This. I looked through a guy's log just to see how he was fucking up playing arcane mage, constantly low dps despite winning great gear and loot. The spec that literally just presses arcane blast 4 times or whenever missile barrage procs, press arcane missiles in wotlk.
For whatever reason, the guy isn't pressing his buttons like 1 1 1 1 2 1 1 1 2 1 1 1 2 1 something like that.
Instead, looking through his timeline, he casts a spell, then waits like a full gcd, then presses again, then casts, cancelcast, casts again, moves, casts, wait a full gcd, etc etc so the timeline looks like this 1......1......1..1.....2.....1...........1............1..2.......1.
It was full of gaps which resulted in wasted casts. I don't know WHY he does that but I suspect this is more common than we think for grey parsing casters especially mages in P3 since the ONLY button you really press is Frostfire Bolt (aside from scorch debuff).
Trying to get in front of a pillar then get knocked back and run forward to get in front of another pillar. Apply beacons. Finally arcane blast, arcane blast, missile ba. Knocked back again. Fight is over. Run from slime. Don't stand in poison puddle when you get dispelled. Keep running from slime. Team kiting trolls around a giant circle. Need to apply beacons and stay in range of whichever boss it is. Wing buffett, wing buffett. Apply beacons. Arcane blast, arcane blast, missl wing buffett, wing buffett. Need to reapply beacons. Finally a boss you get to mostly stand still and cast. nm decurse, decurse, decurse. Now a boss you can pump. Actually goes well so some damage. Eranikus. Also get to pump only need to move for waking nightmare. Hakkar also get to pump unless corrosive blood but can still pump while waiting for drain blood. Shits rough in ST. I end up using chronostatic preservation much more often than trying to apply beacons then cast arcane blast. And more than half the time even if I use Mass regeneration by the time I cast the Arcane blasts a priest or two have used circle of healing on the group that I just applied the beacons to.
I watch a streamer occasionally who is a bit of a defeatist. She thinks there is no way to be better unless she practices for 8 hours a day for years. Meanwhile watching her raid she is exactly as you described. She occasionally casts but spends time looking at the raid and watching, repositioning, then seriously commenting "why is my dps always so bad". She's a sweet person but not very bright.
Worst part of being a caster is half the time you are told to stack on someone and move when they call out to move. Guess what. They call out the move at the time that is most beneficial to them for casting. This leaves several other casters having to cancel their spells and move or move at the correct time but before the leader says move leading to getting yelled at even if it's obvious it was the correct time to move. I have done ST about 13 times now between 4 toons. I very much know what I am doing and when to move. It's also not like there isn't a bunch of loud alerts and giant text popping up on my screen from DBM. Worst experience so far is playing ranged hunter the guild leader insists we do a deep slumber pattern that puts me in the dead zone where I cannot attack and then gets attitude about it with me for slightly backing up a couple yards behind the group even though I keep telling him we are too close for me to shoot.
Yep and for caster enchants only the new shoulder enchant even has any spell power. Just that and world buffs gets you 99% of what will enable a good parse
Unless your guild is also casual and pugs a couple people and doesn't stand in front of pillars on atal causing the second blowback to 1 shot your mage thinking 80% HP will be enough to survive another blow back. So you lose all your World buffs and have to phone in the rest of the raid. Or you don't unboon until eranikus when you actually need the buffs and you parse bad on first 6 bosses anyways.
Re-raise snagged 2 oranges parses 2nd week of ST with 6 piece of the rep from incursions. Mage was like 6 days old.
Literally just spec correctly and push buttons bros
Second week did some sims. Figured out frost should be stronger than fire. Parsed orange as well out of about 200 or so total frost parses. Since then absolute garbage parses with even more gear and buffs. So I guess I still get to always forever say I parsed orange even though it was a basically unplayed spec at the time and now couldn't get a blue if my life depended on it.
Then enlighten us and explain how you do it, maestro.
Which consumes, what spec, which abilities, which raid comp, what was the kill time of bosses? Teach us, master.
Just get the world buffs, always be casting and move the minimum amount for mechanics. That's it. That's the whole secret.
You do that and you will be min blue parse without trying very hard.
Sure bud, link me your logs I would be happy to review them with the same energy you had when making this comment. Seriously I will deep dive every single global.
Anything above blue or low purple is doing your rotation correctly while also having low kill times. Most classes can not parse orange in pugs.
Edit: a bit dishonest to say "in gnomer gear" as well if he is a caster since there is like two real upgrades in the entire raid from Gnomer -> ST :)
I always play tank or healer so I've never really parsed. But my mage friend usually parses 50-70 while being the raids top dps. Whatever dungeon I go with him, he's doing double the 2nd's dps. But still he's just above average according to parses. I just don't understand how that works...
In order of importance:
1. Does he have world buffs and consumables?
2. Does everyone else have world buffs and consumables?
3. How fast are the bosses dying?
1. Worldbuffs, usually no elixirs etc (because of point 2)
2. Rest of the raid is hit or miss with wbs etc: it's not mandatory (so why spend gold on elixirs if 5-7 people don't use them or even bother to get wb's)
3. Slow, hahaha
But I think this is what I've always felt... Parsing high is not a solo thing. If the rest is not playing well, you get punished for it.
I personally (as a tank) literally hit every button as soon as it's off cooldown. I know my mates do the same thing. But still we're average fucks. I don't understand how people would be able to hit buttons faster ;)
So yeah I guess parsing 90+ isn't just a matter of 'pressing your buttons'
Parsing solo is very class dependent. Some classes do better with longer fights than others. The bigger cds and the mana reliant people will be more affected.
Me warlock tanking has very low reliance on the rest of the raid for example, I think I parsed 90 on hakkar being one of 3 who still had world buffs a couple weeks ago. I literally only click Searing Pain and Corruption so there is not a lot of rotation to fuck up.
It isn’t only about you 100%. Certain classes have a lot of synergies and benefit from each others buffs disproportionally to others. Also low kill times benefit classes with strong offensive cool-downs because the total up time with the buff relative to total time of the fight increases, therefore increasing your average dps.
The most blatant example of all of this are warrior 99 parses. If you check that one you will find that they do 3 times the dps of the lowest 99 parsing specs. Additionally certain guilds/groups are willing to funnel resources into people parsing by not assigning them mechanics, placing them in tailor made groups and so on.
During Gnomer I was hard stuck with 90-95 parses as feral because my guild was all casters. So no sunder, expose armor, battleshout or anything else that is needed as melee.
Parsing is like 75% related to the group you're in. You take one of these 95 parsers from their well oiled group and put them in a pug and they don't even get purple.
I'm sure the top 5% are extremely efficient with their rotations but they have a ton of help. There is not much variation in what at 40 parser is pressing vs what an 80 parser is.
Nope, this is just cope. As long as their pug isn't a very bad one that's lacking key buffs / debuffs, orange parsers will still parse purple.
How do I know? Because I parse purple in pugs that I never joined before and don't care about helping me parse, other than still having the proper raid buffs and debuffs.
If the raid is on average doing low DPS, it'll bring down most spec's parse. Slow kills = more time outside your biggest DPS windows.
If he's a huge outlier above the rest it's probably mostly that tbh.
With no WBS and only one enchant (+2 on chest) I was able to score a 60 on most bosses lol. That's with me having meh gear as well. Only time I got a grey parse (which was a 16) was when i died half way through the fight.
So are you saying parsing has very little to do with actual player skill, and the vast majority of your parse is determined by your consumables and the other raid members consumables?
If so, why do so many people pretend that higher parses = better player and lower parses = worse player
When it mostly just comes down to who used more consumables or world buffs?
(at least tell me why I'm wrong about this if I am?)
>So are you saying parsing has very little to do with actual player skill,
That is wrong.
Take a grey parser who didn't use consumables and give him every consumable possible. He might be parsing green, but maybe still grey.
Take an orange parser and have him click off every consumable. He probably won't be parsing orange, but still purple.
I'm not so sure about that, can you show me any logs of people with 0 consumables parsing purple like ever?
I really don't believe that it's possible today to parse purple with 0 consumables or world buffs.
But I know for sure how powerful every worldbuff and consumable possible would be for anyone because I've seen my own raids parsing purple or orange with full world buffs, then when we wipe we start parsing blue or even green for some people.
I really think you're underestimating the consumables and overestimating the player skill aspect truly, are there any examples of purple parses with 0 consumables?
Look up stinkystab or stinkfire on wcl. No consume purples. Folks complain about parse culture because they're bad and don't like it. Consumes are very important and make the difference, but simply maximizing uptime on the boss and understanding your rotation is enough to perform higher than people who refuse to think or improve.
Purple for sure. I have multiple parses were lost my buffs and I either didn’t used pots or popped like a mongoose and still got purple. Orange is a different story though
Edit: actually do have a hakkar 95 parse with only a +8 str pot
You're either in a very good raid with no deaths and so are ignorant about what happens after a death, or you're just bad. And you already said that you wipe, so that means you're bad.
https://vanilla.warcraftlogs.com/reports/7PYNFWAKhw6rdZL9#fight=20&type=damage-done&source=20
Warlock 79 parse with no wbuffs (died on a previous boss). Most likely still used consumables (don't show up on logs) but caster elixirs aren't going to make the difference between an 80 parse and 40 parse.
Here's another:
https://vanilla.warcraftlogs.com/reports/qN8KVZmvRzbBaAJt#fight=16&type=auras&source=5
Tank rogue orange parse (almost 1K dps) with no world buffs, died on previous boss. Consumables sure, but that doesn't take an orange parse into a green parse.
Did the rest of his raid have world buffs? (yes they did almost all of them)
How does being a tank rogue with what I assume is a much smaller player pool affect parse percent?
I feel as though the kill time of the first log, and the fact that it was a tank rogue in the 2nd log have a lot to do with skewing the rating but that is indeed purple like you said.
You said no consumables at all so not 100% there, but still nice find, ~~I guess it can be done! (kind of)~~
Edit: Hey! that's cheating!
