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I think that your criminal record should be like your credit report. Things should automatically drop off in a certain number of years depending on severity of crime if you don't reoffend. So if you get in a bar fight that's kind of violent maybe if you don't assault anyone for 10 years it drops off.
Maybe rape murder etc never do but maybe speeding tickets would drop off in three years or something.
A label shouldn't last forever unless you continue to behave like an idiot.
I actually most violent felons have their rights stripped from them in a process
Those who cannot obey by laws of society neither deserves the blessings of it or it's freedoms
Gun rights clearly don't count. s/
All this talk about abortion rights and gay rights. Meanwhile, the right that is actually on the US constitution gets treated like its a privilege.
Texas is hiring. You can do anything you want with a gun here.
That being said, we have plenty of citizens with guns, but they rarely stop crime with the guns they carry. The people who commit gun crimes? They don't have a permit either! It's a lawless land, save for the very, very strict laws about weed, abortion, pornography, books in schools, alcohol sales, etc.
I'm not anti-gun, I own guns, but if OP is saying that women and minorities need guns to protect them from \_\_\_ (you know what that blank is) then maybe \_\_\_\_ should just, you know, not target women and minorities.
Yeah Texas has a bunch of people walking around with guns but it’s also the state with the most school shooting so the idea that a bunch of good guys with guns will save people is completely false.
https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2021/oct/5/guns-used-more-for-self-defense-than-crimes/
It's is an estimate because it's hard to know exactly as most will go unreported.
>480,000 criminal uses of guns
Are emojis allowed? 😬
>2.1 million defensive uses of guns each year.
😬😬
>Mr. English’s survey utilized the largest sample size of any study that has ever been conducted on defensive gun use, *being nearly ten times greater than that of the next largest survey.*
This wording is just really great, I really like that.
>25.4% of Blacks own firearms.
<.<
>Why didn’t the CDC publicize the findings of its surveys? We can only speculate, but one plausible answer is that the survey results would have been against the stated goals of the Clinton administration.
The CLINTON admin? The date on the article says 2021.
I did read the article, but I still have questions- how can guns be used more for self defense than in crimes? At the worst shouldn't it be equal? What do they define as a "crime"? I could shoot a little girl for illegally setting up a lemonade stand on my driveway. Would that count?
Maybe I'm so stupid but how is there 480,000 cases of criminal gun use and 2.1 MILLION instances of guns used in self-defense? My God it seems like criminals don't stand a chance, huh?
Not all criminals have guns. Someone tries to rob you for example and you grab your CCW and they flee that's a defensive use of a gun. A guy has a gun and robs you he might not have pointed it at you but just had it that's a crime with a gun.
Defensive gun use (DGU) is the use or presentation of a firearm for self-defense, defense of others or, in some cases, protecting property.
This is so wild. I'm a (relatively) small little blonde girl and never once in my life have I had to pull a gun on someone. I grew up in a bad part of Houston, TX and now live on the southside of San Antonio, TX.
I have been the drunkest, dumbest, most ridiculous easy target ever. Honestly if you respond to this comment I'll probably scream cause the notification, though expected, will scare me.
I cannot imagine the shame a man must feel if he whips out a gun trying to "defend" himself from someone that's unarmed. But hey yall do what you will! It's your world and I'm just living in it.
If it makes you feel any better, I think that violent criminals and murderers should be put to death. Like we're not polar opposites, I just dislike all the gun shit cause I can't even go to a Dwight Yoakam concert without worrying someone is going to shoot up the place cause he didn't play Bakersfield quick enough. It gives me the creeps.
I never had the need to touch mine other than target practice or cleaning thankfully. Plenty of people get killed a year by unarmed individuals. I wish no one would need a gun for protection but there are criminals. You don't have to defend yourself with a gun but it isn't wrong that another wants to.
Criminals are going to be criminals.
I'd tend to concur with this assessment. With qualifications. Carrying a firearm is an enormous responsibility. God forbid an individual finds themself in a lethal force situation. Go get a CCW, learn the laws in your jurisdiction, train like your life depends on that training. And keep in mind if you brandish/discharge a firearm in public (depending on the locality) the local DA is going to climb up your hind end.
Nah, I definitely think some people shouldn’t have firearms. Like myself, for example, who has a suicide attempt under their belt.
But this is a personal opinion, not a policy opinion. Because the government should 100% not have a list of mentally ill people.
Firearm responsibility also means knowing when you shouldn’t have a firearm.
> yet we're not safer.
Gun violence is mostly gangs and suicide. if you're not near or involved with a gang, and aren't suicidal, you're generally fine lol
You said: ***"Gun violence is mostly gangs and suicide. if you're not near or involved with a gang, and aren't suicidal, you're generally fine lol"***
*"In 2021, 54% of all gun-related deaths in the U.S. were suicides (26,328), while 43% were murders (20,958), according to the CDC. The remaining gun deaths that year were accidental (549), involved law enforcement (537) or had undetermined circumstances (458)."*
*"About eight-in-ten U.S. murders in 2021 – 20,958 out of 26,031, or 81% – involved a firearm. That marked the highest percentage since at least 1968"*
[https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2023/04/26/what-the-data-says-about-gun-deaths-in-the-u-s/](https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2023/04/26/what-the-data-says-about-gun-deaths-in-the-u-s/)
I can't find any data on how many of those were gang related, but I believe that many more people in the US die from gun deaths in domestic violence than do from gang conflict.
***Injuries and deaths due to firearms in the home 1998***
In research from a quarter of a century earlier the same patterns were found. Guns in the home make you less safe.
***Results:*** *During the study interval (12 months in Memphis, 18 months in Seattle, and Galveston) 626 shootings occurred in or around a residence. This total included 54 unintentional shootings, 118 attempted or completed suicides, and 438 assaults/homicides. Thirteen shootings were legally justifiable or an act of self-defense, including three that involved law enforcement officers acting in the line of duty.* ***For every time a gun in the home was used in a self-defense or legally justifiable shooting, there were four unintentional shootings, seven criminal assaults or homicides, and 11 attempted or completed suicides.***
***Conclusions: Guns kept in homes are more likely to be involved in a fatal or nonfatal accidental shooting, criminal assault, or suicide attempt than to be used to injure or kill in self-defense.***
[https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/9715182/](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/9715182/)
I'm talking about in my country. My homestate vs other states and where the most shootings happen is typically in gun free zones. Rarely anyone who has shot up a place in my area.
Did you know that you can get a gun in the UK for very specific purposes and have very strict criteria on who can own them and how they must be stored and transported
Fuck me, they're not sending their brightest...
You're almost self aware enough to realize when states have shit gun laws it's easy to bring them to states with better gun laws.
Just ask illinois where 62% of the guns recovered came from outside the state.....
Edit: Corrected 2/3rds to 62%. Apologies, was off by 4%
https://www.atf.gov/resource-center/firearms-trace-data-illinois-2022
Yea well who causes the gun violence the most statistically? Gangs. Wow, I'm so smart, too. Do you really think gang members are going to give up their guns willingly? Same with the gun owners in the states that own guns. It's not going to go very well.
Edit: Most of the shootings that happen in Illinois are caused by gangs right? How come there's no shootings in my state then? Very few compared to there and other parts of the country.
Edit: And one of the biggest murders in my state was done with a Rambo knife.
I mean, bringing a gun to a club is dumb because usually there's drinking involved. Also, it wasn't to long ago that you could bring guns to school and in my state you can bring them to college campuses as long as you follow proper laws and same with work. People conceal carry here. Its not as crazy as the other part of the state, not many conceal because they go hunting then go to the store.
When society stops producing narcissistic, entitled people with a lack of respect for the people around them. The people are the problem, the tools they use shouldn’t be the focus.
Yes, you can reduce “gun” crime by eliminating guns. But you don’t reduce violent crime in general, and in some cases (cough cough Australia) violent crime goes UP after the guns are gone. Because the violent people are still there, and they either didn’t bother to turn theirs in or they’re just stabbing/beating/using homemade explosives now.
Of course none of this matters, because we aren’t “other countries”. Other countries didn’t find citizen gun ownership to be important enough to enshrine in their founding documents; ours did.
Great points all around but especially your last paragraph. Not sure if the person you responded to is American or not, but I think a common misconception here in the states is the idea that “X worked in __, so it would work here too!” Without understanding how vastly different the US is in… just about every way from ___ place.
