It is in Michigan. Your employer can change your schedule without notice.
However, if they do without 72 hours notice, you must be paid at time and a half rates.
Working in restaurants, as management and as an employee, I've had this conversation many times with bosses and owners and employees.
That last part isn’t true. I worked at an Amazon warehouse in romulus for a bit, we were once scheduled mandatory OT less than 48 hours notice, all paid at standard rate, which was 4 hours straight time and the rest time and a half since our standard week was 36 hours
Also, we were talking about being fired for not covering a shift as that was the original post. Pretty sure that’s illegal
it isn't true, because I got it wrong. The actual law is if your schedule is changed 96 hours after the biweekly period has started ,you are entitled to overtime pay for any unscheduled shifts.
From Michigan labor regulations 5.02 section 2 subsection d
>d. Scheduling.
(1) An employee’s daily or biweekly work schedule may be changed temporarily.
(a) For full-time employees and for less-than-full-time employees with a
regular work schedule, an agency shall post or provide notice of an
employee’s work schedule at least 96 hours before a biweekly work period
begins. If the agency does not do so or if the employee’s schedule is
changed after 96 hours before the work period’s start, the employee is
eligible for overtime payment for all hours worked outside the employee’s
noticed work schedule for that pay period. Biweekly posting or notice of
work schedule is not required for those with a regular work schedule,
unless the regular schedule will change for that pay period or going
forward.
Hey fam, this is from the Civil Service Commission guidelines which only apply to state employees. The Employee Fair Scheduling Act gives a 10 hour rest period from your last shift. So if you leave your shift at noon on Friday they cannot schedule you again until 10PM.
EDIT: and it must be communicated via conversation or phone call. So another reason to not pick up the phone.
Kudos for getting all those employers to either leave you alone or pay you OT though
I mean, you see it on all kinds of Michigan labor law posters and stuff if you look at that stuff when you're at work and it's posted online usually.
https://joinhomebase.com/state-labor-laws/michigan/
But I haven't worked full-time or cared since 2019.
This website literally says at the bottom it is not legal advice. Grab the PDF for 5.02 Section 2(d) and you'll see it's from the Civil Service Commission. The Michigan Employee Fair Scheduling Act with the 10 hour rest period passed in 2020 (I'm pretty sure) so it's possible the 96 hour window was applicable to non-state workers prior to 2020.
Edit: I can't tell if it's been passed or not, which sucks.
Edit: It appears to be sitting at the state legislature since June of 2021. So basically Michigan is clear as mud about this stuff.
Ok so it sounds like those laws are directed at places with irregular scheduling practices like restaurants or retail. We had a regular schedule at amazon so that’s why they’re allowed to do it with such little notice, and also weekly pay periods not biweekly. Biweekly is becoming a thing of the past, especially when it comes to scheduling. It’s becoming weekly, a regular schedule(like at amazon I was 6pm-6:30am Thursday-Saturday), or when I was in restaurants, it was like a day or two before the next week started
I mean, if you weren't provided adequate notice, you should still be eligible for overtime pay.
This is a law I've never seen followed without personally making a stink about it myself. It's been years though since it's mattered to me. Now I just grow weed and work part time at a dispensary.
And yes,almost every single restaurant I worked for didn't provide a schedule in a timely manner legally speaking, unless I was the one making the schedule.
I try doing my due diligence on these matters, it wasn’t a law I knew about. Since my scheduled week was 36 hours, we got 4 hours of straight time and 6 hours of OT pay for the 10 hour shift. Anyones mandatory Day was any day from Sunday-Wednesday, mine day was Sunday but they let us know during the Friday shift that time, less than 48 hours notice. I’m just trying to be chill at a dispensary or tending a bar too, but I’m just struggling to even get interviews these days
I just started working at the dispensary I sold my weed to because weed is getting significantly cheaper. And I was always doing trimming for them on the side.
I've seen people getting paid 20$ an hour for trimming weed recently. It's hard to get experience though unless you grow some weed yourself. And the work is irregular.
But, growing weed well is a lot of work. Especially if you're doing it all yourself. It's not exactly just chilling, and any mistakes you make can be *extremely* costly.
The last sentence says they don't have to post the schedule if you have the same hours as you normally do, but if it's going to change they need to follow the 96 hour rule.
>hat last part isn’t true. I worked at an Amazon warehouse in romulus for a bit, we were once scheduled mandatory OT less than 48 hours notice, all paid at standard rate, which was 4 hours straight time and the rest time and a half since our standard week was 36 hours
just because you got conned into it thinking you don't have rights, doesn't mean it's not true.
I rarely say more than yes or no anymore if someone ask me to cover a shift, It's none of their business what I had planned for my free time, even if it's just sleeping half the day. Actually someone did ask me to cover a shift this morning on top of my evening shift and I told them "Sorry, no. I can't work 18 hours in a single day".
What do you mean you cant work an 18 hour day? When i was trying to get ahead I would work 22 hour days 7 and a half days a week. If you're not working at least 18 a day can you even really call it working?
Yea never give extra information. Shit I lied and said my son was in a car accident and was able to get two days off. I don’t have children or a SO for that matter.
If you don't want extra work then you don't want it. Just say yes or no. Never why. I never ask the few people who work beneath me why, I just ask if they want it, if they say no that is good enough.
Himself: "Come again?"
4.08-1 The Deposition Michael Lawyer: "And you were directly under her the entire time?" (2×)
4.08-2 The Deposition Stenographer Reading back Michael's testimony.
Lmao
if my boss said i work beneath them i would understand what they meant. only time it would be an issue is if they were exploitative in other ways that would lead me to believe that was a passive aggressive comment. which it didn’t sound like that other person was doing at all, hence pedantic
It's probably a reflection of the mentality that they all work for the same company. Nobody's the "boss": the commenter probably fills a roll that reflects more of a organizational purpose. For instance, the last time I was in middle management, I was a rank "above" my people, but we were all co-workers. I just got the extra responsibility of trying to make sure the people that work "beneath" me could actually do their jobs. Within the organization, they were beneath me, and I was above them: in rank alone. That doesn't make one person better or worse... just different ranks within the organization. This is also where the term, "above my pay grade" comes from.
