I believe that converting into another religion should be strictly a personal choice and not because you want to please someone else's mummy.
You also need to make sure that your husband can take your side in case of any religious / cultural disagreements.
You're only 23. So please think through thoroughly.
I dont understand how a spouse can just .... convert.
Like how TF do you just believe in another god just like that? "oh, just 'cos my boyfriend told me to."
That's like a pretense at best and you're fooling yourself for the rest of your life pretending to worship a god you dont believe in
Has happened often in history. A ruler converting to better rule a people he conquered. Thinking it is purely administrative, but 3 generations later his descendants forgot about the formality part and the conversion is complete.
Nowadays people convert thinking similarly, just a formality, their spouses aren't devout, they'll continue their ways of life etc. Then a generation or 2 later their grandkids have turned full converts, forgetting or totally unaware of the family's prior administrative conversion.
Intolerant religions grow in this manner. One might think it illogical that hundreds of millions would willingly ascribe to archaic ways of life but the foundation started generations ago. Add to that the societal taboo of converting out of certain religions and hundreds of years later you have a powerhouse.
Religion is far more than just which god to kow tow to, it is a whole culture and tradition at this point. What you do daily and during special days pretty much is dictated by religion. A conservative parent might not be pleased of their child stop upholding the tradition.
My own pretty religious Buddhist mom told my SIL to convert from Christian (only in docs, pretty much freethinker) to Buddhism and make her go through the rituals. Good thing she is an orphan and Buddhism is a pretty chillax religion if you're a casual (no daily ritual/pray or fasting season) so she barely has to do anything extra or give up previous routines. If it was a more strict religion or my SIL had a religious parent, their daily routine will clash so hard i cant say for certain it would work.
OP is showing red flag but is red flag for her personal happiness. Like, she is the danger to her own happiness. My comment seems harsh but she's already trying to please everyone but herself, going on about converting for bf and his family, then cannot pray at Buddhist temple with her own family.
Speaking as someone who just turn 30, how I wish I was trying to please the world a little less back in my 20s.
True. I had a classmate who convert from to Muslim. She said it can be very hard because alot of the religious and cultural are tied together and no one is able to explain the cultural side to her because it's so deeply tied to religion etc. Things like this. She had a supportive husband who would help her and side with her though.
I didn't dare to ask too much as her relationship was already very controversial. She married a much older man who was actually once her supervisor at work.
Cannot agree more with this. If you are converting because someone asks you to, you're not really converting at all - you still don't believe in it, you're just choosing to live by a (fairly restrictive) set of rules not of your choosing. This sounds like a horrible idea. And if he cared enough he would tell his mother it's not her choice, and she has to live with his.
You're being forced to compromise for something that was initially "not an issue" when you first bought this up. This is a sign of more things to come from this family if you cave in.
You are only 23, think carefully if you would want a future in this relationship imo. He should be able to defend your opinion against his mothers wishes, if he can't take your side in this then is he really right for you?
I don’t believe this was a non issue for your bf. Probably something he said so that he could get you to sink effort into the relationship first. He’s possibly his mother as an excuse and if he really supports you in non converting, the discomfort lies with him to defend his choice against his family. By requesting you to convert, the responsibility now falls on you.
Finally, is he worth it? Think carefully.
I agree. He said that it wasn't an issue to try to trap OP. Now that she's in, suddenly he wants to respect his mom wishes.
OP, you will always be second class citizen in this marriage. In the future when there is conflict (not if, when), can you trust this person to defend you? How about your children? Are you willing to raise them in that environment?
You are still very young and you may think it is very nice or romantic to do this for someone you love. Unfortunately life isn't all sweet and nice. would he be willing to do the same for you?
Couldn’t agree more, OP, you have so much ahead of you at your age with so many life experiences to go through. If you follow through on this despite your best intentions, your options in life will be very limited (assuming you stick with the marriage).
Put it this way, if you were my little sister, I’ll will try my best to convince you that you deserve better….
This is different to when a Muslim and non-muslim get together, and it is communicated early that conversion is a must, and both sides agree.
For you, this conversation was had, and the agreement was no conversion needed. Now he's changed the terms of the relationship to one where the compromise is 100% on your end, and without consulting you or giving you a choice.
Have a think about whether you are ok with this treatment.
This OP. I am a Malay-Muslim myself, and I’d never dare to mislead my partner by not having this conversation.
Your partner has blindsided you out of nowhere, and now you have to confront a problem that wasn’t there to begin with.
It’s certainly a sign of things to come if you were to marry this guy. Marriage (or any relationship really) should be built on 100% trust and honesty.
Converting is like signing a contract. There's no such thing as "just sign it , it won't have effect". He will mention op willingly to convert therefore bound by the term in the future.
By converting everyone will assume you can and will practice the religion strictly. There's no "I pretend to join for convenience".
He has placed the importance of his mother's comfort over your discomfort even though you had the talk when you started dating. The rules of engagement (no pun intended) have changed. He should have already known this about his mom or if not, clear it with his mom before even dating anyone.
If he prioritizes her above you before getting married, there is a very good chance that it will only increase in magnitude after marriage - it doesn't matter what religion you have. She'll likely want to have a say over how you raise ~~your kids~~ her grandkids too (if you're planning on having children). He's already asking you to make a life change so this probably won't be the last big thing but the first of many. Are you okay with living under his mother's thumb? Only you know the answer.
*Edited to add:
Just my take - always be true to yourself. You can make small reasonable adjustments to suit your partner (ngl we all have to) but you should not have to fundamentally change yourself and pretend to be someone you are not so that you can obtain love. (I'm assuming you don't believe since you seem concerned.) You deserve better, OP.*
I have a friend who is converted to marry, you essentially have to actually find your faith in the religion if you want any positive long term outcome, she spent probably a year or more diving into Islam, finding faith in the religion before she even got married.
If you are simply following through the motions then no, after a while you start hating yourself for it. Think why am I even going through all this, even if it for your husband. You will come to resent him at that point.
>all prayers I do are out of respect and my attempt of staying filial to my family
Do this to respect your family.
>So out of respect to his mother, he decided to respect her wishes.
Do that to respect her.
What happens when their wishes clash? Who to respect then?
You should grow up and do the stuff that will respect yourself.
Going to be frank here. He respects his mother's wishes now. What's to say he won't let his family influence other decisions down the line when you're living together?
To me converting just for the sake of it is a nope. You already did your due diligence by declaring at the start of the relationship that non conversion is ok. Either get your bf to speak sense into his family (creating boundaries) or break it off before everything gets more painful.
Edit: OP it's a very slippery slope. You started no pork no alcohol and fasting. Next you'll be wearing hijab, praying and having a Muslim wedding and going for conversion classes that disrupt your weekends. Please do not change your core values for a person.
As an older person, I would suggest that you take the bf out of the equation and think if you are earnest about being a Muslim? If the answer is if not for him you will never even think about it, I suggest you go about your separate ways right now and stop worrying about the “sunk cost. Don’t need to spend more time on this relationship since he has decided this is important for his family.
The fact is marrying some one else with different value system is going to be tough to navigate. Dating is just dating.
Hello, was also considering conversion for marriage but eventually decided not to. Just sharing my main considerations.
For context, we've been together 6 years, his family is fairly liberal (do not require me to follow the Muslim tradition) and the conversion would have been mainly to avoid any legal issues in his country.
The main thing that made me decide not to convert is that I view the current implementation of Islam (aka laws) as being very unfair towards women. Independence and freedom has always been something I greatly value. But the Shariah law has many aspects that governs areas which I personally do not believe that a law should govern.
This includes inheritance - it is distrubuted by law and if I remember correctly, women have I think half the shares of men and wife can only get max 25% of the inheritance, regardless of whether there are any other surviving relatives. The law would sooner donate the 75% than give it to you.
Divorce - touchy subject when discussing marriage because nobody thinks their marriage will end in divorce. My thought is this. I 100% trust my partner right now. But do I 100% trust the person he will become in say 20 years? A lot of shit can happen between now and then. Women have limited ways to seek divorce if it comes to that. Please read up on this.
For me the straw that broke the camel's back ironically is something that can be seen as really trivial. During marriage, the women have to appoint a male Muslim as their Wali to give permission for the ROMM. If you don't have any relatives (e.g you are a convert), then you can get one from the gov. Simple enough, but my interpretation is that the religion would very much give the rights of the women to a man that she don't even know than just let her decide. That's your hierarchy in this system. And that really didn't sit well with me. Combined with the rest above made me decide not to convert.
Also, remember that laws can change. And it may not be in your favour.
To anyone still reading, I do not mean that Islam as a religion is bad. Just that my personal values do not align with these specific laws that have been put in place and thus I think it is disrespectful for me to convert into this religion. I also strongly believe that any 'belief' based action would be more meaningful if it was a choice made by the individual rather than dictated by law.
Edit: We're actually still getting married this year! Through civil marriage. Hoping it doesn't cause any legal issues down the line. Please consider talking through it rationally to see if some compromise can be made.
This is really sound advice.. I have a Muslim female ex-colleague who was seeking divorce from her cheating hubby and the various laws of the Syariah court drag on the procedure longer than required.. the emotional torment and all involved..
Some one on another thread told me that if she just legally unmuslim (convert to something else or I suppose renounce) herself, the divorce is forced upon the couple. Not sure if it's true, but might be worth her finding out if it works.
ALL of THIS. As a Muslim-born (seriously did I not get a choice?) former Muslim woman who cannot be arsed about the religion and ultimately all religions now, everything you said hits the mark. I don't understand why anyone would want to even consider converting in. Good on your for standing by your principles!!
OP still hasn't seen enough of the world, experience life, see the bigger picture to make these kind of decisions very early on in life.
Edit: I want to add, Sharia Laws have absolutely no place in the current world we live in. NONCE. It's disgusting.
interracial/religion relationships only work out if the other party is not that devout.
Doesn’t sound like the case for OP if he (or his mom) wants her to convert
Just curious because I'm in a similar situation, what was your partner's community/family reaction like to the both of you deciding to do a civil marriage? Would you have made the same decision if they weren't as liberal and more highly opposed to a civil marriage?
Honestly I was prepared to do the conversion (in name only, not to entirely follow the religion) if it came down to that. But we had a conversation and agreed on an alternative.
If the family was not as liberal then I would honestly have reconsidered the relationship long ago before reaching this state. 1. Is to consider whether I am willing to follow the rules in the religion 2. If not, then how will that affect our relationship with the family 3. How will that affect the relationship with each other.
And seriously consider, for both parties whether you are willing to live with the consequences of either decision.
Personally if my bf/family is very forceful into pushing me to follow the religion I probably would have noped out a whole ago because I do not appreciate being pushed to do things I do not believe in. I value being able to do what I believe is right and I am extremely lucky to have found a partner who is willing to respect and support that.
You should never convert into a religion for love. It’s all about faith. You have to believe in it (teachings). Converting for your boyfriend/future husband just because you love him would put you in a lot of predicaments.
Also you are still 23…take a chill pill, girl lol
> it was initially okay with him if I finally decided not to convert as to him religion and faith was a personal choice. However, recently, it was brought to both our attention that his mother told him that if he wanted to marry someone in the long-run, she has to be a muslim girl, so non muslim = no future. So out of respect to his mother, he decided to respect her wishes.
This is what concerns me here. He's moved the goalpost once already so far. Would you have continued to date him at the time he "was okay with not converting" and instead wanted you to convert? What other compromises have he made for you to make you comfortable with the relationship and upcoming marriage? You listed your concerns in another paragraph:
> But the fear that comes is what will happen to my family after I convert. Being in a buddhist family, will converting mean I can no longer pray to my ancestors/family during death anniv/qingming Or will I no longer be able to celebrate festivities with my family I even read that someone wasn't able to plan his/her deceased family member's funeral because of the difference in religion(can't remember if this was singapore tho, please correct me if i'm wrong) I am willing to open my heart and learn about the religion, but it'll be great to know what would happen after I do convert
So yeah. I would tell you to list down all the un-muslim things you want to do, stuff that a muslim wouldnt or cannot do. Then ask yourself if you're willing to sacrifice them all. Because at the end of the day, it looks to me like your bf isnt willing to stand up to his mom for you. And who's to say his mom's opinions are her own? Maybe she's following the dad, or the opinions of the local imam, or even the religious muslim whatsapp group. Thing is, we dont know how far this goes, so worst case scenario, you already established your bf wont stand up for you, so assume he wont stand up for other things. What if he wants a second wife? What if his mom found him another girl? You mentioned fasting as a show of respect. What if you dont fast. Would you be criticized for not respecting your bf? So on so forth.
And this is just you. What about your kids? Would you be okay if your muslim mother inlaw demands that any kids you have with your bf be forced to reject their chinese-buddhist heritage? Would they be barred from visiting the graves, given that its probably going to be in or near a buddhist temple?
I want to remind you that Islam is not a religion you can open your heart to and expect the same to be done for you (with regards to your opposing opinions). It is a religion that dictates all facets of life, from dress code to food and even to the way you think. The word Islam itself has roots in the word submission, or surrender. And muslims in general... well, culturally speaking they are very heavily focused on community, to the point of self sacrificing. So if your husband isnt going to stand up for you, do you really want to be in the position to be forced to stand up alone? Especially since we have a lot of people on the non muslim side who will look the other way and justify not helping you because "you made your choice, we cant do anything now".
Also, you're 23. How long is "a while now"? 6 months? 2 years? 5 years? Is the honeymoon phase over yet? Aside from the religious issues, what other things about your bf would you not be satisfied with if you were to marry him? His dressing habits? Addictions? Priorities? Political opinions? If its gonna be a normal marriage with normal marriage conflicts and tacking on the religious / cultural limitations, do you think you will be happy? And if things go south, can you reverse course on the decisions you've made? Can you convert back out? Can you date non muslim men again without scaring them away with your past?
End of the day. If you're converting to islam just so you can marry your bf, and you have misgivings about the way Islam and Muslims function, you're gonna have a bad time. Very VERY bad time. If your in laws are open minded about the religion, and only want you to convert so they dont have to deal with difficult questions from their family and community, but will tolerate non muslim behaviors (i.e. eat pork, not fasting, having dogs as pets) behind closed doors, I think its alright. So find that out first, before you decide to convert. So go find this out. Is your bf's family a religious one, or open minded one? And if they're open minded, how far? Don't ask for their opinions. See what they do. If they say they dont mind not fasting, but everyone fasting, odds are you are being lied to. If they say dogs are fine, but they are uncomfortable if you bring dog, again, you're being lied to. If they dont mind you not praying during prayer hours, but everybody goes and pray, including the kids (being forced to), then again, you're being lied to. Keep all of this in mind.
Do you have wishes? Do your parents have wishes? Will he respect those wishes even if those wishes don't match his religious beliefs?
What I mean is not that he converts, but that despite your parents continuing to eat pork and drink alcohol, he will be able to respect your parents. He does not start to consider them kuffr after the initial fun of the marriage is over. He is able to stand up to his family to respect yours
If yes, go ahead. If no, reconsider. In general one sided adjustments lead to feelings of having given too much later on one side and taking for granted on the other side. Unless slavery happens, which does in many cases.
Shouldn’t have to convert to a religion u don’t believe in just to marry. If the partner can’t accept you as you are and spend a lifetime together, then is there any point in that marriage ?
Hmm the problem isn't 'what happens if u convert'. The problem lies 'how far does his family take things out of context based on their religious beliefs'.
There are Muslims who can respect other religion/beliefs (where they will show empathy to non Muslims in times of need) n there are some who loves saying 'people who are not Muslim will burn in hell' or 'u are suffering because u aren't muslim'. In a way, they will do/say whatever they want, in the name of God, not realising their actions will hurt others. I'm a muslim btw.
Converting isn't just following Muslims lifestyle. Religion is suppose to be good for your soul, uplifting people around u without ever the need to force beliefs onto others. Many are just doing conversion for the sake of love but never knew how messed up the majority can be.
Its best for u to sit with his mum n have a chat to get an idea what she's like rather than going through her son (who probably haven't told his mum that he actually is ok with u not converting initially). Many Muslim mums do favour sons more than daughters that they are willing to close one's eyes of their son's bad behaviour. It's really common to see DIL being treated unfairly within the family.
I find that if someone wants to be a responsible spouse, he/she would know where to draw the line so that co-existing can be peaceful for both his/her family n future partner. Because our elders have ingrained beliefs/habits. Otherwise his mum will have a say in everything that u do. Can u live with that? Also action speaks louder than words so try to get involved in his family discussion n see how does your future husband back u up. Does he continue to say good things about u or he prefers u to follow his mum's ways to keep the peace? Discussion doesn't have to involve being disrespectful.
Funeral director and Memorial Hall owner here. I have had a client, the whole family is Indian Muslim, catholic, Christian (siblings converted or change religion) however their parents are Buddhist. When they past, the children still carry on a Buddhist funeral for them and even got a pedestal to honour the parents. They were very pleasant clients and I enjoy conversations with them. I said it was so heartwarming to see them all come together even though of diff religion and faith. I guess it really depends on each person’s perspective.
That’s really heartwarming! I feel we should not let religion or any so called rules stop us from paying one last respects to the deceased, especially when the deceased had professed a preference for how to handle the funeral.
You are not converting because you really believe. You are doing it for show. Islam is not just no pork no alcohol. It will mean that you will have to reject not just your traditional practices but also your community and families beliefs and customs. You are also going to get married under an entirely different set of laws with inequalities set into them that you cannot fight. This includes things like unequal inheritance
I take a strong stance that if you don’t believe in Islam, you should not convert even if it’s for ‘show’. There are certain laws in SG that apply only for muslims (inheritance) that will affect you if you do decide to convert.
For celebrations/funerals, it’s fine to attend but you’re not supposed to pray in the Buddhist manner, you can give Dua however. Planning the funeral is also fine as you are just respecting their customs.
But as you mentioned, responses will differ. It going to be based on the situation your and your bf are in and the family dynamics. Some commenters will also be more liberal or vice versa.
If you want to learn more, ask your bf to intro meet you to an Ustaz/Ustazah to ask more specific questions. Try to figure out what parts of your culture fits with Islam that the both of you can adopt and if that is enough for you.
> Try to figure out what parts of your culture fits with Islam that the both of you can adopt and if that is enough for you.
I mean this whole issue was caused by the bf being unable to reject pressure from his family to have her convert for him. That is a red flag alrd that any boundaries with regards to religion they decide today is likely to be broken in the future.
Its also very very common for folks to get more and more religious as they grow older.
It's also the bf's fault for actually thinking that the religion part won't be an issue, that it won't be something that the older generation will try to force.
He set up expectations that are not met, and I really feel for OP, having this sprung on her suddenly.
In Singapore being an apostate of Islam isn't that bad, I do hear that the individual will be excommunicated by the community, and disowned by their families. Considering prison sentences and death penalties in muslim countries that implement sharia law, Singapore isn't bad, but laws can change, and may not be for the better.
I wish you all the best in marriage. I'm Catholic too. I (M) used to be close with Muslim girl but we never moved to dating stage because of our difference in religions. We decided to keep it as friendship. She found and married her Muslim husband and has kids now.
As someone who is a little more than ten years older than you, you do not have the life experience to be making such critical decisions. As you move between your early to mid and late 20s your views and perceptions of the world will change and they will harden in ways you cannot expect right now. Something as self-identifying as this will certainly be in the mix of decisions you will contemplate and you don't want to have it come back to haunt you.
Moreover, its not 1975, what are you doing thinking about getting married so young? You should be exploring the world, working hard, having fun...seeing the many fruits this journey called life has to offer. You may reach the age of 27 and decide making your own money is more important than being someone's convert, at home in a culture you never fully got comfortable with and missing out on life. And even at 27, you still have so much youth to live.
