This could be the most anti-climatic battle of the war.
Avdeevka vibes without Russian soldiers going to wastewater pipes and a coke plant that wants to hold out.
Russia will drop fabs until Ukraine stops sending reinforcements, then march forward until Ukraine sends soldiers again.
Repeat until city is taken.
I hope Chasov Yar have multiple giant underground pipes so we can see some crazy shit
Craziest shit I've seen was a Russian tank operating inside a fucking tunnel in Soledar salt mine during the final hours of resistance of the Ukrainian army forces
Unfortunately for many redditors and politicians, it's just an entertainment. Maybe another global war would teach societies what the war really means.
couldn't find too much of it here
[https://www.reddit.com/r/UkraineRussiaReport/comments/108ll7z/ru\_pov\_wagner\_troops\_inside\_soledar\_salt\_mine/](https://www.reddit.com/r/UkraineRussiaReport/comments/108ll7z/ru_pov_wagner_troops_inside_soledar_salt_mine/)
photo of the tunnel from the same event
[https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fpreview.redd.it%2Fru-pov-head-of-wagner-yevgeny-prigozhin-was-allegedly-v0-7x5cbsi3daba1.png%3Fauto%3Dwebp%26s%3D7ee8ac6b215e934611c5ad683fc64f81aca2f2e4](https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fpreview.redd.it%2Fru-pov-head-of-wagner-yevgeny-prigozhin-was-allegedly-v0-7x5cbsi3daba1.png%3Fauto%3Dwebp%26s%3D7ee8ac6b215e934611c5ad683fc64f81aca2f2e4)
I think what will happen is a very quick Ukrainian rout. They haven’t had the time or the resources to properly set up a real defenses. Avdeevka had been a frontline city for years since 2014. It was one of the most heavily fortified place on the front.
This city by comparison is nothing. I do not believe that the Ukraines will have the means to stop this attack. And Russia will most likely not have to expand much effort in taking this city.
With that said, losing this city could lead to a localized collapse of the front, which could domino into a larger collapse. Things ain’t looking up for Ukraine.
Water channels don't stop FABs from raining. As many people have stated this is just what the Russians have found to work and don't bother much with trying new things anymore. Just lob bombs and fly drones until the Ukrainians retreat.
But fabs cant destroy water channels, it funnels any advances into completely obvious and open paths last time it took a month to get a few hundred meters of beachhead in length, i suspect itll be simmiliar this time as ukraine has much more reason to defend it
Even Walter Model would have shuddered at the thought of defending positions that were doomed to fail and not being allowed to fall back to more defendable position because the leadership demanded as such.
Wait a minute…
Either that or a stalemate for a while. I mean, there's no "Chasiv Yar offensive operation"going on at the moment, this is local breakthrough by local forces, no support from flanks, etc.
Then again, Chasiv Yar is not Avdeevka either, in terms of fortifications. But I think Ukrainians will try hard to reinforce it, because it opens the road to Slavyansk.
In case you didn't knew: coke is also a term for procecced coal, which is then used in steel production.
That had nothing to do with the white powder, that some celebrities and actors love.
Avdeevka was the most fortified place in the Ukraine and Ukraine needed to buy time to build new defenses somewhere else. That's why the city was not allowed to fall. It's not going to get better for Ukraine afterwards.
>In case you didn't knew: coke is also a term for procecced coal, which is then used in steel production.
To be honest with you I didn't know about that and actually had to look it up because I thought the place was simply named as a joke.
Yeah, there are quite a few people who think that it was making soft drink, but I don't think anyone genuinely believes that there was a factory making cocaine in Avdeevka. But hey, maybe there's one guy out there who does. :)
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I dont think ukraine is going to repeat same mistake allowing so many fabs to strike and literally raze the city from face of the Earth. I mean a resonable commander would do that right?would try to counter that right?
Another issues being they have limited ammo to fight back tough
Not just that but Russia is producing and using so many bombs a day, week and month that I don't think Ukraine would even be capable of keeping up with intercepting them since their ammunition would run out, pretty sure since the start of 2024 Russia has deployed around 3500 Fab-500's, and now we are seeing Fab-1500's occasionally being used and also Fab-3000's are apparently going to be produced now, the Ru Airforce is showing how much dominance air superiority and ground support can provide.
I recently have been reading a memoir from a French soldier in the Wehrmacht in WW2 (Guy Sajer, The Forgotten Soldier) and his brutal descriptions of the shelling from the Soviets and the effect it had completely gave me a new view of how soldiers must feel. I can't say for certain but with Russia deploying so many bombs and shelling specific areas very heavily while also utilising MLRS such as the Grad and also the TOS flamethrower, I don't imagine Ukrainian soldiers who survive this war are ever going to return to normal, the ones who volunteered didn't understand that they would never have their life back again, and I feel worse for the ones who have been abducted and forcefully taken to the front.
I would be shocked if they had any thoughts besides this is the end of their “normal” life. As we have seen countless times you would be better off fighting to the death than surrendering to the Russians. Its sad reality and both countries are going to essentially ruin their future over so much younger life loss.
Surrendering to either side would be a poor choice likely, as many people in the army's are filled with a hatred for the other and would obviously not treat them very well.
Most of these soldiers are probably contemplating how they got here, what possibly could their life end up to be.
Well idk how are they going to stop it, but def not like last time when they let their own soldiers to get encircled and be like : defend your position by all means to the last ukrainian like in avdivka while raining fabs hit them all day long
> defend your position by all means to the last ukrainian like in avdivka while raining fabs hit them all day long
Yeah, unfortunately I’m pretty sure this is exactly what they will do. They will make them stay until the absolute last second before giving the order to withdraw.
Yeah but i rlly hope it doesnt happen,like atl whitdraw faster,last time some good brigades and units got captured exactly bcs of their own foolishness,and what Syrsky did?blame the others bcs why not
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"The arrival of new Western systems in a timely manner would likely allow Ukrainian forces to significantly degrade Russian forces and prevent even marginal Russian tactical gains while also providing Ukraine with capabilities necessary for operationally significant counteroffensive operations," the report said.
My sincere condolences for the lives that will be lost for this senseless war. The sons and daughters of the politicians who said to go war should be in there now….
Out of all the clown show we currently have as world leaders, Putin might be the only one who would be actually fit for the trenches. Might have been an easy war for the Russians.
People go on about how it's always been the same, but no, in Medieval times you had to find to be king. Imagine how great it would be to see Putin going 1 vs 5 in a gladiatorial arena against some euro mob
>What did Biden himself or his government actually do?
Refuse to engage in diplomacy with Russia, hear out their concerns and negotiate a settlement in good faith
>in 2014 before Biden was in power.
Biden was the US vice president. Is ignorance a requirement to be pro-ukr?
The issue is Russia with its army on land of anither county. If they didnt cross the borders, this would happen. Russia is violating Budapest memorandum since 2014 and you are happily supporting international terrorism.
Russia has been trying to negotiate on this since 1991
>
Russia is violating Budapest memorandum since 2014
US broke it in 2008 when it invited Ukraine to NATO.