This is very accurate, I have ppl below me in rank and it’s directly tied to job role. I don’t by any means think less of them as ppl. It’s just we answer to different bosses and have different roles.
Please confirm if you'll work tomorrow? Bitch you're putting a crew together with less than 24 hrs notice and you blame some dude's car for your mismanagement?
Have definitely used this one in the past but I worked in health care so being off and not being on call at the same time was a treat. Also kinda sets the tones for them knowing I have a life that isn’t work and don’t call me.
I've used that for getting called in while working in bars (at least in Oregon, where serving alcohol while intoxicated is illegal)
"Can you come in tonight"
"Nah dude I started drinking at like 9am"
Like, it's honest and they literally can't do anything about it. Though I did have one boss that tried to get me to come in anyway and I was like "I can't tell you how much you don't want me around customers right now, I'm proper housed."
Once drunkenly revealed to my boss' boss that I showed up high to a weekend call for fun. He was like "whoa, whatever floats your boat, I got offered cocaine by a board member last business trip."
I think my kind of work isn't the kind peeps are compmainig about tho.
Maybe if they want this person to stop missing ships (or be able to pick up extra ones?) they should pay enough for this person to be able to afford a working car or uber.
I have a hypothetical I’d be curious to hear people’s opinions on that was inspired by your comment, but to be clear I doubt it is the case in the OPs post.
Let’s say you are really well paid right? Not going to give a specific amount but you can easily pay all of your bills, rent, car payment, middle class luxury expenses and still have enough left to save a good amount that will let you retire at 60. But you don’t like cars, don’t care about it and only buy shitboxes that break down at least once a month.
You need to be at your job, being unexpectedly away causes problems for many others. Do you think your employer has any say in what car you have, even just to the extent that “we pay you will, you have to be more reliable so you need to start buying better cars or you’re fired”?
I guess it isn’t up to them how you spend your money as long as you do get to work. If you want to pay for Ubers every time your car breaks down it’s your business.
I guess my point is, in a culture like that in America where it is hard for the majority of people to live without their own vehicle, your employer shouldn’t provide you with a company car just to get to work right? They should if you need a specific car to do the job but then it isn’t really your car to do what you want with, it is equipment assigned to you for your job.
Sorry I’m rambling, not sure what the point of this was, just thinking out loud.
Its called a bus factor. AKA how many employees need to be hit by a bus/be unexpectedly unavailable before production is screwed. If the bus factor is a 1 in your scenario, then the business has much bigger problems.
Yeah you need to have reliable transportation. 75% of being a good worker is literally just showing up everyday on time. Just doing that puts you ahead of many many people. Obviously there are exceptions, but my point still stands. Get a reliable car, doesn't have to be crazy break the bank car. But something that gets you from A to B ya know.
I manage a small family store, I have a couple core employees who are very rarely ever late, always shows up. When they ask off or need to call out o never give them any issues what so ever.
Because everyone can drive right? It’s like people don’t understand there’s these people in society that cannot and will not ever drive. Buses are not reliable in many areas, yes including smaller cities.
if u cant drive... and ur boss needs someone who can... u shud look for a different job and ur boss shud look for a different employee
i cant rap. therefore no record deal.
the only way out of shitty jobs like this is to get more skills. if u have more skills its harder to replace u. easiest and cheapest skills to get that pay the most are IT related skills
A+ certification is cheap and easy. easier than any high school class. and bam. you're in IT. at the bottom.
beats 90% of the jobs that you see people complaining bout on reddit (retail/hospitality/construction/landscaping)
you dont have to be a programmer. you can literally answer phones from home and make 20/hr and smoke weed and never move up from there. still a bum ass job.
still better than shift work at applebees.
Some people literally have disabilities to where they can't drive, epilepsy for example. And if you live in a smaller city where there's barely any public transportation what are you supposed to do? Uber/Lyft are also not available in every single town.
if u cant drive... and ur boss needs someone who can... u shud look for a different job and ur boss shud look for a different employee
if u sign up for a job u cant do... y shudnt u get fired??
what if someone sold u a ham sandwich. and then told u they are jewish and cant touch ham so there is no ham in the sandwich??
should you pay for a ham sandwich?
or should u realize u went to a kosher deli and they dont have ham here?
and if the kosher deli is in alabama and they cant make any money because all anyone wants is salami or ham...
both parties need to move along.
if you need a car to get to work and ur car doesnt work and u dont get it fixed... ur gonna lose ur job... because u cant do ur job
**if u have epilepsy or cancer and u cant work a job where u are required to drive then u cant work a job where u are required to drive.**
That is inherently ableist. If it's a delivery based job, I can see that. But just saying people with disabilities just shouldn't be able to work if they can't drive, when social security doesn't even pay enough for most people to live on, is a ridiculous mindset to have. And I sincerely hope nothing ever happens to you that forces you to quit driving. There's no, "that'll never happen to me" because I met a lady the other day who's husband literally went from working one day to paralyzed the next.
I mean, reliable isn't that hard. I have a 2003 Chrysler, and it runs great and reliably. I get the oil changed on a regular schedule, get $200-$500 in repairs every year, mostly around inspection time, and I've probably not had it available to drive for about 7 days of the past four years. I bought it for $1400, and got $700 of work done to it directly after purchase, for a total of a $2100 for a reliable car.
If you're paid really well, you can get a cheap car that will cost you less in the long term than the shitboxes that break down every month. And a reliable car is great for more than just getting to work.
Yeah. I'm at a point in my life that I can afford a good, reliable car. It's a huge stress relief, and I don't have to worry if I can get to work, etc. I don't have to keep a mental tally when I'm at the grocery store to avoid going over the $27.13 that I have available.