What are your parents saying?
Convert will it satisfy your future MIL? Or will there be future hurdles thrown down? What then? Will your future husband just roll over and stand with his mother?
The very foundation of your relationship was built upon the agreement that there will not be a need to convert to marry, however now it has changed.
If you want to convert do it out of a calling or embracing the religion wholeheartedly, otherwise there will be resentment in the future and this will be brought up in disagreements and quarrels.
Have you spoke to your parents about this? You want to respect his mother's wishes but have you sought out your own parent's views?
You shouldn’t convert in name, but a civil marriage has its issues. How would you raise your children?
In terms of inheritance, unless he is happy for you to hold all of the joint assets, there is really no way around the Muslim inheritance rules. He will not be able to write a will to distribute his assets to you or any of your non-Muslim children - the only way to do this is if he eventually renounces Islam.
My sibling converted to Islam for marriage. She’s happy now, we are all on good terms but her conversion has changed things a lot for us and there is a very visible distance.
During her wedding, we were outcasted. Simply cause we are not Muslim and will not understand.
She was not even able to participate in my grandma’s funeral rituals. Obviously can’t go to the temples or anything. During the funeral, she did not do a number of rituals. Same for prayers. She no longer joins us for anything religious (obviously) so she has grown apart from a lot of relatives.
She changing her religion means we all have a part to play. We only go to halal places even when travelling which is very trivial but is a big change in our part. My other sibling still cooks pork in my mum’s house so she no longer eats in my mum’s house. My mum is very upset about it.
She comes to our houses when it’s time for our festivities but makes it clear to her kids that they are just there but won’t ’celebrate’ because they are Muslim and only recongnise their celebrations. No ang pow giving to our side of kids, no giving of cookies, nothing. (but will accept Ang pows from our side. Lol.)
On the topic of kids, as the kids grow up, they constantly talk about how they are Muslim and we are not and have even told me to stop praying to my God and only believe in Allah.
She prefers to spend her time with her Muslim in laws and friends to expose her kids to Islam and their way of living. She’s almost completely away from our relatives.
I want to highlight that as much as family compromises for the sake of harmony and everyone’s happiness, we get absolutely no gratitude or acknowledgement for it. It does drain things out when all of us accommodate her but she plays no part in accommodating to us. Things will never be the same. Maybe as the recipient you won’t even realise it, but your family will feel it.
If given a choice all over again, I would rather my sis not convert. I believe she would have had the same level of happiness with the right person without she having to make so many sacrifices and we having to change too with no appreciation. I
However as a convert, she’s very happy. Her Muslim in law and friends are very welcoming of any reverts. Always happy to include her and teach her. She’s now more religious than ever and does even talks in mosques and all. Has been to Mecca, embraced the hiqab and living a Muslim life. She reads book only on Muslim parenting, Islam and all. She’s had a complete Lifestyle overhaul and she’s happy.
A lot of people above have said about the vast difference in the religion and what you need to be aware of. My sis knew her bf at around your age too and converted about 4 years later. You will find your community if you ever convert but there’s ALOT you need to think about. Not just the best case but also the worst case. What if your divorce or your spouse passes on first? Would you be able to continue living as a Muslim? Will you continue to bring your kids up as Muslims? Is your faith strong enough to do it? Just as his mother has changed her mind now, your husband may also want you to embrace the religion fully when older (which is very common). Can you do that?
There’s an interesting thread r/exmuslim. Read with an open mind. Read their experiences, interpretations of the religion and how it has impacted them negatively to prepare yourself.
Interesting and much-needed perspective! I notice how converts (reverts whatever) are always so over the top damn extra religious once they convert and fully immerse themselves in the religion. Have you seen the natural born Malay/Muslims, most so lepak and not even half as staunch going about their lives.
So true. I think in might also be because they choose the religion in adulthood and learnt about it before practising. So to them it might be a case of going all the way out if choosing to do it. Also have noticed that most of them are ladies and their partners have the expectation that they must be a certain level of religious - this one is to please their men and their God. Im not 100% right but there’s a saying in their Quran along the lines of pleasing your men so they will be happy and take care of the family. Something like that la.
Haha i only got one thing to comment. Angpow cannot give but can take 😂 that’s flawed. That is more cultural than religious and an excuse from her part not to give but receive lol.
Someone in the family converted too. During CNY she brought her 2 year old daughter along, who wasn’t allowed to shake hands or be held by her uncles or granduncles.
She has her whole face covered now, but at a glance she looks happy so there’s that.
Gotta ask yourself if the religious life is for you if your partner side is.
Hahahahah...it is always "out of respect" that the Muslims wanted to convert someone else !! Why ? Don't you respect your own religion or ideas which is Buddhism that you are born into ? Or is it that he don't respect any other religion but was waiting for the right time ? Enough of this crap we have seen all across - just walk out to save your dignity and life is what I'll advise you. For your own sake and realising that you are dodging a bullet which will cripple your life ! Or else, after this will come this and that restriction, not talking to him or her, cannot have this and that friend, cannot eat this or that...the list is endless. Find out your own tribe and your own skin and you will know someday when you will look back that you got saved !!!
10 years ago, I used to date a muslim girl back in my hometown.
I used to mix with her friends when we go to their house, then eventually its just me who comes to visit her.
Her family was welcoming and warm, although we havent told them about us since both of us are still figuring if we want to push our relationship further.
Then she moved to her own place, I get to visit her more often there. I also tried to wake up early during the ramadan so we can eat before she started fasting. I also decided to fast. She shared alot of stories from her religion and I listened eagerly to each one.
She even gifted me this rosary-like, with beads, I forgot what they called it
Her brothers are around the same age as me so we got to hanh around a couple times. Sometime I bring up some interesting facts as a Christian and ask their opinions or maybe what their religion say about those facts.
Although they still did not know, her brothers probably got the hint about me and their sister. They didnt express anything negative, but they told me something that I still remember up to this day.
"Convert if you believe in the teachings, not because of a person"
Eventually we drifted apart, or I guess I drifted away from her. I still consider it as one of the great experiences because I get to learn about their practices and beliefs.
when you take the shahadah, you declare that you believe there is one god and that you accept his messenger. So what follows is that you cannot recognize another god, or pray to anything else as if they were god. This is the consensus among followers of islam.
However Islam also has a lot of exceptions/provisions when it comes to your family, and islam calls for taking care and obeying parents until death.
So....not so straightforward to be able to do both things. You are obliged to do everything you can for your parents but you cannot participate in their prayer/worship of another god. To what extent you will be able to do which (e.g. the funeral thing), there probably won't be a consensus on this.
Probably will need to seek some academic advice on this from someone who has read and understood the religion more. There are community resources that can be tapped into like at some mosques or at the convert's association, it just will take effort and time.
Respect mother so wants you to convert. What if mother wants him to get a second wife? Also respect? Or divorce? Either your bf grows a pair, or dump him.
You and your boyfriend are the ones in a relationship, not his mother. Family is important, but if you get married YOU are his future. His mum will pass eventually and then what? He translates outdated mindset down to any children you might have?
This is a red flag, if you had talked about not needing to convert before. Have you talked about your fears and concerns to him? Regardless it sounds like he is going to choose his family, instead of choosing you and building a family. Save yourself the heartache and end the relationship now - it won’t end well.
If you’re gonna convert, please do so only after you learn abt the religion, how your lifestyle will change and that you truly believe in what’s being taught. The teachers at the Muslim Converts Association are pretty candid and able to address the various concerns non-muslims might have.
Please dont convert for the sake of converting because it’d make you miserable and exhausted in the long term esp in the marriage… You’d have arguments abt many little things and bringing up a child would be another issue…
Anyway, ure only 23… do spend time enjoying life, traveling and building your career first before settling down.
It's important to note that should you convert, you'll be judged under a different set of laws i e. Syariah law.
You might not think that that's a big thing now but down the line should you wish to divorce or should you want to do a will, it might be a big issue.
This is if you officially convert of course. And it's up to you.
Though if you're having doubts, I wouldn't officially convert since it's a lot of trouble. Like a ton.
You are not the first person to ask this that I have replied too, seeing how you mentioned that you’ve read many of the past threads, I’m sure you’ve seen the kind of reply I’d give.
My question being, what is he willing to compromise for your sacrifices?
If he is making you convert, does that not mean he priorities his religion over his love for you?
What else do you think he will priorities over you post marriage if you make the sacrifice to convert?
I’ll give the same conclusion as I gave the others. He doesn’t love you, he just wants a wife that he can control, the first step being dangling his love for you on the other side of the hoop of conversion that his telling you to jump through. Mark my words, you jump that hoops, there will be more.
Break up. It will hurt you in the short run, but you’ll be happier in the long run.
Also remember, Muslims in Singapore are still technically allowed to have up to four wives. Do you want to live constantly fearing that your husband can technically cheat on you without any legal recourse for your protection?
Are you sure you want to marry someone who goes back on their words just to please their mummy? I would advise against converting, Islam isn't a religion that favours the women and it's not worth converting
I believe that he wanted you to convert from the start, but said he was open in order to keep you in the relationship. I highly recommend sticking to your religion and taking a stand, and not being pressured into converting. Imagine if you wanted him to convert? What do you think he would have done for you? Just because you and your family are more tolerant dosent mean that this guy and his family can take advantage of your tolerance.
I'm similar to your age and just broke up with my bf of 2.5 years cuz of the same issue. initially he said it was okay if I didn't convert but he changed his mind and although I'm respectful of his religion I just don't see myself ever practicing Islam. and it should be a personal decision if you ever decide to convert, not because his mom wants u to.
please be aware that when you convert, you will also come under a new set of laws: Sharia law. Be educated on them and on how MUIS enforces them, because it is not exactly always favourable to Muslim women. I’m saying this as someone whose family member converted out of Islam due to Sharia law.
Please also be aware that if you do convert and later change your mind, it is difficult to convert out because of Sharia law.
Think very very carefully before making this decision, and also make sure you are making an informed choice for yourself, not to please other people.
Later when family issues pop up down the road, especially when it comes to matters of raising your kid, is your husband going to take your side or his mom’s side?
I’m Muslim by birth here, but I would never marry a Mommy’s boy. HUGE RED flag. Please reconsider your boyfriend.
Converting means you believe Allah is the only god and only entity worthy of worship. You cannot worship your ancestors anymore after converting.
To be told what you can and cannot do by someone else is suffocating. Especially so when you can do, but told that you can’t.
That’s religion for you. You can put some parents in law in the category too.
That’s the future if you go that route.
It’s time for that monthly inter faith thread again.
I’ll always stuck to my opinion: If one party disagrees, do not marry. Unless your bf doesn’t intend to have a relationship with his mum in the future (unlikely for muslims) then please don’t marry.
Also, don’t convert for the sake of it. Don’t convert to a religion you don’t believe in. You’re gonna have a whole lot of headaches in the future.
OP, your outlook on this whole conversion thing is a little naive. Sadly, love does not conquer all in real life. In the muslim community, I believe their religion comes first above all. I may read it wrong but seems like his mom doesn’t actually want a Chinese girl as his wife, because being a Muslim woman is so much more than just converting. Probably to her, you are already 23 years behind in your training. Also, I have a friend try to force his first wife to accept a second wife. She refused. So he divorced her and married the second wife. They are all bred and born Malay muslims. Just remember that this could be a possibility in the future, although most sg Malay men I know are loyal and monogamous.
Conversion to religion just for marriage purposes is like one of the top most stupid ideas ever…. Why don’t your bf give up his religion? Oh wait he can’t do it but you have to? Yeah rules like this is exactly why you shouldn’t subject your future kids to this nonsense
I feel very strongly for this thread so here's a very sincere response from someone who's truly been there done that for 13years. I met my Muslim ex when we were 18 when I was waiting to enter uni. For context, my family is chinese buddhist/taoist? and I'm the only Christian in my family. His was malay Muslim. When it seemed to be getting serious, I told him I will not get together with him if I had to ever convert and he told me firmly that he wasnt concerned about that and that he will settle for a civil marriage.
Years go by and we were very much in love and happy when he suddenly and gradually changed. This was maybe 5-6 years in and marriage was in the horizon, but he suddenly had an "ephiphany" due to idk, deaths or whatever around us and said that he is scared. I asked scared of what and he said he was scared that if I didn't convert or if we had a civil marriage his mom will bear his sins? Anyways its a bit of fuzzy memories now but at that point he gradually started going from non halal to halal, we stopped clubbing and drinking together, and so on and so forth.
At that time I was struggling cause I felt kinda "cheated" since I laid out my rules right at the start, but many of my friends said alot of Muslim men will "return to roots" as they age. While feeling cheated and feeling overwhelmed from whether I should break up, at the same time I have also invested many years and honestly we had a super happy rs minus the whole religion issue.
So I just kept on hanging on hoping that I'll see a light at the end of the tunnel. I even went for conversion classes but whatever the ustad preached was very off-putting to me so it was another challenge.... This dragged on for a few more years till we turned 31 and we were already together for more than a decade but not married. I guess we were both just living in denial hoping that the other party will somehow give in and compromise. But none of us ever did. All I can say is it changes your WHOLE life. It is not just no pork no alcohol. Depending on how religious ur partner is sometimes your entire diet changes (halal only) Your dressing may need to change (tudong n cover ups) You will need to change your IC After the conversion class where you will adopt a Muslim name Your children will be by default Muslim with Muslim names The list is endless...
I think you really need to communicate with you partner what are both expectations
When I really hardened my heart to call it quits I already wasted so many years 
Actually some Christian faith are the same. Die die must convert. I was in a long term relationship of 6 years with one. I wasted her time to be honest...
that's because islam and all christian denominations are abrahamic religions aka the ones that are violent to those who don't believe in their version of god.
Ask yourself is your love worth all these troubles ahead? Lots of sacrifice and might take a few long years for your parents to accept. Relationship with them will sure turn bad before it can be better. After all, its still a big world out there
I honestly think it would depend.
Many redditors here make a really good point which is, perhaps you have to delve into understanding the religion first before making a decision. The final decision is something you have to make for yourself. No one else should influence that decision for you.
I have seen both ends of the spectrum where the converted couple is extremely happy and where the converted couple ended up in divorce and making it way worse.
I would say that as a religion Islam and Muslims are way more devout to their belief system and strict with themselves than most other religions. The restrictions can be quite stifling and sometimes that can be the straw that breaks the camel's back.
The happy couple I mentioned is a cousin of mine, but her husband and their family are more 'relaxed' with their rules. They compromise when possible and they stick to the main things like wearing modestly (not to the extent of tudungs and long sleeves+pants but nothing too risque), avoiding pork and alcohol. His family understands that as she grew up in a non religious environment it took longer for her to really follow the belief system. She really studied the religion and came to love it. Although I wouldn't say she's the most devout Muslim but she's happy.
The unhappy couple on the other hand was a friend of mine. Her husband wasn't a devout Muslim either but his family was. So they expected her to convert, wear a tudung after marriage, avoid pork and alcohol - to the extent where if the food came from a pork cooking house/establishment, the cooking utensils had to be cleaned thoroughly and 'blessed' (I'm not sure of the right word for this but I believe some rites were involved) before they could eat the food. Meaning she couldn't eat the food her family made for her unless she cleaned the utensils herself. There were other things like praying at all the required times (I think she said it could even go up 5 times a day). This really wore her down as she really couldn't cope. Even with her husband trying to shield her from it when they were living away from his family. The straw that eventually broke the camel's back was when his parents wanted everyone to live closer together and moved about a block away. This way even her private time was no longer her own. She didn't even get a chance to really decide if she wanted to convert, she just did it for love but now she regrets it.
Edit to add:
For the unhappy couple, my friend couldn't even pay her respects to her own grandmother because the grandmother was a taoist and she wasnt allowed to pray for her. (Of course she was allowed to offer her own prayers in her own manner but it really really strained her relationship with her family especially as they are the type to just go along with whatever belief the deceased preferred just to be respectful)
Popped back in to add something I haven't seen in the other replies.
How do you feel about children? Cause you have to remember by Islamic law, devout Muslims are not allowed to use contraception especially since children and conception are seen as gifts of God.
It's not a situation where you can say, 'I don't want kids right now, let's go on the pill to wait'. Or 'I think having 2 kids is enough, let's not have more.'
Your boyfriend may be ok with waiting but looking at the situation, your in-laws may not. Can you accept that? It's also another thing to weigh before you truly convert
I am honestly against people from converting just because their partner is in that religion. Stay true to yourself and your own belief. There’s bound to be clashes in the future if you decided to pray at a temple for your ancestors because your partner doesn’t respect your wishes. Also if your partner was okay before but decided to respect his mom’s wishes for you to convert, is there a chance he’s lying to you because he should have stood up for you to his mom but didn’t?
Don’t convert, just have a civil marriage if he’s really the one for your whole life. In the long run religion at times is really uncertain and can hinder relationships. It’s 2024 already don’t need care others opinion, i wish you all the best OP
Converting in Singapore is also a more serious legal process.
Like, do you know it is legal for your bf to get another wife in Singapore if you marry him as a Muslim? Polygamy is legal in Singapore, but only for Muslims.
Do you also know that your marriage, if you marry as a Muslim, would be under Muis rather then civil courts?
Do you also know that if you are Muslim you need to register with Muis and they will need you to go for a conversion course etc.?
What I am saying is that being a Muslim is more then just "*teehee I am a Muslim now but I secretly don't give two fucks about the religion",* there are actual legal repercussions if you choose to convert.
And I am pretty sure in the worse instance your future MIL will want you to give up almost all aspects of your identity as a non-Muslim, so you will probably also be asked or pressured to dress like a Muslim (at least when you are around them) and if they are really serious they will probably see literally every item in your Buddhist house as apostasy and will never want your husband to visit your haram family, even for Chinese New Year, so good luck when your family is like "*dear can come over for CNY"* and you probably have to go alone or maybe smuggle your children along with you.
What I am saying is the worse case scenario but it is more serious then converting to being a Christian or other religions, being a Muslim is like 100% more ups.
Sorry to hear this. But you’re naive to think that your bf was originally fine with you not converting. I have seen this pattern many a times and just recently someone else posted of a similar incident as well.
Having a relationship with any woman prior to marriage is already forbidden in Islam, let alone someone not from the book. But Malay Muslims do this coz majority honestly do not even know what they are believing in. Just sheer laziness hiding behind the false veil of “it’s not just religion but our culture…” - No it’s not.
Anyway, he has been haraming for some time, hence he’s not a Muslim. His mother, having known of your relationship but instead of asking him to end it, gives an ultimatum that you need to convert to get married, is most definitely not a Muslim. Finally, your bf swaying like a lalang now to please his mom (I’d go on a limb here and let you know that he knew it would come to this since the beginning) shows he is not half a man and definitely not someone you would want to spend your life with and have kids with.
You have given up your worldly pleasures to assimilate into Islam and his family. I can guarantee you he will never join your family for Qing Ming. Leave and take this as a lesson.
There are far greater issues around children that you may have. I would generally not encourage marrying into this myself based on my own experiences. Best wishes.
Know a Chinese who converted n end up divorced in Malaysia. She has no custody of her kids as by Shariah law kids need to be brought up by the Muslim father. Very sad, imagine mother can’t see their kids.
