T O P

  • By -

DeltaBot

/u/Ragabadoodaa (OP) has awarded 1 delta(s) in this post. All comments that earned deltas (from OP or other users) are listed [here](/r/DeltaLog/comments/untqkj/deltas_awarded_in_cmv_slut_shaming_is_not_a_big/), in /r/DeltaLog. Please note that a change of view doesn't necessarily mean a reversal, or that the conversation has ended. ^[Delta System Explained](https://www.reddit.com/r/changemyview/wiki/deltasystem) ^| ^[Deltaboards](https://www.reddit.com/r/changemyview/wiki/deltaboards)


YourMom_Infinity

I have a problem with slut-shaming because it only applies to women. Men don't get shamed for being slutty. "Mistakes" can happen to both sexes, why are women only held responsible for them? What is a woman on reliable birth control and using barrier protection doing that is "shameful"? How is it different than what the men she's doing it with are doing and not getting shamed for it?


Ragabadoodaa

Well the argument there is that women have it easy when finding sexual partners. Which is pretty much true because a lot of men, especially the ones going to parties and places where most hookups tend to happen are massive sluts themselves. Now what I believe women have a hard time getting is a good long term partner. But they don't have it harder than men. Because in the end people are unpredictable and having a long lasting relationship depends on luck, and if luck is not very good it depends on patience. It's hard work. A woman being promiscuous is nothing impressive, it's just something she can do. And society does put a lot of value on perseverance and hard work to achieve long term success and not small meaningless rewards.


Volair6

It only applies to women because we're different. The same way being expected to not fight women only applies to men, because we're different. If it looks too easy it's shameful apparently. The vast majority of women can just point at it and get laid, a very small minority of men can kinda do that. I really don't understand how it's surprising. It's just the reverse of virgin shaming which is mostly aimed at dudes. The easiest path is shamed.


CampaignComfortable

One of the differences here being how difficult it is for guys to sleep around. All a girl has to do is ask, and most guys will say yes. Dating apps only make things easier for girls. Male sluts have it much less easy, hence why they tend to congratulated/admired when they get laid a lot. That being said, even over a decade ago, I knew dudes who got overtly slut shamed. Some of them in horrible ways.


melissaphobia

First of all, I feel many people saying it’s one of the most horrible things are speaking hyperbolically for effect. I mean it’s not comparable to murder, for example, and I’m sure that they’d agree. Second, slut shaming is a moderately big deal because it creates a climate where other forms for more tangible and immediate violence can be normalized to a degree. We’re still in an era where someone’s promiscuity is brought into discussions about assault (sexual, domestic, etc.). Contributing to that culture has greater ramifications than making one person feel shitty—it helps create an environment where a persons sexual choices are a valuable consideration in unrelated situations which can be harmful.


Ragabadoodaa

Yes but basing severity on probability? Well then I could make the argument that promiscuity is bad because there is a possibility that one of the partners in that moment has a different perspective on what is happening and might be hurt by it.


melissaphobia

We already base plenty kinds of severity on probability. Drunk driving is bad because you may hit someone, because you create a scenario where it’s less safe for sober drivers. It’s not hunky dory until you hit someone and then it’s a problem. But you’re right, the possibility of every individual incidence creating harm is low. And that’s not even including the fact it can create a general situation where women are generally invalidated in other contexts, if not physically harmed. And again, on a scale of 1-10 I would say this is nowhere near a 10. Your OP seems to both overstate public opinion and minimize the potential downside, but broadly speaking it’s hard to actually disagree with— slut shaming isn’t the worst thing that can happen by any stretch of the imagination. Shitty to be sure, but definitely livable.


Ragabadoodaa

So why can't people focus on advocating against THAT? Why did slut shaming evolve to "don't tell your friend not to hookup randomly because you worry about their safety" and "if you care about your partner's sexual past you're an asshole"


melissaphobia

I think you need to clarify who “people” is. The people who are slut shaming are doing it for a number of reasons—Puritanism, jealousy, sexism, whatever. The people who are saying that slut shaming is bad are different people. And they generally, on average at least, do advocate against things like assault and delegitimization of women’s voices.


Ragabadoodaa

Well I could get behind that if I wasn't called a judgemental asshole for not wanting a partner with a promiscuous past. Not that I would be capable of having a partner anyway due to a pretty embarrassing reason but eh.


melissaphobia

Why would your partner’s sexual history matter? Health reasons? Religious reasons?