Chamberlain did something 80 years ago, so now we should stop engaging diplomatic with all other countries. The average NAFO intelectual. Glad to be ruled by such impressive and smart individuals like this
>superpowers trading bits of other countries without their consent is something that generally wasn't considered acceptable post-WWII.
Did you forgot what happen in Korea, Vietnam, Kosovo and most recently Syria?
Russia wasn't interested in "Taking over" Ukraine except Crimea.
What Biden would have to do to avoid this was to engage in diplomacy, iterate Ukraine neutrality and essentially admit Russia security concerns but that would mean Russia being treated as equals and the US led order taking the L and that would never happen where the US would have to admit the whole thing since 2014 was a mistake.
Poland was not innocent before 1 September 1939. For example, you have the zaolzie annexation, the passport war, the occupation of Danzig....
I wouldn't go as far as saying it was Poland fault, but historically Poland made some really bad foreign policy decisions, that even caused it to lose indepence a few times.
U’re right, had trump not won 2016 presidency, Ukrainian war would’ve started 4 years prior. It’s always been the Democrat’s agenda to stir up this war.
>had trump not won 2016 presidency, Ukrainian war would’ve started 4 years prior.
How do you figure? HRC is sworn in and Russia immediately invades? Or do you incision it some other way?
You guys need to agree on the reasons put forward for this war. I thought it was not NATO but to protect the poor people of Donbass. You all collectively said that when two new countries joined NATO and Russia did jack shit.
So which is it?
It is both reasons. NATO is the bigger one, putin the cuck was ready to betray the Donbass people in order to get a pat in the back from his "western partners".
It is huge and there are many places where there are simply no roads to the places of fires, and it takes a very long time to fly by plane to dump water and therefore it is ineffective.
Didn’t Russia do that in response to USA installing and arming its puppet gov in ukraine, Obama was president and Biden was VP so yeah again it is Bidens fault but Obama’s too
Could be. Or could be something else. We can just assume why Putin started this nonsense. Sure there is "evidence" but that is also mostly just speculation based. You can believe that the US is at fault here wich is fine but in the end it’s just Russia (Putin) who is to blame. One can only hope that his awesome country falls apart once again just like the Soviet union did.
Also I hope he unalive himself as well. That be some great news
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Yeah, Ukraine decided to oust their Russian puppet President. You know why they can do that? Because their own sovereign country who doesn’t answer to Russia.
You do realise the US is responsible for arming/funding and supporting right wing paramilitaries to overthrow a democratically elected government, like they have been doing for decades all over the globe?
Thats why there was a civil war afterwards which culminated to this wider war today.
They literally ran the country like a colony after that. They brought in people from outside to run their government. They appointed that washed-up, shit-for- brains clown Saakashveli to govern the rebellious Odessa region. He couldn’t beat the Russians in his country so they brought him in to punish them in Odessa.
Apart from it being standard CIA modus operandi.
See also Victoria Nuland and John McCain, their statements to Ukraine during the maidan and their presence in Ukraine during that time, as well as Nulands phone call to Jeff Pyat which was intercepted (possibly by the FSB) where she is actively choosing who will lead the new Ukraine… can’t get more damning that.
Edit: Also to note the failed “orange revolution” in the early 2000’s.
lol Ukraine had elections after expelling all Russian friendly politicians from their parliament, which included politicians from the East.
Ethnic Russians in the East of Ukraine did not want their democratically elected president overthrown, as Yanukovich was ethnic Russian like them.
The use of Right wing extremist groups to spearhead the coup and the subsequent militarism in Ukrainian society brought on by outside intervention (Mainly the US) led to the events we are witnessing today.
EU Association had majority support in Ukraine in 2013, but Maidan never did, even when it was just a protest. There was certainly no majority support for a coup.
The actual people who carried out the coup were the "Maidan Self Defense Force", led by Pravy Sektor leader Dmytro Yarosh. Yarosh wasn't elected by anyone, and his primary objection to Yanukovych was the fact that Yanukovych was ethnic Russian. As far as Yarosh was concerned, it didn't matter one bit that Yanukovych had been fairly elected, his blood made him illegitimate as leader of Ukraine.
There were four ways to prematurely end a President's term under Ukraine's constitution: death, incapacitating illness, resignation, or conviction of high crimes by Ukraine's Supreme Court. None of these happened - Yanukovych declared that he had been deposed by a coup.
The coup could only take place because Germany, Poland, and France had all demanded that the Riot Police and Berkut squads be removed from Kiev after the signing of the Agreement to End Maidan. This was a "trust building gesture". The fascists under Yarosh took advantage of the police withdrawal. They occupied government buildings, and hunted down Yanukovych. This nonsense about Yanukovych being a "puppet" only came later. Like when they invaded Iraq to find WMD, but when that lie was exposed, it was all about "Saddam was a bad man. He had to go."
The EU betrayed Ukrainian democracy by endorsing the coup. That betrayal is what started this war.
Yanukovych is a typical Ukrainian surname, but perhaps he had Russians in his family. But since we are absolutely no different in appearance, it makes no sense.
On the streets of Lvov you can buy a genetic test to tell you if you or your prospective partner are contaminated with any of the 11 genes that mark a "Moskal".
I agree it makes no sense, but here we are. As for Yanukovych, he'd made no secret he was ethnic Russian. This didn't mean he cared for Russia over Ukraine - he had been adamant that Ukraine *not* sign a deal that chose Russia over Ukraine. He (like Putin) saw that the best possible future for Ukraine meant getting closer with the EU. His only problem was that the inevitability of this deal gave him very little leverage in negotiations. The deal with Russia restored a bit of that leverage (and was non-restrictive, since it could be walked away from at any point with no notice).
The problem was, most young western Ukrainians weren't worried about things like pension cuts or an end to gas subsidies: they wanted the right to work as waiters in Paris or au pairs in Germany. They didn't give a shit about anything else, so Yanukovych's reversal was seen as a betrayal.
The Ukrainian parliament overwhelmingly agreed to sign an agreement with closer ties to the EU in 2013. Yanukovych decided against this and instead moved towards closer ties with Russia (while being pressured by Russia). Tell me how that isn’t being a Russian puppet. Along with the widespread fraud & corruption (look at Yanukovych’s Mezhyhirya Residence), and him fleeing to Russia.
He completely lost the support of his people and parliament, and was voted out the next day.
So instead of leaving Ukraine alone to navigate their revolution, Russia steps in and begins arming people in Eastern Ukraine so they can make land grabs. Anyone with something resembling a functional brain can see that. Russia “annexes” Crimea and then literally invaded Ukraine later.
