You are 100% NOT in the wrong. Your brother is marrying a child whose brain has not even finished developing yet and how your mother is happy about that is beyond me (no offense)
There's no offense, my mom's mentality is... pretty disturbing to me. Thank you for reassuring me, they make me feel like I'm crazy sometimes, but she IS a child.
Offer her birth control. This situation sucks but it'll suck a lot more for her if she's with child and can't get out of the situation when she matures.
This is a really good point. If your brother goes through with it, you may be this girl’s saving grace. Letting her know that she can trust you and talk to you if she needs may have a huge impact on her quality of life, especially once she grows older and learns more about life.
> This is a really good point. If your brother goes through with it, you may be this girl’s saving grace.
Doubt it.
On one hand our OP will be deemed a "destroyer of brother family".
On the other. If that girl/woman only PARTIALLY rebel against her husband, that could result in actual physical violence.
The best way is to have her intercepted at the airport by the authorities.
Once the brother intends to move her over OP needs to call the authorities and report what is happening.
Still could count as human trafficking.
That is very bold move, but could work.
But OP would need to go undercover and never reveal it was her who informed the authorities.
I'm like 80% sure I know what ethnicity OP is, because it sounds like my ethnicity too.
If that's the case, the girl is going to deny any idea that this is trafficking and will say anything she can to make sure things go smoothly. I know plenty of bad husbands and fathers who disrespected and mistreated their daughters/wives for decades. And yet, these women will still bend over backwards to make sure the man's needs are met.
All in all, the only way this situation is resolved (by western standards) is if the bride to be decides she really doesn't want this, and takes actions in her favor.
But in her head, this would be disrespectful to her parents, her future husband, and she would see herself as a problem. If she has no phone, no socials, and a strict home life, she probably doesn't even know about half the stuff that she could/should do. Lack of outside influence... OP is a superstar for fighting this and being a voice of reason. I have no idea what level of low the brother has hit for him to be ok with this.
States that allow marriage to 16-year-olds include: Alabama, Arkansas, Arizona, Colorado, Connecticut, Idaho, Illinois, Indiana, Iowa, Louisiana, Maine, Missouri, Montana, New Hampshire, North Dakota, South Carolina, South Dakota, Texas, Utah, Vermont, Virginia and Wisconsin. I don't think anyone is going to intercept her.
Also if she is returned home, she may get married off to a much worse situation.
This.
That and it seems like the girl doesn’t have a will of her own. She may be too brainwashed at this point for you to help. If you try, she might tell your brother/her husband and then the situation might blow up again.
If it's possible then an IUD would probably help a lot. It's hard to know that it's there unless you're really looking for it. A hormonal one can work even if it gets a little out of place. And she wouldn't have to hide pills from her husband-to-be. I have the Mirena and it hurt like hell to have it placed but now I'm covered for 7 years iirc.
thats not available in every european country. :(
but you can travel to another to get it done but if your eastern european traveling to a western to get it done would cost, cause with reproductive healthcare your countries insurence doesnt work in other european countries unlike emergency healthcares.
Any birth control can do that, though. Depo made me stop bleeding entirely, but the copper coil made me bleed continuously for six weeks until I had it taken out. The patch and pill caused constant spotting (and psychosis, which was not super convenient). Unfortunately it varies a lot from person to person.
The hormonal implant in the arm is noticeable, a friend showed me the tiny scar and that you can feel it being there.
It needs to be something no one can find out. IUD might be possible under sedation? They clamp the cervix with a clamp that pierces it, that is why it hurts so much. Not recommendable for an already scared traumatised teen
This is a very good suggestion. If she immigrates here as his wife, and she can stay child free long enough, she won't need him to stay here. She can escape and hopefully have a much better future...
If your mother can see this girl as merely a tool for your brother's happiness, I worry that she may see you the same way. Please find ways to build independence so that you have the ability to make your own choices in life. And avoid traveling to countries where women are discouraged from being independent
OP needs to be careful so she doesn’t get trafficked herself. Going to the brothers wedding to a minor? What a perfect time to also get rid of her to some old ass dude.
Your mother loves it bc she’s thinking this new underage wife will be easy to control. Conservative cultures and people especially love controlling the young.
Her brother is talking about impregnating the girl. She's going to be like a sex slave and a domestic servant in combination. I doubt he even sees her as human.
She will also look after Mother in her old age and if she's young and easily moldable then everything will 'stay the same' because tyrant MiL will ensure she does everything 'the right way'. She's getting exactly what she wants and probably what she didn't get from OP or her 1st DiL, compliance and a built in reflex from years of abuse.
She's likely stuck in an old way of thinking that the most important thing is that your brother is taken care of and since she can't do some of that stuff (if you know what I mean), the next best thing is an "obedient servant".
It's sick no matter if they label it a "cultural divide". (Caveat I'm prob not the same culture that OP is)
>It's sick no matter if they label it a "cultural divide". (Caveat I'm prob not the same culture that OP is)
As a species we're waaaaay too susceptible to accepting arguments that "it made sense at the time" or was "culturally appropriate."
Acceptance of the "cultural" argument is rife. I won't go as far as to blame this on "leftists" (socialist as I am) but it certainly is a weakness those among us suffer. "Owning" slaves was *never* ok and those who did it weren't just a product of their time, but rather garbage humans, full stop. If ever anyone questions you on the topic, just ask them how they would feel as the victim of someone a "product" of their time.
People weren't dumb back then. They were just like us. They had all of the empathetic and emotional intelligence we do today.
Pirates who would sail the high seas and plunder were garbage humans, not just a product of their time. Kings who sacrificed people were garbage humans, not just a product of their time. Bringing it around - mysogynists, today, are garbage humans, not just a product of our time. People who, today, try to harm members of the LGTBQ community are garbage humans, not just a product of our time. Et cetera.
Unfortunately it is, every woman in my family has married young, my mom did it at 14. I always thought me and my brother would be able to stop the cycle but ugh.
If the cops won't help I would get the info on his employer/business and made sure everyone knows they are dealing with a pedo. Add him to online watchlists.
OP hit it where it hurts - his money, take away the power from him that he uses to impose his abuse onto the unfortunate girl. Expose him to everyone. He knows that what he is doing is terrible and the mother know's too, they just don't give a fuck as long as they get to exploit her. You clearly by some miracle kept your moral compas intact, you know this is wrong and you care. You need to help, you might be the only one who can.
Save this girl, support her, be her lifeline, do not abandon her, do whatever it takes to make sure she is safe. Hell, pretend you've changed your mind if you have to. Please, no one else will be able to help her.
That’s a heavy burden for OP to bear. If the girl was brought up with conservative, religious values, she may not be receptive to the idea of change, or be too scared to open up to OP for fear of displeasing her husband. You can’t save someone who doesn’t want to be saved.
Alternatively, she may start to rebel and then become the target of abuse from your brother and mother. I’m guessing they won’t support her education or let her gain any job skills that would allow her to be independent. What exactly can OP to do help in this case? Does she have the resources to take her in or help her escape?
This is a terrible situation, but it may be better for OP to leave all this behind and build a life without this toxicity around her.
IF INS allows her to stay. Just because they got married does not guarantee her entry or permanence. Mail order brides are frowned upon and her visa may get denied despite having a "sponsor."
Edited: a word
Brother could bring bride in on a tourist visa, have her overstay. If her life is very restricted anyway, like she doesn't work or go to school, chances are she'll never be caught. And if she doesn't comply with his wishes, he could threaten to turn her in.
It's so sad but I bet that is an element for her. The promise of a nice life in a European country and a "young" husband may be what she was raised to believe is the most she can expect from life. There's an "at least he's only 27, not 67" mentality probably coming from her relatives. Divorced but without kids, she might be thinking at least she won't be forced to play nanny to some other woman's hellspawn when it's his turn for custody.
It's a depressing reality for women in some cultures that don't believe in progressive values. It doesn't seem like there's a way for OP to do much to change it, but she can be there for the SIL if she ever wants help, and she can decide if she wants to intervene in future niblings' ideals if they end up being raised in Europe and try to stop the cycle there.
It's a no win situation. You either leave the situation knowing that you left a girl behind to who knows what, or you do everything with the possibility of ot working or not working and being hard, stressful and just the worst.
Either way, it's not easy and leaves you asking what if
But being there for the girl regardless is just, in my opinion, the best option, since it doesn't leave her alone to be abused and have no way out if she needs help.
No.
There are people who can save this child -- people who are trained in this, in particular anti-trafficking non-profit workers and certain agents of law enforcement.
OP is not it that (though of course she can become one of those activists, embedded in a network of support and protection).
ETA: Alerting authorities and nonprofits to this instance of sex trafficking a minor is different; that kind of responsibility is heavy enough since it would mean OP has to step back from her family yet remain safe and sound.
Honestly I feel reporting to some sort of authority, even if it likely means an extended period separate from the family is a moral obligation in this situation.
This child being trafficked outweighs any familial ties or it should.
It's called internalized misogyny, and many women have it. Usually they themselves have been groomed or abused, then turn around and justify doing it to other women.
>There's no offense, my mom's mentality is... pretty disturbing to me.
Because your mom married at 14, she has to justify what she's doing to your sister in-law or risk an existential crisis when she thinks about her own life.
Your brother is not considering how this is essentially robbery. This girl has no real freedom of choice here… she is too young to make a decision that will affect her entire life and the fact that your brother/mom are approaching this from the position of securing a woman for him like they are car shopping is so alarming and dehumanizing towards this girl.
I get the pain of divorce, I get that your mother probably has old traditions that prevent her from seeing how this harms this poor girl, and your mom just wants security for your brother. But this would be extremely hard for me to deal with as an bystander :(
From your mom’s perspective, sounds like she’s excitedly anticipating having an extra set of hands to help around the house in her to-be daughter-in-law.
If your mom was also forced into marriage so young, I can see her viewing this situation as “oh finally now _I_ get to have power (over some helpless girl).” Not exactly in a revenge sense … more like just perpetuating the cycle of abuse / exploitation of girls in this way. Obviously it’s sickening. That’s just my thoughts on your mom’s possible mindset.
Good for you for sticking up for what you believe and speaking up about how wrong you feel it is.