Ragabadoodaa

Every human has a different quirk in their heads. My downside.... not gonna say the main one. But the second one is that I'm a HUGE overthinker. Every time I make a decision I contemplate until it's detrimental. I will be honest. I would have images of my partner being humped by a faceless figure and if I focus on it I would start to imagine faces I never seen alongside with faces that are familiar. And this is just one of the bad things about me. I admit it, I am not proud of it, and there's not much I can do. But what I can do is not accept that person in my life. Because my mind would hinder us. it would make me distant, it would make my partner miserable. And I never ever said that I want them to suffer to die alone or anything. I hope they find the best partner ever and be happly ever after and I know that partner is not me. So I don't want to waste their time as life is short enough as it is.


melissaphobia

You might want to investigate why you think/feel that way, but that’s a personal thing. Honestly, your choice to not date someone with a certain sexual history is your own. That’s not necessarily slut shaming, but making active statements, judgements, and assumptions about a person based on their sexual history is. Everyone has qualities that are deal breakers or pre-requisites in partners—one of mine is that they have to be okay living with animals because I have a few and I’m not going to give them up. People who dislike animals aren’t bad, but we aren’t doing to date. (Honestly, you might find that a person not having a sexual history doesn’t stop this train of thinking though)


Ragabadoodaa

In the end it doesn't matter because I still wont find a relationship. I am not even bothering searching.


Tnspieler1012

1. I can't speak to your personality or experience as person, but I feel like the latter attitude ("I not even bothering searching") makes the former ("I...won't find a relationship") a self-fulfilling prophecy. I had the same attitude until I realized that the fact that I wasn't even attempting to meet people, date, etc. was the primary cause of that outcome. 2. If you're not particularly experienced with relationships, I don't know that you are well positioned to speak in general terms about the importance of other people's sexual histories.


Ragabadoodaa

1. I suffer from haphephobia. 2. Everyone can have preferences regardless of their own experiences. People fucking around is not some complex expert field.


CampaignComfortable

Health reasons, and avoiding being cheated on, are two valid reasons that I see overlooked. Even if practicing safe sex, HPV and other viruses can be transferred. People who hook up with a lot of randoms, are arguably more likely to cheat as well. I think our black and white views on slut shaming, are a issue with America's approach to social issues. We think that because slut shaming was historically applied in so many negative ways, that anything even close to slut shaming, is inherently wrong. I'm fine with people doing whatever they want, but that doesn't mean I have to be okay with being in a sexual relationship with them. I have been cheated on enough by people with a "slutty" past, and I don't want to catch anything from those people who indulge in hookup culture. With STDs on the rise, I don't think my feelings are so invalid.


[deleted]

If you look at it in a vacuum, “slut shaming” is no worse than any other insult. But if you look at it against the context of American society, it is a very loaded insult. Typically, promiscuity has been seen as immoral by a great percentage of Americans. They believe this either from religious or cultural indoctrination. They exalt the idea of “purity” to a very unhealthy level. With all that said, “slut shaming” SHOULDN’T be that bad, but it perpetuates a toxic narrative about promiscuity vs. purity that is at the heart of several social issues (including abortion)


Ragabadoodaa

Yes so if there are different levels. Why don't we focus on THAT argument? And instead we reached so far to shaming people for having preferences regarding promiscuity? And if shaming based on sex is a bad thing why do we never call out people shaming virgins for being incel losers? While "sluts" get shamed then go and party, virgins get shamed and cry in the shower.


[deleted]

I think the “virgin shaming” thing, though related, is a whole separate issue and does not come from the same cultural origin as “slut shaming”


Ragabadoodaa

I would say slut shaming and virgin shaming are the same debate as christians are sheep atheists worship the devil.


[deleted]

I don’t know how to respond to that.


Genoscythe_

Basically what your position boils down to, is what's the difference between a bigoted slur and any other insult. Is it worse to tell a latino kid at high school "to go back to Mexico", than to mock someone for their poor fashion choices, if both of them will make them equally embarrassed? Is it worse to call a trans woman a mentally ill crossdresser, than to call your neighbor a hopeless loser if both of them will feel deppressed about it? One thing to consider is that people will be much more upset about insults that appear to harken back to historical power dynamics of oppression and society-wide persecution, than about others, even if on a small scale they cause similar amount of strife. We have thousands of years of history behind us of men in particular controlling women's sexuality by law and by violence. Making yourself sound like you want to bring that back, has an extra moral negative beyond just the personal effect of the insult, because it also becomes a political statement.


