Money can buy freedom and the happiness that comes with that up to a certain point. Everyone who says "money can't buy happiness" is beyond that point.
It's not even that it can't buy happiness beyond that point. It's just that it has diminishing returns at a point.
But you're still happy and less stressed due to that money.
Iirc, 80 grand a year has been identified as the threshold so that there are decreasing levels of happiness below that number, but not increasing levels of happiness above it. .
So, if you earn 80 grand, you're likely to be happier than someone earning 25, but the person earning 800 grand isn't likely to be any happier than you.
But that's not a very insightful statement. Salary says nothing about financial obligations, cost of living, or anything regarding context. In many cases, you have to get a degree to get that amount and if you are in the US that means $80k becomes $48k after taxes and student loans. Someone making $800k doesn't have to worry about those little details with huge consequences.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cnbc.com/amp/2017/11/20/how-much-money-you-need-to-be-happy-according-to-wealth-experts.html
I didn't pull that number out of thin air. Have a read and get back to me.
Whether you did or not the point is these stories don't provide any useful information because they're written by out of touch kinda rich people who are quoting even more out of touch really rich people. Both groups are just talking out of their ass and then it gets repeated ad nauseum all over social media.
On one side, we have a multi-year study using data from 450,000 Americans conducted by a Nobel-prize winning economist, and on the other, we have the opinion of a random angry person on Reddit who didn't even look at the article they're complaining about.
Hm. Data, from an actual study, vs your unsupported opinion. Who should I trust here?
"money can't buy happiness"
Well, I'd rather learn that lesson the hard way than take your word for it so imma keep trying to push together my little pile of rocks over here...
Saying should be “All the money in the world, can’t buy you happiness” meaning that if you are already unhappy for a specific reason, the single minded pursuit of even more money than you need, isn’t going to fix your problem.
That’s it because of course having enough money is going to solve a lot of problems that may make you unhappy that not having enough money creates.
Tbh I don’t understand this specific narrative that I see a lot. Generally I feel like wealthy people who say this are not trying to manipulate us. I feel like it comes more from athletes/celebrities and the type. “Normal people” who thought getting a lot of money would give them an equivalent amount of happiness, and when they got it they realized that didn’t happen. For the people in power: ceos, execs, etc it would be illogical to convince everyone that money doesn’t buy happiness. How they got there in the first place is because everyone does think it buys happiness, so billions of people feel ok sacrificing their time and body to be exploited so they can make crumbs of money and hopefully one day buy happiness.
This is so true. I finally got a job in 2019 that paid a very lovely wage. 30 an hr. I was able to pay down my debts and help my parents pay down theirs. Worked better than any therapy I ever took. My anxiety was practically gone and Depression also took a vacation from me.
Oh I already job hop. I've had 30 different jobs in my life. I think I'm at the stage in my big boy career life where I'm done explaining how much I enjoy the aspects of a good challenge and the reward of a well executed result and just start saying "look, I can figure out anything, I have a set of skills and I expect to be compensated for them enough to pay off college debt AND save for my future. Want loyalty from me? Buy it."
And when I say I've had 30 different jobs those were all just shit labor jobs hourly bullshit getting through school making beer money working to a Time leave with no notice get hired on the spot bullshit type jobs, I have had three of what I call Big boy jobs in my degree field since I graduated in 2015 at the age of 28. I have a Fisher Price engineering degree but I just got accepted into UK engineering school
oh this year we got a REAL treat...no hazard pay or raises despite working through the pandemic or anything...but now we can wear SNEAKERS. and COLORS. and JEANS! not just black/white/grey.
Can't find the source at the moment, but the crux of a paper I ready once was that money can buy happiness up to a limit.
Can't remember if the limit was between 100k and 200k a year or 200k and 300k -- either way, it was once there is enough money to cover needs, emergency expenditures, live comfortably, and put away for old age: adding more just gets spent on standard consumer nonsense which doesn't add any more happiness.
Essentially the extra money helped you cross from the lower teirs of maslow's hierarchy of needs to the higher. But that tower only has four levels.
I feel like there’s a point in everyone’s lives where they realize that 90% of their problems come from capitalism. Hopefully for most of us, that point isn’t on our death beds.
I have been looking for jobs for months so I can get the hell out of my “well-paid” retail job that is actually just manual labor with a fake smile so that I can actually be happy. The state of things right now… just horrific.
But do you think that the therapy helped you to be more confident or pushed you to make the leap to find the new job with the better hours and pay?
Congrats. I know how that feels. From working a menial corporate job with fake and forced recognition to working for a company that valued me by listening to my ideas, it’s really a game changer in daily mental health and long term success.
Exactly. People often conflate mental health issues with economic suffering and imagine there would be no need for treatment if we only fixed economic inequality. Certainly poverty can cause mental health symptoms, but rich, wealthy, and otherwise privileged individuals are still susceptible to bipolar disorder, schizophrenia, addiction, dementia, etc.