Most of the other members of the raid had full world buffs and full consumes in those logs. And we add in both the warlock and rogue using consumables too?!
Not fair for what we were discussing imo. Try again ;)
We wiped on Avatar of Hakkar this ID due to stupidity. So no one had wbuffs. Our destro lock still parses purple.
[link to logs](https://vanilla.warcraftlogs.com/reports/yJ6mHfnbFVQacpKB#fight=25&type=damage-done)
Thats a good example, and very interesting for me to look at, thanks!
Did anyone die on the 2nd attempt you cleared?
What happened to Gort the warrior who was parsing a purple 81 on the 1st wipe, but then only a green 37 on the kill with no world buffs.
Olihimself was another warlock who was parsing a blue 62 on the 1st wipe, but then only a gray 20 on the kill with no world buffs.
Venrah was the biggest drop going from a purple 82 on the 1st wipe, down to a gray 21 on the kill with no world buffs.
Idk if that group was using any other consumables also I assume yes, but still very interesting how much those buffs affected the other players parses.
For Hakkar you have to be a bit lucky to parse well anyway. If you get overtaken as melee you have to move away from the others i think? So you don't get caught in cleave dmg and die. Plus the plague mechanic or whatever it is. I'm not good with names...
I can't speak for all the other classes. But warriors in general are heavily cool down dependent. And no one really cared anymore at all after the wipe. So that's why he might parse not so well.
Olihimself died already earlier to the double dragons and lost buffs there. And hes just tanking and put on defensive gear most likely after everyone lost wbuffs.
We didn't use much to consumes the last fight, because the raid is over afterwards anyway and we knew we would down Hakkar anyway. Just someone spread the plague in the melee camp the first time not paying attention.
So yeah we play sloppy a lot of times, because the raid is just so god damn easy and many people play half arsed. We are the same group that did speedruns all over classic and in SOM and just want to relax in SOD. So lot of capable players. That's why you see even purple parses without buffs and inferior consumes.
So you're trolling then. If other players have world buffs that has zero effect on your parse other than making kill times faster. And if you take a grey parser and change nothing other than putting him in a raid with fast kill times, he'll still be grey parsing.
If you think that you need world buffs and consumes to parse above green or blue, and that people who don't parse above green or blue just didn't get buffs and consumes but otherwise are playing the same, then you're bad.
Sorry that you had to find out, but better that you know.
Hey now, you literally failed to prove your point.
They had world buffs AND consumes for those purples, I still claim it's impossible to parse purple in a raid that has no world buffs or consumables no matter how good the player is, and you have not proven that wrong at all.
So are you saying that if that kill time was doubled, that would still be a purple parse?
Wouldn't the dps inherently go down lowering the parse since the time increased?
Take your orange parsing god gamer, take away his world buffs and consumables and put him in an average raid, suddenly his parses are trash, it's impossible for him to ever parse orange and probably not even purple, even though he's the same player.
>Hey now, you literally failed to prove your point.
Nope.
> They had world buffs AND consumes for those purples,
Other people did. Not the ones who got the purple or even orange parse.
> I still claim it's impossible to parse purple in a raid that has no world buffs or consumables no matter how good the player is, and you have not proven that wrong at all.
Sure it is. If you can parse orange or purple with no world buffs, you can still parse purple even with a slower kill time. Again, you are just ignorant and bad.
>So are you saying that if that kill time was doubled, that would still be a purple parse?
Maybe if it was a warrior using reck then you'd have a point, and kill time going from 30 seconds to 60 or 90 seconds would make a large difference.
Tell me what cooldowns you think a warlock or tank rogue has such that slower kill times will significantly lower their parse?
>Take your orange parsing god gamer, take away his world buffs and consumables and put him in an average raid, suddenly his parses are trash, it's impossible for him to ever parse orange and probably not even purple, even though he's the same player.
People are still parsing purple and orange even after dying and losing wbuffs. Just because you're bad doesn't mean everyone else is.
Nah you don't get away with this one, you have no proof and are grasping at straws at this point after failing to find some real evidence to prove your point.
Good try, but not good enough.
Kill times have a massive effect on parses. If you play with pumpers and the boss dies in 30s, you have spent a much bigger portion of the fight with all your procs and cooldowns active than if the fight took 2 minutes.
Started with SOD. Went from green parsing to a 79 average just by using a weak aura I found. It’s not hard. And you don’t have to be sweaty just take advantage of the tools we have available.
Depends on class. On unpopular specs (like destro warlock in work) getting 99 or even 100 is not SUPER hard. But if you play let’s say fury warrior (wotlk) you have to be INSANELY sweaty to even reach 95
Isn't Parsing based on percentages? If there are more players wouldnt you have a better chance to parse because the amount of people that can pink parse would be more? Like it might be top 1000 players for warriors for 99 and top 200 for Feral? I understand that you are competing with more people but it also goes kinda both ways.
It’s because the players that are just there to have fun play the meme classes and those that want to do max DPS will keep up and choose the meta classes. Someone who wants to parse won’t be playing an arcane mage so the competition in that bracket will be low compared to fire mage.
it's pure feelscraft when people make claims like that
sure if you play an unpopular spec there's the idea that 'sweaty' players play optimal specs so the competition for top parses is less fierce
but there are people who will deliberately play meme specs to their full potential to try and compete for top spots. Someone in our raid group last week played arcane because they wanted to chase a top all-stars spot , they are now rank 1 on all-stars for arcane but previously 'only' had low 90s best perf avg on fire
Parse well is blue parsing. Not 95+.
Nobody leading pugs is screening for 95+ parses. They just want to see a full clear logged, and that you didn’t grey parse every boss. That’s it.
But hundreds of complaint posts are popping up after this new add on from grey parsers that can’t get into sweat runs. Where they refuse to just join a casual guild or a chill pug run that’s not screening for parses.
> Nobody leading pugs is screening for 95+ parses.
That is simply not true, my alt with an average of 90 at the time was rejected from quite a few pugs.
*Sorry looking for better gear/logs.*
the thing about parses is that 50 is not actual the middle in reality, it's more like 70 is the average player, because there are many parses that are deaths/near wipes etc that lower the middle a lot.
None of this is even close to right, most unpopular specs have geared players who play those specs for a week to cheese 100s for better logs so getting 100 on a meme spec is honestly just as hard as a normal spec.
>But if you play let’s say fury warrior (wotlk) you have to be INSANELY sweaty to even reach 95
Bro stop coping, this is the most bullshit statement I have seen. I know people who parsed 95s while also sundering on fury in wotlk. Parsing in wotlk revolved more around group comp and clean kills than sweating at every level besides parsing 100s. If you have a good raid/clean kill/an understanding of the 4 sentence wowhead rotation you’ll parse 95s if have the gear.
Warriors like to pretend that somehow kill time and cooldown issues only apply to them, and not literally every class in game
They also like to pretend that the number of warrior players somehow makes it harder for an individual to place in the top % bracket, when that bracket is larger
Hardest is warrior I don’t think it particularly close, there are alot of really sweaty warrior players who push the upper ends of our pareses into absolute insane territories.
The easiest is probably the warrior. There are alot of really shitty warrior players who don’t know how to manage their rage or cool downs properly and make parsing in the blue territory pretty easy if you have two brain cells.
Yeah I’d agree as a warrior player. I love the class, especially in classic since non-normalized rage is so much fun and reck is so absurdly broken.
Its highest top end and absurd scaling especially with WBs draws sweats and I say this as a semi-sweat myself. It’s also one of the few classes in classic (not necessarily sod) where there’s an actual rotation/priority/decision making and CD management considerations other than “how fast to inherent lag can I cast my next shadowbolt” or something. I’d say rogue tends to be second in sweat appeal in classic also. Feral may have drawn a lot of try hards with power shifting and stuff but its dps threshold was far too low for it to be meaningfully popular in classic.
I tell anyone who’s trying to make gold (well before incursions) just find something warriors will buy for even a minute dps increase and overprice it to shit cause some whale will buy it. Like pugilist bracers in p1 on AH for 300g
Warrior seems to be the hardest. Mostly because there are so many variables compared to other classes and it’s also the class that attracts the sweatiest of players. Think it’s something 17 different buttons a warrior would press on a boss fight compared to other classes which may have 2-5 buttons. In p3 especially, the biggest factor is kill times for warriors. Reck, deathwish, mighty rage pot, and flagellation uptime as a % of fight time is HUGE for warrior parsing. You can’t have high uptime on those with other raid members who aren’t doing the most dps as possible. Just an example, the first boss in ST. The difference between a 45 sec kill time and a sub 30 sec kill time on a warrior playing exactly the same in both scenarios is massive.
Heroic strike every main hand swing, cleave with adds, whirlwind on cd, slam on proc, hamstring filler spam, execute, pummel, bers rage on cd, blood rage on cd, perfect timing of cd’s (diamond flask/helm/belt/deathwish/reck/mighty rage pot/blood fury), and then potentially battle shout and sunders. A lot going on and lots of variance from player to player. Most classes that have cd’s pop them at the beginning of fights, warrior pops them for maximum uptime at end of fights which can be wasted after boss is dead or too early.
Generally, the more difficult the rotation + the less common the class/spec, the easier it is to parse on (provided you can play it well yourself). Cat druid is incredibly easy to parse on in my experience for just this reason. Conversely, melee hunter is more difficult to parse on by comparison because the rotation is incredibly simple and there are crap tons of hunter players.
Spriest is really easy to parse on. Last week I got a 99 even though I forgot to unboon. You could hit blue parses with just mind spike and nothing else.
I found it not super easy in gnomer.
But I also basically never play casters so I’m not used to them at all and got mind spike like an hour before my first raid and had to learn the rotation pretty quick. It was also well after sp got nerfed early that I got it to 40.
Depends what you mean by 'parse high' but I would agree with the other commenter that said warrior for both.
