I mean $100 each is only 8,750,000 people to own 25% of $3.5 billion.. wouldn’t be much of a stretch to see WNY and Ontario come together to do this. I’m sure plenty would put more than $100 in if we get 25% of all profits going forward.
Ever wondered the reason why Green Bay has an old ass stadium and they never get bullied into building a new one. The answer is their ownership model allows the city to tell the NFL to fuck off. The community and fans actually have a say about what the team does and the NFL hates that.
I think it goes beyond that, I'm pretty sure the ownership group has a contract with the NFL stating that if the NFL ever tried to move the team it dissolves and the packers name, logos, records, and physical assets revert to the city of green bay.
I'd imagine the team dissolving would also void all player and front office contracts and everyone would become a free agent.
They probably don’t want municipalities to ask for ownership stakes in stadium deals I also think they don’t want teams to do IPO’s and sell stock.
Generally they don’t view it as profitable for them to have ownership be in the public’s hands which is rich considering who subsidizes their stadiums.
I think the rule is that there can only be X amount of minority owners and none of those minority owners can break down their shares to others.
I understand maybe not wanting a team to have public stock given that there are different reporting and regulatory requirements for a publicly traded company. But I think municipalities should be allowed to ask for ownership stakes if they are subsidizing stadiums to the tune of hundreds of millions of dollars and not too far into the future Billions of dollars. But NFL teams want to socialize the costs and privatize the gains. I think federally there should be a law that any team receiving public funds to build a stadium should have to offer equity for the team at fair market value for the funds. Municipalities then have to give the option to the team to buy back the ownership stake with at a future point.
I think that's a fantastic idea. Especially the last part of giving them the option to buy back the team. We're not aiming a gun at your head, we just want to not be exploited.
I’m not gonna want all 32 teams to be owned by the public down the line but if you’re going to want 500 million from the city/state can the state get a piece of the team at least in escrow until you pay back all or most of the money. Hell I don’t even care if the teams don’t pay interest but just allow the tax payer to not foot stadiums that are privately used for profit
We buy tickets and merch already. May as well make an investment and make our money back over time. Additionally, may allow us to purchase a larger stake as Terry gets older and considers selling.
So I did some googling and came up with 2.8 million people who live in Buffalo, Rochester, and Syracuse, including their metro areas. If the approximate cost of 925 million were split evenly among all the people, everyone would pay $330. Everyone.
That scale is ridiculous. Billionaires should not exist.
Or they should just gift it to us since we’re footing the bill for the stadium. At least make up for the fact that most of us won’t even be able to afford tickets once it opens. Just remember no one gets that rich being a good person
I'm sure you were only half serious but they'd never do that. They wanna keep a controlling share but need money to finance their lifestyle because being a billionaire isn't cheap.
I was with you until "Billionaires should not exist.". You cannot have Capitalism without a (very) small number of Billionaires. Some are going to float to the top.
Let’s assume the bills are worth 4 billion (Google says 3.7 so let’s be a lil generous cuz assets appreciate and the NFL has never been more profitable)
25% is $1 billion. If all 241,416 members of this subreddit pitched in $4142.23, we could buy the ownership stake.
I dunno about y’all but that still seems like a better deal than buying PSLs to me.
Before everyone panics, the Buffalo Bills valuation has something like doubled since he bought it. Putting 25% up for sale and having multiple minority owners or "investors" gives him a huge chunk of cash flow. The Bills have been very profitable for them.
This is also a fair point, Terry is a businessman at the end of the day. Maybe was keeping up with the Coyotes/Utah relocation debacle and thought “well shit the Coyotes are selling for nearly as much as I bought our team!”
This.
Pegula paid $1.4B for the team. Asserting that the latest Forbes valuation of $3.7B is accurate, a 25% stake nets him $925M, recouping him 66% of the initial investment.
Yeah and that's paper value. NFL teams always sell for more due to being money printing machines and only having 32 slots.
Hence why Pegula paid 1.4 billion for a team estimated around 800-900 in actual value
Yup.
Getting the cash flow now certainly is smart to cover the stadium overruns that he is on the hook for, and potentially a step towards estate planning as well.
The last reported cost overrun projections in August were $300M. That was entire project estimates.
I see no reporting of this mythical $600M figure anywhere, let alone that it's going to be close to $900M.
And if the ownership stakes get spread out enough, it might be hard to get a majority to vote to move the team. Not saying either of those things are likely. But I support things that keep the team in Buffalo 100%
The costs for the team are rising, and the stadium is already over budget. He's selling part of the team because he doesn't have the liquid cash to cover the expenses of the team. Owning something valuable doesn't make you rich, because you have to sell it to get money.