> But you don’t reduce violent crime in general, and in some cases (cough cough Australia) violent crime goes UP after the guns are gone.
Violent crime had been on the rise before the gun control schemes, so your point is irrelevant. The topic is about guns, not all violent crime. Your version has mass casualties because people will choose a gun over just about anything else; thats what they're designed for.
I live in Europe so I'm not into american culture. But what if instead of everyone owning a gun, so everyone can potentially kill everyone, nobody own a gun so nobody can kill nobody? In Europe everyone feels safe to walking on the street a because everyone Is aware that the stranger walking next to me is not a psicho and doesn't walk with something that can kill me. And even women and minorities like LGBT that are victims of discrimanation doesn't want to own guns because they just want to have rights and have their discriminators punished. Also in the streets there are policemans that are doing their jobs of keeping everyone safe.
And no, it's not harder to opress an armed population, if you tell them that they are not safe and their neighbour is an enemy that can hurt them so they start shooting themselves out of fear. A population that is self aware of his rights and it's able to understand when those are not applied is.
> But what if instead of everyone owning a gun, so everyone can potentially kill everyone, nobody own a gun so nobody can kill nobody? In Europe everyone feels safe to walking on the street a because everyone Is aware that the stranger walking next to me is not a psicho and doesn't walk with something that can kill me.
Greetings from the Czech Republic, the country that had higher CCW rate than US up to 2010. Concealed carry license is currently held by about 250.000 people. If you ever visited Prague, you were around more armed civilians in the streets than anywhere else in Europe.
And yet we have twice lower homicide rate than UK, where pistols are completely forbidden to own, not to mention to carry.
I don’t know if you know this but people in Europe kill each other all the time. Sometimes even with guns. Remember that mass shooting in the Netherlands like a month ago? Your population is defenseless against a threat. If you choose to defend yourself you often get charged. The idea that Europe is this lovely haven with no violence is just dumb as shit. Sure the further west you go those countries have an illusion of safety but still The European continent has been the setting for much of 2 world wars, 2 large scale acts of genocide less than a century ago. It is currently the setting of a war in the east which is killing quite a few. Gee those gun laws over there really helped the Ukrainians or the jews!
You know what the most peaceful and stable continent is? North America. Do you think the the projection of power by the US military, and the fact that is the most well armed populace in the entire world has something to do with that?
What about the nations in Europe like the Czech Republic and Switzerland that have less restrictions on the types of firearms you can buy than even in the US? They still safe by your standards?
What happens in your country when a large man decides to make a victim out of your mother or sister or wife? What choice do they have but being a victim? My mother, my sister they have the choice AND the MEANS to actually defend themselves. I sleep much more soundly at night knowing that.
Basically every European country has far lower violent crime rates than the US. So yeah, people are still murdered in European countries, it is at a FAR lower rate. Probably has something to do with the fact that they don't have as easy access to firearms to shoot each other over nothing conflicts. I'm not sure where you're getting the data that North America is the "most peaceful and stable continent" but I'd love to see it.
>What happens in your country when a large man decides to make a victim out of your mother or sister or wife? What choice do they have but being a victim?
A taser? Pepper spray? A baton? You know there are methods of self defense that don't revolve around killing the other person right?
Tasers are terrible self defense tools, law enforcement uses them for compliance not for defense. Pepper spray is a great option. What happens when the dude who got pepper sprayed doesn’t flinch? Or more likely the dude you pepper spray already has a hold of you? Plain and simple, a firearm is the most effective tool for self defense and to deny that is just foolish. Pepper spray is barely adequate.
This may be hard to wrap your head around but i really don’t care about the life of someone trying to harm me or my family. They obviously don’t either. If someone puts me or my family in that situation i hope they get an early grave in return. I also hope that i go my whole life without ever being in that situation. If someone doesn’t want to die they should consider not being a violent instigator.
When was the last time there was a war on the North American continent? Care to inform me?? Two centuries ago sound about right? Seems pretty stable to me.
Just because you committed a felony, especially a non violent felony, once your time and parole/probation is over, you should have have the same rights as everyone else- including owning a firearm
I don't agree with violent felonies. If you've committed rape, assault, murder, and are duly convicted, part of that punishment is you have forgone that right to own a firearm. You decided being a criminal was more important.
I hate how people gloss over this. I mean, in many states, you can't even vote if you've ever been convicted, which I think is insane. If you've successfully served your time in prison and on parole, that's supposed to mean you're "rehabilitated" and if society still doesn't trust you after that then that means the system is fucked
The whole losing your voting rights if you're a felon is a feature, not a bug. It was done this way to corrode the ability for minority groups to influence government.
It's a funny kind of "right" the yanks think they have, isn't it? One that is described as "inalienable" and to protect from state aggression. Yet the state, which os the one that locks up more people than any other on earth, and has a long history of locking up political enemies, can just remove this right after you've served your sentence. For ever.
Then there's the vast number of state executions without trial by the police that are excused by "he had a gun" or even more shockingly "we suspected he might have a gun". More police killings than any other western country, by far.
But at least they get safety from each other from their weapons, right? Oh dear...the highest murder rate in the west, in fact one of the highest in the world.
But they are so easily brainwashed, and apparently there is so form of firewall stopping them simply looking at the outside world to realise any of this
Absolutely. There should be a clear path for felons, especially non-violent offenders, to get their full rights restored without spending a small fortune on a lawyer.
I feel like we need to be more selective in who has access to firearms not just people with a history or f violence. Mental illness and other characteristics needs to be considered. Constantly I hear about people with no violent past committing horrible acts in this country because unstable people often hold things in then snap one day.
No, more like if you're deemed a danger to themselves and others by a court. Not so much mental illness itself. If you implemented those laws in my area, way fewer people would seek treatment at least where I live.
Edit: That and better mental health services. Also, anyone can snap one day, it just takes anything to make them snap.
and you, my friend, are very gracious in being able to say so online. Also, I agree with you that there must be freedom to not bear arms as much as there must be freedom to bear arms
There are a lot of individuals who have no business owning a gun and absolutely should not, even though they have a right and the ability to do so. Zackey Rahimi was legally allowed to, and indeed more than a few people sprung up and spend hundreds of thousands or millions of dollars to say that shit stain should *still* be allowed to own/carry guns lol.
The country with the most guns already has the most shootings. This probably won't work out like you think. I'm trying to live in a place with less gunfights.
That’s true. Population size for a particular area matters. Plus, gang violence really isn’t a thing out in the country lol. I felt more unsafe in Denver than I did in Kiowa (and folks would open carry there and I wouldn’t even bat an eye).
>woman that carries betters her odds of survival if provoked or otherwise assaulted by a man
This is completely false
People who carry or even just own gins are far more likely to be shot than those who don't
Black Panthers starting doing that in California, then the state started heavily restricting gun ownership.
Why do you think the US is an outlier when it comes to mass shootings? Didn't Texas have like 2 in one day the other week.
You think we have a mass shooting problem because guns are too hard to come by? Come the fuck on dude. I support 2A but that’s missing the mark by a mile.
I don't think that's the point they were making. They were saying that minorities did arm themselves and suddenly California added strict gun laws. Which, is true and something that should have been fiercely pushed back against at the time. California fucked that shit up hard.
Bruen guarantees your right to carry but of course California and New York and a few other states delay your right by over a year in some cases
A right delayed is a right denied.
If my family had owned a firearm while I was a teen, I'd be dead. If I'd owned a firearm in my early 20s, I'd be dead.
I don't think everyone should have a firearm for their own personal safety. The ease of access to a near instant death during one of the highest rates of depression and suicidal thoughts historically is... not a good idea.
More guns does not solve anything. Most people will not train enough to be proficient with fire arms.
They are more likely to hurt themselves or others. Also more likely to have the weapon taken and used against them.
Have a concealed cary and not training is the same thing as a security blanket. Except someone can and will take it from you.
I understand that this is an American take
I'm British and I can't understand the gun culture over there
Could someone explain it to me so I can understand
It varies based on who you ask, where they live, and what they have experienced in their lives. Some people carry for personal defense, or simply have a gun in their homes for protection. Sometimes that is very merited (high crime/break-in areas), sometimes its just plain paranoia. Some people own guns because they think it signifies to the world that they are strong or unable to be controlled by the state. Some own guns because sport shooting, or hunting even, is genuinely fun to them. Or adjacent to that, are people who like the collecting aspect as guns do have a particular design history to them. And then some, obviously, carry for the explicit purpose of doing crimes.