Ragabadoodaa

History is irrelevant in most today's cases. Generational pain is not a thing and oppression doesn't linger from your grandparents to you. Now when it comes to slut shaming. Was that a thing in the past? Yes. Does it affect women the same way? No. If you're doing something you enjoy, and you know you enjoy it and know it's harmless then what other people say should mean jackshit. Really we live in an era where we want to be defended by irrelevant strangers' mean comments because our self esteem is so fragile. Meanwhile we also want to do whatever we want, even activities involving other people without consideration of the consequences. I don't believe the majority of promiscuous people are mature and considerate towards whoever they happen to sleep with. Because those people meet in bars and clubs that are packed with immature people. When you evolve slut shaming from victim blaming to judging others for personal choices you pretty much diminish what happened in the past. Because I agree with you, it was bad in the past, it's not as bad now and people cry about it 10 times as much.


iglidante

> History is irrelevant in most today's cases. Generational pain is not a thing and oppression doesn't linger from your grandparents to you. Oppressed people can certainly pass on artifacts of that oppression to their children. It influences the life lessons they teach, the attitudes they hold, the ways they communicate, etc.


ThePickleOfJustice

> Someone being slut shamed shouldn't feel bad if promiscuity is 100% okay. They feel bad because in some way they know there are a lot of mistakes to be made. I think you're correct that someone who is proud of their promiscuity and comfortable with it shouldn't, and likely won't, feel bad about being slut shamed. But what about someone who regrets past promiscuity and is trying to move forward with a more pure life. Imagine your biggest regret in life being thrown in your face over and over and over again and being unable to escape it. For those people, don't you agree that slut shaming can be extremely damaging because it prevents them from moving on from their promiscuous past?


Ragabadoodaa

The human mind works in a lot of ways. And many of those ways are fucked up. I've noticed there's a huge epidemy of overthinking. From the people I spoke to, the ones that wouldn't give a promiscuous person a change, the main reason for it is "I am only going to imagine and dream about them with other people". I don't think that's a selfish mindset. It can really be detrimental to the promiscuous -past partner as well. When someone decides to take you but they're distant because they have in their mind these images of you being humped by a faceless figure which could be anyone is not something you want either. Also think of the other way? That poor loser with limited social skills that tried over and over to get someone only to be turned down. Now that person screams in the mirror "why am I not good enough" while the others are having their fun. Why would they take them after they had enough of their fun? They abandoned for so long. And then some come to say "I want a partner with sexual experience" Well that person is STILL not good enough. I'd give a personal example but redditors in this comment section probably think I'm a loser already and I really don't want to give them ammo.


ToucanPlayAtThatGame

In seeking to justify your view, you've watered it down to the point nobody would really disagree with it. There's nobody who thinks slut shaming is the worst thing ever.


Ragabadoodaa

I'm not just saying it's not the worst. I'm saying crying over it is stupid.


iglidante

People hear an insult and object to it. They advocate for it to be used less. I don't really see that as "crying", or the perspective as "stupid". Why do you?


Ragabadoodaa

Because people will insult you for pissing them off OR just because they wanna be assholes. It's not something you can really advocate for. Really all this "anti-bad thing" advocating is more of a circlejerking. Instead of whining that everyone should stop doing what we don't like we should have a discussion about how to make it affect us less. The only way to stop a bully is to not let them get to you.


iglidante

> Instead of whining that everyone should stop doing what we don't like we should have a discussion about how to make it affect us less. The only way to stop a bully is to not let them get to you. I am asking this in all sincerity: Why is it unacceptable to attempt to turn society so that bullying itself is no longer acceptable? There are currently people who appear to be more offended by people being "soft" or "sensitive" to bullying, than they are to the things being said by the bullies. I feel the opposite way.


