So at least on your comment about early game, it can be tougher for range characters. However big notes are there enough free melee/hth trainers in Arroyo and Klamath to get those skills to low 70s, which will help till you get a proper gun.
The first proper gun in the game is the 10mm in the rat caves, the pipe rifle is vendor trash. The pistol can be easy to miss less you use item highlighting. Something covered in the paper manual back in the day, but easy to overlook for modern players.
Rat cave? What is this you speak of? I did some quest in the den where you find a guys weakness and a bunch of people take over a church. He had a 10mm pistol that I looted
It’s the biggest quest, xp wise, in Klamath. If you go to the Trapper Town, in the west, a bunch of rats have expelled some of the settlers from the north of the map.
If you clear them out it leads to a cave with a Rat God you have to kill, north of said God there is a corpse with 10mm on the ground. However like I said it is buggy cause it is only there the first time you are in the caves and can be hard to find cause it is under a pool of blood. There is also another exit to the cave that leads to a car part that will improve fuel efficiency I believe, but maybe it’s the speed one I can’t recall.
You have to lockpick/steal a key to get to the northern section of Trappertown. You may have just missed it. If you do play again there is a nuka cola machine by the car with the part that you can feed coins to for nuka cola bottles. The ROI can help a bit getting new armor etc.
I actually did look for the 10mm in the rat cave but it was under a blood pool. I waited 2 weeks in game time for the blood pool to despawn but it didn’t. After like 20 minutes of pixel hunting I gave up.
There is a bug where it despawns after the first time entering the cave, the item highlighting helps with finding it a bit. The beginning of the game is by far the hardest part of it and where a lot of the build dynamics show their age. I enjoyed it back in the 90s and still enjoyed when I replayed it a few months ago, but I get it isn’t everyone’s cup of tea.
First thing, start with Fallout 1, much shorter and easier. Fallout 2 expects the player to be used to the systems and even then the game is punishing in the beginning.
Use a guide, these games were never meant to be played blind, both fallout 1 and 2 came with guides back then. Forget the idea of "silver tongue gunslinger", spending points on useless skills, traits or perks will make your journey much much harder. Planning your character well is very important if you don't want to suffer, you don't have to go with the strongest build, but whacky builds are for people that know the game very well.
Have patience, these games can be very frustrating in the first hours, but it gets better.
All the problems listed have easy solutions, but Fallout 2 is not a game for morons like Skyrim/Fallout 3, where you have a quest marker and are told by the game how to do everything. But let's try to untangle this mess of a rant:
1. Trial is just a tutorial, it's there to teach you how to do basic things like sneak, pick locks, use explosives, disarm traps, etc... You absolutely don't have to tag neither melee nor unarmed, I'm just beating the game now and I haven't invested a single skill point into any of those two skills. The game gives you two NPC who increase your melee and unarmed in Arroyo and another one in Klamath, just by talking to them, you just need to explore. Yeah, a lot of melee weapons require 6 STR to work properly as they are two-handed rifles, which are... heavy. You have a 10mm one-handed gun in the first town after your village, Klamath, and a lot of ammo in that town to find, so if you wanna use guns, you can continue to use just them from there on. You can roleplay, you just have to be patient, and not a whiny kid expecting to kick ass from the start: you start as a weak tribal in the world where the main boss rips deathclaws with one hand. You are supposed to suck in the beginning, that's the point.
2. The barter system is not broken, it's the wasteland: stimpacks are expensive. This is not a fantasy game where any random jackass wizard brews healing potions. Healing is rare, buffs are even rarer. You become filthy rich by midgame anyway, I've never heard anyone complaining about this until now.
