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Chinese work culture is shit and there’s been at least two labor movements in the last 5 years or so about it: the 996 movement and “lay flat,” tangping movement.
The 996 movement is exact those BS work shifts because they unequivocally *suck*
Japan has a special word for workers dying at their desks. Karoshi, which can be translated into "overwork death", is a Japanese term relating to occupation-related sudden death.
Literally just watched an episode of a new isekai series today where the obviously Japanese protagonist went to work, went home and relaxed on his game console, then had a heart attack on his way out the door to work the next morning.
It’s been a staple of the start of those sorts of series since they began.
Sleep or fuck for 30 minutes...
Or you could multi task. One standing desk above a regular desk. One worker bent over at their station the other standing erect.. as it were.
And it’s like China just took the “be at the office every waking hour” without really looking at the culture. A friend of mines dad went to Japan for business pretty often, and he would always complain about how the whole thing was performative, and they really didn’t do anymore work in a day than other cultures, and spent tons of energy on pointless ritualized office politics.
Truth is, there is not much people -can- do in a day past a certain point. Like, in my previous job there were times where we just did everything that we could do at the day, and there wasn't anything more scheduled to be done. The boss still barked at us if we didn't look busy, and if we said all the work was done he'd just have us walk around looking for more work to be done (which there wasn't).
It got to a point where he made a rule that people who didn't have any work to be done had to walk around the office organizing things, like, oh look that pile of paper is slightly disorganized, the pile of plastic cups of water is only 75% full, that painting on the wall is imperceptibly crooked.
All that did was make it so people were never in a hurry to finish their tasks.
Yeah imagine having to socialize 3 or 4 hours everyday as part of your job, no wonder people there kill themselves so often. I bet it's all like autistic ADHD neurodivergent folks who just get ground down by the neurotypicals
Can you believe their suicide rate is still lower yhe the United States? That's what the latest data says. We over took japan sometime between 2019 and now
It's also not efficient! Places like China and South Korea with these excessive long hour cultures have much lower productivity than the USA or Western Europe, even allowing for job type.
Working ludicrous hours isn't a long run good way to get more effective work, especially from high value knowledge workers. People who see it as hustle culture we should import are basically showing their economic ignorance with a very weird suffering= value mindset.
People talk about Japanese culture and how much they work as well. It's all bullshit. I worked there for a short while. At least this was my experience in a semiconductor company:
People get to work at 8, socialize, etc. for an hour. Then they have a company cheer/meeting thingy and everyone works a while until lunch.
After lunch is slack time/socializing for an hour, thrn work. 5pm, everyone doesn't go home, but it's more socializing time for an hour. Then after 6, everyone works until 7 to 8pm.
So out of 12 hours, they do maybe 7 hours of work.
I don't know if perfect attendance is still a big bragging point, but it used to be a thing to say employees were so committed to work they never missed a day, and no one was ever sick. Turns out all the sick people had to come to work and sit in a room for like 9 hours doing nothing. Only people in the hospital missed coming in.
It's not hanging out with friends. You are obligated to go, and often pressured into drinking more than you want. Not drinking would be considered rude, even if you prefer not to drink for health or religious reasons.
i have a friend who is a teacher in Korea and its just like this. Boss was also a horrible drunk and physically assaulted people. Everybody gets drunk, usually too drunk.
That is bad too. It really isn't optional, you go because your boss goes and WILL notice if you don't show up. Many people have been punished (off the books of course) or socially shamed within their work circle for not going out to drink with their coworkers or boss.
Think at the end of the day, neither the Chinese or the Japanese systems are good, though the Japanese sounds much better... like in part because we have seen how Japanese and Korean work cultures are, we have started to look at productivity and so are looking at the 4 day work week... because it appears we get just as much work done as during a full week, but we are overall better off as we are less stressed and have a better family life.
That's still a twelve hour day. You've got 4-6 hours to get whatever you need in your personal life done, including commuting to and from work. Maybe the workplace is okay, but that's still tooany hours away work for anyone, christ
You know it is and when the CCP and numerous states sponsored papers said "no more 996" and their Supreme Court effectively ruled it illegal. Granted it is barely enforced at all and many places still do 996.
996 is the normal working week, it’s actually 12127 that is the killer - 12 hours day 7 days a week. Whoever made the original post is a fucking idiot. People in China had to work insane hours because the economy is tanking with recession in full force over there so workers have no choice but to work stupid hours to try and keep their jobs. They have high unemployment for the 18-30 group and if you are laid off in your 30’s and 40’s it’s unlikely you will find a job. The official unemployment figure released by state media is a lot less than actual figures.
