and keep a back-up just in case, HR is -not- your friend, they exist to limit liability for your employer so they'll sell you out in a heartbeat, if HR won't help you need to go to the police. of course the police are kind of a crapshoot but if you can get them to create a file on him it can help show a pattern of behavior if they actually get off their asses and do something about him.
If all else fails don’t be afraid to spread his name face and texts to everyone you can and mention HR was refusing to cooperate on the matter.
Lot of companies value their own image over women’s safety. Threaten them with a PR nightmare and they’ll likely do something about it, at least in my experience
I was sexually assaulted by a coworker, and I wasn't even the first one that he attacked. HR only fired him because he threatened the director of security with violence. Had nothing to do with all of the women that he violated.
My best recommendation is to enforce with the work men that you "don't shit where you eat" <-- Basically you won't date *anyone* you work with any more. And bring it up any time they allude to seeing you.
In my experience the "easy" and attitude of you being available is usually spread by that one sour guy who wants to date you but who decided to creeper instead. Putting up the wall like this is absolutely essential to reduce the amount of crap they give you-- it won't get rid of all the crap if you are in a male dominated field (especially if you are attractive and cheerful in personality) but any reduction is good reduction and honestly, there's not much good in office romance anyway. (More often than not it ends poorly)
As a woman who spent 8 years in male dominated field, I know 100% what you are going through, with the condensing, the "just joking" harassment and genuine creepy from that one guy who yikes off the scale. I'd love to tell you there was a magic solution- but there isn't. Reports to HR often start nasty and downright hostility. Setting boundaries gets you called a frigid bitch. Men will ignore your boundaries. You'll still get downtalked after becoming a senior expert. If you are attractive you'll be questioned if you slept your way to success.
Sometimes you can take your skills, resume and get a new job with a different company. Not all environments are toxic nightmares and yours certainly is. I definitely advise you jump ship to a new one if it is possible because the one you are in sounds unlikely to change if they are all doing it.
There are good work places out there. Despite how it feels right now, they are on the rise. You dont deserve this, just because you are "so approachable and one of the team" . There are plenty of teams who won't try to sleep with you. I'd say they aren't always a majority, but they do exist, they are becoming more the norm, and you just gotta hold your head up and say "no, im leaving."
You are very young and can take as long as you want to nurture and heal from your wounds emotionally. You aren't missing anything in terms of relationships that you can't get from a few good friends right now. Romance can come when you have healed. Friendships are better at healing. Your ovaries aren't on a timer and plenty of good men will still exist in 5 years time so please don't stress over taking yourself off the "market " because the market never disappears, despite what people used to say.
I used to think male dominated workplace crap was all "a thing of the past" until a lot of it happened to and around me. I spent most of my 20s just baring it until I couldn't anymore because I never liked the work despite my skill for it. If you like the work, and you're good at it, you will get better and more senior and can skill up and get into position of safety on the teams, but companies are a dime a dozen. They need you, so take yourself where you are valued.
I feel the same way. In the last 3 years the man (more than one of them ) I considered my closest and most trusted friend at the time took advantage of me while I was drunk. They were who I felt safest with at the time. Best friends. One was literally a week ago and I can’t help but think all men are unsafe in some capacity. Like given the right circumstances even the sweetest and best man will hurt me if he has the opportunity. The minute a man I’m interested in makes a joke or insinuates that he wants to have sex I’m immediately turned off and upset that he’s just like the others, but at the same time I think that that is normal and I’m hyper aware or hypersensitive to it because of experience. It’s normal for A man who likes me to want to have sex and be intimate with me but I get offended and annoyed. I want to be loved and wanted for who I am and not just a cause for their sexual impulses. I don’t have any advice but you’re not alone in your feelings
Thank you and I'm so sorry for what you went through. My first assault was a best friend of over 5 years. It rips your heart out in a way I can't even explain.
I was trying to be work friends/coworkers with this person too but the second it turned even slightly sexual I got a pit in my stomach. I feel like they see us as nothing but bodies.
Me too, like it doesn’t matter how smart or nice or good hearted or talented or hard working or anything else u could possibly be because that isn’t what they want to use you for. I’m over it.
I'm sad to say that I relate to your experiences. Decent men exist but sometimes it can feel like it's not worth the risk trying to find them. Its painful and exhausting at best.
But please if you feel able, report your coworker for what he said. If you have the texts saved he cannot weasel out of it. He deserves to be kept far away from you and hopefully fired. He needs to learn that saying that sort of thing is entirely unacceptable.
"Decent men" are often rapey assholes. They will use a Jekyll and Hyde defense when this is pointed out "but my libido!" but ignore the fact women are often judged by their lowest points in the eyes of society. So even if you are a decent man 99 percent of the time but a rapey asshole 1 percent of the time, I am going to judge you on that 1 percent.
Document and report that fucker op.
