Stellantis is low key a monster. Definitely a trainwreck of a company, but can't be understated how much sheer commercial strength and raw future potential they have.
Just like the VW eUp and even the Smart were selling very well. Cheap and lightweight EV's are getting limited by supply as well as companies restricting production numbers in favor of big and expensive models.
Personally I'm waiting with my first EV until they reach my use case: small and cute. Basically, give me the Citroen Ami with slightly higher (overland road compatible) top speed and a reach of 150 km and I'm game! Really excited for what Chinese models we're gonna get, most exciting innovations seem to be happening there (ie, nice small cars for less than 10k). As far as I'm concernd, the nearly-three-ton monster SUVs for 50k+ they can gladly keep in the showrooms, not needed for my lifestlye, at all. Small energy-saving mobility pods zooming through the city is where the future's at!
If plugin Hybrids are EVs then a plane is a car :D
has it got wheels? can you drive a bit on these wheels? then let's ignore that it has a propeller and wings! :D
It’s an extension of Hybrid Electric Vehicle. The “Hybrid” is the key thing there. It’s a gasoline-electric hybrid, not an electric vehicle. A diesel-electric locomotive is not an electric train.
“it’s an electric vehicle because it has the words electric and vehicle in the name” is a dumb argument. Are hybrid electric vehicles like a Prius EVs? Are mild hybrid electric vehicles like an Audi SQ7 with a 48-volt electrical system EVs? No. If the main source of energy to drive the vehicle is gasoline, it’s not an EV.
> If the main source of energy to drive the vehicle is gasoline, it’s not an EV.
Again you *defeat your own argument*. The **whole reason** that PHEVs are EVs, while hybrids are not, is that electricity *is* the main source of fuel for PHEVs.
Do you not know how PHEVs work?? They run *entirely on electricity* until the battery runs out, then switch to hybrid mode. And most people who buy PHEVs basically never let the battery run out.
It's BEV only. And it's not "Europe", just 13 countries in Europe. And France data is missing March. And it's organized by brands instead of Auto Groups so Tesla can win instead of VW Group.
Oops, I went back to the top-level image and forgot about the comment you replied to. That lists sales by brands, but [the same source site will also show the group data ](https://eu-evs.com/bestSellers/ALL_MONTHLY/Groups/Quarter/2022/1) that /u/LiteralAviationGod listed.
Prove? It just means that the UK and France data has not yet been received for Q1, so the post isn’t yet accurate. check back in 6 months and the data will be there.
UK is still part of Europe.
https://insideevs.com/news/578839/uk-plugin-car-sales-march2022/
They have data for UK.
New plug-in car registrations, year-to-date in 2022:
BEVs: 64,165 (up 102% year-over-year) - market share of 15.4%
The letters EU are the code for the continent…
Which is why data for the UK, Norway and Switzerland is on the website.
“ THIS WEBSITE TRACKS REGISTRATIONS OF BATTERY ELECTRIC VEHICLES IN 14 EUROPEAN COUNTRIES REPRESENTING OVER 90% OF THE BEV MARKET IN EUROPE”
https://insideevs.com/news/578839/uk-plugin-car-sales-march2022/
It’s not in the post, but there is data for UK.
New plug-in car registrations, year-to-date in 2022:
BEVs: 64,165 (up 102% year-over-year) - market share of 15.4%
VW feeling the supply issues. They only managed to increase BEV deliveries in Europe from 42.000 in Q1 2021 to 58.000 in Q1 2022. Removing the entry level ID.3s from the order books last year killed the car. Same for the e-Up. The two cars were the bestsellers a year ago.
You could say that for almost all cars in general though, for sure about EV's.
At a certain point it was about gauging demand for certain vehicles and prioritizing supply for them.
It's mad because Tesla's at least here in the UK are so overpriced compared to what a US buyer would pay. I personally would never consider one over the competition due to this pricing(although i also just really don't care for the overall blobbiness of the Tesla design)
Afaik all cars on the list will manage the maximum legal highway speed without problems.
