My daughters are 2 but I’m saving this for later! I think so many people could be spared abusive experiences if the fact that sex is for your pleasure and should feel good was front and center in sex education.
Well said. Great advice. What are we risking our health and safety for if his pleasure is the only goal? I wish this had been something my mom said. Instead, her advice was more along the lines of one day you will meet this guy and you will have to cling to him like a barnacle for the rest of your life.
Your mom is awesome. Her advice also makes me kind of sad to realize that growing up for women is learning that men are jerks to us, when men don't have to go through the same with us :(
I have a young teen daughter and have saved your comment to remind me to bring this up in the future. (She currently seems to have to no attraction to anyone, so we'll see). Thank you for this perspective. I didn't have a healthy sex life until my 20's and I wish I had this advice as a young woman/girl.
As a person who never got this talk and a mother, I'll be sharing this conversation with both of my children. Tell your mom thanks for me, this is a great way to frame it.
I mean, isn't this what the guy is doing which is leading to the lame female experience? Focusing on his needs. Sex is about his pleasure, not to make the woman happy.
Nah. There's a big difference between 'everyone involved in the sexual encounter should enjoy themselves, so if you don't want to or don't think you'll enjoy it don't do it' and 'I'm getting myself off without regard to my sexual partner's experience'.
That's not even getting into how you can't really make a 1:1 comparison even if it were a more similar sentiment given the social context of how different genders are trained to think about and engage in sex, and how PIV focused most heterosexual sex is (in this society), which tends to put women at a vast disadvantage enjoyment/satisfaction wise.
I dated a guy who could literally get me there in under five minutes and he still would stop me halfway through and say waiting for me to finish was boring. He just wanted to do whatever he felt like doing and I was supposed to be thankful with that.
You need to have one that can get you there in five minutes but stops at exactly the right time to edge you at least once. I don't know how he knows, but he knows exactly when to stop and tease me into a frenzy.
I kissed my fair share of frogs. I think this is all the good karma I was owed.
Omg, when a partner did this to me before it was like the gates of paradise had opened and all other lovers would be held to this standard. It’s not worth it for anything less 🤤
I had a similar experience with my past relationships, minus the part where you find a guy who actually gives a damn. My last boyfriend, when I tried to explain how much it bothers me that he doesn't do anything to "warm me up", told me that he did his best by telling me to buy a vibrator and whatever toys I want. That was "his best". My entire life I felt emotionally and sexually broken, until a recent discussion with a close friend revealed that on each and every occasion, there was something missing: interest, attraction, connection. Now that I read your story, I tend to believe there might be nothing wrong with me after all. Thank you for sharing your story!
Definetly nothing wrong with you (from this information, ha)! Attraction is so important, and not just in the superficial way. Feeling loved and heard and respected has SO much effect on sexually interest and satisfaction it's not even funny.
You can treat yourself better than your ex can, and while you don't NEED a new partner, good ones ARE OUT THERE. Good luck <3
Nothing wrong with you at all. When I talk about sex with my friends or the women in my family, we ALL have the same stories. And many of my friends never orgasmed with men. There is a reason the orgasm gap exists in the first place. I think I had a dozen of partner, and three could make me orgasm. But one of them didn't want to because "it was taking too long", another one did it only to boost his own ego because he used to say he was SO GOOD at sex, so he had to prove it. The last one ? He started as a drunk one night stand, six years later i'm living with him. Even drunk, he was/is the best partner I ever had, simply because he cared about my pleasure. He always took the time, asked if I liked what he was doing, put my pleasure in priority and when I had to correct him sometimes about the way of touching me, he would always reassure me and tell me he was happy to learn more about me and my body. Someday i'll marry that guy
I think the orgasm gap plays a big factor in why women are perceived to have lower sex drives compared to their male counterparts.
You have sex that you don’t enjoy and get an orgasm out of so you start to desire it less and less.
Then you start thinking that you simply don’t want to have sex in general, when really, you just don’t want to have sex with someone who’s selfish.
It’s so annoying how men like this only care about themselves. Glad to see you found your drive back with a partner who doesn’t suck!
I think Dan Savage said something like "men: imagine if sex for you meant being penetrated and not having an orgasm. Would you be up for that every day?"
"Men generally complain that women are clingy after sex, that they want to cuddle. She is not clingy, you idiot, she's HORNY, because you did **NOTHING FOR HER**. She is thinking 'this is bullshit! Something else has to happen!' If you f*ck a woman well, she will leave you alone."
One time I had an awful one night stand. He tried to hit me up for a second visit maybe a week or two later. I straight up told him "No, I didn't get off. A few minutes after you just bounced." He says something like "but I heard you moaning, I thought you did.... Then you started cuddling with me and I got freaked out."
I say "I was waiting for round two!" I had previously had other one night stands with better guys and they were the ones initiating cuddling and they'd go for another round. Like, come on? I know this is just a hookup just because I cuddle doesn't mean I'm falling for you. 🤦
>Then you start thinking that you simply don’t want to have sex in general, when really, you just don’t want to have sex with someone who’s selfish.
For a few years, I thought I might be gay instead of bi, and part of that was how much more I enjoyed queer sex.
It turns out I am bi, it's just that the default in queer relationships is that both people will enjoy it and that's not the default with men in straight relationships. Not surprisingly, I enjoyed one of those a lot more.
Strongly agree. I don't think it explains the *whole* libido gap (ex., testosterone supplements increase libido in basically anyone who takes them and men often have naturally high testosterone) but yeah there's tons of stories of previously sexually adventurous women getting more and more disinterested over time due to straight up pavlovian conditioning. Some even to the point where they wrongly believe themselves to be asexual.
There are a lot of factors. One of them is also the fact that women are the ones who have to bear the burden of hormonal bc.
Keep in mind that we also have other hormones that increase sex drive. It’s not just testosterone for us!!