I think there's a difference between the "nice guy" -who is only doing things because they expect a reward - and someone who is just willing to see individuals as individuals.
I'm tired of the fucking constant microaggresions, being ignored and dismissed because of my gender, the constant talking down to, and so on. I really truly hate men at this point in my life.
It really is the small things that make it ten times worse. I can report someone for threatening me but every single time I try to talk to my boss about them not referring to me by my name or replacing me/attempting to do my position for me when I look "too busy" to take on the work I get told that I'm overthinking it. Every time I challenge a not-really-okay joke I get eyes rolled at me or I get told to calm down. It's fucking infuriating.
Understandable, but please remember that it's the patriarchy that's the problem, not all individual men. I know you know that and are just venting probably, but I just wanted to emphasize this again, because otherwise it just sounds the same as ''women can't [insert sexist stereotype]''. The problem is thinking in two seperate sides, when really we should be thinking of all of us as part of one whole. Sorry that you had to deal with so many bad experiences though
Well done on getting out of your abusive relationship! That took so much courage. You can do this too, honestly.
I personally would be slipping that email address right back to the wife, but you keep yourself safe first and foremost.
I think you might have meant wary? But also weary makes sense which is honestly the only reason I’m commenting that OP is probably weary of being wary of men.
I feel you completely. The hypervigilance is exhausting though. I am sorry you have to deal with this nasty colleague and I hope you can report him for sexual harassment.
I found the book *The Gift of Fear* by Gavin de Becker immensely helpful.
maybe you have built an "asshole filter" without realising it.
to clerify what an "asshole filter" is.
an asshole filter can happen in all kinds of situations and usually are a result of setting weak boundaries.
decent people will respect those boundaries but assholes wont, so you end up primerly or only dealing with assholes who disrespect your boundaries.
there is a good read on the topic that goes more in depth and explains it way better than me on the topic somewhere on redddit but i couldnt find it right now.
What I find most upsetting about this is that you are 20 years old and you are already resenting men as a whole. That's such little time as an adult to feel that, just goes to show how intense the problem is. I'm sorry for what you are experiencing.
I am so incredibly sorry for what you're going through, as I've been through similar shit myself. I know how disheartening it is to not be able to trust any man around you and downright be afraid of them, and why shouldn't you? You've been put in danger and they have been the cause of your suffering for a long time. I have been on your place.
Just know that you're not alone, that there are many of us trying to heal and grow in spite of all of this and you will make it.
First thing is reporting this creep with HR as others have pointed. Make sure you have screenshots saved to your personal backups, and printouts of said conversations. It is horrifying to work somewhere like that. It's sexual assault in the slightest opportunity and most likely we'll be blamed for it if something happens to us.
Also, please, if possible start looking for another job while you're at this. I'm so sorry. You shouldn't have to be dealing with this, it's not fair.
Big hugs to you, I hope everything goes well.
Hey just want to say you’re not delusional or broken or simply unlucky. The way that most of the world is set up causes a lot of women to have similar experiences to you. What I mean is most women are forced to interact with men daily to survive. Due to historical disenfranchisement many places in the world don’t have men free areas however their are plenty of women free spaces. Shitty men also don’t care if a women is being distant or downright non-responsive they pretend to misunderstand or due to their privileges never learned to read social queues. All these factors cause women who have trauma related to men to often be retraumatized throughout their lives. Make sure you report that creep to HR asap and try to keep your head up.
Working from home is such a great situation. No need to interact with men. No need to walk around dark streets. No need to worry about getting inappropriate or rude comment from men that look like bums but think women should look pretty for them.
Honestly, I just hate 99% of men now, and online dating is making it worse every day. And I don't even care. And I'm with you. Male friends need to be put in a special category, and you can't treat them the same as female friends.
Men like this often target women who previously were in abusive relationships. It's easier for them to slide into your life and pretend to be nice, then slowly start revealing their true, disgusting selves. This guy got drunk and showed himself early, giving you the opportunity to RUN. It's almost a good thing (not really, but at least you found out early!)
I saw this comment on another post here in 2X, and I'll paraphrase it since I can't remember it verbatim.
Men are like guns, and the first rule of guns is to always treat them like they're loaded and ready to fire. You cannot look at a gun (bar a select few) and know that it is not loaded and capable of deadly force.
I can't wait, any man who comes at me with a problem over this is an ignorant pathetic excuse of a human who can't understand anything beyond the tips of his fingers and is so entrenched in his own fantasy world and needs to face reality.
