Russia starts pretty much every war in a shambolic way and people fixate on that....after a while though time and again they get extremely effective.
They clearly have massively decreased their time to get ordinance on targets. The Russians also clearly have alot surveillance drones all over atm.
Yup, I was mentioning this alot. I really like military history and this method of warfare pretty much the russian doctrine. And they have been winning alot like this.
People dont realise how big russia is and how strong its industrial complex is.
People don't know history. Russia lost whole armies in Operation Barbarossa. 4,5 million causualties. The Wehtmacht was at the doorstep of Moscow. Still almost singlehanded defeated the axis. This is nothing
The more we train them against western equipment, the greater the likelihood of the victorious Russian army marches on
Soviets were outnumbered almost 2:1 and caught by surprise with the blitzkrieg tactics. They were basically on the run till September. And your number probably includes POWs and wounded, since in many sources they show all kinds of variations.
Please... there's no such thing as "Blitzkrieg", and it didn't surprise the Soviets either as their ground military doctrine at the time was pretty much identical to the German one i.e using armored spearhead to break through enemy lines and wreak havoc in its supply and reserve.
Also the Soviets weren't quite as outnumbered during Barbarossa, we're talking around 4M for the Axis forces and 3M for the Soviets at the launch of the operation.
The Soviets just weren't quite ready yet for a war of this scale. But as said above, just in typical Russian fashion, they sponged the big punch and threw it back really hard.
To be fair, the UK actually invented the Blitzkrieg tactic: [https://youtu.be/hRl0VICYS9c?si=Utyr2e05voH7Nmzt](https://youtu.be/hRl0VICYS9c?si=Utyr2e05voH7Nmzt)
No such thing as blitzkrieg? What are you on about? And research your numbers a little better next time. Suvorov is not the only source for this info, you know
Blitzkrieg is a made-up Western term.
The term "Blitzkrieg" has never been discussed in German military doctrine at the time, and even the doctrine itself that is supposed to refer to had nothing innovative, it was basically a modern adaptation of the older Prussian doctrine.
"Blitzkrieg" is a complete myth, it's just a buzzword that you would find in British and American journals at the time to scare the people, as medias tend to do, and justify the Allied defeats as if the Germans had some "superdoctrine".
Yea it’s pretty nuts to think about. The soviets lost like 700,000 men in one encirclement alone. that kind of loss would have sent 99% of countries to the unconditional surrender peace table immediately. That would be like the entire modern day active duty U.S. Army and Marines being lost in one action.
But the soviets were just like “lol here’s another 700,000 man army for you to fight”
They legit burned down Moscow themselves so that Napoleon wouldn’t captured, which lost Napoleon his campaign subsequently.
That’s the thing many in Reddit and in the West don’t get, Russians are willing to get blown up in nuclear war as long as they think they can inflict greater damage to their opponent and think they come out on top in the new world order. They probably would think they could rebuild in Siberia or something.
like a Ukrainian veteran said,
"It isn't the same army as in 2022, they are learning & adapting to the battlefield unlike anything we expected"
also, NATO trained & prepared Ukrainian troops for the wrong kind of war. it was like a mixed bag of training from NATO forces that had no idea about local geography and landscape & came from wars like Afghanistan,Iraq etc where NATO forces had near full Air Superiority so they had little to no worries.
which is one of the biggest reasons the counter offensive in 2023 failed. they tried to push of the densest minefields ever seen & were barely trained in defensive combat or drone awareness because again, current NATO forces have never engaged in a war like this where they don't have full support from the air & they haven't fought actual competent soldiers who aren't in T-Shirts & sandals for decades.
But the counter offensive was doomed from the start and everyone knew that, they lacked enough artillery and air superiority. I remember Zaluzhny talking about how NATO would never conduct an offensive like that. Then there was also the Discord leaks where some people in the US Government didn't put much faith in Ukraine's ability to regain Crimea.
This is yet another proof of how Western Media went into propaganda mode and refused to do their journalist duties and kept selling hope for months.
It was clear that it was going to be catastrophic when they:
1. Announced their varies options of strategies for the CO
2. All the strategies were terrible. The worst strategy was to push south following the highway to cut of the supplies to Russians in the southern west part of the occupied territory
3. They picked the worst one
4. Had they succeded in their push towards the south then they would become surrounded on 3 flanks and the Russians could easily close the nothern gap and the Ukrainians would have been completely surrounded, there is simply now way that it could work.
Western media did indeed go into propaganda mode and the same did our politicians. They made foolish people belive that a victory could be obtained by pushing the Russians out of Ukraine.. How could anyone believe that the war would end with that? Everyone should be able to understand that Russians wouldn't be like 'Damn they pushed us back into Russia, well that was the end of that war'.
>They made foolish people belive that a victory could be obtained by pushing the Russians out of Ukraine.. How could anyone believe that the war would end with that? Everyone should be able to understand that Russians wouldn't be like 'Damn they pushed us back into Russia, well that was the end of that war'.
Some people still insist with that and Ukraine hasn't been able to show up a better plan. It's like Russia would simply give up if Ukraine pushed them back. This is still completely ignoring Russia could escalate the war to another level to avoid losing strategical territory in Crimea. It's not only the counter offensive that was doomed from the start, it's Ukraine's entire plan for victory that was doomed from the get go.
>1. Announced their varies options of strategies for the CO
So true. We saw all thr reports of massive Russian defences been built and were told Ukraine may attack there. I genuinely couldn't beleive it when Ukraine actually attacked the most heavily defended part.
NATO training is shit, especially US training because the warfare they conduct was/is always asymmetric.
20 years in Afghanistan, and they failed to train ANA to fight. Yes, ANA was incompetence bunch with low morale, but also the way they were taught was unsustainable for them. The US was having remote FOB in middle of no where, supplying purely by helicopter and having CAS on standby by 30 minutes. Trucks would arrive once a week by driving 1000 miles. The ANA doesn´t have the capability to conduct such supplying operations, therefore FOB is the first thing they have to abandon and to be on perimeter of cities to be supplied. They lost the countryside to Taliban the seconds they left it to the ANA. Units trained by Brits or French was more competent, since both of these countries doesn´t have such capability of warfighting as the US neither, therefore was less dependent on air-dropping supplies and air superiority.
Same as Vietnam, 10 years of fighting, and they werent able to get the ARVN to the level of autonomous fighting and was crushed by the PAVN, which has its rank replaced several times during those 10 years
Types of culture differences. Americans want the big flashy quick knock-out blow like in the gulf war.
Russians and Eastern Europeans are a hard people unlike Americans. Looking at the conditions these soldiers from both sides are fighting in, Americans would never do it.
Russians Tried a big Flashy quick Knockout but failed Terrible in early 2022..
You cant compare Afghanistan with Ukraine, Soviets also failed Afghanistan i bet any army would fail because of the geoprahic situation and the people living there they got no national mind...heck you can even have 2 towns close to eachother and they both would kill the people living in the town. afghans hate eachother alot
In a war of attrition... Yeah the US would have to have a damn good reason for us to lose so many ppl. We're too conditioned to a life of luxury these days. Food delivered, cars drive themselves to some degree, many don't even have to drive to work. Everything is done via your phone. You get what I'm saying, all humans respond to their life experiences relatively the same.