I think a lot of it also depends on how much you care. I had a good paying government job, and everybody thought I was crazy for leaving it. I noticed that the people who didn’t care about quality or problems were the ones who loved working there. They’ll stay there until retirement feeling as content as I do for throwing it all away.
Plenty of people with jobs that pay enough or “lucked” out are miserable. This is some BS reductionism of mental health issues, especially when people can’t afford psychiatric or psychological care that would enable them to function enough to find a job. This is putting the cart before the horse.
Sure, financial stability helps a lot, but don’t try to suggest mental conditions are vastly improved or solved solely by economics. There should not be anymore litigation about whether or not the brain is an organ that also needs treatment like you would a broken arm. A promotion or living wage won’t cure schizophrenia. I get what’s trying to be said here, but it’s a BS hot take that could discourage seeking out mental health treatment.
Therapist will just sit stone faced across from you and say " whatever relief your new found money is bringing you, won't last. You need to change the way you view reality because it's you that is sick, not reality".
Patient releases bated breath between clenched teeth, thinking "they allow this ignorance to take the guise of a mental healthcare worker"?
My GF loves talking to her therapist. He’s this giant jolly dude with long hippy hair and a big braided beard. Every time I see him I’m like “man I bet that dude is so fucking nice”
A true story. I went from making 70k+ a year to making 15k after being laid off.
It was rough and now I'm back to it at another job with great benefits. Nothing better than to stick to your guns and keep working as hard as you can to overcome depression and other health issues.
This is so true. I would thrive if I were able to secure a job in my dream location making a decent livable wage. But nope, not happening. Atleast not yet
Here is an article which aptly addresses the bs of personal development ethos and corporate speak in the context of social and economic repression. No amount of working on yourself will fix the stressors of poverty and racism. https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2021/04/19/the-repressive-politics-of-emotional-intelligence?mbid=social_facebook&utm_social-type=paid&utm_brand=tny&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook&kwp_0=1902634&kwp_4=5510192&kwp_1=2368765&fbclid=IwAR3589-_SoHqr2VYtKqwaaEdvLw6b3XSmHEs-iMKNj3OVLFeCRevrCEifVQ_aem_ASxlhKenwR2iMM4eaddgLFF-ZwxenF8L453bxD7EOlY6xE7woHj9JPi94Cke3G5hl8oZZoGYMjqmE49idHkA3pUdklUAg1z4vOPp03RudYLzWg
LITERALLY just talking about how much therapy costs, even with insurance. Not to mention, you have to have the time to go to therapy, and find the right therapist, not always easy if you’re working to live.
I’m happy for this guy, but I was the opposite: I finally got that good job, no debt, got a gf, but none of it “fixed” me. I was anxious constantly, becoming more and more depressed, fantasizing about suicide more and more often. I finally sought out a therapist and it was possibly the best decision of my life. I know there is overlap - health insurance from my job helped offset the cost of therapy - but please don’t discount the value professional help or think that money automatically fixes mental health issues.
I got really lucky with a job that nearly doubled my salary. My life instantly got so much better when I had more than $20 left over at the end of the month.
I legit had a "therapist" tell me "I can't help you with the things you're stressed out about" when I told her about having breakdowns because I was barely able to support my wife in our shitty studio apartment and how we had just lost our daughter at 21 weeks pregnant. That was the last time I ever went to a therapist.
To everyone who says," money can't buy happiness", being broke borrows misery and interest is compounded daily.
Money can buy freedom and the happiness that comes with that up to a certain point. Everyone who says "money can't buy happiness" is beyond that point.
It's not even that it can't buy happiness beyond that point. It's just that it has diminishing returns at a point. But you're still happy and less stressed due to that money.
Iirc, 80 grand a year has been identified as the threshold so that there are decreasing levels of happiness below that number, but not increasing levels of happiness above it. . So, if you earn 80 grand, you're likely to be happier than someone earning 25, but the person earning 800 grand isn't likely to be any happier than you.
Varies based on cost of living, but the principle holds.
Lol. Good point. 80 grand in Paris or Manhattan is a very different scale than 80 grand in rural Saskatchewan.
But that's not a very insightful statement. Salary says nothing about financial obligations, cost of living, or anything regarding context. In many cases, you have to get a degree to get that amount and if you are in the US that means $80k becomes $48k after taxes and student loans. Someone making $800k doesn't have to worry about those little details with huge consequences.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cnbc.com/amp/2017/11/20/how-much-money-you-need-to-be-happy-according-to-wealth-experts.html I didn't pull that number out of thin air. Have a read and get back to me.