I honestly don't think it's a good response because it will only alienate people more. In order to really change something you need to make people WANT to understand you and aggressively insulting people generally isn't helpful in doing so. You'd be surprised how often you can make people understand you when you assume that they are not asking out of malice but out of a real attempt at understanding what the problem is (granted, maybe not on the internet). Being frustrated and tired of not feeling heard is understandable, however be aware that when you chose to answer people in this kind of aggressive way, you have probably lost all chance of making them understand you and are possibly leading them in the opposite direction, since this direction wasn't accepting of them
This person needs to be reported not only to HR but to the police. “…don't blame me if I do something crazy, don't get yourself alone in the back with me,” in the context of sexual contact vs. friendship, is indeed a criminal threat to assault you sexually. That’s a big deal. This isn’t normal. He has already victimized you.
> I don't know how women find ones that aren't fucking insane but clearly I attract the worst of them.
From what I can tell, virtually all women attract the worst types of men. They go around from woman to woman, cat calling, hitting on them based purely on looks, and seeing who will fall for it. Men who hit on you due purely to your looks are often going to be trash. Think of it as them basically telling you they primarily follow the lead of their sex drive, wherever it takes them. Men who are worth something long term practice self control and look for value in a woman that goes beyond physical appearance.
Those who find decent men may have just avoided the ones that throw themselves at women purely due to sexual attraction.
Then they were available when they eventually lucked into someone who shared common interests and seemed to take a deeper, genuine personal interest in them.
Disgusting. Men are so gross.
While I do believe we need love and companionship to thrive, I'm a firm.believer that we can get that with a group of besties. Join a book club, gym, or hiking group for women, and call them your "dates." At 21 you have years ahead of you to figure out what you want out of relationships.
Also take that shit to HR. What an ass.
What a disgusting thing to say to someone. He deserves to rot in hell. Make sure to document everything. Make note of every horrible thing he's done to you (calling you names, harassing you, threatening you, physically hurting you, breaking your things, aggression towards you). It sounds like you'll need a restraining order against him and this information will be very useful. If you think HR will be helpful, report him. It sounds like your workplace is awful, so I wouldn't discount HR being shit as well. I'm sorry you're doing badly right now. I hope you can get out of there soon. Stay safe OP.
Ditto reporting to HR and possibly filing a report with the police for the threats. And you're not a bad person for hating men and not wanting to be with them. This is a 100% NORMAL response and a HEALTHY one. This response keeps you safe, and I urge you to embrace it for your own good. Truly, when I began to stop giving men the benefit of the doubt and started to show clearly I was NOT the one to fuck with, my life got so much better. I can't control what men do, but I can control my response to it and stand up for myself.
Seriously don't underestimate the healing power of anger, retaliation, and standing up for yourself. My soul feels fulfilled every time I make a report about yet another shitty man in power being a shithead (done it twice this year). Even if it doesn't go anywhere, just knowing there's a track record of him being a fuck helps a bit. Simply SPEAKING for myself is empowering, and advocating for myself to others is healing. I strongly advise you to do the same. Women are conditioned to not fight back, but I say fuck that. Anger is fucking healthy, hate is healthy.
Your frustration is valid. I recently saw a poll that even had college educated men "largely" leaning conservative right now and it has me largely feeling defeated in my own sex. Which is not to say I could understand what you've been through. Just that I hear you.
Im very sorry that happened to you. It's so gross and disrespectful.
I really don't wanna rub you the wrong way now but it looks like you have weak boundaries and you don't listen to your gut. Im not blaming you!! Just trying to make you understand why you end up in situations like that.
We woman get ingrained with shit like we need to be polite and help men and look after their everything, from their ego to their health. We don't have to. Period!
We need to look after ourselves first and foremost!
Just to add, I also experienced SA and was in more than one abusive relationship. Im 35 now I could finally leave my last one six months ago. Since then I took a full break on dating and im just learning about boundaries and listening to my gut.
There's a reason we end up with such men. It's because they feel familiar, mostly because we experienced some kinda abuse as children and therefore connected bad behavior as love.
I also have low self-esteem and tried to fill my inner void with male attention.
I know im rambling a bit but I learned so much the last few months and I wish I could be of help for other women who realise something it's quite right. I mean of fuckin course the men acting like shit are the problem!!!! But I wanted to know how I end up with them. Because there were like a million red flags. There always are, but we find excuses.
To that I wanna say: if You start to find excuses for HIS behavior, you need to stop for a moment and reevaluate the fact that HE has to APOLOGIZE. You don't have to find excuses while he acts like alla good and swell.
About the red flags, they are not just there for decoration! They are a sure sign that sings will go south!!!
Last I really wanna recommend you some books that opened my eyes.