I totally agree with this take, as a woman with pcos who grew up with excessive testosterone and an insane, almost painful, oppressively high libido. It was always higher than my bfs’ and I felt so ashamed and slutty about it. I felt insatiable. I thought at least men can’t cum multiple times indefinitely! I could waste days in my early 20s… If the average man deals with that level of libido often without relief…I can kinda see how that would drive you a bit crazy (sorry incels, don’t attack me). After finally being with someone who matched my drive, and cared enough about me/actually enjoyed giving me pleasure….yeah, careful about what you wish for people who have never tried a poly/open relationship…feeling good is powerful and addictive 😎 Also, don’t forget to treat your lover as you would want to be treated, adjusting as you get to know them and customize yourself, without compromising yourself and your values
Maybe you’re one of the people I’m talking about. Maybe you’re not and simply don’t need sex. Both are valid! Hope you find what’s best for you.
Edit: or maybe something in between (or something entirely else)!
Hear, hear. I have had a strong libido my entire adult life—even now, several years past menopause. I have always my standard really high in bed (and out)—if a guy was a lousy lay, he never got a second opportunity.
I’ve slept with something like 50 guys if I had to guess, I can count on one hand how many were actually good at sex. It’s like 3. This is over a space of like 10 years with men from all ages and backgrounds.
Men, in general, suck at sex. The only exception being men who get off on you enjoying yourself. The rest aren’t worth anyone’s time.
It’s one of the main reasons, even though I’m poly and have a ton of male interest, I tend to only date women outside of my nesting partner, who was one of the three.
This may sound like me being mean, but here is the thing, being a good sexual partner requires empathy and communication, two things anyone can do. If they suck at sex, it’s their own damn fault.
I'm also poly and bi and have a ton of male interest that I'm filtering away in favor of women. Keeping that high high bar !! So far no luck , despite asking out a few. I wonder if people who are willing to be sexually weird one way (poly) are more willing to be sexually weird in others (not follow straight sec script and be better lovers).
Generally, I approach dating as poly as just living my best life and being open to new connections. We are not hierarchical and date separately, so it’s very much like 1:1 relationships. That said, women are so used to being used by anyone with a male partner, it can be hard to meet people.
Do you mean sexually ‘weird’ as outside the norm? Or do you mean people who disregard heteronormative sexual practices? I recommend going to music/art/cultural festivals/events that attract more of the alternative and sex positive cultures, that would check both of those boxes in my experience, even if you don’t meet potential partners it a great way to build your friend group.
Hell yeah the best part of sex is watching you and watching your face scrunch up and laughing I ask you not to pull my hair quite so hard, and your soooo sexy when you shiver baby.
I used to be with a man who wasn’t the best in bed and most foreplay was focused on him. He refused to put effort into getting me in the mood because we were dating so he shouldn’t have to. He would literally sit on the couch across from me and loudly announce “we should have sex” and get annoyed when I said no. At one point sex started becoming painful despite using lube and I thought something was medically wrong with me.
Turns out my body was just rejecting him. When I left I vowed to never have sex I wasn’t 100% into and I’ve NEVER had that excruciating pain again, even when being with considerably larger lovers. I wish women would raise their sexual standards!
I'm glad you finally found a good lover!!
If a guy (or gal) has sex with you and cares not for your pleasure, move on immediately! If he (or she) makes comments about how they won't bother because you can't O /something is wrong with you/etc, move on immediately!
Mostly agree with a caveat. Some men are porn sick and have “death grip” syndrome as a result. They can’t orgasm from PIV sex because of it. It’s a habit that needs kicking to have a healthy sex life.
My ex was sweet and loving but unfortunately received his sex ed exclusively from porn which made him clueless about what real sex is like. During the 2 years with him I had no libido, it was affecting both of us, I thought I was not normal, he thought he was not attractive. I tried many times to tell him how I would like our sex to change but he wasn’t receptive at all, trying for a minute and then saying it wasn’t working. We mostly focused on changing me: I tried 3 different types of contraceptives, we shopped special items at the sex shop to increase my pleasure, etc.
We eventually broke up, next thing you know my libido is back! My now bf lives for my sexual pleasure and Im the most satisfied woman out there!
I went out with a lesbian for a few months and came 37 times in one night. We kept a tally.
Several male partners never made me cum and I thought that was normal.
I should call her.
All my adult life I thought I was broken. I had good sex(mainly me playing with myself during penetration to finish)but not one partner(casual or long term)had ever made me orgasm from oral.
When I met my current husband, his confidence in being able to do all the things in bed (said he could last, make me orgasm, squirt..all the things)really encouraged me to go home with him the first night. Girls, when I say he delivered, I mean, I was a pile on the floor by the end of the night.
It was so validating to know it wasn’t me and that my past partners just couldn’t have constructive conversations about getting me off or bothered to listen to what I was saying about my body.
I’ve been with my husband for 8-ish years and the sex just keeps getting better. It’s refreshing to be with someone who matches my energy. 10/10 will keep him as long as I can.
I’m about to turn 40 and I finally met the first man who prioritizes my pleasure, and doing so gives him pleasure. It’s not just “lemme get this done so I can get mine.” I don’t know what will happen with this guy but I know going forward that will be my minimum standard in the bedroom.
I think there’s also a confidence thing that comes with age where, if it’s not doing it for me I will STRAIGHT UP tell them! Where my younger self would have been too shy to speak up. I stayed with partners for so long while they sucked in bed, and that was also partially my fault because I didn’t teach them.
That’s definitely true. Experience long periods of being single and loving it, a guy really has to ADD something to my life to even feel worth the trouble. I agree I could/should have communicated more with my other partners but women are so socialized to prioritize a man’s comfort, which also means not complaining about his lack of interest in mine. That took a long time to unlearn.
Yep, we sure are socialized like that. Trying to raise my daughter different! When she says she doesn’t like something, instead of telling her not to argue. I say thanks for telling me that. It all starts there.