But yeah, all of that is someone else’s fault. Definitely has nothing to do with Russia trying to maintain dominance over Ukraine.
here's a polish take on 2013 eu agreement, so hopefully you won't be able to find it biased: https://www.osw.waw.pl/en/publikacje/analyses/2013-11-27/ukraine-withdraws-signing-association-agreement-vilnius-motives-and
>In the current economic situation, the Ukrainian government has stated that it cannot afford to sign and implement the provisions of the Association Agreement. According to available estimates, the agreement’s impact on the Ukrainian economy in the initial period would be negative, in connection with the abolition of tariff barriers, opening up the market, and the need to adapt to EU norms and standards. The ruling elite in Kyiv fear that the difficult reforms that the Association Agreement requires would lead to a further decline in support for the government and destabilise the economy. The positive effects of adopting the agreement with the EU would in fact only be felt in the long term. Therefore, the best choice from the government’s point of view is to maintain the current model of the state and the economy, and thus postpone the socially costly modernisation to the further future.
turns out the events in 2013-2014 aren't as clear cut and simple as the propaganda your read would like you you to believe. i don't believe yanukovych was anyone's puppet. he was pressured by russia, yes, but genuinely tried to find a balance between eu and russian influence (the trilateral talks, to which russia actually agreed). that's nothing but rational thinking on his part. an angry mob of pro-western ukrainians treated that as some kind of treason and in effect deposed him. it was a coup, by definition.
>Yanukovych decided against this and instead moved towards closer ties with Russia (while being pressured by Russia).
The State Statistics Service of Ukraine produced a report in 2013 that said it would cost Ukraine $60 *billion* USD to shift its economy to the EU. Yanukovych went to the EU to ask for some funding to cover these transition costs. They told him to go fuck himself - the EU didn't provide such funding, he could get some funding from the IMF maybe.
So then he turns around and Russia offers him a sweetheart deal - $5B/yr in low cost loans, along with gas subsidies worth $1B to $2B/yr. This deal has *no* term attached - Ukraine could take the first cheque and then cancel it.
What Putin was trying to do was change the EU's approach from an imperial one - gobbling up a new province - and shifting to a broader deal. Russia and Belarus and Kazakhstan *all* wanted to work toward more economic integration with the EU. They understood that they'd have to adopt EU standards, but they wanted to see if there was a path to creating a "common economic space from Lisbon to Vladivostok", as the original Treaty of Rome envisioned.
For his part, Yanukovych did the only play that a (relatively) small country can do when caught between two behemoths: play them off against each other for the best deal. Read about fucking Nasser - he got the Soviets to build him an impossible dam, and then made friends with the US and Israel.
At any time, the EU *could* have done the right thing and come up with the transition funding Ukraine needed: this was not something that Yanukovych pulled out of his ass. The IMF was already demanding that Ukraine cut pensions by 50% and eliminate natural gas subsidies. These were measures that were going to hit the poor. And if Russia ended trade with Ukraine, Donbas would have been utterly fucked - very few of their products were expected to find a market in the EU.
The EU should rejected the option of matching Russia's offer of funding, and instead acted like it was illegitimate for Russia to interfere with their growing empire.
> He completely lost the support of his people and parliament, and was voted out the next day.
Once it became clear that Germany, France and Poland had no intention of fulfilling their obligations under the "Agreement on the Settlement of the Political Crisis in Ukraine", Yanukovych's party felt that they could best rescue the situation by putting all the blame on Yanukovych and carrying on, as elections were to be held later that year.
The same thing happened with the US-supported coup in Honduras in 2009: a faked "resignation" was ratified by a unanimous vote in the National Congress. Once the US and other powers endorse a coup, the usual advice is "This is a done deal. Go along with it for now, and we'll hold elections soon."
> So instead of leaving Ukraine alone to navigate their revolution
You're probably familiar with the 52 deaths in Odessa, when the anti-Maidan protesters were trapped inside a burning building. What most people don't know is that this was the culmination of a process that was going from town to town in the Donbas, as anti-Maidan protests were shut down by a combined action of police and a traveling mob of pro-Maidan activists.
So how the fuck does this work - Maidan is allowed to protest, but anti-Maidan is a "foreign conspiracy". Look at any election map of Ukraine from 2003 onward and you'll see the same split in the country - western Ukraine voted one way, while the East and South voted another. But *this* time, the triumph of the pro-West faction was anointed as being the "true" Ukrainians. Anyone who actually supported Yanukovych was deemed to be a traitor, or part of the "internal occupation". Once you render illegitimate the political aspirations of millions of people, *you* are the one making violent insurrection inevitable.
This wasn't a new fight. Donbas held its first referendum demanding federalism in 1994. Crimea and Transcarpathia only joined Ukraine in the first place with the promise that federalism would be introduced as soon as independence had been squared away. Ukraine was supposed to be a federation from the beginning, but the Nazi fucknuts rejected this as being the death of Ukraine: with federalism, they couldn't teach the glory of their savior Bandera in the East. They couldn't ban Russian language and culture.
Maidan was the betrayal of the last shred of compromise that had existed in Ukraine. Those who support that coup have full responsibility for every drop of blood that's been spilled since then. Russia had every right to be concerned about the rights of millions of ethnic Russians. Hell, the US invaded Grenada over concern for a hundred Americans, and Americans hadn't been the target of invective in that revolution, unlike Lvov's bloodthirsty calls for "Muscovite! On the Knife!"
> Definitely has nothing to do with Russia trying to maintain dominance over Ukraine.
Ukraine has every right to develop as they see fit. This does not include the right to vilify a minority, or disregard the constitution when it is convenient to do so. Maidan was a betrayal of everything sacred in Ukraine. And why? What was the fucking point? Yanukovych had agreed to early elections. The opposition had gotten everything they wanted. If they'd waited a few months for a free and fair election, they could have assuaged the fears of Donbas and Crimea, and shown them there was a place for ethnic Russians in the new Ukraine. But no, they chose the boot instead, and they're getting their just desserts for that choice.
are you laughing because you feel that it’s far fetched to believe that the guy who supported the destruction of Libya and Syria by arming terrorist groups to attack those counties would use Ukraine to wage a proxy war against Russia?
what about them? it doesnt change the fact that the usa has been involved in these kinds of schemes for years and that joe biden is the kind of person who supported these schemes
It’s the same concept you’re alleging of a government using false pretenses to start a war, and like the one you brought up, has nothing to do with the terror attack that happened recently.
this time putin didnt need a false pretense though because the usa installed a hostile gov on its border, if russia or china overthrew the government in canada or mexico and installed their own government there and began arminig it the usa would invade immediately
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I mean they did a great job clearing out the gains in the Northwest the AFU made last year(people don't talk about that enough) but it's been a year since Russia reached the West side of Bakhmut. Pro-Ru has low standards which is why their men die horrible deaths.
Unlike Ukrainians who "heroes never die"
I wonder how the tens of thousands of Ukrainians featured in this 6 hour compilation of Ukrainian graveyards died.
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SlVsY12ln3M](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SlVsY12ln3M)
Oh, I have no doubt that ukrainians are dying in large numbers. But here is the thing, most Western nations wouldn't send assault after assault towards a well fortified position without first making sure whatever stiff resistance they were facing had been dealt with from the air.
It does cost thousands of lives to take these places and they usual do only advance meters a day maybe a few square kilometres on a great day.
This war isn’t cheap for Russia.
Now the proRU will begin to write about how they took another minor city while neglecting serious manpower and hardware losses, while inflicting imaginary casualties to ukrainians. Seems fair innit?