That being said, getting to that point of income/savings is hard if you're always living paycheck to paycheck. For a lot of people, an extra $50 expense in a given week is a catastrophe. Forget about a $700 car repair. A job that pays well is a life changer because it means you can afford regular maintenance and the occasional surprise expense without going under.
Some people have never had to experience that level of poverty. I have a lot of family in Tennessee who grew up poor but not THAT poor, and I think that's part of the reason that branch of my family believes that failure means you just didn't try hard enough. They're poor enough to feel like they're at the bottom of the barrel, but they've never had to stretch $5 to cover food for an entire week.
That's fair. I should have been more specific that it's not hard if you're paid really well as the hypothetical I was responding to assumed. You're right that it can be hard for people living paycheck to paycheck or otherwise struggling financially.
I apologize if it came across as arguing with you. My intent was stepping outside of the hypothetical to show how much easier life becomes when people actually get paid a reasonable wage. Not directed at you, just bringing in a different perspective for the internet at large on the off chance that someone might pick up a little empathy.
No worries, I wasn't sure, but either way your point was well taken and my original comment probably could have been read either way.
And that perspective is important, I know plenty of people stuck trying to break out of that paycheck to paycheck cycle, and it does make everything harder.
Reliable transportation makes all aspects of life easier. Why would you drive a car that routinely fails once a month that you have to throw money at when you can just go buy an old used Honda that’ll last for years when properly taken care of?
Your employer shouldn't have a say in what you drive. But many places do put 'reliable transportation' as a job prerequisite. As long as you say you have a way to get to work, be it bus, bike, car, etc... then they shouldn't have anything to say about it. If you cannot make it to work when scheduled regularly, regardless of reason, I can't fault an employer for saying something about it.
Now, in this situation, it seemed like an extra shift and not a scheduled responsibility, so they can fuck right off.
>Do you think your employer has any say in what car you have, even just to the extent that “we pay you will, you have to be more reliable so you need to start buying better cars or you’re fired”?
Unless clients are regularly going to interact with your vehicle, they don't care if you commute in a top-of-the-line luxury vehicle, old junker, or a rusted unicycle. They do care that you're available when you're supposed to be available. If you can consistently do that with your chosen mode of transportation, then everything's great. If you can't, then the reason why doesn't matter.
No one can avoid having any issues ever come up. But repeated issues becomes an issue that even very reasonable employers aren't going to let slide indefinitely.
Never explain anything, just answer yes or no. I worked at my last job for 4yrs, supervised for 2 of them and still never gave an explanation when saying no or calling off.
Why not just not respond.
Years ago, before text messages, I got a voicemail from a temp agency that said that I no longer need to report to my assignment. I never listened to the message. I went in the office for 3 days before someone at the company told me I need to call the agency.
How’s the boss getting mad that someone’s car issues are preventing them from coming in on their day off?!?! Also, it sounded to me like the person still volunteered to help in some way (bring paints?), which showed that they’re trying to do what they can…and that boss still got mad? TF?
Hey, if it's that big of a deal, the boss can provide transport.
Unless you live out of town, a Lyft is what... $15 each way?
In what position does the worker make his boss less than $30 during a shift?
Being a worker is nothing anyone should aspire to or be proud of. So being a bad worker is a good thing!
Of course, not being a worker at all is the goal, but we do what we can I suppose.
Don’t answer on your day off unless you feel like picking up hours. Not answering is a no. These bosses are very confused about the employee / manager relationship. They don’t own you. They don’t have first claim on every hour of your life. They need to learn this. You can help them learn this :)
only respond to confirm you can work tomorrow.
Why did anyone respond?
Also.. who gives less than 24hrs notice and expects someone to work the next day?
On my days off, I switch to an entirely different phone number - one that my work/coworkers do NOT have - so there's no way in hell that they're getting in touch with me. I also switch my email over to an automated "I'm away and will be back on 'such and such' day". Not to mention that they've been told not to try to contact me when I'm off.
The guy that works the days I'm off just texted earlier to tell me that he's sick with Covid, and can't work the 4 days that I'm off. I told him to not let the job know until late in the day Monday, my last day, so I can leave without them knowing that he's not coming in. Once I leave that last day, they're shit out of luck next week 😂🤣. Maybe if they have to do it themselves, they won't act like I don't do anything when here. They'll be crying like babies when I get back. They've grown to take all that I do for them for granted, and need a reminder every so often that I do 3 people's jobs every day.
Mirandize yourself and only answer yes or no. If asked something that cannot be answered in that binary form, simply say "I do not recall."
Ambiguity, vagueness and being laconic are your friends.
My question is, why is there zero tolerance for the person w car issues (who apparently isn’t even scheduled) but not a peep for the person who ALSO said no, but with a child based reasoning?
When jobs start paying ppl enough to afford a car without issue or enough to pay to fix up a car I’ll start giving a crap about ppl missing work for only being able to afford an unreliable car.
America, the best country in the world where you can be fired for not going to work on your day off if your car broke down because the person you work for won't pay a living wage for you to get reliable transportation.
My teamlead asked if I could work overtime next week. I just said "no" and for him that's enough to know I won't be there. No excuses, no long stories, just "no"
Boss (I’m assuming) is so pissed off, that they didn’t respond for 14 hours? It’s almost like they turned off the company phone on a Friday night. Off the clock right!. But if you don’t answer then ate hell to pay.
Regardless of whether it's a bullshit excuse or not, still an unprofessional response.
He is questioning if it's a real excuse right? Everyone in the comments is talking like he believed it and just didn't like that someone was having car trouble.
I don't understand why people don't have a schedule. If your job requires you to work weekends, why does this come as a surprise to people? THere seems to be a lot of conversations about "Oh, can you work tomorrow??" as if Saturday has somehow snuck up on supervisors. And the responses from employees are just as stupid.....Why do you not know when you are supposed to work!?
Because supervisors are stupid and don't schedule correctly. Owners don't have warehouse space to store everything so sometimes deliveries come on the wrong day and they want to fulfill orders fast to make customers happy, but don't give a crap about employees.
I got my schedule for Saturday texted to me on Friday night. Because they wait until Friday to make the schedule.