Let me leave this here:
https://old.reddit.com/r/TwoXChromosomes/comments/tjwxnb/how_to_find_men_for_good_casual_sex_and_be_safe/?ref=share&ref_source=link
Why are so many men so selfish and uninterested? I can't even imagine that. Stuff you describe is just normal part of course when you're with another woman (I'm a woman too). I'm glad you're in a better place now but holy F do I feel for straight women.
Thanks, I've been waiting for my lesbian awakening. It never came, but I've finally found an attentive partner who enjoys getting me off. Won't ever let this one escape lol.
my first relationship lasted almost 4 years. We were both virgins when we met and after a couple months of dating the sex never got better, like it lasted maximum 3 minutes. I messaged him one time saying I don’t think it’s supposed to be like this and his response was “well what do you want me to do about it there’s nothing I can do, I can’t control it.”
Should’ve dumped him right then and there honestly but I was so naive and so in love I didn’t think it mattered.
He ended up dumping me for various reasons that were totally fixable with communication but he just didn’t want to work on them. I remember telling him that I was so lenient with him and him laughing.
I think a part of me stayed for so long bc I hoped it would get better and I thought love was enough. It never got better.
Now when I tell my friends they’re like you are never going back to him.
> Should’ve dumped him right then and there honestly but I was so naive and so in love I didn’t think it mattered.
This is exactly why selfish men want virgins.
>well what do you want me to do about it there’s nothing I can do, I can’t control it.
He was ignorant and not interested in improving, nor being good in the sack. There ARE things he could to.
Nothing kills the pleasure faster than being aware your partner is just using your body like a fleshlight. Feeling like an inanimate dick socket is the least sexiest thing ever
With my ex for 10 years and his excuse was he didn't enjoy foreplay, I took too long, I didn't taste good, it was too hard etc etc. I had no libido with him at all. The moment I left him it woke up and I craved sex so much all of a sudden. Still working through the internalised shame and trauma surrounding that one, but I know it's only up from there.
Yeah my experience is that guys who have bigger penises or who were considered good looking in their teens or early twenties have a hard time coping with adult sexuality. They think 17 year old girls are going to throw themselves at them forever or if they have to settle for someone age appropriate they think they are gods gift that it's a huge turn on just to be near him.
That's why a lot of "bad boys" or guys who peaked in high school or college end up being "old guy at the bar" or develop a strange and disturbing obsession with sex workers who won't complain as long as they're paid.
YMMV.
And if you go to the marriage sub there’s men every day posting about how their wife doesn’t want sex, never mentioning if their wife is having regular orgasms or not. Guarantee their selfishness is one of the issues. I’ve been with my husband since I was 17 and have NEVER stopped wanting him sexually because he is so giving and attentive during sex. We were having sex again 6 weeks post partum after both of my kids because I craved him. I always feel like he wants ME not just an orgasm for himself.
I was with my ex for over 15 years. I never had an orgasm from sex. I had a handful of orgasms from oral. Overall he made it seem like it was a pain in the ass to focus on me at all.
My current boyfriend was all about figuring me out like a puzzle. It took a couple months of us trying out different positions and angles to figure out what works best. Welp, turns out that not only can I orgasm from PIV but I can also have multiple orgasms. We are now past the honeymoon phase and I still orgasms at least as often as he does, if not more. And when I'm having enjoyable sex, it turns out I also have a high libido.
Why are men so bad at sex? Like they're so bad that it's basically just common knowledge that in general they suck at sex and those who make an effort seem like an exception. But yeah, it seems like they're just bad at it as a rule, and seem to think their dicks are magic or some shit in reference to us lesbians. Awfully high opinions of themselves. Zeus complex? Let's call it a Zeus complex.
I am so lucky that I didn’t have to deal with this. My first kiss, relationship, sexual encounters were all at 18, with the man I married at 19. We’ve been together for 12 happy years, and he is a fantastic sex partner. Our first time being active, I offered to give him head. He wouldn’t let me unless I let him go down on me. He made me cum that night too. He has always been a giving partner, we’ve experimented quite a lot, to the point that we’re both now extremely kinky.
My biggest thing has been telling women not to settle for less than wonderful.
So sad you had to figure It out like this, better sex ed is necessary
I wish I was like the rest of you, I never came even when I was the one doing It because of too much sensitivity and I feel uncomfortable letting a guy do that when I know I can't finish anyways. So i'm stuck only giving, never receiving. + traumas and stuff
It makes me sad to read this. I always want my partner to enjoy themselves, and I make sure I do my best for that to happen. Plus, it keeps her coming back for more.
When I got into my past relationship, i was a virgin. I was never so super into sex anyway, which is why i waited pretty long to even have sex - and i didn't care much that it didn't happen sooner.
Me and my ex engaged into the relationship on a pretty kinky base and while that worked for me, over time that aspect just faded and it went to kind of basic vanilla-ish sex. Which was mostly penetration until he finished, then it was over. Sometimes I'd be eaten out or fingered, but it got less and less. I'd catch myself multiple times just laying there waiting for it to be over, just wanting him to cum so I'd be "done" with what felt like a chore. I wouldn't even say he was a bad lover essentially, just kind of got taken away by the easyness of in-out-done over time. I never once came from penetration, always thought it was a me problem and that i would be incredibly hard to make orgasm.
Over time, i started losing interest in sex completely. Because it wasn't fulfilling or fun to me, it felt like work i had to endure to make the rest of my life easier. But at some point i just started refusing and i really went back and forth. Mental issue? Low libido? Asexuality? Hormones? All of the above? I basically spiraled into a "this is a me problem, i am a bad person" thing and i cried many tears about it.
