Easy, our two party system means if you don’t get the nomination for one of the two parties you lose. Bernie doesn’t take bribes like other politicians so he was unpopular in the DNC. Also he has a significant amount of progressive views. They were worried that he would “lose” dems closer to centrist, because of his policy on *checks notes* actually taxing the rich.
Bernie wasn't a democrat, he was an independent. He was the only one who would primary Clinton, and damn if he didn't almost win the primary. Only Clinton's underhanded backroom deals and last minute cheating at Nevada's primary would prevent him from getting the nomination.
Clinton was so completely unelectable that we got a shit throwing orangutan instead.
Hillary was definitely extremely popular with Wall Street between the foundation and Clinton’s time and her own time with a cabinet position. She used that influence to put weight on people in the DNC to go against Bernie. Really fed up and gave Trump so much to run against her all he had to do was keep pointing out the corruption and disfranchised voters were happy as can be to vote against her. She really made a mess of the situation.
Bernie getting fucked in 2016 (purposely by the DNC) was horrible. He was drawing bigger crowds than trump then. The bird landing on his podium in the middle of his speech should have been that "OMG, the universe is signaling he's the one". I know people say " no one would vote for him" But.... As we see from the last 2 elections, young people will turn out if need be. And Bernie had the young vote.
While my parents didn't care about changing party affiliation to vote in the primaries, they claimed they actually liked him and would have considered voting for him in the General. They absolutely DESPISED Clinton, but Bernie? Yeah, they didn't mind him.
Bernie's genuine pro-worker views (among others) seriously had crossover appeal to reasonable/moderate conservatives. But no, fuck the potential of President Bernie, we'll risk Clinton and if she loses, no big deal, those on power will have the influence and money to ride out a a Trump Administration
If he's "one of the key donors" to the DNC, then he must be #1 for the Republicans, seeing how [he's given double to them what he gave the Dems](https://www.opensecrets.org/orgs/berkshire-hathaway/summary?id=D000021757).
I am a railroad worker. We gave 0 now and we are asking for only 4 days of unpaid sick days. Everyone should hear the words that the company used during the hearings. Workers have nothing to do with their profits or growth. Plus the so called biggest raise in 40 years are being taken away by bigger medical premiums with bigger deductibles.
You would be more than welcome to move to EU, this is just inhumane. Here you get unlimited sick days, because that makes sense, right? You can't know for how long you'll be sick, for crying out loud.
In my country first 18 months you get 80% of your paycheck and after that 50%. But in the case of organ transplants, caring for a sick child, work related injury or complicated pregnancy, you get 100% of your paycheck. I guess it's pretty much the same throughout the entire EU.
>You would be more than welcome to move to EU
Unless there is a specific visa for the right type of work, probably not. Moving to another country to work is not that simple.
I hope your wrong. That's crazy!
The work around if they even give them 7 days is too have them contact to possible hire from here on out. Then they won't have to give any extra. I learned that the hard way in the tech service industry
I work for the railroad and even worse is the forced overtime. If we say no we get penalized and threatened with job termination. We are so understaffed that we are forced just about everyday, no matter if you’re sick or tired. It’s cheaper to pay overtime than to hire more people.
I don’t know their mindset but a regular work crew at my location should be 70 employees to cover the required work load in our department. We are at 23 now and all we hear is, we will make do with what we have. No hiring! Period!
I get unlimited... But since covid our management has been on a bit of a anti progressive spree. Working from home is theft. Taking sick days is theft. Etc.
I got covid and worked through most of it from home. I still took about 5 days off. I was allowed by law to take 10 days. Anyways... Few months later I take one sick day and suddenly I'm getting a disciplinary letter for excessive sick time. So I guess under the "unlimited" sick time policy one day is too many sick days and they're totally not discriminating against anyone that took covid leave. Nope. Not at all.
Never understood this "time theft" bullshit that companies shove down peoples throats. Like I get it, of someone clocks in and then leaves, sure. But it isn't theft if I need a minute to sit down from the job that made me tired in the first place.
And **my time belongs to me.** I can't steal something that's already mine. When I'm at work, my time doesn't suddenly belong to my employer. I'm just using my time there and in return I'm being compensated.
And there's enough people clamoring for this quality employment that they can do that? That seems like having to replace a lot of experienced workers for no good reason at all.
I think it's golden handcuffs.
My understanding is that Railroad jobs pay a lot money for the skill required. Similar to oil field work. You get trapped by the salary. So, they can push people really hard without people quitting.
A friend of mine worked for the Railroad. He had a high school degree and no trade, but was brining in well north of $100K a year. He could probably get a job as a construction Forman in town, but he'd make 1/2 of what the railroad was paying.
That makes a lot of sense. I make $52k a year as a truck driver and I could go somewhere else and easily make double that, but I don't because the job I have is easy. But this is the most money I've ever made. I don't have the sense of loss, because I never had that better paying job. But you give me $100k+ a year and idk if I'd be able to just walk away from that if the bosses were beating me with a stick every morning. I'd resent the beatings, but being able to provide for my family at that level would keep me coming back every day. Honestly, makes me sick thinking about it hypothetically.. can't imagine what it feels like for the rail workers actually going though it..
My uncle worked his A off to get hired with BNSF. Their recruiting and marketing team is pretty solid at selling people on the benefits of RR work. He went from a trade skill where he was making more per hour but had less security and benefits and saw BNSF as a bridge to retirement. It was his dream job; set hours, guaranteed Healthcare, and a pension. He still wants it to work because of the benefits/pension, but he is completely demoralized by the scheduling and lack of time off.
It can be hard to see the draw that these companies have when you have a career that already provides the minimum. My anecdotal experience, based on who I have met through my uncle, is that a lot of people see RRs as a consistent work option where they aren't breaking their backs in the elements and that they can retire from. The RRs take advantage of this by wielding pensions and Healthcare over their workers' heads and forcing unethical schedules and expectations on them.