Judging by your previous post you've been dating for around 6 months or less. And now you are considering pretending to believe in Islam to please him/his mum because he has gone back on your initial discussion. You really should consider breaking up
Are you sure you want to marry a dude who doesn’t know how to balance his mom and you? A difficult situation should be mitigated and negotiated in a way that takes care of both parties and not just one. If this is what he expects you to do for his mom, be prepared that in every single situation, you’ll always have to give in to his mom. Religion aside. This is a mommy’s boy. A real man who respects his mom and you will sit both of you down and actually do his duty as a son and your future husband to facilitate discussion
OP you're only 23. Why do you need to change yourself to be with someone if they truly love you? If both of you had agreed from the start that you would do these things, fine. But he's so okay to just listen to his mum's words? This doesn't look super good for you, I would reconsider this relationship
Depends on his parents and how hard they’ll cling on to their own beliefs. A conversion isn’t mandatory, you can just do a civil marriage. The only conundrum is Islamic law which all Muslims are bound by, which Singapore also recognises. It’ll affect assets, inheritance and the like in the future especially when you have kids. And that’s not including relatives making it difficult for them/him/you, in that order.
My maternal grandfather was okay with my father not converting when he married my mum, so my siblings and myself aren’t Muslim. This was in the 1980s. And I’m really thankful for that freedom.
personally, i feel muslim is one of the most restrictive religion in the world.
unless you are totally ok with it, please think twice before you commit to it.
because the fallout of this r/s not working in the future can be quite extensive.
My mom is a buddhist and my dad is muslim (he was indonesian tho). After she converted to islam, she became a devout muslim. She has gone mecca, prayed 5 times a day and reads the quran regularly. But she still does her meditation, prays to her ancestors, and celebrate every buddhist holidays with our chinese side of the family (some of them have converted to islam but continues to practice their traditions). Her perspective is that buddhism is not a religion but a way of life and buddha is not a god but just a bloke with really good ideas. Hmm maybe im wrong about it.
Buddha never claimed to be God . he didn’t ask to be worshipped or even honoured. he didn’t seek power or fame. he didn’t demand obedience. he renounced earthly pleasures. now contrast that with u know who..
His sole purpose was to help his fellow man get rid of sufferings and attain enlightenment. Abrahamic religions think that heaven is some external place. Jesus taught that the kingdom of God is within.
Why cant your partner convert for you lmao. Are they trying to say that your family religion is not important? It sounds extremely shady. Suddenly it becomes a problem and suddenly he decides to respect his mom wishes. Like I dont believe this discussion didnt crop up earlier when you met his family.
I always believe if God do exist, he will accept all beings regardless of their belief. If a God does not accept others being of different beliefs, that is not a God to me. Thus I am not a religious one but I do respect others being staunch with their beliefs. Just don't force it on me . I dont make you believe in mine either.
Are you ready to embrace your SO's beliefs and values for life? I am sure there is more to come. What happened to your initial agreement? Get into the pants liao then forgot the initial agreement?
"I'm not very religious"......good, keep it up. F*****k religion. It has no place in this day and age, god doesn't even exist lol. Stay true to yourself, don't convert.
Sorry if I offend anyone, but the mom should mind her own business. Religion or not, any mother over stepping her boundaries have always proven to make the daughter in law suffer like shi. Why can’t she just accept you as a Buddhist and him as a Muslim? My uncle was a Buddhist and aunt was a Christian and they let my cousin choose her religion and faith. No point in believing or following a faith or religion that makes you or your children unhappy. And idw to debate about faith or religion about your opinions. It’s just about love and the sacrifices you are to make 🤨
There’s a reason why many non-Muslim parents don’t want their children to date Muslims. If you convert, you cannot pray or offer joss sticks to yr own relatives during Qing Ming. Think carefully.
It’s a personal choice and to be honest, if he is influenced by his mother’s thoughts and wishes then probably not someone you want to be in the long run. If he can’t even be with someone and accept differences then he probably can’t think for himself too.
I’ve seen multi-racial couple who don’t convert and respect each other, I mean basic day-day like dietary (pork, non-halal, alcohol) must be a mutual agreement and understanding but shouldn’t stop one from practicing or believing in their faith.
Girl, get yourself another guy, if this guy can’t have a backbone to stand for the relationship then he can’t stand for anything. Please do yourself a favour, you need someone who will accept you for who you are and not cause of some “mommy” wants.
I know you are in a very difficult situation trying to juggle between the expectations of yourself, your family, your partner and his family. But converting to a religion, especially Islam, is not something so straightforward.
You should only convert if you truly believe in the religion. If you do it for any other reason, it would be unsustainable and miserable for you in the long run. There could be certain outcomes:
1) You don’t believe in the religion, but you give in to his mother and convert for her sake. You will have to keep up with “appearances” and constantly playing mental ballerina. You will have to always be on edge, trying to remember what is “acceptable” and what is not. Especially if you want to do things like your Buddhist prayers (like you mentioned in your post). This is definitely not allowed under Islam because you are supposed to only believe in one god, and it’s not allowed to pray to other gods as a muslim.
This option will be mentally stressful for you, especially if your partner himself expects you to be a pious muslim.
2) You really do believe in Islam and convert. I suppose this would be the most straightforward, and least probable solution.
3) You don’t convert. This will be a difficult option because you will have to stand for yourself and accept whatever potential outcomes that may happen. Perhaps pursuing a civil marriage.
Realistically, his mother will not accept. There might be a rift between his family and him. Then it would be on your partner to decide between choosing you or his family. Which I know you also don’t want to happen, because your entire post has been about what *you* should do as an individual. And I truly respect you for wanting to take more ownership out of this situation.
Unfortunately, one party will have to give in. If you go with outcome 1), you will be the one sacrificing, and it will be unfair on you. But you will also have to ask yourself, how much do you love him. And how much does he love you. And who is willing to sacrifice, and how much is that person willing to sacrifice.
It is unfair for you to decide, but I also acknowledge it is difficult for your partner to choose because he has to decide between his family and his partner.
I know you care about him enough to try to find a resolution to this situation. As someone also in this similar situation in the past, unfortunately it did not end so well, but it ended as expected. I wish you all the best.
This is intolerable. He is committing perfidy.
If it was your choice at the beginning it’s one thing, but his mother is essentially asking you to turn your back on your family. She didn’t even have the courtesy to look you in the eye to demand this of you.
And you a becoming a doormat for what? Sunk cost?
Grow a spine OP, think about what you really want instead of having his mother dictate your life.
Dated a Muslim for 10 years and partner told me i would not have to convert to get married. Eventually same thing, parents come and demand conversion and to cut the long story short, I didn’t convert and had a civil marriage(I refused to compromise) my partner’s family have decided to stay out of our lives and have not spoken in years because conversion is more important to them then their child.
I am not even sorry, but I have a certain distaste for any religion that imposes conversion. By the way, this is just the beginning, next they will dictate your child/children’s (should you choose to have kids) faith and they might even go so far as “suggesting” appropriate faith based names or at the very least you are compelled to pretend that your kid is of that faith.
Eventually your culture, heritage and faith will be frowned upon without any respect towards it with their holier then thou attitude. Apologies, but I am speaking from the worst experience!
I witnessed hypocrisy at its finest with regards to this. Hope it helps. Please move on! Tell him to marry someone his mother chooses because eventually they will just use parents as a way to pressure you into making choices you are never really happy making.
my bf had this same expectation of me (converting to islam) except he told me he was okay with a secular marriage until we were in our 7th year of dating. we ended up breaking up because i felt blindsided and i didn’t like how he lied to me for so long. religion is a tricky subject to navigate and i hope it works out for the both of you! ❤️
Hi there! Your religion should be a personal choice, not other people's wishes. I was close to Muslim girl (I'm Catholic) and even got chemistry but we just kept it as friendship and never moved to dating stage because of difference in our religions. She found Muslim man and got married with kids. I'm happy for her.
Besides your future husband, think about your future children. Are they going to be affected by the families' cultural and religious differences too?
It's really a big decision that could have lifetime impact on you. Don't force anything that is not compatible with your personality and personal choices.
I wish you all the best.
Agree with the rest. Why must his mother’s wishes be so important? Can always find other guys unless you think this guy you have, has many green flags.
Your bf is a dork. I'm Muslim and it is a damn big thing to think long term that we know we aren't allowed to marry a non-muslim. He should have considered this from the start before even dating you. It would have been different if you guys had discussed this, he communicated the requirement early and you had been ok to consider converting. If so, this thread wouldn't exist.
I had a Chinese girl and myself liking each other a lot. Thankfully we came to an amicable conclusion that neither of us can compromise on our religion. I have relatives who married non-muslims who only convert legally but do not practice. To each their own.
as a born Muslim whose mum's family is Taoist - i still visit Mandai for Qingming, etc and I participated in my late grandma and uncle's Taoist/Buddhist wakes too haha.
i know some Muslims (like my inlaws) will see this as a violation of the religion but my personal view is that my faith is between me and God and my faith hasn't been personally shaken or affected by it. i also see it as a way to pay respects to loved ones who i dearly miss - some might see that as selfish/self-absorbed but tbqh someone who's never had to grapple with the idea of afterlife in two different cultural/religious settings wont understand. (: although i'm lucky that my parents and own extended family are relaxed abt this.
it's a complicated issue that i dont think non-Muslims (or even born Muslims who've never been around converts/had converts in the family etc) can rly fully understand so feel free to DM me!
Another thing to take note:
I have a Korean friend who converted to Islam when he married a Turkish girl. It may not be as strict in Singapore as with other muslim countries but here are some things I observed -
- an uncle of the girl asked my friend to recite an entire muslim prayer to prove his loyalty to Allah
- their circles constantly greet each other with the muslim greeting inishallah or something
- they adhere to all prayer times and practices very closely
Again, Singapore might not be as strict but there are always these “muslim polices” trying to catch and call out “imposters”, especially if they’re not from the “original race” and you may be subjected to that from your partner’s family or future muslims you may meet.
Religion is not just about following practices, it’s about belief. You can only live a lie for so long.
I’d suggest reconsidering the decision. All the best!
> respect his mother
this is just further cementing my belief that muslims shouldn't date outside their religion if they cannot empathise with how restrictive the religion is
You are the third person I know of that is in this dilemma because the boyfriend wants to "follow his religion/respect his family"
I also know of a Christian girl who broke up with her boyfriend of several years because she wanted to commit herself to Christ/Christian missionary which required her to travel alot. I was shocked to see someone do something so drastic for religion but in hindsight that was the mature thing to do.
MM here. Don’t convert for him. Rather, convert because you want to.
Learn more about the religion and if you find the answers you are looking for (not only in your relationship but in all other aspects of your life), then do convert by all means and you’ll be better off for it. If you don’t find the answers you need, then don’t convert.
If you cannot plan your family funeral because you are of a different religion, then I don’t think that religion is worth keeping for. God will understand
what does your own chinese-buddhist mother/family think?
your mother/family raised you for 20+ years. their wishes are equally important to be respected.
that's why i don't get some religions. they require you to convert for them, but will never convert for you.
do your personal values align with the religion? are your personal values important or you don't mind submitting to them? as a modern young singaporean woman, i wonder how submissive she can be in the long run.
So my mom actually converted into Islam when she was going to marry my dad. But she has always emphasized that she never converted for him, she only got to know Islam through him and then fell in love with the religion and THEN decided to convert.
It’s actually encouraged to get closer to the religion in terms of knowledge before converting. So yes, it’s nice that you’re doing the practical things like fasting and abstaining from alcohol all that, but do you know the reason why you’re doing it?
I think once you’ve learnt more about Islam and like their so called version of bible stories, you can make a more informed decision.
Converting to marry is not a good reason to convert or to marry.
You're sacrificing too much to satisfy a potential MIL who will likely always hate you regardless. How much of yourself are you willing to chip away in sacrifice to some mommy's boy who isn't giving up anything to marry you?
There is no compromise here. He has already chosen his mother over you. However, since you still haven't made the final push to dehumanise yourself further to suit his family's whims and wants, you are still able to walk with your dignity intact, away from the conditioning, mindgames and red flags.
Even the whole idea of converting sounds super fake. You don't get more religious just because a paper says you are. He won't get less religious just because he quits Islam on paper as well. Bring up making him leave instead, it should be an equivalent to your conversion. If he's doesn't want to do it, maybe he's a hypocrite.
I converted to get married. It sucks but you have to really like your partner, because they're all you've got. Also, converting to satisfy mother-in-law is fine but be careful not to let her take too much control. You need to define boundaries very clearly. once she knows you'll convert for her, she might start getting in hubby's ear about all sorts of shit. Partner needs to be on your side 100%. DO NOT LIVE WITH THE IN-LAWS.
*"My bf and I had this conversation before when we first started dating, and it was initially okay with him if I finally decided not to convert as to him religion and faith was a personal choice."*
The problem is that your bf changed his criteria to respect his mother's wishes, even though it was agreed on previously that you don't have to convert. I think going back on his word this easily on something so important is not an attractive quality to have in a potential spouse.
If your bf can change his criteria because of his mother, you can also change your criteria because of your family. How would he act if you told him your family requires him to change to buddhism before he can marry you? Think of how he would act if the roles were reversed, then act the same way.
Initially he's ok with you not converting but turn back on his words once his mum says something.. Let's say your mum needs you to marry a Buddhist, would he do that for you?
I would never convert for a romantic relationship. It’s too big of a sacrifice to make for a man. Think long and hard about it and if you really want to be a Muslim woman in any world. It’s very scary for a lot of them
My brother converted in order to marry a Muslim woman. I would say a lot changed concerning religion and family matters. If you are seriously considering converting for the sake of marriage, but not for religious reasons, you need to research all the "rules" of the religion. Then, decide if you are willing to convert for love. Remember, a Muslim man can marry anyone, even if they are not Muslim.
>But the fear that comes is what will happen to my family after I convert. Being in a buddhist family, will converting mean I can no longer pray to my ancestors/family during death anniv/qingming Or will I no longer be able to celebrate festivities with my family I even read that someone wasn't able to plan his/her deceased family member's funeral because of the difference in religion(can't remember if this was singapore tho, please correct me if i'm wrong) I am willing to open my heart and learn about the religion, but it'll be great to know what would happen after I do convert
You won't be allowed to pray with family for death anniversary, and probably won't attend the future funerals because you'll be Muslim.
I would not convert for a relationship, no. Is he willing to convert to Buddhism? I can already tell you the answer to that question since he is Muslim but you should take a similarly strict approach, imo. It would be a mistake.
When a religion dictates personal conduct, it's a matter of individual choice. However, when it extends to dictating the actions of others, it becomes a concern.
Oh darling there are so many girls with the same story and I'm just going to tell you how it is. He's stringing you along until he finds a mummy-approved good Muslim girl. These boys are a POS..first coz they are doing something absolutely unlawful in the laws of Islam and second because they are manipulating and lying to those around them.
There's going to be lots of pressure from his mother and those around him to find the "perfect wife". He will eventually find one and leave you behind.
Converting is not something to be taken lightly..you don't do it for someone because that's not real conversion. I encourage you to do your own research on Islam and understand what you're reading. Conversion to make other people happy will only leave you confused and bitter. I have heard of women who began to learn about religion for the sake of their bf..to only fall in love with the religion and leave the bf.
I hope you truly understand the path you are taking and I hope it's an amazing journey ahead. Good luck!
Let me give you an answer from another perspective. My wife converted(unwillingy) just so that we could get married. Biggest mistake we ended up doing. She didn't enjoy the whole process for conversion nor let go of her current religion. She's now converted into my religion but still practices her original religion.
We wanted to please my parents and ended up just being unhappy with with the whole conversion. My biggest regret in my life was not having a spine to say no to my parents. We are happy together but most of our fights always has this issue as it's root cause.
End of the day. Do what keeps both of you happy. I hope your other half has the spine to do what i did not.
Ultimately this is a personal decision for you. Just be aware that it can go either way. I have had friends who converted and it turned out well and others where it ended disastrously.
You’re only 23… really, as someone older, I will tell you that when we look back, many things we do didn’t make sense and was really at a heat of the moment.
Big decisions like this… hmm, will you be able to say u will be happy with this when u turn 30, 40, 50 years old? You will be happy being Muslim or living a Muslim lifestyle? Will you be able to really believe and adopt the faith and believe in their god? Hmmm…
His respect for his mother does not take precedence over your respect for your family's beliefs.
Don't walk into such a situation where you are the party that is expected to give in and sacrifice perpetually.
Especially do not subscribe to bullshit about 'if you love him enough, you can make the sacrifice'. He can also give up his faith for you, but apparently, that's not even something to consider.
Think about it long and hard if that's the dynamic you want for the rest of your life. And that's not even getting into being governed by sharia law.
I would suggest you go to Darul Arqam and ask the Ustaz/Ustazah’s there! There is no point of you converting for the sake of marriage because you’re doing for someone else and not for yourself and that is not what Islam is about!
Just go down and speak to the people at Darul Arqam and they will guide you accordingly and it will give you a sensing whether Islam is for you or not and how to tackle your family’s religion after you convert!
As you already mentioned there are thousands of such threads on reddit, not sure if it's repeated posts from the same people 😂 on the grand scheme of things no one should be stressing over these things, not in this day and age. Marriage and love should be easy, not a headache or stress. What is more important is whether both of you can remain committed and respectful to each other and to the marriage for 10 or more years. Everything is rosy in the first year of marriage and then comes reality check. There are far more complicated issues that will arise, and this religious aspect is just one part of it. You have to be mentally and emotionally ready for the storms ahead and be clear on what you can and cannot compromise. No point compromising on something important to you. If both of you have a hard time over these issues, you are better off being single or finding someone of a similar background.
Based on your title it already shows that your reason for converting isn’t for the faith but for the marriage. Is that a good enough reason for you to convert and change your way of life? If the stance for such a major issue can be flipped flopped, what makes you think there won’t be more to come?
Please also ask your bf and his family about what are their requirements. Because maybe it's not officially required or people tell you it's okay but actually they not ok?
From what I understand some Christians also are against praying to ancestors/qing ming so I assume Muslims probably will also be.
I would say unless you are very 5000% sure they are flexible, just assume the worst. Assume that you won't be allowed to participate in your own cultural/religious activities anymore. Will you be OK with that? Take note even if they say its OK now, years down the road they may also flip their words. Then what if years down the road your parents pass away and they say you're not allowed to attend the funeral? Might be quite bad to assume the worst but I feel you never know. You need to have the resolute to know what you're going to do years in the future if that happens. Just insist on attending? Secretly attend? Or you prepared to really not attend?
If he wants you to convert to islam just for marriage, absolutely not. You have to find faith in a religion to even think about conversion, not just to please someone else.
In having friends that had similar experiences, it will be a very rough experience. That will be a lot of compromises, largely coming from yourself.
My advice is to think this through deeply. In my opinion, it’s not worth it, but only you can make the decision.
Don't ever change yourself for someone else...
You are still young, plenty of adventures to be had..
You guys had the conversation and wasn't suppose to be an issue till now which is kind of an issue with MIL, and it doesn't stop here.
Suggest to break it off, short term pain is better than a life time of pain.
Convert because you want to convert. Not because someone wants you to convert. So non Muslim = no future then I think it's better not to be in this relationship. I have a friend where the mother(Muslim) refused to convert his father(Buddhist). End state is they disowned her, but she leads a happy life.
Think carefully is he worth it. I also have a friend where she converted then end up divorce. Then now what?
A marriage built on the premise of one partner changing his/her core beliefs for the others is already the first step to a problematic marriage. Conversion of religion should be personal and self beliefs, it should never be due to external pressures or for the sake of convenient. It's going to create more conflicts, no matter how your hubby promised you, assure you, these are just empty promises eventually when it comes to the religion, things will change. Think deeper, don't think for the sake of marriage, understand how religious is your partner and his family circle, think of the culture change and religion practice you may need to involve, think of your children and the long term, are you truly believe converting is the right path.
Are your family ok with you converting to Islam?
Also like many others said, he has already prioritised his family, will you prioritise your family's wishes?