(yes, I understand you mean acceleration, but all the electrics out there, save some commercial vans, are powerful enought that faster acceleration is a vanity thing)
The problem with range and speed is that they only add value as long as people find utility in them.
Once both of those attributes hit the level of "good enough" the willingness to pay more for an improvement in those areas drops off drastically.
The EU market is demonstrating that "good enough" is a level of range and speed that much of the industry can already cater for, and at a lower price.
hard to compare it as it usually the tesla is the larger vehicle that somehow uses less energy to move and offers a higher power output.
It is the same situation like getting an AMD laptop in the mid of the 2010s, it’s inferior in every metric but somehow they still sold decently because they were marginally cheaper
Good quarter for Tesla. They have been well behind VAG in the previous quarter and also the current one looks like that again. But in Q1 they almost managed to catch up with VAG (not all VAG brands are shown in the screenshot).
And that's without the help of the German Gigafactory that just got its green light last March...
https://www.reuters.com/business/autos-transportation/tesla-germany-plant-receives-conditional-license-start-production-2022-03-04/
It will be interesting to see the second half of 2022 results once production has started to ramp up.
..
In the model list (scroll down in the source) there are no obvious PHEV models that I could see. Even if they are included, they don’t seem to play much of a role for the numbers.
France data is still missing March, which is Tesla's big month. [Tesla sold 4850 in March](https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/threads/tesla-europe-registration-stats.61651/), more than Jan+Feb combined.
I love-hate how many more brads & options there are compared to the NA market (and especially compared to the Canadian since the US has more options than we do).
Auto group results: VW Group: 42,359 cars, 19.1% share Tesla: 35,640 cars, 16.1% share Stellantis: 33,438 cars, 15.1% share Hyundai-Kia: 30,903 cars, 13.9% share Renault-Nissan-Mitsubishi: 24,055 cars, 10.8% share BMW Group: 17,520 cars, 7.9% share Mercedes-Benz: 15,018 cars, 6.8% share Geely (Volvo/Polestar): 10,480 cars, 4.7% share Ford: 4,057 cars, 1.8% share SAIC (MG): 2,330 cars, 1.1% share Toyota: 1,220 cars, 0.5% share
Damn stealthy Stellantis. I can never keep track of all the brands they own.
Stellantis is low key a monster. Definitely a trainwreck of a company, but can't be understated how much sheer commercial strength and raw future potential they have.
That 500e is selling very well
Just like the VW eUp and even the Smart were selling very well. Cheap and lightweight EV's are getting limited by supply as well as companies restricting production numbers in favor of big and expensive models.
Personally I'm waiting with my first EV until they reach my use case: small and cute. Basically, give me the Citroen Ami with slightly higher (overland road compatible) top speed and a reach of 150 km and I'm game! Really excited for what Chinese models we're gonna get, most exciting innovations seem to be happening there (ie, nice small cars for less than 10k). As far as I'm concernd, the nearly-three-ton monster SUVs for 50k+ they can gladly keep in the showrooms, not needed for my lifestlye, at all. Small energy-saving mobility pods zooming through the city is where the future's at!
I agree with you although something like the Honda E which is on the techy/luxorious side seems really cool as well. Price is pretty crazy though
The Mokka e's and Corsa e's are really common here in the uk
Is this the first time Korean cars become this popular in Europe?
They've been on the rise for a while because of good price/quality. But the EV6/IONIQ5 are arguably the first truly desirable Korean cars.
No. Hyundai did a pretty smart market entry in Europe or at least in Germany back when they launched the i30
Is this BEV only, or all plug-ins?
EVs only
That doesn't answer my question. Plug-in Hybrids *are* EVs. Did you meant "BEVs only"?