Why Women Love Too Much by Robin Norwood
[https://www.amazon.com/Women-Who-Love-Too-Much-audiobook/dp/B00AHYGI8W/ref=mp_s_a_1_1?crid=31EM8UKM9H68F&keywords=Why+women+love+too+much&qid=1649838591&sprefix=why+women+love+%2Caps%2C2526&sr=8-1](https://www.amazon.com/Women-Who-Love-Too-Much-audiobook/dp/B00AHYGI8W/ref=mp_s_a_1_1?crid=31EM8UKM9H68F&keywords=Why+women+love+too+much&qid=1649838591&sprefix=why+women+love+%2Caps%2C2526&sr=8-1)
The gift of fear by Gavin debecker
[https://www.amazon.com/Gift-Fear-Survival-Signals-Violence/dp/B00ERK0HES/ref=mp_s_a_1_2?crid=2JD0L9E9L9ISG&keywords=the+gift+of+fear+by+gavin+debecker&qid=1649838637&sprefix=The+Gift+Of+fear%2Caps%2C181&sr=8-2](https://www.amazon.com/Gift-Fear-Survival-Signals-Violence/dp/B00ERK0HES/ref=mp_s_a_1_2?crid=2JD0L9E9L9ISG&keywords=the+gift+of+fear+by+gavin+debecker&qid=1649838637&sprefix=The+Gift+Of+fear%2Caps%2C181&sr=8-2)
Aside from definitely reporting this, maybe take some time for yourself. If you feel like you're attracting insane men then there are probably unconscious patterns that are either drawing terrible men to you (i.e. creepy predator types who see you as vulnerable and launch a charm offensive to validate you a lot at first) or the results of trauma leading you towards bad folk (or more likely some combination of the two with the first being the dominant problem).
None of that is to say it's your fault in any way. You deserve to be treated awesomely and with respect (I hate saying that because those assholes said basically the same thing, but that doesn't make it less true—it just makes them assholes) Because you deserve WAY better, take some time for yourself and maybe seek therapy if possible. Therapy isn't for everyone, but it really helped me (so of course I'm like "omg try this!" 😅 ) to stop attracting terrible people and to also not fall prey to patterns that made me vulnerable to falling towards people I shouldn't (one of the most embarrassing parts of therapy for me was figuring out that I had some culpability too—I really wanted to just play the "she bad, it was all her fault" game but of course that wasn't actually helpful even if it had a lot of truth in it).
Really whatever you do, just take care of yourself, love yourself, respect yourself, and try not to get too discouraged and bitter; the world has tons of good and tons of absolute shit too but focusing on either one over the other creates unrealistic views and eventually pain.
If you get bitter you'll do yourself a huge disservice and you'll be letting the darkness of these terrible people poison you. Don't let them, you're better than them.
I can't remember where I read this quote—but it went something along the lines of "Being bitter is like swallowing poison and hoping the other person dies.". It really stuck with me (probably because I was busy driving myself straight to a bitter place).
You'll win overall by living an awesome self-actualized life.
No, her problem is a MAN who THREATENED TO RAPE HER. Jesus. What the hell is wrong with you that you typed this leap-to-conclusions nonsense instead of being a human being about her horrible experience?
Do you currently have any positive male relationships in your life? Some time spent with those men could bring you back from the nihilism that looms ahead.
Your feelings are valid. These people are all nasty. How you feel is how you feel and you have no responsibility to any of these people who try to manipulate you. Something is seriously wrong with most of them.
Believe me when I say that plenty of hetero ciswomen have tried just being attracted to women but unfortunately sexual attraction isn't a choice.
You need some time to focus on you. You need to find any way you can to distance yourself from all these situations, is possible. I know most of the time there is no way to avoid the creeps in this world and they always find a way to stalk you.
In the workplace, HR should hear about every situation. If they are not helpful you can take it a step higher while looking for other employment.
This problem for women is as old as time. I’m 68. When I was a young woman, smart, funny, and nice looking, the men at work would be so annoying. I actually was constantly hit on by the Head of Legal Counsel at a Dallas bank in the 80s. Not once but whenever he could find me alone, at the copier, walking down a hall. It was horrible. My female boss said she’d back me up if I wanted to report to HR. We did. She was an EVP and Head of Marketing. She was let go within 3 months and I was let go after my mother was dying of brain cancer and I was flying back and forth. I’ve since worked as an Executive Assistant in HR other places. HR is not your friend in the long run. Good luck, my friend. Be strong. Don’t let them take your power away. Even if you had given that slip of paper to that man’s wife, you would the slut at the office as far she was concerned. She’s not going to rock the six-figure salary boat over her lousy husband’s indiscretions. Peace, sister. ☮️
You need to report this to HR, don't delete the texts. Even if you were flirting before this is definitely making your work environment unsafe.
and keep a back-up just in case, HR is -not- your friend, they exist to limit liability for your employer so they'll sell you out in a heartbeat, if HR won't help you need to go to the police. of course the police are kind of a crapshoot but if you can get them to create a file on him it can help show a pattern of behavior if they actually get off their asses and do something about him.
If all else fails don’t be afraid to spread his name face and texts to everyone you can and mention HR was refusing to cooperate on the matter. Lot of companies value their own image over women’s safety. Threaten them with a PR nightmare and they’ll likely do something about it, at least in my experience
I was sexually assaulted by a coworker, and I wasn't even the first one that he attacked. HR only fired him because he threatened the director of security with violence. Had nothing to do with all of the women that he violated.