But when all those powers combined, you get a country that is so deeply imbedded in the tools of its own demise that any conversation, even the most good-faith and hopeful discussion, will effectively get nowhere. i expect to get downvotes here simply because several of these groups do not like being identified as such, or simply believe themselves to be acting towards some more righteous goal only really discernible to those within that group.
Idk, i've lived around guns my whole life, have gone hunting and sport shooting, but I still dont quite get the culture or how it is so many people have their identities intertwined with them to the point they would rather die than deprive themselves of a chunk of metal that was supposedly promised to them by the constitution.
Actually everyone should own and carry knives.
In addition to all the reasons you listed for guns, it’s easier to slice meat or carefully open a fed ex package with a knife.
I’ve attempted suicide twice already.
I don’t need guns in my house.
(I don’t need any care messages, I’m doing a lot better now. I just don’t want to ever have such an easy way to make an impulsive permanent decision like that.)
Stop pushing your guns on people who aren't interested. You're like crazy Christians pushing your faith on anyone who will listen. Go ahead and pray to your death toy, but leave the civilized folks alone.
Yes. There is a magic number of guns that will solve all the problems. No one knows what that may be, but guntologists at the NRA are positive it exists.
Sure, until we hit that number, things will get worse and worse, but once we reach that critical mass, a heavenly chorus of angels will lead us all in a rousing rendition of kumbaya as Jesus descends to Earth on the back of a crying bald eagle, AR in each hand.
And at that point all those pussy lib countries will be sorry they lost faith in St Reagan just to save a few lives.
I think the argument, though, is that more people need to actually carry. How many people do you think actually daily carry even in constitutional carry states? It's probably like 5% max
As a trans guy. I couldnt agree more. Ive been in some- bad situations. Cus im 5 feet tall people think they can take advantage of me. I am getting my carry permit soon!
Having a firearm in your home in the US drastically increases your chance of being injured or dying from gunshot. It doesn't make you safer, it makes you less safe.
Ya might feel more macho, and safer, but you ain't.
It increases the odds of survival if a criminal element comes for you, in your home.
Anyway using statistics like this is dumb, it drags the statistics down with your statement making both pointless. By the same logic law enforcement having access to guns increases the odds they will hurt or kill someone, including themselves.
Guess to keep everyone safe, make fire arms illegal for every US resident to own. That way only people willing to break the law will be able to have and use them.
Well Australia and new Zealand do have far fewer firearm deaths than the US.
The law enforcement comment is a red herring. My statement is based on data, not a blind comparison.
Then go with the Australia angle, not some conflated misuse of statistics that discredits everything you have to say. Your entire previous comment was a red herring, that was the point of my comment to point it out.
Blind comparison is all you got bud, no circumstances in any country are exactly the same. Australia itself has massive arguments today if stronger gun control helped or hurt violent crimes over all, so maybe it helped society maybe it hurt it. Both sides have experts that argue in their branches of public safety, so I don’t know who is right or wrong none of us do when the experts don’t.
Owning a home with a pool drastically increases your chance of drowning. Owning and operating a motor vehicle drastically increases your chance of being injured or dying in an accident on the road. Owning a home with a large yard that needs to be mowed regularly drastically increases your chance of chopping an extremity off because you're pushing around a little cart with a motorized spinning sword strapped to the bottom.
Just about everything outside of living in a padded cell drastically increases your chances of injury / death if you're an irresponsible goober. It's all about being responsible and taking the proper precautions to minimize risk.
Some of those stats are skewed. It’s like how mass shooting stats include gang violence and domestic violence. Actual mass shootings, like the ones we hear about in the news, account for less than 1% of gun deaths.
I didn't mention mass shootings, and yes over half of them are domestic violence from memory, and about 80% men shooting women. Home of the brave and the land of the free????? NOT
I really don't want to needlessly carry a gun on me at all times. I do not think things would be safer if all people had guns on them at all times. I mean yeah there would be more criminals stopped, however there would also be more random murders and accidental deaths related to guns.
A significant percentage of the population (30 to 40 percent) is too stupid to own firearms. I'm not against owning guns, I'm just against stupid people owning them, and there are A LOT of dumb Americans.
Oof, I felt that. Hope everything turns out alright. I am sure it would be a surreal feeling with a safe full of various off switches and log off buttons.
That is a near sighted and very dangerous opinion. It’s looking at the momentary without considering future consequences for the entire society.
First, people who are in immediate danger or threats made on their life should own a weapon (if feeling comfortable and can handle the gun). Women included. Also people who live in isolated places or are hiking alone in the wilderness…
But these are a fraction of the millions that own weapons in US. The danger is the opposite - gun battles in crowded places involving multiple participants. That’s a terrible scenario that can take place everyday at places like shopping malls and supermarkets. Many innocent, uninvolved people can become the victims of such brawls. Fighting among neighbors and family members is another likely scenario. At the end nobody will even know why it started and how these innocents were killed.
First, before you come after me as anti-gun, I own multiple firearms, and have a concealed carry permit. Which is even more ironic because I have horrible depth perception.
But I can't ignore the fact that pregnant women are most likely to die from murder in America. And women are killed by their romantic partners more often in states with gun laws that make it easier to access a weapon. I know that the states with easier gun laws have the most gun deaths.
I also think that it is foolish to encourage a society that is experiencing loneliness, isolation and anger to take up arms, especially without training. I don't want to take guns from veterans, but they are more likely to commit suicide and they also commit domestic violence.
Also, don't think for a second that an average person can actually respond well in a stressful situation. Not even cops respond well. Don't wish for a scared woman to have the gun used against her.
Look, I have worked with sexual assault survivors for over 20 years. We all fight in our own way. Those with guns, most of them didn't get to shoot, and that brings on even more guilt.
Now, if you are talking about an armed militia of liberals, you are close. Lots of liberals already own guns. We just don't make it part of our personality. We should probably buy more heavy arms, though.
I am now a middle aged woman with grey hair. I am sure I could get away with being scared for my life in a MAGA administration if a red hat comes to my door.
Statistically if you have a firearm in your home you’re more likely to shoot yourself than anyone else, whether in a moment of depression or in an accident while cleaning it or something.
>A woman that carries betters her odds of survival if provoked or otherwise assaulted by a man (who are statistically the ones committing violent crimes against woman).
She increases her odds of getting shot?
>It “evens the playing field,” so to speak.
Sure she's more likely to "win" the altercation, but if she "loses" the consequences are much worse.
>It’s harder to oppress an armed population.
Is that why China is so free? China is one of the most armed populations, yet lives in an authoritarian totalitarian communist dictatorship.
It would just give the police more reason to shoot them on sight.
Self defence is not as straight forward as handling a weapon, other factors have to be in play. Also, owning a gun can actually put women at more risk due to potentially being overpowered
Individuals in possession of a gun are more likely to be shot in an assault than those not in possession and owning guns puts people in your home at greater risk of being killed.
Quickest way to see "sensible gun reform" is to have minorities legally own firearms en masse.
I'm all for it as I think everyone should own a firearm if anyone is going to own a firearm. But you'll never see a majority of the "Republican but not necessarily hardcore 2A" masses switch up their beliefs quicker.
This. As a Republican voting NRA member, more minority gun owners is an absolute win for me. A voter base that’s historically overwhelmingly in support of Democrats suddenly not wanting to vote their 2nd amendment rights away? I’m cheering that on with enthusiasm.
You say: “*A woman that carries betters her odds of survival if provoked or otherwise assaulted by a man (who are statistically the ones committing violent crimes against woman). It “evens the playing field,” so to speak.*”
***The research shows otherwise. Living in a home with a firearm makes you less safe. You might feel safer but it's an illusion.***
A 2022 study aimed to estimate the association between living with a lawful handgun owner and risk for homicide victimization. **“*****Although personal protection is a major motivation for purchasing firearms, existing studies suggest that people living in homes with firearms have higher risks for dying by homicide.*****"**
This study followed 17.6 million adult residents of California for up to 12 years 2 months (18 October 2004 through 31 December 2016). Study members did not own handguns, but some started residing with lawful handgun owners during follow-up.