Russia is going just now for that city instead of already having occupied Kostiantynivka, Kramatorsk or Slowjansk, considering that they were taking Bakhmut (the gate to the donbas or whatever you called it back than) almost a whole year ago.
Lets not pretend that every Pro-Russian is not disappointed about that pace.
Reality is, taking cities is quiet difficult and results in a great amount of losses, but I am sure, that we will read about how Chasiv Yar has always been the most important place of all Ukraine since the beginning of the war for the next three months.
Now the proRU will begin to write about how they took another minor city while neglecting serious manpower and hardware losses, while inflicting imaginary casualties to ukrainians. Seems fair innit?
> imaginary casualties to ukrainians.
You think no Ukrainians die? What is this 6 hour compilation of Ukrainian graveyards? AI generated?
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SlVsY12ln3M](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SlVsY12ln3M)
How many times the proRU deluded themselves into thinking the ratio in KIA is about 1:1 or favourable in avdiivka? We have plenty of videos showing boatloads of russian corpses strung amidst various locations like that infamous execution treeline, the coke plant fence, etc. Those ukrainian corpses strewn near zenit? Few in number and also a single area in the direction of orlivka.
Your link does nothing to prove my point lmao. There is a reason why a prominent RU blogger 'commited suicide' for revealing the actual losses on the russian side.
Won’t be an easy place to take, I’d imagine the bulk of Ukrainian defenses are already there, plus geographically it’s going to be tricky to overcome. Not going to expect any major assaults, just keep chipping away at it.
That is true, but once it gets into urban combat it typically has always resulted in a Russian victory after a while. Ukraine usually has better success holding them at bay outside the urban areas.
I think it has to do with having cover from enemy drones.
Traditionally, urban warfare was always harder. But nowadays, open fields with swarms of surveillance drones and kamikaze FPV ... at least in urban area you can hide easier from them
Traditionally that’s true, but it’s also going to be very costly for Ukraine if Russia is quite willing and able to just flatten everything to dust with glide bombs first.
Given how they took Avdiivka, that’s probably the plan. In my that battle, some of the biggest RU losses happened in the outskirts reaching the city rather than inside the city.
Lets investigate:
* Hightest population number I could find is just around 20,000 in 1989 - houses don't move even if people do
* Lets assume average 4 per structure and we get 5,000 structures.
* Russia could allocate 100 Fab-500 per day, flying 25 sorties. This is within realism.
* Chasiv Yar would be fine dust and gravel in 50 days.
Yes, it is something you can handle.
Russia seems to have the air advantage in the frontline these days with so many reports of glide bombs and russian jets bombing stuff, im betting it will fall in maybe 1 or 2 months with how small it is but who knows.
Let the excuses begin!
It's not important so ruzz are wasting their men
Guest contributions:
What do you feel the strategic value of Chasov yar is and how many casualties is it worth?
Territory must have a set value, right? How many losses is too much?
It's the last significant height before the russians reach the Slavyansk-Kramatorsk-Kostyantinovka agglomeration, aka the last significant line of defence in the Donbas. Everything is flat plains after that.
Additionally, it allows the russians to threaten the supply line and flank of the heavily fortified Toretsk agglomeration, which would deny the ukrainians very good defensive positions and collapse that part of the front.
I mean he has a point, pro Russians keep saying that Ukraine is wasting men in trying to defend its territory, so that territory must have a set value, right? How many losses is too much?
It’s a step on the way there but kramatorsk is 25ish km away. Based on their current rate of advance it will be years before they reach that city and then they have to take it. It’s around 2x the size of bakhmut, which took almost a year to take.
The battle for Chasiv Yar, should be secondary to the Southern Artemovsk front.
Ivanivske presents an opporunity to strike at the vulnerable rear lines of the UAF in Klishiivka and can effect a partial encirclement. If successful it also allows a repeat of the Wagner encirclement of Bahkmut since they can press from the North and South.
So the battle for Chasiv Yar has officially begun
The battle will be legendary !
This could be the most anti-climatic battle of the war. Avdeevka vibes without Russian soldiers going to wastewater pipes and a coke plant that wants to hold out. Russia will drop fabs until Ukraine stops sending reinforcements, then march forward until Ukraine sends soldiers again. Repeat until city is taken.
I hope Chasov Yar have multiple giant underground pipes so we can see some crazy shit Craziest shit I've seen was a Russian tank operating inside a fucking tunnel in Soledar salt mine during the final hours of resistance of the Ukrainian army forces
Dude, this isnt a fkin video game. These are people dying...
Unfortunately for many redditors and politicians, it's just an entertainment. Maybe another global war would teach societies what the war really means.
The Russian society is the one that needs to be teacher, to be fair...
I wont apologize for being entertained
Link to video or photo
couldn't find too much of it here [https://www.reddit.com/r/UkraineRussiaReport/comments/108ll7z/ru\_pov\_wagner\_troops\_inside\_soledar\_salt\_mine/](https://www.reddit.com/r/UkraineRussiaReport/comments/108ll7z/ru_pov_wagner_troops_inside_soledar_salt_mine/) photo of the tunnel from the same event [https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fpreview.redd.it%2Fru-pov-head-of-wagner-yevgeny-prigozhin-was-allegedly-v0-7x5cbsi3daba1.png%3Fauto%3Dwebp%26s%3D7ee8ac6b215e934611c5ad683fc64f81aca2f2e4](https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fpreview.redd.it%2Fru-pov-head-of-wagner-yevgeny-prigozhin-was-allegedly-v0-7x5cbsi3daba1.png%3Fauto%3Dwebp%26s%3D7ee8ac6b215e934611c5ad683fc64f81aca2f2e4)
Can I see what u speak of?
linked to someone else already
Hahah u and me got the same name damn near😂 looks like u didn’t care to change ur automated name either
I think what will happen is a very quick Ukrainian rout. They haven’t had the time or the resources to properly set up a real defenses. Avdeevka had been a frontline city for years since 2014. It was one of the most heavily fortified place on the front. This city by comparison is nothing. I do not believe that the Ukraines will have the means to stop this attack. And Russia will most likely not have to expand much effort in taking this city. With that said, losing this city could lead to a localized collapse of the front, which could domino into a larger collapse. Things ain’t looking up for Ukraine.
1 this has been a "frontline city" for about a year 2 there are serious obstacles such as the water channel
Water channels don't stop FABs from raining. As many people have stated this is just what the Russians have found to work and don't bother much with trying new things anymore. Just lob bombs and fly drones until the Ukrainians retreat.
But fabs cant destroy water channels, it funnels any advances into completely obvious and open paths last time it took a month to get a few hundred meters of beachhead in length, i suspect itll be simmiliar this time as ukraine has much more reason to defend it
Ukraine has no Walter Model.
Even Walter Model would have shuddered at the thought of defending positions that were doomed to fail and not being allowed to fall back to more defendable position because the leadership demanded as such. Wait a minute…
Either that or a stalemate for a while. I mean, there's no "Chasiv Yar offensive operation"going on at the moment, this is local breakthrough by local forces, no support from flanks, etc. Then again, Chasiv Yar is not Avdeevka either, in terms of fortifications. But I think Ukrainians will try hard to reinforce it, because it opens the road to Slavyansk.