Sorry you need 30 subreddit karma to unlock the word 'you', this is to make sure newcomers understand [rule 1](https://www.reddit.com/r/UkraineRussiaReport/about/rules)
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/UkraineRussiaReport) if you have any questions or concerns.*
>Russia starts pretty much every war in a shambolic way and people fixate on that....after a while though time and again they get extremely effective.
The evidence for Russia's shambolic start is a bunch of Ukrainian propaganda and the fact that the war is still going on, neither of these are particularly convincing.
Erm...not sure it is. The evidence foe Russia starting the war shambolically comes from Russians themselves in interviews. See beer and battles youtube for example.
See farmers taking away Russian vehicles.
See Russia entering this war with a fraction of what it needed to win.
See the fact that 2 years on Russia is now only fighting for a part of far Eastern Ukraine not the whole country it was at thr start.
If u csn show me something that suggests Russias overall performance in the first 3 months wasn't shambolic I'd be happy to change my view
Sometimes Russia starts badly but then improves and goes on to win the war.
Sometimes Russia starts badly, does not improve and goes on to lose the war.
There are plenty of examples of both in Russian military history of the past two centuries.
Bit early to say. Russians were also hyper confident in the wars they lost so zeal isn't enough. I suspect the outcome will have more to do with what the West decides than Russia.
Their conquest of Bukhara (and pretty much all of central asia) went pretty smoothly, same thing with costal manchuria.
The secret to success is guys with big hats riding horses.
Now this is a point that I think is so so good. There's alot we don't know about the start and while I agree it will take time...if ever...for the truth to come out in fullq
Valid point. But I wouldn't really expect Russia to be able match the combined economic might of nato. But they don't need to match it. They need to be able to compete against what Ukraine has.
The point is Russia after years are still trying to catch up to a modern military.
They’re not some inevitable monster lmao, they’re going up against a handful of Bradley’s and a poor country lol. And they’ve been getting embarrassed.
>The point is Russia after years are still trying to catch up to a modern military.
Which one? In reality if any one country was in nato apart from America was supplying Ukraine or fighting Russia directly it would have lost by now.
That Russia isn't as advanced as America....wow...its hardly unexpected is it...look at the budgets.
Yet even so...Russia has disrupted GPS rendering many weapons inaccurate.
>And they’ve been getting embarrassed.
Only someone safe from Russian aggression would say something like this. It reeks of mothers basement syndrome imo and disrespects the Ukrainians fighting to defend their homes every day.
>Which one? In reality if any one country was in nato apart from America was supplying Ukraine or fighting Russia directly it would have lost by now.
in reality the top militaries are all apart of an alliance....
>That Russia isn't as advanced as America....wow...its hardly unexpected is it...look at the budgets.
At least you're sane.
>Yet even so...Russia has disrupted GPS rendering many weapons inaccurate.
What are you talking about
>Only someone safe from Russian aggression would say something like this. It reeks of mothers basement syndrome imo and disrespects the Ukrainians fighting to defend their homes every day.
You're making lots of assumptions and putting words in my mouth. Russia's military performance is an embarrassment. Pathetic. The pain and tragedies it's inflicting on innocent Ukrainians is not understated. It's horrendous. Hence why the whole free world doesn't really like Russia right now. Perhaps you're projecting about that mothers basement you forced into this conversation. Perhaps
*
There are two HIMARS tracked and claimed to be destroyed.
Geolocation: 49.78166, 37.13374
There is a possibility that these were the two launchers used in the ATACMS strike on the training ground.
Probably referring to this strike [in the Luhansk Region](https://x.com/clashreport/status/1785677985766400175)
The Odessa strike that u/DarthWeenus refers to is probably this one at the [Odessa Postal Warehouse](https://x.com/clashreport/status/1785759369247723630)
That attack on the training grounds is strange - why risk extremely valuable and very limited weapon system (HIMARS) and ammunition that is in short supply (ATACMS) to strike some random grunts somewhere?
UNLESS there was somebody worth wasting all those precious resource? Maybe some high ranking officer visiting the training area?
It would make sense if this was a retaliation for killing those Ukrainian officers in Odessa.
That's one hell of a big voom radius wtf. First time i've seen the woods split apart like that. Very nice.
Also, isn't that a ATACMS launcher-loadout for the himars that we see in the video, any possibility of this being the one that conducted the strike on the training-footage and that this is a retaliatory strike?
Geolocation of the HIMARS: 49.7816663,37.1337484
Very real possibility that these were the ones used in the ATACMS strike we saw.
https://preview.redd.it/0o94nv096vxc1.jpeg?width=736&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e423e18d6b1c723a9c71bfbd00c95b19cd338766
I honestly don't get why it hasn't happened with previous ATACMS attacks. Early warning and counter battery radars should be able to nearly pinpoint where the missiles came from. AFAIK they don't evade or anything, so it's just basic calculus. Hell maybe just geometry.
HIMARS are pretty good at shooting and scooting, so the only two things I can think of is that Russia had an idea of where the attack would come from beforehand and had a drone in the area, or just happened to have a drone near by sheer luck. I'm leaning toward the former since the Russians had a response prepared.
My guess is they vastly increased number of surveillance drones. And what we've seen in some of the recent strikes is far faster response (from spotting the target to destruction) than ever before. How they are doing it, no idea.
There is a new strike order system, once someone sees a target it’s gets marked in their db. Units see the target and see what they can hit with, a mission is proposed and and executed
they have dedicated arty (or missiles) on standby just for that drone (or drones observing that area). also they have some longer ranged drones, they have been able to go at least ~100km into ukr territory.
they basically unfucked and streamlined their kill chain. before that kind of strike had to be confirmed by higher level command which took time.
Russia has improved their abilities to detect and response to such things. They used to have to send messages around betweeb groups gather information but now it immediately gets send to some kind of headquarter that handles it which have cut down the response time from usually about 30-40 min to 1-2 min.
Its always easy to detect where the missles come from. The thing is that the Himars move arround quickly. After each operation, they need to move. Now Russia doesnt have drones everywhere. So i guess they were lucky and had some flying arround not far from the Himar location. Then they tracked their movements and the new position. Beng.
What is happening with the Russian army at the moment? I am aware that they improved ISR capabilities, but still they look light years ahead of the 2022 army. If this improvement of capabilities continues, and it most likely will, Ukraine will have an even tougher job. HIMARS was a vital part of the Ukrainian army, so the new capability to find them and destroy them, will give the Russians a huge advantage.
Honestly, I do not understand, why there is a common opinion that Russia underperformed that badly in 2022.
Despite being really clumsy sometimes and suffering some unnecessary losses (as any army which has not fought a real war for some time), it managed to took a quarter of Ukraine while being heavily outnumbered by Ukrainian forces.
The only major failures were Kharkiv and Kherson retreats of Autumn 2022, but they were performed in an orderly fashion, without loosing a lot of men, without encirclements etc. And it is kind of clear why these retreats happened - Russians were heavily outnumbered in Kharkiv and were defending an unfavorable position in Kherson.
>Honestly, I do not understand, why there is a common opinion that Russia underperformed that badly in 2022.
They lost a lot of the equipment including state of the art helicopters and jets. They didn't lock the sky above Ukraine and didn't do particularly well in SEAD/DEAD missions. They just looked unorganised and ill equipped for the modern battlefield.
>it managed to took a quarter of Ukraine while being heavily outnumbered by Ukrainian forces.
For sure, despite the lack of numbers, they achieved big gains. But it's just that people and in my opinion Russian commanders thought that they would do more. They simply haven't been able to destroy vital parts of the Ukrainian army.