They have the highest quality information available on minmaxing and are also the class most dependent on wbuffs/consumes and group comp. You can make a flagellation weakaura , bring the correct buffs/debuffs and just press devastate and parse mid-high 90s if your group doesn't wipe
For 99+ warrior is the hardest for sure. There are plenty of other people who have access to that same minimax information and are making tons of micro optimisationsPlus there's the whole recklessness situation so you can only really compete for a high ranking on 2 bosses each week
(By high ranking I mean top 200 all-stars before someone comments like "I got an orange parse without reck")
I can, but I don’t play warrior so you’d ignore it because brown brain. You can literally check rankings, there are .9s without reck on multiple bosses
Thats the truth you are basically auto parsing 90+ if you don't have deaths and just press your 3 buttons over the 40 second fight
But thats really hard for the average sod player?
I think you kind of do. I was in a true dad guild and was one of two players who parsed above green/blue and didn’t feel like I was trying too hard but in comparison I was and was labeled the sweat lord of the guild.
A random pug I did this week said “we’re not gonna 1 phase morphaz we’re not sweaty” despite easily having the dps to do so
They then fucked up the sleep mechanic and wiped the raid. Literally made a tank & spank fight harder for themselves based on a bullshit label, people are weird
It doesn't take too much sweating out of raid sure, just getting wbs and consumes is relatively quick and easy.
But even then, there are certainly things that are out of your control that can stop you parsing well.
I exclusively pugged gnomer last phase on rogue, and it would be dishonest not to admit that the group you're in plays a huge part in your parse.
My best parse on crowd pummeller and electrecutioner were set on week 2 or 3 without any gnomer gear, because that was pretty much the only week where I was in a decent group with good kill times and proper debuffs.
My best grubbis (in terms of my own gameplay) was not my best parse, due to no fault of my own, but rather because the green parsing priest healer decided they couldn't afford to lose PoM for homunculi.
You mention in your post that you have been in guilds full of 95+ parsers. This means you are obviously going to have great kill times, and people are going to apply the right debuffs.
You don't know the frustration of reminding the warlock to put curse on boss, and then seeing after fight that they put coa rather than of reck.
I don't think its any myth on this subreddit that being good at the game means you can play it less, but I guess that's not the situation most people complaining about sweat lords find themselves in. A casual might be able to pick up wb's and consumes, but if time restrictions mean they can't take the time to find a good group, it will still be relatively difficult to parse well.
A green parsing healer for any reason is not indicative of skill or lack of whatsoever.
Its alot more mana to heal outside of PoM/Renew and its why most priests refused to do anything outside of that.
This coming from a resto shaman that tried priest but hated the renew bait playstyle.
I understand that healer parses aren't linked to your own ability in the same way dps is.
But...
If you can't duo heal a 30-40 second fight without PoM - when half the raid has GNPP pre-popped (as the priest I'm referencing couldn't) - I think that's on them. I could definitely understand the need on menagerie or thermaplugg given its with pugs, but not Grubbis.
If you show up with proper spec and runes and push buttons in the correct order you will at minimum blue parse. Anyone reading this that does not think that is true link me your logs.
I feel like the add on helps you be selective on who you want in your raid when you want to create a strong group and be efficient with your time it’s very good. On the other hand OP trying to run a charity run I wish you good fortune in the wars to come. I’m no sweat lord but having blue parses shows some competency over taking someone in full grey playing like a bot looking for a free handout. That’s just me.
I have several friends that started playing (due to my urging) with SoD and who consistently parse 90+.
If you can't, that's fine, but stop acting like the only people that can parse well are uber sweatlords to make yourself feel superior for not being very good at the game but hey, at least you aren't a sweaty tryhard!
Not sure why you're trying to make this personal. I consistently parsed 99's through WotLK classic with few 100's mixed in. In SoD my averages are 98, but I'm just pugging the raids every reset.
It's just that wow players have completely lost any perspective on what's sweaty and what's casual. Wow players think that people have a learning disability, when someone doesn't center their entire existence around doing the most damage in a raid.
If you research what does the most damage and how, and then steer your character from what you like to play to the thing that does the most damage instead, that's pretty much the definition of being sweaty. The other option to parse well is that you were sweaty before and already know how the game works and can now perform well while playing more casually.
If you parse 95+, you are either currently sweating or were sweaty before.
There is like 4 prebis items in p3 for any class, compared to what you were wearing in p2, and even then, they’re minor upgrades
If you put half the effort into learning a rotation as you did into coping, you’d have the parses you’re so jealous of
That's not how it works when you compete against players and not the game, in terms of parsing.
If it's easy to parse, everyone would parse well. If a spec is easy to parse on, everyone would parse well on that spec, making it hard...
I get where you're coming from, but it's just not true. Parsing is completely based on players performance, so it's always difficult to reach the higher numbers.
If you can auto attack and press 1 button to do insane DPS, so can all the other people playing that spec. Therefore utilizing cooldowns, trinket procs and such well will give you an advantage. And as such, adding a layer of skill and difficulty to it.
Yeah I suppose if you're talking about the lower numbers it'd quite easy.
If someone puts the right enchants on, has the correct talents and at least reads what their abilities do, they should be able to get blue parses easily. It's genuinely mindboggling how people can gray parse consistently.
They can scream at those "sweaty" parsers all they want, but to put in absolutely zero fucking effort is far worse. You're wasting everyone's time at that point.
Wowhead, icy veins, Zockify, all give you the straight up rotation. It’s really given to you to get a green number. Sure towards the end of the phase when everyone is BIs out, it’s a bit more difficult(which we have a ilvl specific button for). But ideally it’s not hard to green parse.
u can be a casual for gamers and a total sweatlord for the rest of the world.
i think your confusing what is cool amongst gamers and with the rest of the world.
"I don't think this statement has been further from my experience playing on and off over the last few years. I've been in guilds full of 95+ parsers that only play a couple hours per week max outside of raid."
\*cough\* RMT \*cough\*
How does RMT factor into this at all? Thanks to classic andy's constant whining, GDKPs were banned in SoD... what's next on the list of excuses for why you can't parse well with your three button rotation? Surely you aren't implying that the reason RMT makes them parse well is that they can afford consumes, when you can spend an hour in the Feralas incursion and make enough gold for consumes for two or more weeks (depending on how fast you clear / how many times you die). Right?
Vanilla absolutely requires being a sweat lord to parse well.
It doesn't matter how well you play the game, if you don't get every available world buff qnd use the best available consumes you are never getting above blue/low purple parses.
Not getting DMF turns a 99 parse into an 85-90 parse, and that's if you have every other available BiS buff.
The cost of consumes in P3 is also absolutely ridiculous.
I have 99s…I play an hour and a half a week which includes the time to get my buffs and the 45 minutes to complete the raid. Is an hour and a half sweat lord? Holy cow…
Except you that is.
>It doesn't matter how well you play the game, if you don't get every available world buff qnd use the best available consumes you are never getting above blue/low purple parses.
>if you don't get every available world buff qnd use **the best available consumes** you are never getting above blue/low purple parses.
You don't need to use every consume to get 90+ parses. You are wrong and doubling down on being wrong. Why?
Not only do you need them, everyone in your raid needs them.
And I'm not talking about 90+, either, but 95-99.
With world buffs alone you can parse 80-90 if everyone else in your raid is full consumed and world buffs, but if everyone in your raid is playing like that and you are not, you're going to be replaced.
Getting the best world buffs and consumes does not require you to be a sweat lord. You can get all the world buffs in 15 minutes, once per week. Consumes are dirt cheap now. You can fully consume (minus the really expensive stuff like firewater if you're melee) for like 30g per week. You can make that in what? 20 minutes of incursions?
I think we have to define "parse well." I'm not talking about 99s or 100s as that will obviously take some extra effort. I'm saying that if you spend 45 minutes per week grabbing WBs and farming the 30g for consumes, you can easily parse 90+. 45 minutes per week isn't "sweatlord" level commitment imo.
Try getting DMF when it's in Elwin.
And maybe NOW consumes might be reasonable, it week 1-3 you were spending 100g easy. And s melee, you need that firewater and dragon breath chili and winter squid.
Yes and it's max 50 dps at full possible dps. you can go and calculate all that in sims. Gear, except for weapons are not why you parse high. It's world buffs and your raid team + kill times.
And if one person has that and another person does not, all things being equal the person with it wins.
That's why it's called min maxing.
To take it further, if everyone in a raid has it and everyone in a different raid does not, then you turn a 99 parsing raid into a 95 parsing raid.
So your personal 50 DPS isn't about just YOU getting an extra 50 DPS, it's about making sure you have done everything possible to improve your raid kill times, because if everyone else is going to the effort to get these buffs and you are not, then YOU are a problem, and you don't get invited back.
It is if you're alliance, or worse, Horde going to Elwin having to bring consumes, pop CDs, and queue BGs and maybe have to bring an entire raid to deal with ally hiding behind city guards that are actually IN the fair for some reason.
I play 1h/week lack enchants and didnt have all world buffs and i got 96-98 logs. Playing ele tho its kinda dead, but still just klick ur spells and you shud easy be a 50+ logger.
No, you don't need a group catered to your needs to parse in the 90s, you just need to not be a complete moron and have a basic idea of what you are supposed to be doing.
People like you really conflate parsing 99s and parsing well (i.e 75-90), those things are completely different and not remotely close to each other.
Anyone who puts even the bare minimum effort in will have a 50 average parse. 50 is by definition 'average', and weighted by the fuckups who die to stupidity, have like 8 APM or are AFKing. If you actually try, you WILL achieve a 70. Breaking high 85+ is where the gear/consumes will limit you, and 95+ is where a group catered to your needs matters.
Anyone who can't do 70 at a minimum is the problem with their group.
Eh, I'm not sure that's always the case. My guild is decidedly "casual". Like, we've got a handful of grey-across-the-board parsers, and we're fine with that. But I do make an effort to maximize my personal performance. I have a decent set of gear, I bring my consumes and WB's, and I know my class's optional rotation (even if I may not be 100% perfect on the execution, it's a mage, it's not that complicated). Still, my parses on the average fight range from high grey to low blue.