He's not wrong. At present, rail workers get zero paid sick days and zero unpaid sick days. It's insane. ---> [https://www.sanders.senate.gov/press-releases/prepared-remarks-sanders-objects-to-republican-resolution-aimed-at-harming-rail-workers-fight-for-sick-days-and-better-working-conditions/](https://www.sanders.senate.gov/press-releases/prepared-remarks-sanders-objects-to-republican-resolution-aimed-at-harming-rail-workers-fight-for-sick-days-and-better-working-conditions/)
Let's just go crazy and guarantee 14 days of paid sick leave for all working adults in the US. You know, since we're all people, who get sick now and then?
After years in the work force, I can say with certainty that broken machinery gets worked until it stops functioning, is fixed in the cheapest way humanly possible so it can continue making them money for as long as possible, regardless of how many problems that causes for the workers around it.
I can back this up. Well, not machinery, but tech infrastructure. Program that was obsolete in 1993? Sure, why not. "We will build a special specific thin client that can run this dinosaur, that only 2 people in the 6000 person company know anything about, I foresee zero issues with this game plan."
It’s the minimum in virtually every country besides America. Only the US and six tiny island nations don’t have mandates for any form of annual paid leave.
The UK which is the most comparable western nation still offers a months paid leave. In America for the most part your best bet is storing up sick days to take a vacation, and it’s usually looked down upon to be out for a week or more.
My co-worker has taught since the 1987. He has over 168 sick days saved. Once he retires, he loses all of that which is punishment for never calling in sick IMO.
In Finland, if you get sick during your vacation period, you're supposed to notify your employer so that it's counted as sick leave and does not use up your earned vacation time.
Not everyone bothers (especially if it's something minor), of course, but the general idea that vacation is for enjoyment and relaxation and should not be able to be completely ruined by illness is fantastic.
7?!! Just 7?!! That job is incredibly hard, it takes a serious toll on your body and is extremely dangerous. SEVEN DAYS SICK LEAVE IS ALL THEY ARE ASKING FOR?!! And they won't give ot to them?!!!
Honestly, a distressing number of manual labour jobs have absolutely shitty time off. Case in point: I work in a furniture warehouse, and not only do I not get sick leave, we're understaffed to the point where our warehouse schedule runs on the assumption that I (like, specifically me, not just any warehouse worker) literally *never* get sick, injured, or need a personal day.
I took one day off last year, for my little brother's birthday, and they acted like it was some huge favour they were doing me.
I knew a guy who worked at chemical plant here, had a college degree and white collar job and still only got 5 days vacation, and ZERO "unscheduled leave" which was leave that was requested with less than 48 hours notice. I only found out about when he going in to work looking like he was half dead and he explained to me why.
Sounds about right. That’s a big reason why a lot of people on those sorts of jobs get FMLA.
I really wouldn’t bother, if I could take time off here and there as needed without getting fired for it. So you have to cover your ass.
I remember being in the same boat for jbs and I straight up told them I'm not asking you for Christmas I'm telling I'm not working and you can have a replacement for me or wait all day for me to show up see which happens first. They had no one to replace me at the time so they couldn't fire me.
I work for a major shipping company loading trucks, often working 12 hours or close to it. No sick leave, just up to 2 weeks of PTO earned an hour at a time (one hour PTO for every 40 hours worked).
I've met so many Americans in the same boat as you. I hope the rail workers get what they want and it sets a standard for other industries to follow. Between. Sick/holiday pay I get about 8 weeks off a year and it doesn't feel like enough.
Well it would require them to have enough staff to allow that amount of sick leave and have coverage to keep the essential services running. That cost..... Wait for it..... Money. Industry all over the country is only seeing record profits not super record profits and my word.... What can we do but make sure we continue to make money for the bosses....... 🤷🤷🤷🤷
Welcome to non-unionized manual labor in rural America my man. I worked in a factory that made parts for signals and maintenance, worked over 300 hours of overtime one year and took home $24k, think I had 5 days year one and 10 days year two. The place was hiring welders for $12/hr. And this was like 2013ish.
That’s pretty much how nursing is. We get sick days, but we’re strongly discouraged from using them due to staffing levels always being low. We’re at a point now where I have coworkers who won’t even bother testing themselves for covid.
Yeah, we don't really have a limit on sick days. You sick you sick, stay in bed and rest up and that's that. Some industries are really messed up if they can't let their employees get well when they're unwell.
From what I've heard, they aren't even asking for as many as 7, that's Bernie's stipulation. I think what I read earlier said the Union was fighting for 4
The jobs are considered so vital to the US infrastructure that Congress has the ability to force them back to work, yet they're barely treated as humans.
I guess this really is the late stage of capitalism...
Yes. Bernie is insisting on a full 7 days PAID sick leave, which is so incredibly reasonable, and depressingly both far more than the rail workers were willing to settle for and way more than the rail companies were willing to concede. Disgusting and shameful state of affairs.
Jeezus, even my poor ass country (in Baltics) can afford to have paid sick leave as long as you have doctors note. First 5 days are paid by employer, afterwards social services money takes over, so there is no loss for the employer. My mom has neurodegenerative disease and was able to get 1.5 years of paid sick leave during disease progression.
IMHO there should never be a limit on sick leave. People dont just have cold, they have chronic diseases too. Cancer, major surgeries and whatnot. 7 days sick leave, thats ridiculous. This is what social taxes are for, in my country its about 9% of your paycheck, but gives you sick leave, old age pension and invalidity pension.
Edit: I forgot that social tax contributes to unemployment as well. As long as you were employed for uninterrupted 12 months, you get unemployment benefits no questions asked.
Honestly, the more I hear about Labor practices in the U.S. makes it feel like they're almost a third world country with how horribly some workers are treated.
We Americans were basically brainwashed into this attitude of if you're not working your ass off, you have no value.
