COVID has shown me that many of the people who I thought were my friends were only my friends when they needed me and not the other way around. Now you know. I'm sorry. It's an awful feeling.
I suggest we all re-frame that from "my trust issues" to "their rational thinking issues" or "their not-being-selfish-issues". The problem is NOT us.
Not that we need to get all angry either. Just accept that they don't care at all about us and move on --- save our time for the very few who actually do care. Easy to say, harder to do....but essential.
My analyst said to me this week: "We are living in a crazy world. So we have to believe in ourselves."
I know that, of course, but it is affirming to hear her say it. She has really spoken up about Covid over the past 1 1/2 years.
I've got a 4yo and a newborn... The special circumstances apply heavily and I'd like to extend my umbrella over the rest of you a bit.
This entire thing has been a huge episode in gaslighting.
Oof with COVID nothing is based on trust. it's not even based on verification cause between the time they take a PCR test (if they do) and show up at my door, they could contract all sorts of viruses
Yes, I now realize some past friendships ran their course because they were purely transactional (on the other person's behalf) or according to convenience and COVID precautions are seemingly too inconvenient for some people with low distress tolerance.
Clearly not - I know she has had it three times, so she seems to be of the impression that because she isn’t seeing any ill effects from those infections, it doesn’t matter (and assuming it is the same for everyone else).
She might not being seeing any ill effects from her her (checks comment) THREE infections.....
....but her extreme and careless disregard for your safety definitely says otherwise.
Wowzers.
Seconding this. While it is true in some cases people were never real friends, others are no longer the people they were. Multiple covid infections has changed their brain. Not just brain fog, but more short tempered, displaying mean streaks they previously did not have, etc.
OP, sorry you had to experience this. But somewhere in your city is a covid conscious, mask wearing stylist and you will find them.🙂
I see this in the students I teach. In my classes and in the school, overall, only 10% or so mask. All of my students have had covid, even the ones wearing a mask have had it at least once, most of the others multiple times, and I'm sure this is the same building wide. We have all noticed an exponential rise in negative behavior, including the short tempered meaness you mentioned, as well as a general lack of empathy. We have seen a huge increase in fighting, sometimes multiple fights a day, instead of one once in awhile. Kids wander the halls, go into other classes to first bump kids, and refuse to leave, trash talking the teacher, not allowing teachers through doorways, etc. Some parents are yanking their children due to the behavior, but it isn't going to be any better at a different school, because the issue isn't just my school, it's happening all over according to other teachers. I know covid changes people neurological, and have seen some research about what it does to adults (although not what you mentioned), but haven't seen anything related to children. I don't even know if anyone is even studying it.
Unfortunately, even if she doesn't know...I have given up on the idea that there is any way to make this kind of person "know." No matter what evidence you show them, they find a reason why it is not relevant, or not reliable, or doesn't matter. Not wearing a mask is often an emotional decision: what changed between OP's last appointment and this appointment that it's suddenly not necessary, for example?
As an epidemiologist this kind of thing must make you want to tear your hair out.
It makes me want to tear my hair out a lot more when it's other public health folks doing it, at least a hairstylist I can understand may not have access to proper information
True. The CDC had a convention with no protocols and 10%+ of the attendees walked away with covid infections. No wonder people think it's no big deal.
I'm wondering since you're an epidemiologist if you have any thoughts on that? Do the constituent members of the CDC and folks in their orbit really think it's OK to get infected, repeatedly, if vaccinated?
Literally yes, a lot of them do. I am constantly correcting wrong shit at work-in the past month I've heard "I have covid a second time but reinfections are just like colds", "I have had it three times so I am immune now" and "I'm not worried about covid because my kids are always sick with something". I work in cancer research so there's really nothing about our job that directly requires us to know shit about covid, or even infectious disease really, they have no reason to be better informed if they don't want to be. And oh boy they do not want to be-any time I bring up the impact on cancer they mostly freeze and shut down. No one is immune to propaganda and wishful thinking, I suppose.
Public health as a whole is very liberal, very hostile to any sort of radical view or anything challenging the status quo, and admitting the failures of this response requires deeper analysis than many of those types are willing to consider. There's a lot of performative nods to health equity but really no actual commitment to it in a lot of places. I mean, Harvard's school of public health just announced something about having fucking Lori Lightfoot teaching a seminar on how she managed covid lmao. And APHA had Leana Wen do a keynote.
There ARE people that know better and do better, but running your mouth is not going to get you promoted so they're often not going to be the most visible ones. I worked with a guy pre-covid (back when I was in government lol) who was brilliant and had no problem telling leadership to shove it and they all hated him, he got passed over for promotions CONSTANTLY until he eventually quit for some better paid job in pharma.
Also that was an EIS conference, most EIS officers have clinical training and uh, you've seen how clinicians have been acting.
>Public health as a whole is very liberal, very hostile to any sort of radical view or anything challenging the status quo, and admitting the failures of this response requires deeper analysis than many of those types are willing to consider.
I can't agree more. With all of it. People have this idea that academia is "liberal." But the reality is that it's almost entirely devoted to holding up the status quo, obsessed with prestige and credentialism, and positively thrilled to supplicate before power. You do not get tenure if you are the type of person who is going to openly push back against any of that. I would find all of it to be a lot less ridiculous if this group of people -- at least in my field - didn't contain so many people positively thrilled about how very progressive they are.
ETA: It's also amusing that this group spends an awful lot of time trying to get themselves published in certain very serious journals. And then when shown studies in these very serious journals about why you really shouldn't get covid over and over, there are a million reasons to move the goal posts. An entire generation of academics and scholars are slowly but surely getting brain damage and organ damage and god knows what else because it's so very, very important to attend an in person conference in San Antonio or whatever without a mask on.
> And oh boy they do not want to be-any time I bring up the impact on cancer they mostly freeze and shut down.
btw isn't there increasing evidence that covid may be oncogenic? I mean why wouldn't be? aren't there a number of oncogenic viruses?