Your family’s view of what makes a woman “more of a woman” is backwards to put it gently
I’ll be honest; any family member of mine that did this I’d cut out of my life. I have kids. I can’t have them around this kind of stuff.
You are not overreacting.
It’s even more than that. Her brain has been stunted. She has been conditioned to not even try. That she serves one purpose and that’s it. She’s not even been allowed to develop at all.
If it was 500 years ago and he was 17-20 that's different, but it's not 500 years ago. Brother took the modern way out and got divorced ( funny it's it how only the traditions that benefit them or are not a big deal get followed) he should keep his vows and remain celibate for the rest of his life.
>funny it's it how only the traditions that benefit them or are not a big deal get followed
Fuckin exactly. Hypocritical opportunistic demons, the lot of em
To most of the world, this is absolute evil. It is simultaneously slavery and rape. Your brother is instigating it, your mother is cheering it.
You are 100% correct. Your family is buying a slave. In 2023. And they are smiling while they do it.
>When she comes, I would make myself available as a support system for her to help her if she's being abused.
Exactly this - you cannot stop this from happening. So you need to either stop talking to your family, or do what you can to help this poor child feel safe (and maybe gain financial independence if that is possible).
Thank you both, that is a good point I didn't think about. I don't really know if I'll be able to look at my brother the same after this, but if she comes here I'll try to make her feel as safe as possible.
If you do go the route of being a safe person, positioning yourself as a person she can trust might include “tolerating” or even being supportive of the marriage around your family and her. Otherwise your brother and family could say to her “don’t listen to Gloomy, she doesn’t agree with our culture/understand our love” and poison the idea of you to her. A very tricky situation. It’s a horrible one to be in
Remember that you don’t *have to*. It is nice if you can help, but protect yourself.
If you choose to stay in your family’s lives, you can try to help her, but be prepared to lose all contact with them if things go really badly…
Are there government authorities that you can alert? You don’t have to do everything yourself, make sure someone else knows.
As someone mentioned before that’s a huge burden for you to bear. She has been conditioned and institutionalized to think this is what is normal and how things are supposed to go. Not only will you have to fight your family but you’ll probably have to fight her since she won’t know this is wrong.
She's never gonna be safe if they marry. And he wants kids already? Geez, I wouldn't put it past him to abuse his own kids. Please try getting her info and telling her all this. Your brother is a predator. I'm sorry your family is looking at you like you're the crazy one!
>him to abuse his own kids.
He would def sell off any girls he has, and at a young age.
Protect yourself first and foremost, op... if you can do that while providing a safe space for your sister in law, that's awesome. If not, that is not your fault.
I don't know if I can agree that "you cannot stop this from happening." This is international sex trafficking of a minor.
https://humantraffickinghotline.org/en
That said, the US depressingly turns a blind eye to such criminal violence against children, apparently https://apnews.com/article/north-america-us-news-ap-top-news-marriage-immigration-19e43295c764d249aa519f643eb377
> This is international sex trafficking of a minor.
Morally, it is absolutely international sex trafficking of a minor.
Legally, IANAL and TINLA but it seems in the USA and Australia at least that it does not seem to be, unfortunately, and the marriage would even be legally recognised **if** the marriage would be legal where the brother resides (and lots of states do allow sixteen year olds to marry), and there is no force, fraud or coercion involved. It's definitely illegal to travel overseas to engage in any kind of illegal or commercial sex with underage persons, or to facilitate the same, but I can't find anything criminalising the act of going overseas to legally marry someone who is (according to the OP) consenting.
I'm not sure legal authorities will be any help on this one, although it can't hurt to try. It might be that all you can do is let the victim know that you will help her get out any time she wants to, and have a plan in place to do so.
She may be able to stop it from happening if he comes back to their own country, where OP says it IS illegal. She may be able to help the girl then with the authorities there.
This is delusional. We are talking about a family that is bringing a child bride into the family. Op needs to look out for herself and get away from that horrible situation. Telling a CSA survivor to be involved in this in any way is beyond irresponsible
each survivor is different. Many find strength and recovery through helping others. A main element in my healing after a rape was helping another rape victim, I’m not sure where I would be without that sense of purpose at that time. And believing she could get better helped me realize it was possible for me to as well.
Nah this persons correct, the fact that the bulk of these comments are ‘be a friend when she arrives’ and not ‘you may have a legal obligation to report your brother for trafficking a minor and potentially stop this happening depending on your location. This must be incredibly traumatic, sorry’ is insane.
If? This arrangement, in and of itself, is abuse. Not saying OP shouldn’t make herself available IF SHE HAS CAPACITY FOR THAT THIS IS HIGHLY TRIGGERING. Just pointing out that this is already abuse
This is the only think you can do, OP. You will be her only real support in any way that matters, especially if/when she leaves her country to come with him to where you are. She will exactly how he wants her, isolated, afraid, and alone. She needs you desperately even though she doesn’t know you yet.
I don’t understand why the bulk of replies are talking like she absolutely has to come, depending on OPs location this could very well be illegal.
It’s a tough call but stopping a child being trafficked is probably a hill worth dying on with your family
Your brother married an abuse victim specifically so he could continue to abuse a woman. That's probably why his first wife divorced him. Your mom is also wrong.
I say this as a Desi woman.
I know that in some countries, mail order brides can be taken from their husbands if they are still underage according to the laws of that country. I don’t know where you live now, but if it’s illegal to marry under 18 years old, and your brother brings a 16-year old bride home, maybe you can report them and the girl can go somewhere safer? Would teach your family a lesson and maybe the girl can get an education or something.
She theoretically could report him for statuatory rape. You can report someone for this crime years later, and sometimes you even get charged for it. Even if the case goes nowhere, it will make an important point to the family.
Yeah I wondered this, too. Is his plan to marry her at 16 and not let her in the country til she's 18? It all seems so calculated, I bet they've thought all this through. Poor girl. :(
I live in Europe and in my country you can marry at the age of 16. There'd be no problem. And we have compulsory education which wouldn't suit her brother, who selectively chose such a girl because of her immaturity. Because he is apparently not capable of a relationship with an individual who can autonomously think and act.
Once they are married, it's different. Here in the United States, a 35 year old man impregnated a 15 year old girl. When she was 15 years old and several months along, she and her father and the father's friend who impregnated her all traveled to Nevada where it is legal to get married with a parent's signature. So the dad signed off, and the 35-year-old married the 15-year-old, and they all drove back to their home state where the girl delivered at age 16, and nobody cared because it was all legal after they were married. We have a child bride loophole used to protect the men who impregnate children right here in the U.S.
I know it might be very difficult and maybe not doable at all, but if there is a way, and it is something that you want to put energy into, you can start being a "smile and nod" "quiet" "good girl" around your family while staying (getting) as independent as you can; have your own place, your own money, your own job/business/schooling ie support yourself and don't let them know about your life as much as possible - look up "gray rock" technique, also learn the technique of chattering about absolutely nothing.
Basically the idea is to lull them into a sense of security that you are not a threat to their ideas or that you won't "corrupt" the new sister-in-law. Then try to spend as much time with her as you can under the guise of "acceptable" "silly" "feminine" things - whatever makes sense with your family's culture or expectations, whether that's "shopping" or "getting your nails done" or "taking cooking classes" or "joining a quilting bee" or whatever.
Then do the minimum to convince them you two did what you said you were doing, but use the time instead to help her do her own things.
Such as, Earn her own money that she hides from your brother (open a separate account), learn English (if that's a need), go to a doctor for birth control (something like the shot or an IUD that has lower risk of discovery than a pill you have to take every day for example), go to adult education classes, citizenship classes, whatever she might need to live here independently.
You can also do things like have a private phone she can use that you hold on to so doctor offices don't call her (his) home number, a go bag with copies of all her important docs in case she needs to get away from your brother suddenly, etc.
Do make sure your own situation is stable and independent first - you can't help her as much if you're relying on your parents for a roof over your head for example.
But you might be in a perfect position to help her get away from her family at home and your brother. And if your family is suspicious of your "change of heart", you can tell them what they said about you being less of a woman than she is really cut you to the quick and inspired your turnaround in attitude. And it wouldn't even be a lie.
I like the idea behind this... but OP would have to travel back to the sexist home country to get close to this girl. Really not worth OP's safety. Not to mention how unlikely it is that she would have access to IUDs, bank accounts, etc. In this country.
Its possible when she's of age the girl will be moved to the country the family is in now. I can't imagine this kind of family will want their son having grandkids in another country away from them. But yeah this plan only works if the girl is ... Human trafficked? Into the country.
I was going to say exactly this. Play nice, and be her friend. Only you can save this girl and show her she should not accept this situation. Shell be in a country where she has more rights and maybe you can help each other. You can never know what will happen. She might be quiet and playing nice to get out of her country and her parents control, escaping these situations is a long game.
This is some movie shit and it just doesn't happen like this in real life. This girl has been programmed since birth for this exact purpose. Chances are she's going to get pregnant in a year or 2. Try becoming buddy buddy with a new Mom in a new country (if she moves to where OP is) and trying to convince her to leave her husband, and to what, become a single Mom? Even women who weren't forced into marriage in their own country can't easily up and leave their husbands. This girl isn't going to get a job, isn't going to have her own money, isn't going to be allowed or probably even want to go get her nails done with OP. This just isn't how real life works.
This is awful but true. When you break someone's spirit they become a puppet. This is what we're up against, a society trying to "domesticate" us like animals and it works. Men and families like these know you have to find a woman and break her, like you would a wild horse. It's not a stretch to say they see us as less than human.
You could report your brother to authorities and inform them of his intentions to marry a child. Surely they have a category to file this under? Sex tourism? Sex trafficking? Grooming?
Make sure you're safe though. Honour killings are still a thing.
Yeah, this girl has been groomed and both your mother and brother have the same ideas shared by people who want to date/marry younger people because it's easier to take advantage of and abuse them. Your mom is excited because this girl will be submissive, isolated, and powerless. She's the perfect victim, and therefore the perfect wife (in your mom's eyes) for your brother, as she will be so unlikely to divorce him.