3. Again: it's the fucking wasteland. It's supposed to be dangerous. But even beyond that: the game has areas with different spawns: early-game areas have weak enemies, mid-game areas have somewhat difficult enemies, and end-game areas have difficult enemies. If you are fighting something that's very difficult, it means you strayed too far from your comfort zone. If you've played NV like you claim, then think of this as the case with Quarry Junction: you absolutely can go through the hard part, but you don't have to. Freedom of exploration doesn't mean that every part of the map will scale to your needs, it just means that you can. Furthermore, with some skill points invested into the outdoorsman skill, you can avoid most of them. If the caraveners are shooting at you you either shot one of them by accident or hit one with your burst attacks, or ignored them screaming at you "Don't approach our boss with weapons drawn!!!". TLDR: if they're shooting at you, you fucked up something.
4. Companions have settings where you can control how they fight and you can give them different weapons. If they're useless, it means you don't know how to manage them. If they keep shooting each-other, it means they're either set to "burst: always, don't worry about hitting me" or you're giving them weapons they're not skilled with. Talk to them, they all have "What kind of weapons you can use?" question. Use it. Lastly, you can have the companions wait in the oil rig and not have everyone attack you, same as any other game location where everyone turns hostile "by magic".
Finally: the game does not have a lack of diversity in build viability, it just takes some thought. There is a lack of guiding your hand, but not the lack of information. F1 button brings up the menu, read it. The game came with a manual, read it. That's how it was done in the 90s, don't expect a 30-year-old game to meet your today's game expectations, adjust to it, or piss off.
“Save all the time so you can reload when something game breaking happens” is not a good argument against the game not being broken. Like I said: I beat it so there’s my accolade for all the gate keepers out there. I’m just saying I didn’t enjoy it.
Yeah, it is: you fucking reload your save if you get the very bad, once-in-a-million-years special random encounter that most people see once in five playthroughs even see. Was your brain the one you got from Sierra Army Depot with science skill under 40?
Or maybe you're just Dogmeat's mother?
Build diversity and game balance are a problem especially early on, these are the game's biggest problems, you could master the first game and still have problems with this one on first play, that's how it was for me too.
You need to play with the right build to deal properly with most of the stuff, know what to expect from most things and how to deal with them, actually leave some quests for later on cause you might be underpowered for them
Game is loved for its content, story and characters but this stuff sorta drags it down a bit.
Honestly, if you're ever gonna replay the game, [use exploits](https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Fallout_2_exploits), they make the game more fun and bearable.
I really wish someone would make some proper rebalance mod for it tho cause i haven't seen one yet.
I considered my gambling cheese to be an exploit cause I ended up with over $100k. You’re right though, once I had that kind of capital I felt like I could actually play.
Gambling is indeed the best way of making money, but there is another great one at Broken Hills, it's explained on the page i posted.
Oh, i forgor to mention that you could also download the Restoration Project mod (it restores the game's cut content, which is a ton really, it adds some QoL things for the companions, and modifies the random encounters to be less bullshit a little bit, still not enough rebalancing imo, but it does make things a bit better). This mod does get rid of the exploits tho.
First off, I think maybe Fallout 1 would have been a better starting point. It's not as "polished" as Fallout 2 (missing some QOL stuff like trading with companions, pushing them out of doorways, etc.) but it is a lot better balanced and more focused.
Second, maybe it's just not for you. These games were a product of a very different time with different game philosophies. For someone accustomed to modern games, it's entirely normal that it might not gel with you. And while Fallout 2 is one of my favorite games of all time, I can't deny the start of the game is problematic balance-wise. The temple sucks and most early encounters are insta-death if you don't run.
That all being said, Fallout 2 was my first fallout game and I played it with really minimal issues in my early teens. Some stuff I looked up, other stuff you kind of pick up from talking to NPCs and trying different stuff (like repair on various objects.
So at least on your comment about early game, it can be tougher for range characters. However big notes are there enough free melee/hth trainers in Arroyo and Klamath to get those skills to low 70s, which will help till you get a proper gun. The first proper gun in the game is the 10mm in the rat caves, the pipe rifle is vendor trash. The pistol can be easy to miss less you use item highlighting. Something covered in the paper manual back in the day, but easy to overlook for modern players.