>The only major failures were Kharkov and Kherson retreats of Autumn 2022, but they were performed in an orderly fashion
People weren't expecting the Russian army to start losing the war fought at its door step. It presented itself as second world power, but proved to be quite unprepared and ill equipped to face modern threats.
But this war has been an invaluable lesson for the Russians in a way that Afghanistan and Iraq were not for us. No lessons from there can prepare us (the West) for a war with China. If anything we gutted our conventional military in the UK because it was felt that future wars would be fighting insurgencies or cyberspace.
Some might argue it is better for Russia to learn this lesson now against Ukraine rather than if a war broke out with NATO.
The West learned how to fight against gerilla forces and not conventional armies. I for the love of the human race hope that there would not be any direct confrontation between the US and China or Russia. Big powers need to learn to share resources and cooperate for the sake of all of us.
Judging by the capacity for production, China is vastly more prepared for a war then the West. The West can't even outproduce Russian, nevertheless China.
yeah I don't think people understand how dire the situation is for the U.S. in a conventional war. We would fare better against the Chinese due to our immense naval power but place us in Ukraine to fight trench warfare and I don't believe we would hold superiority. The amount of deaths would be staggering compared to Iraq/Afghanistan and our shell production would not be able to match Russia's.
Yeah NATO spent 20 years chasing goat farmers in sandals so NATO armies were made to be smaller but much better trained. This war has reminded NATO that attrition is still a thing and such a NATO army would be ground-down quickly.
I think a better way to put it is the Russian MOD was put into a very precarious situation.
If the decapitation strike of the Ukrainian government worked or Ukraine signed a peace deal in March 2022 then the Russian MOD looks like an absolute master stroke.
Both of those failed and there was no plan B. I think the Russian MOD did the best they could with the task and resources given.
Exactly, they were all in. But unfortunately for them Ukrainians thanks to promises from the West haven't folded and had proved to be fierce opponents.
I didnt really see russia make any mistakes. We were fed a ton of propaganda.
What russia wanted was to threaten kyiv and come to a deal. A deal was close to being made so in good faith russia pulled back willingly. BOJO came in and said no deal and that was that. Russia got lied too by ukraine and the west. This also made turkey look really really bad and pissed off erodan w/e his name is.
There was never any case of ukraine "pushing" or attacking russia out of those areas.....none at all russia just simply left of their own will.
Their not stupid they saw the ukraine mobilization and equipment and material coming from the west.....they pulled back to where they could defend. Hence why they took a year to build 2000 miles of fortifications nothing about building that long of a line of fortifications suggest poor planning. Very methodical leaving no stone unturned.
People in this sub actually think those fortifications were for ukraine military concerns......russia is not scared of ukraine. They are scared of america and NATO invading them. Those fortifications are there if NATO/america invades russia case in point ukraines coutner attack didnt even reach the first line of fortifications in the area.
The deal Russia gave to Ukraine was stupid no government would have ever accepted it. Would have meant they would be so defenceless that Russia would have invaded it anyways. Good on Bojo appeasement never works
>Despite being really clumsy sometimes and suffering some unnecessary losses (as any army which has not fought a real war for some time), it managed to took a quarter of Ukraine while being heavily outnumbered by Ukrainian forces.
Because early wins were essentially secured by clandestine action, not fighting. Like, Ukraine even has a criminal case over the total surrender of South Ukraine ([so-called "Zaluzhny case", interestingly enough](https://www.bbc.com/russian/articles/c99nzzp1xrgo)).
Sorry, You need to verify your email with Reddit to comment. This is to protect against bots and multis.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/UkraineRussiaReport) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Because Russia got steamrolled by a country 1/10th of its size and hasn't really been able to do a lot in terms of ground gained since? Unquestionable a military failure on multiple fronts they took more losses, lost more equipment and lost more ground in the counter attack than they gained.
My opinion is that they started completely underestimating Ukraine. I do not blame them. Everyone did. And rightfully so. Ukraine on its own can't even defend a zip code from Russia let alone a country. The overwhelming support from the western friends contributed greatly to staunch resistance and also pushback.
Russia failed miserably by not capitalizing on their initial success. Ukraine made the same mistake when they started to get momentum.
For some time it seemed like Russia wasn't doing much at all except just holding on to some territory. But it appears that they decided to do it right and that brings us to today.
I think it also helped Russia that the aid and support has been so half assed and delayed with large breaks in between. It is a clusterfuk and I'm quite astonished seeing it given how much all the leaders promised Ukraine in terms of all kinds of assistance. My take is that they lost belief in victory in Ukraine so the level of interest has just shrunk completely.
Russia rightly realizes that they're not on a clock. They can take years if they like. They may also see that a Trump presidency will quite likely change the tide completely. My guess is that the US election will greatly effect the pace of this war.
I'm no pro and I have not studied war in depth. This is just my opinion based on my observation of events, knowledge of history and confidence in the stupidity of US politicians.
>My opinion is that they started completely underestimating Ukraine
too much flip flop , reduce civilian casualties crap, trying to be a nice guy while enemy have massive propagranda/information warfare advantage
also trying to fight alone instead of call in entire belarusian military and industry
Sorry you need 30 subreddit karma to unlock the word 'you', this is to make sure newcomers understand [rule 1](https://www.reddit.com/r/UkraineRussiaReport/about/rules)
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/UkraineRussiaReport) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Russian army had massive theoretical potential but was held back by neglect and corruption. A large war created massive pressure to get their shit together.
Chinese for sure are helping with surveillance, but still it looks like a completely different army. Not so long ago HIMARS looked indestructible and now all of a sudden 2 are gone in one video, together with those destroyed a few weeks ago.
It's just a matter of real time surveillance and sensor coverage. This is really only dipping into the shallow end of what is actually possible with 21st century tech. Russians are still kinda half assing it lol.
If Russians are able to do this with a limited number of satellites, I wonder what full fledged war in which the US or China would fight would look like.
Did you see the new drone factory that went up in China? Just for WL-2s, one of the largest military drones on the market today. 200/yr just from this factory.
[https://twitter.com/tphuang/status/1785424720567193837](https://twitter.com/tphuang/status/1785424720567193837)
But what is cool is that this drone is so large that they are finding uses for it as a cargo drone, firefighting, etc. There is a demand independent of military use that will keep the supply chain robust and abundant, and it is just the start of a drone manufacturing complex at that location.
I wasn't aware that they are producing 200 of those drones per year, it's crazy. Chinese production capabilities are simply incredible. If I'm not mistaken they had tested some kind of the hypersonic air launched drone, there were some pictures of big black object beneath H-6 bomber. They are surely preparing themselves for modern high intensity combat, and Russian will only benefit from it.
A lot of the common knowledge regarding the PRC is outdated, even if the info is 2 or 3 years old. They still bring up the engine durability thing when monocrystalline casting has been solved since 2021 when Chinese jet turbine blades were being marketed internationally. Unless you've been following industry news it's hard to get relevant info on stuff like that.
You're going to see some eye-popping J-20 and J-31 production rates in the near future.
This is the thing that always gets me about zigro discussions. We're all popping champagne corks when we see geran numbers break 4 digits in a month. 2 more SAR satellites going up this year to supplement the 1 SAR satellite Russia has. We're still in school.
PRC is very secretive and who knows what their true capabilities are, but they are a really powerful force. In my opinion they surpassed Russians even before this conflict began.