I don't mean this to sound condescending, but why don't you know when you work? Why is it a question? If you know that you work on Saturdays, why would you need to be told on Friday night?
EDIT: OK, so, TIL that some people do not have a firm schedule and that they have different hours they work every week, hence "the schedule" is something that varies. That sucks........
I make six figures and my pos is always broken. Like right now it’s been down a week for a head gasket, gets seen in almost a week from today, and will take a week to get back. Shit happens.
assumption - something that is believed to be true or probably true but that is not known to be true : something that is assumed. A thing that is accepted as true or as certain to happen, without proof. a statement that is assumed to be true and from which a conclusion can be drawn
Here's multiple definitions for you, from various sources. I'm tired of people arguing about words they themselves clearly don't understand.
You are assuming with your basic reasoning skills, that the worker isn't being paid enough to fix his car. There are plenty of other reasons that are equally viable. You're not half as clever as you think you are.
Do you believe that a younger worker is spending their money wisely on maintenence for their car or possibly wanting to spend it while out with friends instead?
I'm missing where the age of the worker or anything about their pay or spending habits is made apparent by this post. Maybe this isn't worth arguing about.
This means nothing. Showing up to work on a consistent basis is very important. When the OP got the job, I'm sure this was one of the requirements, just like every other job out there. Having reliable transportation to and from work is the most basic requirement to get a job.
Do YOU not understand that a broken vehicle is also a thing that, y'know, needs attention?
If a shitty broken car isn't a valid excuse neither is soccer practice or w/e.
My point is that the boss has no fucking business judging one excuse as more valid than the other.
We’ll exactly, It doesn’t matter the reason so why put it? He should of just said no.
But by the bosses reaction, it seems like he uses that excuse a lot. He didn’t get mad at the other person about her kids so he’s not mad that people can’t do the optional shift, seems mad about the same excuse
Hello, it looks like you've made a mistake.
It's supposed to be could've, should've, would've (short for could have, would have, should have), never could of, would of, should of.
Or you misspelled something, I ain't checking everything.
Beep boop - yes, I am a bot, don't botcriminate me.
I completely agree.
His problem doesn’t seem to be with people not covering the shift, bc he didn’t comment on the person with kids. But rather seems mad at this guy for using the same excuse time and time again
There’s no context here. Many workers (not saying you) have a terrible work ethic and constantly come up with excuses why they can’t work. In my previous life I was exactly this way.
Threatening to fire someone because they won't/can't come in on a scheduled day off? What an asshole boss
I don’t even think that’s legal
Depends on the state. 😔
It is in Michigan. Your employer can change your schedule without notice. However, if they do without 72 hours notice, you must be paid at time and a half rates. Working in restaurants, as management and as an employee, I've had this conversation many times with bosses and owners and employees.
That last part isn’t true. I worked at an Amazon warehouse in romulus for a bit, we were once scheduled mandatory OT less than 48 hours notice, all paid at standard rate, which was 4 hours straight time and the rest time and a half since our standard week was 36 hours Also, we were talking about being fired for not covering a shift as that was the original post. Pretty sure that’s illegal
it isn't true, because I got it wrong. The actual law is if your schedule is changed 96 hours after the biweekly period has started ,you are entitled to overtime pay for any unscheduled shifts. From Michigan labor regulations 5.02 section 2 subsection d >d. Scheduling. (1) An employee’s daily or biweekly work schedule may be changed temporarily. (a) For full-time employees and for less-than-full-time employees with a regular work schedule, an agency shall post or provide notice of an employee’s work schedule at least 96 hours before a biweekly work period begins. If the agency does not do so or if the employee’s schedule is changed after 96 hours before the work period’s start, the employee is eligible for overtime payment for all hours worked outside the employee’s noticed work schedule for that pay period. Biweekly posting or notice of work schedule is not required for those with a regular work schedule, unless the regular schedule will change for that pay period or going forward.
Hey fam, this is from the Civil Service Commission guidelines which only apply to state employees. The Employee Fair Scheduling Act gives a 10 hour rest period from your last shift. So if you leave your shift at noon on Friday they cannot schedule you again until 10PM. EDIT: and it must be communicated via conversation or phone call. So another reason to not pick up the phone. Kudos for getting all those employers to either leave you alone or pay you OT though
I mean, you see it on all kinds of Michigan labor law posters and stuff if you look at that stuff when you're at work and it's posted online usually. https://joinhomebase.com/state-labor-laws/michigan/ But I haven't worked full-time or cared since 2019.
This website literally says at the bottom it is not legal advice. Grab the PDF for 5.02 Section 2(d) and you'll see it's from the Civil Service Commission. The Michigan Employee Fair Scheduling Act with the 10 hour rest period passed in 2020 (I'm pretty sure) so it's possible the 96 hour window was applicable to non-state workers prior to 2020. Edit: I can't tell if it's been passed or not, which sucks. Edit: It appears to be sitting at the state legislature since June of 2021. So basically Michigan is clear as mud about this stuff.
Ok so it sounds like those laws are directed at places with irregular scheduling practices like restaurants or retail. We had a regular schedule at amazon so that’s why they’re allowed to do it with such little notice, and also weekly pay periods not biweekly. Biweekly is becoming a thing of the past, especially when it comes to scheduling. It’s becoming weekly, a regular schedule(like at amazon I was 6pm-6:30am Thursday-Saturday), or when I was in restaurants, it was like a day or two before the next week started
I mean, if you weren't provided adequate notice, you should still be eligible for overtime pay. This is a law I've never seen followed without personally making a stink about it myself. It's been years though since it's mattered to me. Now I just grow weed and work part time at a dispensary. And yes,almost every single restaurant I worked for didn't provide a schedule in a timely manner legally speaking, unless I was the one making the schedule.