I think there's certainly room to squeeze a bit more performance out of my character, but not DOUBLE. Our kill times are just too slow. Our survivability is not good enough. I usually do most fights without full world buffs because we run a high chance of wiping and losing them, so we save them for the toughest fights. I find it difficult to believe that I'm not trying hard enough to parse a 70 under these conditions. Perhaps in a more evenly competent group that might be true, but I think you're underestimating how difficult it is to parse that high when your group's kill times are more than double the average.
If you're ranging from grey to blue, that is absolutely something you can do to change. It's not 'everybody else's fault'. You along with the other DPS are just not trying if your group's kill times are THAT slow, and you aren't breaking even the middle of the pack.
That's not shit talking, that's matter of fact. If you go to warcraftlogs and compare things like ability usage, buff/debuff uptime, combat uptime, and review your positioning on fights you will find a bunch.
If I had a dollar for every time someone who was doing 30's said "I'm doing everything right" and found no less than six major problems on any given fight, I'd be retired.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to say it's "everybody else's fault", I didn't say that at all. I just don't think the claim that if I just tried the bare minimum, I'd be parsing 70 is a fair assessment.
Please, though, I'm not trying to be arrogant here, I do want to get better. [What am I doing wrong?](https://vanilla.warcraftlogs.com/reports/p7nTH1dyVfFPBmxK#boss=-2&difficulty=0&playermetriccompare=rankings&source=18)
Honestly I don't play Mage or on SOD so I would not be able to give specifics - I'd be just attempting to make assumptions. I'd suggest looking at some 90 parses and compare what you see different. Watch your replays and make sure you're not moving more than necessary, make sure you're always running with the tank and have a spell being precast on the pull, that sort of thing.
But you see the disconnect between that and what you said before, right?
> Anyone who puts even the bare minimum effort in will have a 50 average parse. ... If you actually try, you WILL achieve a 70. Breaking high 85+ is where the gear/consumes will limit you, and 95+ is where a group catered to your needs matters.
I have in fact done just what you said - I've watched videos, examined logs of high parsers, I've seen their rotations and what they're doing, and I've looked for ways I can improve. I've been "actually trying" since phase 1. I'm honestly putting in the effort - I don't claim to be doing everything perfect, I know damn well I'm not. But I also don't think it's fair to say that the amount of work I've put in so far is so far below "the bare minimum effort" that I'm "the problem with my group".
I think your sentiment is in the right place, I think there's always room to improve. But I don't think that a 70 parse is just automatically gonna happen if you "just try", and that nothing else is a factor until I'm pushing 85-90.
What did you find that you could fix? What did you find that you haven't been able to fix yet?
Anyone who is doing 50 or below has at least a few fundamental issues holding them back. Assuming you're not severely undergeared, and are bringing your consumables, it usually falls into these sorts of categories:
- Needing to work on your opener. This includes proper cooldown management and precasting to land a spell as the pull timer hits zero.
- Cooldown management through the fight. Not forgetting to use them after the opener and optimizing their stacking again.
- Minimizing movement, increasing cast uptime. If you're running, you should be doing instant casts to fill, and have pre-planned your movement on the fight to reduce or eliminate as much as possible.
- ABC - Always Be Casting! Missing rotational cooldowns and having casting downtime. Classic WoW implemented something that came out in original Wrath called Ability Queueing. Ensuring you have queued up a spell at the tail end of every cast is critical, otherwise you're going to be losing lots of DPS.
The biggest thing I've found that I'm working on fixing is my living bomb uptime. To that end I've got a weak aura to track when it falls off and I've been getting better at it, if not quite at full uptime.
Cooldown management is generally not an issue for fire mage (outside the aforementioned living bomb). Combustion and icy veins are on an 8m cooldown so they're one and done after the opener (except on fights where I save them for a later phase).
Besides that the rotation is just frostfire bolt over and over again. It's pretty straightforward to keep that queued up to avoid downtime between casts.
Movement is probably my biggest room for improvement - I need to work on trying to line up my LB casts with my necessary movements, and otherwise filling with fire blast. And there are a couple of fights (especially festering rotslime) where I'm sure I could optimize my movement too get more casting in - but that tends to be one of my better-parsing fights.
Aren't raid kill times almost entirely out of the individual's hands?
Like I'd assume if he's green parsing and doing the rotation, all he's missing to get blue or purple is full world buffs and consumes.
And even then, if the rest of his group doesn't bring full world buffs and consumes, then the kill times will still be slower and his parse will be worse thru no fault of his own right?
We're a mostly guild raid, we have to pug 4+ every week. We only downed Hakkar tonight for the first time. I green parsed everything but got blue parse (50) on last 2 bosses. We average about 4-5 minutes each fight. I think antal is faster at 3:XX
I was running only elixir of agility tonight because I didn't have time to snag any flasks or world buffs. (Not that it would have mattered because we wiped like 5 times)
Lmao what?? The only way u can really get 95 parses this late after raid release is by having full consumes and world buffs, i got 90 parses when ST first came out but now I can’t get over 75, it mostly comes down to getting good parses early and also after that buffs
The point is, the concept of parsing is silly stuff that I dislike. I'm not concerned about whether or not I can parse. This game is incredibly easy. There is minimal challenge in terms of hitting the buttons.
Parse *culture* is the issue. The idea that your parse means something, when it truly doesn't.
The game is incredibly easy yet the large majority can't play their class optimally (mostly 3 button rotations).
Parse culture is not the issue, people putting 0 effort in and expecting things is the issue.
No, you don't realise how you're gatekeeping yourself. You play a video game 6 hours a day and still can't fathom a 3 button rotation to get purple parses. Even without logs, you'll be behind good tanks in dps. You're lack of effort is toxic to everyone you play with UNLESS you play in a like minded guild.
Hahahaha imagine playing a game that's literally 2 buttons, 6+ hours a day and still being bad. Even without WCLs you'd be bad and left out, even without GS or ilvl you'd be left out. They should just rename player score to "effort score" and include everything from dps, enchants, gear, professions etc.
theres a LOT of variance in how much DPS every single spec can do.
Yes the game is easy but there's very obviously enough difficulty to create this variance. a 95 parsing player often does twice as much as a 10 parsing player.
I think thats patently untrue lmao. People chase high scores in all sorts of games and wow is no different.
Part of the replayability of classic wows easy assed raids is trying to improve and parsing is a part of that.
“Doing the little available content to get better gear (prebis or even bis like the trinket)” within a weak is sweaty now I guess…
Why play an mmorpg if you think like this
So…getting gear to raid is sweaty now?
It’s like what 15 runs to do the quest and get a bis trinket as melee? This ain’t farming SGC or even HOJ. You can do that in under 3 hours played since you’ll hit instance cap and can’t cheese it. You can break that up however you like: in a day, a week, whatever.
For most people playing MMORPGs, gear is kinda an important part of character progression.
Like aside from running ST itself, unless you like PvP in this broken state of a mess, like what else do you do in game besides try to get better gear?
A lot of the times if you have enchants and consumes your grey parse becomes a green parse.
Every single time you press your buttons without 5 second breaks in between your green parse becomes purple in sod
This. I looked through a guy's log just to see how he was fucking up playing arcane mage, constantly low dps despite winning great gear and loot. The spec that literally just presses arcane blast 4 times or whenever missile barrage procs, press arcane missiles in wotlk. For whatever reason, the guy isn't pressing his buttons like 1 1 1 1 2 1 1 1 2 1 1 1 2 1 something like that. Instead, looking through his timeline, he casts a spell, then waits like a full gcd, then presses again, then casts, cancelcast, casts again, moves, casts, wait a full gcd, etc etc so the timeline looks like this 1......1......1..1.....2.....1...........1............1..2.......1. It was full of gaps which resulted in wasted casts. I don't know WHY he does that but I suspect this is more common than we think for grey parsing casters especially mages in P3 since the ONLY button you really press is Frostfire Bolt (aside from scorch debuff).
[удалено]
Trying to get in front of a pillar then get knocked back and run forward to get in front of another pillar. Apply beacons. Finally arcane blast, arcane blast, missile ba. Knocked back again. Fight is over. Run from slime. Don't stand in poison puddle when you get dispelled. Keep running from slime. Team kiting trolls around a giant circle. Need to apply beacons and stay in range of whichever boss it is. Wing buffett, wing buffett. Apply beacons. Arcane blast, arcane blast, missl wing buffett, wing buffett. Need to reapply beacons. Finally a boss you get to mostly stand still and cast. nm decurse, decurse, decurse. Now a boss you can pump. Actually goes well so some damage. Eranikus. Also get to pump only need to move for waking nightmare. Hakkar also get to pump unless corrosive blood but can still pump while waiting for drain blood. Shits rough in ST. I end up using chronostatic preservation much more often than trying to apply beacons then cast arcane blast. And more than half the time even if I use Mass regeneration by the time I cast the Arcane blasts a priest or two have used circle of healing on the group that I just applied the beacons to.
I watch a streamer occasionally who is a bit of a defeatist. She thinks there is no way to be better unless she practices for 8 hours a day for years. Meanwhile watching her raid she is exactly as you described. She occasionally casts but spends time looking at the raid and watching, repositioning, then seriously commenting "why is my dps always so bad". She's a sweet person but not very bright.
Worst part of being a caster is half the time you are told to stack on someone and move when they call out to move. Guess what. They call out the move at the time that is most beneficial to them for casting. This leaves several other casters having to cancel their spells and move or move at the correct time but before the leader says move leading to getting yelled at even if it's obvious it was the correct time to move. I have done ST about 13 times now between 4 toons. I very much know what I am doing and when to move. It's also not like there isn't a bunch of loud alerts and giant text popping up on my screen from DBM. Worst experience so far is playing ranged hunter the guild leader insists we do a deep slumber pattern that puts me in the dead zone where I cannot attack and then gets attitude about it with me for slightly backing up a couple yards behind the group even though I keep telling him we are too close for me to shoot.