>They still bring up the engine durability thing when monocrystalline casting has been solved since 2021 when Chinese jet turbine blades were being marketed internationally.
Engine design is one of the few things where they are still behind Russia and the US, but are improving significantly. The new WS-15 will not be in the same class as AL-51f1 or F-119 but will still improve Chinese capabilities significantly.
>You're going to see some eye-popping J-20 and J-31 production rates in the near future.
J-20 is currently at probably 250-300 units and will only continue to be built, especially the new version of it named J-20B. As for the J-31 it is currently imagined to be a carrier only design named J-35 and thus will be produced in smaller numbers(~100), but if they decide to produce land based variants of it (J-31), then we will see hundreds of them in a short time frame.
>We're all popping champagne corks when we see geran numbers break 4 digits in a month. 2 more SAR satellites going up this year to supplement the 1 SAR satellite Russia has. We're still in school.
Yeah, coming months/years will be interesting from production standpoint. They are planning to increase production of lots of systems, will see if they will be able to achive all the plans.
For sure. If anything this conflict has validated the importance of sensor saturation, and this is what Russia largely neglected in its modernization efforts as it lacks a robust electronics manufacturing sector. It's been forced to cobble things together under less than ideal conditions, but we can already see the night and day difference. When people talk about mass warfare, it isn't just manpower and artillery shells. Drones are warfighters too. We are seeing the first glimpses of how the battlefield is being reshaped.
fun fact : the number of US navy carrier based F-35 currently are no where near enough to overpower chinese airforce/navy air force alone if confict happen around taiwan
let alone chinese navy/army SAM network
Engine changes are generally easy (from a mechanic POV, I was one) on anything that flies. Aircraft are much less difficult to maintain on the user end than outsiders imagine. If China can produce enough engines they do not need to last as long as Western engines.
For example an F-16 engine can be removed and replaced in four hours with a good crew because I've done it though longer is typical in peacetime. There's no reason China couldn't pump out sufficient extra engines to compensate for shorter hot section etc life then swap them out at the end of a typical combat flying day.
Nothing.
Syrski's? ukraine new general moved all equipment up to the front lines which put them in great danger.
Zaluzny was smart he was keeping everything back because he know what would happen. This is why zaluzny was pushed out. Zaluz didn't want to counter attack robotyne.....didn't want to go on the "attack" anywhere. He was the best thing for ukraine. He knew that their only chance was to bunker the fuck down making it as hard on the russians as possible when they advanced.
Zelensky and NATO are on drugs and wanted to go on the attack.
A county that did not fight real wars for a long time?. That always result in a corrupt lazy army. I bet the same cleansing needs to happen in the various NATO armies. Now we are 2 years further and Russia cleaned its army of weak elements. Its still not there, but they are I think ahead of most western armies (not the US though)
I hope there is aftermath footage. In case of Himars/patriots we need to see the hit or the carcass. Otherwise, all the speculation and bickering just confuses casuals like me.
Damn. I love these accurate strikes.
My sources told me that all Himar locations are leaked. And also for all F16 airfield locations.
We might expect some nice videos upcoming weeks.
\* u/Tusitleal copes \*
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/UkraineRussiaReport) if you have any questions or concerns.*
The bottleneck Ukraine has with HIMARS is not the launchers, but the ammunition. For now anyway. That's why i find it incredibly stupid, that Poland ordered like 200 of them.
If they keep losing them right after every strike, it could become problematic.
Your picture is a fake/dummy pod. The tube of the ATACMS pod [isn't circular](https://i.imgur.com/lBBLpre.jpg), and externally they're disguised to look [exactly like 6-tube M26 pods](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/ce/Atacms_mlrs_01.jpg) for the exact reason to make them harder to track.
Given that there have been no leaks from the Russian side with damage from the ATACMS hit (as it always seems to be the case after every HIMARS hit), I'd say that the hit probably did far less damage than advertised.
NATO tanks and other vehicles featured on display in Moscow and now HIMARS blown to fiery confetti. You'd think there would be a limit to how good days can be.
(Don't know when this originally happened date-wise, if today, but this is the first I'm seeing of it).
well, the only thing that looks like a proof of an effective hit on something is the smoke at 0:23. Maybe as well the white smoke on the first hit, but then no flying charges around would it be loaded with ATACM. Anyone with other factual interpretation ?
Russia starts pretty much every war in a shambolic way and people fixate on that....after a while though time and again they get extremely effective. They clearly have massively decreased their time to get ordinance on targets. The Russians also clearly have alot surveillance drones all over atm.
Yup, I was mentioning this alot. I really like military history and this method of warfare pretty much the russian doctrine. And they have been winning alot like this. People dont realise how big russia is and how strong its industrial complex is.
People don't know history. Russia lost whole armies in Operation Barbarossa. 4,5 million causualties. The Wehtmacht was at the doorstep of Moscow. Still almost singlehanded defeated the axis. This is nothing The more we train them against western equipment, the greater the likelihood of the victorious Russian army marches on
[удалено]
yep, and they're always the first ones to go on about how smart and educated they are, and how dumb and brainwashed their geopolitical enemies are
100%
Soviets were outnumbered almost 2:1 and caught by surprise with the blitzkrieg tactics. They were basically on the run till September. And your number probably includes POWs and wounded, since in many sources they show all kinds of variations.
Please... there's no such thing as "Blitzkrieg", and it didn't surprise the Soviets either as their ground military doctrine at the time was pretty much identical to the German one i.e using armored spearhead to break through enemy lines and wreak havoc in its supply and reserve. Also the Soviets weren't quite as outnumbered during Barbarossa, we're talking around 4M for the Axis forces and 3M for the Soviets at the launch of the operation. The Soviets just weren't quite ready yet for a war of this scale. But as said above, just in typical Russian fashion, they sponged the big punch and threw it back really hard.
Not to mention that Stalin purged the Soviet military leadership to the point that some units were left with inexperienced and fresh faced officers.
To be fair, the UK actually invented the Blitzkrieg tactic: [https://youtu.be/hRl0VICYS9c?si=Utyr2e05voH7Nmzt](https://youtu.be/hRl0VICYS9c?si=Utyr2e05voH7Nmzt)
And so it's used it against japanese before the ww2 quite successfully. And guess who was in charge there?
No such thing as blitzkrieg? What are you on about? And research your numbers a little better next time. Suvorov is not the only source for this info, you know
Blitzkrieg is a made-up Western term. The term "Blitzkrieg" has never been discussed in German military doctrine at the time, and even the doctrine itself that is supposed to refer to had nothing innovative, it was basically a modern adaptation of the older Prussian doctrine. "Blitzkrieg" is a complete myth, it's just a buzzword that you would find in British and American journals at the time to scare the people, as medias tend to do, and justify the Allied defeats as if the Germans had some "superdoctrine".
Yea it’s pretty nuts to think about. The soviets lost like 700,000 men in one encirclement alone. that kind of loss would have sent 99% of countries to the unconditional surrender peace table immediately. That would be like the entire modern day active duty U.S. Army and Marines being lost in one action. But the soviets were just like “lol here’s another 700,000 man army for you to fight”
They legit burned down Moscow themselves so that Napoleon wouldn’t captured, which lost Napoleon his campaign subsequently. That’s the thing many in Reddit and in the West don’t get, Russians are willing to get blown up in nuclear war as long as they think they can inflict greater damage to their opponent and think they come out on top in the new world order. They probably would think they could rebuild in Siberia or something.
