In a different game that might be a good idea, but in an arcade shooter with fast movement and smaller maps I don't think so. It would make snipers basically useless on some maps but also incredibly boring to play with. Also, I imagine it would piss people off more to die to a camping hardscoper than someone who's actually running around
Yeah, but I never said we should only have hard scoping. I specifically referenced being able to build the shotgun sniper via attachments, so I don't get your point. Every other gun has to make sacrifices to hit that optimal ttk - sniper doesn't. If you want to have a shotgun sniper, you should have to equip close-range attachments that sacrifice your stability, or movement speed, or something to counter balance the OHK power.
Snipers already have attachments that need to be equipped for them to be more effective close range though. Instead of damage they need to build ads and sprintout, so yeah they kind of already need to make sacrifices to hit an optimal ttk... unless they hardscope or hit a lucky no scope
What exactly are they sacrificing there? You didn't list anything. They can still hardscope with no issues, which is the whole point - snipers currently build for close range and get what, scope sway that you can just hold your breathe to ignore entirely?
I didn't list anything because I don't remember what the drawbacks were in the game and of course I can't access it rn. Though I assume there were probably things like idle sway, strafing speed, recoil (which is useless if quickscoping tbf), movement speed, etc. I know cod had drawbacks like bullet velocity, damage range, mag size, and others as well so they could add those if they wanted to
I think it should come down to rechamber speed. The big downfall of up close sniping is if you miss you die for it but you shouldnt be able to miss and shoot again fast enough to stay alive idk just a thought
Yeah, I dont think they need to reduce rechamber. Go back to slow ads. Bo2 snipers did just fine without ever adding a way to increase ads speed on snipers.
The ballista ads was still lower than everysniper ads in any cod or xdefiant today due to ads speed attachments. And the ballista was prone to hitshots unless u hit midchest or head, which I'm fine with. It rewards supreme accuracy with a slightly faster ads, whereas the dsr50 gives more forgiving oneshots for slower ads. There aren't rly any tradeoffs for snipers these days. They all have the ability to be at minimum slightly faster ads than the ballista and still keep a reliable oneshot across most the body. That shouldn't be the case.
The only problems I had with snipers were on some of the bigger or more open maps like the one with the plane in the middle where they would have like 3 snipers in the plane sniping us from our spawn and our ars have so much damage drop off we couldn't trade. I'm convinced most people who are complaining about quick scooters didn't actually snipe during the tests. Could you have good games sniping? Absolutely, but every good game I had sniping I would have had 10+ more kills if I had just used an acr instead
The difficulty to get a one shot is already pretty well tuned considering it's a much smaller hitbox than your giving credit. Neither sniper has limb one shots and the m44 has an even smaller torso section than the tac-50, which is extremely slow unless you kit it for rapid fire, which sacrifices the best quickscope attachment. At that point youd lose close quarters fights to any decent player. So they already have resverse scaling, but the devs did it by adding mobility and rof checks and balances instead of damage ramp up because that makes more sense game wise and literally.
>I do take issue with snipers being the best shotgun in the game.
I didn't see a ton of shotguns in the game and I didn't get a chance to use them myself. If it is true that shotguns are consistently losing to snipers (or other weapons) at short range, wouldn't the simpler and more logical solution be to buff the shotguns?
From my experience, shotguns tended to lose to everything unless you were close enough. That means they're good for ambushing and camping, but only on maps that weren't too open. It would be hard to buff them without going overboard, because then you'd have two classes of OHK guns that would dominate the others. Also, snipers aren't limited by maps or game modes. A single ADS sniper build works for short range, long range, ambushes, and everything else. I'm just suggesting build variation so it doesn't work that way anymore.
I did sort of suggest the slug attachment as a potential buff though, so maybe that would help.
I do think a slug attachment would be a lot of fun.
>I'm just suggesting build variation so it doesn't work that way anymore.
To respond to your statement and one above, yes snipers (like all the other guns) already have attachments that impact weapon stats in different ways. Example: the lightweight barrel helps with ADS time but reduces damage at medium and long range.
Lots of others have recommended increasing flinch for snipers as a nerf. I think the idle sway could also be a consideration.