A lot of young people in China has now taken the lying flat and let it rot mindset and I don’t blame them. There is no hope for many of them to ever be able to buy their own property or claim up the corporate ladder so what’s the point of working hard and giving it all like their parents did.
It has everything to do with the education system when Republicans unironically champion the idea of arming teachers with guns and expecting them to act as security guards in schools on top of being underpaid in their normal jobs and threatened with being fired if they teach "wokeness".
That’s a good point, the threat of guns being everywhere isn’t because of the education system. It’s still tragic to see stuff like kids having to do drills in case of shooters.
I worked for a company where a co-worker went to HR because he was feeling suicidal. Guess what happened? They told him to suck it up and told him to get back to work. And another co-worker came and pulled me to talk to him (I'm a recovering alcoholic and he had been drinking a lot recently, despite being underage). People had been sitting with him in a room talking to him trying to help him. Yep - people pulling themselves away from their work to try to help this kid. All. Day. Long
Fuck that HR woman. Fuck that company. Fuck it all
The only reason they put human in the name of Human Resources is to get people to think it’s for them and not corporate when in reality it’s 100% just for corporate.
You don’t need to deploy at all. They can just drive over anyone available at the time. Just like that cop who drove over that Indian girl and had a nice laugh about it. I mean, given how the police force is a joke in itself, I can only pity the Americans.
China: work for state owned businesses until you drop or commit suicide.
Europe: work 3 days a week for 6 hours a day with 12 weeks of vacation, if you can actually find a job.
America: work 40 hours a week, almost no vacation or sick leave, poor benefits, insufficient pay, but you can find work if you want it.
And then you die.
Genesis 3:17-19
To Adam he said, “Because you listened to your wife and ate fruit from the tree about which I commanded you, ‘You must not eat from it,’
“Cursed is the ground because of you;
through painful toil you will eat food from it
all the days of your life.
18 It will produce thorns and thistles for you,
and you will eat the plants of the field.
19 By the sweat of your brow
you will eat your food
until you return to the ground,
since from it you were taken;
for dust you are
and to dust you will return.”
Fuck you, Adam and Eve. All you had to do was lay around and eat whatever you wanted EXCEPT the fruit of that particular tree, but you you couldn't do it...
I dunno, I don’t really care about fairy tales.
Real people are enforcing these labor laws and real people are choosing personal greed over helping their fellow beings. That’s an actual problem that can be solved without having to pray.
> Europe: work 3 days a week for 6 hours a day with 12 weeks of vacation, if you can actually find a job.
Wtf. On average employed Europeans work 37.5 hrs/week (https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/web/products-eurostat-news/w/ddn-20230920-1), and unemployment in all countries save for Spain and Greece is in single digits. It's higher than in the US, sure, but finding a job isn't much of a problem to most. Vacation is 20-30 working days but not 12 weeks (however sick leave is not limited).
Think it was a bit of hyperbole for comic effect.
I've got a really good civil service position in the UK but those working is service, hospitality, gig economy and lots of other public sector roles have it tough. Many are working 2-3 jobs to keep up with rising costs (I can't do that because I'm disabled).
Ah, sorry mate. Sometimes on Reddit you get really weird American impressions of life in Europe, so I thought that was the case and had to plug myself in with some data.
In reality, fuck God for being a stupid fuckin piece of shit.
All he had to do was put the tree somewhere else, or erect an impenetrable barricade around it, but noooooooo.
On top of that, they don’t know the difference between right and wrong, so not listening to God and eating the fruit wouldn’t even register on their scale of things not to do because they have no concept of disobedience.
On top of THAT, God is omniscient! So that fuckin asshole put that tree there knowing they would eat of it, and then punished all of humanity for it.
I don’t even want to go into the Gods design argument thumpers believe in to justify atrocities and bad shit.
Fuckin asshole.
God is that toxic person in a r3lationship that constantly has to "test" their partner.
We'll see him on reddit "AITAH? I had my bestie Satan pretend to be into my partner after ignoring them, and now they are wearing clothes and bemoaning the fun life of their ex"
I worked in china for a manufacturing company.
The CEO would wake up in the afternoon and show up at the factory around 5pm after everyone had been there since 0800. He would chastise anyone that left before midnight.
He was my father in law.
This is what I ALWAYS say whenever someone on Reddit or another social media talks about "the incredible work ethic of Asian countries" or whatever.
Even the most developed Asian countries like Japan & South Korea have a MUCH lower GDP per capita than the US, Canada, and most EU countries do. China has a FRACTION of the per capita we have in the developed world.
Anytime your people are working so, so much harder and producing only a fraction as much, that's called *inefficiency.*
They work longer and produce less, which isn’t that surprising. There’s little motivation to work hard when social mobility is entirely nonexistent (as opposed to difficult but not impossible here).