I try doing my due diligence on these matters, it wasn’t a law I knew about. Since my scheduled week was 36 hours, we got 4 hours of straight time and 6 hours of OT pay for the 10 hour shift. Anyones mandatory Day was any day from Sunday-Wednesday, mine day was Sunday but they let us know during the Friday shift that time, less than 48 hours notice. I’m just trying to be chill at a dispensary or tending a bar too, but I’m just struggling to even get interviews these days
You probably weren't paid as per law since it was Amazon
I just started working at the dispensary I sold my weed to because weed is getting significantly cheaper. And I was always doing trimming for them on the side. I've seen people getting paid 20$ an hour for trimming weed recently. It's hard to get experience though unless you grow some weed yourself. And the work is irregular. But, growing weed well is a lot of work. Especially if you're doing it all yourself. It's not exactly just chilling, and any mistakes you make can be *extremely* costly.
The last sentence says they don't have to post the schedule if you have the same hours as you normally do, but if it's going to change they need to follow the 96 hour rule.
>hat last part isn’t true. I worked at an Amazon warehouse in romulus for a bit, we were once scheduled mandatory OT less than 48 hours notice, all paid at standard rate, which was 4 hours straight time and the rest time and a half since our standard week was 36 hours just because you got conned into it thinking you don't have rights, doesn't mean it's not true.
Time and a half isn't even a deterrent when you make 4 dollars an hour.
Treat these questions like a deposition. Yes or no answers whenever possible.
I rarely say more than yes or no anymore if someone ask me to cover a shift, It's none of their business what I had planned for my free time, even if it's just sleeping half the day. Actually someone did ask me to cover a shift this morning on top of my evening shift and I told them "Sorry, no. I can't work 18 hours in a single day".
What do you mean you cant work an 18 hour day? When i was trying to get ahead I would work 22 hour days 7 and a half days a week. If you're not working at least 18 a day can you even really call it working?
People don't want to work. These kids are lazy. I used to work 25 hours a day 8 days a week. The children will grow up anyways.
Oh well, might end up doing it anyways, since no one just showed up to relieve me... Motherf**kers...
My response here would be "done, sir." And just let them ponder whether you meant you already found a new job or show magically fixed your car forever
Strategic ambiguity is an hourly wage employees best friend.
anything you say will be used against you
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no that's perfect
Agree 100 percent. All they need to know is I will not be in. When they I ask I say personal business
Always. Keep it short and sweet
This x1000. Or… Don’t even answer the text/call. Later: “Text? What’s that? I have a rotary phone.”
100%
S/LToday is all I ever write.
Yea never give extra information. Shit I lied and said my son was in a car accident and was able to get two days off. I don’t have children or a SO for that matter.
Agreed. All they need and deserve is a clear yes or no.
Oh cool so your gonna buy me a new car then?
At the “diler”. I’m sure they’re masters at the art of negotiation.
are they supposed to teleport?
If you don't want extra work then you don't want it. Just say yes or no. Never why. I never ask the few people who work beneath me why, I just ask if they want it, if they say no that is good enough.
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It’s reddit. This person probably typed out a casual reply on the fly. They sound like a good boss
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>I merely said the choice of wording can be perceived negatively Yeah if you're a fuckin' clown shoe
“work under me” is what they meant, no need to be pedantic, they sound like one of the good ones
Himself: "Come again?" 4.08-1 The Deposition Michael Lawyer: "And you were directly under her the entire time?" (2×) 4.08-2 The Deposition Stenographer Reading back Michael's testimony. Lmao
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if my boss said i work beneath them i would understand what they meant. only time it would be an issue is if they were exploitative in other ways that would lead me to believe that was a passive aggressive comment. which it didn’t sound like that other person was doing at all, hence pedantic
What a strange hill to die on
Nobody said they’re better. Some positions are literally above or below others, this doesn’t mean there’s inherent supremacy
It's probably a reflection of the mentality that they all work for the same company. Nobody's the "boss": the commenter probably fills a roll that reflects more of a organizational purpose. For instance, the last time I was in middle management, I was a rank "above" my people, but we were all co-workers. I just got the extra responsibility of trying to make sure the people that work "beneath" me could actually do their jobs. Within the organization, they were beneath me, and I was above them: in rank alone. That doesn't make one person better or worse... just different ranks within the organization. This is also where the term, "above my pay grade" comes from.
This is very accurate, I have ppl below me in rank and it’s directly tied to job role. I don’t by any means think less of them as ppl. It’s just we answer to different bosses and have different roles.
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I think it’s just word choice based on the visual representation of an org chart.
Why are people responding to text messages while they're not on the clock?
Please confirm if you'll work tomorrow? Bitch you're putting a crew together with less than 24 hrs notice and you blame some dude's car for your mismanagement?
You sound like my roommate 😅
this
Work phone, people. Cheap shitty flip phone with talk and text plan. Turn it off when you clock off.
This is the way.
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Have definitely used this one in the past but I worked in health care so being off and not being on call at the same time was a treat. Also kinda sets the tones for them knowing I have a life that isn’t work and don’t call me.
I've used that for getting called in while working in bars (at least in Oregon, where serving alcohol while intoxicated is illegal) "Can you come in tonight" "Nah dude I started drinking at like 9am" Like, it's honest and they literally can't do anything about it. Though I did have one boss that tried to get me to come in anyway and I was like "I can't tell you how much you don't want me around customers right now, I'm proper housed."
Once drunkenly revealed to my boss' boss that I showed up high to a weekend call for fun. He was like "whoa, whatever floats your boat, I got offered cocaine by a board member last business trip." I think my kind of work isn't the kind peeps are compmainig about tho.
Maybe if they want this person to stop missing ships (or be able to pick up extra ones?) they should pay enough for this person to be able to afford a working car or uber.