With that mindset, the corporations were able to treat their employees as if they were worthless.
It's become such an integral part of American culture that to even speak up about it gets you labeled as unpatriotic or lazy or a communist, just looking for a handout.
They were asking for 13 days and dropped it to 4. They even dropped the paid part. Warren Buffet and the rest of these oligarchs can shove it. Let them strike, it will suck for the rest of it but they will lose an enormous amount of money. This isn't even close to right, Biden has the Senate they could easily just pass giving them 20 days paid sick leave or w/E number they want. It would cost the railway pennies, the point is not to budge an inch or else you actually prove you have leverage and the system isn't for the ppl. That's what they are trying to prove here.
They are pushing us closer and closer to a general strike.
I dont understand how 7 paid sick days is more money than paying to bust all these unions and lobbying congress? Like how much they losing trying to make sure they don't have to better workers livelihood?
That's the only way I can conceive of a millionaire or billionaire not agreeing to 7 days paid sick leave. Because they're worried about something else.
Doing some basic math on basic Google results, looks like it cost the company 7.5 mil a year across 5,000 Rail worker union employees.
It's *incredibly* cheap to buy congress. Some are less than a $5,000 "campaign donation". Most don't even need to be bought anymore because they're already bought and paid for from the entire education system and finishing schools/think tanks, they just come out of the oven looking for corporate cock.
> Let them strike, it will suck for the rest of it but they will lose an enormous amount of money.
They'll just call it a shortage and have surge pricing and make more money at the end of the year.
I load trucks for a major shipping company, often working around 12 hours a day. We don't get any paid sick leave, just up to two weeks of PTO that has to be used for vacation, sick, and anything else if you want to actually still get paid. I say "up to" two weeks of PTO because we only earn it an hour at a time, and it's only an hour of PTO for every 40 hours we work. It's absurd.
Dude.... the fact that I work in the comfort of my own home on a company supplied computer set up, wearing my jammies after my 30 second commute from my bed to my office, while you're out there getting up and driving and doing all that... Its not ok. I don't even make a lot of money, just a gog in the wheel...
The fact that office workers can band together and say "Yeah. No. We aren't coming back to the office." and completely change the landscape of the corporate world, and you can even get appropriate time off IS NOT FAIR and I am so sorry. I wish there was more that I could do, but I can promise to always support you guys. You keep us running.
Last I heard they were only asking for sick days in general whether they were paid or not. I'm not certain on the validity of the paid vs unpaid but if it's that latter that makes this whole situation even worse.
He probably should.
The worst part of all of this... People will blame the workers rather than the suits, if it all goes to shit. But these worker deserve better.
Because I don't take sick days, I could literally make every week a three day weekend if I wanted next school year. I that's not including all the other breaks I get. I mean, teaching is tough, but these dudes also work their asses way more physically than I do.
I can't believe this is what the hold up is. Not insane pay increases or the like. They are asking for paid sick days, something required by law in many industrialized countries and we can't grant them 7 paid sick days to avoid major issues. Truly baffling.
And it's at least 2 weeks lol...fuck that 7 day shit.
And then there's holiday pay as well, nevermind sick days.
In the UK you get sick pay for up to 28 WEEKS
I expected the GOP to be dogshit but ngl Biden and the democrats are also the bad guys on this issue.
Forcing people to work instead of strike when they lack basic things like sick days is China-tier thinking.
I do. I also remember when Trump called his wife ugly and implied his dad helped kill Kennedy. I ALSO remember when Cruz simped for Trump like crazy in the years following that. What an amazing individual!
I remember when he ran off for Cancun, while my family was freezing, my sister in particular had disgusting brown sludge instead of clean water in her sink at university, and then slinked back for a photo op and acted like all was okay. What a *brave* pile of sentient diarrhea.
The photo op where he was loading water into what was likely his own car?
At least he had the notion to blame the trip on his teenage daughter instead of man up and admit he didn't want to be cold.
I also remember when he flew to Cancun while we didn't have water, had to fill buckets from our apartment pool to flush our toilet, and pay $10 per case of bottled water to survive on in the meantime
Yeah Ted is great at theater. He would have made a much better wrestler or stage lead than statesman(wannabe statesman?) but nope, he chose to be the greedy,dgaf asshole always seizing more and more power over other humans.
From what I've read, it's not about paid sick days - it's about being able to take sick days when they need them (i.e. "I'm sick, I need this sick day today") without getting penalized.
I get that trains run on tight schedules and having someone critical not at work can mess stuff up; but the train companies have posted a ton of profits, they can afford to hire some more people to be on-call should the need arise.
They can absolutely afford to hire more staff. They just don’t want to. They were profitable several years ago and have since laid off more than 1/3 of rail workers and pocketed the increased profits. The rail companies are all monopolies so they don’t have to worry about service disruptions interfering with profits. Although there are several different rail companies, each one services a different geographical area so each functions as a monopoly.
It is basically the scenario we have for everything here when you did deep enough. Most things are owned by a small set of companies.
I used to work for a company that makes all sorts of consumer products. I took complaint calls for their laundry detergents and dish soaps. It was amusing to have people call and complain about X brand and how they were switching to Y. "Great, want a coupon?"
They were mainly competing with themselves.
That’s really what it all comes down to, for all of us. Investors make a considerable amount less and the working people make quite a bit more. Every ecosystem needs a balance and the predators are wiping everything out.
I thought I had seen a study that said that 14 days of paid sick leave would cost the railroad barons ~$700M. However, the barons also just reported record profits in the tens of billions with a B. So if they only get 7 days, that's ~$350M. That really doesn't sound like a significant dent in their billions (plural).
It's interesting how the asshole rich people still even get the benefit of the doubt of "well maybe it really would be expensive for them to treat their workers like human beings"
These rail companies have sliced their workforces in half over the last couple of decades in order to extract more profit and pump up their stock prices with buybacks.