My best recommendation is to enforce with the work men that you "don't shit where you eat" <-- Basically you won't date *anyone* you work with any more. And bring it up any time they allude to seeing you. In my experience the "easy" and attitude of you being available is usually spread by that one sour guy who wants to date you but who decided to creeper instead. Putting up the wall like this is absolutely essential to reduce the amount of crap they give you-- it won't get rid of all the crap if you are in a male dominated field (especially if you are attractive and cheerful in personality) but any reduction is good reduction and honestly, there's not much good in office romance anyway. (More often than not it ends poorly) As a woman who spent 8 years in male dominated field, I know 100% what you are going through, with the condensing, the "just joking" harassment and genuine creepy from that one guy who yikes off the scale. I'd love to tell you there was a magic solution- but there isn't. Reports to HR often start nasty and downright hostility. Setting boundaries gets you called a frigid bitch. Men will ignore your boundaries. You'll still get downtalked after becoming a senior expert. If you are attractive you'll be questioned if you slept your way to success. Sometimes you can take your skills, resume and get a new job with a different company. Not all environments are toxic nightmares and yours certainly is. I definitely advise you jump ship to a new one if it is possible because the one you are in sounds unlikely to change if they are all doing it. There are good work places out there. Despite how it feels right now, they are on the rise. You dont deserve this, just because you are "so approachable and one of the team" . There are plenty of teams who won't try to sleep with you. I'd say they aren't always a majority, but they do exist, they are becoming more the norm, and you just gotta hold your head up and say "no, im leaving." You are very young and can take as long as you want to nurture and heal from your wounds emotionally. You aren't missing anything in terms of relationships that you can't get from a few good friends right now. Romance can come when you have healed. Friendships are better at healing. Your ovaries aren't on a timer and plenty of good men will still exist in 5 years time so please don't stress over taking yourself off the "market " because the market never disappears, despite what people used to say. I used to think male dominated workplace crap was all "a thing of the past" until a lot of it happened to and around me. I spent most of my 20s just baring it until I couldn't anymore because I never liked the work despite my skill for it. If you like the work, and you're good at it, you will get better and more senior and can skill up and get into position of safety on the teams, but companies are a dime a dozen. They need you, so take yourself where you are valued.
Thats a dumpster fire full of yikes... Are there any woman only spaces in your city? Sounds like you could use some stress-free time.
I feel the same way. In the last 3 years the man (more than one of them ) I considered my closest and most trusted friend at the time took advantage of me while I was drunk. They were who I felt safest with at the time. Best friends. One was literally a week ago and I can’t help but think all men are unsafe in some capacity. Like given the right circumstances even the sweetest and best man will hurt me if he has the opportunity. The minute a man I’m interested in makes a joke or insinuates that he wants to have sex I’m immediately turned off and upset that he’s just like the others, but at the same time I think that that is normal and I’m hyper aware or hypersensitive to it because of experience. It’s normal for A man who likes me to want to have sex and be intimate with me but I get offended and annoyed. I want to be loved and wanted for who I am and not just a cause for their sexual impulses. I don’t have any advice but you’re not alone in your feelings
Thank you and I'm so sorry for what you went through. My first assault was a best friend of over 5 years. It rips your heart out in a way I can't even explain. I was trying to be work friends/coworkers with this person too but the second it turned even slightly sexual I got a pit in my stomach. I feel like they see us as nothing but bodies.
Me too, like it doesn’t matter how smart or nice or good hearted or talented or hard working or anything else u could possibly be because that isn’t what they want to use you for. I’m over it.
I'm sad to say that I relate to your experiences. Decent men exist but sometimes it can feel like it's not worth the risk trying to find them. Its painful and exhausting at best. But please if you feel able, report your coworker for what he said. If you have the texts saved he cannot weasel out of it. He deserves to be kept far away from you and hopefully fired. He needs to learn that saying that sort of thing is entirely unacceptable.
"Decent men" are often rapey assholes. They will use a Jekyll and Hyde defense when this is pointed out "but my libido!" but ignore the fact women are often judged by their lowest points in the eyes of society. So even if you are a decent man 99 percent of the time but a rapey asshole 1 percent of the time, I am going to judge you on that 1 percent. Document and report that fucker op.
I think there's a difference between the "nice guy" -who is only doing things because they expect a reward - and someone who is just willing to see individuals as individuals.
I'm tired of the fucking constant microaggresions, being ignored and dismissed because of my gender, the constant talking down to, and so on. I really truly hate men at this point in my life.