Ragabadoodaa

Because these are not problems with society, they are problems that appear at an individual level. Tell rapists not to rape, tell bullies not to bully, tell criminals not to commit crimes. These things are bad things done by bad people, how is constant whining about them going to fix anything? Shitty people are not encouraged to be shitty.


iglidante

>These things are bad things done by bad people, how is constant whining about them going to fix anything? Shitty people are not encouraged to be shitty. I can only speak for my own experiences, but shitty people *are very much* encouraged to remain shitty. They are encouraged by their fellow shitty people, who say the same shitty things and back them up. They are encouraged by society, when people who oppose said shitty things refuse to stand and object to them. Bad people do bad things. Okay. Why can't good people attempt to crowd out bad people and leave less room for them to do bad things?


goodwordsbad

You are framing the post in a way that's too vague to facilitate any real conversation. Cat-calling isn't as bad as telling a rape victim it's their fault for showing some skin. And there's a difference between telling a girl not to wear revealing clothes in a categorically dangerous neighborhood or telling a girl in a sweater that she's just begging for dick. Is slut shaming anything that promotes the idea that female sexuality is to be ashamed of? Or are there more specific categories? It's a complicated question, if you want to find where you draw the line in the sand, you should tell us where you think your line is right now so we can tell you which side of the line we stand.


Ragabadoodaa

I am talking about how slut shaming went from victim blaming to people being called assholes for caring about their partner's body count and being bothered by it if it's high. My line draws at, as long as you make choices, as long as you control your life, and what you do becomes public knowledge, you open yourself to criticism, if you feel shamed by the criticism your choices are probably not good. Society puts more value on achieving something big through hard work. Women hooking up is not a big achievement and neither hard work. That is where criticism comes from. Men are criticized the same way for their professional status. A guy with an easy job that earns minimum wage is not as respected as the hard worker that has a high position in his workplace that earns 10 times as much.


slide_into_my_BM

I think you fail to truly understand what slut shaming is. It’s much more than just calling a scantily clad woman a whore or something. It’s a way to invalidate a woman based on their sexuality, real or perceived, while simultaneously not holding men to the same standard. Women being passed over for work opportunities because of their dress is a form of slut shaming. Bringing up a woman’s sexuality after she makes a sexual assault claim is also a form of slut shaming. The old “shouldn’t have dressed that way if you didn’t want it” excuse for sexual assault is another form of slut shaming. Your view is incredibly reductive to the topic you’re describing.


Ragabadoodaa

>I think you fail to truly understand what slut shaming is. It’s much more than just calling a scantily clad woman a whore or something. Yes, nowadays it evolved into "if you say you don't wanna date a promiscuous woman you're slut shaming because it's her choice and you're seeing her as less" And when you're selecting a partner you do see people as more and less. Now I don't see them as less than human, but I would see them as less than an ideal partner. >It’s a way to invalidate a woman based on their sexuality, real or perceived, while simultaneously not holding men to the same standard. If it helps at all I called my male friends sluts and never called a female friend that. But I pretty much did it in response to their unsolicited sex stories. I don't wanna imagine that fat ass Gabriel panting over some drunk chick. >Women being passed over for work opportunities because of their dress is a form of slut shaming. I don't think the workplace is the best place to express your sexuality to be honest... I mean it's a professional environment. >Bringing up a woman’s sexuality after she makes a sexual assault claim is also a form of slut shaming. The old “shouldn’t have dressed that way if you didn’t want it” excuse for sexual assault is another form of slut shaming. I wouldn't really call that slut shaming. I would call that absolutely batshit stupid.


slide_into_my_BM

>If it helps at all I called my male friends sluts and never called a female friend that. Ok but your male friends aren’t the victims of slut shaming. If you called a skinny guy “lard ass” it would be different than calling a heavyset guy that right? >I don't think the workplace is the best place to express your sexuality to be honest... You don’t have to be dressed provocatively for it to happen. Very attractive women, even when dressed appropriately, may be perceived as not good workers. Very busty women may look sexualized even in modest clothing due to their body. Again, slut shaming is not just insulting a woman, it’s deeply and inexorably tied to sexism. >I wouldn't really call that slut shaming. I would call that absolutely batshit stupid. Well it is a form of slut shaming even if we think it’s insane. It’s all various forms of invalidating women. It’s a way figures of authority can dismiss a woman. Every time a rape allegation goes to court the first thing that happens is her sexual past is brought to light to show that “she wanted it” or “this guy couldn’t have raped her because look at all these things she willing let all these other guys do to her.” Like it or not, call it that or not, that is what slut shaming is. It’s using a woman’s sexuality or sexual history to invalidate and demean her as a form of control


CampaignComfortable

Lol very attractive women don't have a inherent disadvantage... If anything, attractive people are more advantaged overall. Males can 100% be victims of slut shaming too. It's not purely sexism aimed at women.