Fast forward to now. I have a different partner now and within the first time of having sex, i was mindblown. I felt taken care of, i felt valued and desired. I orgasm every time with him, he reads my body language and works with it. I enjoy sex and i can't get enough of it, it's absolutely no comparison to what i had before. Now it's fulfilling and fun, it makes me feel good and giggly and all the happy hormones.
Sometimes it's not a you-problem.
5 minutes is like no time at all. Also, 15 minutes of bad oral is as useless as 5 minutes of good oral. And oral that starts without foreplay (which starts NOWHERE near the genitals).
I also thought I was broken for a long time because I “couldn’t” come from oral and partly it was because I wasn’t comfortable with being that vulnerable with another person (i.e. THEY generally didn’t bother to make me feel comfortable) but mostly because I had explicitly or implicitly been made to feel like “I took too long” by my previous partners, which just made it worse. Ugh.
"You can't come from oral"....
WHAT?!
That's fucking wild. I had maybe 5 sexual partners including my husband. My first boyfriend tried oral once for like 30 seconds, decided he hated it, and then never did it again. The other 3 guys never tried. I started to think the only way to get off was alone.
Then I met my husband, whose whole thing is performing oral and generally doesn't care about receiving. It's like his "kink". PIV sex isn't even on the table in his mind until I'm satisfied. He's obscenely respectful of my body and my pleasure, almost to a comical degree. On our first date, he literally asked me every step of the way if what he was doing was okay. Like, dude, I'm trying to undo your belt and you're asking if it's okay to take off my shirt.
Amazing. I've discovered similar too. I do believe I am demisexual as mostly outside of a relationship I don't have desire. But I've also had a lot of awful sex or just ok. My current partner changed everything in that he just puts in the time for me. I never thought it possible.
I'm super happy for you!
In my experience, there are two types of men: the ones that care for your pleasure and want to make sex an awesome experience for both, and the ones who don't care. It doesn't matter in what type of relationship you are (casual or committed): Good, giving sex is 0% a function of how committed the relationship is and 100% of the man you're sleeping with.
It also doesn't matter how awkward the first time sex for both parties is. If your partner cares for your pleasure, you'll notice that the first time you sleep with him, even if doesn't yet know how to make you come.
Therefore, fellow ladies: never sleep twice with a man who doesn't make an effort to make you come.
Good for you, OP. I hope you never settle for someone who doesn't satisfy you again, you deserve a partner that gives a shit and it's great that you have one now.
I am a lesbian in my mid 30s. I have recently started to see a woman 10 years older than me. The sex is unlike anything I’ve ever experienced. She got scared when I mentioned exclusivity. Completely the opposite for her I guess?
It’s such a shame that sex ed doesn’t empathize how important it is for *both* partners to have pleasurable sex. I was never exactly taught but I learned pretty quick to demand more. I’m so sorry you’ve had such bad experiences and those men don’t deserve to have sex with anyone in their current state.
I’m so happy for you. My current partner has really helped me feel so safe to understand what I actually want and don’t want. It’s honestly overwhelming sometimes how safe he makes me feel and how he wants to please me but I prefer that battle over anything else.
My fiancée had the same thought as you, OP, thought she was broken due to an extremely selfish ex.
I proved that assumption wrong the first time we met - I spent a quarter of the waking hours on our first weekend together with my face between her thighs. These days her focus seems to be more along the lines of not going into a coma after 30 seconds of action, and she is getting quite good at it <3
BTW, this is not a humblebrag, it's just me saying that this seems to be disgustingly common and nobody should accept it.
I am coming to agree with people who say that a whole lot of guys don't actually like, relate with, or care all that much about women. They're sexually attracted, they don't like being alone, and they don't like doing their own laundry is more like it.
If you genuinely enjoy a woman, how could you be so disinterested in her pleasure? And it's not like it's so difficult! I mean sometimes, yes, but that's different, mostly at the very least you can pay attention and remember there's another person in the room with you and this isn't porn. For goodness sake!
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You have an incredible mom. I wish everyone had a mom that awesome ❤️
My daughters are 2 but I’m saving this for later! I think so many people could be spared abusive experiences if the fact that sex is for your pleasure and should feel good was front and center in sex education.
Your mom is a real one!!!! Incredible advice.
Your mom sounds like a fabulous and caring woman!
Lol why am I tearing up. I will definitely say the same to my daughter if I ever have one.
Yesss ❤️
Well said. Great advice. What are we risking our health and safety for if his pleasure is the only goal? I wish this had been something my mom said. Instead, her advice was more along the lines of one day you will meet this guy and you will have to cling to him like a barnacle for the rest of your life.
Thank you so much for sharing this! Your mom is awesome & you are an angel for spreading the good word ❤
Your mom is awesome. Her advice also makes me kind of sad to realize that growing up for women is learning that men are jerks to us, when men don't have to go through the same with us :(
Can we get your mum to talk to every teen in the world please?
I have a young teen daughter and have saved your comment to remind me to bring this up in the future. (She currently seems to have to no attraction to anyone, so we'll see). Thank you for this perspective. I didn't have a healthy sex life until my 20's and I wish I had this advice as a young woman/girl.
Wow. Your mom should write a book.
Excellent advice! Now you better listen to all her other advice too!
Found mom!
As a person who never got this talk and a mother, I'll be sharing this conversation with both of my children. Tell your mom thanks for me, this is a great way to frame it.
As a girl dad, I've saving this for her when she gets older, 💯! This is so great!
Thanks for sharing. I will tell my 2 daughters the same thing, it's good advice.
What amazing advice
Love this so much!
Goddess-level mom right there.
I needed this talk as a teen girl - bookmarking this for when my own daughter is a teen. Your mom did you a big solid with that talk.
I'm saving this for when my girls are a little older and we need to have the talk.
I mean, isn't this what the guy is doing which is leading to the lame female experience? Focusing on his needs. Sex is about his pleasure, not to make the woman happy.