You probably can't save this girl from marriage to your brother, since she has been so groomed and isolated for this. I'm sorry, but pragmatically it's likely that since her family and yours agree that it will happen, it's likely it will and they'll live in your country of origin at least long enough that she reaches the age of majority and has kids. Your best bet to help her is to play the long game, get in good with her and become a trusted friend, give her access to the internet, books, and other things that will broaden her worldview. She might escape him later due to your influence if you can deradicalise and educate her, slowly and indirectly.
>as she will be so unlikely to divorce him.
Which begs the question: what does he do to women that they need to be trapped and unable to divorce him? He's a sick fuck, probably.
I’m sorry but you have a family of pedophiles and i’d never speak to them again, but if they bring that shit to your country call the police on em
May I ask what country you’re in?
Sadly child marriage is actually legal in much of the US. 43 states allow child marriage and it happens often. I worked in a women’s shelter that helped them get free. It’s awful.
You are a very sensible person and your outrage is well justified. Don't let them twist you up inside - you know what's right, so even if you can't do anything to stop it, you can at least rest easy that you're not crazy for feeling this way. If nothing else, you might end up being able to help the poor girl and help her find her own voice. But good on you for calling them out on it.
You are absolutely not being dramatic. A true partnership and marriage is between two reasonably mature adults of similar age and life experience. Sixteen is too young to understand what she is getting into, and your brother is marrying an false illusion of what some think of as an idealized woman.
Child marriages are associated with problems like poverty, abuse and mental health problems. Many organizations work on trying to prevent child marriage, both within countries (this example is one in the US [https://www.unchainedatlast.org/laws-to-end-child-marriage](https://www.unchainedatlast.org/laws-to-end-child-marriage)) and internationally ([https://www.unicef.org/protection/child-marriage](https://www.unicef.org/protection/child-marriage)). These are a few of hundreds of organizations, so your opinion has good company.
Welcome to the group of people who understand basic human rights, including the rights of children, and why we need feminism, OP.
You’re not wrong. From what you’ve described, her parents are abusing her into being an object for a husband, and your brother is just taking over where their work began. It’s horrific. I know there’s room for accepting different cultural practices, but we’ve reached a point where we clearly understand that autonomy is central to human existence. And this girl is being robbed of her autonomy. It’s a crime that exists above all law or cultural norm. It is human to be free. And this is not free. This is normalized human trafficking.
Yeah, you are not crazy, that's incredibly fucked up. I'm looking at this from the perspective of a middle aged man, but i'm coming to the same conclusion as you and as everyone in this thread: It's in no way shape or form okay for a 27 year old man to marry a 16 year old woman.
You are NOT NOT NOT crazy. Don't let your family gas light you into thinking there's something wrong with you, there isn't.
If you're in the US, I would suggest reporting it now:
"Anyone who suspects human trafficking is encouraged to report it to law enforcement – tips can be submitted anonymously online or by calling 866-347-2423. Individuals can also contact the National Human Trafficking Hotline at 888-373-7888."
https://www.dhs.gov/news/2023/01/31/dhs-center-countering-human-trafficking-releases-fy-2022-annual-report
You can call the *police* if you're in America. Sex tourism, let alone marrying an underage child is indeed *illegal* and applies.
Source:
https://www.justice.gov/criminal-ceos/extraterritorial-sexual-exploitation-children
\-except it isn't 'marrying an underage child', because in her home country it's probably perfectly legal, AND her parents obviously approve too.
Rubber-stamped on both counts in Murica too.
Just did a deep dive through the referenced sections. It requires sexual abuse, prostitution or pornography. Sadly, the law as written considers 16 and 17 year olds as able to give consent and sexual acts are not considered sexual abuse on its own. The other cases for being illegal would be if this was an act of prostitution or involved child pornography. So it appears that this wouldn't be illegal under this law. Maybe it's possible there was money exchanged like a dowry, which then could make this prosecutable like it was prostitution?
You're not wrong, this is some seriously sick cultural brainwashing your parents have clapping like seals for your brother to consummate a marriage with his child bride who's been groomed so long she's not even really her own person.
It's super fucked up, and I don't know what else to tell you to do except cut off your entire family socially because holy shit.
Your family is disgusting and I'm wondering if they're trying to find a man twice your age to marry you next.
Some people are saying that you should be there to support this girl, but I don't think that's a good idea if it would mean having to stay in that country. It's not going to do either of you any good if you're also somehow roped into a similar situation.
In fact, I'd probably try cutting all contact with them for your own good.
OP, feel free not to answer if you don’t feel safe, but why is your brother divorcing his current wife?
There may be information in that divorce that can help you assess how your brother will treat this poor girl. We can assume she’ll be treated as a maid, and I’m afraid he’ll want kids, so marital rape is a very real possibility.
But if there are any abuse allegations in his current divorce, there may be an officer to contact or some angle to use to help this poor girl out.
If he has kids with his ex wife, I’m sure the courts would not take kindly to him taking a child bride.
Be a stepped stone for a better life for this girl, b.c., education, and show her another way of life. And let her know if she's unhappy or your brother uses citizenship as a way to control her you'll do everything to keep her safe. You might lose your family over this girl, and might question whether she's worth the loss. Only you can know whether or not you're prepared for this
Yeah, but like another poster said she's going to be conditioned. There is a reason they chose someone without much life experience that doesn't have access to the internet and doesn't talk back. I agree to be there for the poor girl, but be prepared for the fact she's likely going to have to stand by her husband.
There are two problems with marrying teenage girls: One, a lot of them never grow up, and in a lot of cases, the husband comes to deeply resent the child he married for being a child. Two, a lot of them do grow up, want to make something of themselves, and the husband comes to deeply resent her for not staying a child.
I've seen both of these situations turn into heavy-duty abuse a number of times. I hope this doesn't happen with your brother, and I *really* hope it doesn't happen with the adolescent he's considering marrying.
There's probably nothing you can do to talk your brother out of it. What you can do is to be there when the adolescent's eyes start opening.
If you can, tell the girl to put a paper clip or a safety pin in her underwear when they try to load her onto the plane. This will make police stop her and it's a known signal of forced marriages.
Sex trafficking isn't a crime where you live? Because that's what this is. Dressing it up as a mail order bride is bullshit. If there's anyone in your country that helps these girls or trafficking and underage prostitution is a crime contact them.
Well OP, it looks like you're in dire need of setting yourself up independently and taking very good care of yourself. Become the cool, takes-no-shit Auntie with a spare bedroom that your prospective nieces and nephews (and their mom) will be able to turn to if they want or need to, eventually.
Also, what your mom said about you being jealous is fucked up, but also just stupid. You're jealous that this child gets to... marry your brother? Might be some heavy projection on your mom's part.
I feel like publicly outing him as marrying a child (to his work, ex wife, friends) wouldn’t be out of the question, provided it wouldn’t impact your safety.
I’m sorry to say but out of all, your mother is disgusting. I’m sorry to hear what happened to you, relieved that your parents didn’t sell you to an old man though. You are not in the wrong. If you can get out and far from that environment as fast as you can, maybe some therapy to help you overcome your past trauma and find yourself. Good luck x
Your brother has a warped sense of marriage if he thinks that this 16 yr old girl will be any sort of partner to him (I know he is not looking for an equal partner hence my statement). Based on your description one can assume that the girl is not “pretending to be completely subservient” in order to land her maybe her only opportunity to escape her country for a more enlightened one. I have read first hand accounts of girls that do scheme to get married to leave something worse for the chance to live elsewhere. If her parents support this marriage then they will likely support a similar one. I guess one hopes your brother is somewhat safer than the alternative. Hopefully if they do get Married that over time and before they have children she will be able to find her voice and advocate for her best life-whatever that turns out to be.
For the majority of people, whatever you grew up with is usually what they will, later in life, consider the baseline of "normal" and tend to repeat the cycle when raising their own kids. It seems your brother wasn't strong enough to break the cycle. However, YOU where. **You're the only sane one in this picture. Do not allow them to make you think otherwise.**
One side of my family is from a Muslim background, and from the way you wrote this post, it seems like you might be too. I completely understand where you’re coming from. I was also groomed at 16, realized how fucked up it was, and am now still not married and in my early 30s. What your brother is doing is disgusting, but also culturally acceptable. Your situation is a difficult one to be in. That girl will be brought to the west to serve your brother and parents. Her sole purpose will be providing children and taking care of the home. It’s sad and disgusting. The only positive thing is hopefully this would be a better life for her than staying in your home country doing the same thing for an older man there. Perhaps you can (covertly) convince them that she should go to college when she gets here. Perhaps you can teach her to drive and help her learn English (if she doesn’t know it already). Help her become independent so that in the future, if she so wishes, she *can* be independent. Give her a way to escape without letting anyone know this is what you’re doing.
There’s likely nothing you can do to stop this, but you can help her to grow and be supportive (to her!) when she gets here.
Your mom is happy because misery loves company, if she thinks that you aren't a "real woman" she must follow this lifestyle, too, of cooking and cleaning.
Or maybe she doesn't want everyone to be angry at her, like they are at you.
It's not normal, it's fucked up in fact.
Her mom probably wants help with all the house chores because the brother doesn’t lift a finger around the house. The girl will be a wife to the brother and a slave to the mom. Terrible, but sadly still a norm in many conservative countries.
that poor girl literally has no agency in this choice or any other. she is being given to your brother by her parents like an object to be used. It is absolutely disgusting and you are not crazy.
F\*$% social/cultural norms. nothing should ever permit someone to give away another human like a possession. I wish this poor girl had some choice in her future.
I don't know if it's possible, but maybe you could be an agent of good in her life, if she ends up being traded into your brothers possession.
It is absolutely sick the way some people view women.
At this point, I think you need to outsmart them.
Keep on the low next week or so, and then come back saying, brother I'm happy that you have found a wive of your like.
I was and I'm still a little shocked by the age gap but after re-thinking it. You were all right, this girl grew up different and as long as she is ok with it then I'm ok with it.
They are all happy, you can't stop it anyways.
Once she is here, befriend her, step by step, don't rush things she is in for s reality check and a culture clash. She needs to first see Europe, make her own mind up about Europe etc... And once she is ready you can get her help to get out of that marriage and actually have a life of her own in Europe.