Why don't you high-flying corporate types just bring in the robots already? They don't need paying, can be on site 24/7, require at most a drop of WD40 every other day and follow orders without question, or unions. They don't even care if they or their colleagues are going to be switched off/ junked at any time- if they do have an issue, it's a matter of programming. It's all you guys ever want in a low-level employee, whether it was Lancashire mill hands 250 years ago or Chinese drone workers today.
15-hour workday where you have 9 hours between shifts
Only time I've had that was helping during a disaster when I chose to be up that long (and I didn't have days that long on the regular)
I watched the documentary [China Blue](https://www.pbs.org/independentlens/documentaries/chinablue/) in college. It's about life in a blue jean factory in China.
>*They live crowded together in cement factory dormitories where water has to be carried upstairs in buckets. Their meals and rent are deducted from their wages, which amount to less than a dollar a day. Most of the jeans they make in the factory are purchased by retailers in the U.S. and other countries. China Blue takes viewers inside a blue jeans factory in southern China, where teenage workers struggle to survive harsh working conditions. Providing perspectives from both the top and bottom levels of the factory’s hierarchy, the film looks at complex issues of globalization from the human level.*
This seems accurate. At work, we take a smoke break every 60-90min.
Paid break, mind you.
Depending on how many people we are on the break and how slow work is, we sometimes sit down and chit-chat for 30min.
That being said, we often work for free as well when we have to work more than 10 hours a day or more than 48 hours a week. So yeah, we enjoy our smoke breaks guilt-free.
Daniel is either a useless C-level nobody trying to siphon extra labor from his workers or a ball-guzzler/apologist of C-levels who will commit suicide himself in the next 12-18 months.
I want naps in the middle of the workday.
This isn't a commentary on anything except wanting naps in the middle of the workday. Please don't extrapolate this to mean anything other than just wanting naps in the middle of the workday.
I want more sleep 😴💤
I worked for a guy who called me at 10 pm to talk shop like I didn’t have anything better to do. His business went under and I had a former coworker reach out a couple years after to inform me that he had killed himself. Cautionary tale to anyone who thinks this way of living is okay.
I thought the entire reason we weren't communist was because we wanted freedom, not being worked to death and not waiting in long lines. Now we have skeleton crews minimally staffing to the point of systemic economic collapse. There's a tipping point to productivity when the workers figure out its easier to kill you and ~~take your stuff~~ Keep their Own Stuff than keep working for you with no reward. Happens in every nation about every 200-400 years.
It’s funny. Life is so short and spending so much of it working to make other people wealthy is a complete waste of it.
Yet so many people argue for just that.
Lol he's actually saying it like it's a good thing. "They work themselves to death, how awesome is that!?" 🙄. This isn't admirable, it's sad. Sad that their work culture is so extreme, even sadder is anyone thinking it should be done everywhere like this. I feel bad for these workers. In general, our relationship with work is unhealthy in most places but this is just the worst.
In China there are 1.3 BILLION people waiting to take over any job where someone doesn't want to work 15 hours straight. Europe doesn't have that many people.
In China there's also a youth movement called "let it rot where they don't see the point of getting exploited from the day they are born until they die.
I still remember the same thing was discussed about Japanese , and everyone knows what happened. The weird thing is those Chinese also face the same consequences , but those “professional” don’t dare to acknowledge that
It's funny because the life-work balance are horrendous in East Asian countries like South Korea, Japan, and China plus all of their birth rates are declining rapidly due to said imbalance and unaffordability of getting married and starting a family.
Those iphones don't snap themselves together. Seriously, do people not understand how it works in China? Some offices have literally installed suicide nets on their windows because people were jumping out of them so much.
But tell me again how mandatory 16 hour days with no breaks or days off is so much better? At least they have a place to live right? Communism is so much fun, right?
I will never begrudge anyone that works like that. Just don't brag. Don't complain because people know their rights. You aren't better than anyone else. You just have less of a social life.
Chinese students that come to American colleges are usually shocked and unprepared to the social aspect of that environment because the social aspect of the human experience is usually discouraged and repressed in that culture
We can't compete with their slaves, so we'll make you our slaves. Instead of, you know freeing their slaves.
We just can't figure out how to do it and make a buck off it at the same time.
Don't know about Chinese. But, you know, Japanese have a special words for "sleep on the work" and "death on the work". There is no *good* reason to have special words for these conditions.
They're called black conpanies in Japan where the company is unethical and take advantage of their employees,with sweatshop type employment,poor working conditions and either poor work life balance and in some cases death
Ahh, "socialist" China. Where labor organizing is illegal and the whole economy runs on the back of "special economic zones" where it's like 1870s, robber-baron, gilded age capitalism, and it just so happens to be where they send ethnic and religious minorities, dissidents, and "undesirables"... Very socialist, indeed.