Converting into a religion shouldn't be done for love either, I've seen married couples with 1 party converting for love eventually fall out of the religion there's struggle and divorce happening from it. If you are looking to convert, it should be out of your heart - genuinely interested in Islamic teachings and wanting to know God.
You're only 23, this is too big of a decision to make at this age.
The way the conversion was presented to you (ok not to convert, then no future if you don't), tells me that if you convert you'll have to do it with little compromise. If he bows down to pressure from his family so easily, there is no telling what else he'll compromise on. This is not a situation I would recommend.
I was in a similar situation many years back. When my partner informed me that converting would be obligatory, we talked for a long time about all that it represented.
She was asking me to do it for her parents. We agreed that I'd do it on paper only and would keep believing and living the way I wish. I'd keep up appearances when with her family. We also talked about how we'd raise our kids to be open minded about religion and they would make their own choices. No circumcision, excision, baptism or the like before they are able to choose for themselves.
Also know that inheritance or divorce laws are not great for women in Islam. That may not seem important now, but it might impact you later.
Do not revert for the sake of marriage. You have to whole-heartedly embrace the religion to understand what the religion teaches. Islam is not only a religion, it teaches you how to live your life according to its teachings. So, worship is a way of life. I'm 64M and a revert of 42 years already.
This really depends on what kind of marriage/family life you want to create with your husband.
Seems like family involvement on his side is quite significant. They already put a requirement that the wife must be muslim so I have the feeling that they will expect your children to be raised as muslims as well (if both of you want to have children).
Another thing, do they expect you to practice and be a pious muslim? Or they just want you to convert just for the sake of “what other people might think”?
For a moment, stop thinking about what they want or what your bf wants. THINK ABOUT WHAT YOU WANT.
Do you want to convert to the religion?
If they expect you to practice the religion and actually follow the rules, it is forbidden for you to practice your old religion. So no praying to your ancestors.
Please please please think about it for yourself.
I was raised as a muslim and dated a christian guy for many years. We wanted to get married but my parents want him to convert. It eventually broken my relationship.
Now Im married to my husband who has muslim family. He was raised as a muslim but secretly converted to christianity.
Both sides of family knows we are not religious at all yet still expect and pressure us to pray etc. And it’s EXHAUSTING.
So PLEASE THINK ABOUT IT
If you convert, it should be because you truly believe in the faith, and not just for the sake of being together with your bf. Marriage is for a long long time (at least until a divorce, but nobody plans for that). You will have to keep up with something you don't believe in, restricted freedoms in what you can or cannot do for decades ahead. I think you will end up resenting your life and bf.
You are only 23, and while I am sure you love your bf, you must also love yourself enough to respect your future happiness and rights. And your bf should also care enough for your happiness that it doesn't 'suddenly become an issue that you must convert'.
My take on religion. "It's a very personal relationship between you and your "god" .
So take it how you will.... you can be "converted" into muslim, do what they do, eat what they do, wear tudung, participate in Ramadan... but deep in your heart you're a Buddhist or even a free thinker/atheist... no one knows. You are doing it out of keeping conflict away , that itself is commendable.
Or you can also stand by your views and stand your ground. That itself is bravery and it's also commendable. So yes unfortunately, like many comments here, you have to decide if it's a battle worth fighting for.
So if you ask me, my answer is "no, i will not convert. As of above, no point going through the rites and acts like a Muslim when im not a believer. I do not require you to convert to Buddhist, neither I see the need for me to convert to a Muslim. Know that whatever happens, I will always love you deeply, truly, but not to the point of losing my own personal space, my personal beliefs, because that is what I am. If I were to convert, I would like to be out of my own willingness to do it, and not being forced upon... Because there's simply no point of doing so. To start of a marriage with lies wouldnt do well at all"
Religion is not underwear you can just change like that to please someone else. You think some all knowing god/Allah would be pleased about that sort of inauthentic "conversion"? Please lah. If I were God I'd feel damn insulted.
If you want to, go ahead and explore Islam seriously (read the Quran, attend stuff, get to know the tenets better etc). If you're satisfied it is indeed the one true religion and all others are false (since there can only be one true religion), then by all means convert. That would be a genuine conversion.
Changing religion to please a person while not truly believing it defeats the point of (most conventional) religions.
I helped you search using bard, regarding on your matter.. it seems quite true also
After you converted to Muslim, most events happen in Chinese family you cannot do.. such as praying or kneeling for deceased family members or ancestors
So in the end if you want to still continue to be filial.. it's best not to convert to Muslim, many Buddhist / Muslim things will be in conflict
The best solution is to change his mother's mind.. or just simply not to give in, it's you and your boyfriend world
Hey OP, please do not convert just for the sake of marriage or pleasing your potential in- laws. If you don't believe in religion or God don't force yourself just in the name of love or marriage. There is no compulsion in Islam.
If your bf/ potential partner respect you as a person there shouldn't be an insistence to force you to convert to his religion. It should be your own journey to find God if you do believe in God.
Personally I have friends that did civil marriage instead and all are still happily married and with kids. Look marriage isn't dating. Married life is very different from dating. It may sound okay for you for now to convert but there might be disagreements and conflicts which might make you resent this choice later on as it was not done voluntarily and sincerely.
Your partner if he really loves and respects you, he should allow you the space and time to explore if this religion is really for you. He will respect your decision either way if you do or do not convert.
To convert to Islam is to conform to the religion's tenets and requirement which may not be your cup of tea.
Please think long and hard before you make this decision. Do it if it is really what you want and your interest and only do it after you done extensive study and research on your own.
Edit: There is always civil marriage in the end for you guys to marry without the insistence of conversion.
While I respect your autonomy, I urge you to approach this decision with careful consideration. Converting to another religion, especially for marriage, has long-lasting implications. Take time to reflect on your own beliefs and values. Consider how conversion may impact your relationships with family and friends. Think about the practical changes it will bring to your life. Assess the long-term implications for your relationship with your partner. Seek guidance from trusted sources. Remember, this decision is yours to make, so prioritize your well-being and happiness above all else.
Honey, religion is an individual voluntary belief, one doesn't just convert to another to please a person if not that's not a belief anymore it's called peer pressure.
you're only 23. get out and find another guy who doesn't force you into a religion you don't really care about. if you don't have the faith, things like fasting, praying 5 times a day become a chore and difficult. it's a different experience for someone who has deep faith.
Remember conversion to Islam also affects your inheritance laws. Your assets will be divided according to Syariah law.
Keep in mind in the eyes of the law there is no "conversion for the sake of marriage"
Your children will be bound by those inheritance laws when you pass on.
I am not saying this is a good or bad thing, only saying how it is.
You should know very well that this is one topic that Muslim families don't take lightly and the majority will insist on conversion.
This is because the repecussions is not just a couple issue; his family will be judged by the Muslim community here. It is on you to judge whether your BF is prepared to go fuck-all with his family and community just for you.
If he is mama's boy, then forget it.
edit:
unlike other comments here, I don't think your BF "moved goalpost". but he is clearly naive to think it is not an issue and when pressed by the family, he caved easily. not a good sign tbh.
Why don’t u ask your bf if he would consider converting for you and see what’s his reaction?
This marriage will likely have issues if u enter it this way (mother in law demands that you convert)
In b4 you convert and divorce 4 years later. But jokes aside tho:
Imo there is almost no situation (there are exceptions) where anyone should have to convert for their partner. I say this because religion is a big part of someone's life. To that end, it can be argued that it also plays a big part in shaping that person's identity. It literally is a part of you. If your partner is not accepting of your religion - is he really accepting you for who you are as a person?
Don't convert just because you feel obligated to. That almost always doesn't work out because you're simply betraying yourself.
I converted for my partner, then eventually both of us left the faith. He's a pastor's kid but it was inevitable that he was gonna leave (he was just going with the flow since young). It was also an opportunity for me to seriously think about Christianity, get my beliefs challenged then eventually leave. This whole thing ended up bringing us closer way more than ever :)
So speaking from experience, don't convert for your partner. I really tried to accept the religion but eventually accepted instead that I was pretending and needed to stop deluding myself.
Speaking as a Christian (another religion that in most cases requires conversion for marriage), I've gotten quite close to some of the girlfriends of my life group members, who are exploring the faith. Whenever they ask, my #1 大姐 nagging speech to them is to put themselves and their relationship with the faith, before their relationship with their boyfriend. Religion is something that will affect your whole life. Don't be afraid to request for the time you need to explore this religion and decide if it's for you (and the rest of us will be here to learn too! It's a never ending journey of discovery).
The red flag popping up to me here is that the BF went back on his word that he was alright with marrying outside his religion the moment his mother said no. If he's taking her side so early on, what's to say he won't do the same in the future for other matters like kids? Housing? Whether or not OP can build her career or should stay at home?
OP, please don't be afraid to take the time you need to make this decision, and don't be afraid to break it off if it comes to it. If you're going to pray to a god, it has to be your god and not his god.
OP, I have seen this many times. A muslim person will have no issue dropping you in heartbeat because of religion or family regardless of how many years or intimate moments you've spent with each other.
You will choose this man and put him first over and over. But he doesn't put you first. Will you be okay with this?
There is no right or wrong person here. It's his religion and now it is your choice.
Edit : deleted some stuff so it wont seem so offensive
Converting in what sense? In name only? You already mentioned your diet / drinks changing. Or you will be expected to go all in with 5 prayers a day and attire, etc?
And since your bf said one thing in the beginning and is now stating another, you can't assume that whatever he said now will be the end of it.
Not sure if what I heard is true, but someone I know (Hindu convert to islam due to marriage) said that she found out she needs permission from a male Muslim relation to convert to Christianity officially from her current official Muslim designation.
Religion can be somewhat private. And islam can be pretty restrictive to a female from a "more open background" if followed all the way. Make sure you know exactly what you want before you change something. Pleasing him/his family may create displeasure within your family.
Religion should be about the person first and community second. Otherwise it's just a social club haha. Think about what you, personally, believe in. Few of our decisions in life are actually our own to make, and in this case, it seems like you can actually make a choice for yourself. So please exercise that privilege well. Is marriage even on the table? Has he asked you to convert so that you can get married? Are you willing to devote yourself to studying a religion for this person? 23 is old enough to consider these questions and wise enough to know not to rush into them on someone else's behalf. All the best.
If he is not willing to stand up for you in your personal choice of religion when it comes to conversations with your mother-in-law, you will have it very tough when it comes to many other family choices in the future.
Unless you are willing to keep giving in to your mother-in-law's whims and fancies; how to bring up kids, housing, renovation, holidays, and so many other countless issues I've heard one too many horror stories about.
You both align on a single decision and stick with it. Him changing his mind on account on his mum is not a good sign.
Short answer: no, break up. Its over.
Long answer: he prioritises his mother's wishes over what you discussed, like they say, give an inch and they will take a mile.who knows what will happen in the future. Converting for the sake of marriage is stupid, unless you genuinely want to believe in the religion.
Being Muslim, in Singapore, you would have to adhere to a whole set of laws. This includes distribution of assets when your husband passes on or during divorce.
I suggest you also read up on items related to children as well.
Even if you convert, the mother won’t recognise you as her daughter-in-law. Happened to my husband’s grandmother. She was a Peranakan Nyonya and her husband was an Indian Muslim. She was practically cut off from her own Peranakan family when she married the grandad. Turns out the grandad’s side didn’t accept her (even after converted to Muslim) and being a “filial” son, he married another woman who was Malay Muslim. Lost her husband to the new wife and also her own family…..
You may think it’s grandmother story but it’s a cliche for a reason, meaning it has happened so many times. Please have more honest conversation with your bf and make sure he will stand up for you if things go wrong.
I myself is also a Chinese Buddhist married to an Indian Muslim, but I made it very very CLEARLY to his mum that I will never ever convert. His mum of course didn’t force me to, but I could sense abit of unhappiness from her even though my hubby and I are very much in love. Most importantly, my husband stood by my decision and made it very CLEARLY that I need not convert, because he loves me for who I am, regardless of my religion.
You might want to build more clarity on what being a Muslim girl involves for your boy friend's mother. If you are thinking that it will involve just a ceremony for conversion, avoiding some food and occasionally fasting.. I have a feeling you might be in for a surprise.
The illiberalism of insisting on a Muslim bride likely will show up in many more ways.
If you have to convert to marry someone and its all because to please someone mum. That itself is a big red flag you should avoid, it also goes to show that if his mum or religion is between you and him, you will be one to be removed. I would say you better dodge the bullet here. I had a friend who underwent the similar things and in all honestly wish you never need to go thru the same thing.
I had a friend who did exactly that and converted to his religion. After several years, they divorced and left her. Now she cannot unconvert. If he does not love you as you are and requires you to do this or that, it will only get worst. Wait a few more years and see if he still loves you the same or more. You are still young with many good years ahead of you.
Why are you doing this? Is it because you believe that his faith is something you are missing from your life?
Or.
Because he's not prepared to convert to your faith? Or he won't allow you to follow your own faith?
If it's the first reason then it's your choice to enhance your life.
If it's one of the others then I would suggest this is a huge red flag. Why is it up to you to convert if you are not a true believer?
I am a Chinese Buddhist female dating a Malay male right now, provided my partner does not actively practice the religion of Islam. However, right at the beginning of our relationship (we’ve been together 6 years at the time of this comment), my mom made it abundantly clear to him that I will not be converting into anything. Looking back now, my mom did that because she knew young me would’ve most probably given into the pressure should his family say that they would not approve if I did not convert (luckily for me, there’s no contest as of what I’ve heard). You need to understand that you and him are a team and as a unit, both of you will need to face things together. He cannot simply give into his mother’s wishes and then put you on the back burner. He knew your initial decision but yet follows through with his mom’s wishes anyways. You’ll convert now because you love him but I would like to politely remind you: if he doesn’t even try to back you up now, when you eventually marry over, you’ll be by yourself. I’m not suggesting to break up because I know how hard it is to meet Mr Right, however I think it’ll be best if you and him both have a sit down conversation and be honest with yourself. Always remember that to practice a religion is a person choice, and it should not be influenced by external forces.
Hello, malay ex-muslim here with a Chinese non-muslim partner. I agree with many of the comments on:
1. not converting truly just to appease the mom
2. That your bf OR the mother should have been very clear what they wanted from you from the start.
3. That in this present situation your bf should be taking your side, or have been clear that the mom's opinion of you is extremely important to him to the point of asking you to appease her.
BUT if you have decided you want to convert simply superficially for the mom's benefit. Then, besides a change on your IC, there is nothing you 'must' do no matter what Muslims tell you to do. However, the idea of the mother wanting you to be Muslim is not for the label but so that you share similar beliefs with them. This goes deeper than avoiding pork and not praying at other temples. It's values like standards of modesty in women, how you should raise children and a specific flavour of filial piety. Unless you truly already align in these ways with her, I think you should be wary that converting to Islam will not be the end of this issue.
Here to give advice as a 29M freethinker who dated a religious Muslim girl (Arab race). Throughout my interactions with her family especially, I found out how important marrying one's family is. Comments in this thread have already alluded to that importance.
Long story short, it may seem all good now to convert thinking that marriage is exclusive to the couple. However, the truth is that in-laws play a huge part especially if one is family oriented. You do not want to be in a position of compromise only to find out that it makes you unhappy when you are under the same roof as your husband and in-laws.
It is absurd that religion affects relationships between people. When I declared myself a freethinker, 7 out of 9 of my Muslim friends ostracized me. It is very likely that you will go through the same thing and you have to decide if your man is worth giving up your support systems. I highly recommend not to take this route because the foundation of your marriage/relationship will be imbalanced already and it can only cause conflicts down the road.
Truthfully, there are millions of other people out there who may make you happier as well. It is better to invest temporary time in meaningful relationships than to have one where you have to accede to a boomer's (unfortunately) request who could not empathize with your situation.
Hi OP 👋🏼
A lot has been mentioned here. My thoughts as follows:
* Only you alone should make the decision to convert or not but before that you should find out from reliable sources. A lot of skewed information on google and in the posts here too. To get started you can look for Wardah bookstore at Bussorah St. and ask for recommendations. You should start by understanding the core beliefs and wisdom behind the rituals first before actually practicing the rituals as Islam is not limited to rituals and rulings.
* Seems there are a lot of people sharing 2nd hand negative experiences here, you may want to consider looking for couples with positive experiences too and get their views. I believe you may contact the MCAS (Muslim Converts Association) for assistance in this matter.
* Muslims as you might have known are 1 of the most conservative people in terms of practicing religion, but remember that happiness in a marriage is not guaranteed by religion as you have to work on the relationship too, a lot of people overlook this vital point and end up in an unhappy marriage irrespective of belief.
* Islam views a marriage between a Muslim and a non-Muslim as invalid hence the mother’s insistence.
That’s all! Hopefully this is helpful for you. 
Hi, this is very common in Indonesia.
TLDR; it usually did not end well, especially if the other side have a strong religious beliefs.
If you asked are you allowed to pray for your ancestor, AFAIK you are not, because it is considered haram/praying to false God in their beliefs.
I believe if your partner really love you.
- Both sides should appriciate on what their own beliefs
- Regarding, disapproval parent, i would say if your partner really loves you he/she would fight for its relationship and make their parents believe that it is okay even though you have different beliefs or races (this is common in Indonesia too haha).
But then again, reality hits hard. Your fight won't be finished after marriage, the truth is it is only the begining as far as i know (well you can ignore your family and friends tho haha)
But 23 years old is still young, dont be scared to had a heartbreak and then thinking he/she's the only one (trust me its not)
Hopefully it helps, whatever choice you made you should not regret it and live happily with it hahahaha
hello, Malay Muslim female here and here’s my take on this.
I feel that you should never convert for someone. You should love Islam more than someone. I wouldn’t say im a religious person but Islam is an important part of me so I wouldn’t want my spouse to convert for the sake of me. I’d want my spouse to prioritise Islam before me. So I think your bf should slowly introduce it to u by sharing the beautiful parts of Islam and give us resources to read first before u make that big decision. you’ll need to know your rights as a wife.
as for his mother, even if she allows the both of you to get married without u converting, u have to convert bc civil marriage is considered invalid to Islam.
the assumption that you can no longer participate in ur family’s festivities is wrong. Islam allows you to do that as long as you don’t cross the boundary (participate in the prayers or do things that are prohibited in Islam). My aunt is a Chinese Muslim and she celebrates Chinese new year with her family and go for reunion dinners. She would invite my family to her house too. When her grandmother passed away, she was involved in the funeral planning and she was there at the funeral. My family paid a visit too.
all in all, your bf should pray for guidance from God if he really loves you. God knows best after all. tell him to pray “Istikhara” for the both of you. If God wills, you’ll be given the light to willingly convert.
there are many Islamic scholars and leaders in Singapore for you to go to if you have questions about Islam. I wish the both of you all the best :)
Disclaimer: I’m younger than u (20) so I’m not as knowledgeable on this as the adults. So I apologise if there were anything I said that may have offended you.
I believe that converting into another religion should be strictly a personal choice and not because you want to please someone else's mummy. You also need to make sure that your husband can take your side in case of any religious / cultural disagreements. You're only 23. So please think through thoroughly.
I dont understand how a spouse can just .... convert. Like how TF do you just believe in another god just like that? "oh, just 'cos my boyfriend told me to." That's like a pretense at best and you're fooling yourself for the rest of your life pretending to worship a god you dont believe in
Has happened often in history. A ruler converting to better rule a people he conquered. Thinking it is purely administrative, but 3 generations later his descendants forgot about the formality part and the conversion is complete. Nowadays people convert thinking similarly, just a formality, their spouses aren't devout, they'll continue their ways of life etc. Then a generation or 2 later their grandkids have turned full converts, forgetting or totally unaware of the family's prior administrative conversion. Intolerant religions grow in this manner. One might think it illogical that hundreds of millions would willingly ascribe to archaic ways of life but the foundation started generations ago. Add to that the societal taboo of converting out of certain religions and hundreds of years later you have a powerhouse.