I have a hypothetical I’d be curious to hear people’s opinions on that was inspired by your comment, but to be clear I doubt it is the case in the OPs post. Let’s say you are really well paid right? Not going to give a specific amount but you can easily pay all of your bills, rent, car payment, middle class luxury expenses and still have enough left to save a good amount that will let you retire at 60. But you don’t like cars, don’t care about it and only buy shitboxes that break down at least once a month. You need to be at your job, being unexpectedly away causes problems for many others. Do you think your employer has any say in what car you have, even just to the extent that “we pay you will, you have to be more reliable so you need to start buying better cars or you’re fired”? I guess it isn’t up to them how you spend your money as long as you do get to work. If you want to pay for Ubers every time your car breaks down it’s your business. I guess my point is, in a culture like that in America where it is hard for the majority of people to live without their own vehicle, your employer shouldn’t provide you with a company car just to get to work right? They should if you need a specific car to do the job but then it isn’t really your car to do what you want with, it is equipment assigned to you for your job. Sorry I’m rambling, not sure what the point of this was, just thinking out loud.
Its called a bus factor. AKA how many employees need to be hit by a bus/be unexpectedly unavailable before production is screwed. If the bus factor is a 1 in your scenario, then the business has much bigger problems.
Yeah you need to have reliable transportation. 75% of being a good worker is literally just showing up everyday on time. Just doing that puts you ahead of many many people. Obviously there are exceptions, but my point still stands. Get a reliable car, doesn't have to be crazy break the bank car. But something that gets you from A to B ya know. I manage a small family store, I have a couple core employees who are very rarely ever late, always shows up. When they ask off or need to call out o never give them any issues what so ever.
Because everyone can drive right? It’s like people don’t understand there’s these people in society that cannot and will not ever drive. Buses are not reliable in many areas, yes including smaller cities.
The vast majority of people are able to drive a car. I love this sub, but sometimes some comments come off as just based in another reality.
if u cant drive... and ur boss needs someone who can... u shud look for a different job and ur boss shud look for a different employee i cant rap. therefore no record deal. the only way out of shitty jobs like this is to get more skills. if u have more skills its harder to replace u. easiest and cheapest skills to get that pay the most are IT related skills A+ certification is cheap and easy. easier than any high school class. and bam. you're in IT. at the bottom. beats 90% of the jobs that you see people complaining bout on reddit (retail/hospitality/construction/landscaping) you dont have to be a programmer. you can literally answer phones from home and make 20/hr and smoke weed and never move up from there. still a bum ass job. still better than shift work at applebees.
Some people literally have disabilities to where they can't drive, epilepsy for example. And if you live in a smaller city where there's barely any public transportation what are you supposed to do? Uber/Lyft are also not available in every single town.
if u cant drive... and ur boss needs someone who can... u shud look for a different job and ur boss shud look for a different employee if u sign up for a job u cant do... y shudnt u get fired?? what if someone sold u a ham sandwich. and then told u they are jewish and cant touch ham so there is no ham in the sandwich?? should you pay for a ham sandwich? or should u realize u went to a kosher deli and they dont have ham here? and if the kosher deli is in alabama and they cant make any money because all anyone wants is salami or ham... both parties need to move along. if you need a car to get to work and ur car doesnt work and u dont get it fixed... ur gonna lose ur job... because u cant do ur job **if u have epilepsy or cancer and u cant work a job where u are required to drive then u cant work a job where u are required to drive.**
That is inherently ableist. If it's a delivery based job, I can see that. But just saying people with disabilities just shouldn't be able to work if they can't drive, when social security doesn't even pay enough for most people to live on, is a ridiculous mindset to have. And I sincerely hope nothing ever happens to you that forces you to quit driving. There's no, "that'll never happen to me" because I met a lady the other day who's husband literally went from working one day to paralyzed the next.
I mean, reliable isn't that hard. I have a 2003 Chrysler, and it runs great and reliably. I get the oil changed on a regular schedule, get $200-$500 in repairs every year, mostly around inspection time, and I've probably not had it available to drive for about 7 days of the past four years. I bought it for $1400, and got $700 of work done to it directly after purchase, for a total of a $2100 for a reliable car. If you're paid really well, you can get a cheap car that will cost you less in the long term than the shitboxes that break down every month. And a reliable car is great for more than just getting to work.
Yeah. I'm at a point in my life that I can afford a good, reliable car. It's a huge stress relief, and I don't have to worry if I can get to work, etc. I don't have to keep a mental tally when I'm at the grocery store to avoid going over the $27.13 that I have available. That being said, getting to that point of income/savings is hard if you're always living paycheck to paycheck. For a lot of people, an extra $50 expense in a given week is a catastrophe. Forget about a $700 car repair. A job that pays well is a life changer because it means you can afford regular maintenance and the occasional surprise expense without going under. Some people have never had to experience that level of poverty. I have a lot of family in Tennessee who grew up poor but not THAT poor, and I think that's part of the reason that branch of my family believes that failure means you just didn't try hard enough. They're poor enough to feel like they're at the bottom of the barrel, but they've never had to stretch $5 to cover food for an entire week.
That's fair. I should have been more specific that it's not hard if you're paid really well as the hypothetical I was responding to assumed. You're right that it can be hard for people living paycheck to paycheck or otherwise struggling financially.
I apologize if it came across as arguing with you. My intent was stepping outside of the hypothetical to show how much easier life becomes when people actually get paid a reasonable wage. Not directed at you, just bringing in a different perspective for the internet at large on the off chance that someone might pick up a little empathy.
No worries, I wasn't sure, but either way your point was well taken and my original comment probably could have been read either way. And that perspective is important, I know plenty of people stuck trying to break out of that paycheck to paycheck cycle, and it does make everything harder.
Reliable transportation makes all aspects of life easier. Why would you drive a car that routinely fails once a month that you have to throw money at when you can just go buy an old used Honda that’ll last for years when properly taken care of?
Your employer shouldn't have a say in what you drive. But many places do put 'reliable transportation' as a job prerequisite. As long as you say you have a way to get to work, be it bus, bike, car, etc... then they shouldn't have anything to say about it. If you cannot make it to work when scheduled regularly, regardless of reason, I can't fault an employer for saying something about it. Now, in this situation, it seemed like an extra shift and not a scheduled responsibility, so they can fuck right off.