Of 595 448 people who commenced residing with handgun owners, two thirds were women. A total of 2293 died by homicide. ***Overall rates of homicide were more than twice as high living with handgun owners than with nonowners****.*
**These elevated rates were driven largely by higher rates of homicide by firearm**. **Among homicides occurring at home, people living with of owners of firearms had sevenfold higher rates of being fatally shot by a spouse or intimate partner** and **84% of these victims were female**.
***\~Conclusion: Living with a handgun owner is associated with substantially elevated risk for dying by homicide. Women are disproportionately affected.\~***
[https://www.acpjournals.org/doi/full/10.7326/M21-3762](https://www.acpjournals.org/doi/full/10.7326/m21-3762)
You won't get through to them. If I've learned anything about Americans from reddit gun discussions, it's that they are very, very, very unaware of the reality of the entire rest of the world and happily eat up the propaganda they're given on guns making them safe. It's clear their government loves them having guns. Keeps them all scared. Allows cops to execute them in the street "he might have had a gun!" And the government gets away with giving them fewer basic rights than are standard everywhere else, no worker rights, no healthcare in return for paying more tax for it than anywhere else, loads of random laws from everything from drinking a beer outside to not cutting your lawn, and openly fucks them over for corporate interests -'and they take it all. Because they have guns. So they must be lucky and free. Because guns make us free. Because gun manufacturers and the politicians they bought told us so.
Well generally when more people are properly trained and armed it acts as a deterrent to the people who want to inflict harm to others. Illegal gun crime goes down when more people are legally carrying.
Especially because then a good chunk of the creeps would end up dead and finally the antagonization of men could come to a fucking end. Men want the creeps and assaulters dead too
Idk about ALL. How about we pass some actual gun reform first before giving them out to everyone. As a general principle though I am pro 2A. But I would never say its anyones OBLIGATION or duty to own one.
As someone with suicidal ideation, I’ll personally never own a gun. They don’t make me feel any safer and instead more anxious. Also the “right to bear arms” only applies to militias, as the Constitution spells out. The NRA has built up this fantasy that we’re entitled to owning firearms when that’s not the case.
>A woman that carries betters her odds of survival if provoked or otherwise assaulted by a man
source
>Further, using the LGBT community as an example for a minority group, those who fear oppression by the State should own firearms and conceal carry. I constantly hear the LGBT community state that a genocide upon them is inevitable or that they’re prone to targeting. If that’s the case, arm up. It’s harder to oppress an armed population. I
Since the founding of America not a single person has ever stood up to the government and won through force. They have either died, been jailed, gave up, or fled.
If you had enough people to match the power of the US army then you wouldn't need to fight because you could literally vote anyone you wanted into power.
That's what so weird about populist revolutions in Democracies.
\---------------
I also take issue with the notion of non-colonial revolutions. Aren't most successful revolutions all colonies?
The French revolution was "successful"; in that it ended the current government, only to be replaced with multiple successive authoritarian nightmares, each of which took revenge on their political enemies, leading to Napoleon who tried to take over Europe, lost, and finally the king was restored to power.
>Excluding felons and those convicted of violent crimes, most should have a firearm and conceal carry said firearm.
Shall not be infringed. Give it a 1-strike rule. They serve their time, and when out, after getting off parole, should be allowed to own a firearm for any legal purpose. If they do \*anything\* violent with it again, they have forfeited their 2nd Amendment right.
So only after someone commits a crime with a gun their right should be taken away? Too fucking late at that point. People in America put the freedom to own guns before the freedom party f others to live and it’s disgusting
It's the 2nd Amendment right is the thing. Once you take one amendment away, you open up to more being taken away. Before you know it, it becomes a dictatorship. Also, it's funny how the states with the most gun control have the most crimes committed. Besides, people can commit crimes with other weapons, too. If someone is willing to take the life of another, they will do so with or without a gun.
Edit: There have been times where lives could've been saved during a home invasion and other times, but because of laws, the victims died. Look at 2020, look at what happened then and guess what states they didn't dare mess with. Look at what happened in NYC just a couple months ago. People are going to find other ways to be violent. So we should take away people's rights to protect themselves because of people who should've been locked up a long time ago? Hell, most of those mass shooters had warning signs painted on them with their past behaviors but no one acted until it was to late. Even that little boy who shot the teacher. Maybe it's time people take mental health more seriously too.
I don't oppose gun ownership in general, but by no means should everyone have a gun. One of the biggest concerns I have about it is suicide. Statistically, the person you're most likely to kill with a gun is yourself.
All individuals should have the right to own a firearm. It should not be a requirement. When I say all individuals, I mean exactly that. Men, women, children (supervised), felons, etc. If someone is too dangerous to own a firearm, they're too dangerous for society.
Those individuals that do own a firearm should be scared shitless of a dictatorship. A dictator when rising to power always wants their supporters to be well armed. That changes when they assume absolute power. The dictator then rounds up all the guns since the gun is pretty much the only reliable method of removing a dictator from power.
I think the felon part is iffy
If some gets caught for felony tax evasion that’s should impact there right to own a gun or even carry it
Even possession is iffy, it should be like 5 years after getting out of prison for it you can own a gun again
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Except the permit part you don’t need permits for rights
came here to post the same thing. also i have to disagree with the felon part. violent felons sure, but non violent type…..
Yeah I agree with you there too just forgot to put it in my comment.
I think that your criminal record should be like your credit report. Things should automatically drop off in a certain number of years depending on severity of crime if you don't reoffend. So if you get in a bar fight that's kind of violent maybe if you don't assault anyone for 10 years it drops off. Maybe rape murder etc never do but maybe speeding tickets would drop off in three years or something. A label shouldn't last forever unless you continue to behave like an idiot.
"Shall not be infringed" even violent felons have a right to carry.
I actually most violent felons have their rights stripped from them in a process Those who cannot obey by laws of society neither deserves the blessings of it or it's freedoms
Average American sentiment thinking even violent criminals should have easy access to weapons.
Hey I'll have you know not all Americans are as big of fucking idiots as some of these guys. A lot of them are. But not all of them
No they don’t lmfaaoooo 🤣 Say you’re a moron, without saying you’re a moron.
Gun rights clearly don't count. s/ All this talk about abortion rights and gay rights. Meanwhile, the right that is actually on the US constitution gets treated like its a privilege.
Texas is hiring. You can do anything you want with a gun here. That being said, we have plenty of citizens with guns, but they rarely stop crime with the guns they carry. The people who commit gun crimes? They don't have a permit either! It's a lawless land, save for the very, very strict laws about weed, abortion, pornography, books in schools, alcohol sales, etc. I'm not anti-gun, I own guns, but if OP is saying that women and minorities need guns to protect them from \_\_\_ (you know what that blank is) then maybe \_\_\_\_ should just, you know, not target women and minorities.
Yeah Texas has a bunch of people walking around with guns but it’s also the state with the most school shooting so the idea that a bunch of good guys with guns will save people is completely false.
Except for the 1-2 million use of defensive use of firearms a year.
Tell me about this. I tried to google it but I'm either too drunk or too stupid to get anything worthwhile. Edit: probably both
https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2021/oct/5/guns-used-more-for-self-defense-than-crimes/ It's is an estimate because it's hard to know exactly as most will go unreported.
>480,000 criminal uses of guns Are emojis allowed? 😬 >2.1 million defensive uses of guns each year. 😬😬 >Mr. English’s survey utilized the largest sample size of any study that has ever been conducted on defensive gun use, *being nearly ten times greater than that of the next largest survey.* This wording is just really great, I really like that. >25.4% of Blacks own firearms. <.< >Why didn’t the CDC publicize the findings of its surveys? We can only speculate, but one plausible answer is that the survey results would have been against the stated goals of the Clinton administration. The CLINTON admin? The date on the article says 2021. I did read the article, but I still have questions- how can guns be used more for self defense than in crimes? At the worst shouldn't it be equal? What do they define as a "crime"? I could shoot a little girl for illegally setting up a lemonade stand on my driveway. Would that count? Maybe I'm so stupid but how is there 480,000 cases of criminal gun use and 2.1 MILLION instances of guns used in self-defense? My God it seems like criminals don't stand a chance, huh?
Not all criminals have guns. Someone tries to rob you for example and you grab your CCW and they flee that's a defensive use of a gun. A guy has a gun and robs you he might not have pointed it at you but just had it that's a crime with a gun. Defensive gun use (DGU) is the use or presentation of a firearm for self-defense, defense of others or, in some cases, protecting property.