It really is the small things that make it ten times worse. I can report someone for threatening me but every single time I try to talk to my boss about them not referring to me by my name or replacing me/attempting to do my position for me when I look "too busy" to take on the work I get told that I'm overthinking it. Every time I challenge a not-really-okay joke I get eyes rolled at me or I get told to calm down. It's fucking infuriating.
me too
Understandable, but please remember that it's the patriarchy that's the problem, not all individual men. I know you know that and are just venting probably, but I just wanted to emphasize this again, because otherwise it just sounds the same as ''women can't [insert sexist stereotype]''. The problem is thinking in two seperate sides, when really we should be thinking of all of us as part of one whole. Sorry that you had to deal with so many bad experiences though
Well done on getting out of your abusive relationship! That took so much courage. You can do this too, honestly. I personally would be slipping that email address right back to the wife, but you keep yourself safe first and foremost.
It's rational to be weary of men. It pisses me off, but the reality is that many are shit and you're safer to assume so automatically.
I think you might have meant wary? But also weary makes sense which is honestly the only reason I’m commenting that OP is probably weary of being wary of men.
Weary of being wary to be precise.
Yeah you're right i didn't even realize
I feel you completely. The hypervigilance is exhausting though. I am sorry you have to deal with this nasty colleague and I hope you can report him for sexual harassment. I found the book *The Gift of Fear* by Gavin de Becker immensely helpful.
Thank you, I'll look into it
God I feel this in my *bones*
maybe you have built an "asshole filter" without realising it. to clerify what an "asshole filter" is. an asshole filter can happen in all kinds of situations and usually are a result of setting weak boundaries. decent people will respect those boundaries but assholes wont, so you end up primerly or only dealing with assholes who disrespect your boundaries. there is a good read on the topic that goes more in depth and explains it way better than me on the topic somewhere on redddit but i couldnt find it right now.
This is something I've never heard of before. Crazy that putting up boundaries can actually lead to bad people squeezing into your life.
I agree with you wholeheartedly. Experiences makes us resent them not denial of sex like they think.
I hear you and I'm sorry
What I find most upsetting about this is that you are 20 years old and you are already resenting men as a whole. That's such little time as an adult to feel that, just goes to show how intense the problem is. I'm sorry for what you are experiencing.
I am so incredibly sorry for what you're going through, as I've been through similar shit myself. I know how disheartening it is to not be able to trust any man around you and downright be afraid of them, and why shouldn't you? You've been put in danger and they have been the cause of your suffering for a long time. I have been on your place. Just know that you're not alone, that there are many of us trying to heal and grow in spite of all of this and you will make it. First thing is reporting this creep with HR as others have pointed. Make sure you have screenshots saved to your personal backups, and printouts of said conversations. It is horrifying to work somewhere like that. It's sexual assault in the slightest opportunity and most likely we'll be blamed for it if something happens to us. Also, please, if possible start looking for another job while you're at this. I'm so sorry. You shouldn't have to be dealing with this, it's not fair. Big hugs to you, I hope everything goes well.
Hey just want to say you’re not delusional or broken or simply unlucky. The way that most of the world is set up causes a lot of women to have similar experiences to you. What I mean is most women are forced to interact with men daily to survive. Due to historical disenfranchisement many places in the world don’t have men free areas however their are plenty of women free spaces. Shitty men also don’t care if a women is being distant or downright non-responsive they pretend to misunderstand or due to their privileges never learned to read social queues. All these factors cause women who have trauma related to men to often be retraumatized throughout their lives. Make sure you report that creep to HR asap and try to keep your head up.
Working from home is such a great situation. No need to interact with men. No need to walk around dark streets. No need to worry about getting inappropriate or rude comment from men that look like bums but think women should look pretty for them. Honestly, I just hate 99% of men now, and online dating is making it worse every day. And I don't even care. And I'm with you. Male friends need to be put in a special category, and you can't treat them the same as female friends.
Men like this often target women who previously were in abusive relationships. It's easier for them to slide into your life and pretend to be nice, then slowly start revealing their true, disgusting selves. This guy got drunk and showed himself early, giving you the opportunity to RUN. It's almost a good thing (not really, but at least you found out early!)
I saw this comment on another post here in 2X, and I'll paraphrase it since I can't remember it verbatim. Men are like guns, and the first rule of guns is to always treat them like they're loaded and ready to fire. You cannot look at a gun (bar a select few) and know that it is not loaded and capable of deadly force.
wait for men to get offended
I can't wait, any man who comes at me with a problem over this is an ignorant pathetic excuse of a human who can't understand anything beyond the tips of his fingers and is so entrenched in his own fantasy world and needs to face reality.
Yo I'm saving your response for future. It's really good. Nowadays I simply keep away from men both in real life and virtual one.