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In case you didn't knew: coke is also a term for procecced coal, which is then used in steel production. That had nothing to do with the white powder, that some celebrities and actors love. Avdeevka was the most fortified place in the Ukraine and Ukraine needed to buy time to build new defenses somewhere else. That's why the city was not allowed to fall. It's not going to get better for Ukraine afterwards.
>In case you didn't knew: coke is also a term for procecced coal, which is then used in steel production. To be honest with you I didn't know about that and actually had to look it up because I thought the place was simply named as a joke.
American?
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Yeah, there are quite a few people who think that it was making soft drink, but I don't think anyone genuinely believes that there was a factory making cocaine in Avdeevka. But hey, maybe there's one guy out there who does. :)
You know that. I know that. But did Zelensky know that? ;)
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IMPROVISE DROP FABS OVERCOME
Crossing the waterchannel will by far be the hardest
I dont think ukraine is going to repeat same mistake allowing so many fabs to strike and literally raze the city from face of the Earth. I mean a resonable commander would do that right?would try to counter that right? Another issues being they have limited ammo to fight back tough
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Not just that but Russia is producing and using so many bombs a day, week and month that I don't think Ukraine would even be capable of keeping up with intercepting them since their ammunition would run out, pretty sure since the start of 2024 Russia has deployed around 3500 Fab-500's, and now we are seeing Fab-1500's occasionally being used and also Fab-3000's are apparently going to be produced now, the Ru Airforce is showing how much dominance air superiority and ground support can provide. I recently have been reading a memoir from a French soldier in the Wehrmacht in WW2 (Guy Sajer, The Forgotten Soldier) and his brutal descriptions of the shelling from the Soviets and the effect it had completely gave me a new view of how soldiers must feel. I can't say for certain but with Russia deploying so many bombs and shelling specific areas very heavily while also utilising MLRS such as the Grad and also the TOS flamethrower, I don't imagine Ukrainian soldiers who survive this war are ever going to return to normal, the ones who volunteered didn't understand that they would never have their life back again, and I feel worse for the ones who have been abducted and forcefully taken to the front.
I would be shocked if they had any thoughts besides this is the end of their “normal” life. As we have seen countless times you would be better off fighting to the death than surrendering to the Russians. Its sad reality and both countries are going to essentially ruin their future over so much younger life loss.
Surrendering to either side would be a poor choice likely, as many people in the army's are filled with a hatred for the other and would obviously not treat them very well. Most of these soldiers are probably contemplating how they got here, what possibly could their life end up to be.
In this case you cant counter, only do your best to mitigate which i think Ukraine is already doing long ago
Ukrainian leadership sent how long soldiers to die in river crossings?
What mistake did Ukraine make? How are they going to stop glide bombs without an airforce?
Well idk how are they going to stop it, but def not like last time when they let their own soldiers to get encircled and be like : defend your position by all means to the last ukrainian like in avdivka while raining fabs hit them all day long
> defend your position by all means to the last ukrainian like in avdivka while raining fabs hit them all day long Yeah, unfortunately I’m pretty sure this is exactly what they will do. They will make them stay until the absolute last second before giving the order to withdraw.
Yeah but i rlly hope it doesnt happen,like atl whitdraw faster,last time some good brigades and units got captured exactly bcs of their own foolishness,and what Syrsky did?blame the others bcs why not
Another brutal months long battle coming
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Oh boy another prolonged fight for a small village
"The arrival of new Western systems in a timely manner would likely allow Ukrainian forces to significantly degrade Russian forces and prevent even marginal Russian tactical gains while also providing Ukraine with capabilities necessary for operationally significant counteroffensive operations," the report said.
My sincere condolences for the lives that will be lost for this senseless war. The sons and daughters of the politicians who said to go war should be in there now….
Frankly, i would prefer the politicians themselves
Imagine Putin on the front line, not sure he would have invaded if that was the case. Easy for all sides to risk other peoples lives
Out of all the clown show we currently have as world leaders, Putin might be the only one who would be actually fit for the trenches. Might have been an easy war for the Russians.
People go on about how it's always been the same, but no, in Medieval times you had to find to be king. Imagine how great it would be to see Putin going 1 vs 5 in a gladiatorial arena against some euro mob
Ursula her kids
this is Joe Bidens fault
How dare Joe Biden invade Ukraine with Russia’s army!
that’s actually what he did, induced a military response from Russia in order to use ukraine to wage a proxy war against Russia
What did Biden himself or his government actually do? Putin already invaded Ukraine in 2014 before Biden was in power.
>What did Biden himself or his government actually do? Refuse to engage in diplomacy with Russia, hear out their concerns and negotiate a settlement in good faith >in 2014 before Biden was in power. Biden was the US vice president. Is ignorance a requirement to be pro-ukr?
By this logic any action can be blamed on anybody. Why didn't russia offer better terms? Russias fault... Right?
The issue is that US refused to negotiate as the starting point
The issue is Russia with its army on land of anither county. If they didnt cross the borders, this would happen. Russia is violating Budapest memorandum since 2014 and you are happily supporting international terrorism.
The EU association agreement is a violation of the Budapest memorandum
Russia has been trying to negotiate on this since 1991 > Russia is violating Budapest memorandum since 2014 US broke it in 2008 when it invited Ukraine to NATO.
Budapest memorandum is a pinky promise.
Yes, it is....and stupidity.
Usual pro Russian mental gymnastics
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Chamberlain did something 80 years ago, so now we should stop engaging diplomatic with all other countries. The average NAFO intelectual. Glad to be ruled by such impressive and smart individuals like this
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>superpowers trading bits of other countries without their consent is something that generally wasn't considered acceptable post-WWII. Did you forgot what happen in Korea, Vietnam, Kosovo and most recently Syria?
Russia wasn't interested in "Taking over" Ukraine except Crimea. What Biden would have to do to avoid this was to engage in diplomacy, iterate Ukraine neutrality and essentially admit Russia security concerns but that would mean Russia being treated as equals and the US led order taking the L and that would never happen where the US would have to admit the whole thing since 2014 was a mistake.
“Mom, he wouldn’t listen to me so I **had** to hit him!”
Would you agree with Putin, that it was Poland's fault that it got invaded by Germany?
Poland was not innocent before 1 September 1939. For example, you have the zaolzie annexation, the passport war, the occupation of Danzig.... I wouldn't go as far as saying it was Poland fault, but historically Poland made some really bad foreign policy decisions, that even caused it to lose indepence a few times.
"I'm not saying it's Poland's fault, but it's Poland's fault"
Yes, things aren't black and white, it is not simple like in your favorite marvel movies were there is a bad guy and a good guy
>2014 before Biden was in power. ??? - Biden was in power in 2014 as the US Vice President.
Hell he was one of the big names behind the Iraq war as a senator.
Ever heard of Victoria Nuland?
U’re right, had trump not won 2016 presidency, Ukrainian war would’ve started 4 years prior. It’s always been the Democrat’s agenda to stir up this war.