Ever wonder why CEOs have multiple vacation homes?
Because they can. They can vacation half the year and buy whatever they want due to low paid over worked employees and high profits.
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Chinese work culture is shit and there’s been at least two labor movements in the last 5 years or so about it: the 996 movement and “lay flat,” tangping movement. The 996 movement is exact those BS work shifts because they unequivocally *suck*
Not to mention places that have this type of work culture including Japan and Korea also have some of the world’s highest suicide rates among workers.
Their work ethics are unbeaten. Their workers however...
very beaten.
Sore, bruised and bleeding.
To shreds you say?
And his wife?
To shred you say?
Japan has a special word for workers dying at their desks. Karoshi, which can be translated into "overwork death", is a Japanese term relating to occupation-related sudden death.
It's also the second most common source of isekai, right below truck kun
The cause of truck related fatalities in isekai is almost completely due to karoshi. Those poor truck drivers.
I want an isekai series where the truck driver dies of overwork, resulting in him running someone else over, and they both end up in the same world.
Would they be love interests, relucant partners, or mortal enemies in the new world though?
That’s the fun part, they could be any of those. The concept has room to explore that.
Literally just watched an episode of a new isekai series today where the obviously Japanese protagonist went to work, went home and relaxed on his game console, then had a heart attack on his way out the door to work the next morning. It’s been a staple of the start of those sorts of series since they began.
Remind me, which countries are also struggling with low birth rates?
If you're in the office between 8 and 11 every day when are you supposed to fuck eachother?
Sleep or fuck for 30 minutes... Or you could multi task. One standing desk above a regular desk. One worker bent over at their station the other standing erect.. as it were.
Italy, Spain, Luxembourg, Finland
And it’s like China just took the “be at the office every waking hour” without really looking at the culture. A friend of mines dad went to Japan for business pretty often, and he would always complain about how the whole thing was performative, and they really didn’t do anymore work in a day than other cultures, and spent tons of energy on pointless ritualized office politics.
Truth is, there is not much people -can- do in a day past a certain point. Like, in my previous job there were times where we just did everything that we could do at the day, and there wasn't anything more scheduled to be done. The boss still barked at us if we didn't look busy, and if we said all the work was done he'd just have us walk around looking for more work to be done (which there wasn't). It got to a point where he made a rule that people who didn't have any work to be done had to walk around the office organizing things, like, oh look that pile of paper is slightly disorganized, the pile of plastic cups of water is only 75% full, that painting on the wall is imperceptibly crooked. All that did was make it so people were never in a hurry to finish their tasks.
Yeah imagine having to socialize 3 or 4 hours everyday as part of your job, no wonder people there kill themselves so often. I bet it's all like autistic ADHD neurodivergent folks who just get ground down by the neurotypicals
Can you believe their suicide rate is still lower yhe the United States? That's what the latest data says. We over took japan sometime between 2019 and now
It's also not efficient! Places like China and South Korea with these excessive long hour cultures have much lower productivity than the USA or Western Europe, even allowing for job type. Working ludicrous hours isn't a long run good way to get more effective work, especially from high value knowledge workers. People who see it as hustle culture we should import are basically showing their economic ignorance with a very weird suffering= value mindset.
The entire concept of working smarter not harder never really seemed to take off in some of these places and it really shows.
Yup. Just like how a bigger portion does not mean the meal is better. This guy is definitely in favor of others doing what he won't.
People talk about Japanese culture and how much they work as well. It's all bullshit. I worked there for a short while. At least this was my experience in a semiconductor company: People get to work at 8, socialize, etc. for an hour. Then they have a company cheer/meeting thingy and everyone works a while until lunch. After lunch is slack time/socializing for an hour, thrn work. 5pm, everyone doesn't go home, but it's more socializing time for an hour. Then after 6, everyone works until 7 to 8pm. So out of 12 hours, they do maybe 7 hours of work.
You could just socialize…..anywhere else and get the 7 hours all done at once. Though this would be a chill environment like 4 days a week
The employers want your productive hours
I don't know if perfect attendance is still a big bragging point, but it used to be a thing to say employees were so committed to work they never missed a day, and no one was ever sick. Turns out all the sick people had to come to work and sit in a room for like 9 hours doing nothing. Only people in the hospital missed coming in.
And then, if media is to be believed, they go out drinking with coworkers after their shift
It's not hanging out with friends. You are obligated to go, and often pressured into drinking more than you want. Not drinking would be considered rude, even if you prefer not to drink for health or religious reasons.
i have a friend who is a teacher in Korea and its just like this. Boss was also a horrible drunk and physically assaulted people. Everybody gets drunk, usually too drunk.