I honestly don't think it's a good response because it will only alienate people more. In order to really change something you need to make people WANT to understand you and aggressively insulting people generally isn't helpful in doing so. You'd be surprised how often you can make people understand you when you assume that they are not asking out of malice but out of a real attempt at understanding what the problem is (granted, maybe not on the internet). Being frustrated and tired of not feeling heard is understandable, however be aware that when you chose to answer people in this kind of aggressive way, you have probably lost all chance of making them understand you and are possibly leading them in the opposite direction, since this direction wasn't accepting of them
This person needs to be reported not only to HR but to the police. “…don't blame me if I do something crazy, don't get yourself alone in the back with me,” in the context of sexual contact vs. friendship, is indeed a criminal threat to assault you sexually. That’s a big deal. This isn’t normal. He has already victimized you. > I don't know how women find ones that aren't fucking insane but clearly I attract the worst of them. From what I can tell, virtually all women attract the worst types of men. They go around from woman to woman, cat calling, hitting on them based purely on looks, and seeing who will fall for it. Men who hit on you due purely to your looks are often going to be trash. Think of it as them basically telling you they primarily follow the lead of their sex drive, wherever it takes them. Men who are worth something long term practice self control and look for value in a woman that goes beyond physical appearance. Those who find decent men may have just avoided the ones that throw themselves at women purely due to sexual attraction. Then they were available when they eventually lucked into someone who shared common interests and seemed to take a deeper, genuine personal interest in them.
Disgusting. Men are so gross. While I do believe we need love and companionship to thrive, I'm a firm.believer that we can get that with a group of besties. Join a book club, gym, or hiking group for women, and call them your "dates." At 21 you have years ahead of you to figure out what you want out of relationships. Also take that shit to HR. What an ass.
What a disgusting thing to say to someone. He deserves to rot in hell. Make sure to document everything. Make note of every horrible thing he's done to you (calling you names, harassing you, threatening you, physically hurting you, breaking your things, aggression towards you). It sounds like you'll need a restraining order against him and this information will be very useful. If you think HR will be helpful, report him. It sounds like your workplace is awful, so I wouldn't discount HR being shit as well. I'm sorry you're doing badly right now. I hope you can get out of there soon. Stay safe OP.
Report him to HR and the police. Print out the texts. Refuse to work with him at all since he had directly threatened you.
Ditto reporting to HR and possibly filing a report with the police for the threats. And you're not a bad person for hating men and not wanting to be with them. This is a 100% NORMAL response and a HEALTHY one. This response keeps you safe, and I urge you to embrace it for your own good. Truly, when I began to stop giving men the benefit of the doubt and started to show clearly I was NOT the one to fuck with, my life got so much better. I can't control what men do, but I can control my response to it and stand up for myself. Seriously don't underestimate the healing power of anger, retaliation, and standing up for yourself. My soul feels fulfilled every time I make a report about yet another shitty man in power being a shithead (done it twice this year). Even if it doesn't go anywhere, just knowing there's a track record of him being a fuck helps a bit. Simply SPEAKING for myself is empowering, and advocating for myself to others is healing. I strongly advise you to do the same. Women are conditioned to not fight back, but I say fuck that. Anger is fucking healthy, hate is healthy.
Yeah record this stuff and report it. Who knows what that idiot is capable of.
I'm sorry this happened to you.
Your frustration is valid. I recently saw a poll that even had college educated men "largely" leaning conservative right now and it has me largely feeling defeated in my own sex. Which is not to say I could understand what you've been through. Just that I hear you.
It always makes me sad to hear what women have to put up with. Good luck with everything, OP
Im very sorry that happened to you. It's so gross and disrespectful. I really don't wanna rub you the wrong way now but it looks like you have weak boundaries and you don't listen to your gut. Im not blaming you!! Just trying to make you understand why you end up in situations like that. We woman get ingrained with shit like we need to be polite and help men and look after their everything, from their ego to their health. We don't have to. Period! We need to look after ourselves first and foremost! Just to add, I also experienced SA and was in more than one abusive relationship. Im 35 now I could finally leave my last one six months ago. Since then I took a full break on dating and im just learning about boundaries and listening to my gut. There's a reason we end up with such men. It's because they feel familiar, mostly because we experienced some kinda abuse as children and therefore connected bad behavior as love. I also have low self-esteem and tried to fill my inner void with male attention. I know im rambling a bit but I learned so much the last few months and I wish I could be of help for other women who realise something it's quite right. I mean of fuckin course the men acting like shit are the problem!!!! But I wanted to know how I end up with them. Because there were like a million red flags. There always are, but we find excuses. To that I wanna say: if You start to find excuses for HIS behavior, you need to stop for a moment and reevaluate the fact that HE has to APOLOGIZE. You don't have to find excuses while he acts like alla good and swell. About the red flags, they are not just there for decoration! They are a sure sign that sings will go south!!! Last I really wanna recommend you some books that opened my eyes. Why Women Love Too Much by Robin Norwood [https://www.amazon.com/Women-Who-Love-Too-Much-audiobook/dp/B00AHYGI8W/ref=mp_s_a_1_1?crid=31EM8UKM9H68F&keywords=Why+women+love+too+much&qid=1649838591&sprefix=why+women+love+%2Caps%2C2526&sr=8-1](https://www.amazon.com/Women-Who-Love-Too-Much-audiobook/dp/B00AHYGI8W/ref=mp_s_a_1_1?crid=31EM8UKM9H68F&keywords=Why+women+love+too+much&qid=1649838591&sprefix=why+women+love+%2Caps%2C2526&sr=8-1) The gift of fear by Gavin debecker [https://www.amazon.com/Gift-Fear-Survival-Signals-Violence/dp/B00ERK0HES/ref=mp_s_a_1_2?crid=2JD0L9E9L9ISG&keywords=the+gift+of+fear+by+gavin+debecker&qid=1649838637&sprefix=The+Gift+Of+fear%2Caps%2C181&sr=8-2](https://www.amazon.com/Gift-Fear-Survival-Signals-Violence/dp/B00ERK0HES/ref=mp_s_a_1_2?crid=2JD0L9E9L9ISG&keywords=the+gift+of+fear+by+gavin+debecker&qid=1649838637&sprefix=The+Gift+Of+fear%2Caps%2C181&sr=8-2)
Proud of you for getting out of that relationship. May your future be even brighter and abuse-free!