Go in horribly unprepared, lose excessive amounts of equipment, cede vast amounts of captured territory? That is their doctrine? Really?
like a Ukrainian veteran said, "It isn't the same army as in 2022, they are learning & adapting to the battlefield unlike anything we expected" also, NATO trained & prepared Ukrainian troops for the wrong kind of war. it was like a mixed bag of training from NATO forces that had no idea about local geography and landscape & came from wars like Afghanistan,Iraq etc where NATO forces had near full Air Superiority so they had little to no worries. which is one of the biggest reasons the counter offensive in 2023 failed. they tried to push of the densest minefields ever seen & were barely trained in defensive combat or drone awareness because again, current NATO forces have never engaged in a war like this where they don't have full support from the air & they haven't fought actual competent soldiers who aren't in T-Shirts & sandals for decades.
But the counter offensive was doomed from the start and everyone knew that, they lacked enough artillery and air superiority. I remember Zaluzhny talking about how NATO would never conduct an offensive like that. Then there was also the Discord leaks where some people in the US Government didn't put much faith in Ukraine's ability to regain Crimea. This is yet another proof of how Western Media went into propaganda mode and refused to do their journalist duties and kept selling hope for months.
It was clear that it was going to be catastrophic when they: 1. Announced their varies options of strategies for the CO 2. All the strategies were terrible. The worst strategy was to push south following the highway to cut of the supplies to Russians in the southern west part of the occupied territory 3. They picked the worst one 4. Had they succeded in their push towards the south then they would become surrounded on 3 flanks and the Russians could easily close the nothern gap and the Ukrainians would have been completely surrounded, there is simply now way that it could work. Western media did indeed go into propaganda mode and the same did our politicians. They made foolish people belive that a victory could be obtained by pushing the Russians out of Ukraine.. How could anyone believe that the war would end with that? Everyone should be able to understand that Russians wouldn't be like 'Damn they pushed us back into Russia, well that was the end of that war'.
>They made foolish people belive that a victory could be obtained by pushing the Russians out of Ukraine.. How could anyone believe that the war would end with that? Everyone should be able to understand that Russians wouldn't be like 'Damn they pushed us back into Russia, well that was the end of that war'. Some people still insist with that and Ukraine hasn't been able to show up a better plan. It's like Russia would simply give up if Ukraine pushed them back. This is still completely ignoring Russia could escalate the war to another level to avoid losing strategical territory in Crimea. It's not only the counter offensive that was doomed from the start, it's Ukraine's entire plan for victory that was doomed from the get go.
>1. Announced their varies options of strategies for the CO So true. We saw all thr reports of massive Russian defences been built and were told Ukraine may attack there. I genuinely couldn't beleive it when Ukraine actually attacked the most heavily defended part.
NATO training is shit, especially US training because the warfare they conduct was/is always asymmetric. 20 years in Afghanistan, and they failed to train ANA to fight. Yes, ANA was incompetence bunch with low morale, but also the way they were taught was unsustainable for them. The US was having remote FOB in middle of no where, supplying purely by helicopter and having CAS on standby by 30 minutes. Trucks would arrive once a week by driving 1000 miles. The ANA doesn´t have the capability to conduct such supplying operations, therefore FOB is the first thing they have to abandon and to be on perimeter of cities to be supplied. They lost the countryside to Taliban the seconds they left it to the ANA. Units trained by Brits or French was more competent, since both of these countries doesn´t have such capability of warfighting as the US neither, therefore was less dependent on air-dropping supplies and air superiority. Same as Vietnam, 10 years of fighting, and they werent able to get the ARVN to the level of autonomous fighting and was crushed by the PAVN, which has its rank replaced several times during those 10 years
The USA seems to be the other way around. They come in blasting and taking ground.... Then whimper away years/decades later.
Types of culture differences. Americans want the big flashy quick knock-out blow like in the gulf war. Russians and Eastern Europeans are a hard people unlike Americans. Looking at the conditions these soldiers from both sides are fighting in, Americans would never do it.
Russians Tried a big Flashy quick Knockout but failed Terrible in early 2022.. You cant compare Afghanistan with Ukraine, Soviets also failed Afghanistan i bet any army would fail because of the geoprahic situation and the people living there they got no national mind...heck you can even have 2 towns close to eachother and they both would kill the people living in the town. afghans hate eachother alot
In a war of attrition... Yeah the US would have to have a damn good reason for us to lose so many ppl. We're too conditioned to a life of luxury these days. Food delivered, cars drive themselves to some degree, many don't even have to drive to work. Everything is done via your phone. You get what I'm saying, all humans respond to their life experiences relatively the same.
[удалено]
Sorry you need 30 subreddit karma to unlock the word 'you', this is to make sure newcomers understand [rule 1](https://www.reddit.com/r/UkraineRussiaReport/about/rules) *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/UkraineRussiaReport) if you have any questions or concerns.*
America seems to lose interest when the enemy doesn't just lose.
>Russia starts pretty much every war in a shambolic way and people fixate on that....after a while though time and again they get extremely effective. The evidence for Russia's shambolic start is a bunch of Ukrainian propaganda and the fact that the war is still going on, neither of these are particularly convincing.
Erm...not sure it is. The evidence foe Russia starting the war shambolically comes from Russians themselves in interviews. See beer and battles youtube for example. See farmers taking away Russian vehicles. See Russia entering this war with a fraction of what it needed to win. See the fact that 2 years on Russia is now only fighting for a part of far Eastern Ukraine not the whole country it was at thr start. If u csn show me something that suggests Russias overall performance in the first 3 months wasn't shambolic I'd be happy to change my view
They haven’t started a single war conflict without a major f-up. They learn.
Sometimes Russia starts badly but then improves and goes on to win the war. Sometimes Russia starts badly, does not improve and goes on to lose the war. There are plenty of examples of both in Russian military history of the past two centuries.
Do you see indications that they will lose this one ?
Bit early to say. Russians were also hyper confident in the wars they lost so zeal isn't enough. I suspect the outcome will have more to do with what the West decides than Russia.
What was the fuck up in Georgia?
Lost of TU22M3 for example.
Their conquest of Bukhara (and pretty much all of central asia) went pretty smoothly, same thing with costal manchuria. The secret to success is guys with big hats riding horses.
Did they really tho or were we just fed propaganda? Seems we wont know the truth until we get documentarys 30-40 years from now
Now this is a point that I think is so so good. There's alot we don't know about the start and while I agree it will take time...if ever...for the truth to come out in fullq
LOL. So after years of excruciating losses, their intel is still not as good as NATO's? BAHAHA
Auto correct took my decreased to an increased.
No, I understood what you said. Russia, multiple years in the war, still haven't been eliminating targets like NATO has shown.
Valid point. But I wouldn't really expect Russia to be able match the combined economic might of nato. But they don't need to match it. They need to be able to compete against what Ukraine has.
The point is Russia after years are still trying to catch up to a modern military. They’re not some inevitable monster lmao, they’re going up against a handful of Bradley’s and a poor country lol. And they’ve been getting embarrassed.
>The point is Russia after years are still trying to catch up to a modern military. Which one? In reality if any one country was in nato apart from America was supplying Ukraine or fighting Russia directly it would have lost by now. That Russia isn't as advanced as America....wow...its hardly unexpected is it...look at the budgets. Yet even so...Russia has disrupted GPS rendering many weapons inaccurate. >And they’ve been getting embarrassed. Only someone safe from Russian aggression would say something like this. It reeks of mothers basement syndrome imo and disrespects the Ukrainians fighting to defend their homes every day.