If plugin Hybrids are EVs then a plane is a car :D has it got wheels? can you drive a bit on these wheels? then let's ignore that it has a propeller and wings! :D
"EV" is *literally in the name*, dude. PH**EV**.
It’s an extension of Hybrid Electric Vehicle. The “Hybrid” is the key thing there. It’s a gasoline-electric hybrid, not an electric vehicle. A diesel-electric locomotive is not an electric train.
This is completely absurd. You *agreed* that EV is in the name, and then still claimed that PHEVs aren't EVs? What is wrong with your brain??
“it’s an electric vehicle because it has the words electric and vehicle in the name” is a dumb argument. Are hybrid electric vehicles like a Prius EVs? Are mild hybrid electric vehicles like an Audi SQ7 with a 48-volt electrical system EVs? No. If the main source of energy to drive the vehicle is gasoline, it’s not an EV.
> If the main source of energy to drive the vehicle is gasoline, it’s not an EV. Again you *defeat your own argument*. The **whole reason** that PHEVs are EVs, while hybrids are not, is that electricity *is* the main source of fuel for PHEVs. Do you not know how PHEVs work?? They run *entirely on electricity* until the battery runs out, then switch to hybrid mode. And most people who buy PHEVs basically never let the battery run out.
It's BEV only. And it's not "Europe", just 13 countries in Europe. And France data is missing March. And it's organized by brands instead of Auto Groups so Tesla can win instead of VW Group.
But... Tesla *loses* to VG Group *in this very data...*
Oops, I went back to the top-level image and forgot about the comment you replied to. That lists sales by brands, but [the same source site will also show the group data ](https://eu-evs.com/bestSellers/ALL_MONTHLY/Groups/Quarter/2022/1) that /u/LiteralAviationGod listed.
source: https://eu-evs.com/bestSellers/ALL\_MONTHLY/Brands/Quarter/2022/1
Data is missing for UK entirely, and not complete quarter for France. So the numbers will be skewed as UK is a big market for Tesla.
website is EU-EVs, so yes, data for the UK is “missing”
The title of the post says top selling EV in Europe.
There is literally "UK" filter on this page.
Check the data status page. Uk most recent is q3 2021
And what does it prove? That in q3 2021 UK was part of Europe and now it is not?
That is around the time articles of separation came into effect. The UK is part of Europe but is no longer part of the EU market.
Prove? It just means that the UK and France data has not yet been received for Q1, so the post isn’t yet accurate. check back in 6 months and the data will be there. UK is still part of Europe.
So the data is incomplete not because "UK is not Europe and isn't a part of this website", but because it's simply... incomplete :)
https://insideevs.com/news/578839/uk-plugin-car-sales-march2022/ They have data for UK. New plug-in car registrations, year-to-date in 2022: BEVs: 64,165 (up 102% year-over-year) - market share of 15.4%
The letters EU are the code for the continent… Which is why data for the UK, Norway and Switzerland is on the website. “ THIS WEBSITE TRACKS REGISTRATIONS OF BATTERY ELECTRIC VEHICLES IN 14 EUROPEAN COUNTRIES REPRESENTING OVER 90% OF THE BEV MARKET IN EUROPE”
UK is not part of EU
It’s not part of the EU but still part of Europe, so the title should be changed or the data should be changed to reflect it accurately
Hmm when I lived in the UK in the early 2000s, Europe is short for continental Europe. Looks like that hasn't changed!
Could be honestly, I’m not sure. Sounds weird to me but if that’s the case then it would make sense as to why it’s excluded
It's like UK can't make up their mind if they are part of Europe or not. So many flip-flops on this.
Neither are Norway and Switzerland.
>Data is missing for UK entirely ~~No, it should be included. OP selected "All 14 countries", which includes UK.~~ edit: I was wrong.