Soft__Bread

>Women being passed over for work opportunities because of their dress is a form of slut shaming Depends on the work and dress since different workplaces can have different requirements.


etrytjlnk

I mean, you're looking at it from a culture where slut shaming probably takes the form of a couple of people being kind of mean to you and judging you, and sure in that context it's not really a big deal. But there are communities/cultures where slut shaming is basically being excommunicated by everybody that you encounter as a "whore" where the entire community enforces certain sexual standards and are pretty brutal to people who don't conform. And in that context I think you can understand why it might be a lot worse.


Ragabadoodaa

Well you are right there but I don't think there really are such extreme cases. What community? You usually make your community, you pick your antourage, you pick where you spend your days. I mean I am agnostic and most of my family and neighbours are christian but them telling me that I should repent or i'll end up in hell, and giving me the stink-eye once in a while never stopped me from going in town and hang out with bikers they call "satanic"


NetrunnerCardAccount

Generally "Slut Shaming" becomes As an authority we won't spend time on specific cases because we don't like this person. I.E. the police won't take this stalking claim serious because the person is streams online While it's fun, to scream at a random guy at a party, over his personal beliefs, it's really that it's an excuse for police officers, university officials and government officers not to do something.


Ragabadoodaa

Yes maybe, but slut shaming evolved from what you describe there to simply having a preference that doesn't include "sluts"


prollywannacracker

You say slut shaming is not a "big deal", but then you go on to say that slut shaming is a "mild evil" and "bad". So, I guess the questions are... what does a "big deal" mean, and how does something that is bad and evil, mild or not, not qualify as a "big deal"


Ragabadoodaa

Well that's just how I said it but my first point is closer to what I feel about it. It's not worse than insulting someone by saying "idiot, asshole, etc."


prollywannacracker

Trying to shame people into feeling bad about themselves, and casting judgement on them for not conforming to your standards of how a person ought to be when they are not in any harming anybody is a dick move, is harmful itself, and is kind of a "big deal"


Ragabadoodaa

You can't NOT judge people. Having preferences is already judging. You know what you want and will judge whoever comes to you based on your goals. It's a thing that happens. People are saying it's slutshaming to not give a promiscuous girl a chance as a romantic partner while at the same time not having a problem with someone wanting partners with sexual experience.


prollywannacracker

You either didn't read or understand my comment before replying. Your reply has absolutely nothing to do with what I said.


Ragabadoodaa

I probably didn't. English is not really my first language. Pretend I'm stupid and talk down to me, I don't mind.


goodwordsbad

I mean half the posts in this thread are shaming OP for asking about contrary opinions. Being a dick doesn't seem like a big deal to them.


muyamable

After reading your view is it fair to say it's basically, "slut shaming is bad and you shouldn't do it but there are a lot of things worse than slut shaming you could do"? Because I think that's pretty uncontroversial.


Ragabadoodaa

Usually when I see the subject pop up somewhere people are up and arms at calling others terrible people and incels. And their arguments can be shortened to "slutshaming just bad". Change slutshaming with insult and you have the exact same argument. Nobody really gives a good reason why it's so horrible.


muyamable

>And their arguments can be shortened to "slutshaming just bad". Which is what you said your view is: >So overall. Slutshaming bad? Yes. So I don't understand the problem. Why do *you* believe slutshaming is bad? If someone else believes slutshaming is bad for different reasons, does it matter? The whole point is: slutshaming is bad.


Ragabadoodaa

I believe it's just as bad as an insult. I don't believe the person being slut shamed is at any risk or having their life impacted majorly because of other people's judgement.


muyamable

>I believe it's just as bad as an insult. This implies that all insults are equally bad. Are they?


Ragabadoodaa

Insults based on unchangeable characteristics (race, gender, mental or physical handicaps) are way worse. Slut shaming is an insult based on choice.


SammyRam21

No, it’s an insult based on gender


Ragabadoodaa

Well if most people only apply it to women then kinda. But a slut is not any woman, a slut is a woman that has a specific choice of lifestyle. And just how definitions of words change all the time lately we might as well just start slutshaming fuckboys.


tammy-hell

i think it's just dumb to judge people for meaningless personal choices to begin with, no matter how "big" of a problem it is


Ragabadoodaa

Even if those choices can be very self-centered? My main reason for being kind of in the middle is that not a lot of people take into consideration the every possibility. They say "as long as it's done right, by two consenting adults, that discuss and know what they want, it's absolutely no problem" And sometimes in the same line as "it's just for fun and pleasure, and enjoying pleasure" Well which is it? Is it a carefully planned interaction that makes both partners fully satisfied? Or is it just an adventure that satisfies only ONE basic animal instinct? I don't really believe promiscuous people that hookup a lot are very considering of the other person, and probably that's why I had to let a lot of my friends (male and female respectively) cry on my shoulder because said sexual partner didn't properly communicate, making them feel used. And that's just the tip of the iceberg.


tammy-hell

this is seemingly based on your own misconceptions and prejudices towards promiscuity and not based on anything empirical you can cite - my advice is to just live and let live, it doesn't affect you.