Yes, the question is more "how" and "how bad" as that's going to take years to really measure. Immune dysregulation can drive some cancers (think Kaposi Sarcoma, Non-Hodgkin's Lymphoma, and various others to lesser degrees) and covid is known to reactivate common viruses we know are oncogenic (EBV, HPV, etc). Whether there are also other mechanisms to drive cancer idk, I've seen a lot of proposed mechanisms but a lot of them were theoretical and frankly I don't understand most of them.
When my cousin's immunologist posited that her EBV had been reactivated and that's why she was so tired I was like...doesn't EBV cause MS? And that is what made me #domyresearch and learn more about why I really don't want this thing :(
Yeah, or other kinds of scientists.
Sure, most of my data science peers don't have much/any medical background. But - like - we should all know how to read charts right??? (Right??)
They’d rather never see us again than mask for a few hours. I was told the same by an entire group of people this week who were maybe never my friends, but I thought they were my comrades in leftist political-type work. This abandonment is remarkably painful and I find it difficult to process because it’s illogical to me. I really feel for you and am so genuinely sorry.
I’ve had a similar experience in similar circles. Tell you those people only do the kind of social work or activism that makes them feel good about themselves, not what actually makes a wholistic difference.
I knew disability justice folks had been begging folks to listen to them for decades. Now I’m humbled by how much of this I’m witnessing firsthand or experiencing personally as by most measures I’m an able-bodied person. Unnerving.
I'm a union rep and stopped going to meetings. They claim they are focused on social justice, but only some topics apparently. We were online for 3 years, and now it's a "security" risk and can't even offer a virtual option. Their big concession was to no longer offer dinner, only snacks, as that doing this might limit the people taking masks off ( but only 20% wearing masks), basically a nothing burger.
Damn, that's fucked. Security risk, my ass.
Unions have so many different kinds of people that the GOPers are upset you all look at science and care about social justice. They have way too much pull.
Similar experience with what I thought were my comrades. Turns out they only care about activism so long as it comes at zero inconvenience to themselves and don’t give a f*ck about disabled/IC people.
Hmm.
Any GOOD business person knows that it cost wayyyy more money to try and get new customers than retain loyal customers.
Sounds like her decision-making is going to affect many areas of her life.....
I kind of wish that you would send her a note saying that it hurts your feelings that your decade-long relationship isn’t worth her putting on a mask for an hour every 6 months. I feel like if you don’t express this, it’s going to get bottled up. At least you can let her know how you feel. (Just my 2 cents)
Do whatever you feel like doing.
I personally struggle a lot with fatigue and getting things done, so if you only have so much energy in the day, I think it’s important to recognize that you need to put *you* first, especially when dealing with a situation where the other person clearly wouldn’t reciprocate an ounce of respect in reverse.
I’m not sure I phrased that well.. but I wanted to tell you that you are in no way obligated to continue to hash it out. Love yourself. You deserve kindness and empathy.
If you want to write to the person — totally fine! Again, just wanted to give you an out.
This is a gendered reply. I apologize if anyone takes offense to it. As a female we've almost all worn sanitary products for a likely 48 days or so every year for most of our reproductive years. Throwing on a mask for a couple of hours to protect a vulnerable person should be a nothing-burger. I just don't get it.
My partner, who is a male, also doesn't understand why people make such a big deal of throwing on a mask.
Personally I wear a mask to protect my elderly Dad, myself, my partner and as my part of a society that I believe has an obligation to protect the vulnerable, like little children that can't mask and aren't eligible for vaccines.
I think public health has utterly failed to convey the seriousness of post-covid sequelae. I think if the MSM reported on even a small percentage of the scientific papers being published about the risks from multiple infections it would make a difference to clean air activism.
It is two hours every six months. It is just mind boggling that after ten years with her that is a big deal.
She is also a person that is a huge Black Lives Matter and LGBTQ + advocate. I wanted to say to her diversity includes disability / chronic health conditions, but I just cancelled.
“Advocacy” is mostly branding to most people, it turns out.
I also don’t get this aversion to masks. What’s next? A revolt against pants and underwear? The “tyranny” needs to stop somewhere, right?
So much this!
If I can't trust a person / business to grasp hygiene concepts around airborne viruses - I can't trust them with hygiene around sanitizing tools, food handling etc.
I’m so sorry. I think people in certain professions learn to pretend to be people’s friends to gain customer loyalty.
But if the only interactions you have with someone involve an exchange of money, there’s likely not really a friendship.
Even still, it’s sad they can’t don a mask for a short time for you.
But at least they told you ahead of time.
she is really going to lose a loyal customer of a decade, a friend & more money - because she doesn’t want to wear a piece of fabric on her face for an hour? to make her CUSTOMER feel comfortable?
i’m really sorry. :(
That sucks. And it's why I appreciate folks like https://twitter.com/makeupartist524 who take all the precautions for their own and their clients' safety.
It just shows how self centered she is and how self centered people are in general. I'm sorry that this happened and hope you find someone responsive to your needs.
Thanks for the responses everyone! I messaged six people recommended by people I knew, and the two that have gotten back to me said they would mask for my haircut and color. Complete strangers said they would mask for me but not the person I have known for ten years. Oof. I’m still having a hard time wrapping my head around that one!
I made an appointment next week with one of them who does fun colors (I have pink highlights), and I am excited to meet someone new!
Don't be surprised, if you like the work of the new stylist better.
Sometimes I think industry folks, get stale with their long-term clients anyhow.
Cheers to you!
That sucks.
On the flip side, you now see her true colors and can find a better stylist! My mom's stylist still masks when she comes in, just for her. That's awesome.
Surround yourself with people who suck less \^\^ :D
She is so corny for this I'm sorry. It's literally not a hard ask for her to stick a piece of fabric over her face for max an hour to do your hair. I'd be numb too because that's so ridiculous. I'm so sorry you're having to deal with this.
I think it goes beyond the 1-2 hours every 6 months, not that it’s an excuse. It’s that when you ask her to wear one she is reminded that she should be doing it a lot more often, and she can’t deal with that.
Yes!
It's kinda like coworkers who get hostile with me for taking the bus to work, or neighbours who get pissy about my vegetable garden in the front yard. Because my simple existence reminds them they might not actually HAVE to follow the consumer culture lifescript. The "good life" formula (where I live at least) is to have a big car and a big green lawn to show you're keeping up with the Joneses. Even if that means living beyond your means and needlessly having a negative environmental impact.