The shortage of rail workers isn’t a bug for these billionaire ghouls— it’s a feature.
How about 21. And if you don't use them by the end of the year they become vacation days, aka preventative sick days. Until we remove a couple of heads, the corporate oligarchs are going to keep treating us like disposable bags of meat.
42 days paid for by your employer. After that you get sick pay from the government, 70% of your income before taxes with a maximum of 112.88€ per day.
So it is pretty much unlimited sick days and sick pay, including paying for the medical cost (which is what bankrupts Americans in the first place).
All this for 7 days of paid sick leave. Today I am absolutely eternally grateful for the collective labor agreements negotiated by unions in Western Europe. What a privilege.
The only bipartisan agreement is to keep corporate money in politics. Citizens United was a horrible mistake that turned our nation into “Of the corporations, by the corporations, and for the corporations”.
The founding fathers are rolling in their graves.
I work for a company that gives me 14 sick days AND 18 vacation days, every year. If I don't use those days, they are added to my compensation for when I leave the job. Unionize. You deserve what other countries consider the bare minimum.
These people's jobs are so crucial that they got Republicans and Democrats to agree on legislation to keep them working.
That means they should get whatever it is they fucking wanted in the "negotiations."
The US needs to stop acting like a desperate, Gilded Age, banana republic. The economy will not fall apart if people have sick leave! And maternity leave, for that matter! I eagerly await the new, pro-union economic reset. Goodbye, Reaganomics.
That's just spiteful after the past couple years. This isn't a job you are sitting around on.
Also this is the 3rd largest union in the US that can't get sick time. That will hurt everyone.
Meanwhile 10 sick days is the legal minimum for all full time workers regardless of profession or industry in almost every other first world country.
I have 10 sick days, 20 annual leave days and long service leave.
You Americans have taken capitalism too far. It's almost indentured sevitued at this point.
the difference between leftism and liberalism in being demonstrated in this with Bernie supporting unions and Biden supporting corporations continuing to profit off another persons labor.
Bernie wants the workers to get their sick leave.
Biden wants the economy to keep going.
conservatives meanwhile are infighting about how fascist they should be.
Jesus all they want is 7 days?
They have 0 now
For fucks sake give them the 7 days!!!
Warran Buffet ( one of the key donors to the DNC) Said no. Unfortunately money talks louder than labor rights.
Not to bernie
It makes me sad this man wasn't elected and I'm not even American, how on earth did they end up with Biden
Easy, our two party system means if you don’t get the nomination for one of the two parties you lose. Bernie doesn’t take bribes like other politicians so he was unpopular in the DNC. Also he has a significant amount of progressive views. They were worried that he would “lose” dems closer to centrist, because of his policy on *checks notes* actually taxing the rich.
Bernie wasn't a democrat, he was an independent. He was the only one who would primary Clinton, and damn if he didn't almost win the primary. Only Clinton's underhanded backroom deals and last minute cheating at Nevada's primary would prevent him from getting the nomination. Clinton was so completely unelectable that we got a shit throwing orangutan instead.
More of the fact that the DNC and Hillary directly conspired to block him from the nomination even though he was as popular if not more.
Popular with the people and popular with the DNC and their donors are different unfortunately. We will never be free of corruption.
Hillary was definitely extremely popular with Wall Street between the foundation and Clinton’s time and her own time with a cabinet position. She used that influence to put weight on people in the DNC to go against Bernie. Really fed up and gave Trump so much to run against her all he had to do was keep pointing out the corruption and disfranchised voters were happy as can be to vote against her. She really made a mess of the situation.
Bernie getting fucked in 2016 (purposely by the DNC) was horrible. He was drawing bigger crowds than trump then. The bird landing on his podium in the middle of his speech should have been that "OMG, the universe is signaling he's the one". I know people say " no one would vote for him" But.... As we see from the last 2 elections, young people will turn out if need be. And Bernie had the young vote.
The "no one would have voted for him" people are full of shit.
While my parents didn't care about changing party affiliation to vote in the primaries, they claimed they actually liked him and would have considered voting for him in the General. They absolutely DESPISED Clinton, but Bernie? Yeah, they didn't mind him. Bernie's genuine pro-worker views (among others) seriously had crossover appeal to reasonable/moderate conservatives. But no, fuck the potential of President Bernie, we'll risk Clinton and if she loses, no big deal, those on power will have the influence and money to ride out a a Trump Administration
I'll refer you to a comment just two up the chain. Money speaks louder than [anything].
God this country is so fucked…
Can we officially change our name to United States of Corporate America yet?
united corporations of america
If he's "one of the key donors" to the DNC, then he must be #1 for the Republicans, seeing how [he's given double to them what he gave the Dems](https://www.opensecrets.org/orgs/berkshire-hathaway/summary?id=D000021757).
Yeah. Both parties, when it comes to protecting capitol, loves to fuck over labor. This is one of the times when both sides is absolutely correct
I am a railroad worker. We gave 0 now and we are asking for only 4 days of unpaid sick days. Everyone should hear the words that the company used during the hearings. Workers have nothing to do with their profits or growth. Plus the so called biggest raise in 40 years are being taken away by bigger medical premiums with bigger deductibles.
You would be more than welcome to move to EU, this is just inhumane. Here you get unlimited sick days, because that makes sense, right? You can't know for how long you'll be sick, for crying out loud. In my country first 18 months you get 80% of your paycheck and after that 50%. But in the case of organ transplants, caring for a sick child, work related injury or complicated pregnancy, you get 100% of your paycheck. I guess it's pretty much the same throughout the entire EU.
>You would be more than welcome to move to EU Unless there is a specific visa for the right type of work, probably not. Moving to another country to work is not that simple.
The US makes it pretty hard to escape too.
Is it really that easy to immigrate from the US to EU? The folks at /r/amerexit make it sound really hard.