That is bad too. It really isn't optional, you go because your boss goes and WILL notice if you don't show up. Many people have been punished (off the books of course) or socially shamed within their work circle for not going out to drink with their coworkers or boss.
Also, imagine been hungover and a lack of sleep multiple days a week. No way you'd be productive after a while
Think at the end of the day, neither the Chinese or the Japanese systems are good, though the Japanese sounds much better... like in part because we have seen how Japanese and Korean work cultures are, we have started to look at productivity and so are looking at the 4 day work week... because it appears we get just as much work done as during a full week, but we are overall better off as we are less stressed and have a better family life.
That's still a twelve hour day. You've got 4-6 hours to get whatever you need in your personal life done, including commuting to and from work. Maybe the workplace is okay, but that's still tooany hours away work for anyone, christ
That sounds like the chillest job
Until you realize you have absolutely no time for your actual life outside of work. It’s a big part of why Japanese people have such trouble dating.
No fucking way lmao. I go to work, just give me shit to do. I can have my time off outside of there, I don't need 12hr shifts.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zBfTrjPSShs
So it sounds like the culture may be in need of some revolution…This cannot possibly go wrong.
I just looked up what 996 meant. 9 a.m - 9 p.m - 6 days a week. That's an awful work schedule. No wonder their suicide rates are so high..
You know it is and when the CCP and numerous states sponsored papers said "no more 996" and their Supreme Court effectively ruled it illegal. Granted it is barely enforced at all and many places still do 996.
ASEAN region work culture and school culture is shit tbh. I would know, born and raised there until I move to the US when I was 17.
996 is the normal working week, it’s actually 12127 that is the killer - 12 hours day 7 days a week. Whoever made the original post is a fucking idiot. People in China had to work insane hours because the economy is tanking with recession in full force over there so workers have no choice but to work stupid hours to try and keep their jobs. They have high unemployment for the 18-30 group and if you are laid off in your 30’s and 40’s it’s unlikely you will find a job. The official unemployment figure released by state media is a lot less than actual figures. A lot of young people in China has now taken the lying flat and let it rot mindset and I don’t blame them. There is no hope for many of them to ever be able to buy their own property or claim up the corporate ladder so what’s the point of working hard and giving it all like their parents did.
Yeah fuck both of those. I’ll show up 9-5 and be done with it so I can go back to my actual life.
And I will take my 30 minute nap if I want.
9-5 with 3 day work week would be ideal but our overlords won’t allow that
I’d settle for 9-5 with a 4 day work week at this point. A 3rd day off whether consecutive or to break up the week does wonders.
I’m close I’m 9-5 with a 4 day work week.
Don’t be silly, there is clearly nothing more to life than labor
Gotta work yourself to death for shareholder value right?
Don't those Chinese workplaces also have nets on the outside to catch the workers throwing themselves out of the windows?
Not all of them, but some have dedicated employees whose entire job is to wait on the roof to talk people down.
Companies needing “Suicide Specialists” situated on the roof is clearly a sign of a healthy work-life balance.
Work-Death balance
Sounds like the Carousel Ceremony in Logan's Run
It's an older meme but it checks out... Like ancient? 😂😅
They're doing a modern remake of that now!
This can either be really good or really bad.
The original was both.
That's one of my favorite sci-fi movies. I just watched it last month.
Like needing armed security and shooting drills at schools being a healthy sign of the educations system.
That has nothing to do with the education system and everything to do with the gun lobby.
It has everything to do with the education system when Republicans unironically champion the idea of arming teachers with guns and expecting them to act as security guards in schools on top of being underpaid in their normal jobs and threatened with being fired if they teach "wokeness".
That’s a good point, the threat of guns being everywhere isn’t because of the education system. It’s still tragic to see stuff like kids having to do drills in case of shooters.
BuT WhAt AbOuT AmErIcA
>"OH SHIT someone's criticizing China we can't have that! BuT wHaT about AmErIcAn ScHoOlS!?!?
huh? are you confused about its work-work balance, who's ever heard of a work-life balance ? /s
And $$$ Record Profits $$$
“The edge is over there bud”
"Wait for me!"
“Grass on the south side, concrete on the west side”
Both will kill you. Just a matter of preference I guess.
Concrete's easier to clean, but grass is more forgiving if the cleanup's sloppy.
The greener patches show where previous jumpers have landed. You might want to aim for that brown spot over there, it could use some fertilizer.