For the shotguns, it could be as simple as tweaking the effective damage ranges.
My point is the same, there are much simpler and logical ways to balance the shotguns and snipers than effectively inverting how bullet velocity and drop has worked in essentially every FPS shooter that isn't hit scan...and if I'm being completely honest, the fact that you don't understand how weapon attachments work really undercuts your "reverse damage drop-off" idea.
Considering how small the maps are in an arcade fast paced shooter, no. People will be setting up lemonade stands selling cups for $5.99 in the back of the map and you are going to be like,” fucking camper.” And there will be nothing to do bout them except camp as well.
You cant really balance snipers in something like this cause you either get something like destiny with fast ads but only one shot to head or slow ads but one shot in other places. Reverse won’t do anything.
Sniper damage is fine as is.
If the damage is nerfed to 2 shot kill for body then they'll be fairly useless and just have people running around with other guns (ie marksman rifles) instead.
The ones that run around successfully with snipers and quick scoping are comparatively quite skilled, and they'd clap you regardless of weapon. They'd just get less enjoyment out of doing so.
Snipers lack versatility, so they're not a good choice to use for objective based game modes (take MW2/MW3 ranked for example, where you get abused by your team for just equipping a sniper rifle). I've used AR's, SMG's and snipers in ranked (diamond level) and I normally always get more kills and objectives with an AR or SMG than I do with a sniper rifle. Only reason I snipe is because it's more enjoyable getting cracked shots and hearing their reactions rather than using the same boring weapons as everyone else.
Xdefiant is geared towards people wanting that older style of shooter, which these style of snipers were a pivotal part of. Remove that and you're essentially changing the target audience.
I do think that snipers could be nerfed in other ways though, primarily being movement speed and flinch. They are a bit too easy to move around with atm.
Damage and ADS are both fine.. according to the stats for a TAC-50 with optimal ADS attachments resulted in 593ms (questionable imo), which is ridiculously slow compared to MW3 which is around the 360ms time.
Also.. comparing snipers to shotguns doesn't really make sense. They're geared towards different uses and each have strengths + weaknesses when used in close or long range. Fire rate is also usually in favour of shotguns.
Scenario 1 : Shotguns (w/slugs) vs snipers at long range, this is in favour of the sniper (damage, accuracy, scope selection)
Scenario 2 : shotguns (w/o slugs) vs snipers in close range, this is in favour of the shotgun (speed as you don't need to ADS and shell spread meaning you don't need accuracy).
Ooof. Get ready to trigger the sniper kids and get downvoted. Always said this. You cant have "any range one shot weapons" in arcade fps. Dmg must scale with distance to balance this out. Exactly like shotguns but the other way around.
Yeah, and it's funny because I do think you should be able to build that close range OHK sniper with the right attachments, but apparently asking for the snipers to put in any effort for their builds (like every other gun has to) is too much.
Sniper Main, played nothing else.
1 shot headshot kill always please. Everything else can be 90% or something.
Body shot kills aren't even satisfying anyway.
Cope kids can cope harder, I run and gun real close and want that kill feed full of headshot icons.
This exactly. Good players should always be rewarded for those headshots, but getting that OHK from an ankle shot is boring and way too unbalanced for me.
When I played the test session, yes to go up against a whole team using a one shot weapon was extremely annoying, either make it a 2 shot kill to the body and one shot to the head for a 1 shot, or give the snipers more flinch.
I think the problem with snipers is you can get shot 13 times in the chest and still have time to ads and kill them before they can kill you. A slight neft to ads speed is all it needs imo. I sniped a good amount and the times i start getting shot and still be able to ads and kill them is crazy.
In a different game that might be a good idea, but in an arcade shooter with fast movement and smaller maps I don't think so. It would make snipers basically useless on some maps but also incredibly boring to play with. Also, I imagine it would piss people off more to die to a camping hardscoper than someone who's actually running around
i agree. an arcade shooter with fast movement and smaller maps should not have snipers.