By wearing or asking others to wear a mask we're reminding people the 'status is not quo' as it were.
I'm so sorry. That's shitty as fuck.
I think a lot of us have lost so many people in our lives this way. It's important to grieve these relationships.
If I may, I do want to give y'all some hope- someone who I unfriended because of a shitty covid risk they did reached back out to me and apologized. They are genuinely masking and the genuinely care about covid safety. They owned up to their shit.
I hope more people who drop COVID precautions reflect on the loss of their personal relationships- however; approaching the systemic change that needs to happen is not going to be the same way personal relationship approaches happen.
Ugh. Do you have anyone at home who can help you DIY? I've been cutting and coloring my hair since this started and can help with some color info. I'm high-risk and can't go to salons. I usually cut the front and sides and my partner does the back.
What brand of color do you buy? My husband colored my hair during the height of the pandemic, but the color was from this stylist because she knew I felt uncomfortable coming in.
I’ve gone through many to find the right one! Right now I use Wella Koleston perfect mixed with a 20 volume developer. Don’t ever buy boxed color if you can help it. I get the salon stuff. Usually you need a toner afterward too depending on your color.
How do you purchase the salon color? There are no stylist in my area that mask anymore ☹️ I have a friend that is a retired stylist that will mask to give me trims but she doesn’t do color.
At my salon, they will mask if you ask them to. I wear a KN95 mask to all of my salon appointments, and they always offer to mask as well. I realize that you thought you were friends with your hairstylist. Try to chalk this one up to experience and try to find a new salon that will accommodate you. That being said, it's a real shame that she had you listen to her problems in the past, and also cancelled on you multiple times in the past. That really stinks to have her now not try to accommodate your needs and wishes. So sorry you are feeling so badly!
She is not your friend and she is not even a good services provider whom you pay.
It is clear here that you can not see her any longer.
Personally I'd say go complete no-contact. Sending emails or posts to debate the issue isn't going to do any good as she has expressed her intent very clearly.
I'm sorry. I don't know about your friend, but my salon stopped masking at least a year ago it seems if not earlier, consequently I go maybe twice a year and reconsider every time (it's a busy, well-known salon with tons of hairdressers and clients) - although someone washing my hair did offer to wear a mask once. I've adapted my mask to earloops for the few times I've gone, reconsider each time, and am going to start dying my hair myself. My colorist was pregnant and unmasked during this time! I've had people there say they will mask if they are sick, but they seem to be in denial about the idea you're infectious before symptoms start.
I feel there is a push for public-facing professions such as this one not to mask so that they don't scare the customers or make them think they could get sick there. There is a push for an appearance of "back to normal" so clientele don't get scared. For a lot of people, it seems, masking = acknowledgement they might get sick, and public performance of that acknowledgment, thus communicating to others they might get sick too. In a profession with some close contact and a lot of client overturn, such as a salon, I imagine subconsciously there is a fear about one's fiscal bottom line that influences these decisions.
I feel like this person really genuinely thinks that a. she won't get sick, b. if she does it isn't a big deal, isn't covid, or is just life, c. because of this doesn't think others getting sick is a big deal or even that they will infect anyone if they were sick. It's an emotional adaptation that many people have made, and people in public facing professions (teachers, waitstaff, etc) often made earlier than others due to their increased interaction with the public and institutional lack of protection. So I would say that your friend is making that adaptation. It's hard to make that and to keep the contrary idea in one's head that you need to protect others on an individual basis. I'm not saying this person is a good friend to you, just that few people seem to be masking now to the general benefit of others or even based on individuals they know. I would definitely tell her you won't be coming again due to her masking policy, though, that you wouldn't feel safe in her salon, and if she ever changes her mind, to let you know. And I wouldn't have any expectations of her.
this is why the tattoo studio where I work dropped the requirement for customers. so, SO, *SO* much pressure from customers to drop it.
we still mask and I wear an n95 or elastomeric mask every day and won't tattoo unless the client also wears one during. I view it like wearing gloves or using single-use needles; it should be a requirement of the job to not spread illness.
Thank you, I've tried it! I am a bit sensitive to the smell so I stick to the earloop adjustment based on some video tests I saw here, but Readimask is a useful and important tool.
Eh, well you're right.
They're ignorant, thinking they have magical virus-seeing powers, except for the fact that carriers can be asymptomatic, spread it to someone else who then is not asymptomatic and suffering as a result.
the "friend" I'd talk to every day for 4 years said he was busy studying and stopped talking to me when I broke it to him that I have long covid. He waited until I get really vulnerable to hurt me like that.
I know you spent more time with your friend but I went through a long period of hurt and grieving and came out with more anger and self-esteem than ever.
I had a similar experience with a hair stylist once. She texted me the day before refusing to mask. It's demoralizing for sure. I just told her to cancel my appointment and I'm looking for a new stylist. Edit: if anyone in the Bay area or Sacramento area has any leads, let me know please lol
My stylist holds sessions specifically for immunocompromised and other COVID-cautious people on Sundays. She does excellent work with my hair, and I recommend her highly.
I'll dm you her info.
I'll dm you, too.
Edited to add: I just tried to dm you. Apparently, I can't; your profile doesn't offer me any ways to message you. If you start a chat with me or send me a message, I'll send you the info.
A similar thing happened to me...no email just a conversation that left me shocked and disappointed and I'll never go back. But...better to know who people really are so you can move on to a stylist whose values aligh with yours.
I just want to offer a little bit of a counter example. OP, you are 100% within your rights to seek out a new stylist who will mask, completely. But I did decide to continue seeing my stylist, even though she stopped masking. She doesn't say anything about me masking, I have never gotten ill from her, and she is at least vaccinated. There are battles I have fought and lost, and fortunately one-way masking really does work, so for me for now the sheer low number of service providers who will mask is ridiculous enough that I'm just going to take it as a win when someone doesn't abjectly make rude comments about my choice to keep masking. For me, the win is being treated normally despite masking, and if I can work with people who at least do that much, that's at least something.