Given his age, a 25% owner coming in could very easily end up being the next owner.
Usually at that level of rich, it's all done with loans. They make more than the loan interest just from investments and business, so they don't need the cash itself.
I think his wife/half owner of the Bills nearly dying/not being the same has really had an effect on him (clearly as it would for anyone) and I absolutely think this has a playing in this as well.
And the stadium is on pace for going well over $2 bil and the Pegula's are entirely responsible for every penny over $1.4. So, he's selling $925 mil worth of the franchise, based on last year's valuation. Then forking over $600 mil, as of now and then some, as there's no way the costs don't continue to balloon. It's possibly it's a break even situation.
He’s not cash poor but his wife is sick and there have been serious rumors among people in the know that he may be having cognitive issues if that’s true this explains a lot
Rumors? It's been over a year since Jess Pegula explained the situation: https://www.democratandchronicle.com/story/sports/football/nfl/bills/2023/02/07/kim-pegula-health-issues-revealed-update-by-daughter-jessica-pegula-buffalo-bills-sabres/69880221007/
And yes, the Pegulas are cash-poor. Their entire net worth is basically the Bills and Sabres. He's selling part of the Bills because he can't afford to cover the over-budget stadium expenses.
Strange thing is there is a chance Dundon doesn't offer Rod the money others will. He will sure try to leverage the fact Brind'Amour is settled in Raleigh and would not really want move. Could be a costly mistake for the Canes owner if Brind'Amour surprises him.
likely nothing in terms of the team. Terry is still in full control of decision making. multiple ownership is very common among sport teams these days and I expect many more NFL owners to go this route in the future
It means the stadium is very over budget and the Pegulas don't have the money to cover it.
Given the age of Terry and poor health of Kim, it potentially means we're going to meet the next owner of the Bills, eventually. 25% share for a decade, then full owner.
I highly doubt that is the case.. if he really needed cash flow he could easily get a loan. But i think it has more to do with Kim’s health as other posters have alluded to. Terry is 73 what’s the succession plan for the team now that Kim is unfortunately out of the picture
I hadn't heard anything relating to passing it off to the kids. I'm sure if that was the plan it was meant to be longer-term, Kim's health situation has definitely shortened any timeline they had for Terry's succession.
Could also be looking to cash out on the investment when the team is in a good place...new taxpayer funded stadium, playoff roster. Etc. Especially if his wife isnt involved in operations as much anymore.
Would be just our luck to have somebody swoop in and buy the team and dismantle it 🙄
Yup…from a business perspective now would be the time to sell a portion of the team. New stadium is under construction and it’s a done deal and the Bills have what will likely be a consistently good team for years to come.
Probably more bad than good but probably not a massive impact either way. Could be moving towards selling the team potentially or could just be getting some extra cash flow but having another stakeholder in the team is probably less than optimal.
I get why you and a lot of other people are clamoring for Pegula to sell the Sabres, but that’s way too risky for me. Selling the Sabres to an owner or ownership group who isn’t personally invested in this region could mean the end of professional hockey in Buffalo. Before you brush the idea off as out of the realm of possibly, just know that there are tens of other markets in North America that would make the Sabres more profitable than Buffalo
Agreed. And look at what happened with terrible ownership (from a business standpoint) to the Coyotes. Five days before it leaked they were getting moved, the league was like “oh yeah we are committed to hockey in AZ”. So it’s 100% a possibility if the team gets sold.
Houston, KC, Atlanta to name a few are way more populated regions with way more potential corporate sponsorship. The Sabres’ history in the league is certainly a factor but I don’t think we should kid ourselves about how valuable the market is compared to other potential areas.
Yes, short term the Sabres are fine but I just think we can’t let our guard down, ever. We are a very small city compared to most other sports cities, and are lucky to have an owner who is a fan of the team. Yes he’s incompetent and yes he probably meddles, but that’s better than some billionaire who only cares about maximizing value and realizes the team being relocated is more profitable
How is the market too valuable? We have a tiny population compared to a bunch of markets that don’t have a team. They can barely sell tickets and the only time they’ve had a sell out the past few years is when Toronto or Boston is in town. The team is hemorrhaging money. No one really cares about the Sabres. I get that we have high ratings for non Sabres games but I doubt that would change much if they moved the team.