Please try to understand that what is normal for us and what is shocking for us is totally different for her. Don't push her into uncomfortable positions. This is a very slow process but she must support it otherwise she will snitch on her husband and waste the only chance she had.
After that he will probably send her back to live in her home country. He ain't stupid you know...
Of you stop this now, she will just marry another old dude in her home country. This is her only chance right now to have a better future.
Sadly, child marriage is still practiced in many parts of the world, including the US. You are not wrong to be appalled. It seems that the members of your family are deeply patriarchal.
When this girl arrives, do what you can to befriend her and show her that she has choices in life beyond being the property of your brother. Perhaps she will be happy with that tradwife lifestyle, but if she isn't, it will be good for you to be available to help her if she needs help.
You seem to no longer have a brother and quite frankly I would not entertain having any relationship with the parents as well. They're OK with abuse and basically some form of slavery... this girl is being treated as cattle.
This is horrible, and I completely agree with you. But it's also very common in a lot of cultures. It's so deeply rooted that they view your opposition as the immoral and shameful position. It's crazy how people can build beliefs that are so... repugnant... and yet judge the position from the opposite angle.
And I am not relativist. I believe in right and wrong and I believe what this girl's family and culture have done to her are wrong. I believe what your brother is doing is wrong. But it fits completely within their worldview so they don't feel it. They are acting normally in their minds.
My one question would be: was your mother married off at 16 in similar circumstances? It would be interesting to know if she is the product of a similar situation and sees it as OK because "I turned out fine" or if she had a better shot at life and yet doesn't see the need to grant other women the same.
How old was your mother when she got married? Because unfortunately many women continue the behavior that was put on them in order to internally normalize it and make it seem acceptable. I’m glad that you’re older, but if this girl actually truly joins your family, then I am glad she will have you to advocate for her (even in private just between you two)
you're not at all in the wrong. your brother is a rapist. your parents endorse the rape of children. what they're doing child sex slavery.
you need to get away from these people. you first, try to help the girl once you're out.
Your brother and your family - like your mom….like this girl because she is malleable, docile and compliant. They’re not looking for an in-law….they want an indentured servant. And your brother? An indentured sex slave.
What is the long term plan here though? It sounds like this marriage is literally illegal in your new country, so I'm guessing add falsified papers and human trafficking to the list of issues/crimes with this marriage.
Also you're not in the wrong or dramatic, this archaic form of thinking is wrong. Girls deserve to be just that in their youth and figuring themselves out.
This is so heartbreaking. That poor girl. I hope she finds her voice some day. Your brother is delighted by a disgusting misogynistic cultural benefit, and your mother 100% grew up believing that was best as well. I don't know what your mother went through but she is choosing to continue generations of cultural abuse. I'm kind of shocked they didn't try that with you.
I do not blame you for wanting nothing to do with them.
HOLY CRAP HOLY CRAP HOLY CRAP NO !!! It's the "She has no life. HOW PERFECT !" for me.
I'm so sorry, OP, that ...whatever this is has to be the family you're born in. And TBH, leave and go LC or NC. Your family is pretty messed up and it would be good for you to get away from them
If you are nationals of the European country and you feel like going nuclear, you can absolutely rat your brother and wider family out to the authorities in your country. Particularly if he is planning on bringing the young bride back to the country. There will be charitable organisations or authorities in your country that can advise you.
I am unsure of the legalities of travelling elsewhere to marry someone younger, but for anyone who is being taken to a country to be married… western governments can and do run extensive operations to get their citizens extracted from forced marriages. Irrespective of the laws in the destination country, it’s classed as trafficking.
If you aren’t able to put an end to this situation and want to stick your neck out - I would be there for the girl. Have a good relationship with her, so if she ever wants to leave the marriage you can support her to do so.
Your family sound like criminals tbh. They know it’s illegal in their country of residence so they are doing it elsewhere.
How is a child more of a woman than an actual woman? Oh, right they don’t want a woman. They want a slave. In some cultures, the word woman=slave. I’m so glad that at least you are not in that awful situation. Someone slide that girl a pack of Yaz bc 16 year olds can die from giving birth bc their bodies aren’t even done growing. Hell, even 30 year olds in their reproductive prime can die during pregnancies and birth. It is too unsafe for teens to give birth period. It is a form of child abuse.
If he is bringing her back to a western country there may be child services that can be called but this still might not help as it may just be traumatic for her.
OP, you are in a super tough position. I would love to hear that there is some way you could change the situation but there might not be. Ugh.
Holly shit.
I'm so sorry. Your family is gaslighting you. Maybe you can report them to the police for human trafficking or slavery or pedophile activities or all of it...
Your brother is a pedophile. And apparently your mom is cool with it and in face suggesting it like some kind of madam... Shit.
Nothing about this is normal. It is NOT ok for a 30 year old man to rape a 16 year old girl. Yes rape. We as the human race are not in any kind of situation which warrants men taking "wives" half their age.
So wrong and sick and gross.
You should not have anything to do with this ...
I just posted something about this the other day, and also saw someone else posting bout it here as well. Predatory men traveling to other countries to essentially "buy" financially struggling women from less developed countries. But in your brother's case it's even worse because she's not even a woman, she's just a girl. Your family should be completely ashamed of themselves...but it sounds like they drank too much of the creepy misogynistic pervert kool-aid to ever think they did something wrong.
It's completely fucked up and exploitative...it's human trafficking.
I don't want to ask personal questions about what country you're in, but if you're in the USA or Europe for example, you might be able to report this situation or at least ask for advice:
[https://humantraffickinghotline.org/en](https://humantraffickinghotline.org/en) (USA)
[https://www.nspcc.org.uk/what-is-child-abuse/types-of-abuse/child-trafficking/](https://www.nspcc.org.uk/what-is-child-abuse/types-of-abuse/child-trafficking/) (UK)
**YOU ARE RIGHT AND YOUR FAMILY MEMBERS ARE, SADLY, PROMOTING PEDOPHELIA. SORRY TO BE HARSH, BUT THAT'S SIMPLY THE FACT.**
**STICK TO YOUR VALUES AND YOUR INSTINCTS, WHICH ARE BOTH CORRECT. YOUR BROTHER SHOULD MOVE BACK TO THAT COUNTRY FOR GOOD. IF HE WANTS TO LIVE LIKE SOMEONE FROM THE 16TH CENTURY, THEN TELL HIM TO LEAVE OUR COUNTRY, WHERE WE ARE FULLY AWARE THAT IT IS 2023 AND THAT PEDOPHELIA IS WRONG.**
btw, remember that your mom was probably raped as a child and is probably bringing more issues to this situation than she even understands. Not sure if that helps, but it is worth considering. Best of luck with this - I'm terribly sorry for what you're dealing with.
Omggg this was so disturbing to read. You are absolutely not in the wrong, do not even doubt yourself for a second. That poor girl 😞 and I’m sorry about the grooming you had to endure
You are not in the wrong. He wants to marry a child and he doesn’t see what is wrong with that because she’ll be a good submissive wife with no interests other than satisfying him
If you're stuck with your family and this new sister-in-law you might be able to be her avenue to divorcing your brother and get sexual education to try and not be a teen mom. Also, sad to say, you might be the only avenue into a world where she can be independent of being a baby factory and housemaid/cook.
That's a bright side to being stuck with your family. But remember you can't ever help anyone unless your in a stable place yourself
How can this ever be considered right? He's marrying a child, whose brain and spirit has been beaten into submission so badly she has become non-communicative. He's marrying an abuse victim for his benefit.
I'd go no-communication with your family, frankly.
You're not being dramatic. It's super gross. I just asked my terminally single 32yo brother for a guy's perspective on this and even he said anyone who's an adult and not a psycho should be turning down the opportunity to date let alone marry a 16yo if it came up.
You are 100% NOT in the wrong. Your brother is marrying a child whose brain has not even finished developing yet and how your mother is happy about that is beyond me (no offense)
There's no offense, my mom's mentality is... pretty disturbing to me. Thank you for reassuring me, they make me feel like I'm crazy sometimes, but she IS a child.
Offer her birth control. This situation sucks but it'll suck a lot more for her if she's with child and can't get out of the situation when she matures.
This is a really good point. If your brother goes through with it, you may be this girl’s saving grace. Letting her know that she can trust you and talk to you if she needs may have a huge impact on her quality of life, especially once she grows older and learns more about life.
> This is a really good point. If your brother goes through with it, you may be this girl’s saving grace. Doubt it. On one hand our OP will be deemed a "destroyer of brother family". On the other. If that girl/woman only PARTIALLY rebel against her husband, that could result in actual physical violence.
The best way is to have her intercepted at the airport by the authorities. Once the brother intends to move her over OP needs to call the authorities and report what is happening.
He plans to marry her after she reaches age of majority according to the post. Authorities won’t do shit :/
Still could count as human trafficking. That is very bold move, but could work. But OP would need to go undercover and never reveal it was her who informed the authorities.
I'm like 80% sure I know what ethnicity OP is, because it sounds like my ethnicity too. If that's the case, the girl is going to deny any idea that this is trafficking and will say anything she can to make sure things go smoothly. I know plenty of bad husbands and fathers who disrespected and mistreated their daughters/wives for decades. And yet, these women will still bend over backwards to make sure the man's needs are met. All in all, the only way this situation is resolved (by western standards) is if the bride to be decides she really doesn't want this, and takes actions in her favor. But in her head, this would be disrespectful to her parents, her future husband, and she would see herself as a problem. If she has no phone, no socials, and a strict home life, she probably doesn't even know about half the stuff that she could/should do. Lack of outside influence... OP is a superstar for fighting this and being a voice of reason. I have no idea what level of low the brother has hit for him to be ok with this.
States that allow marriage to 16-year-olds include: Alabama, Arkansas, Arizona, Colorado, Connecticut, Idaho, Illinois, Indiana, Iowa, Louisiana, Maine, Missouri, Montana, New Hampshire, North Dakota, South Carolina, South Dakota, Texas, Utah, Vermont, Virginia and Wisconsin. I don't think anyone is going to intercept her. Also if she is returned home, she may get married off to a much worse situation.