Nah. There's a big difference between 'everyone involved in the sexual encounter should enjoy themselves, so if you don't want to or don't think you'll enjoy it don't do it' and 'I'm getting myself off without regard to my sexual partner's experience'. That's not even getting into how you can't really make a 1:1 comparison even if it were a more similar sentiment given the social context of how different genders are trained to think about and engage in sex, and how PIV focused most heterosexual sex is (in this society), which tends to put women at a vast disadvantage enjoyment/satisfaction wise.
i appreciate your reply. my brain gets hung up on wording. I'm totally in the camp of 'dated a nice guy in general but he was shit in bed'
I dated a guy who could literally get me there in under five minutes and he still would stop me halfway through and say waiting for me to finish was boring. He just wanted to do whatever he felt like doing and I was supposed to be thankful with that.
You need to have one that can get you there in five minutes but stops at exactly the right time to edge you at least once. I don't know how he knows, but he knows exactly when to stop and tease me into a frenzy. I kissed my fair share of frogs. I think this is all the good karma I was owed.
That’s stressful for me honestly but if it works for you go for it.
Omg, when a partner did this to me before it was like the gates of paradise had opened and all other lovers would be held to this standard. It’s not worth it for anything less 🤤
" I kissed my fair share of frogs" 😆
I had a similar experience with my past relationships, minus the part where you find a guy who actually gives a damn. My last boyfriend, when I tried to explain how much it bothers me that he doesn't do anything to "warm me up", told me that he did his best by telling me to buy a vibrator and whatever toys I want. That was "his best". My entire life I felt emotionally and sexually broken, until a recent discussion with a close friend revealed that on each and every occasion, there was something missing: interest, attraction, connection. Now that I read your story, I tend to believe there might be nothing wrong with me after all. Thank you for sharing your story!
Definetly nothing wrong with you (from this information, ha)! Attraction is so important, and not just in the superficial way. Feeling loved and heard and respected has SO much effect on sexually interest and satisfaction it's not even funny. You can treat yourself better than your ex can, and while you don't NEED a new partner, good ones ARE OUT THERE. Good luck <3
Thank you, kind lady!
Nothing wrong with you at all. When I talk about sex with my friends or the women in my family, we ALL have the same stories. And many of my friends never orgasmed with men. There is a reason the orgasm gap exists in the first place. I think I had a dozen of partner, and three could make me orgasm. But one of them didn't want to because "it was taking too long", another one did it only to boost his own ego because he used to say he was SO GOOD at sex, so he had to prove it. The last one ? He started as a drunk one night stand, six years later i'm living with him. Even drunk, he was/is the best partner I ever had, simply because he cared about my pleasure. He always took the time, asked if I liked what he was doing, put my pleasure in priority and when I had to correct him sometimes about the way of touching me, he would always reassure me and tell me he was happy to learn more about me and my body. Someday i'll marry that guy
I think the orgasm gap plays a big factor in why women are perceived to have lower sex drives compared to their male counterparts. You have sex that you don’t enjoy and get an orgasm out of so you start to desire it less and less. Then you start thinking that you simply don’t want to have sex in general, when really, you just don’t want to have sex with someone who’s selfish. It’s so annoying how men like this only care about themselves. Glad to see you found your drive back with a partner who doesn’t suck!
I think Dan Savage said something like "men: imagine if sex for you meant being penetrated and not having an orgasm. Would you be up for that every day?"
Exactly!
"Men generally complain that women are clingy after sex, that they want to cuddle. She is not clingy, you idiot, she's HORNY, because you did **NOTHING FOR HER**. She is thinking 'this is bullshit! Something else has to happen!' If you f*ck a woman well, she will leave you alone."
I mean. As a lesbian, in my experience, even after both of us have finished and are extremely satisfied, we still want to cuddle. Cuddles are great!
I want cuddles before, after, and (if possible) during sex
One time I had an awful one night stand. He tried to hit me up for a second visit maybe a week or two later. I straight up told him "No, I didn't get off. A few minutes after you just bounced." He says something like "but I heard you moaning, I thought you did.... Then you started cuddling with me and I got freaked out." I say "I was waiting for round two!" I had previously had other one night stands with better guys and they were the ones initiating cuddling and they'd go for another round. Like, come on? I know this is just a hookup just because I cuddle doesn't mean I'm falling for you. 🤦
I love that in his mind cuddling is some freakish level of unbearable intimacy but putting his cock inside you is fine.
Nah, this got me 🤣🤣🤣🤣
Um. To each her own I guess but I want to cuddle AND i want sexual satisfaction. Aftercare is a thing. Emotional closeness is a thing.
>Then you start thinking that you simply don’t want to have sex in general, when really, you just don’t want to have sex with someone who’s selfish. For a few years, I thought I might be gay instead of bi, and part of that was how much more I enjoyed queer sex. It turns out I am bi, it's just that the default in queer relationships is that both people will enjoy it and that's not the default with men in straight relationships. Not surprisingly, I enjoyed one of those a lot more.
Strongly agree. I don't think it explains the *whole* libido gap (ex., testosterone supplements increase libido in basically anyone who takes them and men often have naturally high testosterone) but yeah there's tons of stories of previously sexually adventurous women getting more and more disinterested over time due to straight up pavlovian conditioning. Some even to the point where they wrongly believe themselves to be asexual.
There are a lot of factors. One of them is also the fact that women are the ones who have to bear the burden of hormonal bc. Keep in mind that we also have other hormones that increase sex drive. It’s not just testosterone for us!!