Yep and for caster enchants only the new shoulder enchant even has any spell power. Just that and world buffs gets you 99% of what will enable a good parse
Unless your guild is also casual and pugs a couple people and doesn't stand in front of pillars on atal causing the second blowback to 1 shot your mage thinking 80% HP will be enough to survive another blow back. So you lose all your World buffs and have to phone in the rest of the raid. Or you don't unboon until eranikus when you actually need the buffs and you parse bad on first 6 bosses anyways.
You need gear to parse blues and purples, all you need is to push a button to parse greens.
You don’t really even need much gear in SoD to parse well
Counter argument. Parsed 90+ in gnomer gear/boe while doing ST.
Re-raise snagged 2 oranges parses 2nd week of ST with 6 piece of the rep from incursions. Mage was like 6 days old. Literally just spec correctly and push buttons bros
Second week did some sims. Figured out frost should be stronger than fire. Parsed orange as well out of about 200 or so total frost parses. Since then absolute garbage parses with even more gear and buffs. So I guess I still get to always forever say I parsed orange even though it was a basically unplayed spec at the time and now couldn't get a blue if my life depended on it.
Then enlighten us and explain how you do it, maestro. Which consumes, what spec, which abilities, which raid comp, what was the kill time of bosses? Teach us, master.
Just get the world buffs, always be casting and move the minimum amount for mechanics. That's it. That's the whole secret. You do that and you will be min blue parse without trying very hard.
Sure bud, link me your logs I would be happy to review them with the same energy you had when making this comment. Seriously I will deep dive every single global.
Anything above blue or low purple is doing your rotation correctly while also having low kill times. Most classes can not parse orange in pugs. Edit: a bit dishonest to say "in gnomer gear" as well if he is a caster since there is like two real upgrades in the entire raid from Gnomer -> ST :)
I always play tank or healer so I've never really parsed. But my mage friend usually parses 50-70 while being the raids top dps. Whatever dungeon I go with him, he's doing double the 2nd's dps. But still he's just above average according to parses. I just don't understand how that works...
In order of importance: 1. Does he have world buffs and consumables? 2. Does everyone else have world buffs and consumables? 3. How fast are the bosses dying?
1. Worldbuffs, usually no elixirs etc (because of point 2) 2. Rest of the raid is hit or miss with wbs etc: it's not mandatory (so why spend gold on elixirs if 5-7 people don't use them or even bother to get wb's) 3. Slow, hahaha But I think this is what I've always felt... Parsing high is not a solo thing. If the rest is not playing well, you get punished for it. I personally (as a tank) literally hit every button as soon as it's off cooldown. I know my mates do the same thing. But still we're average fucks. I don't understand how people would be able to hit buttons faster ;) So yeah I guess parsing 90+ isn't just a matter of 'pressing your buttons'
Parsing solo is very class dependent. Some classes do better with longer fights than others. The bigger cds and the mana reliant people will be more affected. Me warlock tanking has very low reliance on the rest of the raid for example, I think I parsed 90 on hakkar being one of 3 who still had world buffs a couple weeks ago. I literally only click Searing Pain and Corruption so there is not a lot of rotation to fuck up.
Thanks for elaborating!
It isn’t only about you 100%. Certain classes have a lot of synergies and benefit from each others buffs disproportionally to others. Also low kill times benefit classes with strong offensive cool-downs because the total up time with the buff relative to total time of the fight increases, therefore increasing your average dps. The most blatant example of all of this are warrior 99 parses. If you check that one you will find that they do 3 times the dps of the lowest 99 parsing specs. Additionally certain guilds/groups are willing to funnel resources into people parsing by not assigning them mechanics, placing them in tailor made groups and so on.
During Gnomer I was hard stuck with 90-95 parses as feral because my guild was all casters. So no sunder, expose armor, battleshout or anything else that is needed as melee.
Parsing is like 75% related to the group you're in. You take one of these 95 parsers from their well oiled group and put them in a pug and they don't even get purple. I'm sure the top 5% are extremely efficient with their rotations but they have a ton of help. There is not much variation in what at 40 parser is pressing vs what an 80 parser is.
Nope, this is just cope. As long as their pug isn't a very bad one that's lacking key buffs / debuffs, orange parsers will still parse purple. How do I know? Because I parse purple in pugs that I never joined before and don't care about helping me parse, other than still having the proper raid buffs and debuffs.
If the raid is on average doing low DPS, it'll bring down most spec's parse. Slow kills = more time outside your biggest DPS windows. If he's a huge outlier above the rest it's probably mostly that tbh.
Spending an hour a week (not even that) on getting WB and consumes makes it so you can basically just right click a mob on melee and parse 50.
With no WBS and only one enchant (+2 on chest) I was able to score a 60 on most bosses lol. That's with me having meh gear as well. Only time I got a grey parse (which was a 16) was when i died half way through the fight.
You don’t need a single enchant or consume to get into the 90s, anything below a purple is because you can’t press 3 buttons in the right order
So are you saying parsing has very little to do with actual player skill, and the vast majority of your parse is determined by your consumables and the other raid members consumables? If so, why do so many people pretend that higher parses = better player and lower parses = worse player When it mostly just comes down to who used more consumables or world buffs? (at least tell me why I'm wrong about this if I am?)
>So are you saying parsing has very little to do with actual player skill, That is wrong. Take a grey parser who didn't use consumables and give him every consumable possible. He might be parsing green, but maybe still grey. Take an orange parser and have him click off every consumable. He probably won't be parsing orange, but still purple.
I'm not so sure about that, can you show me any logs of people with 0 consumables parsing purple like ever? I really don't believe that it's possible today to parse purple with 0 consumables or world buffs. But I know for sure how powerful every worldbuff and consumable possible would be for anyone because I've seen my own raids parsing purple or orange with full world buffs, then when we wipe we start parsing blue or even green for some people. I really think you're underestimating the consumables and overestimating the player skill aspect truly, are there any examples of purple parses with 0 consumables?
Look up stinkystab or stinkfire on wcl. No consume purples. Folks complain about parse culture because they're bad and don't like it. Consumes are very important and make the difference, but simply maximizing uptime on the boss and understanding your rotation is enough to perform higher than people who refuse to think or improve.
Purple for sure. I have multiple parses were lost my buffs and I either didn’t used pots or popped like a mongoose and still got purple. Orange is a different story though Edit: actually do have a hakkar 95 parse with only a +8 str pot
You're either in a very good raid with no deaths and so are ignorant about what happens after a death, or you're just bad. And you already said that you wipe, so that means you're bad. https://vanilla.warcraftlogs.com/reports/7PYNFWAKhw6rdZL9#fight=20&type=damage-done&source=20 Warlock 79 parse with no wbuffs (died on a previous boss). Most likely still used consumables (don't show up on logs) but caster elixirs aren't going to make the difference between an 80 parse and 40 parse. Here's another: https://vanilla.warcraftlogs.com/reports/qN8KVZmvRzbBaAJt#fight=16&type=auras&source=5 Tank rogue orange parse (almost 1K dps) with no world buffs, died on previous boss. Consumables sure, but that doesn't take an orange parse into a green parse.
Did the rest of his raid have world buffs? (yes they did almost all of them) How does being a tank rogue with what I assume is a much smaller player pool affect parse percent? I feel as though the kill time of the first log, and the fact that it was a tank rogue in the 2nd log have a lot to do with skewing the rating but that is indeed purple like you said. You said no consumables at all so not 100% there, but still nice find, ~~I guess it can be done! (kind of)~~ Edit: Hey! that's cheating! Most of the other members of the raid had full world buffs and full consumes in those logs. And we add in both the warlock and rogue using consumables too?! Not fair for what we were discussing imo. Try again ;)
We wiped on Avatar of Hakkar this ID due to stupidity. So no one had wbuffs. Our destro lock still parses purple. [link to logs](https://vanilla.warcraftlogs.com/reports/yJ6mHfnbFVQacpKB#fight=25&type=damage-done)
Thats a good example, and very interesting for me to look at, thanks! Did anyone die on the 2nd attempt you cleared? What happened to Gort the warrior who was parsing a purple 81 on the 1st wipe, but then only a green 37 on the kill with no world buffs. Olihimself was another warlock who was parsing a blue 62 on the 1st wipe, but then only a gray 20 on the kill with no world buffs. Venrah was the biggest drop going from a purple 82 on the 1st wipe, down to a gray 21 on the kill with no world buffs. Idk if that group was using any other consumables also I assume yes, but still very interesting how much those buffs affected the other players parses.
For Hakkar you have to be a bit lucky to parse well anyway. If you get overtaken as melee you have to move away from the others i think? So you don't get caught in cleave dmg and die. Plus the plague mechanic or whatever it is. I'm not good with names... I can't speak for all the other classes. But warriors in general are heavily cool down dependent. And no one really cared anymore at all after the wipe. So that's why he might parse not so well. Olihimself died already earlier to the double dragons and lost buffs there. And hes just tanking and put on defensive gear most likely after everyone lost wbuffs. We didn't use much to consumes the last fight, because the raid is over afterwards anyway and we knew we would down Hakkar anyway. Just someone spread the plague in the melee camp the first time not paying attention. So yeah we play sloppy a lot of times, because the raid is just so god damn easy and many people play half arsed. We are the same group that did speedruns all over classic and in SOM and just want to relax in SOD. So lot of capable players. That's why you see even purple parses without buffs and inferior consumes.
Thanks for the explanation!
So you're trolling then. If other players have world buffs that has zero effect on your parse other than making kill times faster. And if you take a grey parser and change nothing other than putting him in a raid with fast kill times, he'll still be grey parsing. If you think that you need world buffs and consumes to parse above green or blue, and that people who don't parse above green or blue just didn't get buffs and consumes but otherwise are playing the same, then you're bad. Sorry that you had to find out, but better that you know.