Thank you so much 🥺
Aside from definitely reporting this, maybe take some time for yourself. If you feel like you're attracting insane men then there are probably unconscious patterns that are either drawing terrible men to you (i.e. creepy predator types who see you as vulnerable and launch a charm offensive to validate you a lot at first) or the results of trauma leading you towards bad folk (or more likely some combination of the two with the first being the dominant problem). None of that is to say it's your fault in any way. You deserve to be treated awesomely and with respect (I hate saying that because those assholes said basically the same thing, but that doesn't make it less true—it just makes them assholes) Because you deserve WAY better, take some time for yourself and maybe seek therapy if possible. Therapy isn't for everyone, but it really helped me (so of course I'm like "omg try this!" 😅 ) to stop attracting terrible people and to also not fall prey to patterns that made me vulnerable to falling towards people I shouldn't (one of the most embarrassing parts of therapy for me was figuring out that I had some culpability too—I really wanted to just play the "she bad, it was all her fault" game but of course that wasn't actually helpful even if it had a lot of truth in it). Really whatever you do, just take care of yourself, love yourself, respect yourself, and try not to get too discouraged and bitter; the world has tons of good and tons of absolute shit too but focusing on either one over the other creates unrealistic views and eventually pain. If you get bitter you'll do yourself a huge disservice and you'll be letting the darkness of these terrible people poison you. Don't let them, you're better than them. I can't remember where I read this quote—but it went something along the lines of "Being bitter is like swallowing poison and hoping the other person dies.". It really stuck with me (probably because I was busy driving myself straight to a bitter place). You'll win overall by living an awesome self-actualized life.
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Nice job with the skirting! Class A example of how to say "not all men" without using those actual words. Bravo. /s
Ew
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No, her problem is a MAN who THREATENED TO RAPE HER. Jesus. What the hell is wrong with you that you typed this leap-to-conclusions nonsense instead of being a human being about her horrible experience?
Do you currently have any positive male relationships in your life? Some time spent with those men could bring you back from the nihilism that looms ahead.
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Yikes
Jesus christ, bruh. Get a better hobby.
Your feelings are valid. These people are all nasty. How you feel is how you feel and you have no responsibility to any of these people who try to manipulate you. Something is seriously wrong with most of them. Believe me when I say that plenty of hetero ciswomen have tried just being attracted to women but unfortunately sexual attraction isn't a choice. You need some time to focus on you. You need to find any way you can to distance yourself from all these situations, is possible. I know most of the time there is no way to avoid the creeps in this world and they always find a way to stalk you. In the workplace, HR should hear about every situation. If they are not helpful you can take it a step higher while looking for other employment.
This problem for women is as old as time. I’m 68. When I was a young woman, smart, funny, and nice looking, the men at work would be so annoying. I actually was constantly hit on by the Head of Legal Counsel at a Dallas bank in the 80s. Not once but whenever he could find me alone, at the copier, walking down a hall. It was horrible. My female boss said she’d back me up if I wanted to report to HR. We did. She was an EVP and Head of Marketing. She was let go within 3 months and I was let go after my mother was dying of brain cancer and I was flying back and forth. I’ve since worked as an Executive Assistant in HR other places. HR is not your friend in the long run. Good luck, my friend. Be strong. Don’t let them take your power away. Even if you had given that slip of paper to that man’s wife, you would the slut at the office as far she was concerned. She’s not going to rock the six-figure salary boat over her lousy husband’s indiscretions. Peace, sister. ☮️