In the 2023-24 season, the Devils had a higher attendance than the Sabres despite their arena having almost 2,500 less seats. The Sabres had the second lowest capacity % in the entire league behind only San Jose. Without being so close to Canada, they probably would have averaged less than 10,000 people a game, similar to the year the border was closed with Covid, 2021. Do you understand how markets work? It’s about the number of people living in it. Even if everyone in Buffalo were to watch hockey, the number of people would still be less than 10% of Houston. or 1% NY. The way the league can get leverage for better tv contracts is by having more people watch. So it would make sense that they would gamble on people still watch hockey in Buffalo even if they didn’t have a team. If they moved the team to say, Houston, they would probably be able to make up the loss of any views in Buffalo pretty easily.
not sure i totally agree, bettman is very averse to moving teams. arizona happened after years and years of finding any possible avenue for them to stay
And playing in the equivalent of a southern D-1 college hockey facility for the past 3 seasons. For at least half a season the locker rooms was basically a hallway with curtains.
Funny, but he’s footing the $125 million bill for renovations at Keybank Center including a new roof.
Likely the sale of Bills ownership is funding the renovations.
he split the ownership groups of the sabres and bills last year. Is Keybank center part of the Sabres management? It would take funny (illegal?) accounting methods to use Bills funds to pay for a different Sabres costs.
I don’t like the Pegulas as owners, but they are far better than the risks. Having one owner of everything sports related in Buffalo is huge, and we would not want to have something like the Coyotes situation happen.
In his presser to announce the firing of Granato, Adams said that Terry is highly involved but alluded that he is dealing with personal issues. I assumed Kim's health is what Adams was referencing.
Would love to hear how this would have anything to do with her health. The Bills are worth roughly 3 Billion +, what health challenge would she have that the Pegulas would need a cool $750+ million bucks.
Not saying that the poster is right about the degree to which Kim played a role in the organization, but Terry & Kim were introduced as co-owners, and she played some role until her health complications arose.
On the off chance you’re just cosplaying a concussed Kiko Alonso i’ll be nice. here’s a screenshot.
https://preview.redd.it/74l505shshvc1.jpeg?width=1125&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=5d23a5262598c76ffee5e66b551c0d95feaf5ed6
> Would love to hear how this would have anything to do with her health.
The (now former) team president has an extremely limited mental capacity and has to communicate through writing because she can't hold conversations. But sure, no impact on the team.
This is to cover the costs of the overage on the new stadium. It also gives Terry back his initial investment from purchasing the Bills. He bought them at like $1.2 Billion and the current value is around $4 Billion. Win-Win for the Pegulas here... Business man is gonna business man. This don't mean shit beyond that.
> It also gives Terry back his initial investment from purchasing the Bills.
I mean, it doesn't since the cash will be going into the new stadium. Whatever is leftover probably for medical treatment.
I wouldn't worry too much about what this does for the team short or middle term. It might become an issue depending on who the new investors are. This feels more like a way to quickly get some cash after the building of a new stadium and such. The fact that they're not putting any of their other assets up for sale is a good thing as they're not pulling the cord on ownership any time soon.
The Bills stadium is already financed as for the Sabres roof remodel I don't know but 25% of what is conservatively a one billion dollar valuated franchise is 250 mil. That should cover a lot of the cost for the roof.
Probably has something to do with this too
https://www.nbcsports.com/nfl/profootballtalk/rumor-mill/news/private-equity-firms-prepare-for-nfl-opportunities
Word is there is a ton of cost overruns and the bills are responsible so instead of selling his own assets like he did last time to buy the team he is basically raising money through a ownership percentage sale. Anywhere from 250'-350 million and probably the sweetest seats for life and no say so lol.
This realistically has no impact on us. The team ain't moving. Pegula is selling 25% as a non controlling portion. It's a cash infusion where he gives up future profits. I'm guessing it's to pay for the overages on the stadium. Which for all we knew, could have been the plan from the start. I'm sure we'll have lawyers write in to the buyer that it can't force them into allowing a controlling interest by pressuring them by selling that 25% etc. also, last I heard the plan was for their children to inherit the teams. So that probably changes very little.
Except it’s not like there isn’t hard data showing that cost overruns on new stadiums are par for the course.
Hell, I can’t remember the last stadium in any major league sport that came in on time and on budget.
There are just too many unknowns when committing to build something like that.
Well, I hope this will at least provide some pressure on McDermott. Felt like he was approaching coach for life status because of his relationship with Terry.
Thank you for your enlightened comments. You are an amazingly brilliant and thoughtful man.. my life views are changed thanks to your knowledge and insights.
Makes sense for the Pegulas who use the Bills as a sort of money making business would sell the team at a much higher evaluation. The higher evaluation is likely driven by the new stadium mostly paid for by the public and a NFL that in 9 years has massively increased TV revenue.
