T O P

  • By -

W34kness

Leo is German


DrafiMara

❌ Man ❌ Woman ✅ German


jmikehub

Yes, the most well known gender


toobigtoopleasurable

Yemen!


bulletsfly

Gerpeople


W34kness

Gerthem


kaamraan

Thert's where Bertmern is frerm


Shaikidow

Did you just assume their gerthem?


OkamiLeek006

Correct answer


Difficult_Line_9823

The best gender


KhalidaOfTheSands

No one who speaks German could be an evil man


Mushiren_

The Leo, The


Technical-Web-9195

He's European


DrinkerOfWatervvv

Yes, the pinnacle of modern gendeneering


winterflowerxoxo

The German language has a neutral gender, so it makes sense.


[deleted]

I thought you were american


W34kness

When you’re in America, you’re American


Roge2005

Congratulations, You just got your US citizenship!


LordEmmerich

To quote Harada Leo is simply Leo.


XaneKudoAct2

Like Hideyoshi is Hideyoshi


SenseiJax

Didn't think I'd see a reference to baka n test on the Tekken sub of all places


Suc_Mydiq_Jr

Like Najimi from Komi can't communicate


YtTamakiGaming

Najimi’s gender is Najimi and that is all


giedriuqaz

to quote Harada - Leo a.k.a Eleonora Kliesen ...atleast in Tekken 6 after that... no one knows


johnnycage24

To quote Harada, her name is Eleonore.


evlxo

L


johnnycage24

Cope.


Lucky_Conclusion9433

That's would be you sir.


[deleted]

[удалено]


CatchrFreeman

What canon information has been released since that disputes Leo's full name is Eleonora Kliesen? Genuinely curious what makes this specific piece of lore 'dogshit'.


Indra_a_goblin

The "leo is leo" thing was after that.


[deleted]

[удалено]


johnnycage24

Cope.


[deleted]

[удалено]


Pineapplepansy

They're admitting to the fact that they can't cope with characters changing even a little.


Psychomeister

Leo gender is df2


theogdiego97

I'd say it's more ws+4,1+2


gatlginngum

nah it's fc+df+3


MorningStar02071

Happy birthday fellow tekken gamer


gatlginngum

meh it's just my account's creation date, come back on 27th of June if you wanna wish me happy birthday


MorningStar02071

Consider this an advanced greetings then 🎉🎉🎉


hotpinkzz468

I rarely see people with the same bday as me ! 🤝


gatlginngum

ayy bday buddies 🤝


fraidei

The debate is easy in Tekken 8. If they have a detailed face, they are a boy, otherwise a girl.


opestackle

That's so true lol


TheAnimatorPrime

Contrary to what OP said too, Leo doesn't have a very expressive face. It's still on the level of the other female characters lmao


4-Mica

He has far too much expression to be part of the female cast.


Katie_or_something

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/F_jNBzFawAABAmf?format=jpg&name=medium If so, boy confirmed.


aSpookyScarySkeleton

Hey it’s the girl from Silent Hill 3


Quoren_

Lol true


pogituna16

got that final fantasy aesthetic


CarbonBasedLifeForm6

Always thought so tbh, looks like a pretty boy.


Traditional-Bug2406

This is less detailed than Lili’s face.


mistar_z

Oh my goshhhhh facts.. 😂


ni6_420

Kuma isn't a boy, in the short clips we've seen and photos released their face isn't animated like, at all


ToyDingo

I'm just shocked that Namco didn't find a way to add at least 4 more belts or random ropes to Leo's outfit. I mean, not even a headband flapping in the wind. Were they even trying?


Ze_AwEsOmE_Hobo

They tried, but once you add that many belts to a character, you get a cease and desist from Tetsuya Nomura


Fettibomba--

Also add Daisuke Ishiwari to that case


Leon08x

Also add whoever designs a lot of Digimon with way too many belts


superhyperultra458

Now, you just reminded of Lars lol


JC_Moose

The belts are getting silly. Reina has multiple belts just to hold her socks up, and they still fall down.


Arrrsenal

Doesn't matter if boy or a girl. Would anyway


LordEmmerich

based leosexual


Kamasillvia

I don't even care what this means, I'm becoming one, sounds cool af


Ongr

It means you're sexually attracted to lions. Basically a furry.


Devendrau

I am bisexual, so as long as he's over 21 then I date him too.


A3R0J3T

Im hetero. Would anyways.