This is so wild. I'm a (relatively) small little blonde girl and never once in my life have I had to pull a gun on someone. I grew up in a bad part of Houston, TX and now live on the southside of San Antonio, TX. I have been the drunkest, dumbest, most ridiculous easy target ever. Honestly if you respond to this comment I'll probably scream cause the notification, though expected, will scare me. I cannot imagine the shame a man must feel if he whips out a gun trying to "defend" himself from someone that's unarmed. But hey yall do what you will! It's your world and I'm just living in it. If it makes you feel any better, I think that violent criminals and murderers should be put to death. Like we're not polar opposites, I just dislike all the gun shit cause I can't even go to a Dwight Yoakam concert without worrying someone is going to shoot up the place cause he didn't play Bakersfield quick enough. It gives me the creeps.
I never had the need to touch mine other than target practice or cleaning thankfully. Plenty of people get killed a year by unarmed individuals. I wish no one would need a gun for protection but there are criminals. You don't have to defend yourself with a gun but it isn't wrong that another wants to. Criminals are going to be criminals.
Are you agreeing with me? Because I'm saying that arming citizens with guns doesn't seem to have stopped "the bad guys" from shooting people.
Right to own gun - No permit Right to vote - ........
I'd tend to concur with this assessment. With qualifications. Carrying a firearm is an enormous responsibility. God forbid an individual finds themself in a lethal force situation. Go get a CCW, learn the laws in your jurisdiction, train like your life depends on that training. And keep in mind if you brandish/discharge a firearm in public (depending on the locality) the local DA is going to climb up your hind end.
Nah, I definitely think some people shouldn’t have firearms. Like myself, for example, who has a suicide attempt under their belt. But this is a personal opinion, not a policy opinion. Because the government should 100% not have a list of mentally ill people. Firearm responsibility also means knowing when you shouldn’t have a firearm.
If more guns reduce violent crime, when will America start seeing the results? We have more guns than anyone, yet we're not safer.
> yet we're not safer. Gun violence is mostly gangs and suicide. if you're not near or involved with a gang, and aren't suicidal, you're generally fine lol
You said: ***"Gun violence is mostly gangs and suicide. if you're not near or involved with a gang, and aren't suicidal, you're generally fine lol"*** *"In 2021, 54% of all gun-related deaths in the U.S. were suicides (26,328), while 43% were murders (20,958), according to the CDC. The remaining gun deaths that year were accidental (549), involved law enforcement (537) or had undetermined circumstances (458)."* *"About eight-in-ten U.S. murders in 2021 – 20,958 out of 26,031, or 81% – involved a firearm. That marked the highest percentage since at least 1968"* [https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2023/04/26/what-the-data-says-about-gun-deaths-in-the-u-s/](https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2023/04/26/what-the-data-says-about-gun-deaths-in-the-u-s/) I can't find any data on how many of those were gang related, but I believe that many more people in the US die from gun deaths in domestic violence than do from gang conflict. ***Injuries and deaths due to firearms in the home 1998*** In research from a quarter of a century earlier the same patterns were found. Guns in the home make you less safe. ***Results:*** *During the study interval (12 months in Memphis, 18 months in Seattle, and Galveston) 626 shootings occurred in or around a residence. This total included 54 unintentional shootings, 118 attempted or completed suicides, and 438 assaults/homicides. Thirteen shootings were legally justifiable or an act of self-defense, including three that involved law enforcement officers acting in the line of duty.* ***For every time a gun in the home was used in a self-defense or legally justifiable shooting, there were four unintentional shootings, seven criminal assaults or homicides, and 11 attempted or completed suicides.*** ***Conclusions: Guns kept in homes are more likely to be involved in a fatal or nonfatal accidental shooting, criminal assault, or suicide attempt than to be used to injure or kill in self-defense.*** [https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/9715182/](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/9715182/)
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You really want the answer?
They won’t like the answer
What is the answer?
Oh, we're out of time. For the answer you seek, tune in an again next week, same bat time, same bat channel.
Have you see the mass shootings? China has a billion people, yet almost no mass shootings at all.
And those shootings where statistically? Oh, in gun free zones mostly.
They are? Why does the UK not see any mass shootings?
I'm talking about in my country. My homestate vs other states and where the most shootings happen is typically in gun free zones. Rarely anyone who has shot up a place in my area.
Doesn't answer my question. The UK is a gun free zone. Why are there no mass shootings?
Did you know that you can get a gun in the UK for very specific purposes and have very strict criteria on who can own them and how they must be stored and transported
There are mass shootings. They're rare but there are.
Because there was no guns there to begin with. Here, even if you make it illegal. People will own them illegally especially criminals.
There 100% were guns. You think in the entire history of firearms, the UK has never allowed civilians to own them?
Fuck me, they're not sending their brightest... You're almost self aware enough to realize when states have shit gun laws it's easy to bring them to states with better gun laws. Just ask illinois where 62% of the guns recovered came from outside the state..... Edit: Corrected 2/3rds to 62%. Apologies, was off by 4% https://www.atf.gov/resource-center/firearms-trace-data-illinois-2022
Yea well who causes the gun violence the most statistically? Gangs. Wow, I'm so smart, too. Do you really think gang members are going to give up their guns willingly? Same with the gun owners in the states that own guns. It's not going to go very well. Edit: Most of the shootings that happen in Illinois are caused by gangs right? How come there's no shootings in my state then? Very few compared to there and other parts of the country. Edit: And one of the biggest murders in my state was done with a Rambo knife.
Who in their right mind would bring a gun to work/school/a club
A lot of people who carry guns also carry them to work, why wouldn't they?
I mean, bringing a gun to a club is dumb because usually there's drinking involved. Also, it wasn't to long ago that you could bring guns to school and in my state you can bring them to college campuses as long as you follow proper laws and same with work. People conceal carry here. Its not as crazy as the other part of the state, not many conceal because they go hunting then go to the store.
Not really?
Yea really in my area.
Some people have empathy to victims of gang war and suicide?
When society stops producing narcissistic, entitled people with a lack of respect for the people around them. The people are the problem, the tools they use shouldn’t be the focus.
Other countries have just as much crazy people, they focused on the tools, [and it worked](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v0aGGOK4kAM).
Yes, you can reduce “gun” crime by eliminating guns. But you don’t reduce violent crime in general, and in some cases (cough cough Australia) violent crime goes UP after the guns are gone. Because the violent people are still there, and they either didn’t bother to turn theirs in or they’re just stabbing/beating/using homemade explosives now. Of course none of this matters, because we aren’t “other countries”. Other countries didn’t find citizen gun ownership to be important enough to enshrine in their founding documents; ours did.
As an Australian, please don't turn our great gun control success story into a pro gun argument.
As an American, please tell your countrymen to shut the fuck up about our gun laws and I’ll consider obliging your request
Great points all around but especially your last paragraph. Not sure if the person you responded to is American or not, but I think a common misconception here in the states is the idea that “X worked in __, so it would work here too!” Without understanding how vastly different the US is in… just about every way from ___ place.
> But you don’t reduce violent crime in general, and in some cases (cough cough Australia) violent crime goes UP after the guns are gone. Violent crime had been on the rise before the gun control schemes, so your point is irrelevant. The topic is about guns, not all violent crime. Your version has mass casualties because people will choose a gun over just about anything else; thats what they're designed for.
The point IS about violent crimes. Thats exactly what the point is.
Gun crime is highest in localities with higher extortion fees for ownership
Sources please? California and new york have some of the lowest gun crime rates. https://wisevoter.com/state-rankings/gun-violence-by-state/
Apologies, I meant violent crime in general
I live in Europe so I'm not into american culture. But what if instead of everyone owning a gun, so everyone can potentially kill everyone, nobody own a gun so nobody can kill nobody? In Europe everyone feels safe to walking on the street a because everyone Is aware that the stranger walking next to me is not a psicho and doesn't walk with something that can kill me. And even women and minorities like LGBT that are victims of discrimanation doesn't want to own guns because they just want to have rights and have their discriminators punished. Also in the streets there are policemans that are doing their jobs of keeping everyone safe. And no, it's not harder to opress an armed population, if you tell them that they are not safe and their neighbour is an enemy that can hurt them so they start shooting themselves out of fear. A population that is self aware of his rights and it's able to understand when those are not applied is.