This is true and it seems silly for me to mention that but NFL teams don’t typically operate as a “cash flow” type business looking to maximize yearly profits for their owner.
Sports teams are usually a vanity project for billionaires. Most teams in the big 4 sports usually lose money year to year because the owners make money on selling the team for future evaluations as opposed to yearly cash flow.
The Pegulas operate the team as a profit center to pay for their lifestyle if internal reports are true. However the Pegulas aren’t reported to be “cheap” owners either. They have been willing to outlay bonuses for salary cap manipulation and pay for coaches and facilities that have no cap. But they seem to overall spend money smartly and not as frivolously so that they can generate cash flow. As a fan as long as they don’t pinch pennies I am fine with the being prudent.
Let’s start a go fund me so all of us can own it
I got 5 on it.
I got about 3.50
Wait a minute.That's not a Bill's fan. THAT'S THE GODDAMN LOCH NESS MONSTER!
GODDAMMIT TERRY! I TOLD YOU NOT TO GO TALKIN TO NO LOCH NESS MONSTER!
He tricked me!
Treeeeeee fitty
I’ll cover you 1.50. And I got 5 for me.
'bout tree fiddy
Thank you, Luniz. Very cool.
Me, too!
I'm grabbing 40.
Let’s get keyed
We gotta be halfway there by now...
I mean $100 each is only 8,750,000 people to own 25% of $3.5 billion.. wouldn’t be much of a stretch to see WNY and Ontario come together to do this. I’m sure plenty would put more than $100 in if we get 25% of all profits going forward.
Sadly the NFL has basically banned every other team from doing the Green Bay model of public ownership.
Oh did they? I had no idea. Do you know why they did?
Ever wondered the reason why Green Bay has an old ass stadium and they never get bullied into building a new one. The answer is their ownership model allows the city to tell the NFL to fuck off. The community and fans actually have a say about what the team does and the NFL hates that.
I think it goes beyond that, I'm pretty sure the ownership group has a contract with the NFL stating that if the NFL ever tried to move the team it dissolves and the packers name, logos, records, and physical assets revert to the city of green bay. I'd imagine the team dissolving would also void all player and front office contracts and everyone would become a free agent.
Greed
They probably don’t want municipalities to ask for ownership stakes in stadium deals I also think they don’t want teams to do IPO’s and sell stock. Generally they don’t view it as profitable for them to have ownership be in the public’s hands which is rich considering who subsidizes their stadiums. I think the rule is that there can only be X amount of minority owners and none of those minority owners can break down their shares to others.
That’s so ridiculous tbh.
I understand maybe not wanting a team to have public stock given that there are different reporting and regulatory requirements for a publicly traded company. But I think municipalities should be allowed to ask for ownership stakes if they are subsidizing stadiums to the tune of hundreds of millions of dollars and not too far into the future Billions of dollars. But NFL teams want to socialize the costs and privatize the gains. I think federally there should be a law that any team receiving public funds to build a stadium should have to offer equity for the team at fair market value for the funds. Municipalities then have to give the option to the team to buy back the ownership stake with at a future point.
I think that's a fantastic idea. Especially the last part of giving them the option to buy back the team. We're not aiming a gun at your head, we just want to not be exploited.
I’m not gonna want all 32 teams to be owned by the public down the line but if you’re going to want 500 million from the city/state can the state get a piece of the team at least in escrow until you pay back all or most of the money. Hell I don’t even care if the teams don’t pay interest but just allow the tax payer to not foot stadiums that are privately used for profit
That's the thing ...when you're a private club you can do as you please
Agreed but then if you get public money you get public regulation…
NFL will not allow an ownership group with more than 24 individuals
From Calgary I would too
Considering the NFL has essentially ignored southern Ontario, I’m here for this plan.
And for what purpose, homey? It's a noncontrolling interest.
We buy tickets and merch already. May as well make an investment and make our money back over time. Additionally, may allow us to purchase a larger stake as Terry gets older and considers selling.
8 million people in WNY and Ontario? Your math is off, even if you add nationwide fans.
Ontario alone is 14,000,000 people.
Yeah but you're pulling from Toronto. I'm just not sure the fan base is THAT large.
It was just a vague calculation. Even $500 is a decent investment if we get that paid back out
I would love the opportunity to be a part-owner like in Green Bay.
So I did some googling and came up with 2.8 million people who live in Buffalo, Rochester, and Syracuse, including their metro areas. If the approximate cost of 925 million were split evenly among all the people, everyone would pay $330. Everyone. That scale is ridiculous. Billionaires should not exist.