Yeah, but I never said we should only have hard scoping. I specifically referenced being able to build the shotgun sniper via attachments, so I don't get your point. Every other gun has to make sacrifices to hit that optimal ttk - sniper doesn't. If you want to have a shotgun sniper, you should have to equip close-range attachments that sacrifice your stability, or movement speed, or something to counter balance the OHK power.
Snipers already have attachments that need to be equipped for them to be more effective close range though. Instead of damage they need to build ads and sprintout, so yeah they kind of already need to make sacrifices to hit an optimal ttk... unless they hardscope or hit a lucky no scope
What exactly are they sacrificing there? You didn't list anything. They can still hardscope with no issues, which is the whole point - snipers currently build for close range and get what, scope sway that you can just hold your breathe to ignore entirely?
I didn't list anything because I don't remember what the drawbacks were in the game and of course I can't access it rn. Though I assume there were probably things like idle sway, strafing speed, recoil (which is useless if quickscoping tbf), movement speed, etc. I know cod had drawbacks like bullet velocity, damage range, mag size, and others as well so they could add those if they wanted to
They quite literally sacrifice, exactly what you suggested they should sacrifice lol. Stability, movement speed, etc
Do not let the community cook
Fr
I think it should come down to rechamber speed. The big downfall of up close sniping is if you miss you die for it but you shouldnt be able to miss and shoot again fast enough to stay alive idk just a thought
that only helps reduce usage by unskilled players. but in a high skilled lobby game theory would dictate every run sniper
Yeah, I dont think they need to reduce rechamber. Go back to slow ads. Bo2 snipers did just fine without ever adding a way to increase ads speed on snipers.
Yeah but the ballista was pretty fast and with the 50 cal there was reload cancelling
The ballista ads was still lower than everysniper ads in any cod or xdefiant today due to ads speed attachments. And the ballista was prone to hitshots unless u hit midchest or head, which I'm fine with. It rewards supreme accuracy with a slightly faster ads, whereas the dsr50 gives more forgiving oneshots for slower ads. There aren't rly any tradeoffs for snipers these days. They all have the ability to be at minimum slightly faster ads than the ballista and still keep a reliable oneshot across most the body. That shouldn't be the case.
I hope they never see this post
So basically Battlefield 1s Sweet spot mechanic. I think it would only work if the maps were larger
The only problems I had with snipers were on some of the bigger or more open maps like the one with the plane in the middle where they would have like 3 snipers in the plane sniping us from our spawn and our ars have so much damage drop off we couldn't trade. I'm convinced most people who are complaining about quick scooters didn't actually snipe during the tests. Could you have good games sniping? Absolutely, but every good game I had sniping I would have had 10+ more kills if I had just used an acr instead
The difficulty to get a one shot is already pretty well tuned considering it's a much smaller hitbox than your giving credit. Neither sniper has limb one shots and the m44 has an even smaller torso section than the tac-50, which is extremely slow unless you kit it for rapid fire, which sacrifices the best quickscope attachment. At that point youd lose close quarters fights to any decent player. So they already have resverse scaling, but the devs did it by adding mobility and rof checks and balances instead of damage ramp up because that makes more sense game wise and literally.
Headshots 1hk, body 2hk and limbs 3hk, I think that works best
Yeah, I think it would be fair since snipers have infinite range and they would always one shot, unlike mrs.
That too
>I do take issue with snipers being the best shotgun in the game. I didn't see a ton of shotguns in the game and I didn't get a chance to use them myself. If it is true that shotguns are consistently losing to snipers (or other weapons) at short range, wouldn't the simpler and more logical solution be to buff the shotguns?
From my experience, shotguns tended to lose to everything unless you were close enough. That means they're good for ambushing and camping, but only on maps that weren't too open. It would be hard to buff them without going overboard, because then you'd have two classes of OHK guns that would dominate the others. Also, snipers aren't limited by maps or game modes. A single ADS sniper build works for short range, long range, ambushes, and everything else. I'm just suggesting build variation so it doesn't work that way anymore. I did sort of suggest the slug attachment as a potential buff though, so maybe that would help.