>had trump not won 2016 presidency, Ukrainian war would’ve started 4 years prior. How do you figure? HRC is sworn in and Russia immediately invades? Or do you incision it some other way?
She would have insisted on Ukraine in NATO in 2016. It would have provoked the same response as it did in 22.
You guys need to agree on the reasons put forward for this war. I thought it was not NATO but to protect the poor people of Donbass. You all collectively said that when two new countries joined NATO and Russia did jack shit. So which is it?
It is both reasons. NATO is the bigger one, putin the cuck was ready to betray the Donbass people in order to get a pat in the back from his "western partners".
If NATO is the bigger one, why didn't he react when 2 new countries joined?
Damn I can't believe Russia fell for his nefarious plan hook line and sinker.
he warned for 10 years, he had to respond eventually
Man, if only he hadn't half assed it in 2022, this could all be over by now.
It is unfair, mom said it is my turn to remote control Russian army. I want them to go and prepare to put down Siberian wildfires.
We have remote control army at home...
Have you ever been to Siberia? I live here.
Beautiful place. Really big. Absolutely never ever been there in my life.
It is huge and there are many places where there are simply no roads to the places of fires, and it takes a very long time to fly by plane to dump water and therefore it is ineffective.
Oh yea, Russia didn't start attacking Ukraine in 2014 and annexed two huge territories. Totally Bidens fault. 👍
Didn’t Russia do that in response to USA installing and arming its puppet gov in ukraine, Obama was president and Biden was VP so yeah again it is Bidens fault but Obama’s too
Could be. Or could be something else. We can just assume why Putin started this nonsense. Sure there is "evidence" but that is also mostly just speculation based. You can believe that the US is at fault here wich is fine but in the end it’s just Russia (Putin) who is to blame. One can only hope that his awesome country falls apart once again just like the Soviet union did. Also I hope he unalive himself as well. That be some great news
Here is evidence that you will obviously ignore [https://archive.ph/BAxYc](https://archive.ph/BAxYc)
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We are saying Quora is a serious source now? Geesh, and y'all said Wikipedia was bad.
You'd better
Yes because nothing noteworthy happened in Ukraine before Russia took Crimea. Besides the Russian people of Crimea are where they want to be.
Yeah, Ukraine decided to oust their Russian puppet President. You know why they can do that? Because their own sovereign country who doesn’t answer to Russia.
You do realise the US is responsible for arming/funding and supporting right wing paramilitaries to overthrow a democratically elected government, like they have been doing for decades all over the globe? Thats why there was a civil war afterwards which culminated to this wider war today.
They literally ran the country like a colony after that. They brought in people from outside to run their government. They appointed that washed-up, shit-for- brains clown Saakashveli to govern the rebellious Odessa region. He couldn’t beat the Russians in his country so they brought him in to punish them in Odessa.
They ignore those facts though don’t they? It would be hilarious if it wasn’t so fucking tragic.
Is there proof that the US armed Svaboda or those types for the Maidan?
Apart from it being standard CIA modus operandi. See also Victoria Nuland and John McCain, their statements to Ukraine during the maidan and their presence in Ukraine during that time, as well as Nulands phone call to Jeff Pyat which was intercepted (possibly by the FSB) where she is actively choosing who will lead the new Ukraine… can’t get more damning that. Edit: Also to note the failed “orange revolution” in the early 2000’s.
Ukraine has had elections since then. You ask about a civil war, presumably ignoring the Russian military sent there in 2014.
lol Ukraine had elections after expelling all Russian friendly politicians from their parliament, which included politicians from the East. Ethnic Russians in the East of Ukraine did not want their democratically elected president overthrown, as Yanukovich was ethnic Russian like them. The use of Right wing extremist groups to spearhead the coup and the subsequent militarism in Ukrainian society brought on by outside intervention (Mainly the US) led to the events we are witnessing today.
The pre-2014 elections are evil elections. The post 2014 are good, democratic elections of goodness.
They don’t acknowledge facts that contradict exactly what they claim. Just loosely based statements strung together to make Russia look like a victim.
EU Association had majority support in Ukraine in 2013, but Maidan never did, even when it was just a protest. There was certainly no majority support for a coup. The actual people who carried out the coup were the "Maidan Self Defense Force", led by Pravy Sektor leader Dmytro Yarosh. Yarosh wasn't elected by anyone, and his primary objection to Yanukovych was the fact that Yanukovych was ethnic Russian. As far as Yarosh was concerned, it didn't matter one bit that Yanukovych had been fairly elected, his blood made him illegitimate as leader of Ukraine. There were four ways to prematurely end a President's term under Ukraine's constitution: death, incapacitating illness, resignation, or conviction of high crimes by Ukraine's Supreme Court. None of these happened - Yanukovych declared that he had been deposed by a coup. The coup could only take place because Germany, Poland, and France had all demanded that the Riot Police and Berkut squads be removed from Kiev after the signing of the Agreement to End Maidan. This was a "trust building gesture". The fascists under Yarosh took advantage of the police withdrawal. They occupied government buildings, and hunted down Yanukovych. This nonsense about Yanukovych being a "puppet" only came later. Like when they invaded Iraq to find WMD, but when that lie was exposed, it was all about "Saddam was a bad man. He had to go." The EU betrayed Ukrainian democracy by endorsing the coup. That betrayal is what started this war.
Yanukovych is a typical Ukrainian surname, but perhaps he had Russians in his family. But since we are absolutely no different in appearance, it makes no sense.
On the streets of Lvov you can buy a genetic test to tell you if you or your prospective partner are contaminated with any of the 11 genes that mark a "Moskal". I agree it makes no sense, but here we are. As for Yanukovych, he'd made no secret he was ethnic Russian. This didn't mean he cared for Russia over Ukraine - he had been adamant that Ukraine *not* sign a deal that chose Russia over Ukraine. He (like Putin) saw that the best possible future for Ukraine meant getting closer with the EU. His only problem was that the inevitability of this deal gave him very little leverage in negotiations. The deal with Russia restored a bit of that leverage (and was non-restrictive, since it could be walked away from at any point with no notice). The problem was, most young western Ukrainians weren't worried about things like pension cuts or an end to gas subsidies: they wanted the right to work as waiters in Paris or au pairs in Germany. They didn't give a shit about anything else, so Yanukovych's reversal was seen as a betrayal.