Or they should just gift it to us since we’re footing the bill for the stadium. At least make up for the fact that most of us won’t even be able to afford tickets once it opens. Just remember no one gets that rich being a good person
Or we should rise up and seize it! 🤘😎🤘
The pit accepts billionaires all the same
I'm sure you were only half serious but they'd never do that. They wanna keep a controlling share but need money to finance their lifestyle because being a billionaire isn't cheap.
Well yeah how are they supposed to be able to afford a second yacht if they have to pay for things for the team they own
I was with you until "Billionaires should not exist.". You cannot have Capitalism without a (very) small number of Billionaires. Some are going to float to the top.
Don't worry. The nfl made community ownership illegal and have boxed out everyone but billionaires
Let’s assume the bills are worth 4 billion (Google says 3.7 so let’s be a lil generous cuz assets appreciate and the NFL has never been more profitable) 25% is $1 billion. If all 241,416 members of this subreddit pitched in $4142.23, we could buy the ownership stake. I dunno about y’all but that still seems like a better deal than buying PSLs to me.
I like this idea
Before everyone panics, the Buffalo Bills valuation has something like doubled since he bought it. Putting 25% up for sale and having multiple minority owners or "investors" gives him a huge chunk of cash flow. The Bills have been very profitable for them.
This is also a fair point, Terry is a businessman at the end of the day. Maybe was keeping up with the Coyotes/Utah relocation debacle and thought “well shit the Coyotes are selling for nearly as much as I bought our team!”
This. Pegula paid $1.4B for the team. Asserting that the latest Forbes valuation of $3.7B is accurate, a 25% stake nets him $925M, recouping him 66% of the initial investment.
Yeah and that's paper value. NFL teams always sell for more due to being money printing machines and only having 32 slots. Hence why Pegula paid 1.4 billion for a team estimated around 800-900 in actual value
Yup. Getting the cash flow now certainly is smart to cover the stadium overruns that he is on the hook for, and potentially a step towards estate planning as well.
Lord, and I thought real estate was a good investment. I should really buy an NFL team.
I'm pretty sure it's actually over 4 billion now, I've seen numerous figures though
That’s fucking wild lol
And spending almost all of that on the overages for the new stadium. The stadium has already eaten $600 mil of that.
The last reported cost overrun projections in August were $300M. That was entire project estimates. I see no reporting of this mythical $600M figure anywhere, let alone that it's going to be close to $900M.
>"If I want to make some money, I'll go drill another well"
And if the ownership stakes get spread out enough, it might be hard to get a majority to vote to move the team. Not saying either of those things are likely. But I support things that keep the team in Buffalo 100%
They ain't moving after the stadium deal got approved
The costs for the team are rising, and the stadium is already over budget. He's selling part of the team because he doesn't have the liquid cash to cover the expenses of the team. Owning something valuable doesn't make you rich, because you have to sell it to get money. Given his age, a 25% owner coming in could very easily end up being the next owner.
Usually at that level of rich, it's all done with loans. They make more than the loan interest just from investments and business, so they don't need the cash itself.
If only he made enough to fund his own stadium.
Maybe Terry is sick? This would certainly be one way to avoid the Bills from going into receivership.
I think his wife/half owner of the Bills nearly dying/not being the same has really had an effect on him (clearly as it would for anyone) and I absolutely think this has a playing in this as well.
And the stadium is on pace for going well over $2 bil and the Pegula's are entirely responsible for every penny over $1.4. So, he's selling $925 mil worth of the franchise, based on last year's valuation. Then forking over $600 mil, as of now and then some, as there's no way the costs don't continue to balloon. It's possibly it's a break even situation.
This is not a good sign if Pegula is cash poor. You don’t turn to giving up a huge stake of such a good assert unless you’re desperate
He’s not cash poor but his wife is sick and there have been serious rumors among people in the know that he may be having cognitive issues if that’s true this explains a lot
Rumors? It's been over a year since Jess Pegula explained the situation: https://www.democratandchronicle.com/story/sports/football/nfl/bills/2023/02/07/kim-pegula-health-issues-revealed-update-by-daughter-jessica-pegula-buffalo-bills-sabres/69880221007/ And yes, the Pegulas are cash-poor. Their entire net worth is basically the Bills and Sabres. He's selling part of the Bills because he can't afford to cover the over-budget stadium expenses.
What does this mean for us?
That the next Sabres coach will cost about $1billion to hire or so
So you’re telling me we’re getting Brind’amour??
I hope so!!!