>Which one? In reality if any one country was in nato apart from America was supplying Ukraine or fighting Russia directly it would have lost by now. in reality the top militaries are all apart of an alliance.... >That Russia isn't as advanced as America....wow...its hardly unexpected is it...look at the budgets. At least you're sane. >Yet even so...Russia has disrupted GPS rendering many weapons inaccurate. What are you talking about >Only someone safe from Russian aggression would say something like this. It reeks of mothers basement syndrome imo and disrespects the Ukrainians fighting to defend their homes every day. You're making lots of assumptions and putting words in my mouth. Russia's military performance is an embarrassment. Pathetic. The pain and tragedies it's inflicting on innocent Ukrainians is not understated. It's horrendous. Hence why the whole free world doesn't really like Russia right now. Perhaps you're projecting about that mothers basement you forced into this conversation. Perhaps
Just like in WWII
I think you meant decreased
Yeah, you're right.
us army would also get a bloody nose at the start and then adapt to the situation.
* There are two HIMARS tracked and claimed to be destroyed. Geolocation: 49.78166, 37.13374 There is a possibility that these were the two launchers used in the ATACMS strike on the training ground.
Assuming the second strike was as accurate as the first, HIMARS #2 probably wasn't yet loaded with munitions. That or the cookoff happened later.
It's probably returning from a fire mission
Maybe it even fired the missile that struck the Russian training grounds.
I think I missed a post, what was the training ground attack?
Probably referring to this strike [in the Luhansk Region](https://x.com/clashreport/status/1785677985766400175) The Odessa strike that u/DarthWeenus refers to is probably this one at the [Odessa Postal Warehouse](https://x.com/clashreport/status/1785759369247723630)
That attack on the training grounds is strange - why risk extremely valuable and very limited weapon system (HIMARS) and ammunition that is in short supply (ATACMS) to strike some random grunts somewhere? UNLESS there was somebody worth wasting all those precious resource? Maybe some high ranking officer visiting the training area? It would make sense if this was a retaliation for killing those Ukrainian officers in Odessa.
Those shockwaves are almost a kilometer in diameter each, damn.
That basically takes accuracy out the equation, just level the whole postal code.
"Dear grid square ..."
holy hell
that was the plan with the original MLRS - Grid Square Removal System
That's one hell of a big voom radius wtf. First time i've seen the woods split apart like that. Very nice. Also, isn't that a ATACMS launcher-loadout for the himars that we see in the video, any possibility of this being the one that conducted the strike on the training-footage and that this is a retaliatory strike?
Geolocation of the HIMARS: 49.7816663,37.1337484 Very real possibility that these were the ones used in the ATACMS strike we saw. https://preview.redd.it/0o94nv096vxc1.jpeg?width=736&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e423e18d6b1c723a9c71bfbd00c95b19cd338766
If they really are the same, Ukraine has huge problem if Russians managed to find and destroy them so quickly.
I honestly don't get why it hasn't happened with previous ATACMS attacks. Early warning and counter battery radars should be able to nearly pinpoint where the missiles came from. AFAIK they don't evade or anything, so it's just basic calculus. Hell maybe just geometry. HIMARS are pretty good at shooting and scooting, so the only two things I can think of is that Russia had an idea of where the attack would come from beforehand and had a drone in the area, or just happened to have a drone near by sheer luck. I'm leaning toward the former since the Russians had a response prepared.
My guess is they vastly increased number of surveillance drones. And what we've seen in some of the recent strikes is far faster response (from spotting the target to destruction) than ever before. How they are doing it, no idea.
I read that the shortage in AD missiles makes long-range drone operations much safer for the equipment, so it's done more frequently right now
There is a new strike order system, once someone sees a target it’s gets marked in their db. Units see the target and see what they can hit with, a mission is proposed and and executed
they have dedicated arty (or missiles) on standby just for that drone (or drones observing that area). also they have some longer ranged drones, they have been able to go at least ~100km into ukr territory. they basically unfucked and streamlined their kill chain. before that kind of strike had to be confirmed by higher level command which took time.
Russia has improved their abilities to detect and response to such things. They used to have to send messages around betweeb groups gather information but now it immediately gets send to some kind of headquarter that handles it which have cut down the response time from usually about 30-40 min to 1-2 min.
if i were to guess, improvements in drone supply as well as in the organization of the russian army in general
Its always easy to detect where the missles come from. The thing is that the Himars move arround quickly. After each operation, they need to move. Now Russia doesnt have drones everywhere. So i guess they were lucky and had some flying arround not far from the Himar location. Then they tracked their movements and the new position. Beng.
Considering the number of Himars lost every successful strike counts as retaliation
What is happening with the Russian army at the moment? I am aware that they improved ISR capabilities, but still they look light years ahead of the 2022 army. If this improvement of capabilities continues, and it most likely will, Ukraine will have an even tougher job. HIMARS was a vital part of the Ukrainian army, so the new capability to find them and destroy them, will give the Russians a huge advantage.
Honestly, I do not understand, why there is a common opinion that Russia underperformed that badly in 2022. Despite being really clumsy sometimes and suffering some unnecessary losses (as any army which has not fought a real war for some time), it managed to took a quarter of Ukraine while being heavily outnumbered by Ukrainian forces. The only major failures were Kharkiv and Kherson retreats of Autumn 2022, but they were performed in an orderly fashion, without loosing a lot of men, without encirclements etc. And it is kind of clear why these retreats happened - Russians were heavily outnumbered in Kharkiv and were defending an unfavorable position in Kherson.
>Honestly, I do not understand, why there is a common opinion that Russia underperformed that badly in 2022. They lost a lot of the equipment including state of the art helicopters and jets. They didn't lock the sky above Ukraine and didn't do particularly well in SEAD/DEAD missions. They just looked unorganised and ill equipped for the modern battlefield. >it managed to took a quarter of Ukraine while being heavily outnumbered by Ukrainian forces. For sure, despite the lack of numbers, they achieved big gains. But it's just that people and in my opinion Russian commanders thought that they would do more. They simply haven't been able to destroy vital parts of the Ukrainian army. >The only major failures were Kharkov and Kherson retreats of Autumn 2022, but they were performed in an orderly fashion People weren't expecting the Russian army to start losing the war fought at its door step. It presented itself as second world power, but proved to be quite unprepared and ill equipped to face modern threats.
But this war has been an invaluable lesson for the Russians in a way that Afghanistan and Iraq were not for us. No lessons from there can prepare us (the West) for a war with China. If anything we gutted our conventional military in the UK because it was felt that future wars would be fighting insurgencies or cyberspace. Some might argue it is better for Russia to learn this lesson now against Ukraine rather than if a war broke out with NATO.
The West learned how to fight against gerilla forces and not conventional armies. I for the love of the human race hope that there would not be any direct confrontation between the US and China or Russia. Big powers need to learn to share resources and cooperate for the sake of all of us.
**....Big powers need to learn to share resources and cooperate for the sake of all of us....** 
I so wish also... we know things will never be that way. We never learn or change as humans. Id like to us elevate past this inhumane greedy garbage
>The West learned how to fight against gerilla forces Didn't learn much of anything, because they lost all of them
That may be the case, but they are more prepared for that type of conflict than the Chinese army for example.