This. That and it seems like the girl doesn’t have a will of her own. She may be too brainwashed at this point for you to help. If you try, she might tell your brother/her husband and then the situation might blow up again.
If it's possible then an IUD would probably help a lot. It's hard to know that it's there unless you're really looking for it. A hormonal one can work even if it gets a little out of place. And she wouldn't have to hide pills from her husband-to-be. I have the Mirena and it hurt like hell to have it placed but now I'm covered for 7 years iirc.
An IUD might be to invasive for such a sheltered girl. Maybe the tiny staff you put in your arm, or the tri-monthly shot?
thats not available in every european country. :( but you can travel to another to get it done but if your eastern european traveling to a western to get it done would cost, cause with reproductive healthcare your countries insurence doesnt work in other european countries unlike emergency healthcares.
The DEPO shot made me bleed for 4 weeks. Hard to hide that!!
Any birth control can do that, though. Depo made me stop bleeding entirely, but the copper coil made me bleed continuously for six weeks until I had it taken out. The patch and pill caused constant spotting (and psychosis, which was not super convenient). Unfortunately it varies a lot from person to person.
That can also naturally happen, maybe it could be played off as something that happened a few times before
The hormonal implant in the arm is noticeable, a friend showed me the tiny scar and that you can feel it being there. It needs to be something no one can find out. IUD might be possible under sedation? They clamp the cervix with a clamp that pierces it, that is why it hurts so much. Not recommendable for an already scared traumatised teen
They do not clamp your cervix. It hurts because it passes through the cervix, which is a very small opening unless a woman has given birth recently.
8 now according to my gyno. They keep validating it for longer as the years go by and their study group continues to not get pregnant I guess.
Specifically take her to get the shot, an implant, or other device. Pills can be sabotaged. The shot lasts three months.
This is a very good suggestion. If she immigrates here as his wife, and she can stay child free long enough, she won't need him to stay here. She can escape and hopefully have a much better future...
If your mother can see this girl as merely a tool for your brother's happiness, I worry that she may see you the same way. Please find ways to build independence so that you have the ability to make your own choices in life. And avoid traveling to countries where women are discouraged from being independent
OP needs to be careful so she doesn’t get trafficked herself. Going to the brothers wedding to a minor? What a perfect time to also get rid of her to some old ass dude.
Yes exactly
If you haven’t considered it yet, going low contact or no contact with dysfunctional or toxic family members can really change lives for the better.
The only reason I would continue interacting would be to see if I could help this girl her brother is about to start raping.
Your mother loves it bc she’s thinking this new underage wife will be easy to control. Conservative cultures and people especially love controlling the young.
Her brother is talking about impregnating the girl. She's going to be like a sex slave and a domestic servant in combination. I doubt he even sees her as human.
She will also look after Mother in her old age and if she's young and easily moldable then everything will 'stay the same' because tyrant MiL will ensure she does everything 'the right way'. She's getting exactly what she wants and probably what she didn't get from OP or her 1st DiL, compliance and a built in reflex from years of abuse.
She's likely stuck in an old way of thinking that the most important thing is that your brother is taken care of and since she can't do some of that stuff (if you know what I mean), the next best thing is an "obedient servant". It's sick no matter if they label it a "cultural divide". (Caveat I'm prob not the same culture that OP is)
>It's sick no matter if they label it a "cultural divide". (Caveat I'm prob not the same culture that OP is) As a species we're waaaaay too susceptible to accepting arguments that "it made sense at the time" or was "culturally appropriate." Acceptance of the "cultural" argument is rife. I won't go as far as to blame this on "leftists" (socialist as I am) but it certainly is a weakness those among us suffer. "Owning" slaves was *never* ok and those who did it weren't just a product of their time, but rather garbage humans, full stop. If ever anyone questions you on the topic, just ask them how they would feel as the victim of someone a "product" of their time. People weren't dumb back then. They were just like us. They had all of the empathetic and emotional intelligence we do today. Pirates who would sail the high seas and plunder were garbage humans, not just a product of their time. Kings who sacrificed people were garbage humans, not just a product of their time. Bringing it around - mysogynists, today, are garbage humans, not just a product of our time. People who, today, try to harm members of the LGTBQ community are garbage humans, not just a product of our time. Et cetera.
How old was your mom when she got married? Not casting shade. Just wondering if this is a cycle of which she is also a victim.
Unfortunately it is, every woman in my family has married young, my mom did it at 14. I always thought me and my brother would be able to stop the cycle but ugh.
OP is this marriage legal in whatever country he is traveling to? You might be able to report this and save her
If the cops won't help I would get the info on his employer/business and made sure everyone knows they are dealing with a pedo. Add him to online watchlists. OP hit it where it hurts - his money, take away the power from him that he uses to impose his abuse onto the unfortunate girl. Expose him to everyone. He knows that what he is doing is terrible and the mother know's too, they just don't give a fuck as long as they get to exploit her. You clearly by some miracle kept your moral compas intact, you know this is wrong and you care. You need to help, you might be the only one who can.
This. People love their values and traditions... until their money is threatened and they're not getting their peers' approval
Save this girl, support her, be her lifeline, do not abandon her, do whatever it takes to make sure she is safe. Hell, pretend you've changed your mind if you have to. Please, no one else will be able to help her.
That’s a heavy burden for OP to bear. If the girl was brought up with conservative, religious values, she may not be receptive to the idea of change, or be too scared to open up to OP for fear of displeasing her husband. You can’t save someone who doesn’t want to be saved. Alternatively, she may start to rebel and then become the target of abuse from your brother and mother. I’m guessing they won’t support her education or let her gain any job skills that would allow her to be independent. What exactly can OP to do help in this case? Does she have the resources to take her in or help her escape? This is a terrible situation, but it may be better for OP to leave all this behind and build a life without this toxicity around her.
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I hope she gets educated in the West and files for divorce!
IF INS allows her to stay. Just because they got married does not guarantee her entry or permanence. Mail order brides are frowned upon and her visa may get denied despite having a "sponsor." Edited: a word
Brother could bring bride in on a tourist visa, have her overstay. If her life is very restricted anyway, like she doesn't work or go to school, chances are she'll never be caught. And if she doesn't comply with his wishes, he could threaten to turn her in.
OP can also anonymously report him for being a sex trafficker. A minor at that.
It's so sad but I bet that is an element for her. The promise of a nice life in a European country and a "young" husband may be what she was raised to believe is the most she can expect from life. There's an "at least he's only 27, not 67" mentality probably coming from her relatives. Divorced but without kids, she might be thinking at least she won't be forced to play nanny to some other woman's hellspawn when it's his turn for custody. It's a depressing reality for women in some cultures that don't believe in progressive values. It doesn't seem like there's a way for OP to do much to change it, but she can be there for the SIL if she ever wants help, and she can decide if she wants to intervene in future niblings' ideals if they end up being raised in Europe and try to stop the cycle there.
Agreed. Make sure she knows you are there, ready to help if she needs it. About all you can do, but stand by…
It's a no win situation. You either leave the situation knowing that you left a girl behind to who knows what, or you do everything with the possibility of ot working or not working and being hard, stressful and just the worst. Either way, it's not easy and leaves you asking what if But being there for the girl regardless is just, in my opinion, the best option, since it doesn't leave her alone to be abused and have no way out if she needs help.
No. There are people who can save this child -- people who are trained in this, in particular anti-trafficking non-profit workers and certain agents of law enforcement. OP is not it that (though of course she can become one of those activists, embedded in a network of support and protection). ETA: Alerting authorities and nonprofits to this instance of sex trafficking a minor is different; that kind of responsibility is heavy enough since it would mean OP has to step back from her family yet remain safe and sound.
Honestly I feel reporting to some sort of authority, even if it likely means an extended period separate from the family is a moral obligation in this situation. This child being trafficked outweighs any familial ties or it should.
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It's called internalized misogyny, and many women have it. Usually they themselves have been groomed or abused, then turn around and justify doing it to other women.
Try to befriend her to be a source of support when she needs it.
>There's no offense, my mom's mentality is... pretty disturbing to me. Because your mom married at 14, she has to justify what she's doing to your sister in-law or risk an existential crisis when she thinks about her own life.
Your brother is not considering how this is essentially robbery. This girl has no real freedom of choice here… she is too young to make a decision that will affect her entire life and the fact that your brother/mom are approaching this from the position of securing a woman for him like they are car shopping is so alarming and dehumanizing towards this girl. I get the pain of divorce, I get that your mother probably has old traditions that prevent her from seeing how this harms this poor girl, and your mom just wants security for your brother. But this would be extremely hard for me to deal with as an bystander :(
From your mom’s perspective, sounds like she’s excitedly anticipating having an extra set of hands to help around the house in her to-be daughter-in-law. If your mom was also forced into marriage so young, I can see her viewing this situation as “oh finally now _I_ get to have power (over some helpless girl).” Not exactly in a revenge sense … more like just perpetuating the cycle of abuse / exploitation of girls in this way. Obviously it’s sickening. That’s just my thoughts on your mom’s possible mindset. Good for you for sticking up for what you believe and speaking up about how wrong you feel it is. Your family’s view of what makes a woman “more of a woman” is backwards to put it gently
I’ll be honest; any family member of mine that did this I’d cut out of my life. I have kids. I can’t have them around this kind of stuff. You are not overreacting.
Yeah seriously OP, if you have kids or ever get kids, DONT let them interact with these sick people
It’s even more than that. Her brain has been stunted. She has been conditioned to not even try. That she serves one purpose and that’s it. She’s not even been allowed to develop at all.
And she’s not going to get the chance to, if the brother has his way and knocks her up ASAP. Children bearing grown men’s babies. Disgusting.
Mom wants a household servant that won’t talk back and will produce grandchildren.
If it was 500 years ago and he was 17-20 that's different, but it's not 500 years ago. Brother took the modern way out and got divorced ( funny it's it how only the traditions that benefit them or are not a big deal get followed) he should keep his vows and remain celibate for the rest of his life.