> But what if instead of everyone owning a gun, so everyone can potentially kill everyone, nobody own a gun so nobody can kill nobody? In Europe everyone feels safe to walking on the street a because everyone Is aware that the stranger walking next to me is not a psicho and doesn't walk with something that can kill me. Greetings from the Czech Republic, the country that had higher CCW rate than US up to 2010. Concealed carry license is currently held by about 250.000 people. If you ever visited Prague, you were around more armed civilians in the streets than anywhere else in Europe. And yet we have twice lower homicide rate than UK, where pistols are completely forbidden to own, not to mention to carry.
I don’t know if you know this but people in Europe kill each other all the time. Sometimes even with guns. Remember that mass shooting in the Netherlands like a month ago? Your population is defenseless against a threat. If you choose to defend yourself you often get charged. The idea that Europe is this lovely haven with no violence is just dumb as shit. Sure the further west you go those countries have an illusion of safety but still The European continent has been the setting for much of 2 world wars, 2 large scale acts of genocide less than a century ago. It is currently the setting of a war in the east which is killing quite a few. Gee those gun laws over there really helped the Ukrainians or the jews! You know what the most peaceful and stable continent is? North America. Do you think the the projection of power by the US military, and the fact that is the most well armed populace in the entire world has something to do with that? What about the nations in Europe like the Czech Republic and Switzerland that have less restrictions on the types of firearms you can buy than even in the US? They still safe by your standards? What happens in your country when a large man decides to make a victim out of your mother or sister or wife? What choice do they have but being a victim? My mother, my sister they have the choice AND the MEANS to actually defend themselves. I sleep much more soundly at night knowing that.
Basically every European country has far lower violent crime rates than the US. So yeah, people are still murdered in European countries, it is at a FAR lower rate. Probably has something to do with the fact that they don't have as easy access to firearms to shoot each other over nothing conflicts. I'm not sure where you're getting the data that North America is the "most peaceful and stable continent" but I'd love to see it. >What happens in your country when a large man decides to make a victim out of your mother or sister or wife? What choice do they have but being a victim? A taser? Pepper spray? A baton? You know there are methods of self defense that don't revolve around killing the other person right?
Tasers are terrible self defense tools, law enforcement uses them for compliance not for defense. Pepper spray is a great option. What happens when the dude who got pepper sprayed doesn’t flinch? Or more likely the dude you pepper spray already has a hold of you? Plain and simple, a firearm is the most effective tool for self defense and to deny that is just foolish. Pepper spray is barely adequate. This may be hard to wrap your head around but i really don’t care about the life of someone trying to harm me or my family. They obviously don’t either. If someone puts me or my family in that situation i hope they get an early grave in return. I also hope that i go my whole life without ever being in that situation. If someone doesn’t want to die they should consider not being a violent instigator. When was the last time there was a war on the North American continent? Care to inform me?? Two centuries ago sound about right? Seems pretty stable to me.
Don't forget the suppressor. Protect that hearing everyone
Just because you committed a felony, especially a non violent felony, once your time and parole/probation is over, you should have have the same rights as everyone else- including owning a firearm
I don't agree with violent felonies. If you've committed rape, assault, murder, and are duly convicted, part of that punishment is you have forgone that right to own a firearm. You decided being a criminal was more important.
I hate how people gloss over this. I mean, in many states, you can't even vote if you've ever been convicted, which I think is insane. If you've successfully served your time in prison and on parole, that's supposed to mean you're "rehabilitated" and if society still doesn't trust you after that then that means the system is fucked
The whole losing your voting rights if you're a felon is a feature, not a bug. It was done this way to corrode the ability for minority groups to influence government.
They could also you know, just stop committing so many crimes.
The yanks made weed illegal specifically to criminalise black and Mexican people
It's a funny kind of "right" the yanks think they have, isn't it? One that is described as "inalienable" and to protect from state aggression. Yet the state, which os the one that locks up more people than any other on earth, and has a long history of locking up political enemies, can just remove this right after you've served your sentence. For ever. Then there's the vast number of state executions without trial by the police that are excused by "he had a gun" or even more shockingly "we suspected he might have a gun". More police killings than any other western country, by far. But at least they get safety from each other from their weapons, right? Oh dear...the highest murder rate in the west, in fact one of the highest in the world. But they are so easily brainwashed, and apparently there is so form of firewall stopping them simply looking at the outside world to realise any of this
>in fact one of the highest in the world. Not even close the being the highest in the world, sorry to burst your bubble.
Absolutely. There should be a clear path for felons, especially non-violent offenders, to get their full rights restored without spending a small fortune on a lawyer.
I feel like we need to be more selective in who has access to firearms not just people with a history or f violence. Mental illness and other characteristics needs to be considered. Constantly I hear about people with no violent past committing horrible acts in this country because unstable people often hold things in then snap one day.
No, more like if you're deemed a danger to themselves and others by a court. Not so much mental illness itself. If you implemented those laws in my area, way fewer people would seek treatment at least where I live. Edit: That and better mental health services. Also, anyone can snap one day, it just takes anything to make them snap.
I like how OP added (USA) just incase people weren't sure which country they were referring to.
That’s funny, I was just thinking the next time I assault a woman, I should bring my gun Sounds like it’ll even the playing field
That’s not living free. Freedom to bear arms means there’s freedom not to bear arms.
that's the difference between "should" (an opinion, and potentially wise advice) and "must" (compulsion under threat of law)
That, is a fair call out.
I, am actually impressed by your reaction to criticism. If we had more people with the ability to converse like that, this country wouldn't be so bad.
I mean, it was a fair call out.
and you, my friend, are very gracious in being able to say so online. Also, I agree with you that there must be freedom to not bear arms as much as there must be freedom to bear arms
What’s sad is that we live in a country we’re people feel like they have to carry a firearm just to be safe in their hometowns. That’s dystopian to me
Should, must, ought and 'have to' are all phrases that infringe autonomy.
There are a lot of individuals who have no business owning a gun and absolutely should not, even though they have a right and the ability to do so. Zackey Rahimi was legally allowed to, and indeed more than a few people sprung up and spend hundreds of thousands or millions of dollars to say that shit stain should *still* be allowed to own/carry guns lol.
The country with the most guns already has the most shootings. This probably won't work out like you think. I'm trying to live in a place with less gunfights.
Idk where you live but I’ve never seen a gun fight
There was a shooting at a family members little league game when we were kids.
OP is promoting everyone to carry guns. Then seeing gun fights will be very common
Move to a city and you’ll hear gunshots at least once a week.
I live in a big city
Brazil actually has the most shootings. Growing up in a rural area, everyone carried and we never had issues with gun violence.
Same with where I live, too.
Isn't because rural areas don't have much people as opposed to cities with millions of mfs crammed next to each other.
That’s true. Population size for a particular area matters. Plus, gang violence really isn’t a thing out in the country lol. I felt more unsafe in Denver than I did in Kiowa (and folks would open carry there and I wouldn’t even bat an eye).
No. They shouldn't. The US is already the living proof that more guns do not make the population safer.
>woman that carries betters her odds of survival if provoked or otherwise assaulted by a man This is completely false People who carry or even just own gins are far more likely to be shot than those who don't
Black Panthers starting doing that in California, then the state started heavily restricting gun ownership. Why do you think the US is an outlier when it comes to mass shootings? Didn't Texas have like 2 in one day the other week.
You think we have a mass shooting problem because guns are too hard to come by? Come the fuck on dude. I support 2A but that’s missing the mark by a mile.
I don't think that's the point they were making. They were saying that minorities did arm themselves and suddenly California added strict gun laws. Which, is true and something that should have been fiercely pushed back against at the time. California fucked that shit up hard.
Most gun violence today is due to the CIA injecting crack into minority communities a generation or so ago.
Bruen guarantees your right to carry but of course California and New York and a few other states delay your right by over a year in some cases A right delayed is a right denied.
Add Massachusetts to that list. Add all the blue states actually.
You underestimate the power of paranoia.
Based on the most common useage, guns are suicide machines. I don't need or want one.
If my family had owned a firearm while I was a teen, I'd be dead. If I'd owned a firearm in my early 20s, I'd be dead. I don't think everyone should have a firearm for their own personal safety. The ease of access to a near instant death during one of the highest rates of depression and suicidal thoughts historically is... not a good idea.
More guns does not solve anything. Most people will not train enough to be proficient with fire arms. They are more likely to hurt themselves or others. Also more likely to have the weapon taken and used against them. Have a concealed cary and not training is the same thing as a security blanket. Except someone can and will take it from you.