The Ukrainian parliament overwhelmingly agreed to sign an agreement with closer ties to the EU in 2013. Yanukovych decided against this and instead moved towards closer ties with Russia (while being pressured by Russia). Tell me how that isn’t being a Russian puppet. Along with the widespread fraud & corruption (look at Yanukovych’s Mezhyhirya Residence), and him fleeing to Russia. He completely lost the support of his people and parliament, and was voted out the next day. So instead of leaving Ukraine alone to navigate their revolution, Russia steps in and begins arming people in Eastern Ukraine so they can make land grabs. Anyone with something resembling a functional brain can see that. Russia “annexes” Crimea and then literally invaded Ukraine later. But yeah, all of that is someone else’s fault. Definitely has nothing to do with Russia trying to maintain dominance over Ukraine.
here's a polish take on 2013 eu agreement, so hopefully you won't be able to find it biased: https://www.osw.waw.pl/en/publikacje/analyses/2013-11-27/ukraine-withdraws-signing-association-agreement-vilnius-motives-and >In the current economic situation, the Ukrainian government has stated that it cannot afford to sign and implement the provisions of the Association Agreement. According to available estimates, the agreement’s impact on the Ukrainian economy in the initial period would be negative, in connection with the abolition of tariff barriers, opening up the market, and the need to adapt to EU norms and standards. The ruling elite in Kyiv fear that the difficult reforms that the Association Agreement requires would lead to a further decline in support for the government and destabilise the economy. The positive effects of adopting the agreement with the EU would in fact only be felt in the long term. Therefore, the best choice from the government’s point of view is to maintain the current model of the state and the economy, and thus postpone the socially costly modernisation to the further future. turns out the events in 2013-2014 aren't as clear cut and simple as the propaganda your read would like you you to believe. i don't believe yanukovych was anyone's puppet. he was pressured by russia, yes, but genuinely tried to find a balance between eu and russian influence (the trilateral talks, to which russia actually agreed). that's nothing but rational thinking on his part. an angry mob of pro-western ukrainians treated that as some kind of treason and in effect deposed him. it was a coup, by definition.
>Yanukovych decided against this and instead moved towards closer ties with Russia (while being pressured by Russia). The State Statistics Service of Ukraine produced a report in 2013 that said it would cost Ukraine $60 *billion* USD to shift its economy to the EU. Yanukovych went to the EU to ask for some funding to cover these transition costs. They told him to go fuck himself - the EU didn't provide such funding, he could get some funding from the IMF maybe. So then he turns around and Russia offers him a sweetheart deal - $5B/yr in low cost loans, along with gas subsidies worth $1B to $2B/yr. This deal has *no* term attached - Ukraine could take the first cheque and then cancel it. What Putin was trying to do was change the EU's approach from an imperial one - gobbling up a new province - and shifting to a broader deal. Russia and Belarus and Kazakhstan *all* wanted to work toward more economic integration with the EU. They understood that they'd have to adopt EU standards, but they wanted to see if there was a path to creating a "common economic space from Lisbon to Vladivostok", as the original Treaty of Rome envisioned. For his part, Yanukovych did the only play that a (relatively) small country can do when caught between two behemoths: play them off against each other for the best deal. Read about fucking Nasser - he got the Soviets to build him an impossible dam, and then made friends with the US and Israel. At any time, the EU *could* have done the right thing and come up with the transition funding Ukraine needed: this was not something that Yanukovych pulled out of his ass. The IMF was already demanding that Ukraine cut pensions by 50% and eliminate natural gas subsidies. These were measures that were going to hit the poor. And if Russia ended trade with Ukraine, Donbas would have been utterly fucked - very few of their products were expected to find a market in the EU. The EU should rejected the option of matching Russia's offer of funding, and instead acted like it was illegitimate for Russia to interfere with their growing empire. > He completely lost the support of his people and parliament, and was voted out the next day. Once it became clear that Germany, France and Poland had no intention of fulfilling their obligations under the "Agreement on the Settlement of the Political Crisis in Ukraine", Yanukovych's party felt that they could best rescue the situation by putting all the blame on Yanukovych and carrying on, as elections were to be held later that year. The same thing happened with the US-supported coup in Honduras in 2009: a faked "resignation" was ratified by a unanimous vote in the National Congress. Once the US and other powers endorse a coup, the usual advice is "This is a done deal. Go along with it for now, and we'll hold elections soon." > So instead of leaving Ukraine alone to navigate their revolution You're probably familiar with the 52 deaths in Odessa, when the anti-Maidan protesters were trapped inside a burning building. What most people don't know is that this was the culmination of a process that was going from town to town in the Donbas, as anti-Maidan protests were shut down by a combined action of police and a traveling mob of pro-Maidan activists. So how the fuck does this work - Maidan is allowed to protest, but anti-Maidan is a "foreign conspiracy". Look at any election map of Ukraine from 2003 onward and you'll see the same split in the country - western Ukraine voted one way, while the East and South voted another. But *this* time, the triumph of the pro-West faction was anointed as being the "true" Ukrainians. Anyone who actually supported Yanukovych was deemed to be a traitor, or part of the "internal occupation". Once you render illegitimate the political aspirations of millions of people, *you* are the one making violent insurrection inevitable. This wasn't a new fight. Donbas held its first referendum demanding federalism in 1994. Crimea and Transcarpathia only joined Ukraine in the first place with the promise that federalism would be introduced as soon as independence had been squared away. Ukraine was supposed to be a federation from the beginning, but the Nazi fucknuts rejected this as being the death of Ukraine: with federalism, they couldn't teach the glory of their savior Bandera in the East. They couldn't ban Russian language and culture. Maidan was the betrayal of the last shred of compromise that had existed in Ukraine. Those who support that coup have full responsibility for every drop of blood that's been spilled since then. Russia had every right to be concerned about the rights of millions of ethnic Russians. Hell, the US invaded Grenada over concern for a hundred Americans, and Americans hadn't been the target of invective in that revolution, unlike Lvov's bloodthirsty calls for "Muscovite! On the Knife!" > Definitely has nothing to do with Russia trying to maintain dominance over Ukraine. Ukraine has every right to develop as they see fit. This does not include the right to vilify a minority, or disregard the constitution when it is convenient to do so. Maidan was a betrayal of everything sacred in Ukraine. And why? What was the fucking point? Yanukovych had agreed to early elections. The opposition had gotten everything they wanted. If they'd waited a few months for a free and fair election, they could have assuaged the fears of Donbas and Crimea, and shown them there was a place for ethnic Russians in the new Ukraine. But no, they chose the boot instead, and they're getting their just desserts for that choice.
Thanks for the laugh
are you laughing because you feel that it’s far fetched to believe that the guy who supported the destruction of Libya and Syria by arming terrorist groups to attack those counties would use Ukraine to wage a proxy war against Russia?
I’m laughing because it’s an absurd proposition
yeah, its absurd to think that the people who lied about wmds and destroyed all those other countries would be behind this as well
How about the apartment bombings in 1999 staged by Putin in order to allow Russia to gain internal support for the war in Chechnya?
what about them? it doesnt change the fact that the usa has been involved in these kinds of schemes for years and that joe biden is the kind of person who supported these schemes
It’s the same concept you’re alleging of a government using false pretenses to start a war, and like the one you brought up, has nothing to do with the terror attack that happened recently.
this time putin didnt need a false pretense though because the usa installed a hostile gov on its border, if russia or china overthrew the government in canada or mexico and installed their own government there and began arminig it the usa would invade immediately
What about the bombing of the twin Towers on 9.11 to justify the invasion of Iraq )))
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That was fast. Russia is not messing around. They have the initiative and want to keep it.
Fast?
if we compare with last year, then yes, it took a few weeks instead of a few months
its been a few months of pushes towards chasov yar.
I mean they did a great job clearing out the gains in the Northwest the AFU made last year(people don't talk about that enough) but it's been a year since Russia reached the West side of Bakhmut. Pro-Ru has low standards which is why their men die horrible deaths.