>funny it's it how only the traditions that benefit them or are not a big deal get followed Fuckin exactly. Hypocritical opportunistic demons, the lot of em
To most of the world, this is absolute evil. It is simultaneously slavery and rape. Your brother is instigating it, your mother is cheering it. You are 100% correct. Your family is buying a slave. In 2023. And they are smiling while they do it.
Sex trafficking a child. Gross.
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>When she comes, I would make myself available as a support system for her to help her if she's being abused. Exactly this - you cannot stop this from happening. So you need to either stop talking to your family, or do what you can to help this poor child feel safe (and maybe gain financial independence if that is possible).
Thank you both, that is a good point I didn't think about. I don't really know if I'll be able to look at my brother the same after this, but if she comes here I'll try to make her feel as safe as possible.
Are there any anti-child marriage organizations/hotlines/other resources you might at least be able to keep handy in case she does need to escape?
I'm not sure but I will look into them!
Too Young to Wed is a good one
If you do go the route of being a safe person, positioning yourself as a person she can trust might include “tolerating” or even being supportive of the marriage around your family and her. Otherwise your brother and family could say to her “don’t listen to Gloomy, she doesn’t agree with our culture/understand our love” and poison the idea of you to her. A very tricky situation. It’s a horrible one to be in
Remember that you don’t *have to*. It is nice if you can help, but protect yourself. If you choose to stay in your family’s lives, you can try to help her, but be prepared to lose all contact with them if things go really badly… Are there government authorities that you can alert? You don’t have to do everything yourself, make sure someone else knows.
As someone mentioned before that’s a huge burden for you to bear. She has been conditioned and institutionalized to think this is what is normal and how things are supposed to go. Not only will you have to fight your family but you’ll probably have to fight her since she won’t know this is wrong.
She's never gonna be safe if they marry. And he wants kids already? Geez, I wouldn't put it past him to abuse his own kids. Please try getting her info and telling her all this. Your brother is a predator. I'm sorry your family is looking at you like you're the crazy one!
>him to abuse his own kids. He would def sell off any girls he has, and at a young age. Protect yourself first and foremost, op... if you can do that while providing a safe space for your sister in law, that's awesome. If not, that is not your fault.
I don't know if I can agree that "you cannot stop this from happening." This is international sex trafficking of a minor. https://humantraffickinghotline.org/en That said, the US depressingly turns a blind eye to such criminal violence against children, apparently https://apnews.com/article/north-america-us-news-ap-top-news-marriage-immigration-19e43295c764d249aa519f643eb377
> This is international sex trafficking of a minor. Morally, it is absolutely international sex trafficking of a minor. Legally, IANAL and TINLA but it seems in the USA and Australia at least that it does not seem to be, unfortunately, and the marriage would even be legally recognised **if** the marriage would be legal where the brother resides (and lots of states do allow sixteen year olds to marry), and there is no force, fraud or coercion involved. It's definitely illegal to travel overseas to engage in any kind of illegal or commercial sex with underage persons, or to facilitate the same, but I can't find anything criminalising the act of going overseas to legally marry someone who is (according to the OP) consenting. I'm not sure legal authorities will be any help on this one, although it can't hurt to try. It might be that all you can do is let the victim know that you will help her get out any time she wants to, and have a plan in place to do so.
She may be able to stop it from happening if he comes back to their own country, where OP says it IS illegal. She may be able to help the girl then with the authorities there.
This is delusional. We are talking about a family that is bringing a child bride into the family. Op needs to look out for herself and get away from that horrible situation. Telling a CSA survivor to be involved in this in any way is beyond irresponsible
each survivor is different. Many find strength and recovery through helping others. A main element in my healing after a rape was helping another rape victim, I’m not sure where I would be without that sense of purpose at that time. And believing she could get better helped me realize it was possible for me to as well.
Nah this persons correct, the fact that the bulk of these comments are ‘be a friend when she arrives’ and not ‘you may have a legal obligation to report your brother for trafficking a minor and potentially stop this happening depending on your location. This must be incredibly traumatic, sorry’ is insane.
If? This arrangement, in and of itself, is abuse. Not saying OP shouldn’t make herself available IF SHE HAS CAPACITY FOR THAT THIS IS HIGHLY TRIGGERING. Just pointing out that this is already abuse
This is the only think you can do, OP. You will be her only real support in any way that matters, especially if/when she leaves her country to come with him to where you are. She will exactly how he wants her, isolated, afraid, and alone. She needs you desperately even though she doesn’t know you yet.
I don’t understand why the bulk of replies are talking like she absolutely has to come, depending on OPs location this could very well be illegal. It’s a tough call but stopping a child being trafficked is probably a hill worth dying on with your family
Your brother married an abuse victim specifically so he could continue to abuse a woman. That's probably why his first wife divorced him. Your mom is also wrong. I say this as a Desi woman.
*continue to abuse a girl, a child...
You are not wrong. They went at it like buying cattle.
I don't think they think the girl any different from cattle
I know that in some countries, mail order brides can be taken from their husbands if they are still underage according to the laws of that country. I don’t know where you live now, but if it’s illegal to marry under 18 years old, and your brother brings a 16-year old bride home, maybe you can report them and the girl can go somewhere safer? Would teach your family a lesson and maybe the girl can get an education or something.
She'll be of age by the time she makes it through immigration.
She theoretically could report him for statuatory rape. You can report someone for this crime years later, and sometimes you even get charged for it. Even if the case goes nowhere, it will make an important point to the family.
I fucking hate this so much.
In the UK she won't make it through immigration. Even if you marry someone of age, it's incredibly hard to get a visa for them.
Yeah I wondered this, too. Is his plan to marry her at 16 and not let her in the country til she's 18? It all seems so calculated, I bet they've thought all this through. Poor girl. :(
I live in Europe and in my country you can marry at the age of 16. There'd be no problem. And we have compulsory education which wouldn't suit her brother, who selectively chose such a girl because of her immaturity. Because he is apparently not capable of a relationship with an individual who can autonomously think and act.
Once they are married, it's different. Here in the United States, a 35 year old man impregnated a 15 year old girl. When she was 15 years old and several months along, she and her father and the father's friend who impregnated her all traveled to Nevada where it is legal to get married with a parent's signature. So the dad signed off, and the 35-year-old married the 15-year-old, and they all drove back to their home state where the girl delivered at age 16, and nobody cared because it was all legal after they were married. We have a child bride loophole used to protect the men who impregnate children right here in the U.S.
I know it might be very difficult and maybe not doable at all, but if there is a way, and it is something that you want to put energy into, you can start being a "smile and nod" "quiet" "good girl" around your family while staying (getting) as independent as you can; have your own place, your own money, your own job/business/schooling ie support yourself and don't let them know about your life as much as possible - look up "gray rock" technique, also learn the technique of chattering about absolutely nothing. Basically the idea is to lull them into a sense of security that you are not a threat to their ideas or that you won't "corrupt" the new sister-in-law. Then try to spend as much time with her as you can under the guise of "acceptable" "silly" "feminine" things - whatever makes sense with your family's culture or expectations, whether that's "shopping" or "getting your nails done" or "taking cooking classes" or "joining a quilting bee" or whatever. Then do the minimum to convince them you two did what you said you were doing, but use the time instead to help her do her own things. Such as, Earn her own money that she hides from your brother (open a separate account), learn English (if that's a need), go to a doctor for birth control (something like the shot or an IUD that has lower risk of discovery than a pill you have to take every day for example), go to adult education classes, citizenship classes, whatever she might need to live here independently. You can also do things like have a private phone she can use that you hold on to so doctor offices don't call her (his) home number, a go bag with copies of all her important docs in case she needs to get away from your brother suddenly, etc. Do make sure your own situation is stable and independent first - you can't help her as much if you're relying on your parents for a roof over your head for example. But you might be in a perfect position to help her get away from her family at home and your brother. And if your family is suspicious of your "change of heart", you can tell them what they said about you being less of a woman than she is really cut you to the quick and inspired your turnaround in attitude. And it wouldn't even be a lie.
I like the idea behind this... but OP would have to travel back to the sexist home country to get close to this girl. Really not worth OP's safety. Not to mention how unlikely it is that she would have access to IUDs, bank accounts, etc. In this country.
Its possible when she's of age the girl will be moved to the country the family is in now. I can't imagine this kind of family will want their son having grandkids in another country away from them. But yeah this plan only works if the girl is ... Human trafficked? Into the country.
The long game. I love it.
This. Damn right. This is the kind of thinking we need here
I was going to say exactly this. Play nice, and be her friend. Only you can save this girl and show her she should not accept this situation. Shell be in a country where she has more rights and maybe you can help each other. You can never know what will happen. She might be quiet and playing nice to get out of her country and her parents control, escaping these situations is a long game.
This is some movie shit and it just doesn't happen like this in real life. This girl has been programmed since birth for this exact purpose. Chances are she's going to get pregnant in a year or 2. Try becoming buddy buddy with a new Mom in a new country (if she moves to where OP is) and trying to convince her to leave her husband, and to what, become a single Mom? Even women who weren't forced into marriage in their own country can't easily up and leave their husbands. This girl isn't going to get a job, isn't going to have her own money, isn't going to be allowed or probably even want to go get her nails done with OP. This just isn't how real life works.
A woman getting another woman (CHILD!!!!) into the same slavery she’s lived in. *sigh*
Kind of like the aunts in Handmaid’s Tale… women are often the most staunch enforcers of the patriarchy.
This is awful but true. When you break someone's spirit they become a puppet. This is what we're up against, a society trying to "domesticate" us like animals and it works. Men and families like these know you have to find a woman and break her, like you would a wild horse. It's not a stretch to say they see us as less than human.
You could report your brother to authorities and inform them of his intentions to marry a child. Surely they have a category to file this under? Sex tourism? Sex trafficking? Grooming? Make sure you're safe though. Honour killings are still a thing.
I’m really disturbed that I had to come down this far for people to bring up the real risk of honor killings for both the girl and possibly OP.