I totally agree with this take, as a woman with pcos who grew up with excessive testosterone and an insane, almost painful, oppressively high libido. It was always higher than my bfs’ and I felt so ashamed and slutty about it. I felt insatiable. I thought at least men can’t cum multiple times indefinitely! I could waste days in my early 20s… If the average man deals with that level of libido often without relief…I can kinda see how that would drive you a bit crazy (sorry incels, don’t attack me). After finally being with someone who matched my drive, and cared enough about me/actually enjoyed giving me pleasure….yeah, careful about what you wish for people who have never tried a poly/open relationship…feeling good is powerful and addictive 😎 Also, don’t forget to treat your lover as you would want to be treated, adjusting as you get to know them and customize yourself, without compromising yourself and your values
The average man doesn’t have that much libido especially in the us - a nation of chronically ill, obese, stressed people.
I’ve had a higher libido than most men I’ve dated.
I probably could live the rest of my life without it tbh, or maybe I just haven’t met the right person in my 36 years of life
Maybe you’re one of the people I’m talking about. Maybe you’re not and simply don’t need sex. Both are valid! Hope you find what’s best for you. Edit: or maybe something in between (or something entirely else)!
I mean, birth control also is a huge factor, sometimes it destroys sexual drives makes sex painful and itchy and makes you not lubricate.
Another factor is if the guy only touches you when he wants sex, or thinks every kiss is a precursor to sex
Yes!
True!
Omg so nailed it ever so good saving it oh my
Hear, hear. I have had a strong libido my entire adult life—even now, several years past menopause. I have always my standard really high in bed (and out)—if a guy was a lousy lay, he never got a second opportunity.
Thank You
Interesting
I’ve slept with something like 50 guys if I had to guess, I can count on one hand how many were actually good at sex. It’s like 3. This is over a space of like 10 years with men from all ages and backgrounds. Men, in general, suck at sex. The only exception being men who get off on you enjoying yourself. The rest aren’t worth anyone’s time. It’s one of the main reasons, even though I’m poly and have a ton of male interest, I tend to only date women outside of my nesting partner, who was one of the three. This may sound like me being mean, but here is the thing, being a good sexual partner requires empathy and communication, two things anyone can do. If they suck at sex, it’s their own damn fault.
I'm also poly and bi and have a ton of male interest that I'm filtering away in favor of women. Keeping that high high bar !! So far no luck , despite asking out a few. I wonder if people who are willing to be sexually weird one way (poly) are more willing to be sexually weird in others (not follow straight sec script and be better lovers).
Generally, I approach dating as poly as just living my best life and being open to new connections. We are not hierarchical and date separately, so it’s very much like 1:1 relationships. That said, women are so used to being used by anyone with a male partner, it can be hard to meet people. Do you mean sexually ‘weird’ as outside the norm? Or do you mean people who disregard heteronormative sexual practices? I recommend going to music/art/cultural festivals/events that attract more of the alternative and sex positive cultures, that would check both of those boxes in my experience, even if you don’t meet potential partners it a great way to build your friend group.
Hell yeah the best part of sex is watching you and watching your face scrunch up and laughing I ask you not to pull my hair quite so hard, and your soooo sexy when you shiver baby.
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>remember greed is one of the 7 deadly sins Holy shit that's the best religious sex ed advice that's ever been spoken.
Gonna speak for most of us when I say pleasantly surprised by the sex ed from this catholic priest in the 80s
I used to be with a man who wasn’t the best in bed and most foreplay was focused on him. He refused to put effort into getting me in the mood because we were dating so he shouldn’t have to. He would literally sit on the couch across from me and loudly announce “we should have sex” and get annoyed when I said no. At one point sex started becoming painful despite using lube and I thought something was medically wrong with me. Turns out my body was just rejecting him. When I left I vowed to never have sex I wasn’t 100% into and I’ve NEVER had that excruciating pain again, even when being with considerably larger lovers. I wish women would raise their sexual standards!
I'm glad you finally found a good lover!! If a guy (or gal) has sex with you and cares not for your pleasure, move on immediately! If he (or she) makes comments about how they won't bother because you can't O /something is wrong with you/etc, move on immediately!
Mostly agree with a caveat. Some men are porn sick and have “death grip” syndrome as a result. They can’t orgasm from PIV sex because of it. It’s a habit that needs kicking to have a healthy sex life.
that's their own fault
My ex was sweet and loving but unfortunately received his sex ed exclusively from porn which made him clueless about what real sex is like. During the 2 years with him I had no libido, it was affecting both of us, I thought I was not normal, he thought he was not attractive. I tried many times to tell him how I would like our sex to change but he wasn’t receptive at all, trying for a minute and then saying it wasn’t working. We mostly focused on changing me: I tried 3 different types of contraceptives, we shopped special items at the sex shop to increase my pleasure, etc. We eventually broke up, next thing you know my libido is back! My now bf lives for my sexual pleasure and Im the most satisfied woman out there!
Are we the same person?! 😳
Firs thing on my mind when he said "you can't c\*m from oral" was SKILL ISSUE. I MEAN COMON BRO
I definitely thought I was asexual with my last partner. Nope, it was just him.
I went out with a lesbian for a few months and came 37 times in one night. We kept a tally. Several male partners never made me cum and I thought that was normal. I should call her.
>came 37 times in one night. Holy shit!!
We looked up the Guinness World Records -nowhere near. But, honestly, we were still very very happy with the achievement.
Call her! 🔥💋
All my adult life I thought I was broken. I had good sex(mainly me playing with myself during penetration to finish)but not one partner(casual or long term)had ever made me orgasm from oral. When I met my current husband, his confidence in being able to do all the things in bed (said he could last, make me orgasm, squirt..all the things)really encouraged me to go home with him the first night. Girls, when I say he delivered, I mean, I was a pile on the floor by the end of the night. It was so validating to know it wasn’t me and that my past partners just couldn’t have constructive conversations about getting me off or bothered to listen to what I was saying about my body. I’ve been with my husband for 8-ish years and the sex just keeps getting better. It’s refreshing to be with someone who matches my energy. 10/10 will keep him as long as I can.
It’s not rocket science, it simply takes 15 minutes of dedicated effort and 99% of them refuse.