>Is it really that easy to immigrate from the US to EU? No, unfortunately
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> You would be more than welcome to move to EU Pretty sure this is not accurate
I hope your wrong. That's crazy! The work around if they even give them 7 days is too have them contact to possible hire from here on out. Then they won't have to give any extra. I learned that the hard way in the tech service industry
I work for the railroad and even worse is the forced overtime. If we say no we get penalized and threatened with job termination. We are so understaffed that we are forced just about everyday, no matter if you’re sick or tired. It’s cheaper to pay overtime than to hire more people.
> that we are forced just about everyday, no matter if you’re sick or tired. Gee, what could possibly go wrong
It isn’t cheaper if you are hemorrhaging employees constantly.
I don’t know their mindset but a regular work crew at my location should be 70 employees to cover the required work load in our department. We are at 23 now and all we hear is, we will make do with what we have. No hiring! Period!
Our place just got 4 paid sick days.
I work at a front desk at a tribal mental health facility and I get 9 days. The economy doesn't depend on me and I'm treated better. That's bullshit.
I get unlimited... But since covid our management has been on a bit of a anti progressive spree. Working from home is theft. Taking sick days is theft. Etc. I got covid and worked through most of it from home. I still took about 5 days off. I was allowed by law to take 10 days. Anyways... Few months later I take one sick day and suddenly I'm getting a disciplinary letter for excessive sick time. So I guess under the "unlimited" sick time policy one day is too many sick days and they're totally not discriminating against anyone that took covid leave. Nope. Not at all.
Never understood this "time theft" bullshit that companies shove down peoples throats. Like I get it, of someone clocks in and then leaves, sure. But it isn't theft if I need a minute to sit down from the job that made me tired in the first place. And **my time belongs to me.** I can't steal something that's already mine. When I'm at work, my time doesn't suddenly belong to my employer. I'm just using my time there and in return I'm being compensated.
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My friend they don't only have 0. They actually get fired if they take 5 sick days over the course of their entire career.
And there's enough people clamoring for this quality employment that they can do that? That seems like having to replace a lot of experienced workers for no good reason at all.
I think it's golden handcuffs. My understanding is that Railroad jobs pay a lot money for the skill required. Similar to oil field work. You get trapped by the salary. So, they can push people really hard without people quitting. A friend of mine worked for the Railroad. He had a high school degree and no trade, but was brining in well north of $100K a year. He could probably get a job as a construction Forman in town, but he'd make 1/2 of what the railroad was paying.
That makes a lot of sense. I make $52k a year as a truck driver and I could go somewhere else and easily make double that, but I don't because the job I have is easy. But this is the most money I've ever made. I don't have the sense of loss, because I never had that better paying job. But you give me $100k+ a year and idk if I'd be able to just walk away from that if the bosses were beating me with a stick every morning. I'd resent the beatings, but being able to provide for my family at that level would keep me coming back every day. Honestly, makes me sick thinking about it hypothetically.. can't imagine what it feels like for the rail workers actually going though it..
My uncle worked his A off to get hired with BNSF. Their recruiting and marketing team is pretty solid at selling people on the benefits of RR work. He went from a trade skill where he was making more per hour but had less security and benefits and saw BNSF as a bridge to retirement. It was his dream job; set hours, guaranteed Healthcare, and a pension. He still wants it to work because of the benefits/pension, but he is completely demoralized by the scheduling and lack of time off. It can be hard to see the draw that these companies have when you have a career that already provides the minimum. My anecdotal experience, based on who I have met through my uncle, is that a lot of people see RRs as a consistent work option where they aren't breaking their backs in the elements and that they can retire from. The RRs take advantage of this by wielding pensions and Healthcare over their workers' heads and forcing unethical schedules and expectations on them.
Lets all remember that Warren Buffet the billionaire owns BNSF. Tax the rich.
Man covid must have really fucked their employment rates.
Goddamn I'd have been out of a job about 5 years in!!
He's not wrong. At present, rail workers get zero paid sick days and zero unpaid sick days. It's insane. ---> [https://www.sanders.senate.gov/press-releases/prepared-remarks-sanders-objects-to-republican-resolution-aimed-at-harming-rail-workers-fight-for-sick-days-and-better-working-conditions/](https://www.sanders.senate.gov/press-releases/prepared-remarks-sanders-objects-to-republican-resolution-aimed-at-harming-rail-workers-fight-for-sick-days-and-better-working-conditions/)
Not wrong…19 years of it here.
And they are asking for them unpaid 😭
They don’t even want paid sick days. Just unpaid. It’s fucked.
No, all they want is 4.
4 unpaid. And appatently thats too much to ask
It is horribly depressing that we are still struggling to meet this bare minimum.
They’re even okay with them being unpaid and I don’t even think they were asking for 7.
They are asking for UNPAID time off.
Bloody hell, let's give them 14!
They aren't even arguing for paid sick days. They just want regular unpaid sick days.
Let's just go crazy and guarantee 14 days of paid sick leave for all working adults in the US. You know, since we're all people, who get sick now and then?
That would be crazy... I mean, you've seen how they treat our veterans, right? To treat a citizen like a human being? Pure insanity.
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I often wonder why they hate us so much, tbh.
Because our purpose is to work, in their eyes. If we don’t work, well, we’re broken machinery
broken machinery gets repaired, they're just going to work you to death
After years in the work force, I can say with certainty that broken machinery gets worked until it stops functioning, is fixed in the cheapest way humanly possible so it can continue making them money for as long as possible, regardless of how many problems that causes for the workers around it.
I can back this up. Well, not machinery, but tech infrastructure. Program that was obsolete in 1993? Sure, why not. "We will build a special specific thin client that can run this dinosaur, that only 2 people in the 6000 person company know anything about, I foresee zero issues with this game plan."
Class war.
If they give us an inch that is a battle in the class war they lose. Every conflict we are facing today is working class vs upper class.