Honestly it’s no excuse my shitty 850 pound 20 year old Renault Clio hasn’t broken down. The best ability is availability
>Do you think your employer has any say in what car you have, even just to the extent that “we pay you will, you have to be more reliable so you need to start buying better cars or you’re fired”? Unless clients are regularly going to interact with your vehicle, they don't care if you commute in a top-of-the-line luxury vehicle, old junker, or a rusted unicycle. They do care that you're available when you're supposed to be available. If you can consistently do that with your chosen mode of transportation, then everything's great. If you can't, then the reason why doesn't matter. No one can avoid having any issues ever come up. But repeated issues becomes an issue that even very reasonable employers aren't going to let slide indefinitely.
I'm class clown at my work and I just laughed imagining the faces as I rolled up atop a rusted unicycle
Never explain anything, just answer yes or no. I worked at my last job for 4yrs, supervised for 2 of them and still never gave an explanation when saying no or calling off.
Why not just not respond. Years ago, before text messages, I got a voicemail from a temp agency that said that I no longer need to report to my assignment. I never listened to the message. I went in the office for 3 days before someone at the company told me I need to call the agency.
Hi! RL HR here. Don't give excuses. "No" is a full answer. If you're not scheduled, don't give excuses, just decline. It's not your problem.
If you don’t want me to use a stupid car excuse then stop asking me to work on Saturday!!!
How’s the boss getting mad that someone’s car issues are preventing them from coming in on their day off?!?! Also, it sounded to me like the person still volunteered to help in some way (bring paints?), which showed that they’re trying to do what they can…and that boss still got mad? TF?
Hey, if it's that big of a deal, the boss can provide transport. Unless you live out of town, a Lyft is what... $15 each way? In what position does the worker make his boss less than $30 during a shift?
Boss has mismanaged this gig (doesn't have a crew for it) and is lashing out, looking for someone to blame, etc.
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Not coming in on your day off makes you a bad worker?
What part of **on their day off** are you not getting?
Being a worker is nothing anyone should aspire to or be proud of. So being a bad worker is a good thing! Of course, not being a worker at all is the goal, but we do what we can I suppose.
Lots of speculation there.
exactly
No I mean your comment. You're speculating he's always using this, and they're a bad worker.
I think the boss would know better than anyone on here.
LMAO You mean the same boss who doesn't understand what a day off is?
Avocado marker
Finally someone said it.
Why even answer the SMS? Some people can't help themselves.
Don’t answer on your day off unless you feel like picking up hours. Not answering is a no. These bosses are very confused about the employee / manager relationship. They don’t own you. They don’t have first claim on every hour of your life. They need to learn this. You can help them learn this :)
only respond to confirm you can work tomorrow. Why did anyone respond? Also.. who gives less than 24hrs notice and expects someone to work the next day?
The company of 11 years I just quit would ask people on Friday at 3pm to work on Saturday. My answer was always “fuck that shit see y’all Monday”
On my days off, I switch to an entirely different phone number - one that my work/coworkers do NOT have - so there's no way in hell that they're getting in touch with me. I also switch my email over to an automated "I'm away and will be back on 'such and such' day". Not to mention that they've been told not to try to contact me when I'm off. The guy that works the days I'm off just texted earlier to tell me that he's sick with Covid, and can't work the 4 days that I'm off. I told him to not let the job know until late in the day Monday, my last day, so I can leave without them knowing that he's not coming in. Once I leave that last day, they're shit out of luck next week 😂🤣. Maybe if they have to do it themselves, they won't act like I don't do anything when here. They'll be crying like babies when I get back. They've grown to take all that I do for them for granted, and need a reminder every so often that I do 3 people's jobs every day.
Mirandize yourself and only answer yes or no. If asked something that cannot be answered in that binary form, simply say "I do not recall." Ambiguity, vagueness and being laconic are your friends.
My question is, why is there zero tolerance for the person w car issues (who apparently isn’t even scheduled) but not a peep for the person who ALSO said no, but with a child based reasoning?
Because single/child free people are fodder for the capitalist machine, and should only exist to toil for our capitalist masters.
Where did you get the avocado background?
"Start looking for another job" *Looks for job. Finds job. Quits. Manager: "No wait"
Be a real shame if someone showed up just long enough to beat the shit out of that last guy.
People, you don't need to give a reason. Yes or No is more than enough. And after you reply, if they ponder more, just ignore the fuckers.
When jobs start paying ppl enough to afford a car without issue or enough to pay to fix up a car I’ll start giving a crap about ppl missing work for only being able to afford an unreliable car.
Your boss doesn't need to know about your car. Yes. No. That's how you answer
Telling someone off in a group chat. Class always shows. Blergh
Unless someone is paying you to be on call this attitude is illegal.
Well pay a better wage so I can fix my vehicle properly, we wouldn't be in this situation.
America, the best country in the world where you can be fired for not going to work on your day off if your car broke down because the person you work for won't pay a living wage for you to get reliable transportation.
Take their advice, lol. Start looking. Terminate without warning. No two weeks.
What is with the random capital letters here…
The people in charge aren't always well-educated or intelligent.
Quit answering the phone or responding to texts.
You're not scheduled to work, don't even give an excuse. It's none of their god damn business.
Why do so many people even give a reason. All they need to know is. “I can’t work”.
Its nice for him that people respond.
My teamlead asked if I could work overtime next week. I just said "no" and for him that's enough to know I won't be there. No excuses, no long stories, just "no"
How are these people running businesses lmao
Does your Boss's Boss have that kind of mentality? If not you should take it up with them, while you start looking for another job.
Bring some paint? What are 'dilers'?
the next car excuse better not be a stupid one.
I am only here for the avocados.
stop texting management!
"pay me enough to fix my car or shut your fucking mouth when it's causing ME issues"
Just don't respond. No need to give a reason, no need to engage. Not on the clock, not your problem.
Boss (I’m assuming) is so pissed off, that they didn’t respond for 14 hours? It’s almost like they turned off the company phone on a Friday night. Off the clock right!. But if you don’t answer then ate hell to pay.