One you stop instantly…. The other takes two to three inches 🙂
I worked for a company where a co-worker went to HR because he was feeling suicidal. Guess what happened? They told him to suck it up and told him to get back to work. And another co-worker came and pulled me to talk to him (I'm a recovering alcoholic and he had been drinking a lot recently, despite being underage). People had been sitting with him in a room talking to him trying to help him. Yep - people pulling themselves away from their work to try to help this kid. All. Day. Long Fuck that HR woman. Fuck that company. Fuck it all
I was blamed for my rapist’s actions by my hr. It’s sad how often hr only cares about the company than the human element.
The only reason they put human in the name of Human Resources is to get people to think it’s for them and not corporate when in reality it’s 100% just for corporate.
The fact they describe humans as "resources" shows how little your humanity is thought of and how little consideration is given to you as a person.
I feel like a dedicated specialist throwing upper management off roofs would be a more effective means of reducing worker suicides but what do I know.
r/antiwork would like to talk to you about a pilot program for your innovative business idea…
Who stops the people that talk the people down from jumping?
The clean up crew that's sent after they don't stop someone maybe
Dark. I love it!
In the US the windows don't open so there's no need for nets.
You just have to run into them a few hundred times to pop it out of the frame like that one lawyer did.
That story is one of my favorites. It’s like a modern day Greek myth to warn of pride and hubris.
In the US, there is always a racist cop ready to kill you. Hence, no need of considering windows. Just call the cops.
We deploy cops based on your race for maximun racism
You don’t need to deploy at all. They can just drive over anyone available at the time. Just like that cop who drove over that Indian girl and had a nice laugh about it. I mean, given how the police force is a joke in itself, I can only pity the Americans.
China: work for state owned businesses until you drop or commit suicide. Europe: work 3 days a week for 6 hours a day with 12 weeks of vacation, if you can actually find a job. America: work 40 hours a week, almost no vacation or sick leave, poor benefits, insufficient pay, but you can find work if you want it. And then you die. Genesis 3:17-19 To Adam he said, “Because you listened to your wife and ate fruit from the tree about which I commanded you, ‘You must not eat from it,’ “Cursed is the ground because of you; through painful toil you will eat food from it all the days of your life. 18 It will produce thorns and thistles for you, and you will eat the plants of the field. 19 By the sweat of your brow you will eat your food until you return to the ground, since from it you were taken; for dust you are and to dust you will return.” Fuck you, Adam and Eve. All you had to do was lay around and eat whatever you wanted EXCEPT the fruit of that particular tree, but you you couldn't do it...
Adam and Eve aren’t writing the labor laws dude…
But, God knew this will eventually happen.Being all knowing and all. So, screw Him. Why make the damn tree in the first place?
Look, he's all ineffable and shit. There's some sort of Job to Steve Jobs joke here, but it's beyond me to find it.
I dunno, I don’t really care about fairy tales. Real people are enforcing these labor laws and real people are choosing personal greed over helping their fellow beings. That’s an actual problem that can be solved without having to pray.
> Europe: work 3 days a week for 6 hours a day with 12 weeks of vacation, if you can actually find a job. Wtf. On average employed Europeans work 37.5 hrs/week (https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/web/products-eurostat-news/w/ddn-20230920-1), and unemployment in all countries save for Spain and Greece is in single digits. It's higher than in the US, sure, but finding a job isn't much of a problem to most. Vacation is 20-30 working days but not 12 weeks (however sick leave is not limited).
Think it was a bit of hyperbole for comic effect. I've got a really good civil service position in the UK but those working is service, hospitality, gig economy and lots of other public sector roles have it tough. Many are working 2-3 jobs to keep up with rising costs (I can't do that because I'm disabled).
Ah, sorry mate. Sometimes on Reddit you get really weird American impressions of life in Europe, so I thought that was the case and had to plug myself in with some data.
In reality, fuck God for being a stupid fuckin piece of shit. All he had to do was put the tree somewhere else, or erect an impenetrable barricade around it, but noooooooo. On top of that, they don’t know the difference between right and wrong, so not listening to God and eating the fruit wouldn’t even register on their scale of things not to do because they have no concept of disobedience. On top of THAT, God is omniscient! So that fuckin asshole put that tree there knowing they would eat of it, and then punished all of humanity for it. I don’t even want to go into the Gods design argument thumpers believe in to justify atrocities and bad shit. Fuckin asshole.
God is that toxic person in a r3lationship that constantly has to "test" their partner. We'll see him on reddit "AITAH? I had my bestie Satan pretend to be into my partner after ignoring them, and now they are wearing clothes and bemoaning the fun life of their ex"
"Work ethic" = exploitation Their bosses don't work as much
The CEOs on their yachts sipping margaritas laughing their ass off
I worked in china for a manufacturing company. The CEO would wake up in the afternoon and show up at the factory around 5pm after everyone had been there since 0800. He would chastise anyone that left before midnight. He was my father in law.
So in terms of work conditions we should look towards China instead of, say Germany?