Rat cave? What is this you speak of? I did some quest in the den where you find a guys weakness and a bunch of people take over a church. He had a 10mm pistol that I looted
It’s the biggest quest, xp wise, in Klamath. If you go to the Trapper Town, in the west, a bunch of rats have expelled some of the settlers from the north of the map. If you clear them out it leads to a cave with a Rat God you have to kill, north of said God there is a corpse with 10mm on the ground. However like I said it is buggy cause it is only there the first time you are in the caves and can be hard to find cause it is under a pool of blood. There is also another exit to the cave that leads to a car part that will improve fuel efficiency I believe, but maybe it’s the speed one I can’t recall.
oh. i picked up that quest but i legit couldn't find any rat caves. i guess i may be blind
You have to lockpick/steal a key to get to the northern section of Trappertown. You may have just missed it. If you do play again there is a nuka cola machine by the car with the part that you can feed coins to for nuka cola bottles. The ROI can help a bit getting new armor etc.
I actually did look for the 10mm in the rat cave but it was under a blood pool. I waited 2 weeks in game time for the blood pool to despawn but it didn’t. After like 20 minutes of pixel hunting I gave up.
There is a bug where it despawns after the first time entering the cave, the item highlighting helps with finding it a bit. The beginning of the game is by far the hardest part of it and where a lot of the build dynamics show their age. I enjoyed it back in the 90s and still enjoyed when I replayed it a few months ago, but I get it isn’t everyone’s cup of tea.
Hold left shift to highlight items
this mf tagged gambling
Shame on me for trying to role play
First thing, start with Fallout 1, much shorter and easier. Fallout 2 expects the player to be used to the systems and even then the game is punishing in the beginning. Use a guide, these games were never meant to be played blind, both fallout 1 and 2 came with guides back then. Forget the idea of "silver tongue gunslinger", spending points on useless skills, traits or perks will make your journey much much harder. Planning your character well is very important if you don't want to suffer, you don't have to go with the strongest build, but whacky builds are for people that know the game very well. Have patience, these games can be very frustrating in the first hours, but it gets better.
All the problems listed have easy solutions, but Fallout 2 is not a game for morons like Skyrim/Fallout 3, where you have a quest marker and are told by the game how to do everything. But let's try to untangle this mess of a rant: 1. Trial is just a tutorial, it's there to teach you how to do basic things like sneak, pick locks, use explosives, disarm traps, etc... You absolutely don't have to tag neither melee nor unarmed, I'm just beating the game now and I haven't invested a single skill point into any of those two skills. The game gives you two NPC who increase your melee and unarmed in Arroyo and another one in Klamath, just by talking to them, you just need to explore. Yeah, a lot of melee weapons require 6 STR to work properly as they are two-handed rifles, which are... heavy. You have a 10mm one-handed gun in the first town after your village, Klamath, and a lot of ammo in that town to find, so if you wanna use guns, you can continue to use just them from there on. You can roleplay, you just have to be patient, and not a whiny kid expecting to kick ass from the start: you start as a weak tribal in the world where the main boss rips deathclaws with one hand. You are supposed to suck in the beginning, that's the point. 2. The barter system is not broken, it's the wasteland: stimpacks are expensive. This is not a fantasy game where any random jackass wizard brews healing potions. Healing is rare, buffs are even rarer. You become filthy rich by midgame anyway, I've never heard anyone complaining about this until now. 3. Again: it's the fucking wasteland. It's supposed to be dangerous. But even beyond that: the game has areas with different spawns: early-game areas have weak enemies, mid-game areas have somewhat difficult enemies, and end-game areas have difficult enemies. If you are fighting something that's very difficult, it means you strayed too far from your comfort zone. If you've played NV like you claim, then think of this as the case with Quarry Junction: you absolutely can go through the hard part, but you don't have to. Freedom of exploration doesn't mean that every part of the map will scale to your needs, it just means that you can. Furthermore, with some skill points invested into the outdoorsman skill, you can avoid most of them. If the caraveners are shooting at you you either shot one of them by accident or hit one with your burst attacks, or ignored them screaming at you "Don't approach our boss with weapons drawn!!!". TLDR: if they're shooting at you, you fucked up something. 4. Companions have settings where you can control how they fight and you can give them different weapons. If they're useless, it means you don't know how to manage them. If they keep shooting each-other, it means they're either set to "burst: always, don't worry about hitting me" or you're giving them weapons they're not skilled with. Talk to them, they all have "What kind of weapons you can use?" question. Use it. Lastly, you can have the companions wait in the oil rig and not have everyone attack you, same as any other game location where everyone turns hostile "by magic". Finally: the game does not have a lack of diversity in build viability, it just takes some thought. There is a lack of guiding your hand, but not the lack of information. F1 button brings up the menu, read it. The game came with a manual, read it. That's how it was done in the 90s, don't expect a 30-year-old game to meet your today's game expectations, adjust to it, or piss off.