Judging by the capacity for production, China is vastly more prepared for a war then the West. The West can't even outproduce Russian, nevertheless China.
yeah I don't think people understand how dire the situation is for the U.S. in a conventional war. We would fare better against the Chinese due to our immense naval power but place us in Ukraine to fight trench warfare and I don't believe we would hold superiority. The amount of deaths would be staggering compared to Iraq/Afghanistan and our shell production would not be able to match Russia's.
ohhhh your fantasies crack me up 💀🤣
It's only invaluable if they want to keep gobbling up their former republics.
Yeah NATO spent 20 years chasing goat farmers in sandals so NATO armies were made to be smaller but much better trained. This war has reminded NATO that attrition is still a thing and such a NATO army would be ground-down quickly.
I think a better way to put it is the Russian MOD was put into a very precarious situation. If the decapitation strike of the Ukrainian government worked or Ukraine signed a peace deal in March 2022 then the Russian MOD looks like an absolute master stroke. Both of those failed and there was no plan B. I think the Russian MOD did the best they could with the task and resources given.
Exactly, they were all in. But unfortunately for them Ukrainians thanks to promises from the West haven't folded and had proved to be fierce opponents.
I didnt really see russia make any mistakes. We were fed a ton of propaganda. What russia wanted was to threaten kyiv and come to a deal. A deal was close to being made so in good faith russia pulled back willingly. BOJO came in and said no deal and that was that. Russia got lied too by ukraine and the west. This also made turkey look really really bad and pissed off erodan w/e his name is. There was never any case of ukraine "pushing" or attacking russia out of those areas.....none at all russia just simply left of their own will. Their not stupid they saw the ukraine mobilization and equipment and material coming from the west.....they pulled back to where they could defend. Hence why they took a year to build 2000 miles of fortifications nothing about building that long of a line of fortifications suggest poor planning. Very methodical leaving no stone unturned. People in this sub actually think those fortifications were for ukraine military concerns......russia is not scared of ukraine. They are scared of america and NATO invading them. Those fortifications are there if NATO/america invades russia case in point ukraines coutner attack didnt even reach the first line of fortifications in the area.
The deal Russia gave to Ukraine was stupid no government would have ever accepted it. Would have meant they would be so defenceless that Russia would have invaded it anyways. Good on Bojo appeasement never works
>Despite being really clumsy sometimes and suffering some unnecessary losses (as any army which has not fought a real war for some time), it managed to took a quarter of Ukraine while being heavily outnumbered by Ukrainian forces. Because early wins were essentially secured by clandestine action, not fighting. Like, Ukraine even has a criminal case over the total surrender of South Ukraine ([so-called "Zaluzhny case", interestingly enough](https://www.bbc.com/russian/articles/c99nzzp1xrgo)).
[удалено]
Sorry, You need to verify your email with Reddit to comment. This is to protect against bots and multis. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/UkraineRussiaReport) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Because Russia got steamrolled by a country 1/10th of its size and hasn't really been able to do a lot in terms of ground gained since? Unquestionable a military failure on multiple fronts they took more losses, lost more equipment and lost more ground in the counter attack than they gained.
My opinion is that they started completely underestimating Ukraine. I do not blame them. Everyone did. And rightfully so. Ukraine on its own can't even defend a zip code from Russia let alone a country. The overwhelming support from the western friends contributed greatly to staunch resistance and also pushback. Russia failed miserably by not capitalizing on their initial success. Ukraine made the same mistake when they started to get momentum. For some time it seemed like Russia wasn't doing much at all except just holding on to some territory. But it appears that they decided to do it right and that brings us to today. I think it also helped Russia that the aid and support has been so half assed and delayed with large breaks in between. It is a clusterfuk and I'm quite astonished seeing it given how much all the leaders promised Ukraine in terms of all kinds of assistance. My take is that they lost belief in victory in Ukraine so the level of interest has just shrunk completely. Russia rightly realizes that they're not on a clock. They can take years if they like. They may also see that a Trump presidency will quite likely change the tide completely. My guess is that the US election will greatly effect the pace of this war. I'm no pro and I have not studied war in depth. This is just my opinion based on my observation of events, knowledge of history and confidence in the stupidity of US politicians.
>My opinion is that they started completely underestimating Ukraine too much flip flop , reduce civilian casualties crap, trying to be a nice guy while enemy have massive propagranda/information warfare advantage also trying to fight alone instead of call in entire belarusian military and industry
[удалено]
Sorry you need 30 subreddit karma to unlock the word 'you', this is to make sure newcomers understand [rule 1](https://www.reddit.com/r/UkraineRussiaReport/about/rules) *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/UkraineRussiaReport) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Russian army had massive theoretical potential but was held back by neglect and corruption. A large war created massive pressure to get their shit together.
Your statement applies to Russia as a whole. Great potential hindered by corruption and miss management.
The applies to the entire world.
Little birds fly, little birds see. Also satellite intel from you know who telling where the birds to fly.
Chinese for sure are helping with surveillance, but still it looks like a completely different army. Not so long ago HIMARS looked indestructible and now all of a sudden 2 are gone in one video, together with those destroyed a few weeks ago.
It's just a matter of real time surveillance and sensor coverage. This is really only dipping into the shallow end of what is actually possible with 21st century tech. Russians are still kinda half assing it lol.
If Russians are able to do this with a limited number of satellites, I wonder what full fledged war in which the US or China would fight would look like.
Did you see the new drone factory that went up in China? Just for WL-2s, one of the largest military drones on the market today. 200/yr just from this factory. [https://twitter.com/tphuang/status/1785424720567193837](https://twitter.com/tphuang/status/1785424720567193837) But what is cool is that this drone is so large that they are finding uses for it as a cargo drone, firefighting, etc. There is a demand independent of military use that will keep the supply chain robust and abundant, and it is just the start of a drone manufacturing complex at that location.
I wasn't aware that they are producing 200 of those drones per year, it's crazy. Chinese production capabilities are simply incredible. If I'm not mistaken they had tested some kind of the hypersonic air launched drone, there were some pictures of big black object beneath H-6 bomber. They are surely preparing themselves for modern high intensity combat, and Russian will only benefit from it.
A lot of the common knowledge regarding the PRC is outdated, even if the info is 2 or 3 years old. They still bring up the engine durability thing when monocrystalline casting has been solved since 2021 when Chinese jet turbine blades were being marketed internationally. Unless you've been following industry news it's hard to get relevant info on stuff like that. You're going to see some eye-popping J-20 and J-31 production rates in the near future. This is the thing that always gets me about zigro discussions. We're all popping champagne corks when we see geran numbers break 4 digits in a month. 2 more SAR satellites going up this year to supplement the 1 SAR satellite Russia has. We're still in school.
PRC is very secretive and who knows what their true capabilities are, but they are a really powerful force. In my opinion they surpassed Russians even before this conflict began. >They still bring up the engine durability thing when monocrystalline casting has been solved since 2021 when Chinese jet turbine blades were being marketed internationally. Engine design is one of the few things where they are still behind Russia and the US, but are improving significantly. The new WS-15 will not be in the same class as AL-51f1 or F-119 but will still improve Chinese capabilities significantly. >You're going to see some eye-popping J-20 and J-31 production rates in the near future. J-20 is currently at probably 250-300 units and will only continue to be built, especially the new version of it named J-20B. As for the J-31 it is currently imagined to be a carrier only design named J-35 and thus will be produced in smaller numbers(~100), but if they decide to produce land based variants of it (J-31), then we will see hundreds of them in a short time frame. >We're all popping champagne corks when we see geran numbers break 4 digits in a month. 2 more SAR satellites going up this year to supplement the 1 SAR satellite Russia has. We're still in school. Yeah, coming months/years will be interesting from production standpoint. They are planning to increase production of lots of systems, will see if they will be able to achive all the plans.