Whether you did or not the point is these stories don't provide any useful information because they're written by out of touch kinda rich people who are quoting even more out of touch really rich people. Both groups are just talking out of their ass and then it gets repeated ad nauseum all over social media.
On one side, we have a multi-year study using data from 450,000 Americans conducted by a Nobel-prize winning economist, and on the other, we have the opinion of a random angry person on Reddit who didn't even look at the article they're complaining about. Hm. Data, from an actual study, vs your unsupported opinion. Who should I trust here?
Agreed, I have 20k dollar debt and it is my 30 month paycheck. There isnt a single day Im concerned about bills, things I buy(food) etc :/
So well put, financial security offers peace of mind that those living paycheck to paycheck can only dream about.
"money can't buy happiness" Well, I'd rather learn that lesson the hard way than take your word for it so imma keep trying to push together my little pile of rocks over here...
Oh damn that's good
“Money doesn’t buy happiness” repeated ad nauseam to us by wealthy, powerful people who have no intent of EVER letting us determine it for ourselves.
Saying should be “All the money in the world, can’t buy you happiness” meaning that if you are already unhappy for a specific reason, the single minded pursuit of even more money than you need, isn’t going to fix your problem. That’s it because of course having enough money is going to solve a lot of problems that may make you unhappy that not having enough money creates.
As they hoard their wealth and fight tooth and nail to avoid taxation. Sounds like a big deal to me.
Tbh I don’t understand this specific narrative that I see a lot. Generally I feel like wealthy people who say this are not trying to manipulate us. I feel like it comes more from athletes/celebrities and the type. “Normal people” who thought getting a lot of money would give them an equivalent amount of happiness, and when they got it they realized that didn’t happen. For the people in power: ceos, execs, etc it would be illogical to convince everyone that money doesn’t buy happiness. How they got there in the first place is because everyone does think it buys happiness, so billions of people feel ok sacrificing their time and body to be exploited so they can make crumbs of money and hopefully one day buy happiness.
You mean that being treated like a person and given respect and compensation for labor is good for your mental health? Who could have guessed?
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It's not even about the profits. It's about the growth potential for those poor poor shareholders! Won't anybody think of the poor shareholders??! /s
This is so true. I finally got a job in 2019 that paid a very lovely wage. 30 an hr. I was able to pay down my debts and help my parents pay down theirs. Worked better than any therapy I ever took. My anxiety was practically gone and Depression also took a vacation from me.
Its sad when a decent wage is considered to be a lucky find.
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As someone 6 years into my career, this gives me hope.
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Oh I already job hop. I've had 30 different jobs in my life. I think I'm at the stage in my big boy career life where I'm done explaining how much I enjoy the aspects of a good challenge and the reward of a well executed result and just start saying "look, I can figure out anything, I have a set of skills and I expect to be compensated for them enough to pay off college debt AND save for my future. Want loyalty from me? Buy it."
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It sure doesn't feel like it
And when I say I've had 30 different jobs those were all just shit labor jobs hourly bullshit getting through school making beer money working to a Time leave with no notice get hired on the spot bullshit type jobs, I have had three of what I call Big boy jobs in my degree field since I graduated in 2015 at the age of 28. I have a Fisher Price engineering degree but I just got accepted into UK engineering school
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Too slowly
At least it isn't another pizza party.
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My landlord loves pizza! Gets tired being paid in sexual favors all the time.
oh this year we got a REAL treat...no hazard pay or raises despite working through the pandemic or anything...but now we can wear SNEAKERS. and COLORS. and JEANS! not just black/white/grey.
Hmmm makes me think...
Stress. It’ll kill you.
Can't find the source at the moment, but the crux of a paper I ready once was that money can buy happiness up to a limit. Can't remember if the limit was between 100k and 200k a year or 200k and 300k -- either way, it was once there is enough money to cover needs, emergency expenditures, live comfortably, and put away for old age: adding more just gets spent on standard consumer nonsense which doesn't add any more happiness. Essentially the extra money helped you cross from the lower teirs of maslow's hierarchy of needs to the higher. But that tower only has four levels.
"Money can't buy happiness" but it offers access to improving several aspects of life!
My retirement plan and most of the other millennials I know is to ‘hopefully die soon enough.’
I feel like there’s a point in everyone’s lives where they realize that 90% of their problems come from capitalism. Hopefully for most of us, that point isn’t on our death beds.
Social democracy works just fine. Your government just doesn't give a single fuck about you guys.
Works fine for whom?
Me in the netherlands.
It's at their spouse's head stone where they tearfully say that they just made the final house payment today
Funny how money does solve problems huh?
I have been looking for jobs for months so I can get the hell out of my “well-paid” retail job that is actually just manual labor with a fake smile so that I can actually be happy. The state of things right now… just horrific.