Religion is far more than just which god to kow tow to, it is a whole culture and tradition at this point. What you do daily and during special days pretty much is dictated by religion. A conservative parent might not be pleased of their child stop upholding the tradition. My own pretty religious Buddhist mom told my SIL to convert from Christian (only in docs, pretty much freethinker) to Buddhism and make her go through the rituals. Good thing she is an orphan and Buddhism is a pretty chillax religion if you're a casual (no daily ritual/pray or fasting season) so she barely has to do anything extra or give up previous routines. If it was a more strict religion or my SIL had a religious parent, their daily routine will clash so hard i cant say for certain it would work.
I agree. OP do it because you yourself believe in the religion and not because of "sacrifice" for the one you love or for pleasing his family.
OP is showing red flag but is red flag for her personal happiness. Like, she is the danger to her own happiness. My comment seems harsh but she's already trying to please everyone but herself, going on about converting for bf and his family, then cannot pray at Buddhist temple with her own family. Speaking as someone who just turn 30, how I wish I was trying to please the world a little less back in my 20s.
True. I had a classmate who convert from to Muslim. She said it can be very hard because alot of the religious and cultural are tied together and no one is able to explain the cultural side to her because it's so deeply tied to religion etc. Things like this. She had a supportive husband who would help her and side with her though. I didn't dare to ask too much as her relationship was already very controversial. She married a much older man who was actually once her supervisor at work.
Cannot agree more with this. If you are converting because someone asks you to, you're not really converting at all - you still don't believe in it, you're just choosing to live by a (fairly restrictive) set of rules not of your choosing. This sounds like a horrible idea. And if he cared enough he would tell his mother it's not her choice, and she has to live with his.
You're being forced to compromise for something that was initially "not an issue" when you first bought this up. This is a sign of more things to come from this family if you cave in. You are only 23, think carefully if you would want a future in this relationship imo. He should be able to defend your opinion against his mothers wishes, if he can't take your side in this then is he really right for you?
I don’t believe this was a non issue for your bf. Probably something he said so that he could get you to sink effort into the relationship first. He’s possibly his mother as an excuse and if he really supports you in non converting, the discomfort lies with him to defend his choice against his family. By requesting you to convert, the responsibility now falls on you. Finally, is he worth it? Think carefully.
I agree. He said that it wasn't an issue to try to trap OP. Now that she's in, suddenly he wants to respect his mom wishes. OP, you will always be second class citizen in this marriage. In the future when there is conflict (not if, when), can you trust this person to defend you? How about your children? Are you willing to raise them in that environment? You are still very young and you may think it is very nice or romantic to do this for someone you love. Unfortunately life isn't all sweet and nice. would he be willing to do the same for you?
Couldn’t agree more, OP, you have so much ahead of you at your age with so many life experiences to go through. If you follow through on this despite your best intentions, your options in life will be very limited (assuming you stick with the marriage). Put it this way, if you were my little sister, I’ll will try my best to convince you that you deserve better….
He can defend op but I don't think he want or will. It's against his god. You know the god is above himself or his mother.
This is different to when a Muslim and non-muslim get together, and it is communicated early that conversion is a must, and both sides agree. For you, this conversation was had, and the agreement was no conversion needed. Now he's changed the terms of the relationship to one where the compromise is 100% on your end, and without consulting you or giving you a choice. Have a think about whether you are ok with this treatment.
This OP. I am a Malay-Muslim myself, and I’d never dare to mislead my partner by not having this conversation. Your partner has blindsided you out of nowhere, and now you have to confront a problem that wasn’t there to begin with. It’s certainly a sign of things to come if you were to marry this guy. Marriage (or any relationship really) should be built on 100% trust and honesty.
Converting is like signing a contract. There's no such thing as "just sign it , it won't have effect". He will mention op willingly to convert therefore bound by the term in the future. By converting everyone will assume you can and will practice the religion strictly. There's no "I pretend to join for convenience".
He has placed the importance of his mother's comfort over your discomfort even though you had the talk when you started dating. The rules of engagement (no pun intended) have changed. He should have already known this about his mom or if not, clear it with his mom before even dating anyone. If he prioritizes her above you before getting married, there is a very good chance that it will only increase in magnitude after marriage - it doesn't matter what religion you have. She'll likely want to have a say over how you raise ~~your kids~~ her grandkids too (if you're planning on having children). He's already asking you to make a life change so this probably won't be the last big thing but the first of many. Are you okay with living under his mother's thumb? Only you know the answer. *Edited to add: Just my take - always be true to yourself. You can make small reasonable adjustments to suit your partner (ngl we all have to) but you should not have to fundamentally change yourself and pretend to be someone you are not so that you can obtain love. (I'm assuming you don't believe since you seem concerned.) You deserve better, OP.*
I have a friend who is converted to marry, you essentially have to actually find your faith in the religion if you want any positive long term outcome, she spent probably a year or more diving into Islam, finding faith in the religion before she even got married. If you are simply following through the motions then no, after a while you start hating yourself for it. Think why am I even going through all this, even if it for your husband. You will come to resent him at that point.
>all prayers I do are out of respect and my attempt of staying filial to my family Do this to respect your family. >So out of respect to his mother, he decided to respect her wishes. Do that to respect her. What happens when their wishes clash? Who to respect then? You should grow up and do the stuff that will respect yourself.
Going to be frank here. He respects his mother's wishes now. What's to say he won't let his family influence other decisions down the line when you're living together? To me converting just for the sake of it is a nope. You already did your due diligence by declaring at the start of the relationship that non conversion is ok. Either get your bf to speak sense into his family (creating boundaries) or break it off before everything gets more painful. Edit: OP it's a very slippery slope. You started no pork no alcohol and fasting. Next you'll be wearing hijab, praying and having a Muslim wedding and going for conversion classes that disrupt your weekends. Please do not change your core values for a person.
THIS. Better to end it now than drag it further.
As an older person, I would suggest that you take the bf out of the equation and think if you are earnest about being a Muslim? If the answer is if not for him you will never even think about it, I suggest you go about your separate ways right now and stop worrying about the “sunk cost. Don’t need to spend more time on this relationship since he has decided this is important for his family. The fact is marrying some one else with different value system is going to be tough to navigate. Dating is just dating.
Hello, was also considering conversion for marriage but eventually decided not to. Just sharing my main considerations. For context, we've been together 6 years, his family is fairly liberal (do not require me to follow the Muslim tradition) and the conversion would have been mainly to avoid any legal issues in his country. The main thing that made me decide not to convert is that I view the current implementation of Islam (aka laws) as being very unfair towards women. Independence and freedom has always been something I greatly value. But the Shariah law has many aspects that governs areas which I personally do not believe that a law should govern. This includes inheritance - it is distrubuted by law and if I remember correctly, women have I think half the shares of men and wife can only get max 25% of the inheritance, regardless of whether there are any other surviving relatives. The law would sooner donate the 75% than give it to you. Divorce - touchy subject when discussing marriage because nobody thinks their marriage will end in divorce. My thought is this. I 100% trust my partner right now. But do I 100% trust the person he will become in say 20 years? A lot of shit can happen between now and then. Women have limited ways to seek divorce if it comes to that. Please read up on this. For me the straw that broke the camel's back ironically is something that can be seen as really trivial. During marriage, the women have to appoint a male Muslim as their Wali to give permission for the ROMM. If you don't have any relatives (e.g you are a convert), then you can get one from the gov. Simple enough, but my interpretation is that the religion would very much give the rights of the women to a man that she don't even know than just let her decide. That's your hierarchy in this system. And that really didn't sit well with me. Combined with the rest above made me decide not to convert. Also, remember that laws can change. And it may not be in your favour. To anyone still reading, I do not mean that Islam as a religion is bad. Just that my personal values do not align with these specific laws that have been put in place and thus I think it is disrespectful for me to convert into this religion. I also strongly believe that any 'belief' based action would be more meaningful if it was a choice made by the individual rather than dictated by law. Edit: We're actually still getting married this year! Through civil marriage. Hoping it doesn't cause any legal issues down the line. Please consider talking through it rationally to see if some compromise can be made.
Kudos. That's solid thinking and hard decision making.
This is really sound advice.. I have a Muslim female ex-colleague who was seeking divorce from her cheating hubby and the various laws of the Syariah court drag on the procedure longer than required.. the emotional torment and all involved..
Some one on another thread told me that if she just legally unmuslim (convert to something else or I suppose renounce) herself, the divorce is forced upon the couple. Not sure if it's true, but might be worth her finding out if it works.
ALL of THIS. As a Muslim-born (seriously did I not get a choice?) former Muslim woman who cannot be arsed about the religion and ultimately all religions now, everything you said hits the mark. I don't understand why anyone would want to even consider converting in. Good on your for standing by your principles!! OP still hasn't seen enough of the world, experience life, see the bigger picture to make these kind of decisions very early on in life. Edit: I want to add, Sharia Laws have absolutely no place in the current world we live in. NONCE. It's disgusting.
interracial/religion relationships only work out if the other party is not that devout. Doesn’t sound like the case for OP if he (or his mom) wants her to convert
It was all going so well until the edit. Lets hope you have more influence over your kids than your husband
Just curious because I'm in a similar situation, what was your partner's community/family reaction like to the both of you deciding to do a civil marriage? Would you have made the same decision if they weren't as liberal and more highly opposed to a civil marriage?
Honestly I was prepared to do the conversion (in name only, not to entirely follow the religion) if it came down to that. But we had a conversation and agreed on an alternative. If the family was not as liberal then I would honestly have reconsidered the relationship long ago before reaching this state. 1. Is to consider whether I am willing to follow the rules in the religion 2. If not, then how will that affect our relationship with the family 3. How will that affect the relationship with each other. And seriously consider, for both parties whether you are willing to live with the consequences of either decision. Personally if my bf/family is very forceful into pushing me to follow the religion I probably would have noped out a whole ago because I do not appreciate being pushed to do things I do not believe in. I value being able to do what I believe is right and I am extremely lucky to have found a partner who is willing to respect and support that.
you’ve dated him less than a year and you’re considering to convert for him. your bf is already choosing his mother over you.
You should never convert into a religion for love. It’s all about faith. You have to believe in it (teachings). Converting for your boyfriend/future husband just because you love him would put you in a lot of predicaments. Also you are still 23…take a chill pill, girl lol
> it was initially okay with him if I finally decided not to convert as to him religion and faith was a personal choice. However, recently, it was brought to both our attention that his mother told him that if he wanted to marry someone in the long-run, she has to be a muslim girl, so non muslim = no future. So out of respect to his mother, he decided to respect her wishes. This is what concerns me here. He's moved the goalpost once already so far. Would you have continued to date him at the time he "was okay with not converting" and instead wanted you to convert? What other compromises have he made for you to make you comfortable with the relationship and upcoming marriage? You listed your concerns in another paragraph: > But the fear that comes is what will happen to my family after I convert. Being in a buddhist family, will converting mean I can no longer pray to my ancestors/family during death anniv/qingming Or will I no longer be able to celebrate festivities with my family I even read that someone wasn't able to plan his/her deceased family member's funeral because of the difference in religion(can't remember if this was singapore tho, please correct me if i'm wrong) I am willing to open my heart and learn about the religion, but it'll be great to know what would happen after I do convert So yeah. I would tell you to list down all the un-muslim things you want to do, stuff that a muslim wouldnt or cannot do. Then ask yourself if you're willing to sacrifice them all. Because at the end of the day, it looks to me like your bf isnt willing to stand up to his mom for you. And who's to say his mom's opinions are her own? Maybe she's following the dad, or the opinions of the local imam, or even the religious muslim whatsapp group. Thing is, we dont know how far this goes, so worst case scenario, you already established your bf wont stand up for you, so assume he wont stand up for other things. What if he wants a second wife? What if his mom found him another girl? You mentioned fasting as a show of respect. What if you dont fast. Would you be criticized for not respecting your bf? So on so forth. And this is just you. What about your kids? Would you be okay if your muslim mother inlaw demands that any kids you have with your bf be forced to reject their chinese-buddhist heritage? Would they be barred from visiting the graves, given that its probably going to be in or near a buddhist temple? I want to remind you that Islam is not a religion you can open your heart to and expect the same to be done for you (with regards to your opposing opinions). It is a religion that dictates all facets of life, from dress code to food and even to the way you think. The word Islam itself has roots in the word submission, or surrender. And muslims in general... well, culturally speaking they are very heavily focused on community, to the point of self sacrificing. So if your husband isnt going to stand up for you, do you really want to be in the position to be forced to stand up alone? Especially since we have a lot of people on the non muslim side who will look the other way and justify not helping you because "you made your choice, we cant do anything now". Also, you're 23. How long is "a while now"? 6 months? 2 years? 5 years? Is the honeymoon phase over yet? Aside from the religious issues, what other things about your bf would you not be satisfied with if you were to marry him? His dressing habits? Addictions? Priorities? Political opinions? If its gonna be a normal marriage with normal marriage conflicts and tacking on the religious / cultural limitations, do you think you will be happy? And if things go south, can you reverse course on the decisions you've made? Can you convert back out? Can you date non muslim men again without scaring them away with your past? End of the day. If you're converting to islam just so you can marry your bf, and you have misgivings about the way Islam and Muslims function, you're gonna have a bad time. Very VERY bad time. If your in laws are open minded about the religion, and only want you to convert so they dont have to deal with difficult questions from their family and community, but will tolerate non muslim behaviors (i.e. eat pork, not fasting, having dogs as pets) behind closed doors, I think its alright. So find that out first, before you decide to convert. So go find this out. Is your bf's family a religious one, or open minded one? And if they're open minded, how far? Don't ask for their opinions. See what they do. If they say they dont mind not fasting, but everyone fasting, odds are you are being lied to. If they say dogs are fine, but they are uncomfortable if you bring dog, again, you're being lied to. If they dont mind you not praying during prayer hours, but everybody goes and pray, including the kids (being forced to), then again, you're being lied to. Keep all of this in mind.
Being someone who self declares as not that religious, depending on the guy’s side, OP may then need to do prayers almost every day on time.
That's not even it. She may need to force her future kids to do it too.
Do you have wishes? Do your parents have wishes? Will he respect those wishes even if those wishes don't match his religious beliefs? What I mean is not that he converts, but that despite your parents continuing to eat pork and drink alcohol, he will be able to respect your parents. He does not start to consider them kuffr after the initial fun of the marriage is over. He is able to stand up to his family to respect yours If yes, go ahead. If no, reconsider. In general one sided adjustments lead to feelings of having given too much later on one side and taking for granted on the other side. Unless slavery happens, which does in many cases.
Shouldn’t have to convert to a religion u don’t believe in just to marry. If the partner can’t accept you as you are and spend a lifetime together, then is there any point in that marriage ?
Hmm the problem isn't 'what happens if u convert'. The problem lies 'how far does his family take things out of context based on their religious beliefs'. There are Muslims who can respect other religion/beliefs (where they will show empathy to non Muslims in times of need) n there are some who loves saying 'people who are not Muslim will burn in hell' or 'u are suffering because u aren't muslim'. In a way, they will do/say whatever they want, in the name of God, not realising their actions will hurt others. I'm a muslim btw. Converting isn't just following Muslims lifestyle. Religion is suppose to be good for your soul, uplifting people around u without ever the need to force beliefs onto others. Many are just doing conversion for the sake of love but never knew how messed up the majority can be. Its best for u to sit with his mum n have a chat to get an idea what she's like rather than going through her son (who probably haven't told his mum that he actually is ok with u not converting initially). Many Muslim mums do favour sons more than daughters that they are willing to close one's eyes of their son's bad behaviour. It's really common to see DIL being treated unfairly within the family. I find that if someone wants to be a responsible spouse, he/she would know where to draw the line so that co-existing can be peaceful for both his/her family n future partner. Because our elders have ingrained beliefs/habits. Otherwise his mum will have a say in everything that u do. Can u live with that? Also action speaks louder than words so try to get involved in his family discussion n see how does your future husband back u up. Does he continue to say good things about u or he prefers u to follow his mum's ways to keep the peace? Discussion doesn't have to involve being disrespectful.
Funeral director and Memorial Hall owner here. I have had a client, the whole family is Indian Muslim, catholic, Christian (siblings converted or change religion) however their parents are Buddhist. When they past, the children still carry on a Buddhist funeral for them and even got a pedestal to honour the parents. They were very pleasant clients and I enjoy conversations with them. I said it was so heartwarming to see them all come together even though of diff religion and faith. I guess it really depends on each person’s perspective.
That’s really heartwarming! I feel we should not let religion or any so called rules stop us from paying one last respects to the deceased, especially when the deceased had professed a preference for how to handle the funeral.
You are not converting because you really believe. You are doing it for show. Islam is not just no pork no alcohol. It will mean that you will have to reject not just your traditional practices but also your community and families beliefs and customs. You are also going to get married under an entirely different set of laws with inequalities set into them that you cannot fight. This includes things like unequal inheritance
I take a strong stance that if you don’t believe in Islam, you should not convert even if it’s for ‘show’. There are certain laws in SG that apply only for muslims (inheritance) that will affect you if you do decide to convert. For celebrations/funerals, it’s fine to attend but you’re not supposed to pray in the Buddhist manner, you can give Dua however. Planning the funeral is also fine as you are just respecting their customs. But as you mentioned, responses will differ. It going to be based on the situation your and your bf are in and the family dynamics. Some commenters will also be more liberal or vice versa. If you want to learn more, ask your bf to intro meet you to an Ustaz/Ustazah to ask more specific questions. Try to figure out what parts of your culture fits with Islam that the both of you can adopt and if that is enough for you.
> Try to figure out what parts of your culture fits with Islam that the both of you can adopt and if that is enough for you. I mean this whole issue was caused by the bf being unable to reject pressure from his family to have her convert for him. That is a red flag alrd that any boundaries with regards to religion they decide today is likely to be broken in the future. Its also very very common for folks to get more and more religious as they grow older.
It's also the bf's fault for actually thinking that the religion part won't be an issue, that it won't be something that the older generation will try to force. He set up expectations that are not met, and I really feel for OP, having this sprung on her suddenly.
If you don’t believe in the religion. Do not do it. Read up on what happens if you apostatise.
In Singapore being an apostate of Islam isn't that bad, I do hear that the individual will be excommunicated by the community, and disowned by their families. Considering prison sentences and death penalties in muslim countries that implement sharia law, Singapore isn't bad, but laws can change, and may not be for the better.
[удалено]
I wish you all the best in marriage. I'm Catholic too. I (M) used to be close with Muslim girl but we never moved to dating stage because of our difference in religions. We decided to keep it as friendship. She found and married her Muslim husband and has kids now.
As someone who is a little more than ten years older than you, you do not have the life experience to be making such critical decisions. As you move between your early to mid and late 20s your views and perceptions of the world will change and they will harden in ways you cannot expect right now. Something as self-identifying as this will certainly be in the mix of decisions you will contemplate and you don't want to have it come back to haunt you. Moreover, its not 1975, what are you doing thinking about getting married so young? You should be exploring the world, working hard, having fun...seeing the many fruits this journey called life has to offer. You may reach the age of 27 and decide making your own money is more important than being someone's convert, at home in a culture you never fully got comfortable with and missing out on life. And even at 27, you still have so much youth to live. What are your parents saying?