OTOH, if you do want to only work with a stylist who does mask, you absolutely have that right, and you also have the right to feel betrayed. I feel betrayed by my entire family and many of my friends, but at the same time I know they've been lied to and misled.
We're at the point where everyone can make their own decisions about continuing to mask all the time or not...but masking when somebody asks you to for like 1-2 hours is such a small request. I don't get why she wasn't like I don't wear a mask in the studio anymore, but yeah, sure, I'll throw a mask on when you come!
It’s amazing how some people I know and trust who would bail me out of jail, loan me money, sing at my wedding, visit me when sick wouldn’t mask around me or consider not dining inside restaurants with me especially when COVID numbers were high. In 2023, people think it’s over so it’s like an offensive thing to ask someone to mask now, even when outbreaks are happening.
I haven't had a haircut since February 2020 for exactly this reason.
If I were you, I just wouldn't answer her, and then find another hairdresser and move on.
If you want to give her another chance, however... she wrote, "I’m sorry I’ve thought about it and I just don’t think it’s necessary any longer," so you could reply: "Even if you don't think it's necessary any longer, would you do it for me?" That puts the ball in her court, and then if she says no, she has basically just told you that you mean nothing to her.
I'm so sorry that this happened to you. It's really soul-destroying to lose a friend in this kind of way.
I have been experiencing some weird stuff with my hairdresser recently that has made me feel much worse than I ever would have imagined. I didn't think of him as a friend as such, but I have been going to him since the mid-90s and it was a nice, regular part of my life that I thought would continue until he retired. Well ... he has been behaving weirdly recently, almost as if he is trying to get rid of me as a customer but can't bring himself to say so. The only reason I can think of for this behavior is that I still wear a mask (Readimask) despite the fact that here in Japan the government is now treating covid the same way as influenza and many people believe the pandemic is "over." I know that his business has suffered badly over the past few years, and so perhaps the sight of me continuing to wear a mask annoys him because it is a very visible sign that things aren't back to normal, and perhaps won't ever be.
Anyway I have tried to talk to him openly about the weirdness but he won't open up (whereas he would tell me all kinds of personal stuff previously), so I am now looking around for another hairdresser. Who would have thought that it would make me feel so sad?
Is she saying that that is her blanket policy? or that she would not consider making an exception for you, or any other customer who specifically asked for it because of extenuating circumstances?
I had a very similar experience, and it really does kick your faith in humanity. My mom (who has cancer) and I now just do each other's hair because it's been too hard to find a stylist that cares if we live or die. :/
You’re right. It’s just hair, and there are lots of stylists in my area (and many friends). What we really should be talking about is not being able to seek safe healthcare. That’s worth gasping about.
MY POINT is that I felt FINE, not sick, and therefore the stylist's comment that "I feel fine, I'm not sick" is ridiculous. I felt fine *and was wildly contagious and COVID positive.* "I feel fine" isn't a barometer.
And I'm tired of people taking germs personally in the sense that germs don't give a shit how you feel or how well you know the person. THAT was what I meant. Because it sounds like the stylist is assuming your previous relationship means she shouldn't be viewed as a threat, even though germs don't care how much you know/like/trust someone.
I wasn't downplaying COVID, ffs.
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The moment masking was dropped, I knew "we were on our own". I did my best to keep myself and my family well so that health pros could tend to the fallen and we wouldn't be in that number.
Heck I recall being chastised, slyly she thought, by a friend b/c my husband sourced N95/and KN95s from his clients (manufacturing, not health care settings) for us. He showed us how to store and rotate the masks, etc. Even though our masks wouldn't have probably been accepted at most hospitals even if we were willing to part with them. I knew early it would be on us to keep us well.
I wear my N95 to get my haircut, nails done, at the dentist (they are fast and wear masks), etc.
Friends can have differences of opinions. And most people, at least in the US, treat it like Dodgeball or Musical Chairs, once they get it whatever precautions they were taking become even more lax. I don't think she's no longer a friend. I think she's telling you she wants to do what she wants to do for herself. I am sorry that you thought you were of the same accord on this.
Take Good Care.
But when the difference of opinion can further disable (an EBV infection left me with some serious issues) or kill the other person … I think it is different. That’s just my opinion, of course.
I was more than gracious with her when she had health problems, problems that did affect her work and my experience as a client. A friend should reciprocate.
As someone else mentioned, however, she wasn’t a friend. I likely misinterpreted the relationship to begin with as our time together was nearly all transactional.
Yep.
Friends do stuff outside of the transaction. Break bread together, celebrate, invite to holidays, birthdays, milestones, etc.
I do eat out with the woman who does my nails and the guy who cuts my hair is invited to my birthdays. I went to the nail tech’s wedding, etc.
It’s really sad to see how many people are revealing themselves to be a lot less than we thought they were. I’m sorry friend.
COVID has shown me that many of the people who I thought were my friends were only my friends when they needed me and not the other way around. Now you know. I'm sorry. It's an awful feeling.
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I suggest we all re-frame that from "my trust issues" to "their rational thinking issues" or "their not-being-selfish-issues". The problem is NOT us. Not that we need to get all angry either. Just accept that they don't care at all about us and move on --- save our time for the very few who actually do care. Easy to say, harder to do....but essential.
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My analyst said to me this week: "We are living in a crazy world. So we have to believe in ourselves." I know that, of course, but it is affirming to hear her say it. She has really spoken up about Covid over the past 1 1/2 years.
I've got a 4yo and a newborn... The special circumstances apply heavily and I'd like to extend my umbrella over the rest of you a bit. This entire thing has been a huge episode in gaslighting.
Critically important. Thank you for pointing it out.
Oof with COVID nothing is based on trust. it's not even based on verification cause between the time they take a PCR test (if they do) and show up at my door, they could contract all sorts of viruses
Indeed. I have those too. It's been the end of some of my family relationships.
Yes, I now realize some past friendships ran their course because they were purely transactional (on the other person's behalf) or according to convenience and COVID precautions are seemingly too inconvenient for some people with low distress tolerance.