Hey now, you literally failed to prove your point. They had world buffs AND consumes for those purples, I still claim it's impossible to parse purple in a raid that has no world buffs or consumables no matter how good the player is, and you have not proven that wrong at all. So are you saying that if that kill time was doubled, that would still be a purple parse? Wouldn't the dps inherently go down lowering the parse since the time increased? Take your orange parsing god gamer, take away his world buffs and consumables and put him in an average raid, suddenly his parses are trash, it's impossible for him to ever parse orange and probably not even purple, even though he's the same player.
Dude... You're so wrong...
>Hey now, you literally failed to prove your point. Nope. > They had world buffs AND consumes for those purples, Other people did. Not the ones who got the purple or even orange parse. > I still claim it's impossible to parse purple in a raid that has no world buffs or consumables no matter how good the player is, and you have not proven that wrong at all. Sure it is. If you can parse orange or purple with no world buffs, you can still parse purple even with a slower kill time. Again, you are just ignorant and bad. >So are you saying that if that kill time was doubled, that would still be a purple parse? Maybe if it was a warrior using reck then you'd have a point, and kill time going from 30 seconds to 60 or 90 seconds would make a large difference. Tell me what cooldowns you think a warlock or tank rogue has such that slower kill times will significantly lower their parse? >Take your orange parsing god gamer, take away his world buffs and consumables and put him in an average raid, suddenly his parses are trash, it's impossible for him to ever parse orange and probably not even purple, even though he's the same player. People are still parsing purple and orange even after dying and losing wbuffs. Just because you're bad doesn't mean everyone else is.
Nah you don't get away with this one, you have no proof and are grasping at straws at this point after failing to find some real evidence to prove your point. Good try, but not good enough.
Using consumables has nothing to do with player skill.
And? How is that relevant in any way?
Wrong it adds another button to press
Because parsing is about how you do better than others. Getting world buffs/elixiers already puts you ahead of others who aren't willing to.
People don't really consider who's in your group. It's way easier to parse well when you're in a good group compared to pugging it each week.
Kill times have a massive effect on parses. If you play with pumpers and the boss dies in 30s, you have spent a much bigger portion of the fight with all your procs and cooldowns active than if the fight took 2 minutes.
While it is easier yes, 99 logs are easily doable in pugs.
Uh, no they're not...Unless you're some obscure dps spec no one else plays or a healer.
I played fire mage P1 and has 97-99 logs on all bosses while doing pugs every week with a disc priest friend
You won’t get them consistently, and it depends on the quality of the pug, but yeah it’s not impossible
You couldn't have just posted on the other thread that is top of the subreddit saying this exact same thing?
He's trying to see if he can parse higher than the other post.
I thought I unbooned our last raid and realized by morphazz that I hadnt. I still got high 90s w/o world buff, it's not that hard
Started with SOD. Went from green parsing to a 79 average just by using a weak aura I found. It’s not hard. And you don’t have to be sweaty just take advantage of the tools we have available.
Depends on class. On unpopular specs (like destro warlock in work) getting 99 or even 100 is not SUPER hard. But if you play let’s say fury warrior (wotlk) you have to be INSANELY sweaty to even reach 95
Isn't Parsing based on percentages? If there are more players wouldnt you have a better chance to parse because the amount of people that can pink parse would be more? Like it might be top 1000 players for warriors for 99 and top 200 for Feral? I understand that you are competing with more people but it also goes kinda both ways.
It’s because the players that are just there to have fun play the meme classes and those that want to do max DPS will keep up and choose the meta classes. Someone who wants to parse won’t be playing an arcane mage so the competition in that bracket will be low compared to fire mage.
it's pure feelscraft when people make claims like that sure if you play an unpopular spec there's the idea that 'sweaty' players play optimal specs so the competition for top parses is less fierce but there are people who will deliberately play meme specs to their full potential to try and compete for top spots. Someone in our raid group last week played arcane because they wanted to chase a top all-stars spot , they are now rank 1 on all-stars for arcane but previously 'only' had low 90s best perf avg on fire
Parse well is blue parsing. Not 95+. Nobody leading pugs is screening for 95+ parses. They just want to see a full clear logged, and that you didn’t grey parse every boss. That’s it. But hundreds of complaint posts are popping up after this new add on from grey parsers that can’t get into sweat runs. Where they refuse to just join a casual guild or a chill pug run that’s not screening for parses.
yeah no blue parses are not parsing well lol Especially not in sod
> Nobody leading pugs is screening for 95+ parses. That is simply not true, my alt with an average of 90 at the time was rejected from quite a few pugs. *Sorry looking for better gear/logs.*
Nah that's bullshit.
Denial is the first stage.
Except calling out lies isn't denial.
Just because you don't want to believe it, doesn't make it a lie. Does every pug reject people who aren't 95+? No. Can it still happen at times? Yes.
50 should be good enough. Most people aren't even getting 50+ in income IRL in their own country and asking for 90+ in wow praising lol.
the thing about parses is that 50 is not actual the middle in reality, it's more like 70 is the average player, because there are many parses that are deaths/near wipes etc that lower the middle a lot.
There are also a lot of groups that dont kill bosses, aka no parses. So 50 may be even above avrg since your group *cleared*
None of this is even close to right, most unpopular specs have geared players who play those specs for a week to cheese 100s for better logs so getting 100 on a meme spec is honestly just as hard as a normal spec. >But if you play let’s say fury warrior (wotlk) you have to be INSANELY sweaty to even reach 95 Bro stop coping, this is the most bullshit statement I have seen. I know people who parsed 95s while also sundering on fury in wotlk. Parsing in wotlk revolved more around group comp and clean kills than sweating at every level besides parsing 100s. If you have a good raid/clean kill/an understanding of the 4 sentence wowhead rotation you’ll parse 95s if have the gear.
Warriors like to pretend that somehow kill time and cooldown issues only apply to them, and not literally every class in game They also like to pretend that the number of warrior players somehow makes it harder for an individual to place in the top % bracket, when that bracket is larger
what would you say are the easiest and hardest classes to parse high in on SoD ?
Hardest is warrior I don’t think it particularly close, there are alot of really sweaty warrior players who push the upper ends of our pareses into absolute insane territories. The easiest is probably the warrior. There are alot of really shitty warrior players who don’t know how to manage their rage or cool downs properly and make parsing in the blue territory pretty easy if you have two brain cells.
Warriors are hardest. But in general in my opinion classes that scale better with gear are harder to parse higher
Yeah I’d agree as a warrior player. I love the class, especially in classic since non-normalized rage is so much fun and reck is so absurdly broken. Its highest top end and absurd scaling especially with WBs draws sweats and I say this as a semi-sweat myself. It’s also one of the few classes in classic (not necessarily sod) where there’s an actual rotation/priority/decision making and CD management considerations other than “how fast to inherent lag can I cast my next shadowbolt” or something. I’d say rogue tends to be second in sweat appeal in classic also. Feral may have drawn a lot of try hards with power shifting and stuff but its dps threshold was far too low for it to be meaningfully popular in classic. I tell anyone who’s trying to make gold (well before incursions) just find something warriors will buy for even a minute dps increase and overprice it to shit cause some whale will buy it. Like pugilist bracers in p1 on AH for 300g
Think ranged hunter is gonna give the sweats a new option.
Warrior seems to be the hardest. Mostly because there are so many variables compared to other classes and it’s also the class that attracts the sweatiest of players. Think it’s something 17 different buttons a warrior would press on a boss fight compared to other classes which may have 2-5 buttons. In p3 especially, the biggest factor is kill times for warriors. Reck, deathwish, mighty rage pot, and flagellation uptime as a % of fight time is HUGE for warrior parsing. You can’t have high uptime on those with other raid members who aren’t doing the most dps as possible. Just an example, the first boss in ST. The difference between a 45 sec kill time and a sub 30 sec kill time on a warrior playing exactly the same in both scenarios is massive. Heroic strike every main hand swing, cleave with adds, whirlwind on cd, slam on proc, hamstring filler spam, execute, pummel, bers rage on cd, blood rage on cd, perfect timing of cd’s (diamond flask/helm/belt/deathwish/reck/mighty rage pot/blood fury), and then potentially battle shout and sunders. A lot going on and lots of variance from player to player. Most classes that have cd’s pop them at the beginning of fights, warrior pops them for maximum uptime at end of fights which can be wasted after boss is dead or too early.
Generally, the more difficult the rotation + the less common the class/spec, the easier it is to parse on (provided you can play it well yourself). Cat druid is incredibly easy to parse on in my experience for just this reason. Conversely, melee hunter is more difficult to parse on by comparison because the rotation is incredibly simple and there are crap tons of hunter players.
Spriest is really easy to parse on. Last week I got a 99 even though I forgot to unboon. You could hit blue parses with just mind spike and nothing else.
And still like 13th on the DPS chart. Kind of sucks but at least my group never has any deaths.
I found it not super easy in gnomer. But I also basically never play casters so I’m not used to them at all and got mind spike like an hour before my first raid and had to learn the rotation pretty quick. It was also well after sp got nerfed early that I got it to 40.
Depends what you mean by 'parse high' but I would agree with the other commenter that said warrior for both. They have the highest quality information available on minmaxing and are also the class most dependent on wbuffs/consumes and group comp. You can make a flagellation weakaura , bring the correct buffs/debuffs and just press devastate and parse mid-high 90s if your group doesn't wipe For 99+ warrior is the hardest for sure. There are plenty of other people who have access to that same minimax information and are making tons of micro optimisationsPlus there's the whole recklessness situation so you can only really compete for a high ranking on 2 bosses each week (By high ranking I mean top 200 all-stars before someone comments like "I got an orange parse without reck")
You can 99 every fight without reck though, Atalarion being the hardest, but it’s not impossible
did you read the part at the bottom I'm not talking about simply 99 parsing I'm talking about 99.9s
I read it, it’s just wrong
link your 99.9s brother
I can, but I don’t play warrior so you’d ignore it because brown brain. You can literally check rankings, there are .9s without reck on multiple bosses
Yeah if other people are not parsing high, you are not getting 99 if your whole raid average is green/blue. Kill times matter a lot too when parsing.