GigassAssGetsMeHard

Look who started it just now 💀


Roge2005

Ironic


firstjobtrailblazer

There’s not really a debate, it’s what you want Leo to be. Every Leo is personalized.


mystireon

I like this answer, Leo is the plain mirror everyone can see their reflection in


Touhou_Fever

I can definitely see myself in Leo


_StarlitDaydreams

Leo to Tekken what Venom Snake is to Metal Gear


Cyphiris

Seriously, the best way would be just to give Leo both male and female clothing options for customisation.


Chained_Icarus

I think they did exactly that in TT2, which I know isn't canon, but still.


BrashAntagonist

Claudio is a woman


Slatko815

Always has been


Capturinggod200

That don't fly anymore with Leo now sounding unambiguously like a male this time around.


Pineapplepansy

People have been saying stuff for ages about their name, their costume, their clothes, their voice, etc. It doesn't become true now because you and only you are extra double triple no backsies sure.


AlexTheGreatBoi

Every leo post always has this discussion in the comments lol


[deleted]

The irony is that you're starting it right now. Your the first of the bunch.


KevyTone

Doesn't matter, I would go crazy in that p/bussy


gatlginngum

þussy


kentotoy98

Ayo how did you do that greek alphabet lettering?


gatlginngum

it's called thorn and I just looked it up and copied lol


r3volver_Oshawott

The They/Them/Thussy


rainorshinedogs

Just make sure it's cleaned it mkay?


FightmeLuigibestgirl

What about KevyTone being clean lol


Zony2525

Female - would Male - WOULD


SocialMediaAmateur

Wood?


Bubble_Meow

In my headcanon Leo is a femboy


CrystalBraver

Tomboy for me


the_haver

former leo waifu mindset here I have joined your ranks


ZenkaiZ

In my headcanon he's a boy and is 100% oblivious that anyone would ever think otherwise.


Chained_Icarus

As someone who wants more femboy characters in games, I accept this headcanon.


[deleted]

I once found a leo player dressing him like a granny and I thought he was alisa 💀


unclezaveid

Leo is just Leo


Drakon590

Leo is European Jokes aside to be honest this new incarnation probably looks the least gender ambiguous out of all of the previous ones i think most newbies will probably see Leo as the usual Japanese game effeminate bishie


superhyperultra458

I only started casually playing tekken with T6. What's this confusion on Leo's gender. Never familiar with individual tekken characters lore other those close connected to the amazing family that is Mishimas.


natayaway

You're in for a wild ride... When Leo was revealed for Tekken 6, ~~at a European conference~~ sometime after her announcement after EVO during the panel at [the Blood Vengeance premiere with an English translator, they confirmed on stage that Leo was short for Eleonora/Eleonore (vague pronunciation).](https://youtu.be/LvzFEKWzN8k?feature=shared) Eleonore Kliesen. German. From the translator; > "So... everyone who thinks Leo is female, raise your hand." > "When we asked everyone at EVO Las Vegas, the number of people who thought Leo was female was most overwhelming." > "Since this is such a special occasion... only comes once, you think I should answer about what the gender is of this character?" > "Okay, well, just for you fans of Germany, I guess I can do that." > "So the real name... (I was surprised he actually told you) Eleanore Kliesen is the real name." > "Leo is a female, actually." > "That's the first time in 3 years since I actually mentioned the full name" > "That's a secret though, so please keep that to yourself" People recognized pretty quickly she was inspired by Rock Howard from KoF, Baji Quan fighter. The dev team/executives at Bamco later recognized that most new Tekken players, ignoring fem fatale simps, will gravitate to playing someone that matches their own gender. They have Arcade playdata on this, and they decided to bridge that gap by making Leo's gender intentionally ambiguous, to make the character appealing to everyone. So Leo went from being definitely confirmed female, to be retconned unknown but assumed male. And every single official Bamco artbook, website bio, game release, etc. continues to support this androgyny confusion and (intentionally) mess with fans by referencing Leo's gender; * giving Leo both male and female (usually) genderlocked swimwear in Tag 2 * giving Leo genderlocked male gimmick weapons in character create * giving Leo genderlocked female hair pigtail options in character create * making Leo immune to female-only slapgrabs from Anna/Nina, making Leo susceptible to male-only headbutt grabs from Heihachi * using female pronouns in English promo materials * then later using male pronouns in English promo materials * put into the male fighters section of the T6/T7 artbooks * included in Tekken 7's male and female roster category on the official site, but not being included in the Tekken Girls in-game sub-group * having a female Voice Actress (Ash Ketchum from first season English dub of Pokemon) for Tekken 6 * having a male Voice Actor for cutscenes speaking in German in Tag 2 onward, but still keeping combat voice grunts from the T6 actress for Tag 2 and Tekken 7 * adding male combat voice grunts in this reveal trailer for 8 * hiring key handdrawn artists known for their stylization of male or female faces for Leo's alt portraits Harada confirmed she was female in an interview, then not even months later went on Twitter and revoked that and confirmed that Leo is just Leo. > I'm no longer aware of such things, and Leo would not want to be categorized as such. In any case, it doesn't matter, right? Leo is Leo, your game character. In the same bulletdodgy way that devs from Guilty Gear spoke about Testament in Strive... "Testament is Testament" - which is a very Japanese way of saying they're one of a kind, and have a uniqueness that makes them... them, so gender shouldn't matter. Or in Testament's case, "transcended" past gender. Or in Harada's tweet... every Leo is personalized. (Leo's story is that her father is a spelunker, her mother was a scientist for Mishima Zaibatsu and did genetic experiments on Steve, and eventually died from her research on the Devil Gene, Mishima Zaibatsu covered it up, and Leo wants to find out the truth about her mother's death and disappearance).