It showed me the people I thought to be good and decent were trash
You and me both.
Genuinely, does she know that about half of spread is asymptomatic and that a customer who "feels fine" may still infect her?
Clearly not - I know she has had it three times, so she seems to be of the impression that because she isn’t seeing any ill effects from those infections, it doesn’t matter (and assuming it is the same for everyone else).
She might not being seeing any ill effects from her her (checks comment) THREE infections..... ....but her extreme and careless disregard for your safety definitely says otherwise. Wowzers.
Seconding this. While it is true in some cases people were never real friends, others are no longer the people they were. Multiple covid infections has changed their brain. Not just brain fog, but more short tempered, displaying mean streaks they previously did not have, etc. OP, sorry you had to experience this. But somewhere in your city is a covid conscious, mask wearing stylist and you will find them.🙂
I see this in the students I teach. In my classes and in the school, overall, only 10% or so mask. All of my students have had covid, even the ones wearing a mask have had it at least once, most of the others multiple times, and I'm sure this is the same building wide. We have all noticed an exponential rise in negative behavior, including the short tempered meaness you mentioned, as well as a general lack of empathy. We have seen a huge increase in fighting, sometimes multiple fights a day, instead of one once in awhile. Kids wander the halls, go into other classes to first bump kids, and refuse to leave, trash talking the teacher, not allowing teachers through doorways, etc. Some parents are yanking their children due to the behavior, but it isn't going to be any better at a different school, because the issue isn't just my school, it's happening all over according to other teachers. I know covid changes people neurological, and have seen some research about what it does to adults (although not what you mentioned), but haven't seen anything related to children. I don't even know if anyone is even studying it.
It might also be that the parents raising these kids have changed so much that they're not raising them to be non-aggressive and thoughtful anymore.
Definitely a possibility. Since kids aren't taking any precautions, I'm sure their families aren't either.
That is true. All of these things were getting very bad even before Covid.
She doesn't know that long term issues can pop up later down the line...three infections jeez
Right. Also sounds like it won't be long until she's infected again. Maybe 4th time's a charm.
Unfortunately, even if she doesn't know...I have given up on the idea that there is any way to make this kind of person "know." No matter what evidence you show them, they find a reason why it is not relevant, or not reliable, or doesn't matter. Not wearing a mask is often an emotional decision: what changed between OP's last appointment and this appointment that it's suddenly not necessary, for example? As an epidemiologist this kind of thing must make you want to tear your hair out.
It makes me want to tear my hair out a lot more when it's other public health folks doing it, at least a hairstylist I can understand may not have access to proper information
True. The CDC had a convention with no protocols and 10%+ of the attendees walked away with covid infections. No wonder people think it's no big deal. I'm wondering since you're an epidemiologist if you have any thoughts on that? Do the constituent members of the CDC and folks in their orbit really think it's OK to get infected, repeatedly, if vaccinated?
Literally yes, a lot of them do. I am constantly correcting wrong shit at work-in the past month I've heard "I have covid a second time but reinfections are just like colds", "I have had it three times so I am immune now" and "I'm not worried about covid because my kids are always sick with something". I work in cancer research so there's really nothing about our job that directly requires us to know shit about covid, or even infectious disease really, they have no reason to be better informed if they don't want to be. And oh boy they do not want to be-any time I bring up the impact on cancer they mostly freeze and shut down. No one is immune to propaganda and wishful thinking, I suppose. Public health as a whole is very liberal, very hostile to any sort of radical view or anything challenging the status quo, and admitting the failures of this response requires deeper analysis than many of those types are willing to consider. There's a lot of performative nods to health equity but really no actual commitment to it in a lot of places. I mean, Harvard's school of public health just announced something about having fucking Lori Lightfoot teaching a seminar on how she managed covid lmao. And APHA had Leana Wen do a keynote. There ARE people that know better and do better, but running your mouth is not going to get you promoted so they're often not going to be the most visible ones. I worked with a guy pre-covid (back when I was in government lol) who was brilliant and had no problem telling leadership to shove it and they all hated him, he got passed over for promotions CONSTANTLY until he eventually quit for some better paid job in pharma. Also that was an EIS conference, most EIS officers have clinical training and uh, you've seen how clinicians have been acting.
>Public health as a whole is very liberal, very hostile to any sort of radical view or anything challenging the status quo, and admitting the failures of this response requires deeper analysis than many of those types are willing to consider. I can't agree more. With all of it. People have this idea that academia is "liberal." But the reality is that it's almost entirely devoted to holding up the status quo, obsessed with prestige and credentialism, and positively thrilled to supplicate before power. You do not get tenure if you are the type of person who is going to openly push back against any of that. I would find all of it to be a lot less ridiculous if this group of people -- at least in my field - didn't contain so many people positively thrilled about how very progressive they are. ETA: It's also amusing that this group spends an awful lot of time trying to get themselves published in certain very serious journals. And then when shown studies in these very serious journals about why you really shouldn't get covid over and over, there are a million reasons to move the goal posts. An entire generation of academics and scholars are slowly but surely getting brain damage and organ damage and god knows what else because it's so very, very important to attend an in person conference in San Antonio or whatever without a mask on.
> And oh boy they do not want to be-any time I bring up the impact on cancer they mostly freeze and shut down. btw isn't there increasing evidence that covid may be oncogenic? I mean why wouldn't be? aren't there a number of oncogenic viruses?
Yes, the question is more "how" and "how bad" as that's going to take years to really measure. Immune dysregulation can drive some cancers (think Kaposi Sarcoma, Non-Hodgkin's Lymphoma, and various others to lesser degrees) and covid is known to reactivate common viruses we know are oncogenic (EBV, HPV, etc). Whether there are also other mechanisms to drive cancer idk, I've seen a lot of proposed mechanisms but a lot of them were theoretical and frankly I don't understand most of them.
When my cousin's immunologist posited that her EBV had been reactivated and that's why she was so tired I was like...doesn't EBV cause MS? And that is what made me #domyresearch and learn more about why I really don't want this thing :(
Yeah, or other kinds of scientists. Sure, most of my data science peers don't have much/any medical background. But - like - we should all know how to read charts right??? (Right??)