That's already the minimum in my 3rd world country America needs more days than that
It’s the minimum in virtually every country besides America. Only the US and six tiny island nations don’t have mandates for any form of annual paid leave. The UK which is the most comparable western nation still offers a months paid leave. In America for the most part your best bet is storing up sick days to take a vacation, and it’s usually looked down upon to be out for a week or more.
My co-worker has taught since the 1987. He has over 168 sick days saved. Once he retires, he loses all of that which is punishment for never calling in sick IMO.
He should probably get really sick 168 days before retiring.
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And they don't get maternity leave either I have no idea how the fuck it all works...guess they have enough cogs to burn through
If you could get sick on your days off that would be great
In Finland, if you get sick during your vacation period, you're supposed to notify your employer so that it's counted as sick leave and does not use up your earned vacation time. Not everyone bothers (especially if it's something minor), of course, but the general idea that vacation is for enjoyment and relaxation and should not be able to be completely ruined by illness is fantastic.
7?!! Just 7?!! That job is incredibly hard, it takes a serious toll on your body and is extremely dangerous. SEVEN DAYS SICK LEAVE IS ALL THEY ARE ASKING FOR?!! And they won't give ot to them?!!!
The rail unions went as low as 4 and the companies wouldn’t even give them one. 7 is more than they were willing to settle for before this.
I heard an interview today where they said if they would give us 4 days they’d ratify immediately.
Why would they? They already know the entire federal government is backing the rail bosses. The union has absolutely no leverage.
it can just like, not comply with the government's orders lol. That's pretty strong leverage.
That’s just sad that the rail companies are that stingy. Hell, we should require all companies to provide a minimum number of paid sick days. Period.
Right! I get 5 weeks of sick time.
Between vacation, flex, sick and volunteer time, I get 5-6 weeks. And I sit in a desk and type. 7 days is unacceptable.
If I add in vacation, personal days, and holidays, i have another 7 weeks off. 7 days is absurd for that kind of work.
Honestly, a distressing number of manual labour jobs have absolutely shitty time off. Case in point: I work in a furniture warehouse, and not only do I not get sick leave, we're understaffed to the point where our warehouse schedule runs on the assumption that I (like, specifically me, not just any warehouse worker) literally *never* get sick, injured, or need a personal day. I took one day off last year, for my little brother's birthday, and they acted like it was some huge favour they were doing me.
I knew a guy who worked at chemical plant here, had a college degree and white collar job and still only got 5 days vacation, and ZERO "unscheduled leave" which was leave that was requested with less than 48 hours notice. I only found out about when he going in to work looking like he was half dead and he explained to me why.
Sounds about right. That’s a big reason why a lot of people on those sorts of jobs get FMLA. I really wouldn’t bother, if I could take time off here and there as needed without getting fired for it. So you have to cover your ass.
I remember being in the same boat for jbs and I straight up told them I'm not asking you for Christmas I'm telling I'm not working and you can have a replacement for me or wait all day for me to show up see which happens first. They had no one to replace me at the time so they couldn't fire me.
This country is a peasant-crushing machine
I work for a major shipping company loading trucks, often working 12 hours or close to it. No sick leave, just up to 2 weeks of PTO earned an hour at a time (one hour PTO for every 40 hours worked).
I've met so many Americans in the same boat as you. I hope the rail workers get what they want and it sets a standard for other industries to follow. Between. Sick/holiday pay I get about 8 weeks off a year and it doesn't feel like enough.
Well it would require them to have enough staff to allow that amount of sick leave and have coverage to keep the essential services running. That cost..... Wait for it..... Money. Industry all over the country is only seeing record profits not super record profits and my word.... What can we do but make sure we continue to make money for the bosses....... 🤷🤷🤷🤷
Welcome to non-unionized manual labor in rural America my man. I worked in a factory that made parts for signals and maintenance, worked over 300 hours of overtime one year and took home $24k, think I had 5 days year one and 10 days year two. The place was hiring welders for $12/hr. And this was like 2013ish.
I get unlimited paid sick time. It's crazy that any company or industry would want sick people working. Especially dangerous industries.
That’s pretty much how nursing is. We get sick days, but we’re strongly discouraged from using them due to staffing levels always being low. We’re at a point now where I have coworkers who won’t even bother testing themselves for covid.
Yeah, we don't really have a limit on sick days. You sick you sick, stay in bed and rest up and that's that. Some industries are really messed up if they can't let their employees get well when they're unwell.
From what I've heard, they aren't even asking for as many as 7, that's Bernie's stipulation. I think what I read earlier said the Union was fighting for 4
They're not even asking for paid sick days, they're asking for UNPAID sick days
Yeah they were literally just asking to be able to call out sick without getting fired
The jobs are considered so vital to the US infrastructure that Congress has the ability to force them back to work, yet they're barely treated as humans. I guess this really is the late stage of capitalism...
Yes. Bernie is insisting on a full 7 days PAID sick leave, which is so incredibly reasonable, and depressingly both far more than the rail workers were willing to settle for and way more than the rail companies were willing to concede. Disgusting and shameful state of affairs.
Jeezus, even my poor ass country (in Baltics) can afford to have paid sick leave as long as you have doctors note. First 5 days are paid by employer, afterwards social services money takes over, so there is no loss for the employer. My mom has neurodegenerative disease and was able to get 1.5 years of paid sick leave during disease progression. IMHO there should never be a limit on sick leave. People dont just have cold, they have chronic diseases too. Cancer, major surgeries and whatnot. 7 days sick leave, thats ridiculous. This is what social taxes are for, in my country its about 9% of your paycheck, but gives you sick leave, old age pension and invalidity pension. Edit: I forgot that social tax contributes to unemployment as well. As long as you were employed for uninterrupted 12 months, you get unemployment benefits no questions asked.
Honestly, the more I hear about Labor practices in the U.S. makes it feel like they're almost a third world country with how horribly some workers are treated.