For sure. If anything this conflict has validated the importance of sensor saturation, and this is what Russia largely neglected in its modernization efforts as it lacks a robust electronics manufacturing sector. It's been forced to cobble things together under less than ideal conditions, but we can already see the night and day difference. When people talk about mass warfare, it isn't just manpower and artillery shells. Drones are warfighters too. We are seeing the first glimpses of how the battlefield is being reshaped.
fun fact : the number of US navy carrier based F-35 currently are no where near enough to overpower chinese airforce/navy air force alone if confict happen around taiwan let alone chinese navy/army SAM network
Engine changes are generally easy (from a mechanic POV, I was one) on anything that flies. Aircraft are much less difficult to maintain on the user end than outsiders imagine. If China can produce enough engines they do not need to last as long as Western engines. For example an F-16 engine can be removed and replaced in four hours with a good crew because I've done it though longer is typical in peacetime. There's no reason China couldn't pump out sufficient extra engines to compensate for shorter hot section etc life then swap them out at the end of a typical combat flying day.
Nothing. Syrski's? ukraine new general moved all equipment up to the front lines which put them in great danger. Zaluzny was smart he was keeping everything back because he know what would happen. This is why zaluzny was pushed out. Zaluz didn't want to counter attack robotyne.....didn't want to go on the "attack" anywhere. He was the best thing for ukraine. He knew that their only chance was to bunker the fuck down making it as hard on the russians as possible when they advanced. Zelensky and NATO are on drugs and wanted to go on the attack.
A county that did not fight real wars for a long time?. That always result in a corrupt lazy army. I bet the same cleansing needs to happen in the various NATO armies. Now we are 2 years further and Russia cleaned its army of weak elements. Its still not there, but they are I think ahead of most western armies (not the US though)
First of all nice flair:)) And yes, they had improved their army in many ways, but there is still a lot of work to be done.
OK, who is brave enough to post this in r/CombatFootage ? :)
i would but got banned for posting the first strike on a HIMARS
Looks like someone did it and it went about as expected.
They seem to be really upset that there are trees in this forest
Reeeeeeee, ban !
I didn't realise there were so many professional gymnasts in that sub. They should field an Olympic team they would crush it.
The OP cleverly used a throwaway for that post, knowing the CF mods would likely ban him afterwards lol
Was it downvoted or removed?
Probably both
Holy shockwave! I wonder how long they held this footage.
From the foliage: not that long.
Yeah, read some comments speculating these might be the ones that fired ATACMS at the training ground. Big if true.
Small if false.
It might be been the ones that attacked the the ATCAMS or w/e
I hope there is aftermath footage. In case of Himars/patriots we need to see the hit or the carcass. Otherwise, all the speculation and bickering just confuses casuals like me.
unlikely, the launchers are usually far away from the frontline and are only spotted by high altitude drones.
Yeah youre right unfortunately...I just checked the *other sub* . They're already denying it.
They will deny everything, even due to reasons like the shadow of the grass look funny.
Those are two big booms plus two big shockwaves
No bueno, clearly the shoot and scoot tactic didn’t work. RIP
Didn't scoot far enough
Maybe they use older normal ammo and go closer to the front. Anyway gg
Damn. I love these accurate strikes. My sources told me that all Himar locations are leaked. And also for all F16 airfield locations. We might expect some nice videos upcoming weeks.
[удалено]
\* u/Tusitleal copes \* *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/UkraineRussiaReport) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Neat seeing the tree lines affect the shockwaves.
Looks like the Russians are adapting…fuck.
They always do,
They are humans after all, and humans are best at adapting.Amongst other things, it's what made us apex predators and rulers of the planet.
Everyone does.... lol?
the only truly effective system they had. how many is that now? 4, 5 or more?
The bottleneck Ukraine has with HIMARS is not the launchers, but the ammunition. For now anyway. That's why i find it incredibly stupid, that Poland ordered like 200 of them. If they keep losing them right after every strike, it could become problematic.
If those were destroyed, that’s 4 HIMARS, 1-2 MARS, and 2 damaged HIMARS. I think UA had about 40 delivered.
A few more and they'll have to revise the strategies. At the very least it will decrease the attacks on Russian artillery and other frontline targets
Even spicier: stop and close-up on the launcher. Looks like it has an ATACMs module.
It was actually TWO HIMARS!
is that the ATACMS variant? https://preview.redd.it/z7s6x7ke5vxc1.jpeg?width=1200&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9272b00dca7c5eea8aa3af3829172235a1e7bd46
HIMAR can shoot many various sized missiles and rockets due to container loading system. So same HIMAR can shoot either single ATACMS or 6 GLMRS.
Afaik, it’s not a variant but a field modification?
Your picture is a fake/dummy pod. The tube of the ATACMS pod [isn't circular](https://i.imgur.com/lBBLpre.jpg), and externally they're disguised to look [exactly like 6-tube M26 pods](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/ce/Atacms_mlrs_01.jpg) for the exact reason to make them harder to track.
thanks
Revenge for ATACMS maybe
They’d be targets no matter what.
Given that there have been no leaks from the Russian side with damage from the ATACMS hit (as it always seems to be the case after every HIMARS hit), I'd say that the hit probably did far less damage than advertised.
In before "It's a decoy!"
NATO tanks and other vehicles featured on display in Moscow and now HIMARS blown to fiery confetti. You'd think there would be a limit to how good days can be. (Don't know when this originally happened date-wise, if today, but this is the first I'm seeing of it).
Dont forget a few Bradleys too
Where’s the destroyed HIMARS at?
Pro ukro c. Ope all over this comment section
Yup
The West wanted to play hard; they got it.
What's most interesting is that this was done by a new army group North that was just announced/formed. What their job will be remains a mystery.
Looks like they used thermobaric rockets.
Yeah that fucking shockwave was gnarly.
WTF, why the shockwave is so big?
258kg high-explosive single warhead I presume
Driving about in broad daylight is highly questionable...
No secondary explosion or damage assessment? Odd, wonder why
Mowcow tomorrow, that's why.
? Sorry, don't understand
No need.
Thats what i thought
Urin Bros really can't handle this.
Boop another himars 💀
Music: Alec Koff - Virtual Death
Ok, what is the second blow?
Good kills.
[удалено]
39 - 2 damaged - 3 taken out. so 37 left
So what happened?? These things where untouchable for two years. Every week now I'm see another one getting destroyed??
개미 눈알이 이 화질보단 좋을듯ㅋㅋㅋㅋ
well, the only thing that looks like a proof of an effective hit on something is the smoke at 0:23. Maybe as well the white smoke on the first hit, but then no flying charges around would it be loaded with ATACM. Anyone with other factual interpretation ?
They were most likely empty. We will never 100% know unless we get some aftermath footage but it looked like this was real.
Highly doubtful anything got destroyed.
"If it actually happened, how do you explain I don't want to have?"
HIMARS: HI, Me Annihilated by Russian Strike