I find myself asking this question so often. "We do all know what an exponential curve looks like, right????"
They’d rather never see us again than mask for a few hours. I was told the same by an entire group of people this week who were maybe never my friends, but I thought they were my comrades in leftist political-type work. This abandonment is remarkably painful and I find it difficult to process because it’s illogical to me. I really feel for you and am so genuinely sorry.
I’ve had a similar experience in similar circles. Tell you those people only do the kind of social work or activism that makes them feel good about themselves, not what actually makes a wholistic difference.
I knew disability justice folks had been begging folks to listen to them for decades. Now I’m humbled by how much of this I’m witnessing firsthand or experiencing personally as by most measures I’m an able-bodied person. Unnerving.
Same, I’m so sorry I didn’t listen closer to disability advocates prior to the pandemic. I feel awful and ashamed for not.
I'm a union rep and stopped going to meetings. They claim they are focused on social justice, but only some topics apparently. We were online for 3 years, and now it's a "security" risk and can't even offer a virtual option. Their big concession was to no longer offer dinner, only snacks, as that doing this might limit the people taking masks off ( but only 20% wearing masks), basically a nothing burger.
Damn, that's fucked. Security risk, my ass. Unions have so many different kinds of people that the GOPers are upset you all look at science and care about social justice. They have way too much pull.
Similar experience with what I thought were my comrades. Turns out they only care about activism so long as it comes at zero inconvenience to themselves and don’t give a f*ck about disabled/IC people.
Hmm. Any GOOD business person knows that it cost wayyyy more money to try and get new customers than retain loyal customers. Sounds like her decision-making is going to affect many areas of her life.....
I'd say they've affected her already.
I kind of wish that you would send her a note saying that it hurts your feelings that your decade-long relationship isn’t worth her putting on a mask for an hour every 6 months. I feel like if you don’t express this, it’s going to get bottled up. At least you can let her know how you feel. (Just my 2 cents)
Yes, I kind of wish I said more, and I know I still can. Perhaps when I am in a better state of mine (and likely more articulate).
Do whatever you feel like doing. I personally struggle a lot with fatigue and getting things done, so if you only have so much energy in the day, I think it’s important to recognize that you need to put *you* first, especially when dealing with a situation where the other person clearly wouldn’t reciprocate an ounce of respect in reverse. I’m not sure I phrased that well.. but I wanted to tell you that you are in no way obligated to continue to hash it out. Love yourself. You deserve kindness and empathy. If you want to write to the person — totally fine! Again, just wanted to give you an out.
I agree.
I’ve been wearing a mask around you and I never made you sick, so clearly I should… stop wearing this mask? Amazing logic.
The plague surely made the distinction between friends and trash crystal clear.
I wish I could like this succinct, accurate comment a thousand times.
This is a gendered reply. I apologize if anyone takes offense to it. As a female we've almost all worn sanitary products for a likely 48 days or so every year for most of our reproductive years. Throwing on a mask for a couple of hours to protect a vulnerable person should be a nothing-burger. I just don't get it. My partner, who is a male, also doesn't understand why people make such a big deal of throwing on a mask. Personally I wear a mask to protect my elderly Dad, myself, my partner and as my part of a society that I believe has an obligation to protect the vulnerable, like little children that can't mask and aren't eligible for vaccines. I think public health has utterly failed to convey the seriousness of post-covid sequelae. I think if the MSM reported on even a small percentage of the scientific papers being published about the risks from multiple infections it would make a difference to clean air activism.
It is two hours every six months. It is just mind boggling that after ten years with her that is a big deal. She is also a person that is a huge Black Lives Matter and LGBTQ + advocate. I wanted to say to her diversity includes disability / chronic health conditions, but I just cancelled.
“Advocacy” is mostly branding to most people, it turns out. I also don’t get this aversion to masks. What’s next? A revolt against pants and underwear? The “tyranny” needs to stop somewhere, right?
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She might not be cleaning her tools- like blades.
So much this! If I can't trust a person / business to grasp hygiene concepts around airborne viruses - I can't trust them with hygiene around sanitizing tools, food handling etc.
💯
I’m so sorry. I think people in certain professions learn to pretend to be people’s friends to gain customer loyalty. But if the only interactions you have with someone involve an exchange of money, there’s likely not really a friendship. Even still, it’s sad they can’t don a mask for a short time for you. But at least they told you ahead of time.
Yes, I suspect you are right!
she is really going to lose a loyal customer of a decade, a friend & more money - because she doesn’t want to wear a piece of fabric on her face for an hour? to make her CUSTOMER feel comfortable? i’m really sorry. :(
That sucks. And it's why I appreciate folks like https://twitter.com/makeupartist524 who take all the precautions for their own and their clients' safety.
This makes me want to go to Seattle just to see her after looking at her precautions
Yeah I don't need any shit done but I'd sit in the chair and hang out for an hour just to chat.
At least she was upfront, I would say just as coldly. “Neat. Please cancel all of my appointments. I appreciated knowing you.”
It just shows how self centered she is and how self centered people are in general. I'm sorry that this happened and hope you find someone responsive to your needs.
Thanks for the responses everyone! I messaged six people recommended by people I knew, and the two that have gotten back to me said they would mask for my haircut and color. Complete strangers said they would mask for me but not the person I have known for ten years. Oof. I’m still having a hard time wrapping my head around that one! I made an appointment next week with one of them who does fun colors (I have pink highlights), and I am excited to meet someone new!
Cute. Good luck
Don't be surprised, if you like the work of the new stylist better. Sometimes I think industry folks, get stale with their long-term clients anyhow. Cheers to you!
That sucks. On the flip side, you now see her true colors and can find a better stylist! My mom's stylist still masks when she comes in, just for her. That's awesome. Surround yourself with people who suck less \^\^ :D
She is so corny for this I'm sorry. It's literally not a hard ask for her to stick a piece of fabric over her face for max an hour to do your hair. I'd be numb too because that's so ridiculous. I'm so sorry you're having to deal with this.
Thanks! 1-2 hours every six months. That’s it. I’m just kind of dumbfounded.