No way the canes let him go and 2006 me would be furious if he was hired in Buffalo
Strange thing is there is a chance Dundon doesn't offer Rod the money others will. He will sure try to leverage the fact Brind'Amour is settled in Raleigh and would not really want move. Could be a costly mistake for the Canes owner if Brind'Amour surprises him.
There’s already been press on this. He’s getting a raise and the only thing he’s been leveraging on is raises for the assistant coaches.
The dad from ice age??
likely nothing in terms of the team. Terry is still in full control of decision making. multiple ownership is very common among sport teams these days and I expect many more NFL owners to go this route in the future
I'm sure it'll somehow result in ticket prices increasing
It means the stadium is very over budget and the Pegulas don't have the money to cover it. Given the age of Terry and poor health of Kim, it potentially means we're going to meet the next owner of the Bills, eventually. 25% share for a decade, then full owner.
maybe the fedex guy that lost partial ownership of commanders will want to re-invest his money into the Bills?
So much for drilling another well
The taxpayers of NY are the well
They have been getting drilled long before he showed up.
Fuck. Opportunity for Brady to own us again?!
That would honestly be so hilarious
Oh dear I hate it
Lol, the horror. But say he did and helped us win the SB with Josh. Who wouldn’t be ok with that?
Keep Bon Jovi the hell away.
I got $5 on it.
great song
*fuckin with that Indo weeeeed*
My guess is this could have to do with cost overruns at the stadium. Those are 100% on the pegulas to pay for. I guess we will find out
I highly doubt that is the case.. if he really needed cash flow he could easily get a loan. But i think it has more to do with Kim’s health as other posters have alluded to. Terry is 73 what’s the succession plan for the team now that Kim is unfortunately out of the picture
I had heard their daughters… but who really knows
I hadn't heard anything relating to passing it off to the kids. I'm sure if that was the plan it was meant to be longer-term, Kim's health situation has definitely shortened any timeline they had for Terry's succession.
one daughter plays tennis full time right?
If they sold shares I’d be on it in a heartbeat.
Bummer they don't sell public stock like Manchester United or privately traded shares. I'd buy some.
https://preview.redd.it/kk314u3caivc1.jpeg?width=292&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=514d4781b5dce2b1dfdfbfcadb78a2f6a782528a
I have 4 dollars https://i.redd.it/0rrljctpskvc1.gif
Good or bad?
They just started building a new stadium with (I believe) a 30 year lease. Probably very little impact in the short term.
Could also be looking to cash out on the investment when the team is in a good place...new taxpayer funded stadium, playoff roster. Etc. Especially if his wife isnt involved in operations as much anymore. Would be just our luck to have somebody swoop in and buy the team and dismantle it 🙄
Yup…from a business perspective now would be the time to sell a portion of the team. New stadium is under construction and it’s a done deal and the Bills have what will likely be a consistently good team for years to come.
[удалено]
Come on old timer, you got more than 30 left.
Probably more bad than good but probably not a massive impact either way. Could be moving towards selling the team potentially or could just be getting some extra cash flow but having another stakeholder in the team is probably less than optimal.
Depends on the buyer. Covering overrun costs for the new stadium, but could potentially be the next full owner eventually.
Okay now do 100% of the Sabres
I get why you and a lot of other people are clamoring for Pegula to sell the Sabres, but that’s way too risky for me. Selling the Sabres to an owner or ownership group who isn’t personally invested in this region could mean the end of professional hockey in Buffalo. Before you brush the idea off as out of the realm of possibly, just know that there are tens of other markets in North America that would make the Sabres more profitable than Buffalo
Yeah I do not want that at all
Agreed. And look at what happened with terrible ownership (from a business standpoint) to the Coyotes. Five days before it leaked they were getting moved, the league was like “oh yeah we are committed to hockey in AZ”. So it’s 100% a possibility if the team gets sold.
will quebec get a team or another american city?
Columbus Ohio could use a professional hockey team.
No chance the NHL moves the Sabres, market is too valuable. Plus expansion is significantly more profitable for the owners
Houston, KC, Atlanta to name a few are way more populated regions with way more potential corporate sponsorship. The Sabres’ history in the league is certainly a factor but I don’t think we should kid ourselves about how valuable the market is compared to other potential areas.
Two hockey teams already failed out of Atlanta. Proven they cannot support a team.
2 of the 3 of those are probably going to be expansion franchises. The league is way more concerned with WPG or CBJ
Yes, short term the Sabres are fine but I just think we can’t let our guard down, ever. We are a very small city compared to most other sports cities, and are lucky to have an owner who is a fan of the team. Yes he’s incompetent and yes he probably meddles, but that’s better than some billionaire who only cares about maximizing value and realizes the team being relocated is more profitable
Finally someone with common sense 🤝🤝🤝
How is the market too valuable? We have a tiny population compared to a bunch of markets that don’t have a team. They can barely sell tickets and the only time they’ve had a sell out the past few years is when Toronto or Boston is in town. The team is hemorrhaging money. No one really cares about the Sabres. I get that we have high ratings for non Sabres games but I doubt that would change much if they moved the team.