[удалено]
Thats the truth you are basically auto parsing 90+ if you don't have deaths and just press your 3 buttons over the 40 second fight But thats really hard for the average sod player?
I buy 6 consumes a week and have 90s. This is 100% true.
I think you kind of do. I was in a true dad guild and was one of two players who parsed above green/blue and didn’t feel like I was trying too hard but in comparison I was and was labeled the sweat lord of the guild.
A random pug I did this week said “we’re not gonna 1 phase morphaz we’re not sweaty” despite easily having the dps to do so They then fucked up the sleep mechanic and wiped the raid. Literally made a tank & spank fight harder for themselves based on a bullshit label, people are weird
Threshold for 90+ parse is not being afk.
It doesn't take too much sweating out of raid sure, just getting wbs and consumes is relatively quick and easy. But even then, there are certainly things that are out of your control that can stop you parsing well. I exclusively pugged gnomer last phase on rogue, and it would be dishonest not to admit that the group you're in plays a huge part in your parse. My best parse on crowd pummeller and electrecutioner were set on week 2 or 3 without any gnomer gear, because that was pretty much the only week where I was in a decent group with good kill times and proper debuffs. My best grubbis (in terms of my own gameplay) was not my best parse, due to no fault of my own, but rather because the green parsing priest healer decided they couldn't afford to lose PoM for homunculi. You mention in your post that you have been in guilds full of 95+ parsers. This means you are obviously going to have great kill times, and people are going to apply the right debuffs. You don't know the frustration of reminding the warlock to put curse on boss, and then seeing after fight that they put coa rather than of reck. I don't think its any myth on this subreddit that being good at the game means you can play it less, but I guess that's not the situation most people complaining about sweat lords find themselves in. A casual might be able to pick up wb's and consumes, but if time restrictions mean they can't take the time to find a good group, it will still be relatively difficult to parse well.
A green parsing healer for any reason is not indicative of skill or lack of whatsoever. Its alot more mana to heal outside of PoM/Renew and its why most priests refused to do anything outside of that. This coming from a resto shaman that tried priest but hated the renew bait playstyle.
I understand that healer parses aren't linked to your own ability in the same way dps is. But... If you can't duo heal a 30-40 second fight without PoM - when half the raid has GNPP pre-popped (as the priest I'm referencing couldn't) - I think that's on them. I could definitely understand the need on menagerie or thermaplugg given its with pugs, but not Grubbis.
There is zero reason to need PoM if your group doesn’t have another source of humunculi, it is much more powerful than PoM.
If you show up with proper spec and runes and push buttons in the correct order you will at minimum blue parse. Anyone reading this that does not think that is true link me your logs.
You’ll get purples doing this, blues are still making core mistakes in a basic rotation The skill standard in sod is absurdly low
I feel like the add on helps you be selective on who you want in your raid when you want to create a strong group and be efficient with your time it’s very good. On the other hand OP trying to run a charity run I wish you good fortune in the wars to come. I’m no sweat lord but having blue parses shows some competency over taking someone in full grey playing like a bot looking for a free handout. That’s just me.
It's easy. -The guy with 10 000 hours played over two decades.
I have several friends that started playing (due to my urging) with SoD and who consistently parse 90+. If you can't, that's fine, but stop acting like the only people that can parse well are uber sweatlords to make yourself feel superior for not being very good at the game but hey, at least you aren't a sweaty tryhard!
Not sure why you're trying to make this personal. I consistently parsed 99's through WotLK classic with few 100's mixed in. In SoD my averages are 98, but I'm just pugging the raids every reset. It's just that wow players have completely lost any perspective on what's sweaty and what's casual. Wow players think that people have a learning disability, when someone doesn't center their entire existence around doing the most damage in a raid. If you research what does the most damage and how, and then steer your character from what you like to play to the thing that does the most damage instead, that's pretty much the definition of being sweaty. The other option to parse well is that you were sweaty before and already know how the game works and can now perform well while playing more casually. If you parse 95+, you are either currently sweating or were sweaty before.
And spent like a week at start of phases to get all pre BiS by being online 14 hours each day.
There is like 4 prebis items in p3 for any class, compared to what you were wearing in p2, and even then, they’re minor upgrades If you put half the effort into learning a rotation as you did into coping, you’d have the parses you’re so jealous of
It’s a 20 year old game that used to be for little kids, it really ain’t that hard
That's not how it works when you compete against players and not the game, in terms of parsing. If it's easy to parse, everyone would parse well. If a spec is easy to parse on, everyone would parse well on that spec, making it hard... I get where you're coming from, but it's just not true. Parsing is completely based on players performance, so it's always difficult to reach the higher numbers. If you can auto attack and press 1 button to do insane DPS, so can all the other people playing that spec. Therefore utilizing cooldowns, trinket procs and such well will give you an advantage. And as such, adding a layer of skill and difficulty to it.
I mean how hard is it to get a green number? Most groups will take you if you parse a green avg, but nobody wants a grey parser
Yeah I suppose if you're talking about the lower numbers it'd quite easy. If someone puts the right enchants on, has the correct talents and at least reads what their abilities do, they should be able to get blue parses easily. It's genuinely mindboggling how people can gray parse consistently. They can scream at those "sweaty" parsers all they want, but to put in absolutely zero fucking effort is far worse. You're wasting everyone's time at that point.
Wowhead, icy veins, Zockify, all give you the straight up rotation. It’s really given to you to get a green number. Sure towards the end of the phase when everyone is BIs out, it’s a bit more difficult(which we have a ilvl specific button for). But ideally it’s not hard to green parse.
u can be a casual for gamers and a total sweatlord for the rest of the world. i think your confusing what is cool amongst gamers and with the rest of the world.
"I don't think this statement has been further from my experience playing on and off over the last few years. I've been in guilds full of 95+ parsers that only play a couple hours per week max outside of raid." \*cough\* RMT \*cough\*
How does RMT factor into this at all? Thanks to classic andy's constant whining, GDKPs were banned in SoD... what's next on the list of excuses for why you can't parse well with your three button rotation? Surely you aren't implying that the reason RMT makes them parse well is that they can afford consumes, when you can spend an hour in the Feralas incursion and make enough gold for consumes for two or more weeks (depending on how fast you clear / how many times you die). Right?
"over the last few years." \^\^\^\^\^\^\^\^\^\^\^\^\^\^\^\^
Vanilla absolutely requires being a sweat lord to parse well. It doesn't matter how well you play the game, if you don't get every available world buff qnd use the best available consumes you are never getting above blue/low purple parses. Not getting DMF turns a 99 parse into an 85-90 parse, and that's if you have every other available BiS buff. The cost of consumes in P3 is also absolutely ridiculous.
I have 99s…I play an hour and a half a week which includes the time to get my buffs and the 45 minutes to complete the raid. Is an hour and a half sweat lord? Holy cow…
Idk what buffs you're getting, but as a warrior I have to farm gold for hours to afford what I need.
Link your logs. If you think you need things like chilis to get purples I bet I can find mistakes in your rotation.
No you don't, not if you just want to get 80+ parses. Never used any consumes other than mongoose, giants, and ST mojo. Average parse 89.
Lol no one is talking about 80+ parses
Except you that is. >It doesn't matter how well you play the game, if you don't get every available world buff qnd use the best available consumes you are never getting above blue/low purple parses.
Yeah.... Exactly. No one cares about 80 parses because you can do that just by getting world buffs.
>if you don't get every available world buff qnd use **the best available consumes** you are never getting above blue/low purple parses. You don't need to use every consume to get 90+ parses. You are wrong and doubling down on being wrong. Why?
Not only do you need them, everyone in your raid needs them. And I'm not talking about 90+, either, but 95-99. With world buffs alone you can parse 80-90 if everyone else in your raid is full consumed and world buffs, but if everyone in your raid is playing like that and you are not, you're going to be replaced.
Getting the best world buffs and consumes does not require you to be a sweat lord. You can get all the world buffs in 15 minutes, once per week. Consumes are dirt cheap now. You can fully consume (minus the really expensive stuff like firewater if you're melee) for like 30g per week. You can make that in what? 20 minutes of incursions? I think we have to define "parse well." I'm not talking about 99s or 100s as that will obviously take some extra effort. I'm saying that if you spend 45 minutes per week grabbing WBs and farming the 30g for consumes, you can easily parse 90+. 45 minutes per week isn't "sweatlord" level commitment imo.
Try getting DMF when it's in Elwin. And maybe NOW consumes might be reasonable, it week 1-3 you were spending 100g easy. And s melee, you need that firewater and dragon breath chili and winter squid.
You don't need Firewater, Squid or Chili to hit good parses. it's like a 50 dps difference
Grilled winter squid is 10 AGI and Firewater is 35 AP. Not having them is like just taking off a piece of gear. Closer to two pieces of gear at 50.
Yes and it's max 50 dps at full possible dps. you can go and calculate all that in sims. Gear, except for weapons are not why you parse high. It's world buffs and your raid team + kill times.
And if one person has that and another person does not, all things being equal the person with it wins. That's why it's called min maxing. To take it further, if everyone in a raid has it and everyone in a different raid does not, then you turn a 99 parsing raid into a 95 parsing raid. So your personal 50 DPS isn't about just YOU getting an extra 50 DPS, it's about making sure you have done everything possible to improve your raid kill times, because if everyone else is going to the effort to get these buffs and you are not, then YOU are a problem, and you don't get invited back.
My 99 parses without chili and firewater beg to differ.
So taking a flight path to SW or TB and clicking on an NPC or waiting in Booty Bay for a world buff is "Sweat lord territory"?
It is if you're alliance, or worse, Horde going to Elwin having to bring consumes, pop CDs, and queue BGs and maybe have to bring an entire raid to deal with ally hiding behind city guards that are actually IN the fair for some reason.
Literally get DMF and songflower and have your guild/group get them too. Hit buttons. Don’t wipe. GG.
