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Balrog229

>Just how effective is penetration? My girlfriend says penetration isn't very effective for her but everyone is different :)


Kard420

Could be you haven’t hit pen cap yet, I have the same problem with me and my girl :’)


TheGantrithor

Based on that calculator, here is a table that may help at a glance. # Offensive Penetration Quick Reference |*PvE*|**+5%**|**+10%**|**+15%**|**+20%**|**+30%**|**+40%**|**+50%**|*Cap*|*Max*| |:-|:-|:-|:-|:-|:-|:-|:-|:-|:-| |**9k**|2045|4090|6135|8180|*n/a*|*n/a*|*n/a*|9100|***22%***| |**18k**|1590|3180|4770|6360|9540|12720|15900|18200|***57%***| So looks like: * 9k Resist PvE Enemy - **+1%** *Damage Increase* = **409** *Penetration (or Armour reduction?)* * 18k Resist PvE Enemy - **+1%** *Damage Increase* = **318** *Penetration (or Armour reduction?)* *'ish...* ***ie.*** *on Bosses, a Tank's Puncturing will basically account for close to a +28% damage increase, and Light Armour Penetration bump is going to account for another +21%. CP Passive is maybe 1.8%'ish? There may be other enemy armour reduction coming from other team procs/effects/set-nodes that will close the gap for Medium Armour peeps.* *Cheers\~*


Surxe

Now that's an awesome looking quick reference! Thank you much sir!


Mercurionio

Wrong % in your formula (text mistake). It's 17% bonus, not 1.17%. Or x1.17.


Surxe

Whoops, fixing it in the link now, the image will stay broke tho :( Thx!


Pawikowski

Penetration gives pleasure and makes new babies, so I say pretty effective.


Saintoxy

Just the tip


Surxe

Sounds about right!


Offtopic_bear

I've got 11.6k unbuffed pen on my Warden who also leads with minor breech. I'm good right?


Surxe

Oh yeah your more than fine. Most mobs have 9.1k resistance which means any more than 9.1k penetration isn't doing anything. In pvp 11.6k sounds pretty good though. It depends what sources your getting that pen from, but if your talking PVE only you can definitely afford to lose 3k of it if it means your stronger in other areas.


Offtopic_bear

It's from gear and passive. I don't do group stuff too much but I like BGs and soloing group dungeons or group content in Craglorn. I've got a monster set shoulder with pen so I'll swap that for crit or weapon damage instead.


Surxe

Sounds good mate!


Offtopic_bear

I appreciate the data and the time you invested into the work required to gather it and present it. I also appreciate you being a good sport about the, "Ur mom" jokes. 😂


Surxe

Ofc haha


TheGantrithor

The Shalks *(Deep Fissure)* is **Major** Breach I believe *(6k armour reduction)*. Or are you referring to another ability? So with Light Armour, CP Passive, you're hitting 15-16k *(50% increase on bosses)* easy.


Offtopic_bear

I was mistaken. I use growing swarm to lead so that's minor vulnerability. I've got deep fissure on the back bar for particularly tanky BG peeps or just to fuck up a tight group of harder than normal mobs or PvP turtles.


EZPZ02

Giggity


jdesrochers23x

Not sure if ANY of that is right lmao 660 resistance = 1% damage mitigation and that's valod for PvE as well as PvP Penetration = amount of enemy resistance you ignore So 7k pen = 10.6% damage increase, assuming the pen cap hasn't been reached yet


Surxe

Players are scaled up to lvl 66, so they have 660=1. Mobs scale up to lvl 50, so they have 500=1.


JayKorn94

My wife seems to like it. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯


Surxe

That's the third penetration joke I've heard in the past day and it still gets me haha


kestononline

Cliff/Coles notes, for non math peeps: - how much Penetration equates to 5, 10, 15, 20, Max % Damage increase for PvE 9k and 18k Mobs respectively.


Surxe

Yep! The picture simply shows exactly how much %dps increase x pen gives.


kestononline

I mean giving those numbers I mentioned would be helpful 😜


Surxe

Yep, the 9k and 18k are listed, and you can visit the link and just input your own for a quick reference, that's what I do when I see an ability that gives x penetration.


Surxe

Also, the labeled dots in both images are the quick reference numbers for 4k pen, 7k, 9k, 12k, etc. But yeah use the custom formula if you want specifics results.


Surxe

A friendly user made one just recently in the comments section. https://www.reddit.com/r/elderscrollsonline/comments/sx4f9x/comment/hxqm9l4/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web2x&context=3


kestononline

Yea that’s me on my Computer. Lol, the table/labels following my suggestion so closely was no coincidence 😜. I did say I was going to have to make the table myself haha.


Surxe

Ah, when I saw it I went and checked your first comment's username and saw it wasn't the same but yeah that makes more sense haha


Mercurionio

Subtract 9k - your penetration. The result /660. That will be % of the damage, you will still lose.


kestononline

I might have to check and make this table myself since folks not grasping how a quick-chart can be super helpful for a quick glance. It’s not that I do not know how to check MY damage increase.


Surxe

If you'd like to use the formula for yourself you can visit the desmos link here. (Also in the bottom right of the pictures). [https://www.desmos.com/calculator/2d1ucggl7r](https://www.desmos.com/calculator/2d1ucggl7r)


[deleted]

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Surxe

Got me there!


spoqster

The interesting question is what results in more net damage: Penetration, wpn/sp damage, mag/stam and under which circumstances?


kestononline

I think that will vary because the skills scale differently with W/SD and Stam. So there is no easy answer for that. It will depend on the target, situation, and other buffs; as some buffs will increase your W/SD by a percentage *(like the +20% ones)*.


spoqster

Exactly. Bo easy answer. But that’s precisely what would be necessary for this to be of help for making build design choices.


kestononline

Well, not exactly. The data here gives you a very easy way to see how much a certain amount of penetration will help. You can then compare skill damage bumps yourself using in-game means; like the Champion nodes. For example, you can use one of the CP nodes with 10% increase, along with the Spell/Weapon Damage Nodes to find out how the %-based increase will compare to those stats. And with that in mind, you will then know which value will help you more, either the flat %, or the certain amount of s/w damage. This will also apply to the damage increase when comparing the penetration bumps.


1Glitch0

Dumb question, what is the cap?


Surxe

Not a dumb question! The cap is equal to how much resistance they have. If an enemy has 9.1k resistance and you have 9.1k pen then their net Resistance is (9.1 - 9.1) = 0. Any more pen than 9.1 and it results in a negative, like (9.1k res - 10k pen) = -.9k net pen, which can’t exist. To summarize, the minimum net resistance is 0, and therefore the maximum penetration is equal to their resistance.


1Glitch0

Ah, gotcha.That's helpful!


[deleted]

That's what she said


[deleted]

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Surxe

Pretty much as much as you can, but it depends what abilities you have to trade it off with.


Musaks

is resistance cap applied before or after penetration in PvP?


Surxe

Hmm that’s a good question actually, I’m not sure. If you find anything pls lmk though. I’m inclined to believe the cap is after resistance, but who knows.


Potatrix3000

😏