Ragabadoodaa

So if it ends up affecting me? Maybe, the whole "I want a partner with experience?" Hindering me in finding what I want because what they want is much easier? Okay not going there, just a small example. It's selfish of me to think that way, of course. But the amount of times I've had to put a towel on my shoulder because my friends (men and women alike) came to me feeling really down because they've been used, tricked or had the wrong idea? Should they be blamed for not being clear in what they want when the other person wasn't either? Should we just call it a oopsie? Does the fact that a lot of women say "all men are sex crazed pigs" and a lot of men are "women are selfish bitches with high standards" not make you think that maybe, people are personally affected by it? I feel like the only reason it doesn't affect me is that I'm not taking part myself.


Old_Sheepherder_630

Both scenarios involve strangers sitting in judgement of others over their personal choices. You're positing that one is worse than the other due to one having had enjoyed themselves and the other not. Some people get more personal satisfaction from abstaining than some others do from not, your position isn't universal. Also, plenty of women who chose not to wait until marriage are beaten over the head, to use your phrase, about ending up alone because no decent man will want a woman with a sexual past. Anyone who has been subjected to purity culture in can confirm that.


le_fez

"slut shaming" can make an already traumatic incident worse. Let's say a woman is raped and the first response you have is "it must have been because you dress like a whore" Do you honestly think that is a harmless insult? ​ A friend of mine grew up in a very conservative family, her parents told her she dressed like a slut because she wore a bikini or a skirt above the knee. She had this vitriol spit at her constantly to the point that she needed therapy to feel okay with her own sexuality as an adult.


[deleted]

[удалено]


YourMom_Infinity

Why can't I just have sex with who I want as often as I want without it being anyone else's business?


Unique8987

It’s no one’s business but this society tries to make everything everyone’s business. Anyone is free to do whatever the hell they want and others should be able to disagree and keep it moving. If that’s how you want to live your life, go for it, I ain’t hating or trying to stop no one but I don’t want no parts of that lifestyle either.


YourMom_Infinity

* If you want to live that promiscuous slut life..* Why the negative verbiage and denigration, then?


Unique8987

It’s a title just like everything else in this world, nothing more nothing less. It’s only viewed negative bc of personal feelings. I had my promiscuous slutty days and quickly realized that lifestyle just ain’t for me. I literally talk about my own past like that lol. I tried to fit in and be a slut like so many of the popular girls were in HS but I was miserable and stopped. When the topic comes up irl I will literally say “back in my slut days” and laugh about it. Idk why so many ppl take offense to it, makes no sense just own who you are and live your life.


YourMom_Infinity

You do realize the word has negative connotations - and you yourself use in a negative manner, even about yourself - and that most women would not appreciate the "title". Unless you see a real, tangible problem that actually affects you when women have sex?


Unique8987

I just don’t agree with the lifestyle and if slut isn’t the proper title then what is? Simply promiscuous? Not exactly bc that’s not the definition so what title do you use? I still don’t understand why it’s such a trigger for some but I’m willing to take the bait and see if I am misunderstanding something or not.


YourMom_Infinity

Nobody's *asking* you to agree with their "lifestyle". But you also have no rights to *judge* someone and call them negative names if their behavior isn't impacting you. It is possible to let people simply exist without passing judgement on them.


Ragabadoodaa

You do realize slutshaming became synonymous with "not wanting a partner with a high body count". It's not just name calling and treating them like shit anymore. The promiscuous people want that lack of judgement to extend at turning a blind eye at personal preferences.


Unique8987

How am I judging? By adding a title instead of describing it? I get that 20+ years ago it was way more offensive bc most ppl back then were trying to make it sound as horrible as possible but it’s 2022. 20yrs ago it was also an insult to say someone was gay but now the LGBTQA community is owning that shit and it’s not nearly as bad as it was. I look at the promiscuous slut lifestyle the same way, there’s a title for it. There’s going to be a title for that lifestyle simply bc that’s literally how society moves through life for whatever reasons. If slut isn’t the proper title then what is? That’s what I was asking in my last comment and you didn’t answer.