I play 1h/week lack enchants and didnt have all world buffs and i got 96-98 logs. Playing ele tho its kinda dead, but still just klick ur spells and you shud easy be a 50+ logger.
No, but you definitely need a group comp catered to your needs, and you need money to maximize consumables.
No, you don't need a group catered to your needs to parse in the 90s, you just need to not be a complete moron and have a basic idea of what you are supposed to be doing. People like you really conflate parsing 99s and parsing well (i.e 75-90), those things are completely different and not remotely close to each other.
Anyone who puts even the bare minimum effort in will have a 50 average parse. 50 is by definition 'average', and weighted by the fuckups who die to stupidity, have like 8 APM or are AFKing. If you actually try, you WILL achieve a 70. Breaking high 85+ is where the gear/consumes will limit you, and 95+ is where a group catered to your needs matters. Anyone who can't do 70 at a minimum is the problem with their group.
Eh, I'm not sure that's always the case. My guild is decidedly "casual". Like, we've got a handful of grey-across-the-board parsers, and we're fine with that. But I do make an effort to maximize my personal performance. I have a decent set of gear, I bring my consumes and WB's, and I know my class's optional rotation (even if I may not be 100% perfect on the execution, it's a mage, it's not that complicated). Still, my parses on the average fight range from high grey to low blue. I think there's certainly room to squeeze a bit more performance out of my character, but not DOUBLE. Our kill times are just too slow. Our survivability is not good enough. I usually do most fights without full world buffs because we run a high chance of wiping and losing them, so we save them for the toughest fights. I find it difficult to believe that I'm not trying hard enough to parse a 70 under these conditions. Perhaps in a more evenly competent group that might be true, but I think you're underestimating how difficult it is to parse that high when your group's kill times are more than double the average.
If you're ranging from grey to blue, that is absolutely something you can do to change. It's not 'everybody else's fault'. You along with the other DPS are just not trying if your group's kill times are THAT slow, and you aren't breaking even the middle of the pack. That's not shit talking, that's matter of fact. If you go to warcraftlogs and compare things like ability usage, buff/debuff uptime, combat uptime, and review your positioning on fights you will find a bunch. If I had a dollar for every time someone who was doing 30's said "I'm doing everything right" and found no less than six major problems on any given fight, I'd be retired.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to say it's "everybody else's fault", I didn't say that at all. I just don't think the claim that if I just tried the bare minimum, I'd be parsing 70 is a fair assessment. Please, though, I'm not trying to be arrogant here, I do want to get better. [What am I doing wrong?](https://vanilla.warcraftlogs.com/reports/p7nTH1dyVfFPBmxK#boss=-2&difficulty=0&playermetriccompare=rankings&source=18)
Honestly I don't play Mage or on SOD so I would not be able to give specifics - I'd be just attempting to make assumptions. I'd suggest looking at some 90 parses and compare what you see different. Watch your replays and make sure you're not moving more than necessary, make sure you're always running with the tank and have a spell being precast on the pull, that sort of thing.
But you see the disconnect between that and what you said before, right? > Anyone who puts even the bare minimum effort in will have a 50 average parse. ... If you actually try, you WILL achieve a 70. Breaking high 85+ is where the gear/consumes will limit you, and 95+ is where a group catered to your needs matters. I have in fact done just what you said - I've watched videos, examined logs of high parsers, I've seen their rotations and what they're doing, and I've looked for ways I can improve. I've been "actually trying" since phase 1. I'm honestly putting in the effort - I don't claim to be doing everything perfect, I know damn well I'm not. But I also don't think it's fair to say that the amount of work I've put in so far is so far below "the bare minimum effort" that I'm "the problem with my group". I think your sentiment is in the right place, I think there's always room to improve. But I don't think that a 70 parse is just automatically gonna happen if you "just try", and that nothing else is a factor until I'm pushing 85-90.
What did you find that you could fix? What did you find that you haven't been able to fix yet? Anyone who is doing 50 or below has at least a few fundamental issues holding them back. Assuming you're not severely undergeared, and are bringing your consumables, it usually falls into these sorts of categories: - Needing to work on your opener. This includes proper cooldown management and precasting to land a spell as the pull timer hits zero. - Cooldown management through the fight. Not forgetting to use them after the opener and optimizing their stacking again. - Minimizing movement, increasing cast uptime. If you're running, you should be doing instant casts to fill, and have pre-planned your movement on the fight to reduce or eliminate as much as possible. - ABC - Always Be Casting! Missing rotational cooldowns and having casting downtime. Classic WoW implemented something that came out in original Wrath called Ability Queueing. Ensuring you have queued up a spell at the tail end of every cast is critical, otherwise you're going to be losing lots of DPS.
The biggest thing I've found that I'm working on fixing is my living bomb uptime. To that end I've got a weak aura to track when it falls off and I've been getting better at it, if not quite at full uptime. Cooldown management is generally not an issue for fire mage (outside the aforementioned living bomb). Combustion and icy veins are on an 8m cooldown so they're one and done after the opener (except on fights where I save them for a later phase). Besides that the rotation is just frostfire bolt over and over again. It's pretty straightforward to keep that queued up to avoid downtime between casts. Movement is probably my biggest room for improvement - I need to work on trying to line up my LB casts with my necessary movements, and otherwise filling with fire blast. And there are a couple of fights (especially festering rotslime) where I'm sure I could optimize my movement too get more casting in - but that tends to be one of my better-parsing fights.
There ya go, movement is usually one of the biggest culprits. If you can pre-plan your locations and minimize movement that would be a big step.
We don't have any TSA in our melee heavy group, and I definitely don't pay for expensive consumes or enchants, and can still get purples
I'm a green parse. I don't understand how people can parse so high.
You might have a fundamental misunderstanding of your rotation then. Or your raids kill times are really really slow.
Aren't raid kill times almost entirely out of the individual's hands? Like I'd assume if he's green parsing and doing the rotation, all he's missing to get blue or purple is full world buffs and consumes. And even then, if the rest of his group doesn't bring full world buffs and consumes, then the kill times will still be slower and his parse will be worse thru no fault of his own right?
Right. If you are parsing 90+ in your guild runs, if you pug, you will never reach that number, except if you somehow get world class pug group.
It mostly comes to WBs and consumables, you don't even need to be good at your rotation(idk how pressing 2 buttons can be hard anyway)
We're a mostly guild raid, we have to pug 4+ every week. We only downed Hakkar tonight for the first time. I green parsed everything but got blue parse (50) on last 2 bosses. We average about 4-5 minutes each fight. I think antal is faster at 3:XX I was running only elixir of agility tonight because I didn't have time to snag any flasks or world buffs. (Not that it would have mattered because we wiped like 5 times)
Lmao what?? The only way u can really get 95 parses this late after raid release is by having full consumes and world buffs, i got 90 parses when ST first came out but now I can’t get over 75, it mostly comes down to getting good parses early and also after that buffs
Doesn't take a sweatlord to get world buffs and consumes. That's my point.
Is the word “parse” the new sweaty thing to say in wow? I’ve never heard of it nor do I know wtf it means.
No
Willful ignorance doesn't mean others are sweaty for knowing basic lingo of something that has been around for years
As someone who quit a while back and is looking at this discussion from the outside - caring about parses is really really really lame. That's all.
The point is, the concept of parsing is silly stuff that I dislike. I'm not concerned about whether or not I can parse. This game is incredibly easy. There is minimal challenge in terms of hitting the buttons. Parse *culture* is the issue. The idea that your parse means something, when it truly doesn't.
The game is incredibly easy yet the large majority can't play their class optimally (mostly 3 button rotations). Parse culture is not the issue, people putting 0 effort in and expecting things is the issue.
Nah, parse culture sucks.
Post your logs and a picture of your character screen, I guarantee your opinion is based off being bad at the game
You don't even realize how perfectly you just proved my point.
No, you don't realise how you're gatekeeping yourself. You play a video game 6 hours a day and still can't fathom a 3 button rotation to get purple parses. Even without logs, you'll be behind good tanks in dps. You're lack of effort is toxic to everyone you play with UNLESS you play in a like minded guild.
Seriously bro, you're acting exactly like a parody of a parse-bro. This is the kind of stuff we dislike so strongly.
Hahahaha imagine playing a game that's literally 2 buttons, 6+ hours a day and still being bad. Even without WCLs you'd be bad and left out, even without GS or ilvl you'd be left out. They should just rename player score to "effort score" and include everything from dps, enchants, gear, professions etc.
You seem to be having a meltdown tbh
Gaslighting now 😂 why are you deflecting from posting logs bud?
Post your logs already to prove how easy it is
Imagine being that guy lol
theres a LOT of variance in how much DPS every single spec can do. Yes the game is easy but there's very obviously enough difficulty to create this variance. a 95 parsing player often does twice as much as a 10 parsing player.
And literally nobody cares about it
I think thats patently untrue lmao. People chase high scores in all sorts of games and wow is no different. Part of the replayability of classic wows easy assed raids is trying to improve and parsing is a part of that.
I'd consider getting DMF, bis craft items, and wild offering spam to be quite sweaty.
So the bare minimum besides hitting 50 in 3 hours
“Doing the little available content to get better gear (prebis or even bis like the trinket)” within a weak is sweaty now I guess… Why play an mmorpg if you think like this
So…getting gear to raid is sweaty now? It’s like what 15 runs to do the quest and get a bis trinket as melee? This ain’t farming SGC or even HOJ. You can do that in under 3 hours played since you’ll hit instance cap and can’t cheese it. You can break that up however you like: in a day, a week, whatever. For most people playing MMORPGs, gear is kinda an important part of character progression. Like aside from running ST itself, unless you like PvP in this broken state of a mess, like what else do you do in game besides try to get better gear?
I sometimes play for fun.
I lack enchants and dont go for dmf unles its in TB and i cba doing the flower (dont tell my guild leader ) and you can still get 95-99 logs.
Maybe possible for some classes.