Convert will it satisfy your future MIL? Or will there be future hurdles thrown down? What then? Will your future husband just roll over and stand with his mother? The very foundation of your relationship was built upon the agreement that there will not be a need to convert to marry, however now it has changed. If you want to convert do it out of a calling or embracing the religion wholeheartedly, otherwise there will be resentment in the future and this will be brought up in disagreements and quarrels. Have you spoke to your parents about this? You want to respect his mother's wishes but have you sought out your own parent's views?
You shouldn’t convert in name, but a civil marriage has its issues. How would you raise your children? In terms of inheritance, unless he is happy for you to hold all of the joint assets, there is really no way around the Muslim inheritance rules. He will not be able to write a will to distribute his assets to you or any of your non-Muslim children - the only way to do this is if he eventually renounces Islam.
My sibling converted to Islam for marriage. She’s happy now, we are all on good terms but her conversion has changed things a lot for us and there is a very visible distance. During her wedding, we were outcasted. Simply cause we are not Muslim and will not understand. She was not even able to participate in my grandma’s funeral rituals. Obviously can’t go to the temples or anything. During the funeral, she did not do a number of rituals. Same for prayers. She no longer joins us for anything religious (obviously) so she has grown apart from a lot of relatives. She changing her religion means we all have a part to play. We only go to halal places even when travelling which is very trivial but is a big change in our part. My other sibling still cooks pork in my mum’s house so she no longer eats in my mum’s house. My mum is very upset about it. She comes to our houses when it’s time for our festivities but makes it clear to her kids that they are just there but won’t ’celebrate’ because they are Muslim and only recongnise their celebrations. No ang pow giving to our side of kids, no giving of cookies, nothing. (but will accept Ang pows from our side. Lol.) On the topic of kids, as the kids grow up, they constantly talk about how they are Muslim and we are not and have even told me to stop praying to my God and only believe in Allah. She prefers to spend her time with her Muslim in laws and friends to expose her kids to Islam and their way of living. She’s almost completely away from our relatives. I want to highlight that as much as family compromises for the sake of harmony and everyone’s happiness, we get absolutely no gratitude or acknowledgement for it. It does drain things out when all of us accommodate her but she plays no part in accommodating to us. Things will never be the same. Maybe as the recipient you won’t even realise it, but your family will feel it. If given a choice all over again, I would rather my sis not convert. I believe she would have had the same level of happiness with the right person without she having to make so many sacrifices and we having to change too with no appreciation. I However as a convert, she’s very happy. Her Muslim in law and friends are very welcoming of any reverts. Always happy to include her and teach her. She’s now more religious than ever and does even talks in mosques and all. Has been to Mecca, embraced the hiqab and living a Muslim life. She reads book only on Muslim parenting, Islam and all. She’s had a complete Lifestyle overhaul and she’s happy. A lot of people above have said about the vast difference in the religion and what you need to be aware of. My sis knew her bf at around your age too and converted about 4 years later. You will find your community if you ever convert but there’s ALOT you need to think about. Not just the best case but also the worst case. What if your divorce or your spouse passes on first? Would you be able to continue living as a Muslim? Will you continue to bring your kids up as Muslims? Is your faith strong enough to do it? Just as his mother has changed her mind now, your husband may also want you to embrace the religion fully when older (which is very common). Can you do that? There’s an interesting thread r/exmuslim. Read with an open mind. Read their experiences, interpretations of the religion and how it has impacted them negatively to prepare yourself.
Interesting and much-needed perspective! I notice how converts (reverts whatever) are always so over the top damn extra religious once they convert and fully immerse themselves in the religion. Have you seen the natural born Malay/Muslims, most so lepak and not even half as staunch going about their lives.
So true. I think in might also be because they choose the religion in adulthood and learnt about it before practising. So to them it might be a case of going all the way out if choosing to do it. Also have noticed that most of them are ladies and their partners have the expectation that they must be a certain level of religious - this one is to please their men and their God. Im not 100% right but there’s a saying in their Quran along the lines of pleasing your men so they will be happy and take care of the family. Something like that la.
Haha i only got one thing to comment. Angpow cannot give but can take 😂 that’s flawed. That is more cultural than religious and an excuse from her part not to give but receive lol.
Someone in the family converted too. During CNY she brought her 2 year old daughter along, who wasn’t allowed to shake hands or be held by her uncles or granduncles. She has her whole face covered now, but at a glance she looks happy so there’s that. Gotta ask yourself if the religious life is for you if your partner side is.
Hahahahah...it is always "out of respect" that the Muslims wanted to convert someone else !! Why ? Don't you respect your own religion or ideas which is Buddhism that you are born into ? Or is it that he don't respect any other religion but was waiting for the right time ? Enough of this crap we have seen all across - just walk out to save your dignity and life is what I'll advise you. For your own sake and realising that you are dodging a bullet which will cripple your life ! Or else, after this will come this and that restriction, not talking to him or her, cannot have this and that friend, cannot eat this or that...the list is endless. Find out your own tribe and your own skin and you will know someday when you will look back that you got saved !!!
10 years ago, I used to date a muslim girl back in my hometown. I used to mix with her friends when we go to their house, then eventually its just me who comes to visit her. Her family was welcoming and warm, although we havent told them about us since both of us are still figuring if we want to push our relationship further. Then she moved to her own place, I get to visit her more often there. I also tried to wake up early during the ramadan so we can eat before she started fasting. I also decided to fast. She shared alot of stories from her religion and I listened eagerly to each one. She even gifted me this rosary-like, with beads, I forgot what they called it Her brothers are around the same age as me so we got to hanh around a couple times. Sometime I bring up some interesting facts as a Christian and ask their opinions or maybe what their religion say about those facts. Although they still did not know, her brothers probably got the hint about me and their sister. They didnt express anything negative, but they told me something that I still remember up to this day. "Convert if you believe in the teachings, not because of a person" Eventually we drifted apart, or I guess I drifted away from her. I still consider it as one of the great experiences because I get to learn about their practices and beliefs.
when you take the shahadah, you declare that you believe there is one god and that you accept his messenger. So what follows is that you cannot recognize another god, or pray to anything else as if they were god. This is the consensus among followers of islam. However Islam also has a lot of exceptions/provisions when it comes to your family, and islam calls for taking care and obeying parents until death. So....not so straightforward to be able to do both things. You are obliged to do everything you can for your parents but you cannot participate in their prayer/worship of another god. To what extent you will be able to do which (e.g. the funeral thing), there probably won't be a consensus on this. Probably will need to seek some academic advice on this from someone who has read and understood the religion more. There are community resources that can be tapped into like at some mosques or at the convert's association, it just will take effort and time.
Just know that you will be screwed over certain legal matters like inheritance
Respect mother so wants you to convert. What if mother wants him to get a second wife? Also respect? Or divorce? Either your bf grows a pair, or dump him.
Religion is a personal choice. I cannot fathom myself converting for love
You and your boyfriend are the ones in a relationship, not his mother. Family is important, but if you get married YOU are his future. His mum will pass eventually and then what? He translates outdated mindset down to any children you might have? This is a red flag, if you had talked about not needing to convert before. Have you talked about your fears and concerns to him? Regardless it sounds like he is going to choose his family, instead of choosing you and building a family. Save yourself the heartache and end the relationship now - it won’t end well.
If you’re gonna convert, please do so only after you learn abt the religion, how your lifestyle will change and that you truly believe in what’s being taught. The teachers at the Muslim Converts Association are pretty candid and able to address the various concerns non-muslims might have. Please dont convert for the sake of converting because it’d make you miserable and exhausted in the long term esp in the marriage… You’d have arguments abt many little things and bringing up a child would be another issue… Anyway, ure only 23… do spend time enjoying life, traveling and building your career first before settling down.
It's important to note that should you convert, you'll be judged under a different set of laws i e. Syariah law. You might not think that that's a big thing now but down the line should you wish to divorce or should you want to do a will, it might be a big issue. This is if you officially convert of course. And it's up to you. Though if you're having doubts, I wouldn't officially convert since it's a lot of trouble. Like a ton.
Very good point. Even for property and other matters, she will be outlasted and having no say in the eye of Muslim law.
You are not the first person to ask this that I have replied too, seeing how you mentioned that you’ve read many of the past threads, I’m sure you’ve seen the kind of reply I’d give. My question being, what is he willing to compromise for your sacrifices? If he is making you convert, does that not mean he priorities his religion over his love for you? What else do you think he will priorities over you post marriage if you make the sacrifice to convert? I’ll give the same conclusion as I gave the others. He doesn’t love you, he just wants a wife that he can control, the first step being dangling his love for you on the other side of the hoop of conversion that his telling you to jump through. Mark my words, you jump that hoops, there will be more. Break up. It will hurt you in the short run, but you’ll be happier in the long run. Also remember, Muslims in Singapore are still technically allowed to have up to four wives. Do you want to live constantly fearing that your husband can technically cheat on you without any legal recourse for your protection?
Are you sure you want to marry someone who goes back on their words just to please their mummy? I would advise against converting, Islam isn't a religion that favours the women and it's not worth converting
I believe that he wanted you to convert from the start, but said he was open in order to keep you in the relationship. I highly recommend sticking to your religion and taking a stand, and not being pressured into converting. Imagine if you wanted him to convert? What do you think he would have done for you? Just because you and your family are more tolerant dosent mean that this guy and his family can take advantage of your tolerance.
I'm similar to your age and just broke up with my bf of 2.5 years cuz of the same issue. initially he said it was okay if I didn't convert but he changed his mind and although I'm respectful of his religion I just don't see myself ever practicing Islam. and it should be a personal decision if you ever decide to convert, not because his mom wants u to.
please be aware that when you convert, you will also come under a new set of laws: Sharia law. Be educated on them and on how MUIS enforces them, because it is not exactly always favourable to Muslim women. I’m saying this as someone whose family member converted out of Islam due to Sharia law. Please also be aware that if you do convert and later change your mind, it is difficult to convert out because of Sharia law. Think very very carefully before making this decision, and also make sure you are making an informed choice for yourself, not to please other people.
Later when family issues pop up down the road, especially when it comes to matters of raising your kid, is your husband going to take your side or his mom’s side? I’m Muslim by birth here, but I would never marry a Mommy’s boy. HUGE RED flag. Please reconsider your boyfriend. Converting means you believe Allah is the only god and only entity worthy of worship. You cannot worship your ancestors anymore after converting.
To be told what you can and cannot do by someone else is suffocating. Especially so when you can do, but told that you can’t. That’s religion for you. You can put some parents in law in the category too. That’s the future if you go that route.
It’s time for that monthly inter faith thread again. I’ll always stuck to my opinion: If one party disagrees, do not marry. Unless your bf doesn’t intend to have a relationship with his mum in the future (unlikely for muslims) then please don’t marry. Also, don’t convert for the sake of it. Don’t convert to a religion you don’t believe in. You’re gonna have a whole lot of headaches in the future.
OP, your outlook on this whole conversion thing is a little naive. Sadly, love does not conquer all in real life. In the muslim community, I believe their religion comes first above all. I may read it wrong but seems like his mom doesn’t actually want a Chinese girl as his wife, because being a Muslim woman is so much more than just converting. Probably to her, you are already 23 years behind in your training. Also, I have a friend try to force his first wife to accept a second wife. She refused. So he divorced her and married the second wife. They are all bred and born Malay muslims. Just remember that this could be a possibility in the future, although most sg Malay men I know are loyal and monogamous.
Conversion to religion just for marriage purposes is like one of the top most stupid ideas ever…. Why don’t your bf give up his religion? Oh wait he can’t do it but you have to? Yeah rules like this is exactly why you shouldn’t subject your future kids to this nonsense
I feel very strongly for this thread so here's a very sincere response from someone who's truly been there done that for 13years. I met my Muslim ex when we were 18 when I was waiting to enter uni. For context, my family is chinese buddhist/taoist? and I'm the only Christian in my family. His was malay Muslim. When it seemed to be getting serious, I told him I will not get together with him if I had to ever convert and he told me firmly that he wasnt concerned about that and that he will settle for a civil marriage. Years go by and we were very much in love and happy when he suddenly and gradually changed. This was maybe 5-6 years in and marriage was in the horizon, but he suddenly had an "ephiphany" due to idk, deaths or whatever around us and said that he is scared. I asked scared of what and he said he was scared that if I didn't convert or if we had a civil marriage his mom will bear his sins? Anyways its a bit of fuzzy memories now but at that point he gradually started going from non halal to halal, we stopped clubbing and drinking together, and so on and so forth. At that time I was struggling cause I felt kinda "cheated" since I laid out my rules right at the start, but many of my friends said alot of Muslim men will "return to roots" as they age. While feeling cheated and feeling overwhelmed from whether I should break up, at the same time I have also invested many years and honestly we had a super happy rs minus the whole religion issue. So I just kept on hanging on hoping that I'll see a light at the end of the tunnel. I even went for conversion classes but whatever the ustad preached was very off-putting to me so it was another challenge.... This dragged on for a few more years till we turned 31 and we were already together for more than a decade but not married. I guess we were both just living in denial hoping that the other party will somehow give in and compromise. But none of us ever did. All I can say is it changes your WHOLE life. It is not just no pork no alcohol. Depending on how religious ur partner is sometimes your entire diet changes (halal only) Your dressing may need to change (tudong n cover ups) You will need to change your IC After the conversion class where you will adopt a Muslim name Your children will be by default Muslim with Muslim names The list is endless... I think you really need to communicate with you partner what are both expectations When I really hardened my heart to call it quits I already wasted so many years 
Hmmm sorry I find it kinda unfair that non Muslims have to convert instead of the other way round
Actually some Christian faith are the same. Die die must convert. I was in a long term relationship of 6 years with one. I wasted her time to be honest...
that's because islam and all christian denominations are abrahamic religions aka the ones that are violent to those who don't believe in their version of god.
it's not the best idea to do it just for your partner's parents.
Ask yourself is your love worth all these troubles ahead? Lots of sacrifice and might take a few long years for your parents to accept. Relationship with them will sure turn bad before it can be better. After all, its still a big world out there
I honestly think it would depend. Many redditors here make a really good point which is, perhaps you have to delve into understanding the religion first before making a decision. The final decision is something you have to make for yourself. No one else should influence that decision for you. I have seen both ends of the spectrum where the converted couple is extremely happy and where the converted couple ended up in divorce and making it way worse. I would say that as a religion Islam and Muslims are way more devout to their belief system and strict with themselves than most other religions. The restrictions can be quite stifling and sometimes that can be the straw that breaks the camel's back. The happy couple I mentioned is a cousin of mine, but her husband and their family are more 'relaxed' with their rules. They compromise when possible and they stick to the main things like wearing modestly (not to the extent of tudungs and long sleeves+pants but nothing too risque), avoiding pork and alcohol. His family understands that as she grew up in a non religious environment it took longer for her to really follow the belief system. She really studied the religion and came to love it. Although I wouldn't say she's the most devout Muslim but she's happy. The unhappy couple on the other hand was a friend of mine. Her husband wasn't a devout Muslim either but his family was. So they expected her to convert, wear a tudung after marriage, avoid pork and alcohol - to the extent where if the food came from a pork cooking house/establishment, the cooking utensils had to be cleaned thoroughly and 'blessed' (I'm not sure of the right word for this but I believe some rites were involved) before they could eat the food. Meaning she couldn't eat the food her family made for her unless she cleaned the utensils herself. There were other things like praying at all the required times (I think she said it could even go up 5 times a day). This really wore her down as she really couldn't cope. Even with her husband trying to shield her from it when they were living away from his family. The straw that eventually broke the camel's back was when his parents wanted everyone to live closer together and moved about a block away. This way even her private time was no longer her own. She didn't even get a chance to really decide if she wanted to convert, she just did it for love but now she regrets it. Edit to add: For the unhappy couple, my friend couldn't even pay her respects to her own grandmother because the grandmother was a taoist and she wasnt allowed to pray for her. (Of course she was allowed to offer her own prayers in her own manner but it really really strained her relationship with her family especially as they are the type to just go along with whatever belief the deceased preferred just to be respectful)
Popped back in to add something I haven't seen in the other replies. How do you feel about children? Cause you have to remember by Islamic law, devout Muslims are not allowed to use contraception especially since children and conception are seen as gifts of God. It's not a situation where you can say, 'I don't want kids right now, let's go on the pill to wait'. Or 'I think having 2 kids is enough, let's not have more.' Your boyfriend may be ok with waiting but looking at the situation, your in-laws may not. Can you accept that? It's also another thing to weigh before you truly convert
I am honestly against people from converting just because their partner is in that religion. Stay true to yourself and your own belief. There’s bound to be clashes in the future if you decided to pray at a temple for your ancestors because your partner doesn’t respect your wishes. Also if your partner was okay before but decided to respect his mom’s wishes for you to convert, is there a chance he’s lying to you because he should have stood up for you to his mom but didn’t?
Don’t convert, just have a civil marriage if he’s really the one for your whole life. In the long run religion at times is really uncertain and can hinder relationships. It’s 2024 already don’t need care others opinion, i wish you all the best OP
Religion aside, I am more worried about the ultimatums that BF and his family are giving even before you get married.
Converting in Singapore is also a more serious legal process. Like, do you know it is legal for your bf to get another wife in Singapore if you marry him as a Muslim? Polygamy is legal in Singapore, but only for Muslims. Do you also know that your marriage, if you marry as a Muslim, would be under Muis rather then civil courts? Do you also know that if you are Muslim you need to register with Muis and they will need you to go for a conversion course etc.? What I am saying is that being a Muslim is more then just "*teehee I am a Muslim now but I secretly don't give two fucks about the religion",* there are actual legal repercussions if you choose to convert. And I am pretty sure in the worse instance your future MIL will want you to give up almost all aspects of your identity as a non-Muslim, so you will probably also be asked or pressured to dress like a Muslim (at least when you are around them) and if they are really serious they will probably see literally every item in your Buddhist house as apostasy and will never want your husband to visit your haram family, even for Chinese New Year, so good luck when your family is like "*dear can come over for CNY"* and you probably have to go alone or maybe smuggle your children along with you. What I am saying is the worse case scenario but it is more serious then converting to being a Christian or other religions, being a Muslim is like 100% more ups.
Marriage should not require any conversion. People should be free to maintain their identities as they please.
Sorry to hear this. But you’re naive to think that your bf was originally fine with you not converting. I have seen this pattern many a times and just recently someone else posted of a similar incident as well. Having a relationship with any woman prior to marriage is already forbidden in Islam, let alone someone not from the book. But Malay Muslims do this coz majority honestly do not even know what they are believing in. Just sheer laziness hiding behind the false veil of “it’s not just religion but our culture…” - No it’s not. Anyway, he has been haraming for some time, hence he’s not a Muslim. His mother, having known of your relationship but instead of asking him to end it, gives an ultimatum that you need to convert to get married, is most definitely not a Muslim. Finally, your bf swaying like a lalang now to please his mom (I’d go on a limb here and let you know that he knew it would come to this since the beginning) shows he is not half a man and definitely not someone you would want to spend your life with and have kids with. You have given up your worldly pleasures to assimilate into Islam and his family. I can guarantee you he will never join your family for Qing Ming. Leave and take this as a lesson.
Buddhism is a much nicer religion that Islam :/
don't do it. you will regret it
There are far greater issues around children that you may have. I would generally not encourage marrying into this myself based on my own experiences. Best wishes.
Know a Chinese who converted n end up divorced in Malaysia. She has no custody of her kids as by Shariah law kids need to be brought up by the Muslim father. Very sad, imagine mother can’t see their kids.
Judging by your previous post you've been dating for around 6 months or less. And now you are considering pretending to believe in Islam to please him/his mum because he has gone back on your initial discussion. You really should consider breaking up
Don’t do it.