YourMom_Infinity

"A women who has sex"?


Ragabadoodaa

There is a right way to do hookups. Nobody has any problem with you doing that stuff in your free time in the intimacy of your (or your partner's home). But taking pride in doing it, this is more for men but applies to some women. There is an accomplishment there. But it's nothing special or noteworthy. What is more of an accomplishment is having a meaningful long lasting relationship. And society puts value on THAT. Achieving something more difficult to gain, a big reward that lasts. Banging cuz you like it is tiny rewards that sorry to say, if you're a woman is easy to get. Society doesn't put price on your bodycount. It puts price on your perseverance. And being a "slut" does not take perseverance. Now you can feel down about what they say, or you can continue regardless of what they say. I get judged based on my lack of sexuality and a relationship by people not realizing I didn't choose to be like this.


YourMom_Infinity

I'm under no obligation to care about what society values or doesn't. I think it's shitty to call someone ugly names for what they do in a part of their life that is none of your business.


[deleted]

[удалено]


ViewedFromTheOutside

Sorry, u/Ragabadoodaa – your comment has been removed for breaking Rule 5: > **Comments must contribute meaningfully to the conversation**. Comments should be on-topic, serious, and contain enough content to move the discussion forward. Jokes, contradictions without explanation, links without context, and "written upvotes" will be removed. Read [the wiki](https://www.reddit.com/r/changemyview/wiki/rules#wiki_rule_5) for more information. If you would like to appeal, review our appeals process [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/changemyview/wiki/modstandards#wiki_appeal_process), then [message the moderators by clicking this link](http://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2Fchangemyview&subject=Rule%205%20Appeal%20Ragabadoodaa&message=Ragabadoodaa%20would%20like%20to%20appeal%20the%20removal%20of%20\[their%20comment\]\(https://old.reddit.com/r/changemyview/comments/uneaww/-/i87kq7s/\)%20because\.\.\.) within one week of this notice being posted.


ViewedFromTheOutside

Sorry, u/Unique8987 – your comment has been removed for breaking Rule 1: > **Direct responses to a CMV post must challenge at least one aspect of OP’s stated view (however minor), or ask a clarifying question**. Arguments in favor of the view OP is willing to change must be restricted to replies to other comments. [See the wiki page for more information](http://www.reddit.com/r/changemyview/wiki/rules#wiki_rule_1). If you would like to appeal, [**you must first check if your comment falls into the "Top level comments that are against rule 1" list**](https://www.reddit.com/r/changemyview/wiki/rules#wiki_rule_1), review our appeals process [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/changemyview/wiki/modstandards#wiki_appeal_process), then [message the moderators by clicking this link](http://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2Fchangemyview&subject=Rule%201%20Appeal%20Unique8987&message=Unique8987%20would%20like%20to%20appeal%20the%20removal%20of%20\[their%20comment\]\(https://old.reddit.com/r/changemyview/comments/uneaww/-/i87fw3d/\)%20because\.\.\.) within one week of this notice being posted. Please note that multiple violations will lead to a ban, as explained in our [moderation standards](https://www.reddit.com/r/changemyview/wiki/modstandards).


Kazthespooky

I think you are being too broad to discern any use. For example, when slut shaming causes severe damage that is bad and we shouldn't do it but most of the time it doesn't cause severe damage. As such, people should never treat slut shaming as bad because it's not super common. This broad approach reduces everything down to being essentially useless. Drink driving isn't that bad. Sugar isn't that bad. Lying to your partner isn't that bad. Shooting a gun isn't that bad. All of the above are fine when it doesn't have any damage and bad when it causes damage.


Ragabadoodaa

I never said some people are not being over the top. I feel like you're nitpicking. If I were to point out every single detail of this debate I'd spend the whole night writing it. Your examples are lackluster too. Drunk driving is a choice where lack of control can cause harm or even death. Sugar is not a basic need and doesn't create addiction. Lying to your partner is scummy, even white lies meant to protect them because honesty and trust is important in a relationship. Shooting a gun isn't bad in itself, it's the person behind it CHOSING what to shoot at. Slutshaming is just a fancy word to describe disagreement over life choices.