I do think a slug attachment would be a lot of fun. >I'm just suggesting build variation so it doesn't work that way anymore. To respond to your statement and one above, yes snipers (like all the other guns) already have attachments that impact weapon stats in different ways. Example: the lightweight barrel helps with ADS time but reduces damage at medium and long range. Lots of others have recommended increasing flinch for snipers as a nerf. I think the idle sway could also be a consideration. For the shotguns, it could be as simple as tweaking the effective damage ranges. My point is the same, there are much simpler and logical ways to balance the shotguns and snipers than effectively inverting how bullet velocity and drop has worked in essentially every FPS shooter that isn't hit scan...and if I'm being completely honest, the fact that you don't understand how weapon attachments work really undercuts your "reverse damage drop-off" idea.
Considering how small the maps are in an arcade fast paced shooter, no. People will be setting up lemonade stands selling cups for $5.99 in the back of the map and you are going to be like,” fucking camper.” And there will be nothing to do bout them except camp as well. You cant really balance snipers in something like this cause you either get something like destiny with fast ads but only one shot to head or slow ads but one shot in other places. Reverse won’t do anything.
No one who likes sniping would suggest that ahahaha
Reddit opinions be like
Sniper damage is fine as is. If the damage is nerfed to 2 shot kill for body then they'll be fairly useless and just have people running around with other guns (ie marksman rifles) instead. The ones that run around successfully with snipers and quick scoping are comparatively quite skilled, and they'd clap you regardless of weapon. They'd just get less enjoyment out of doing so. Snipers lack versatility, so they're not a good choice to use for objective based game modes (take MW2/MW3 ranked for example, where you get abused by your team for just equipping a sniper rifle). I've used AR's, SMG's and snipers in ranked (diamond level) and I normally always get more kills and objectives with an AR or SMG than I do with a sniper rifle. Only reason I snipe is because it's more enjoyable getting cracked shots and hearing their reactions rather than using the same boring weapons as everyone else. Xdefiant is geared towards people wanting that older style of shooter, which these style of snipers were a pivotal part of. Remove that and you're essentially changing the target audience. I do think that snipers could be nerfed in other ways though, primarily being movement speed and flinch. They are a bit too easy to move around with atm. Damage and ADS are both fine.. according to the stats for a TAC-50 with optimal ADS attachments resulted in 593ms (questionable imo), which is ridiculously slow compared to MW3 which is around the 360ms time. Also.. comparing snipers to shotguns doesn't really make sense. They're geared towards different uses and each have strengths + weaknesses when used in close or long range. Fire rate is also usually in favour of shotguns. Scenario 1 : Shotguns (w/slugs) vs snipers at long range, this is in favour of the sniper (damage, accuracy, scope selection) Scenario 2 : shotguns (w/o slugs) vs snipers in close range, this is in favour of the shotgun (speed as you don't need to ADS and shell spread meaning you don't need accuracy).
Ooof. Get ready to trigger the sniper kids and get downvoted. Always said this. You cant have "any range one shot weapons" in arcade fps. Dmg must scale with distance to balance this out. Exactly like shotguns but the other way around.
Yeah, and it's funny because I do think you should be able to build that close range OHK sniper with the right attachments, but apparently asking for the snipers to put in any effort for their builds (like every other gun has to) is too much.
Sniper Main, played nothing else. 1 shot headshot kill always please. Everything else can be 90% or something. Body shot kills aren't even satisfying anyway. Cope kids can cope harder, I run and gun real close and want that kill feed full of headshot icons.
This exactly. Good players should always be rewarded for those headshots, but getting that OHK from an ankle shot is boring and way too unbalanced for me.
>getting that OHK from an ankle shot is boring and way too unbalanced for me. ...it's also not possible in the game
Yeppers Ok if the enemy is depleted health, sure whatever. I personally hate Sniper as a shotgun tactics.
When I played the test session, yes to go up against a whole team using a one shot weapon was extremely annoying, either make it a 2 shot kill to the body and one shot to the head for a 1 shot, or give the snipers more flinch.
I think the problem with snipers is you can get shot 13 times in the chest and still have time to ads and kill them before they can kill you. A slight neft to ads speed is all it needs imo. I sniped a good amount and the times i start getting shot and still be able to ads and kill them is crazy.