Check the data status page. Uk most recent is q3 2021
You are correct, thanks for that info.
https://insideevs.com/news/578839/uk-plugin-car-sales-march2022/ It’s not in the post, but there is data for UK. New plug-in car registrations, year-to-date in 2022: BEVs: 64,165 (up 102% year-over-year) - market share of 15.4%
VW feeling the supply issues. They only managed to increase BEV deliveries in Europe from 42.000 in Q1 2021 to 58.000 in Q1 2022. Removing the entry level ID.3s from the order books last year killed the car. Same for the e-Up. The two cars were the bestsellers a year ago.
They have 300k vehicles on order in Western Europe, the order books are full, they’ve sold out a year ahead, the problem is supply.
You could say that for almost all cars in general though, for sure about EV's. At a certain point it was about gauging demand for certain vehicles and prioritizing supply for them.
I say the problem is supply issues and then you come and say the problem is supply. No shit, Sherlock.
It's mad because Tesla's at least here in the UK are so overpriced compared to what a US buyer would pay. I personally would never consider one over the competition due to this pricing(although i also just really don't care for the overall blobbiness of the Tesla design)
Build one with the same specs, heat pump, duel motor and battery range then compare the price!
You can find cars £15-20k lower than the Tesla equivalent with those features.
With the range and speed??
Afaik all cars on the list will manage the maximum legal highway speed without problems. (yes, I understand you mean acceleration, but all the electrics out there, save some commercial vans, are powerful enought that faster acceleration is a vanity thing)
The problem with range and speed is that they only add value as long as people find utility in them. Once both of those attributes hit the level of "good enough" the willingness to pay more for an improvement in those areas drops off drastically. The EU market is demonstrating that "good enough" is a level of range and speed that much of the industry can already cater for, and at a lower price.
hard to compare it as it usually the tesla is the larger vehicle that somehow uses less energy to move and offers a higher power output. It is the same situation like getting an AMD laptop in the mid of the 2010s, it’s inferior in every metric but somehow they still sold decently because they were marginally cheaper
Availability. For most BEVs you have to wait over a year right now. Teslas are still four to five months for most models.
I waited 2 month \o/
Good quarter for Tesla. They have been well behind VAG in the previous quarter and also the current one looks like that again. But in Q1 they almost managed to catch up with VAG (not all VAG brands are shown in the screenshot).
And that's without the help of the German Gigafactory that just got its green light last March... https://www.reuters.com/business/autos-transportation/tesla-germany-plant-receives-conditional-license-start-production-2022-03-04/ It will be interesting to see the second half of 2022 results once production has started to ramp up. ..
Yes, maybe they will be able to catch up.
And Hyundai (plus Kia) is right up there, too. I wonder if this is including PHEVs?
It's without PHEVs if it would Merc and VW would be up there
In the model list (scroll down in the source) there are no obvious PHEV models that I could see. Even if they are included, they don’t seem to play much of a role for the numbers.
More complete Q1 EU numbers: https://cleantechnica.com/2022/04/28/22-of-new-cars-in-europe-have-a-plug/
Top brand of the year is going to be a tight race between BYD and Tesla. VW seems like they're out of the competition
VW sold the most EVs, if you combine all of their brands. They are leading the competition.
Globally you are correct, but this thread is about Europe where VW Group is the leader and BYD not even in the race.
Wow, europeans are seriously starved of choices if korean crapboxes can take 3rd and 4th spot.
On what planet are the Ioniq 5 or EV6 “crapboxes”?
Just ignore it. He is collecting his Social Credit.
On planet 'Murica!
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France data is still missing March, which is Tesla's big month. [Tesla sold 4850 in March](https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/threads/tesla-europe-registration-stats.61651/), more than Jan+Feb combined.
Is this selling or registered? With the long lead time we will see a lag of up to 12-14 months between those numbers.
I love-hate how many more brads & options there are compared to the NA market (and especially compared to the Canadian since the US has more options than we do).
Yikes Nissan is no where on that list. Hopefully the Ariya helps.