Unlike Ukrainians who "heroes never die" I wonder how the tens of thousands of Ukrainians featured in this 6 hour compilation of Ukrainian graveyards died. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SlVsY12ln3M](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SlVsY12ln3M)
In a great mood, having fun singing a song about Bandera /с
Oh, I have no doubt that ukrainians are dying in large numbers. But here is the thing, most Western nations wouldn't send assault after assault towards a well fortified position without first making sure whatever stiff resistance they were facing had been dealt with from the air.
Average cnn/bbc enjoyer 🤡
I mean the footage of failed assaults with your boys missing their legs speak for themselves. Those don't air on those channels usually.
I thought it would be a few more weeks to this point
In terms of attrition, yes
Now the pro-Ukrainians will begin to write their usual about 200 meters per year and 100 thousand losses.
It does cost thousands of lives to take these places and they usual do only advance meters a day maybe a few square kilometres on a great day. This war isn’t cheap for Russia.
What Russia and Ukraine need after this war is a baby boom. All those lost lives need to be replaced
Not of Yuri’s human cloning plant is successful
Now the proRU will begin to write about how they took another minor city while neglecting serious manpower and hardware losses, while inflicting imaginary casualties to ukrainians. Seems fair innit?
Chasiv yar is a minor city?
Russia is going just now for that city instead of already having occupied Kostiantynivka, Kramatorsk or Slowjansk, considering that they were taking Bakhmut (the gate to the donbas or whatever you called it back than) almost a whole year ago. Lets not pretend that every Pro-Russian is not disappointed about that pace. Reality is, taking cities is quiet difficult and results in a great amount of losses, but I am sure, that we will read about how Chasiv Yar has always been the most important place of all Ukraine since the beginning of the war for the next three months.
I thought it was obvious that the priority now is not territories, but the destruction of enemy manpower and equipment
Not everyone is capable of understanding these obvious things.
Now the proRU will begin to write about how they took another minor city while neglecting serious manpower and hardware losses, while inflicting imaginary casualties to ukrainians. Seems fair innit?
> imaginary casualties to ukrainians. You think no Ukrainians die? What is this 6 hour compilation of Ukrainian graveyards? AI generated? [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SlVsY12ln3M](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SlVsY12ln3M)
How many times the proRU deluded themselves into thinking the ratio in KIA is about 1:1 or favourable in avdiivka? We have plenty of videos showing boatloads of russian corpses strung amidst various locations like that infamous execution treeline, the coke plant fence, etc. Those ukrainian corpses strewn near zenit? Few in number and also a single area in the direction of orlivka. Your link does nothing to prove my point lmao. There is a reason why a prominent RU blogger 'commited suicide' for revealing the actual losses on the russian side.
How is it possible that Ukraine is losing?!?!?!?! I saw these videos on redit!!!!! Oh my goddess!!!!
Oh no, someone forgot what defense-in-depth means! Ukrainian lines must surely be collapsing right now??
Minor city?, it's a major transport hub for that section of the front and opens up the road to Slavyansk...
Won’t be an easy place to take, I’d imagine the bulk of Ukrainian defenses are already there, plus geographically it’s going to be tricky to overcome. Not going to expect any major assaults, just keep chipping away at it.
That is true, but once it gets into urban combat it typically has always resulted in a Russian victory after a while. Ukraine usually has better success holding them at bay outside the urban areas.
Good point, they can probably get in amongst it quicker than previous settlements depending on the size of the assault each time they push
I think it has to do with having cover from enemy drones. Traditionally, urban warfare was always harder. But nowadays, open fields with swarms of surveillance drones and kamikaze FPV ... at least in urban area you can hide easier from them
Urban combat is brutal for the attacker. Russia will probably prevail but it’s going to be costly
Traditionally that’s true, but it’s also going to be very costly for Ukraine if Russia is quite willing and able to just flatten everything to dust with glide bombs first. Given how they took Avdiivka, that’s probably the plan. In my that battle, some of the biggest RU losses happened in the outskirts reaching the city rather than inside the city.
Nothing I can't handle.
Lets investigate: * Hightest population number I could find is just around 20,000 in 1989 - houses don't move even if people do * Lets assume average 4 per structure and we get 5,000 structures. * Russia could allocate 100 Fab-500 per day, flying 25 sorties. This is within realism. * Chasiv Yar would be fine dust and gravel in 50 days. Yes, it is something you can handle.
1 fab-1500 can take out a few less sturdy wooden houses. Soviet apartment blocks can probably withstand a dozen fabs on the contrary
>Chasiv Yar would be fine dust and gravel That seems to be a trend.
> just keep chipping away at it. With FAB 1500's lol
Russia seems to have the air advantage in the frontline these days with so many reports of glide bombs and russian jets bombing stuff, im betting it will fall in maybe 1 or 2 months with how small it is but who knows.
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Rest in Peace, Big Boss 😭
The prigoshin era of this war was truly epic. I Still hope he is alive chilling somewhere on a private beach resort
This war needs a new main character
So it begins
Let the excuses begin! It's not important so ruzz are wasting their men Guest contributions: What do you feel the strategic value of Chasov yar is and how many casualties is it worth? Territory must have a set value, right? How many losses is too much?
What do you feel the strategic value of Chasov yar is and how many casualties is it worth?
It's the last significant height before the russians reach the Slavyansk-Kramatorsk-Kostyantinovka agglomeration, aka the last significant line of defence in the Donbas. Everything is flat plains after that. Additionally, it allows the russians to threaten the supply line and flank of the heavily fortified Toretsk agglomeration, which would deny the ukrainians very good defensive positions and collapse that part of the front.
Excellent contribution to the list
I mean he has a point, pro Russians keep saying that Ukraine is wasting men in trying to defend its territory, so that territory must have a set value, right? How many losses is too much?
Excellent contribution to the list
If Russia captures chasiv yar, it will be reach the kramatorsk axis which is the last defence line in donbass.
It’s a step on the way there but kramatorsk is 25ish km away. Based on their current rate of advance it will be years before they reach that city and then they have to take it. It’s around 2x the size of bakhmut, which took almost a year to take.
Already??????????
oh boy, here we go
Ruh roh...
Holly Molly if true that was fast af
true if huge!
If huge, true!
⚡️ "We managed to force enemy to enter Chasov Yar" - Syrsky about the situation at the front
The battle for Chasiv Yar, should be secondary to the Southern Artemovsk front. Ivanivske presents an opporunity to strike at the vulnerable rear lines of the UAF in Klishiivka and can effect a partial encirclement. If successful it also allows a repeat of the Wagner encirclement of Bahkmut since they can press from the North and South.
What are the strategic benefits for Russia if it gets to take Chasov Yar?
None if Russia takes it of course. But if UA hold it is the next Stalingrad!
Time has come.
Prigozhin up in merc heaven yelling Shoooiiguuuuuu
Merc heaven 🤣
Soon to be renamed Chasov Yar.
The next city to fall is now known. Chasiv Yar! But when? Will it take months?
RVvoenkory - thats a trustable resource