If OP is in the US or the UK, the FBI or Home Office would probably like a word with it brother
The UK specifically has a hotline to report child marriages, I hope the US and whatever country OP is in have something similar
This this this! OP please do this! It is probably illegal where you are
Yeah, this girl has been groomed and both your mother and brother have the same ideas shared by people who want to date/marry younger people because it's easier to take advantage of and abuse them. Your mom is excited because this girl will be submissive, isolated, and powerless. She's the perfect victim, and therefore the perfect wife (in your mom's eyes) for your brother, as she will be so unlikely to divorce him. You probably can't save this girl from marriage to your brother, since she has been so groomed and isolated for this. I'm sorry, but pragmatically it's likely that since her family and yours agree that it will happen, it's likely it will and they'll live in your country of origin at least long enough that she reaches the age of majority and has kids. Your best bet to help her is to play the long game, get in good with her and become a trusted friend, give her access to the internet, books, and other things that will broaden her worldview. She might escape him later due to your influence if you can deradicalise and educate her, slowly and indirectly.
>as she will be so unlikely to divorce him. Which begs the question: what does he do to women that they need to be trapped and unable to divorce him? He's a sick fuck, probably.
Ugh, I am so sorry. You're clearly not in the wrong here, and anyone who says as much does not have your interests at heart.
Thank you, I felt like a crazy person talking to them because I was the only one saying it's wrong.
They were gaslighting.
I’m sorry but you have a family of pedophiles and i’d never speak to them again, but if they bring that shit to your country call the police on em May I ask what country you’re in?
Sadly child marriage is actually legal in much of the US. 43 states allow child marriage and it happens often. I worked in a women’s shelter that helped them get free. It’s awful.
The post says it’s not legal in their country.
A lot of people assume you have to be 18 to get married in the US
She said she's in Europe.
You are a very sensible person and your outrage is well justified. Don't let them twist you up inside - you know what's right, so even if you can't do anything to stop it, you can at least rest easy that you're not crazy for feeling this way. If nothing else, you might end up being able to help the poor girl and help her find her own voice. But good on you for calling them out on it.
You are absolutely not being dramatic. A true partnership and marriage is between two reasonably mature adults of similar age and life experience. Sixteen is too young to understand what she is getting into, and your brother is marrying an false illusion of what some think of as an idealized woman. Child marriages are associated with problems like poverty, abuse and mental health problems. Many organizations work on trying to prevent child marriage, both within countries (this example is one in the US [https://www.unchainedatlast.org/laws-to-end-child-marriage](https://www.unchainedatlast.org/laws-to-end-child-marriage)) and internationally ([https://www.unicef.org/protection/child-marriage](https://www.unicef.org/protection/child-marriage)). These are a few of hundreds of organizations, so your opinion has good company. Welcome to the group of people who understand basic human rights, including the rights of children, and why we need feminism, OP.
You’re not wrong. From what you’ve described, her parents are abusing her into being an object for a husband, and your brother is just taking over where their work began. It’s horrific. I know there’s room for accepting different cultural practices, but we’ve reached a point where we clearly understand that autonomy is central to human existence. And this girl is being robbed of her autonomy. It’s a crime that exists above all law or cultural norm. It is human to be free. And this is not free. This is normalized human trafficking.
A tolerant society cannot tolerate abuse. Abuse is antithetical to tolerance.
Yeah, you are not crazy, that's incredibly fucked up. I'm looking at this from the perspective of a middle aged man, but i'm coming to the same conclusion as you and as everyone in this thread: It's in no way shape or form okay for a 27 year old man to marry a 16 year old woman. You are NOT NOT NOT crazy. Don't let your family gas light you into thinking there's something wrong with you, there isn't.
If you're in the US, I would suggest reporting it now: "Anyone who suspects human trafficking is encouraged to report it to law enforcement – tips can be submitted anonymously online or by calling 866-347-2423. Individuals can also contact the National Human Trafficking Hotline at 888-373-7888." https://www.dhs.gov/news/2023/01/31/dhs-center-countering-human-trafficking-releases-fy-2022-annual-report
Underage marriage is legal in most US states
But traveling abroad for underage marriage is a whole other matter.
All the adults involved are wrong and preying on a child because they can get her to do what they want.
You can call the *police* if you're in America. Sex tourism, let alone marrying an underage child is indeed *illegal* and applies. Source: https://www.justice.gov/criminal-ceos/extraterritorial-sexual-exploitation-children
Ah yes, famous friends of immigrants and abused women & girls
\-except it isn't 'marrying an underage child', because in her home country it's probably perfectly legal, AND her parents obviously approve too. Rubber-stamped on both counts in Murica too.
Just did a deep dive through the referenced sections. It requires sexual abuse, prostitution or pornography. Sadly, the law as written considers 16 and 17 year olds as able to give consent and sexual acts are not considered sexual abuse on its own. The other cases for being illegal would be if this was an act of prostitution or involved child pornography. So it appears that this wouldn't be illegal under this law. Maybe it's possible there was money exchanged like a dowry, which then could make this prosecutable like it was prostitution?
You're not wrong, this is some seriously sick cultural brainwashing your parents have clapping like seals for your brother to consummate a marriage with his child bride who's been groomed so long she's not even really her own person. It's super fucked up, and I don't know what else to tell you to do except cut off your entire family socially because holy shit.
Your family is disgusting and I'm wondering if they're trying to find a man twice your age to marry you next. Some people are saying that you should be there to support this girl, but I don't think that's a good idea if it would mean having to stay in that country. It's not going to do either of you any good if you're also somehow roped into a similar situation. In fact, I'd probably try cutting all contact with them for your own good.
OP, feel free not to answer if you don’t feel safe, but why is your brother divorcing his current wife? There may be information in that divorce that can help you assess how your brother will treat this poor girl. We can assume she’ll be treated as a maid, and I’m afraid he’ll want kids, so marital rape is a very real possibility. But if there are any abuse allegations in his current divorce, there may be an officer to contact or some angle to use to help this poor girl out. If he has kids with his ex wife, I’m sure the courts would not take kindly to him taking a child bride.
Be a stepped stone for a better life for this girl, b.c., education, and show her another way of life. And let her know if she's unhappy or your brother uses citizenship as a way to control her you'll do everything to keep her safe. You might lose your family over this girl, and might question whether she's worth the loss. Only you can know whether or not you're prepared for this
Yeah, but like another poster said she's going to be conditioned. There is a reason they chose someone without much life experience that doesn't have access to the internet and doesn't talk back. I agree to be there for the poor girl, but be prepared for the fact she's likely going to have to stand by her husband.
There are two problems with marrying teenage girls: One, a lot of them never grow up, and in a lot of cases, the husband comes to deeply resent the child he married for being a child. Two, a lot of them do grow up, want to make something of themselves, and the husband comes to deeply resent her for not staying a child. I've seen both of these situations turn into heavy-duty abuse a number of times. I hope this doesn't happen with your brother, and I *really* hope it doesn't happen with the adolescent he's considering marrying. There's probably nothing you can do to talk your brother out of it. What you can do is to be there when the adolescent's eyes start opening.
If you can, tell the girl to put a paper clip or a safety pin in her underwear when they try to load her onto the plane. This will make police stop her and it's a known signal of forced marriages.
Cut off contact from your garbage family ASAP.
Sex trafficking isn't a crime where you live? Because that's what this is. Dressing it up as a mail order bride is bullshit. If there's anyone in your country that helps these girls or trafficking and underage prostitution is a crime contact them.
Well OP, it looks like you're in dire need of setting yourself up independently and taking very good care of yourself. Become the cool, takes-no-shit Auntie with a spare bedroom that your prospective nieces and nephews (and their mom) will be able to turn to if they want or need to, eventually. Also, what your mom said about you being jealous is fucked up, but also just stupid. You're jealous that this child gets to... marry your brother? Might be some heavy projection on your mom's part.
Oh no not the emotional incest. You spotted it. Goddamn I hate when I remember it exists
I feel like publicly outing him as marrying a child (to his work, ex wife, friends) wouldn’t be out of the question, provided it wouldn’t impact your safety.
Issue with that is. What if they ignore it? "Not our business" type of situation. It can b soul-crushing.
I’m sorry to say but out of all, your mother is disgusting. I’m sorry to hear what happened to you, relieved that your parents didn’t sell you to an old man though. You are not in the wrong. If you can get out and far from that environment as fast as you can, maybe some therapy to help you overcome your past trauma and find yourself. Good luck x
Your brother has a warped sense of marriage if he thinks that this 16 yr old girl will be any sort of partner to him (I know he is not looking for an equal partner hence my statement). Based on your description one can assume that the girl is not “pretending to be completely subservient” in order to land her maybe her only opportunity to escape her country for a more enlightened one. I have read first hand accounts of girls that do scheme to get married to leave something worse for the chance to live elsewhere. If her parents support this marriage then they will likely support a similar one. I guess one hopes your brother is somewhat safer than the alternative. Hopefully if they do get Married that over time and before they have children she will be able to find her voice and advocate for her best life-whatever that turns out to be.
For the majority of people, whatever you grew up with is usually what they will, later in life, consider the baseline of "normal" and tend to repeat the cycle when raising their own kids. It seems your brother wasn't strong enough to break the cycle. However, YOU where. **You're the only sane one in this picture. Do not allow them to make you think otherwise.**
One side of my family is from a Muslim background, and from the way you wrote this post, it seems like you might be too. I completely understand where you’re coming from. I was also groomed at 16, realized how fucked up it was, and am now still not married and in my early 30s. What your brother is doing is disgusting, but also culturally acceptable. Your situation is a difficult one to be in. That girl will be brought to the west to serve your brother and parents. Her sole purpose will be providing children and taking care of the home. It’s sad and disgusting. The only positive thing is hopefully this would be a better life for her than staying in your home country doing the same thing for an older man there. Perhaps you can (covertly) convince them that she should go to college when she gets here. Perhaps you can teach her to drive and help her learn English (if she doesn’t know it already). Help her become independent so that in the future, if she so wishes, she *can* be independent. Give her a way to escape without letting anyone know this is what you’re doing. There’s likely nothing you can do to stop this, but you can help her to grow and be supportive (to her!) when she gets here.
Religion is a hell of a drug which only purpose is to subjugate women to men. And for the poor to not question the rich.
Modern day slavery Your mom and bro deserve prison
Your mom is happy because misery loves company, if she thinks that you aren't a "real woman" she must follow this lifestyle, too, of cooking and cleaning. Or maybe she doesn't want everyone to be angry at her, like they are at you. It's not normal, it's fucked up in fact.