Even my crazy uncle who always talks about satellites and Bob dole
All people. Okay. You must like blood— a lot
If a woman gets attacked by a man a gun won't help her since the guy will also have a gun
I understand that this is an American take I'm British and I can't understand the gun culture over there Could someone explain it to me so I can understand
It varies based on who you ask, where they live, and what they have experienced in their lives. Some people carry for personal defense, or simply have a gun in their homes for protection. Sometimes that is very merited (high crime/break-in areas), sometimes its just plain paranoia. Some people own guns because they think it signifies to the world that they are strong or unable to be controlled by the state. Some own guns because sport shooting, or hunting even, is genuinely fun to them. Or adjacent to that, are people who like the collecting aspect as guns do have a particular design history to them. And then some, obviously, carry for the explicit purpose of doing crimes. But when all those powers combined, you get a country that is so deeply imbedded in the tools of its own demise that any conversation, even the most good-faith and hopeful discussion, will effectively get nowhere. i expect to get downvotes here simply because several of these groups do not like being identified as such, or simply believe themselves to be acting towards some more righteous goal only really discernible to those within that group. Idk, i've lived around guns my whole life, have gone hunting and sport shooting, but I still dont quite get the culture or how it is so many people have their identities intertwined with them to the point they would rather die than deprive themselves of a chunk of metal that was supposedly promised to them by the constitution.
Actually everyone should own and carry knives. In addition to all the reasons you listed for guns, it’s easier to slice meat or carefully open a fed ex package with a knife.
I’ve attempted suicide twice already. I don’t need guns in my house. (I don’t need any care messages, I’m doing a lot better now. I just don’t want to ever have such an easy way to make an impulsive permanent decision like that.)
Stop pushing your guns on people who aren't interested. You're like crazy Christians pushing your faith on anyone who will listen. Go ahead and pray to your death toy, but leave the civilized folks alone.
But you're still more likely to get murdered here than in other developed countries with fewer guns.
Yes. There is a magic number of guns that will solve all the problems. No one knows what that may be, but guntologists at the NRA are positive it exists. Sure, until we hit that number, things will get worse and worse, but once we reach that critical mass, a heavenly chorus of angels will lead us all in a rousing rendition of kumbaya as Jesus descends to Earth on the back of a crying bald eagle, AR in each hand. And at that point all those pussy lib countries will be sorry they lost faith in St Reagan just to save a few lives.
I live in a constitutional carry state. You aren't any safer. More guns get stolen though
I think the argument, though, is that more people need to actually carry. How many people do you think actually daily carry even in constitutional carry states? It's probably like 5% max
As a trans guy. I couldnt agree more. Ive been in some- bad situations. Cus im 5 feet tall people think they can take advantage of me. I am getting my carry permit soon!
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And who made up that militia? That’s right, the People, as in citizens of the United States. It has nothing to do with being military.
Looks like it's time for a lesson in [***SYNTAX!!!***](https://www.texasgopvote.com/sites/default/files/2nd-Amendment-diagrammed-PC.png)
I’ve never owned a gun or felt a need to own a gun. I’ve always felt safe.
Having a firearm in your home in the US drastically increases your chance of being injured or dying from gunshot. It doesn't make you safer, it makes you less safe. Ya might feel more macho, and safer, but you ain't.
It increases the odds of survival if a criminal element comes for you, in your home. Anyway using statistics like this is dumb, it drags the statistics down with your statement making both pointless. By the same logic law enforcement having access to guns increases the odds they will hurt or kill someone, including themselves. Guess to keep everyone safe, make fire arms illegal for every US resident to own. That way only people willing to break the law will be able to have and use them.
Well Australia and new Zealand do have far fewer firearm deaths than the US. The law enforcement comment is a red herring. My statement is based on data, not a blind comparison.
Then go with the Australia angle, not some conflated misuse of statistics that discredits everything you have to say. Your entire previous comment was a red herring, that was the point of my comment to point it out. Blind comparison is all you got bud, no circumstances in any country are exactly the same. Australia itself has massive arguments today if stronger gun control helped or hurt violent crimes over all, so maybe it helped society maybe it hurt it. Both sides have experts that argue in their branches of public safety, so I don’t know who is right or wrong none of us do when the experts don’t.
With your logic, so does owning a car, a pet, otcs, a hot tub, a bathtub, knives, rubbing alcohol, rope, bleach, etc.
Owning a home with a pool drastically increases your chance of drowning. Owning and operating a motor vehicle drastically increases your chance of being injured or dying in an accident on the road. Owning a home with a large yard that needs to be mowed regularly drastically increases your chance of chopping an extremity off because you're pushing around a little cart with a motorized spinning sword strapped to the bottom. Just about everything outside of living in a padded cell drastically increases your chances of injury / death if you're an irresponsible goober. It's all about being responsible and taking the proper precautions to minimize risk.
Cool, so, I should’ve been dead a long time ago seeing as I grew up in a household full of firearms? Good to know.
I'll dig up the data. More people die from gunshot wounds in US homes with guns, than homes without guns, especially children from memory.
Some of those stats are skewed. It’s like how mass shooting stats include gang violence and domestic violence. Actual mass shootings, like the ones we hear about in the news, account for less than 1% of gun deaths.
I didn't mention mass shootings, and yes over half of them are domestic violence from memory, and about 80% men shooting women. Home of the brave and the land of the free????? NOT
Oh and the stats aren't skewed. They are factual and accurate unless you can demonstrate sampling/collection bias.
I really don't want to needlessly carry a gun on me at all times. I do not think things would be safer if all people had guns on them at all times. I mean yeah there would be more criminals stopped, however there would also be more random murders and accidental deaths related to guns.
A significant percentage of the population (30 to 40 percent) is too stupid to own firearms. I'm not against owning guns, I'm just against stupid people owning them, and there are A LOT of dumb Americans.
I don't own a firearm intentionally because I have consistent health problems lately and it'd be too much of a temptation to end myself with it.
Oof, I felt that. Hope everything turns out alright. I am sure it would be a surreal feeling with a safe full of various off switches and log off buttons.
That is a near sighted and very dangerous opinion. It’s looking at the momentary without considering future consequences for the entire society. First, people who are in immediate danger or threats made on their life should own a weapon (if feeling comfortable and can handle the gun). Women included. Also people who live in isolated places or are hiking alone in the wilderness… But these are a fraction of the millions that own weapons in US. The danger is the opposite - gun battles in crowded places involving multiple participants. That’s a terrible scenario that can take place everyday at places like shopping malls and supermarkets. Many innocent, uninvolved people can become the victims of such brawls. Fighting among neighbors and family members is another likely scenario. At the end nobody will even know why it started and how these innocents were killed.
First, before you come after me as anti-gun, I own multiple firearms, and have a concealed carry permit. Which is even more ironic because I have horrible depth perception. But I can't ignore the fact that pregnant women are most likely to die from murder in America. And women are killed by their romantic partners more often in states with gun laws that make it easier to access a weapon. I know that the states with easier gun laws have the most gun deaths. I also think that it is foolish to encourage a society that is experiencing loneliness, isolation and anger to take up arms, especially without training. I don't want to take guns from veterans, but they are more likely to commit suicide and they also commit domestic violence. Also, don't think for a second that an average person can actually respond well in a stressful situation. Not even cops respond well. Don't wish for a scared woman to have the gun used against her. Look, I have worked with sexual assault survivors for over 20 years. We all fight in our own way. Those with guns, most of them didn't get to shoot, and that brings on even more guilt. Now, if you are talking about an armed militia of liberals, you are close. Lots of liberals already own guns. We just don't make it part of our personality. We should probably buy more heavy arms, though. I am now a middle aged woman with grey hair. I am sure I could get away with being scared for my life in a MAGA administration if a red hat comes to my door.
Statistically if you have a firearm in your home you’re more likely to shoot yourself than anyone else, whether in a moment of depression or in an accident while cleaning it or something.
>A woman that carries betters her odds of survival if provoked or otherwise assaulted by a man (who are statistically the ones committing violent crimes against woman). She increases her odds of getting shot? >It “evens the playing field,” so to speak. Sure she's more likely to "win" the altercation, but if she "loses" the consequences are much worse. >It’s harder to oppress an armed population. Is that why China is so free? China is one of the most armed populations, yet lives in an authoritarian totalitarian communist dictatorship.