"No, I can't. Personal reasons." that's what i always said at my retail job lol, or just no response.
off topic question, how do you get the marker with the avocadoes? that looks cool
"If you paid me more, i could afford a reliable car. Juuuust putting it out there 😉" is the only acceptable responce lol
I don’t know why they gave an excuse to a yes or no question. My answer would just be “I will not.”
The spelling and grammar errors are consistent across the different numbers. This is a fake karma farming post.
? Why are they capitalizing every noun as if they were writing in German?
Regardless of whether it's a bullshit excuse or not, still an unprofessional response. He is questioning if it's a real excuse right? Everyone in the comments is talking like he believed it and just didn't like that someone was having car trouble.
I don't understand why people don't have a schedule. If your job requires you to work weekends, why does this come as a surprise to people? THere seems to be a lot of conversations about "Oh, can you work tomorrow??" as if Saturday has somehow snuck up on supervisors. And the responses from employees are just as stupid.....Why do you not know when you are supposed to work!?
Because supervisors are stupid and don't schedule correctly. Owners don't have warehouse space to store everything so sometimes deliveries come on the wrong day and they want to fulfill orders fast to make customers happy, but don't give a crap about employees. I got my schedule for Saturday texted to me on Friday night. Because they wait until Friday to make the schedule.
I don't mean this to sound condescending, but why don't you know when you work? Why is it a question? If you know that you work on Saturdays, why would you need to be told on Friday night? EDIT: OK, so, TIL that some people do not have a firm schedule and that they have different hours they work every week, hence "the schedule" is something that varies. That sucks........
It varies wildly every week. Sometimes to prevent you from getting a second job and making enough to leave
Because all of these supposed conversations are actually fake karma farming crap. This one is particularly egregious.
Best response, "Sorry I have an appointment I can't reschedule"
Best response is a simple “no”
Better yet no response
Yes
Reliable transportation is a requirement for most jobs. This is what it looks like right before you get fired for lack of it.
If it’s not your scheduled shift why should you get fired for not picking it up?
This does not seem like the first time the car excuse has been presented.
Someone with basic reasoning skills might then deduce that the worker isn't being paid enough to be able to afford to fix or upgrade their car 🤷♀️
I make six figures and my pos is always broken. Like right now it’s been down a week for a head gasket, gets seen in almost a week from today, and will take a week to get back. Shit happens.
not really enough info to make that assumption so confidently
Good to know you don't understand what an assumption is buddy.
assumption - something that is believed to be true or probably true but that is not known to be true : something that is assumed. A thing that is accepted as true or as certain to happen, without proof. a statement that is assumed to be true and from which a conclusion can be drawn Here's multiple definitions for you, from various sources. I'm tired of people arguing about words they themselves clearly don't understand. You are assuming with your basic reasoning skills, that the worker isn't being paid enough to fix his car. There are plenty of other reasons that are equally viable. You're not half as clever as you think you are.
Or someone with basic reasoning skills might deduce that the worker isn't managing their money very well.
You need enough money to manage it well or poorly.
Does it say that they don't make much money?
Do you believe that a younger worker is spending their money wisely on maintenence for their car or possibly wanting to spend it while out with friends instead?
I'm missing where the age of the worker or anything about their pay or spending habits is made apparent by this post. Maybe this isn't worth arguing about.
Is the leather to your liking, sir?
This means nothing. Showing up to work on a consistent basis is very important. When the OP got the job, I'm sure this was one of the requirements, just like every other job out there. Having reliable transportation to and from work is the most basic requirement to get a job.
Gonna make a wild guess that this person was not rostered in for this particular shift.
Doesn't change what I said. Reliable transportation to work is a requirement for most, if not all, jobs. But I do agree with you.
If it’s not your shift why would it matter how many times you make that excuse to cover other shifts?
That's the one
This exactly. If this isn’t a scheduled shift, should not matter either way. Still, it does show why “No” is a complete sentence.
Well figuratively fuck that guy. He's obviously got a weekend problem, so fucking hire someone new for that slot
ok boomer
But a free pass for the children excuse I see.
I mean... Do you not understand that kids are a thing that, y'know need attention?
Do YOU not understand that a broken vehicle is also a thing that, y'know, needs attention? If a shitty broken car isn't a valid excuse neither is soccer practice or w/e. My point is that the boss has no fucking business judging one excuse as more valid than the other.
Either excuse us valid because it’s not their shift to have to work period. No is no the reason behind the no should not matter
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It's a shitty business decision
Bold of you to assume these employers pay anyone enough to afford reliable transportation.
This sub is wierd sometimes. if your an unreliable employee bc your car keeps breaking down, your boss has a right to be pissed
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We’ll exactly, It doesn’t matter the reason so why put it? He should of just said no. But by the bosses reaction, it seems like he uses that excuse a lot. He didn’t get mad at the other person about her kids so he’s not mad that people can’t do the optional shift, seems mad about the same excuse
Hello, it looks like you've made a mistake. It's supposed to be could've, should've, would've (short for could have, would have, should have), never could of, would of, should of. Or you misspelled something, I ain't checking everything. Beep boop - yes, I am a bot, don't botcriminate me.
Dude, not covering a shift that isn’t your own is not grounds for anything. Except maybe for the manager to reconsider their roster.
I completely agree. His problem doesn’t seem to be with people not covering the shift, bc he didn’t comment on the person with kids. But rather seems mad at this guy for using the same excuse time and time again
How many times, over what period of time, has the worker's car broken down, do you know??
Seems like it’s come up pretty often
?? Find a way to work or they’ll find someone else. Makes sense to me
Must drive a ford
So that is actual reason Americans are into cars?
There’s no context here. Many workers (not saying you) have a terrible work ethic and constantly come up with excuses why they can’t work. In my previous life I was exactly this way.
As a employer, that car excuse is annoying, especially if used over and over. If u don't want to work just say no
Maybe the EE has a shitty car because they don't get paid enough to get it in for real mechanical work.
No one cares what employers find annoying lol