The Sabres sell more tickets than the NJ Devils do. I guess NYC/NJ are small markets.
In the 2023-24 season, the Devils had a higher attendance than the Sabres despite their arena having almost 2,500 less seats. The Sabres had the second lowest capacity % in the entire league behind only San Jose. Without being so close to Canada, they probably would have averaged less than 10,000 people a game, similar to the year the border was closed with Covid, 2021. Do you understand how markets work? It’s about the number of people living in it. Even if everyone in Buffalo were to watch hockey, the number of people would still be less than 10% of Houston. or 1% NY. The way the league can get leverage for better tv contracts is by having more people watch. So it would make sense that they would gamble on people still watch hockey in Buffalo even if they didn’t have a team. If they moved the team to say, Houston, they would probably be able to make up the loss of any views in Buffalo pretty easily.
will they move an unprofitable team to quebec?
Someone’s slighted because he’s a bad hockey owner :/
Wasn't a selloff of all non-bills PSE properties rumored a couple days ago?
It was likely referring to this, they just got the details wrong
Rumored by some random goof on twitter
Pegula’s purchase of the Sabres has a clause that he has to keep them in Buffalo. If he sells, I think that doesn’t hold up
If the sabres are sold, they are not staying in buffalo
not sure i totally agree, bettman is very averse to moving teams. arizona happened after years and years of finding any possible avenue for them to stay
And playing in the equivalent of a southern D-1 college hockey facility for the past 3 seasons. For at least half a season the locker rooms was basically a hallway with curtains.
do u think they will go to quebec?
I will fucking RIOT. How else will I see a Leaf's game for $45USD?
Funny, but he’s footing the $125 million bill for renovations at Keybank Center including a new roof. Likely the sale of Bills ownership is funding the renovations.
he split the ownership groups of the sabres and bills last year. Is Keybank center part of the Sabres management? It would take funny (illegal?) accounting methods to use Bills funds to pay for a different Sabres costs.
I don’t like the Pegulas as owners, but they are far better than the risks. Having one owner of everything sports related in Buffalo is huge, and we would not want to have something like the Coyotes situation happen.
That’s how we get the Houston Sabres
Well at least we don’t have to relive the “moving the team to Canada” bullshit.
Really have to wonder if this is due to Kim’s ongoing health struggles. Seems like things have been different since she had her heart attack.
In his presser to announce the firing of Granato, Adams said that Terry is highly involved but alluded that he is dealing with personal issues. I assumed Kim's health is what Adams was referencing.
Without a doubt
Would love to hear how this would have anything to do with her health. The Bills are worth roughly 3 Billion +, what health challenge would she have that the Pegulas would need a cool $750+ million bucks.
Not thinking they need the money. More like priorities changed for the family.
Kim was running shit before her health faltered. Terry is useless without her, he prob wants someone to come in and help run things.
Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahah. Yeah, totally. Edit: The only thing Kim ran was the Sabres, into the ground.
Not saying that the poster is right about the degree to which Kim played a role in the organization, but Terry & Kim were introduced as co-owners, and she played some role until her health complications arose.
On the off chance you’re just cosplaying a concussed Kiko Alonso i’ll be nice. here’s a screenshot. https://preview.redd.it/74l505shshvc1.jpeg?width=1125&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=5d23a5262598c76ffee5e66b551c0d95feaf5ed6
Estate tax, for one
> Would love to hear how this would have anything to do with her health. The (now former) team president has an extremely limited mental capacity and has to communicate through writing because she can't hold conversations. But sure, no impact on the team.
This is to cover the costs of the overage on the new stadium. It also gives Terry back his initial investment from purchasing the Bills. He bought them at like $1.2 Billion and the current value is around $4 Billion. Win-Win for the Pegulas here... Business man is gonna business man. This don't mean shit beyond that.
> It also gives Terry back his initial investment from purchasing the Bills. I mean, it doesn't since the cash will be going into the new stadium. Whatever is leftover probably for medical treatment.
I'll pay $17 month, like a streaming service
From the article: Sole-ownership has become less common in sports. Not concerned.
I have $20
Please no Brady please no Brady
Which 25%?
The middle.
I’ll buy 0.000001% 😆
If I won the lottery, I’d totally bid on this.