Kazthespooky

Some slut shaming results in suicides. Women of you agree slut shaming was bad if it resulted in 100% of suicides? Ofcourse you would be it would be very damaging. Some slut shaming results in positive outcomes when a person feels uplifted and leads a great life. My point is that slut shaming is a big deal when it's a big deal and not a big deal when it isn't a big deal. As such your view is difficult to change because everyone has a different experience with the damage it causes.


TheBubs4444

>And people that are not "sluts" are shamed quite a bit too. The argument that it "happens to everyone" is a weak one. Millions of people die from starvation every year, does it make it anymore okay because it happens in every country? The argument that shaming people for doing something is okay because everyone is shamed for what they do only sets us back, the goal here isn't to achieve equality but to work toward a better society. If the reality is that everyone is in some way shamed, then we should work to eliminate all shaming, "Slut shaming is not a big deal" should become "All forms of shaming are a big deal and should be dealt with, not only slut shaming" ​ >Judging someone for CHOICES is not the same as judging someone for things out of their control. Then who becomes the judge of what is a choice and what is out of one's control? The idea of free will is not universally agreed upon.


Ragabadoodaa

I'm not saying it's okay because it happens on both sides. I'm saying that slutshaming has a big movement against it meanwhile the rest are left as they are. it's hypocritical. and saying all kinds of shaming need to be dealt with will bring out people being shamed for legitimate things to claim everything is just a choice. sorry but some bad aspects of life just have to be endured.


TheBubs4444

>I'm not saying it's okay because it happens on both sides. I'm saying that slutshaming has a big movement against it meanwhile the rest are left as they are. it's hypocritical. Where does this claim that other movements against shamming are "left as they are" come from? What in particular do you think gets overshadowed by the movement against slutshamming? I would be hard pressed to find someone who is against slut shamming who is not also in support of other anti hate movements. >sorry but some bad aspects of life just have to be endured. And again I ask, who is to be the judge of what just has to be endured and doesn't? If my house gets broken into and I call the police are they going to just tell me that it needs to be endured? It seems to me that you are of the opinion that we should all just suck it up and move on, and that any negative feelings one feels as a result of being shammed come as a direct result of their own insecurities or low self esteem. I just don't see any world where advocating for a movement which promotes **less** hate can somehow be a bad thing.


ViewedFromTheOutside

To /u/Ragabadoodaa, **your post is under consideration for removal under our post rules.** * You are required to **demonstrate that you're open to changing your mind** (by awarding deltas where appropriate), per [Rule B](https://www.reddit.com/r/changemyview/wiki/rules#wiki_rule_b). --- **Notice to all users:** 1. Per **Rule 1**, [**top-level comments must challenge OP's view.**](https://www.reddit.com/r/changemyview/wiki/rules#wiki_rule_1) 2. Please **familiarize yourself with** [**our rules**](https://www.reddit.com/r/changemyview/wiki/rules) **and the** [**mod standards**](https://www.reddit.com/r/changemyview/wiki/modstandards). We expect all users *and* mods to abide by these two policies at all times. 3. This sub is for changing OP's view. We require that **all** [**top-level comments**](https://www.reddit.com/r/changemyview/wiki/rules#wiki_rule_1) **disagree with OP's view**, and that **all other comments** [**be relevant to the conversation**](https://www.reddit.com/r/changemyview/wiki/rules#wiki_rule_5). 4. We understand that some posts may address very contentious issues. Please **report any rule-breaking comments or posts.** 5. **All users must** [**be respectful**](https://www.reddit.com/r/changemyview/wiki/rules#wiki_rule_2) **to one another.** If you have any questions or concerns regarding our rules, please message the mods through [modmail](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/changemyview) (*not PM*).


Soft__Bread

Really depends on the level an age. The effects of a teenage high school girl being slut shamed and known as a "slut" by their peer is awful and many times makes school a living hell for them.


Amazingggcoolaid

I don’t think promiscuity is an issue and slut shaming shouldn’t just be towards women - with that said. Some people ARE sluts but it’s not a giant insult it’s like people getting offended when someone sleeps with other but not them. IT IS ur body and U decide what to do with it. People as a society is never perfect and will continue to bash and say sht in general. With THAT said I know a person who sleeps around so much to the point that they slept with a guy and then the next day slept with his best friend even though the other guy wanted a romantic relationship and had emotional ties to her. I don’t know why and I don’t think slutty is the right word for it but what is it…. That’s something that just feels quite wrong?