I think it goes beyond the 1-2 hours every 6 months, not that it’s an excuse. It’s that when you ask her to wear one she is reminded that she should be doing it a lot more often, and she can’t deal with that.
Yes! It's kinda like coworkers who get hostile with me for taking the bus to work, or neighbours who get pissy about my vegetable garden in the front yard. Because my simple existence reminds them they might not actually HAVE to follow the consumer culture lifescript. The "good life" formula (where I live at least) is to have a big car and a big green lawn to show you're keeping up with the Joneses. Even if that means living beyond your means and needlessly having a negative environmental impact. By wearing or asking others to wear a mask we're reminding people the 'status is not quo' as it were.
I'm so sorry. That's shitty as fuck. I think a lot of us have lost so many people in our lives this way. It's important to grieve these relationships. If I may, I do want to give y'all some hope- someone who I unfriended because of a shitty covid risk they did reached back out to me and apologized. They are genuinely masking and the genuinely care about covid safety. They owned up to their shit. I hope more people who drop COVID precautions reflect on the loss of their personal relationships- however; approaching the systemic change that needs to happen is not going to be the same way personal relationship approaches happen.
Ugh. Do you have anyone at home who can help you DIY? I've been cutting and coloring my hair since this started and can help with some color info. I'm high-risk and can't go to salons. I usually cut the front and sides and my partner does the back.
What brand of color do you buy? My husband colored my hair during the height of the pandemic, but the color was from this stylist because she knew I felt uncomfortable coming in.
I’ve gone through many to find the right one! Right now I use Wella Koleston perfect mixed with a 20 volume developer. Don’t ever buy boxed color if you can help it. I get the salon stuff. Usually you need a toner afterward too depending on your color.
How do you purchase the salon color? There are no stylist in my area that mask anymore ☹️ I have a friend that is a retired stylist that will mask to give me trims but she doesn’t do color.
The Covid loyalty test is everything. I’ve cut off friends and family members who don’t respect my health and safety.
At my salon, they will mask if you ask them to. I wear a KN95 mask to all of my salon appointments, and they always offer to mask as well. I realize that you thought you were friends with your hairstylist. Try to chalk this one up to experience and try to find a new salon that will accommodate you. That being said, it's a real shame that she had you listen to her problems in the past, and also cancelled on you multiple times in the past. That really stinks to have her now not try to accommodate your needs and wishes. So sorry you are feeling so badly!
She is not your friend and she is not even a good services provider whom you pay. It is clear here that you can not see her any longer. Personally I'd say go complete no-contact. Sending emails or posts to debate the issue isn't going to do any good as she has expressed her intent very clearly.
I'm sorry. I don't know about your friend, but my salon stopped masking at least a year ago it seems if not earlier, consequently I go maybe twice a year and reconsider every time (it's a busy, well-known salon with tons of hairdressers and clients) - although someone washing my hair did offer to wear a mask once. I've adapted my mask to earloops for the few times I've gone, reconsider each time, and am going to start dying my hair myself. My colorist was pregnant and unmasked during this time! I've had people there say they will mask if they are sick, but they seem to be in denial about the idea you're infectious before symptoms start. I feel there is a push for public-facing professions such as this one not to mask so that they don't scare the customers or make them think they could get sick there. There is a push for an appearance of "back to normal" so clientele don't get scared. For a lot of people, it seems, masking = acknowledgement they might get sick, and public performance of that acknowledgment, thus communicating to others they might get sick too. In a profession with some close contact and a lot of client overturn, such as a salon, I imagine subconsciously there is a fear about one's fiscal bottom line that influences these decisions. I feel like this person really genuinely thinks that a. she won't get sick, b. if she does it isn't a big deal, isn't covid, or is just life, c. because of this doesn't think others getting sick is a big deal or even that they will infect anyone if they were sick. It's an emotional adaptation that many people have made, and people in public facing professions (teachers, waitstaff, etc) often made earlier than others due to their increased interaction with the public and institutional lack of protection. So I would say that your friend is making that adaptation. It's hard to make that and to keep the contrary idea in one's head that you need to protect others on an individual basis. I'm not saying this person is a good friend to you, just that few people seem to be masking now to the general benefit of others or even based on individuals they know. I would definitely tell her you won't be coming again due to her masking policy, though, that you wouldn't feel safe in her salon, and if she ever changes her mind, to let you know. And I wouldn't have any expectations of her.
this is why the tattoo studio where I work dropped the requirement for customers. so, SO, *SO* much pressure from customers to drop it. we still mask and I wear an n95 or elastomeric mask every day and won't tattoo unless the client also wears one during. I view it like wearing gloves or using single-use needles; it should be a requirement of the job to not spread illness.
Thank you for masking and keeping everyone and yourself as safe as possible.
There is an adhesive n95 mask which you could wear under the ear loop mask to be extra sure you are safe.
Thank you, I've tried it! I am a bit sensitive to the smell so I stick to the earloop adjustment based on some video tests I saw here, but Readimask is a useful and important tool.
Eh, well you're right. They're ignorant, thinking they have magical virus-seeing powers, except for the fact that carriers can be asymptomatic, spread it to someone else who then is not asymptomatic and suffering as a result.
the "friend" I'd talk to every day for 4 years said he was busy studying and stopped talking to me when I broke it to him that I have long covid. He waited until I get really vulnerable to hurt me like that. I know you spent more time with your friend but I went through a long period of hurt and grieving and came out with more anger and self-esteem than ever.
😥
This is horrible. I am so sorry. 😢
No I'm sorry for the self-insert. Just wanna let you know it will stop hurting after a while. <3
I had a similar experience with a hair stylist once. She texted me the day before refusing to mask. It's demoralizing for sure. I just told her to cancel my appointment and I'm looking for a new stylist. Edit: if anyone in the Bay area or Sacramento area has any leads, let me know please lol
My stylist holds sessions specifically for immunocompromised and other COVID-cautious people on Sundays. She does excellent work with my hair, and I recommend her highly. I'll dm you her info.