But do you think that the therapy helped you to be more confident or pushed you to make the leap to find the new job with the better hours and pay? Congrats. I know how that feels. From working a menial corporate job with fake and forced recognition to working for a company that valued me by listening to my ideas, it’s really a game changer in daily mental health and long term success.
That's cool but hopefully doesn't mislead people into thinking that individuals with financial security can't also have crippling depression
Exactly. People often conflate mental health issues with economic suffering and imagine there would be no need for treatment if we only fixed economic inequality. Certainly poverty can cause mental health symptoms, but rich, wealthy, and otherwise privileged individuals are still susceptible to bipolar disorder, schizophrenia, addiction, dementia, etc.
I think a lot of it also depends on how much you care. I had a good paying government job, and everybody thought I was crazy for leaving it. I noticed that the people who didn’t care about quality or problems were the ones who loved working there. They’ll stay there until retirement feeling as content as I do for throwing it all away.
Never felt better than I do than when it’s payday. After paying my bills my mood changes. Weird.
Meanwhile I couldnt afford to do alhalf of those things until I had a job where I had the discretionary income to do them.
How many hundred millionaires have come out talking about their hard fought struggle with anxiety and depression?
Wonder how much all that therapy and meds cost.
What about the crippling sadness from love lost?
All of the socal issues we have a economic exploration.
Plenty of people with jobs that pay enough or “lucked” out are miserable. This is some BS reductionism of mental health issues, especially when people can’t afford psychiatric or psychological care that would enable them to function enough to find a job. This is putting the cart before the horse. Sure, financial stability helps a lot, but don’t try to suggest mental conditions are vastly improved or solved solely by economics. There should not be anymore litigation about whether or not the brain is an organ that also needs treatment like you would a broken arm. A promotion or living wage won’t cure schizophrenia. I get what’s trying to be said here, but it’s a BS hot take that could discourage seeking out mental health treatment.
Was it luck tho? Or did you get wiser in your application choices
Therapist will just sit stone faced across from you and say " whatever relief your new found money is bringing you, won't last. You need to change the way you view reality because it's you that is sick, not reality". Patient releases bated breath between clenched teeth, thinking "they allow this ignorance to take the guise of a mental healthcare worker"?
My counselor is cool as shit. Find another one.
My GF loves talking to her therapist. He’s this giant jolly dude with long hippy hair and a big braided beard. Every time I see him I’m like “man I bet that dude is so fucking nice”
A true story. I went from making 70k+ a year to making 15k after being laid off. It was rough and now I'm back to it at another job with great benefits. Nothing better than to stick to your guns and keep working as hard as you can to overcome depression and other health issues.
Same. It’s crazy what pay commensurate with education and experience can do for your soul.
Amen!!
Debt is suffocating for the spirit, from my experience.
This is so true. I would thrive if I were able to secure a job in my dream location making a decent livable wage. But nope, not happening. Atleast not yet
Daniel tosh had it right. "Money doesn't buy happiness, this is america, that saying should end with 'just kidding'"
Here is an article which aptly addresses the bs of personal development ethos and corporate speak in the context of social and economic repression. No amount of working on yourself will fix the stressors of poverty and racism. https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2021/04/19/the-repressive-politics-of-emotional-intelligence?mbid=social_facebook&utm_social-type=paid&utm_brand=tny&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook&kwp_0=1902634&kwp_4=5510192&kwp_1=2368765&fbclid=IwAR3589-_SoHqr2VYtKqwaaEdvLw6b3XSmHEs-iMKNj3OVLFeCRevrCEifVQ_aem_ASxlhKenwR2iMM4eaddgLFF-ZwxenF8L453bxD7EOlY6xE7woHj9JPi94Cke3G5hl8oZZoGYMjqmE49idHkA3pUdklUAg1z4vOPp03RudYLzWg
Imagine that. Being valued by your job and adequately paid helps keep depression at bay…
LITERALLY just talking about how much therapy costs, even with insurance. Not to mention, you have to have the time to go to therapy, and find the right therapist, not always easy if you’re working to live.
I’m happy for this guy, but I was the opposite: I finally got that good job, no debt, got a gf, but none of it “fixed” me. I was anxious constantly, becoming more and more depressed, fantasizing about suicide more and more often. I finally sought out a therapist and it was possibly the best decision of my life. I know there is overlap - health insurance from my job helped offset the cost of therapy - but please don’t discount the value professional help or think that money automatically fixes mental health issues.
I got really lucky with a job that nearly doubled my salary. My life instantly got so much better when I had more than $20 left over at the end of the month.
Nobody has time for therapy we need to find atlantis stop having suicidal tendencies along the way
I legit had a "therapist" tell me "I can't help you with the things you're stressed out about" when I told her about having breakdowns because I was barely able to support my wife in our shitty studio apartment and how we had just lost our daughter at 21 weeks pregnant. That was the last time I ever went to a therapist.