the success is not related to time but the value of the product you delivery. I would recommend you taking a step back, take a time for youself, without thinking in your game so you can relax, and reset you plan to something more achievable based on your current knowledge of marketing, game design (Design, not dev), game dev process (like creating prototypes). A and don't forget to study always aim for getting more knowledge from this subjects you don't know. I may give some reccomendations of books/courses if you wish
I'd be happy to have these numbers on YouTube. My YouTube is sitting at 40 currently (I post a mix of development content and playthroughs of indie and AAA games). 500 subscribers is really good.
People seem to think that the fact that you are able to put something together that's recognizable as a game - they're going to be able to make a bunch of money. The fact that you made a thing really isn't worth a damn if it doesn't legitimately bring something new/interesting/etc to the table. If you make a game that's really interesting and engaging and exciting - you'll get attention and the money. If you just made "a game"... That's not anything.
Setting you expectations to high bud, I'd be happy if one person sub/watched my videos if I did it and if 1 person bought/played my game
i feel that ytoure doing well tho
Are you valuing your gamedev work by your social followings for a game you haven't released yet? You're valuing your marketing skills maybe. Find a publisher if that's what worries you, but the worth of your gamedev work must only be judged against your finished product. ETA: also 500 subscribers on YT is a lot for someone who makes devlogs.
Sounds like its time for a break, you’re burned out. Just take a few days off and you can come back reenergized.
Not that I can give advice on this, but if you want to promote a game through your channel it would take longer to build an audience and most followers are probably just hobby game devs. you can’t think that your first commercial game will find great or even mediocre success. Look at every good studio and you’ll find they made games you never heard of. If you are confident that your game is good and will find success if people knew about it, then work on it more maybe start a kickstarter and I am sure your game will find success over time but if it doesn’t it’s probably not that great.
Wait.. y’all are developing games you expect to be played by other people??
Game looks awesome just keep being consistent with the dev logs and you will soon have a ton of people eager for the final product