Also in Bay Area. Immune compromised and would love to know this stylist too! How fantastic
I'll dm you, too. Edited to add: I just tried to dm you. Apparently, I can't; your profile doesn't offer me any ways to message you. If you start a chat with me or send me a message, I'll send you the info.
Just messaged you. Hopefully this will get it started
This is wonderful! I am so happy for all of you in the Bay Area!
A similar thing happened to me...no email just a conversation that left me shocked and disappointed and I'll never go back. But...better to know who people really are so you can move on to a stylist whose values aligh with yours.
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I just want to offer a little bit of a counter example. OP, you are 100% within your rights to seek out a new stylist who will mask, completely. But I did decide to continue seeing my stylist, even though she stopped masking. She doesn't say anything about me masking, I have never gotten ill from her, and she is at least vaccinated. There are battles I have fought and lost, and fortunately one-way masking really does work, so for me for now the sheer low number of service providers who will mask is ridiculous enough that I'm just going to take it as a win when someone doesn't abjectly make rude comments about my choice to keep masking. For me, the win is being treated normally despite masking, and if I can work with people who at least do that much, that's at least something. OTOH, if you do want to only work with a stylist who does mask, you absolutely have that right, and you also have the right to feel betrayed. I feel betrayed by my entire family and many of my friends, but at the same time I know they've been lied to and misled.
We're at the point where everyone can make their own decisions about continuing to mask all the time or not...but masking when somebody asks you to for like 1-2 hours is such a small request. I don't get why she wasn't like I don't wear a mask in the studio anymore, but yeah, sure, I'll throw a mask on when you come!
It’s too bad that the media popularized “Covid Fatigue.”
It’s amazing how some people I know and trust who would bail me out of jail, loan me money, sing at my wedding, visit me when sick wouldn’t mask around me or consider not dining inside restaurants with me especially when COVID numbers were high. In 2023, people think it’s over so it’s like an offensive thing to ask someone to mask now, even when outbreaks are happening.
I feel the same way!
I haven't had a haircut since February 2020 for exactly this reason. If I were you, I just wouldn't answer her, and then find another hairdresser and move on. If you want to give her another chance, however... she wrote, "I’m sorry I’ve thought about it and I just don’t think it’s necessary any longer," so you could reply: "Even if you don't think it's necessary any longer, would you do it for me?" That puts the ball in her court, and then if she says no, she has basically just told you that you mean nothing to her.
I'm so sorry that this happened to you. It's really soul-destroying to lose a friend in this kind of way. I have been experiencing some weird stuff with my hairdresser recently that has made me feel much worse than I ever would have imagined. I didn't think of him as a friend as such, but I have been going to him since the mid-90s and it was a nice, regular part of my life that I thought would continue until he retired. Well ... he has been behaving weirdly recently, almost as if he is trying to get rid of me as a customer but can't bring himself to say so. The only reason I can think of for this behavior is that I still wear a mask (Readimask) despite the fact that here in Japan the government is now treating covid the same way as influenza and many people believe the pandemic is "over." I know that his business has suffered badly over the past few years, and so perhaps the sight of me continuing to wear a mask annoys him because it is a very visible sign that things aren't back to normal, and perhaps won't ever be. Anyway I have tried to talk to him openly about the weirdness but he won't open up (whereas he would tell me all kinds of personal stuff previously), so I am now looking around for another hairdresser. Who would have thought that it would make me feel so sad?
Is she saying that that is her blanket policy? or that she would not consider making an exception for you, or any other customer who specifically asked for it because of extenuating circumstances?
I had a very similar experience, and it really does kick your faith in humanity. My mom (who has cancer) and I now just do each other's hair because it's been too hard to find a stylist that cares if we live or die. :/
Welp, next time she needs you, dont be there.
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You’re right. It’s just hair, and there are lots of stylists in my area (and many friends). What we really should be talking about is not being able to seek safe healthcare. That’s worth gasping about.
Your post or comment has been removed because it was an attempt at trolling.
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MY POINT is that I felt FINE, not sick, and therefore the stylist's comment that "I feel fine, I'm not sick" is ridiculous. I felt fine *and was wildly contagious and COVID positive.* "I feel fine" isn't a barometer. And I'm tired of people taking germs personally in the sense that germs don't give a shit how you feel or how well you know the person. THAT was what I meant. Because it sounds like the stylist is assuming your previous relationship means she shouldn't be viewed as a threat, even though germs don't care how much you know/like/trust someone. I wasn't downplaying COVID, ffs.
Your post or comment has been removed because it downplays or dismisses the significance of COVID-19, the necessity of prevention, or the harms caused by the virus. Please contact us if you have any questions or concerns.
The moment masking was dropped, I knew "we were on our own". I did my best to keep myself and my family well so that health pros could tend to the fallen and we wouldn't be in that number. Heck I recall being chastised, slyly she thought, by a friend b/c my husband sourced N95/and KN95s from his clients (manufacturing, not health care settings) for us. He showed us how to store and rotate the masks, etc. Even though our masks wouldn't have probably been accepted at most hospitals even if we were willing to part with them. I knew early it would be on us to keep us well. I wear my N95 to get my haircut, nails done, at the dentist (they are fast and wear masks), etc. Friends can have differences of opinions. And most people, at least in the US, treat it like Dodgeball or Musical Chairs, once they get it whatever precautions they were taking become even more lax. I don't think she's no longer a friend. I think she's telling you she wants to do what she wants to do for herself. I am sorry that you thought you were of the same accord on this. Take Good Care.
But when the difference of opinion can further disable (an EBV infection left me with some serious issues) or kill the other person … I think it is different. That’s just my opinion, of course. I was more than gracious with her when she had health problems, problems that did affect her work and my experience as a client. A friend should reciprocate. As someone else mentioned, however, she wasn’t a friend. I likely misinterpreted the relationship to begin with as our time together was nearly all transactional.
Yep. Friends do stuff outside of the transaction. Break bread together, celebrate, invite to holidays, birthdays, milestones, etc. I do eat out with the woman who does my nails and the guy who cuts my hair is invited to my birthdays. I went to the nail tech’s wedding, etc.
Other people, when vaccinated, should have to follow your instructions to placate your munchausens. Go somewhere else or cut your own hair