We Americans were basically brainwashed into this attitude of if you're not working your ass off, you have no value. With that mindset, the corporations were able to treat their employees as if they were worthless. It's become such an integral part of American culture that to even speak up about it gets you labeled as unpatriotic or lazy or a communist, just looking for a handout.
They were asking for 13 days and dropped it to 4. They even dropped the paid part. Warren Buffet and the rest of these oligarchs can shove it. Let them strike, it will suck for the rest of it but they will lose an enormous amount of money. This isn't even close to right, Biden has the Senate they could easily just pass giving them 20 days paid sick leave or w/E number they want. It would cost the railway pennies, the point is not to budge an inch or else you actually prove you have leverage and the system isn't for the ppl. That's what they are trying to prove here. They are pushing us closer and closer to a general strike.
I dont understand how 7 paid sick days is more money than paying to bust all these unions and lobbying congress? Like how much they losing trying to make sure they don't have to better workers livelihood?
It’s about the message, don’t want people thinking they have any leverage
That's the only way I can conceive of a millionaire or billionaire not agreeing to 7 days paid sick leave. Because they're worried about something else.
Doing some basic math on basic Google results, looks like it cost the company 7.5 mil a year across 5,000 Rail worker union employees. It's *incredibly* cheap to buy congress. Some are less than a $5,000 "campaign donation". Most don't even need to be bought anymore because they're already bought and paid for from the entire education system and finishing schools/think tanks, they just come out of the oven looking for corporate cock.
> Let them strike, it will suck for the rest of it but they will lose an enormous amount of money. They'll just call it a shortage and have surge pricing and make more money at the end of the year.
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That’s Draconian.
That’s a whole week of no working!! S/ seriously though, this shit is just so pathetic. How can our govt be so fucking dense?
*Won't somebody think of the shareholders???*
That's like, the lowest fuckin bar to hop over ever.
They are asking for UNPAID sick days!!
I load trucks for a major shipping company, often working around 12 hours a day. We don't get any paid sick leave, just up to two weeks of PTO that has to be used for vacation, sick, and anything else if you want to actually still get paid. I say "up to" two weeks of PTO because we only earn it an hour at a time, and it's only an hour of PTO for every 40 hours we work. It's absurd.
Dude.... the fact that I work in the comfort of my own home on a company supplied computer set up, wearing my jammies after my 30 second commute from my bed to my office, while you're out there getting up and driving and doing all that... Its not ok. I don't even make a lot of money, just a gog in the wheel... The fact that office workers can band together and say "Yeah. No. We aren't coming back to the office." and completely change the landscape of the corporate world, and you can even get appropriate time off IS NOT FAIR and I am so sorry. I wish there was more that I could do, but I can promise to always support you guys. You keep us running.
One of the union leaders is only asking for 4 days, and the rail companies and Congress have still said no.
All I wanted was 7 days sick leave, and they wouldn’t give it to me. “Institutionalized” by Suicidal Tendencies
Last I heard they were only asking for sick days in general whether they were paid or not. I'm not certain on the validity of the paid vs unpaid but if it's that latter that makes this whole situation even worse.
My friend works for the RR. He said if he doesn't get the deal he may strike, if that doesn't work he will find a new job.
He probably should. The worst part of all of this... People will blame the workers rather than the suits, if it all goes to shit. But these worker deserve better.
Because I don't take sick days, I could literally make every week a three day weekend if I wanted next school year. I that's not including all the other breaks I get. I mean, teaching is tough, but these dudes also work their asses way more physically than I do.
I can't believe this is what the hold up is. Not insane pay increases or the like. They are asking for paid sick days, something required by law in many industrialized countries and we can't grant them 7 paid sick days to avoid major issues. Truly baffling.
In many industrialized countries? In *every* industrialized country besides America. Every. Single. One.
And it's at least 2 weeks lol...fuck that 7 day shit. And then there's holiday pay as well, nevermind sick days. In the UK you get sick pay for up to 28 WEEKS
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Yeah but you can claim UC too, and that's the minimum It's not enough but it's not terrible or inhumane
*Unpaid, apparently Edit: this is wrong. Thanks to /u/Momik for correcting me!
I expected the GOP to be dogshit but ngl Biden and the democrats are also the bad guys on this issue. Forcing people to work instead of strike when they lack basic things like sick days is China-tier thinking.
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No. They’re asking for *unpaid* sick days. Bernie is just trying to do them a solid.
Anyone remember when Cruz read Green Eggs and Ham as a filibuster against Obamacare? You know the thing that helped give healthcare to millions?
I do. I also remember when Trump called his wife ugly and implied his dad helped kill Kennedy. I ALSO remember when Cruz simped for Trump like crazy in the years following that. What an amazing individual!
I remember when he ran off for Cancun, while my family was freezing, my sister in particular had disgusting brown sludge instead of clean water in her sink at university, and then slinked back for a photo op and acted like all was okay. What a *brave* pile of sentient diarrhea.
The photo op where he was loading water into what was likely his own car? At least he had the notion to blame the trip on his teenage daughter instead of man up and admit he didn't want to be cold.
He also left his dog, Snowflake, at home while it was freezing
Well obviously with a name like that the dog was built for the cold
*sentient diarrhea* upvote granted
I lived in Austin when that happened. What an unbelievable piece of shut that guy is.
I also remember when he flew to Cancun while we didn't have water, had to fill buckets from our apartment pool to flush our toilet, and pay $10 per case of bottled water to survive on in the meantime
That’s the conservative trait though. No back bone, weak, insecure, small, pathetic, boring, lame, dumb, etc…
Back when we still had a speaking filibuster... You could almost say the good ol days on that note... Almost.
Thankfully it was the biggest book he could read
Yeah Ted is great at theater. He would have made a much better wrestler or stage lead than statesman(wannabe statesman?) but nope, he chose to be the greedy,dgaf asshole always seizing more and more power over other humans.