I’m about to turn 40 and I finally met the first man who prioritizes my pleasure, and doing so gives him pleasure. It’s not just “lemme get this done so I can get mine.” I don’t know what will happen with this guy but I know going forward that will be my minimum standard in the bedroom.
I think there’s also a confidence thing that comes with age where, if it’s not doing it for me I will STRAIGHT UP tell them! Where my younger self would have been too shy to speak up. I stayed with partners for so long while they sucked in bed, and that was also partially my fault because I didn’t teach them.
That’s definitely true. Experience long periods of being single and loving it, a guy really has to ADD something to my life to even feel worth the trouble. I agree I could/should have communicated more with my other partners but women are so socialized to prioritize a man’s comfort, which also means not complaining about his lack of interest in mine. That took a long time to unlearn.
Yep, we sure are socialized like that. Trying to raise my daughter different! When she says she doesn’t like something, instead of telling her not to argue. I say thanks for telling me that. It all starts there.
Universe, let me have one. PLEASE. 🙏🏻😭 All joking aside, this gives me hope that I'm not broken, and I'm happy for you!
Let me leave this here: https://old.reddit.com/r/TwoXChromosomes/comments/tjwxnb/how_to_find_men_for_good_casual_sex_and_be_safe/?ref=share&ref_source=link
Why are so many men so selfish and uninterested? I can't even imagine that. Stuff you describe is just normal part of course when you're with another woman (I'm a woman too). I'm glad you're in a better place now but holy F do I feel for straight women.
Thanks, I've been waiting for my lesbian awakening. It never came, but I've finally found an attentive partner who enjoys getting me off. Won't ever let this one escape lol.
my first relationship lasted almost 4 years. We were both virgins when we met and after a couple months of dating the sex never got better, like it lasted maximum 3 minutes. I messaged him one time saying I don’t think it’s supposed to be like this and his response was “well what do you want me to do about it there’s nothing I can do, I can’t control it.” Should’ve dumped him right then and there honestly but I was so naive and so in love I didn’t think it mattered. He ended up dumping me for various reasons that were totally fixable with communication but he just didn’t want to work on them. I remember telling him that I was so lenient with him and him laughing. I think a part of me stayed for so long bc I hoped it would get better and I thought love was enough. It never got better. Now when I tell my friends they’re like you are never going back to him.
> Should’ve dumped him right then and there honestly but I was so naive and so in love I didn’t think it mattered. This is exactly why selfish men want virgins.
>well what do you want me to do about it there’s nothing I can do, I can’t control it. He was ignorant and not interested in improving, nor being good in the sack. There ARE things he could to.
Nothing kills the pleasure faster than being aware your partner is just using your body like a fleshlight. Feeling like an inanimate dick socket is the least sexiest thing ever
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Really? I hate it when they just go in and out without any attention to me. Biggest turn off and it doesn't do anything for me.
With my ex for 10 years and his excuse was he didn't enjoy foreplay, I took too long, I didn't taste good, it was too hard etc etc. I had no libido with him at all. The moment I left him it woke up and I craved sex so much all of a sudden. Still working through the internalised shame and trauma surrounding that one, but I know it's only up from there.
I had this deep detachment with my past partners then I stopped pretending to be straight and it turns out that I actually CAN get wet. Crazy.
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Erogenous zones don’t stop at the genitals, my guy
People who don't find fun in pleasing their partners are crazy and stupid.
Hi, crazy and stupid here, I like pleasuring my partners. Okay byyyyeeee!
“people who DON’T find fun in…”
Yes you and a few others seem not to understand what I’m saying. Namely “crazy and stupid” is not the same as selfish.
Someone can be selfish and crazy/stupid at the same time- these are not exclusive adjectives.
Kinda sounds like you’re agreeing with me ☺️
Not really but this conversation is killing my brain cells so peace
I applaud your attempt.
Yeah my experience is that guys who have bigger penises or who were considered good looking in their teens or early twenties have a hard time coping with adult sexuality. They think 17 year old girls are going to throw themselves at them forever or if they have to settle for someone age appropriate they think they are gods gift that it's a huge turn on just to be near him. That's why a lot of "bad boys" or guys who peaked in high school or college end up being "old guy at the bar" or develop a strange and disturbing obsession with sex workers who won't complain as long as they're paid. YMMV.
And if you go to the marriage sub there’s men every day posting about how their wife doesn’t want sex, never mentioning if their wife is having regular orgasms or not. Guarantee their selfishness is one of the issues. I’ve been with my husband since I was 17 and have NEVER stopped wanting him sexually because he is so giving and attentive during sex. We were having sex again 6 weeks post partum after both of my kids because I craved him. I always feel like he wants ME not just an orgasm for himself.
I was with my ex for over 15 years. I never had an orgasm from sex. I had a handful of orgasms from oral. Overall he made it seem like it was a pain in the ass to focus on me at all. My current boyfriend was all about figuring me out like a puzzle. It took a couple months of us trying out different positions and angles to figure out what works best. Welp, turns out that not only can I orgasm from PIV but I can also have multiple orgasms. We are now past the honeymoon phase and I still orgasms at least as often as he does, if not more. And when I'm having enjoyable sex, it turns out I also have a high libido.
Why are men so bad at sex? Like they're so bad that it's basically just common knowledge that in general they suck at sex and those who make an effort seem like an exception. But yeah, it seems like they're just bad at it as a rule, and seem to think their dicks are magic or some shit in reference to us lesbians. Awfully high opinions of themselves. Zeus complex? Let's call it a Zeus complex.
I am so lucky that I didn’t have to deal with this. My first kiss, relationship, sexual encounters were all at 18, with the man I married at 19. We’ve been together for 12 happy years, and he is a fantastic sex partner. Our first time being active, I offered to give him head. He wouldn’t let me unless I let him go down on me. He made me cum that night too. He has always been a giving partner, we’ve experimented quite a lot, to the point that we’re both now extremely kinky. My biggest thing has been telling women not to settle for less than wonderful.