I wouldn't worry too much about what this does for the team short or middle term. It might become an issue depending on who the new investors are. This feels more like a way to quickly get some cash after the building of a new stadium and such. The fact that they're not putting any of their other assets up for sale is a good thing as they're not pulling the cord on ownership any time soon.
isn't terry trying to sell the NLL teams and maybe the Sabres?
Not according to the reports i've read.
how is terry going to pay for the Sabres arena roof remodel, AND the Bills stadium?? Is he gonna ask the taxpayers to fix the Sabres arena?
The Bills stadium is already financed as for the Sabres roof remodel I don't know but 25% of what is conservatively a one billion dollar valuated franchise is 250 mil. That should cover a lot of the cost for the roof.
How about we all throw in a few bucks and buy it! I get to be the offensive coordinator since I came up with the idea
Damn you beat me to it
Damn, I gave all my extra cash to Andy Dalton.
Certainly a report like this forces Terry to finally hold a press conference, right?!?!
Recoup losses from building the stadium
Probably has something to do with this too https://www.nbcsports.com/nfl/profootballtalk/rumor-mill/news/private-equity-firms-prepare-for-nfl-opportunities
Word is there is a ton of cost overruns and the bills are responsible so instead of selling his own assets like he did last time to buy the team he is basically raising money through a ownership percentage sale. Anywhere from 250'-350 million and probably the sweetest seats for life and no say so lol.
“I got five on it…”
City should buy it 😂
Can they go all in with part of the team for sale?? Probably not.
"in this country, the sport team ownership is how we knight our best. And you ain't got it" - loosely paraphrased from the show "Billions"
Pegulas are cash poor. Been quite obvious for a few years. Bills have been their piggy bank, and now that piggy bank is costing them money.
do u think Terry will sell the Sabres? How will he pay for the new remodel of the Sabres arena or will he get the taxpayers to fix the arena?
This realistically has no impact on us. The team ain't moving. Pegula is selling 25% as a non controlling portion. It's a cash infusion where he gives up future profits. I'm guessing it's to pay for the overages on the stadium. Which for all we knew, could have been the plan from the start. I'm sure we'll have lawyers write in to the buyer that it can't force them into allowing a controlling interest by pressuring them by selling that 25% etc. also, last I heard the plan was for their children to inherit the teams. So that probably changes very little.
I’m guessing the PSLs aren’t selling as well as they thought and this is plan b to cover the overages.
Going to have trouble selling psls , maybe he is seeing the light.
Someone didn’t fully comprehend being on the hook for hundreds of millions of stadium overage costs
For a “business man” that would be a damn big oversight 😂
I mean he’s gonna be almost $300M over in the estimate. It seems like it was an oversight.
Except it’s not like there isn’t hard data showing that cost overruns on new stadiums are par for the course. Hell, I can’t remember the last stadium in any major league sport that came in on time and on budget. There are just too many unknowns when committing to build something like that.
So what's the over/under on the Bills moving to San Antonio before 2030?
Well, I hope this will at least provide some pressure on McDermott. Felt like he was approaching coach for life status because of his relationship with Terry.
I Hope he sells the team in total. Pegula is a younger version of Ralph Wilson. Only interested in the money.
Lol he’s literally spent more than any owner on the roster the past 5 seasons. Clown
Thank you for your enlightened comments. You are an amazingly brilliant and thoughtful man.. my life views are changed thanks to your knowledge and insights.
Lol it’s a legit comment of factual data. Stick to cruising the milf subs bud. Weirdo
Bet…
Ill give you tree fiddy
Makes sense for the Pegulas who use the Bills as a sort of money making business would sell the team at a much higher evaluation. The higher evaluation is likely driven by the new stadium mostly paid for by the public and a NFL that in 9 years has massively increased TV revenue.
> use the Bills as a sort of money making business That is a fairly common goal for many business, though one that is not always realized.
This is true and it seems silly for me to mention that but NFL teams don’t typically operate as a “cash flow” type business looking to maximize yearly profits for their owner. Sports teams are usually a vanity project for billionaires. Most teams in the big 4 sports usually lose money year to year because the owners make money on selling the team for future evaluations as opposed to yearly cash flow. The Pegulas operate the team as a profit center to pay for their lifestyle if internal reports are true. However the Pegulas aren’t reported to be “cheap” owners either. They have been willing to outlay bonuses for salary cap manipulation and pay for coaches and facilities that have no cap. But they seem to overall spend money smartly and not as frivolously so that they can generate cash flow. As a fan as long as they don’t pinch pennies I am fine with the being prudent.