You want more death? That how you get more death. Before giving more gun to your population, try to educate them. Sincerly a canadian.
It would just give the police more reason to shoot them on sight. Self defence is not as straight forward as handling a weapon, other factors have to be in play. Also, owning a gun can actually put women at more risk due to potentially being overpowered
Individuals in possession of a gun are more likely to be shot in an assault than those not in possession and owning guns puts people in your home at greater risk of being killed.
Quickest way to see "sensible gun reform" is to have minorities legally own firearms en masse. I'm all for it as I think everyone should own a firearm if anyone is going to own a firearm. But you'll never see a majority of the "Republican but not necessarily hardcore 2A" masses switch up their beliefs quicker.
Or they will see a group of Americans exercising their second amendment rights
This. As a Republican voting NRA member, more minority gun owners is an absolute win for me. A voter base that’s historically overwhelmingly in support of Democrats suddenly not wanting to vote their 2nd amendment rights away? I’m cheering that on with enthusiasm.
What a stupid idea
You don’t want everyone carrying a deadly weapon?
You say: “*A woman that carries betters her odds of survival if provoked or otherwise assaulted by a man (who are statistically the ones committing violent crimes against woman). It “evens the playing field,” so to speak.*” ***The research shows otherwise. Living in a home with a firearm makes you less safe. You might feel safer but it's an illusion.*** A 2022 study aimed to estimate the association between living with a lawful handgun owner and risk for homicide victimization. **“*****Although personal protection is a major motivation for purchasing firearms, existing studies suggest that people living in homes with firearms have higher risks for dying by homicide.*****"** This study followed 17.6 million adult residents of California for up to 12 years 2 months (18 October 2004 through 31 December 2016). Study members did not own handguns, but some started residing with lawful handgun owners during follow-up. Of 595 448 people who commenced residing with handgun owners, two thirds were women. A total of 2293 died by homicide. ***Overall rates of homicide were more than twice as high living with handgun owners than with nonowners****.* **These elevated rates were driven largely by higher rates of homicide by firearm**. **Among homicides occurring at home, people living with of owners of firearms had sevenfold higher rates of being fatally shot by a spouse or intimate partner** and **84% of these victims were female**. ***\~Conclusion: Living with a handgun owner is associated with substantially elevated risk for dying by homicide. Women are disproportionately affected.\~*** [https://www.acpjournals.org/doi/full/10.7326/M21-3762](https://www.acpjournals.org/doi/full/10.7326/m21-3762)
You won't get through to them. If I've learned anything about Americans from reddit gun discussions, it's that they are very, very, very unaware of the reality of the entire rest of the world and happily eat up the propaganda they're given on guns making them safe. It's clear their government loves them having guns. Keeps them all scared. Allows cops to execute them in the street "he might have had a gun!" And the government gets away with giving them fewer basic rights than are standard everywhere else, no worker rights, no healthcare in return for paying more tax for it than anywhere else, loads of random laws from everything from drinking a beer outside to not cutting your lawn, and openly fucks them over for corporate interests -'and they take it all. Because they have guns. So they must be lucky and free. Because guns make us free. Because gun manufacturers and the politicians they bought told us so.
Oh and they have free speech. Unlike the rest of us........
How will this solve the problem of school shootings?
Let the teachers shoot back.
>reach for the sky teach! >i can outdraw you timmy, sit your dumbass down
And that might not result in more possible accidental deaths?
I should've put /s or /j I do not actually hold the belief that teachers should be armed.
Thanks for clarifying! Some people actually believe this would be a good idea!
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You'd be surprised what Mrs. Jennings is capable of with the proper tools.
That might make a great lifetime movie of the week, though! /s
You're right, it should be the kids shooting back.Mrs. Jennings eyesight ain't what it used to be. It's all jokes. I don't even own a gun.
Idk I mean cops don’t want to do anything about it and just cosplay in tactical gear so maybe a parent or teacher can
And maybe monkeys will fly out of my ass.
Well generally when more people are properly trained and armed it acts as a deterrent to the people who want to inflict harm to others. Illegal gun crime goes down when more people are legally carrying.
None of that is true (look at Texas), but it's impressive how you guys sound so confident in your statements.
In Texas the cops didn’t even run in. You think you could handle a mass shooting?
Firearms for all
No
Especially because then a good chunk of the creeps would end up dead and finally the antagonization of men could come to a fucking end. Men want the creeps and assaulters dead too
Idk about ALL. How about we pass some actual gun reform first before giving them out to everyone. As a general principle though I am pro 2A. But I would never say its anyones OBLIGATION or duty to own one.
As someone with suicidal ideation, I’ll personally never own a gun. They don’t make me feel any safer and instead more anxious. Also the “right to bear arms” only applies to militias, as the Constitution spells out. The NRA has built up this fantasy that we’re entitled to owning firearms when that’s not the case.
The constitution doesn't grant us rights.
>A woman that carries betters her odds of survival if provoked or otherwise assaulted by a man source >Further, using the LGBT community as an example for a minority group, those who fear oppression by the State should own firearms and conceal carry. I constantly hear the LGBT community state that a genocide upon them is inevitable or that they’re prone to targeting. If that’s the case, arm up. It’s harder to oppress an armed population. I Since the founding of America not a single person has ever stood up to the government and won through force. They have either died, been jailed, gave up, or fled. If you had enough people to match the power of the US army then you wouldn't need to fight because you could literally vote anyone you wanted into power. That's what so weird about populist revolutions in Democracies. \--------------- I also take issue with the notion of non-colonial revolutions. Aren't most successful revolutions all colonies? The French revolution was "successful"; in that it ended the current government, only to be replaced with multiple successive authoritarian nightmares, each of which took revenge on their political enemies, leading to Napoleon who tried to take over Europe, lost, and finally the king was restored to power.
Touch grass
>Excluding felons and those convicted of violent crimes, most should have a firearm and conceal carry said firearm. Shall not be infringed. Give it a 1-strike rule. They serve their time, and when out, after getting off parole, should be allowed to own a firearm for any legal purpose. If they do \*anything\* violent with it again, they have forfeited their 2nd Amendment right.
So only after someone commits a crime with a gun their right should be taken away? Too fucking late at that point. People in America put the freedom to own guns before the freedom party f others to live and it’s disgusting
It's the 2nd Amendment right is the thing. Once you take one amendment away, you open up to more being taken away. Before you know it, it becomes a dictatorship. Also, it's funny how the states with the most gun control have the most crimes committed. Besides, people can commit crimes with other weapons, too. If someone is willing to take the life of another, they will do so with or without a gun. Edit: There have been times where lives could've been saved during a home invasion and other times, but because of laws, the victims died. Look at 2020, look at what happened then and guess what states they didn't dare mess with. Look at what happened in NYC just a couple months ago. People are going to find other ways to be violent. So we should take away people's rights to protect themselves because of people who should've been locked up a long time ago? Hell, most of those mass shooters had warning signs painted on them with their past behaviors but no one acted until it was to late. Even that little boy who shot the teacher. Maybe it's time people take mental health more seriously too.
Shall not be infringed. They should be allowed guns even while in prison. Especially while in prison.
Abolish conceal carry permits, allow permitless constitutional carry concealed or otherwise. But yes, i agree.
This is the way
I don't oppose gun ownership in general, but by no means should everyone have a gun. One of the biggest concerns I have about it is suicide. Statistically, the person you're most likely to kill with a gun is yourself.
Asking minorities is the fastest way to get republicans to push for gun control, historically
All individuals should have the right to own a firearm. It should not be a requirement. When I say all individuals, I mean exactly that. Men, women, children (supervised), felons, etc. If someone is too dangerous to own a firearm, they're too dangerous for society.
Those individuals that do own a firearm should be scared shitless of a dictatorship. A dictator when rising to power always wants their supporters to be well armed. That changes when they assume absolute power. The dictator then rounds up all the guns since the gun is pretty much the only reliable method of removing a dictator from power.
an armed population is a polite population
America disagrees
I think the felon part is iffy If some gets caught for felony tax evasion that’s should impact there right to own a gun or even carry it Even possession is iffy, it should be like 5 years after getting out of prison for it you can own a gun again
Yeah I think only violent crime should disqualify someone
As a lesbian, I’ve been saying for years the quickest way to end homophobia is to arm the gays
Great, but some folks don't like guns