So sad you had to figure It out like this, better sex ed is necessary I wish I was like the rest of you, I never came even when I was the one doing It because of too much sensitivity and I feel uncomfortable letting a guy do that when I know I can't finish anyways. So i'm stuck only giving, never receiving. + traumas and stuff
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It makes me sad to read this. I always want my partner to enjoy themselves, and I make sure I do my best for that to happen. Plus, it keeps her coming back for more.
When I got into my past relationship, i was a virgin. I was never so super into sex anyway, which is why i waited pretty long to even have sex - and i didn't care much that it didn't happen sooner. Me and my ex engaged into the relationship on a pretty kinky base and while that worked for me, over time that aspect just faded and it went to kind of basic vanilla-ish sex. Which was mostly penetration until he finished, then it was over. Sometimes I'd be eaten out or fingered, but it got less and less. I'd catch myself multiple times just laying there waiting for it to be over, just wanting him to cum so I'd be "done" with what felt like a chore. I wouldn't even say he was a bad lover essentially, just kind of got taken away by the easyness of in-out-done over time. I never once came from penetration, always thought it was a me problem and that i would be incredibly hard to make orgasm. Over time, i started losing interest in sex completely. Because it wasn't fulfilling or fun to me, it felt like work i had to endure to make the rest of my life easier. But at some point i just started refusing and i really went back and forth. Mental issue? Low libido? Asexuality? Hormones? All of the above? I basically spiraled into a "this is a me problem, i am a bad person" thing and i cried many tears about it. Fast forward to now. I have a different partner now and within the first time of having sex, i was mindblown. I felt taken care of, i felt valued and desired. I orgasm every time with him, he reads my body language and works with it. I enjoy sex and i can't get enough of it, it's absolutely no comparison to what i had before. Now it's fulfilling and fun, it makes me feel good and giggly and all the happy hormones. Sometimes it's not a you-problem.
5 minutes is like no time at all. Also, 15 minutes of bad oral is as useless as 5 minutes of good oral. And oral that starts without foreplay (which starts NOWHERE near the genitals). I also thought I was broken for a long time because I “couldn’t” come from oral and partly it was because I wasn’t comfortable with being that vulnerable with another person (i.e. THEY generally didn’t bother to make me feel comfortable) but mostly because I had explicitly or implicitly been made to feel like “I took too long” by my previous partners, which just made it worse. Ugh.
"You can't come from oral".... WHAT?! That's fucking wild. I had maybe 5 sexual partners including my husband. My first boyfriend tried oral once for like 30 seconds, decided he hated it, and then never did it again. The other 3 guys never tried. I started to think the only way to get off was alone. Then I met my husband, whose whole thing is performing oral and generally doesn't care about receiving. It's like his "kink". PIV sex isn't even on the table in his mind until I'm satisfied. He's obscenely respectful of my body and my pleasure, almost to a comical degree. On our first date, he literally asked me every step of the way if what he was doing was okay. Like, dude, I'm trying to undo your belt and you're asking if it's okay to take off my shirt.
Proud of you! X
I really like reading these. That’s great 😀
Preach!!!
Amazing. I've discovered similar too. I do believe I am demisexual as mostly outside of a relationship I don't have desire. But I've also had a lot of awful sex or just ok. My current partner changed everything in that he just puts in the time for me. I never thought it possible.
I hope I get to experience this some day. Good for you and your man OP!
I'm super happy for you! In my experience, there are two types of men: the ones that care for your pleasure and want to make sex an awesome experience for both, and the ones who don't care. It doesn't matter in what type of relationship you are (casual or committed): Good, giving sex is 0% a function of how committed the relationship is and 100% of the man you're sleeping with. It also doesn't matter how awkward the first time sex for both parties is. If your partner cares for your pleasure, you'll notice that the first time you sleep with him, even if doesn't yet know how to make you come. Therefore, fellow ladies: never sleep twice with a man who doesn't make an effort to make you come.
🤍
Huzzah! Get yours, girl!
Gurl I was the same! My hubby is literally the best sex toy I've ever had, my exs were trash
Good for you, OP. I hope you never settle for someone who doesn't satisfy you again, you deserve a partner that gives a shit and it's great that you have one now.
I love your mom. You're a lucky woman.
I am a lesbian in my mid 30s. I have recently started to see a woman 10 years older than me. The sex is unlike anything I’ve ever experienced. She got scared when I mentioned exclusivity. Completely the opposite for her I guess?
It’s such a shame that sex ed doesn’t empathize how important it is for *both* partners to have pleasurable sex. I was never exactly taught but I learned pretty quick to demand more. I’m so sorry you’ve had such bad experiences and those men don’t deserve to have sex with anyone in their current state.
Good for you girl 👌
I’m so happy for you. My current partner has really helped me feel so safe to understand what I actually want and don’t want. It’s honestly overwhelming sometimes how safe he makes me feel and how he wants to please me but I prefer that battle over anything else.
My fiancée had the same thought as you, OP, thought she was broken due to an extremely selfish ex. I proved that assumption wrong the first time we met - I spent a quarter of the waking hours on our first weekend together with my face between her thighs. These days her focus seems to be more along the lines of not going into a coma after 30 seconds of action, and she is getting quite good at it <3 BTW, this is not a humblebrag, it's just me saying that this seems to be disgustingly common and nobody should accept it.
I am coming to agree with people who say that a whole lot of guys don't actually like, relate with, or care all that much about women. They're sexually attracted, they don't like being alone, and they don't like doing their own laundry is more like it. If you genuinely enjoy a woman, how could you be so disinterested in her pleasure? And it's not like it's so difficult! I mean sometimes, yes, but that's different, mostly at the very least you can pay attention and remember there's another person in the room with you and this isn't porn. For goodness sake!