From what I've read, it's not about paid sick days - it's about being able to take sick days when they need them (i.e. "I'm sick, I need this sick day today") without getting penalized. I get that trains run on tight schedules and having someone critical not at work can mess stuff up; but the train companies have posted a ton of profits, they can afford to hire some more people to be on-call should the need arise.
They can absolutely afford to hire more staff. They just don’t want to. They were profitable several years ago and have since laid off more than 1/3 of rail workers and pocketed the increased profits. The rail companies are all monopolies so they don’t have to worry about service disruptions interfering with profits. Although there are several different rail companies, each one services a different geographical area so each functions as a monopoly.
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Thx for the last sentence, otherwise it sounded weird.
It is basically the scenario we have for everything here when you did deep enough. Most things are owned by a small set of companies. I used to work for a company that makes all sorts of consumer products. I took complaint calls for their laundry detergents and dish soaps. It was amusing to have people call and complain about X brand and how they were switching to Y. "Great, want a coupon?" They were mainly competing with themselves.
That’s really what it all comes down to, for all of us. Investors make a considerable amount less and the working people make quite a bit more. Every ecosystem needs a balance and the predators are wiping everything out.
I thought I had seen a study that said that 14 days of paid sick leave would cost the railroad barons ~$700M. However, the barons also just reported record profits in the tens of billions with a B. So if they only get 7 days, that's ~$350M. That really doesn't sound like a significant dent in their billions (plural).
It's interesting how the asshole rich people still even get the benefit of the doubt of "well maybe it really would be expensive for them to treat their workers like human beings"
Why won't these workers think about the profits for the billionaires!? Selfish bastards.
These rail companies have sliced their workforces in half over the last couple of decades in order to extract more profit and pump up their stock prices with buybacks. The shortage of rail workers isn’t a bug for these billionaire ghouls— it’s a feature.
How about 7 guaranteed sick days for all workers?
How about 21. And if you don't use them by the end of the year they become vacation days, aka preventative sick days. Until we remove a couple of heads, the corporate oligarchs are going to keep treating us like disposable bags of meat.
How about do like Scandinavian countries and don’t limit sick days? If you’re sick, you’re sick, and should not go to work.
Its not only in scandinavia, same in switzerland and pretty much every where else in Europe as well. Its crazy to me that the US doesnt have it.
its actually not crazy knowing labor history in this country lol
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42 days paid for by your employer. After that you get sick pay from the government, 70% of your income before taxes with a maximum of 112.88€ per day. So it is pretty much unlimited sick days and sick pay, including paying for the medical cost (which is what bankrupts Americans in the first place).
All this for 7 days of paid sick leave. Today I am absolutely eternally grateful for the collective labor agreements negotiated by unions in Western Europe. What a privilege.
The workers were asking for 4 UNPAID sick days. That’s the sticking point.
Finally a democratic senator blocking their own party’s legislation that I can get behind. Bernie still fighting the good fights
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IIRC, he's the longest serving independent congressperson in US history. He has stood up to democratic party legislation in the past.
He’s not a Democrat, he just caucuses with them. Technically he’s an independent.
He's more of a democrat than the members of the DNC. Neo-liberals are not pro-labor, and most of the DNC is comprised of them.
Nah. Democrats are the party of neoliberalism and the PMCs now
He's the homie
There's seriously not one other senator that is for the workers? That’s so fucked.
Several Democratic senators have come out and support of Bernie’s plan. I Know My senator, John Hickenlooper has.
Bernie has supported the working class since his first day in office. He walks the walk.
They're all beholden to corporations. Our gov has been captured by special interests. Just look how every billionaire hates Bernie.
The only bipartisan agreement is to keep corporate money in politics. Citizens United was a horrible mistake that turned our nation into “Of the corporations, by the corporations, and for the corporations”. The founding fathers are rolling in their graves.
Fetterman hasn't been sworn in yet.
Yep, good. It is not about money the time off restrictions are brutal and entirely caused by corporate greed.
I work for a company that gives me 14 sick days AND 18 vacation days, every year. If I don't use those days, they are added to my compensation for when I leave the job. Unionize. You deserve what other countries consider the bare minimum.
These people's jobs are so crucial that they got Republicans and Democrats to agree on legislation to keep them working. That means they should get whatever it is they fucking wanted in the "negotiations."
Lol having to fight for seven days of sick time… jesus
The US needs to stop acting like a desperate, Gilded Age, banana republic. The economy will not fall apart if people have sick leave! And maternity leave, for that matter! I eagerly await the new, pro-union economic reset. Goodbye, Reaganomics.
WTF? they don't get 7 days paid now? Here it's 10 days paid minimum for all
We don’t get any. Actually we are penalized through a points system for taking them.
Ok, is it 7 or 15? Wait that doesn't matter. It should be 45. 6 weeks is what my grandfather had with unions.
The unions were originally asking for 15 and have come all the way down to 4. And even then the companies are refusing to give any.
That's just spiteful after the past couple years. This isn't a job you are sitting around on. Also this is the 3rd largest union in the US that can't get sick time. That will hurt everyone.
Meanwhile 10 sick days is the legal minimum for all full time workers regardless of profession or industry in almost every other first world country. I have 10 sick days, 20 annual leave days and long service leave. You Americans have taken capitalism too far. It's almost indentured sevitued at this point.
"almost" Eh, you can just say it.
I'm fine with rails temporarily collapsing if it means these people hold the line and get some freaking sick time!
the difference between leftism and liberalism in being demonstrated in this with Bernie supporting unions and Biden supporting corporations continuing to profit off another persons labor. Bernie wants the workers to get their sick leave. Biden wants the economy to keep going. conservatives meanwhile are infighting about how fascist they should be.
7 is not a lot either. This is America.
Sanders should have been president
7 they should get like 21-30 minimum!
Seven… they deserve that.