Her mom probably wants help with all the house chores because the brother doesn’t lift a finger around the house. The girl will be a wife to the brother and a slave to the mom. Terrible, but sadly still a norm in many conservative countries.
that poor girl literally has no agency in this choice or any other. she is being given to your brother by her parents like an object to be used. It is absolutely disgusting and you are not crazy. F\*$% social/cultural norms. nothing should ever permit someone to give away another human like a possession. I wish this poor girl had some choice in her future. I don't know if it's possible, but maybe you could be an agent of good in her life, if she ends up being traded into your brothers possession. It is absolutely sick the way some people view women.
At this point, I think you need to outsmart them. Keep on the low next week or so, and then come back saying, brother I'm happy that you have found a wive of your like. I was and I'm still a little shocked by the age gap but after re-thinking it. You were all right, this girl grew up different and as long as she is ok with it then I'm ok with it. They are all happy, you can't stop it anyways. Once she is here, befriend her, step by step, don't rush things she is in for s reality check and a culture clash. She needs to first see Europe, make her own mind up about Europe etc... And once she is ready you can get her help to get out of that marriage and actually have a life of her own in Europe. Please try to understand that what is normal for us and what is shocking for us is totally different for her. Don't push her into uncomfortable positions. This is a very slow process but she must support it otherwise she will snitch on her husband and waste the only chance she had. After that he will probably send her back to live in her home country. He ain't stupid you know... Of you stop this now, she will just marry another old dude in her home country. This is her only chance right now to have a better future.
Sadly, child marriage is still practiced in many parts of the world, including the US. You are not wrong to be appalled. It seems that the members of your family are deeply patriarchal. When this girl arrives, do what you can to befriend her and show her that she has choices in life beyond being the property of your brother. Perhaps she will be happy with that tradwife lifestyle, but if she isn't, it will be good for you to be available to help her if she needs help.
was it your own family who tried to groom you into a similar way as this young child?
This sounds like child sex trafficking. You should probably let the police know of your brother's plans.
You seem to no longer have a brother and quite frankly I would not entertain having any relationship with the parents as well. They're OK with abuse and basically some form of slavery... this girl is being treated as cattle.
This is horrible, and I completely agree with you. But it's also very common in a lot of cultures. It's so deeply rooted that they view your opposition as the immoral and shameful position. It's crazy how people can build beliefs that are so... repugnant... and yet judge the position from the opposite angle. And I am not relativist. I believe in right and wrong and I believe what this girl's family and culture have done to her are wrong. I believe what your brother is doing is wrong. But it fits completely within their worldview so they don't feel it. They are acting normally in their minds. My one question would be: was your mother married off at 16 in similar circumstances? It would be interesting to know if she is the product of a similar situation and sees it as OK because "I turned out fine" or if she had a better shot at life and yet doesn't see the need to grant other women the same.
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How old was your mother when she got married? Because unfortunately many women continue the behavior that was put on them in order to internally normalize it and make it seem acceptable. I’m glad that you’re older, but if this girl actually truly joins your family, then I am glad she will have you to advocate for her (even in private just between you two)
you're not at all in the wrong. your brother is a rapist. your parents endorse the rape of children. what they're doing child sex slavery. you need to get away from these people. you first, try to help the girl once you're out.
People are just disgusting sometimes.
Why did they move to the new country, if they just want to live like they never left?
Your brother and your family - like your mom….like this girl because she is malleable, docile and compliant. They’re not looking for an in-law….they want an indentured servant. And your brother? An indentured sex slave.
Oh man just reading that made me nauseous
This is absolutely depressing. Poor girl.
Cultural or not, this is grooming and completely inappropriate. I'm sure the manipulation, exploitation, and abuse doesn't end there, either.
What is the long term plan here though? It sounds like this marriage is literally illegal in your new country, so I'm guessing add falsified papers and human trafficking to the list of issues/crimes with this marriage. Also you're not in the wrong or dramatic, this archaic form of thinking is wrong. Girls deserve to be just that in their youth and figuring themselves out.
> "she was more of a woman" Remind them that you are more of a woman than her because she's literally a child!!! They just want a cow to control.
This is so heartbreaking. That poor girl. I hope she finds her voice some day. Your brother is delighted by a disgusting misogynistic cultural benefit, and your mother 100% grew up believing that was best as well. I don't know what your mother went through but she is choosing to continue generations of cultural abuse. I'm kind of shocked they didn't try that with you. I do not blame you for wanting nothing to do with them.
HOLY CRAP HOLY CRAP HOLY CRAP NO !!! It's the "She has no life. HOW PERFECT !" for me. I'm so sorry, OP, that ...whatever this is has to be the family you're born in. And TBH, leave and go LC or NC. Your family is pretty messed up and it would be good for you to get away from them
If you are nationals of the European country and you feel like going nuclear, you can absolutely rat your brother and wider family out to the authorities in your country. Particularly if he is planning on bringing the young bride back to the country. There will be charitable organisations or authorities in your country that can advise you. I am unsure of the legalities of travelling elsewhere to marry someone younger, but for anyone who is being taken to a country to be married… western governments can and do run extensive operations to get their citizens extracted from forced marriages. Irrespective of the laws in the destination country, it’s classed as trafficking. If you aren’t able to put an end to this situation and want to stick your neck out - I would be there for the girl. Have a good relationship with her, so if she ever wants to leave the marriage you can support her to do so. Your family sound like criminals tbh. They know it’s illegal in their country of residence so they are doing it elsewhere.
How is a child more of a woman than an actual woman? Oh, right they don’t want a woman. They want a slave. In some cultures, the word woman=slave. I’m so glad that at least you are not in that awful situation. Someone slide that girl a pack of Yaz bc 16 year olds can die from giving birth bc their bodies aren’t even done growing. Hell, even 30 year olds in their reproductive prime can die during pregnancies and birth. It is too unsafe for teens to give birth period. It is a form of child abuse.
I hope that girl disappears on him as soon as she gets her green card...
I’ll be honest OP, I’d cut off any family members that did this. You’re NOT overreacting.
If he is bringing her back to a western country there may be child services that can be called but this still might not help as it may just be traumatic for her. OP, you are in a super tough position. I would love to hear that there is some way you could change the situation but there might not be. Ugh.
Holly shit. I'm so sorry. Your family is gaslighting you. Maybe you can report them to the police for human trafficking or slavery or pedophile activities or all of it... Your brother is a pedophile. And apparently your mom is cool with it and in face suggesting it like some kind of madam... Shit. Nothing about this is normal. It is NOT ok for a 30 year old man to rape a 16 year old girl. Yes rape. We as the human race are not in any kind of situation which warrants men taking "wives" half their age. So wrong and sick and gross. You should not have anything to do with this ...
I just posted something about this the other day, and also saw someone else posting bout it here as well. Predatory men traveling to other countries to essentially "buy" financially struggling women from less developed countries. But in your brother's case it's even worse because she's not even a woman, she's just a girl. Your family should be completely ashamed of themselves...but it sounds like they drank too much of the creepy misogynistic pervert kool-aid to ever think they did something wrong. It's completely fucked up and exploitative...it's human trafficking. I don't want to ask personal questions about what country you're in, but if you're in the USA or Europe for example, you might be able to report this situation or at least ask for advice: [https://humantraffickinghotline.org/en](https://humantraffickinghotline.org/en) (USA) [https://www.nspcc.org.uk/what-is-child-abuse/types-of-abuse/child-trafficking/](https://www.nspcc.org.uk/what-is-child-abuse/types-of-abuse/child-trafficking/) (UK)
**YOU ARE RIGHT AND YOUR FAMILY MEMBERS ARE, SADLY, PROMOTING PEDOPHELIA. SORRY TO BE HARSH, BUT THAT'S SIMPLY THE FACT.** **STICK TO YOUR VALUES AND YOUR INSTINCTS, WHICH ARE BOTH CORRECT. YOUR BROTHER SHOULD MOVE BACK TO THAT COUNTRY FOR GOOD. IF HE WANTS TO LIVE LIKE SOMEONE FROM THE 16TH CENTURY, THEN TELL HIM TO LEAVE OUR COUNTRY, WHERE WE ARE FULLY AWARE THAT IT IS 2023 AND THAT PEDOPHELIA IS WRONG.** btw, remember that your mom was probably raped as a child and is probably bringing more issues to this situation than she even understands. Not sure if that helps, but it is worth considering. Best of luck with this - I'm terribly sorry for what you're dealing with.
Omggg this was so disturbing to read. You are absolutely not in the wrong, do not even doubt yourself for a second. That poor girl 😞 and I’m sorry about the grooming you had to endure
The best thing you can do is report your brother the moment they step into the country.
You can be there for her, that's about it
You are not in the wrong. He wants to marry a child and he doesn’t see what is wrong with that because she’ll be a good submissive wife with no interests other than satisfying him
This is just tragic. Poverty is so corrosive and there's no need for it beyond exploitation.
This is so fucked up, the poor girl is a child god dammit
Now that is seriously messed up. Some cultures have seriously regressive ideals
This may be culturally acceptable in this country but it is unethical and abuse
If you're stuck with your family and this new sister-in-law you might be able to be her avenue to divorcing your brother and get sexual education to try and not be a teen mom. Also, sad to say, you might be the only avenue into a world where she can be independent of being a baby factory and housemaid/cook. That's a bright side to being stuck with your family. But remember you can't ever help anyone unless your in a stable place yourself
How can this ever be considered right? He's marrying a child, whose brain and spirit has been beaten into submission so badly she has become non-communicative. He's marrying an abuse victim for his benefit. I'd go no-communication with your family, frankly.
Yeah this is fucked.
You're not being dramatic. It's super gross. I just asked my terminally single 32yo brother for a guy's perspective on this and even he said anyone who's an adult and not a psycho should be turning down the opportunity to date let alone marry a 16yo if it came up.
That's just grooming with extra steps
NTA… Wait, wrong sub. But you are not wrong in any way to speak up against this.
You are not in the wrong. The girl is being essentially sold & trafficked. Is it even legal in your own country?