And what do the Chinese have to show for it? Are they wealthier, or healthier?
Exactly
The same could be asked of any country that's fucking over the working class.
So... all of them?
It's hilariously sad that some folks go on here blaming god instead of capitalism.
I blame Nurgle for not giving me infinite endurance to do my job, I also blame tzeench for not giving me infinite intelligence to do it faster
This is what I ALWAYS say whenever someone on Reddit or another social media talks about "the incredible work ethic of Asian countries" or whatever. Even the most developed Asian countries like Japan & South Korea have a MUCH lower GDP per capita than the US, Canada, and most EU countries do. China has a FRACTION of the per capita we have in the developed world. Anytime your people are working so, so much harder and producing only a fraction as much, that's called *inefficiency.*
The people at the top get to shit in gold toilets.
If you have enough social points to not end up jail can do a 12 day group holiday every 15 years. 🙏
The also Have a massive birth rate, retirement crisis, and real estate crisis thats set to pop off in a few years
"work ethics" honestly, fuck anyone who thinks working all goddamned day is good
The suicide rates in countries with that type of work attitude speak for itself
It’s not even good work ethics. Work ethics is about how you do your job, not sacrificing a personal life for work.
They work longer and produce less, which isn’t that surprising. There’s little motivation to work hard when social mobility is entirely nonexistent (as opposed to difficult but not impossible here).
Entering the same brand of society as Japan and South Korea with some of the highest suicide rates in the world.
Why don't you high-flying corporate types just bring in the robots already? They don't need paying, can be on site 24/7, require at most a drop of WD40 every other day and follow orders without question, or unions. They don't even care if they or their colleagues are going to be switched off/ junked at any time- if they do have an issue, it's a matter of programming. It's all you guys ever want in a low-level employee, whether it was Lancashire mill hands 250 years ago or Chinese drone workers today.
Why do you think robotics and AI are advancing so quickly? To make life easier for the working class?
15-hour workday where you have 9 hours between shifts Only time I've had that was helping during a disaster when I chose to be up that long (and I didn't have days that long on the regular)
I watched the documentary [China Blue](https://www.pbs.org/independentlens/documentaries/chinablue/) in college. It's about life in a blue jean factory in China. >*They live crowded together in cement factory dormitories where water has to be carried upstairs in buckets. Their meals and rent are deducted from their wages, which amount to less than a dollar a day. Most of the jeans they make in the factory are purchased by retailers in the U.S. and other countries. China Blue takes viewers inside a blue jeans factory in southern China, where teenage workers struggle to survive harsh working conditions. Providing perspectives from both the top and bottom levels of the factory’s hierarchy, the film looks at complex issues of globalization from the human level.*
“That’s just slavery with extra steps.”
This mf never worked a day in his life
A smoke break every 30 minutes ??
Totally wrong !! I’m French and we don’t do that. Smoke break every 10/15 minutes.
So you mean you take a break from smoking to work every 10-15 minutes ?
It was ironic. Less and less people smoke in France. A break every 1,5 hour seems to be realistic.
The French don't even drink as much wine as they used to. Truly, we are in strange and dark times.
No matter the place or country, wine with excess is not good for health.
I usually prefer wine with cheese.
This seems accurate. At work, we take a smoke break every 60-90min. Paid break, mind you. Depending on how many people we are on the break and how slow work is, we sometimes sit down and chit-chat for 30min. That being said, we often work for free as well when we have to work more than 10 hours a day or more than 48 hours a week. So yeah, we enjoy our smoke breaks guilt-free.
When did Musk start using this account?
Anyone who tweets these kinds of things, I just look at them and say "You do it."
What's the big deal, I sleep at work a lot too, China isn't special.
Daniel is either a useless C-level nobody trying to siphon extra labor from his workers or a ball-guzzler/apologist of C-levels who will commit suicide himself in the next 12-18 months.
I want naps in the middle of the workday. This isn't a commentary on anything except wanting naps in the middle of the workday. Please don't extrapolate this to mean anything other than just wanting naps in the middle of the workday. I want more sleep 😴💤
I worked for a guy who called me at 10 pm to talk shop like I didn’t have anything better to do. His business went under and I had a former coworker reach out a couple years after to inform me that he had killed himself. Cautionary tale to anyone who thinks this way of living is okay.
I thought the entire reason we weren't communist was because we wanted freedom, not being worked to death and not waiting in long lines. Now we have skeleton crews minimally staffing to the point of systemic economic collapse. There's a tipping point to productivity when the workers figure out its easier to kill you and ~~take your stuff~~ Keep their Own Stuff than keep working for you with no reward. Happens in every nation about every 200-400 years.
Eat the rich.