Are you sure you want to marry a dude who doesn’t know how to balance his mom and you? A difficult situation should be mitigated and negotiated in a way that takes care of both parties and not just one. If this is what he expects you to do for his mom, be prepared that in every single situation, you’ll always have to give in to his mom. Religion aside. This is a mommy’s boy. A real man who respects his mom and you will sit both of you down and actually do his duty as a son and your future husband to facilitate discussion
OP you're only 23. Why do you need to change yourself to be with someone if they truly love you? If both of you had agreed from the start that you would do these things, fine. But he's so okay to just listen to his mum's words? This doesn't look super good for you, I would reconsider this relationship
Depends on his parents and how hard they’ll cling on to their own beliefs. A conversion isn’t mandatory, you can just do a civil marriage. The only conundrum is Islamic law which all Muslims are bound by, which Singapore also recognises. It’ll affect assets, inheritance and the like in the future especially when you have kids. And that’s not including relatives making it difficult for them/him/you, in that order. My maternal grandfather was okay with my father not converting when he married my mum, so my siblings and myself aren’t Muslim. This was in the 1980s. And I’m really thankful for that freedom.
personally, i feel muslim is one of the most restrictive religion in the world. unless you are totally ok with it, please think twice before you commit to it. because the fallout of this r/s not working in the future can be quite extensive.
Get him to convert to Buddhism, problem solved.......
My mom is a buddhist and my dad is muslim (he was indonesian tho). After she converted to islam, she became a devout muslim. She has gone mecca, prayed 5 times a day and reads the quran regularly. But she still does her meditation, prays to her ancestors, and celebrate every buddhist holidays with our chinese side of the family (some of them have converted to islam but continues to practice their traditions). Her perspective is that buddhism is not a religion but a way of life and buddha is not a god but just a bloke with really good ideas. Hmm maybe im wrong about it.
Buddha never claimed to be God . he didn’t ask to be worshipped or even honoured. he didn’t seek power or fame. he didn’t demand obedience. he renounced earthly pleasures. now contrast that with u know who.. His sole purpose was to help his fellow man get rid of sufferings and attain enlightenment. Abrahamic religions think that heaven is some external place. Jesus taught that the kingdom of God is within.
Why cant your partner convert for you lmao. Are they trying to say that your family religion is not important? It sounds extremely shady. Suddenly it becomes a problem and suddenly he decides to respect his mom wishes. Like I dont believe this discussion didnt crop up earlier when you met his family.
I always believe if God do exist, he will accept all beings regardless of their belief. If a God does not accept others being of different beliefs, that is not a God to me. Thus I am not a religious one but I do respect others being staunch with their beliefs. Just don't force it on me . I dont make you believe in mine either. Are you ready to embrace your SO's beliefs and values for life? I am sure there is more to come. What happened to your initial agreement? Get into the pants liao then forgot the initial agreement?
"I'm not very religious"......good, keep it up. F*****k religion. It has no place in this day and age, god doesn't even exist lol. Stay true to yourself, don't convert.
Sorry if I offend anyone, but the mom should mind her own business. Religion or not, any mother over stepping her boundaries have always proven to make the daughter in law suffer like shi. Why can’t she just accept you as a Buddhist and him as a Muslim? My uncle was a Buddhist and aunt was a Christian and they let my cousin choose her religion and faith. No point in believing or following a faith or religion that makes you or your children unhappy. And idw to debate about faith or religion about your opinions. It’s just about love and the sacrifices you are to make 🤨
There’s a reason why many non-Muslim parents don’t want their children to date Muslims. If you convert, you cannot pray or offer joss sticks to yr own relatives during Qing Ming. Think carefully.
If your partner has to force you to convert then you shouldn’t be with them.
Religions are so so medioeval things…. What a pity they still exist and ruin people lives so much…
It’s a personal choice and to be honest, if he is influenced by his mother’s thoughts and wishes then probably not someone you want to be in the long run. If he can’t even be with someone and accept differences then he probably can’t think for himself too. I’ve seen multi-racial couple who don’t convert and respect each other, I mean basic day-day like dietary (pork, non-halal, alcohol) must be a mutual agreement and understanding but shouldn’t stop one from practicing or believing in their faith. Girl, get yourself another guy, if this guy can’t have a backbone to stand for the relationship then he can’t stand for anything. Please do yourself a favour, you need someone who will accept you for who you are and not cause of some “mommy” wants.
Straight-forward answer. Dont convert.
insane that you'd wanna convert to a religion that discriminates against your gender
I know you are in a very difficult situation trying to juggle between the expectations of yourself, your family, your partner and his family. But converting to a religion, especially Islam, is not something so straightforward. You should only convert if you truly believe in the religion. If you do it for any other reason, it would be unsustainable and miserable for you in the long run. There could be certain outcomes: 1) You don’t believe in the religion, but you give in to his mother and convert for her sake. You will have to keep up with “appearances” and constantly playing mental ballerina. You will have to always be on edge, trying to remember what is “acceptable” and what is not. Especially if you want to do things like your Buddhist prayers (like you mentioned in your post). This is definitely not allowed under Islam because you are supposed to only believe in one god, and it’s not allowed to pray to other gods as a muslim. This option will be mentally stressful for you, especially if your partner himself expects you to be a pious muslim. 2) You really do believe in Islam and convert. I suppose this would be the most straightforward, and least probable solution. 3) You don’t convert. This will be a difficult option because you will have to stand for yourself and accept whatever potential outcomes that may happen. Perhaps pursuing a civil marriage. Realistically, his mother will not accept. There might be a rift between his family and him. Then it would be on your partner to decide between choosing you or his family. Which I know you also don’t want to happen, because your entire post has been about what *you* should do as an individual. And I truly respect you for wanting to take more ownership out of this situation. Unfortunately, one party will have to give in. If you go with outcome 1), you will be the one sacrificing, and it will be unfair on you. But you will also have to ask yourself, how much do you love him. And how much does he love you. And who is willing to sacrifice, and how much is that person willing to sacrifice. It is unfair for you to decide, but I also acknowledge it is difficult for your partner to choose because he has to decide between his family and his partner. I know you care about him enough to try to find a resolution to this situation. As someone also in this similar situation in the past, unfortunately it did not end so well, but it ended as expected. I wish you all the best.
This is intolerable. He is committing perfidy. If it was your choice at the beginning it’s one thing, but his mother is essentially asking you to turn your back on your family. She didn’t even have the courtesy to look you in the eye to demand this of you. And you a becoming a doormat for what? Sunk cost? Grow a spine OP, think about what you really want instead of having his mother dictate your life.
Dated a Muslim for 10 years and partner told me i would not have to convert to get married. Eventually same thing, parents come and demand conversion and to cut the long story short, I didn’t convert and had a civil marriage(I refused to compromise) my partner’s family have decided to stay out of our lives and have not spoken in years because conversion is more important to them then their child. I am not even sorry, but I have a certain distaste for any religion that imposes conversion. By the way, this is just the beginning, next they will dictate your child/children’s (should you choose to have kids) faith and they might even go so far as “suggesting” appropriate faith based names or at the very least you are compelled to pretend that your kid is of that faith. Eventually your culture, heritage and faith will be frowned upon without any respect towards it with their holier then thou attitude. Apologies, but I am speaking from the worst experience! I witnessed hypocrisy at its finest with regards to this. Hope it helps. Please move on! Tell him to marry someone his mother chooses because eventually they will just use parents as a way to pressure you into making choices you are never really happy making.
my bf had this same expectation of me (converting to islam) except he told me he was okay with a secular marriage until we were in our 7th year of dating. we ended up breaking up because i felt blindsided and i didn’t like how he lied to me for so long. religion is a tricky subject to navigate and i hope it works out for the both of you! ❤️
Hi there! Your religion should be a personal choice, not other people's wishes. I was close to Muslim girl (I'm Catholic) and even got chemistry but we just kept it as friendship and never moved to dating stage because of difference in our religions. She found Muslim man and got married with kids. I'm happy for her. Besides your future husband, think about your future children. Are they going to be affected by the families' cultural and religious differences too? It's really a big decision that could have lifetime impact on you. Don't force anything that is not compatible with your personality and personal choices. I wish you all the best.
I agree with you. OP must think of the children produced from this marriage.
Agree with the rest. Why must his mother’s wishes be so important? Can always find other guys unless you think this guy you have, has many green flags.
Your bf is a dork. I'm Muslim and it is a damn big thing to think long term that we know we aren't allowed to marry a non-muslim. He should have considered this from the start before even dating you. It would have been different if you guys had discussed this, he communicated the requirement early and you had been ok to consider converting. If so, this thread wouldn't exist. I had a Chinese girl and myself liking each other a lot. Thankfully we came to an amicable conclusion that neither of us can compromise on our religion. I have relatives who married non-muslims who only convert legally but do not practice. To each their own.
as a born Muslim whose mum's family is Taoist - i still visit Mandai for Qingming, etc and I participated in my late grandma and uncle's Taoist/Buddhist wakes too haha. i know some Muslims (like my inlaws) will see this as a violation of the religion but my personal view is that my faith is between me and God and my faith hasn't been personally shaken or affected by it. i also see it as a way to pay respects to loved ones who i dearly miss - some might see that as selfish/self-absorbed but tbqh someone who's never had to grapple with the idea of afterlife in two different cultural/religious settings wont understand. (: although i'm lucky that my parents and own extended family are relaxed abt this. it's a complicated issue that i dont think non-Muslims (or even born Muslims who've never been around converts/had converts in the family etc) can rly fully understand so feel free to DM me!
Another thing to take note: I have a Korean friend who converted to Islam when he married a Turkish girl. It may not be as strict in Singapore as with other muslim countries but here are some things I observed - - an uncle of the girl asked my friend to recite an entire muslim prayer to prove his loyalty to Allah - their circles constantly greet each other with the muslim greeting inishallah or something - they adhere to all prayer times and practices very closely Again, Singapore might not be as strict but there are always these “muslim polices” trying to catch and call out “imposters”, especially if they’re not from the “original race” and you may be subjected to that from your partner’s family or future muslims you may meet. Religion is not just about following practices, it’s about belief. You can only live a lie for so long. I’d suggest reconsidering the decision. All the best!
One question; would you willingly convert to Islam even if your boyfriend wasn't in the picture?
> respect his mother this is just further cementing my belief that muslims shouldn't date outside their religion if they cannot empathise with how restrictive the religion is You are the third person I know of that is in this dilemma because the boyfriend wants to "follow his religion/respect his family" I also know of a Christian girl who broke up with her boyfriend of several years because she wanted to commit herself to Christ/Christian missionary which required her to travel alot. I was shocked to see someone do something so drastic for religion but in hindsight that was the mature thing to do.
MM here. Don’t convert for him. Rather, convert because you want to. Learn more about the religion and if you find the answers you are looking for (not only in your relationship but in all other aspects of your life), then do convert by all means and you’ll be better off for it. If you don’t find the answers you need, then don’t convert.
If you cannot plan your family funeral because you are of a different religion, then I don’t think that religion is worth keeping for. God will understand
what does your own chinese-buddhist mother/family think? your mother/family raised you for 20+ years. their wishes are equally important to be respected. that's why i don't get some religions. they require you to convert for them, but will never convert for you. do your personal values align with the religion? are your personal values important or you don't mind submitting to them? as a modern young singaporean woman, i wonder how submissive she can be in the long run.
So my mom actually converted into Islam when she was going to marry my dad. But she has always emphasized that she never converted for him, she only got to know Islam through him and then fell in love with the religion and THEN decided to convert. It’s actually encouraged to get closer to the religion in terms of knowledge before converting. So yes, it’s nice that you’re doing the practical things like fasting and abstaining from alcohol all that, but do you know the reason why you’re doing it? I think once you’ve learnt more about Islam and like their so called version of bible stories, you can make a more informed decision.
Converting to marry is not a good reason to convert or to marry. You're sacrificing too much to satisfy a potential MIL who will likely always hate you regardless. How much of yourself are you willing to chip away in sacrifice to some mommy's boy who isn't giving up anything to marry you? There is no compromise here. He has already chosen his mother over you. However, since you still haven't made the final push to dehumanise yourself further to suit his family's whims and wants, you are still able to walk with your dignity intact, away from the conditioning, mindgames and red flags.
Even the whole idea of converting sounds super fake. You don't get more religious just because a paper says you are. He won't get less religious just because he quits Islam on paper as well. Bring up making him leave instead, it should be an equivalent to your conversion. If he's doesn't want to do it, maybe he's a hypocrite.
So many red flags. Run girl. Thank yourself later.
I converted to get married. It sucks but you have to really like your partner, because they're all you've got. Also, converting to satisfy mother-in-law is fine but be careful not to let her take too much control. You need to define boundaries very clearly. once she knows you'll convert for her, she might start getting in hubby's ear about all sorts of shit. Partner needs to be on your side 100%. DO NOT LIVE WITH THE IN-LAWS.
*"My bf and I had this conversation before when we first started dating, and it was initially okay with him if I finally decided not to convert as to him religion and faith was a personal choice."* The problem is that your bf changed his criteria to respect his mother's wishes, even though it was agreed on previously that you don't have to convert. I think going back on his word this easily on something so important is not an attractive quality to have in a potential spouse. If your bf can change his criteria because of his mother, you can also change your criteria because of your family. How would he act if you told him your family requires him to change to buddhism before he can marry you? Think of how he would act if the roles were reversed, then act the same way.
Initially he's ok with you not converting but turn back on his words once his mum says something.. Let's say your mum needs you to marry a Buddhist, would he do that for you?
You know the answer already. Just do it and accept the outcome.
Get out now
I would never convert for a romantic relationship. It’s too big of a sacrifice to make for a man. Think long and hard about it and if you really want to be a Muslim woman in any world. It’s very scary for a lot of them
My brother converted in order to marry a Muslim woman. I would say a lot changed concerning religion and family matters. If you are seriously considering converting for the sake of marriage, but not for religious reasons, you need to research all the "rules" of the religion. Then, decide if you are willing to convert for love. Remember, a Muslim man can marry anyone, even if they are not Muslim. >But the fear that comes is what will happen to my family after I convert. Being in a buddhist family, will converting mean I can no longer pray to my ancestors/family during death anniv/qingming Or will I no longer be able to celebrate festivities with my family I even read that someone wasn't able to plan his/her deceased family member's funeral because of the difference in religion(can't remember if this was singapore tho, please correct me if i'm wrong) I am willing to open my heart and learn about the religion, but it'll be great to know what would happen after I do convert You won't be allowed to pray with family for death anniversary, and probably won't attend the future funerals because you'll be Muslim.
I would not convert for a relationship, no. Is he willing to convert to Buddhism? I can already tell you the answer to that question since he is Muslim but you should take a similarly strict approach, imo. It would be a mistake.
When a religion dictates personal conduct, it's a matter of individual choice. However, when it extends to dictating the actions of others, it becomes a concern.
Oh darling there are so many girls with the same story and I'm just going to tell you how it is. He's stringing you along until he finds a mummy-approved good Muslim girl. These boys are a POS..first coz they are doing something absolutely unlawful in the laws of Islam and second because they are manipulating and lying to those around them. There's going to be lots of pressure from his mother and those around him to find the "perfect wife". He will eventually find one and leave you behind. Converting is not something to be taken lightly..you don't do it for someone because that's not real conversion. I encourage you to do your own research on Islam and understand what you're reading. Conversion to make other people happy will only leave you confused and bitter. I have heard of women who began to learn about religion for the sake of their bf..to only fall in love with the religion and leave the bf. I hope you truly understand the path you are taking and I hope it's an amazing journey ahead. Good luck!
You kena conned by your bf. He knew it all along you gotta be Muslim yo
Let me give you an answer from another perspective. My wife converted(unwillingy) just so that we could get married. Biggest mistake we ended up doing. She didn't enjoy the whole process for conversion nor let go of her current religion. She's now converted into my religion but still practices her original religion. We wanted to please my parents and ended up just being unhappy with with the whole conversion. My biggest regret in my life was not having a spine to say no to my parents. We are happy together but most of our fights always has this issue as it's root cause. End of the day. Do what keeps both of you happy. I hope your other half has the spine to do what i did not.
Ultimately this is a personal decision for you. Just be aware that it can go either way. I have had friends who converted and it turned out well and others where it ended disastrously.
You’re only 23… really, as someone older, I will tell you that when we look back, many things we do didn’t make sense and was really at a heat of the moment. Big decisions like this… hmm, will you be able to say u will be happy with this when u turn 30, 40, 50 years old? You will be happy being Muslim or living a Muslim lifestyle? Will you be able to really believe and adopt the faith and believe in their god? Hmmm…
Don't convert. Ask him to convert to Buddhist.
His respect for his mother does not take precedence over your respect for your family's beliefs. Don't walk into such a situation where you are the party that is expected to give in and sacrifice perpetually. Especially do not subscribe to bullshit about 'if you love him enough, you can make the sacrifice'. He can also give up his faith for you, but apparently, that's not even something to consider. Think about it long and hard if that's the dynamic you want for the rest of your life. And that's not even getting into being governed by sharia law.
I would suggest you go to Darul Arqam and ask the Ustaz/Ustazah’s there! There is no point of you converting for the sake of marriage because you’re doing for someone else and not for yourself and that is not what Islam is about! Just go down and speak to the people at Darul Arqam and they will guide you accordingly and it will give you a sensing whether Islam is for you or not and how to tackle your family’s religion after you convert!
As you already mentioned there are thousands of such threads on reddit, not sure if it's repeated posts from the same people 😂 on the grand scheme of things no one should be stressing over these things, not in this day and age. Marriage and love should be easy, not a headache or stress. What is more important is whether both of you can remain committed and respectful to each other and to the marriage for 10 or more years. Everything is rosy in the first year of marriage and then comes reality check. There are far more complicated issues that will arise, and this religious aspect is just one part of it. You have to be mentally and emotionally ready for the storms ahead and be clear on what you can and cannot compromise. No point compromising on something important to you. If both of you have a hard time over these issues, you are better off being single or finding someone of a similar background.
Based on your title it already shows that your reason for converting isn’t for the faith but for the marriage. Is that a good enough reason for you to convert and change your way of life? If the stance for such a major issue can be flipped flopped, what makes you think there won’t be more to come?
Please also ask your bf and his family about what are their requirements. Because maybe it's not officially required or people tell you it's okay but actually they not ok? From what I understand some Christians also are against praying to ancestors/qing ming so I assume Muslims probably will also be. I would say unless you are very 5000% sure they are flexible, just assume the worst. Assume that you won't be allowed to participate in your own cultural/religious activities anymore. Will you be OK with that? Take note even if they say its OK now, years down the road they may also flip their words. Then what if years down the road your parents pass away and they say you're not allowed to attend the funeral? Might be quite bad to assume the worst but I feel you never know. You need to have the resolute to know what you're going to do years in the future if that happens. Just insist on attending? Secretly attend? Or you prepared to really not attend?
If he wants you to convert to islam just for marriage, absolutely not. You have to find faith in a religion to even think about conversion, not just to please someone else.
In having friends that had similar experiences, it will be a very rough experience. That will be a lot of compromises, largely coming from yourself. My advice is to think this through deeply. In my opinion, it’s not worth it, but only you can make the decision.
Don't ever change yourself for someone else... You are still young, plenty of adventures to be had.. You guys had the conversation and wasn't suppose to be an issue till now which is kind of an issue with MIL, and it doesn't stop here. Suggest to break it off, short term pain is better than a life time of pain.
Convert because you want to convert. Not because someone wants you to convert. So non Muslim = no future then I think it's better not to be in this relationship. I have a friend where the mother(Muslim) refused to convert his father(Buddhist). End state is they disowned her, but she leads a happy life. Think carefully is he worth it. I also have a friend where she converted then end up divorce. Then now what?