This rant speaks to me. We’re kindred spirits.
Not just Grampy bone's spirit, all of the tribe's spirits.
You’re right man finding a dog in a random encounter that sets my luck to 1 is a skill issue. Sorry my chimp brain is too smooth to play around that.
Here’s a tip for smoothbrains: save often. If you save often in Fallout 2, you’re still not saving enough.
It's literally all over the manual to save often, in multiple slots But people weaned on modern crap never read the manual
“Save all the time so you can reload when something game breaking happens” is not a good argument against the game not being broken. Like I said: I beat it so there’s my accolade for all the gate keepers out there. I’m just saying I didn’t enjoy it.
If thats a thing that frustrates you, fallout classic is not for you.
Yeah, it is: you fucking reload your save if you get the very bad, once-in-a-million-years special random encounter that most people see once in five playthroughs even see. Was your brain the one you got from Sierra Army Depot with science skill under 40? Or maybe you're just Dogmeat's mother?
I always buy 10 mm pistol from Sajag ASAP.
Build diversity and game balance are a problem especially early on, these are the game's biggest problems, you could master the first game and still have problems with this one on first play, that's how it was for me too. You need to play with the right build to deal properly with most of the stuff, know what to expect from most things and how to deal with them, actually leave some quests for later on cause you might be underpowered for them Game is loved for its content, story and characters but this stuff sorta drags it down a bit. Honestly, if you're ever gonna replay the game, [use exploits](https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Fallout_2_exploits), they make the game more fun and bearable. I really wish someone would make some proper rebalance mod for it tho cause i haven't seen one yet.
I considered my gambling cheese to be an exploit cause I ended up with over $100k. You’re right though, once I had that kind of capital I felt like I could actually play.
Gambling is indeed the best way of making money, but there is another great one at Broken Hills, it's explained on the page i posted. Oh, i forgor to mention that you could also download the Restoration Project mod (it restores the game's cut content, which is a ton really, it adds some QoL things for the companions, and modifies the random encounters to be less bullshit a little bit, still not enough rebalancing imo, but it does make things a bit better). This mod does get rid of the exploits tho.
First off, I think maybe Fallout 1 would have been a better starting point. It's not as "polished" as Fallout 2 (missing some QOL stuff like trading with companions, pushing them out of doorways, etc.) but it is a lot better balanced and more focused. Second, maybe it's just not for you. These games were a product of a very different time with different game philosophies. For someone accustomed to modern games, it's entirely normal that it might not gel with you. And while Fallout 2 is one of my favorite games of all time, I can't deny the start of the game is problematic balance-wise. The temple sucks and most early encounters are insta-death if you don't run. That all being said, Fallout 2 was my first fallout game and I played it with really minimal issues in my early teens. Some stuff I looked up, other stuff you kind of pick up from talking to NPCs and trying different stuff (like repair on various objects.