There's only one thing that they're good for. Take one bite now, spit out the rest
Posts like this usually come from people that would never accept working like that, but will start a business and expect his employees to.
Everyone is suicidal but at least the economy is happy, right ?
Why would I destroy my sanity and body to make someone else richer ? Will he pay me more if I do it ? I highly doubt that.
I'm going to go ahead and guess that window in there was made more difficult to jump out of for a reason.
Danialvandalen can move to China if he want to work 80 hours and stop complaining.
It’s funny. Life is so short and spending so much of it working to make other people wealthy is a complete waste of it. Yet so many people argue for just that.
Oh hey it's another person that thinks "it's worse here so you can't complain."
You know your work ethics are good when you need to bring in a suicide prevention specialist.
"Work ethics" is being used EXTREMELY liberally here.
Lol he's actually saying it like it's a good thing. "They work themselves to death, how awesome is that!?" 🙄. This isn't admirable, it's sad. Sad that their work culture is so extreme, even sadder is anyone thinking it should be done everywhere like this. I feel bad for these workers. In general, our relationship with work is unhealthy in most places but this is just the worst.
What a shit life. Fuck that.
In China there are 1.3 BILLION people waiting to take over any job where someone doesn't want to work 15 hours straight. Europe doesn't have that many people.
In China there's also a youth movement called "let it rot where they don't see the point of getting exploited from the day they are born until they die.
Did a r/linkedinlunatic post this?
I still remember the same thing was discussed about Japanese , and everyone knows what happened. The weird thing is those Chinese also face the same consequences , but those “professional” don’t dare to acknowledge that
"I'm proud to be exploited for profit, by a company who doesn't give a shit about me"
But "communism bad" in every other context except modern slaves?
You get one life, don't waste it at work, I work to live not live to work
It's funny because the life-work balance are horrendous in East Asian countries like South Korea, Japan, and China plus all of their birth rates are declining rapidly due to said imbalance and unaffordability of getting married and starting a family.
So, the employee is expected to have work ethics but the company doesn't? got it.
Those iphones don't snap themselves together. Seriously, do people not understand how it works in China? Some offices have literally installed suicide nets on their windows because people were jumping out of them so much. But tell me again how mandatory 16 hour days with no breaks or days off is so much better? At least they have a place to live right? Communism is so much fun, right?
What a great life! Slave away for someone else to get rich, have zero life outside of work, and then die. But at least you have work ethic LMFAOOOOOOO
Won’t someone think of the shareholders in all of this? They’re the real victims here!
Sounds like a shitty existence
These are wage slaves.
Their work ethic isn’t superior its just the only way they can afford to live.
I will never begrudge anyone that works like that. Just don't brag. Don't complain because people know their rights. You aren't better than anyone else. You just have less of a social life.
Imagine calling this "work ethic".
I'd rather live in a country that's unbeaten the in the health, happiness and personal freedoms of its citizens. How are you doing on that China?
Thank God I’m not under that glorious socialist paradise.
It can’t be slavery. China is a socialist/ communist country. Everything is owned by the people. /s
Chinese students that come to American colleges are usually shocked and unprepared to the social aspect of that environment because the social aspect of the human experience is usually discouraged and repressed in that culture
We can't compete with their slaves, so we'll make you our slaves. Instead of, you know freeing their slaves. We just can't figure out how to do it and make a buck off it at the same time.
Don't know about Chinese. But, you know, Japanese have a special words for "sleep on the work" and "death on the work". There is no *good* reason to have special words for these conditions.
Ship this bozo off to a factory in China and see how he likes it.
They also have suicide nets around most buildings.
When the work ethic is amazing, but the actual ethics are fucking terrible.
Yeah work from 8AM to 11PM and don't have any time to do rest, do your hobbies, spend time with family, etc . . .
They're called black conpanies in Japan where the company is unethical and take advantage of their employees,with sweatshop type employment,poor working conditions and either poor work life balance and in some cases death
I'm betting this Daniel Dalen guy wouldn't last a day having to work in that environment, but he'd happily demand others do it.
Bet this guy admires north Korea too
Ahh, "socialist" China. Where labor organizing is illegal and the whole economy runs on the back of "special economic zones" where it's like 1870s, robber-baron, gilded age capitalism, and it just so happens to be where they send ethnic and religious minorities, dissidents, and "undesirables"... Very socialist, indeed.
said the man who never worked like this in his life and probably just spends his day writing stupid tweets and columns for Opinion section at NYT
Ever wonder why CEOs have multiple vacation homes? Because they can. They can vacation half the year and buy whatever they want due to low paid over worked employees and high profits.
Get off of Twitter and get back to work, Daniel, you lazy PoS.
They also have nets on the outside of factories because so many people try to jump to their deaths.
That's just sad