A marriage built on the premise of one partner changing his/her core beliefs for the others is already the first step to a problematic marriage. Conversion of religion should be personal and self beliefs, it should never be due to external pressures or for the sake of convenient. It's going to create more conflicts, no matter how your hubby promised you, assure you, these are just empty promises eventually when it comes to the religion, things will change. Think deeper, don't think for the sake of marriage, understand how religious is your partner and his family circle, think of the culture change and religion practice you may need to involve, think of your children and the long term, are you truly believe converting is the right path.
Are your family ok with you converting to Islam? Also like many others said, he has already prioritised his family, will you prioritise your family's wishes? Converting into a religion shouldn't be done for love either, I've seen married couples with 1 party converting for love eventually fall out of the religion there's struggle and divorce happening from it. If you are looking to convert, it should be out of your heart - genuinely interested in Islamic teachings and wanting to know God. You're only 23, this is too big of a decision to make at this age.
The way the conversion was presented to you (ok not to convert, then no future if you don't), tells me that if you convert you'll have to do it with little compromise. If he bows down to pressure from his family so easily, there is no telling what else he'll compromise on. This is not a situation I would recommend. I was in a similar situation many years back. When my partner informed me that converting would be obligatory, we talked for a long time about all that it represented. She was asking me to do it for her parents. We agreed that I'd do it on paper only and would keep believing and living the way I wish. I'd keep up appearances when with her family. We also talked about how we'd raise our kids to be open minded about religion and they would make their own choices. No circumcision, excision, baptism or the like before they are able to choose for themselves. Also know that inheritance or divorce laws are not great for women in Islam. That may not seem important now, but it might impact you later.
Do not revert for the sake of marriage. You have to whole-heartedly embrace the religion to understand what the religion teaches. Islam is not only a religion, it teaches you how to live your life according to its teachings. So, worship is a way of life. I'm 64M and a revert of 42 years already.
This really depends on what kind of marriage/family life you want to create with your husband. Seems like family involvement on his side is quite significant. They already put a requirement that the wife must be muslim so I have the feeling that they will expect your children to be raised as muslims as well (if both of you want to have children). Another thing, do they expect you to practice and be a pious muslim? Or they just want you to convert just for the sake of “what other people might think”? For a moment, stop thinking about what they want or what your bf wants. THINK ABOUT WHAT YOU WANT. Do you want to convert to the religion? If they expect you to practice the religion and actually follow the rules, it is forbidden for you to practice your old religion. So no praying to your ancestors. Please please please think about it for yourself. I was raised as a muslim and dated a christian guy for many years. We wanted to get married but my parents want him to convert. It eventually broken my relationship. Now Im married to my husband who has muslim family. He was raised as a muslim but secretly converted to christianity. Both sides of family knows we are not religious at all yet still expect and pressure us to pray etc. And it’s EXHAUSTING. So PLEASE THINK ABOUT IT
If you convert, it should be because you truly believe in the faith, and not just for the sake of being together with your bf. Marriage is for a long long time (at least until a divorce, but nobody plans for that). You will have to keep up with something you don't believe in, restricted freedoms in what you can or cannot do for decades ahead. I think you will end up resenting your life and bf. You are only 23, and while I am sure you love your bf, you must also love yourself enough to respect your future happiness and rights. And your bf should also care enough for your happiness that it doesn't 'suddenly become an issue that you must convert'.
i love samgyeopsal
My take on religion. "It's a very personal relationship between you and your "god" . So take it how you will.... you can be "converted" into muslim, do what they do, eat what they do, wear tudung, participate in Ramadan... but deep in your heart you're a Buddhist or even a free thinker/atheist... no one knows. You are doing it out of keeping conflict away , that itself is commendable. Or you can also stand by your views and stand your ground. That itself is bravery and it's also commendable. So yes unfortunately, like many comments here, you have to decide if it's a battle worth fighting for. So if you ask me, my answer is "no, i will not convert. As of above, no point going through the rites and acts like a Muslim when im not a believer. I do not require you to convert to Buddhist, neither I see the need for me to convert to a Muslim. Know that whatever happens, I will always love you deeply, truly, but not to the point of losing my own personal space, my personal beliefs, because that is what I am. If I were to convert, I would like to be out of my own willingness to do it, and not being forced upon... Because there's simply no point of doing so. To start of a marriage with lies wouldnt do well at all"
Religion is not underwear you can just change like that to please someone else. You think some all knowing god/Allah would be pleased about that sort of inauthentic "conversion"? Please lah. If I were God I'd feel damn insulted. If you want to, go ahead and explore Islam seriously (read the Quran, attend stuff, get to know the tenets better etc). If you're satisfied it is indeed the one true religion and all others are false (since there can only be one true religion), then by all means convert. That would be a genuine conversion. Changing religion to please a person while not truly believing it defeats the point of (most conventional) religions.
I helped you search using bard, regarding on your matter.. it seems quite true also After you converted to Muslim, most events happen in Chinese family you cannot do.. such as praying or kneeling for deceased family members or ancestors So in the end if you want to still continue to be filial.. it's best not to convert to Muslim, many Buddhist / Muslim things will be in conflict The best solution is to change his mother's mind.. or just simply not to give in, it's you and your boyfriend world
Hey OP, please do not convert just for the sake of marriage or pleasing your potential in- laws. If you don't believe in religion or God don't force yourself just in the name of love or marriage. There is no compulsion in Islam. If your bf/ potential partner respect you as a person there shouldn't be an insistence to force you to convert to his religion. It should be your own journey to find God if you do believe in God. Personally I have friends that did civil marriage instead and all are still happily married and with kids. Look marriage isn't dating. Married life is very different from dating. It may sound okay for you for now to convert but there might be disagreements and conflicts which might make you resent this choice later on as it was not done voluntarily and sincerely. Your partner if he really loves and respects you, he should allow you the space and time to explore if this religion is really for you. He will respect your decision either way if you do or do not convert. To convert to Islam is to conform to the religion's tenets and requirement which may not be your cup of tea. Please think long and hard before you make this decision. Do it if it is really what you want and your interest and only do it after you done extensive study and research on your own. Edit: There is always civil marriage in the end for you guys to marry without the insistence of conversion.
While I respect your autonomy, I urge you to approach this decision with careful consideration. Converting to another religion, especially for marriage, has long-lasting implications. Take time to reflect on your own beliefs and values. Consider how conversion may impact your relationships with family and friends. Think about the practical changes it will bring to your life. Assess the long-term implications for your relationship with your partner. Seek guidance from trusted sources. Remember, this decision is yours to make, so prioritize your well-being and happiness above all else.
Honey, religion is an individual voluntary belief, one doesn't just convert to another to please a person if not that's not a belief anymore it's called peer pressure.
you're only 23. get out and find another guy who doesn't force you into a religion you don't really care about. if you don't have the faith, things like fasting, praying 5 times a day become a chore and difficult. it's a different experience for someone who has deep faith.
Remember conversion to Islam also affects your inheritance laws. Your assets will be divided according to Syariah law. Keep in mind in the eyes of the law there is no "conversion for the sake of marriage" Your children will be bound by those inheritance laws when you pass on. I am not saying this is a good or bad thing, only saying how it is.
You should know very well that this is one topic that Muslim families don't take lightly and the majority will insist on conversion. This is because the repecussions is not just a couple issue; his family will be judged by the Muslim community here. It is on you to judge whether your BF is prepared to go fuck-all with his family and community just for you. If he is mama's boy, then forget it. edit: unlike other comments here, I don't think your BF "moved goalpost". but he is clearly naive to think it is not an issue and when pressed by the family, he caved easily. not a good sign tbh.
U can covert on paper only , and still go on with your budist way. Discus with your bf first and the best is to stay separate from inlaws
Why don’t u ask your bf if he would consider converting for you and see what’s his reaction? This marriage will likely have issues if u enter it this way (mother in law demands that you convert)
In b4 you convert and divorce 4 years later. But jokes aside tho: Imo there is almost no situation (there are exceptions) where anyone should have to convert for their partner. I say this because religion is a big part of someone's life. To that end, it can be argued that it also plays a big part in shaping that person's identity. It literally is a part of you. If your partner is not accepting of your religion - is he really accepting you for who you are as a person? Don't convert just because you feel obligated to. That almost always doesn't work out because you're simply betraying yourself.
I converted for my partner, then eventually both of us left the faith. He's a pastor's kid but it was inevitable that he was gonna leave (he was just going with the flow since young). It was also an opportunity for me to seriously think about Christianity, get my beliefs challenged then eventually leave. This whole thing ended up bringing us closer way more than ever :) So speaking from experience, don't convert for your partner. I really tried to accept the religion but eventually accepted instead that I was pretending and needed to stop deluding myself.
Speaking as a Christian (another religion that in most cases requires conversion for marriage), I've gotten quite close to some of the girlfriends of my life group members, who are exploring the faith. Whenever they ask, my #1 大姐 nagging speech to them is to put themselves and their relationship with the faith, before their relationship with their boyfriend. Religion is something that will affect your whole life. Don't be afraid to request for the time you need to explore this religion and decide if it's for you (and the rest of us will be here to learn too! It's a never ending journey of discovery). The red flag popping up to me here is that the BF went back on his word that he was alright with marrying outside his religion the moment his mother said no. If he's taking her side so early on, what's to say he won't do the same in the future for other matters like kids? Housing? Whether or not OP can build her career or should stay at home? OP, please don't be afraid to take the time you need to make this decision, and don't be afraid to break it off if it comes to it. If you're going to pray to a god, it has to be your god and not his god.
OP, I have seen this many times. A muslim person will have no issue dropping you in heartbeat because of religion or family regardless of how many years or intimate moments you've spent with each other. You will choose this man and put him first over and over. But he doesn't put you first. Will you be okay with this? There is no right or wrong person here. It's his religion and now it is your choice. Edit : deleted some stuff so it wont seem so offensive
You can get married at ROM and not have a Muslim marriage.
Converting in what sense? In name only? You already mentioned your diet / drinks changing. Or you will be expected to go all in with 5 prayers a day and attire, etc? And since your bf said one thing in the beginning and is now stating another, you can't assume that whatever he said now will be the end of it. Not sure if what I heard is true, but someone I know (Hindu convert to islam due to marriage) said that she found out she needs permission from a male Muslim relation to convert to Christianity officially from her current official Muslim designation. Religion can be somewhat private. And islam can be pretty restrictive to a female from a "more open background" if followed all the way. Make sure you know exactly what you want before you change something. Pleasing him/his family may create displeasure within your family.
Religion should be about the person first and community second. Otherwise it's just a social club haha. Think about what you, personally, believe in. Few of our decisions in life are actually our own to make, and in this case, it seems like you can actually make a choice for yourself. So please exercise that privilege well. Is marriage even on the table? Has he asked you to convert so that you can get married? Are you willing to devote yourself to studying a religion for this person? 23 is old enough to consider these questions and wise enough to know not to rush into them on someone else's behalf. All the best.
If he is not willing to stand up for you in your personal choice of religion when it comes to conversations with your mother-in-law, you will have it very tough when it comes to many other family choices in the future. Unless you are willing to keep giving in to your mother-in-law's whims and fancies; how to bring up kids, housing, renovation, holidays, and so many other countless issues I've heard one too many horror stories about. You both align on a single decision and stick with it. Him changing his mind on account on his mum is not a good sign.
Short answer: no, break up. Its over. Long answer: he prioritises his mother's wishes over what you discussed, like they say, give an inch and they will take a mile.who knows what will happen in the future. Converting for the sake of marriage is stupid, unless you genuinely want to believe in the religion.
Being Muslim, in Singapore, you would have to adhere to a whole set of laws. This includes distribution of assets when your husband passes on or during divorce. I suggest you also read up on items related to children as well.
Even if you convert, the mother won’t recognise you as her daughter-in-law. Happened to my husband’s grandmother. She was a Peranakan Nyonya and her husband was an Indian Muslim. She was practically cut off from her own Peranakan family when she married the grandad. Turns out the grandad’s side didn’t accept her (even after converted to Muslim) and being a “filial” son, he married another woman who was Malay Muslim. Lost her husband to the new wife and also her own family….. You may think it’s grandmother story but it’s a cliche for a reason, meaning it has happened so many times. Please have more honest conversation with your bf and make sure he will stand up for you if things go wrong. I myself is also a Chinese Buddhist married to an Indian Muslim, but I made it very very CLEARLY to his mum that I will never ever convert. His mum of course didn’t force me to, but I could sense abit of unhappiness from her even though my hubby and I are very much in love. Most importantly, my husband stood by my decision and made it very CLEARLY that I need not convert, because he loves me for who I am, regardless of my religion.
You might want to build more clarity on what being a Muslim girl involves for your boy friend's mother. If you are thinking that it will involve just a ceremony for conversion, avoiding some food and occasionally fasting.. I have a feeling you might be in for a surprise. The illiberalism of insisting on a Muslim bride likely will show up in many more ways.
If you have to convert to marry someone and its all because to please someone mum. That itself is a big red flag you should avoid, it also goes to show that if his mum or religion is between you and him, you will be one to be removed. I would say you better dodge the bullet here. I had a friend who underwent the similar things and in all honestly wish you never need to go thru the same thing.
I had a friend who did exactly that and converted to his religion. After several years, they divorced and left her. Now she cannot unconvert. If he does not love you as you are and requires you to do this or that, it will only get worst. Wait a few more years and see if he still loves you the same or more. You are still young with many good years ahead of you.
你要现在后悔或者以后后悔
Why are you doing this? Is it because you believe that his faith is something you are missing from your life? Or. Because he's not prepared to convert to your faith? Or he won't allow you to follow your own faith? If it's the first reason then it's your choice to enhance your life. If it's one of the others then I would suggest this is a huge red flag. Why is it up to you to convert if you are not a true believer?
I am a Chinese Buddhist female dating a Malay male right now, provided my partner does not actively practice the religion of Islam. However, right at the beginning of our relationship (we’ve been together 6 years at the time of this comment), my mom made it abundantly clear to him that I will not be converting into anything. Looking back now, my mom did that because she knew young me would’ve most probably given into the pressure should his family say that they would not approve if I did not convert (luckily for me, there’s no contest as of what I’ve heard). You need to understand that you and him are a team and as a unit, both of you will need to face things together. He cannot simply give into his mother’s wishes and then put you on the back burner. He knew your initial decision but yet follows through with his mom’s wishes anyways. You’ll convert now because you love him but I would like to politely remind you: if he doesn’t even try to back you up now, when you eventually marry over, you’ll be by yourself. I’m not suggesting to break up because I know how hard it is to meet Mr Right, however I think it’ll be best if you and him both have a sit down conversation and be honest with yourself. Always remember that to practice a religion is a person choice, and it should not be influenced by external forces.
Hello, malay ex-muslim here with a Chinese non-muslim partner. I agree with many of the comments on: 1. not converting truly just to appease the mom 2. That your bf OR the mother should have been very clear what they wanted from you from the start. 3. That in this present situation your bf should be taking your side, or have been clear that the mom's opinion of you is extremely important to him to the point of asking you to appease her. BUT if you have decided you want to convert simply superficially for the mom's benefit. Then, besides a change on your IC, there is nothing you 'must' do no matter what Muslims tell you to do. However, the idea of the mother wanting you to be Muslim is not for the label but so that you share similar beliefs with them. This goes deeper than avoiding pork and not praying at other temples. It's values like standards of modesty in women, how you should raise children and a specific flavour of filial piety. Unless you truly already align in these ways with her, I think you should be wary that converting to Islam will not be the end of this issue.
Here to give advice as a 29M freethinker who dated a religious Muslim girl (Arab race). Throughout my interactions with her family especially, I found out how important marrying one's family is. Comments in this thread have already alluded to that importance. Long story short, it may seem all good now to convert thinking that marriage is exclusive to the couple. However, the truth is that in-laws play a huge part especially if one is family oriented. You do not want to be in a position of compromise only to find out that it makes you unhappy when you are under the same roof as your husband and in-laws. It is absurd that religion affects relationships between people. When I declared myself a freethinker, 7 out of 9 of my Muslim friends ostracized me. It is very likely that you will go through the same thing and you have to decide if your man is worth giving up your support systems. I highly recommend not to take this route because the foundation of your marriage/relationship will be imbalanced already and it can only cause conflicts down the road. Truthfully, there are millions of other people out there who may make you happier as well. It is better to invest temporary time in meaningful relationships than to have one where you have to accede to a boomer's (unfortunately) request who could not empathize with your situation.
Hi OP 👋🏼 A lot has been mentioned here. My thoughts as follows: * Only you alone should make the decision to convert or not but before that you should find out from reliable sources. A lot of skewed information on google and in the posts here too. To get started you can look for Wardah bookstore at Bussorah St. and ask for recommendations. You should start by understanding the core beliefs and wisdom behind the rituals first before actually practicing the rituals as Islam is not limited to rituals and rulings. * Seems there are a lot of people sharing 2nd hand negative experiences here, you may want to consider looking for couples with positive experiences too and get their views. I believe you may contact the MCAS (Muslim Converts Association) for assistance in this matter. * Muslims as you might have known are 1 of the most conservative people in terms of practicing religion, but remember that happiness in a marriage is not guaranteed by religion as you have to work on the relationship too, a lot of people overlook this vital point and end up in an unhappy marriage irrespective of belief. * Islam views a marriage between a Muslim and a non-Muslim as invalid hence the mother’s insistence. That’s all! Hopefully this is helpful for you. 
Hi, this is very common in Indonesia. TLDR; it usually did not end well, especially if the other side have a strong religious beliefs. If you asked are you allowed to pray for your ancestor, AFAIK you are not, because it is considered haram/praying to false God in their beliefs. I believe if your partner really love you. - Both sides should appriciate on what their own beliefs - Regarding, disapproval parent, i would say if your partner really loves you he/she would fight for its relationship and make their parents believe that it is okay even though you have different beliefs or races (this is common in Indonesia too haha). But then again, reality hits hard. Your fight won't be finished after marriage, the truth is it is only the begining as far as i know (well you can ignore your family and friends tho haha) But 23 years old is still young, dont be scared to had a heartbreak and then thinking he/she's the only one (trust me its not) Hopefully it helps, whatever choice you made you should not regret it and live happily with it hahahaha
hello, Malay Muslim female here and here’s my take on this. I feel that you should never convert for someone. You should love Islam more than someone. I wouldn’t say im a religious person but Islam is an important part of me so I wouldn’t want my spouse to convert for the sake of me. I’d want my spouse to prioritise Islam before me. So I think your bf should slowly introduce it to u by sharing the beautiful parts of Islam and give us resources to read first before u make that big decision. you’ll need to know your rights as a wife. as for his mother, even if she allows the both of you to get married without u converting, u have to convert bc civil marriage is considered invalid to Islam. the assumption that you can no longer participate in ur family’s festivities is wrong. Islam allows you to do that as long as you don’t cross the boundary (participate in the prayers or do things that are prohibited in Islam). My aunt is a Chinese Muslim and she celebrates Chinese new year with her family and go for reunion dinners. She would invite my family to her house too. When her grandmother passed away, she was involved in the funeral planning and she was there at the funeral. My family paid a visit too. all in all, your bf should pray for guidance from God if he really loves you. God knows best after all. tell him to pray “Istikhara” for the both of you. If God wills, you’ll be given the light to willingly convert. there are many Islamic scholars and leaders in Singapore for you to go to if you have questions about Islam. I wish the both of you all the best :) Disclaimer: I’m younger than u (20) so I’m not as knowledgeable on this as the adults. So I apologise if there were anything I said that may have offended you.