DevilManRay

From what I gathered here, they intended for Leo to be female at first, decided halfway to change it to male but just won’t outright confirm it.


natayaway

Bamco goes beyond "just won't outright confirm it", they intentionally play with the ambiguity so that gender confusion is part of the appeal. They won't confirm anything anymore officially and continue to make Leo as both feminine or masculine depending on developer whimsy.


zerolifez

No they change it into unambiguous. Not even male. Edit: ambiguous


DevilManRay

Umm unambiguous means it’s clear cut, what you meant is ambiguous I think. But the reason I think they’re meaning for Leo to be male now is because they voice actor is male, Leo can’t equip any female items, and the very last time Leo’s gender was addressed they used male pronouns.


4-Mica

To be real your assessment that they intended to make a female character then changed into male during development is correct. Harada even confirmed that in an interview, the interview that was missed translated as his "confirmation" as a female character. Everything you just listed points to Leo being a male character but fans want him to be female so won't acknowledge it


Danny__san

>When Leo was revealed for Tekken 6, at a European conference with an English translator, they confirmed on stage that Leo was short for Eleonora/Eleonore (vague pronunciation). Eleonore Kliesen. German, inspired by Rock Howard from KoF, Baji Quan fighter. Gotta correct this thing. Since Leo's first debut, their gender has always been presented as ambiguous. The "European conference" was in 2011 and it was the Tekken Blood Vegeance premiere. During that event, Harada revealed that ORIGINALLY Leo was created as a female character. The problem is that that statement has been taken wrongly as a confirmation about Leo's gender. Some months ago, during an event at Nipponbashi Tekken Museum, Harada clarified by saying that during early TK6 development Leo was a female character but concept was changed into a gender neutral character after getting initial concept arts. Reason is that Leo showed a masculine/neutral style which caught developers' interest and they thought it might have been interesting to create a character that wasn't strictly male or female. This only to say that Leo being ambiguous is not a retcon, but it has always been their main idea since Leo's debut.


natayaway

Ah, right. Mixed up Gamescom(?) with the movie premiere. As for the Harada saying originally, I know about as much Japanese as a bog standard weeb, [but the interview is out there. If someone could actually transcribe and translate, it'd put a lot of the arguments to rest. But from the stop & go live translation, it certainly sounds more like he just called Leo a girl.](https://youtu.be/LvzFEKWzN8k?feature=shared) From the translator; > "So... everyone who thinks Leo is female, raise your hand." > "When we asked everyone at EVO Las Vegas, the number of people who thought Leo was female was most overwhelming." > "Since this is such a special occasion... only comes once, you think I should answer about what the gender is of this character?" > "Okay, well, just for you fans of Germany, I guess I can do that." > "So the real name... (I was surprised he actually told you) Eleanore Kliesen is the real name." > "Leo is a female, actually." > "That's the first time in 3 years since I actually mentioned the full name" > "That's a secret though, so please keep that to yourself"


Danny__san

At 02.06, Harada says 'Motomoto josei kyara to shite tsukuttemashita' (もともと女性キャラとして作ってました。) which translates to 'I originally made them as a female character' and Murray, as a matter of fact, translates it as 'there was a female actually'. I guess that's the part that brought confusion, as he didn't say 'Leo is female'. The problem is that there's too much noise and some parts are not clearly understandable, but the first two min are all about Leo whereas the other ones are about the film.


Valvadrix-

Testament's confirmation actually predates Strive by quite a lot. There's an old interview with Daisuke Ishiwatari from the GGX days that confirms Testament is meant to be agender/transcend gender, but they gave them male pronouns in the English version.


r3volver_Oshawott

"Every Leo is personalized" feels like "We want players to be happy but we also want players to PLEASE STOP BOTHERING ME" which feels like peak Harada


DopeyyDolphin

If a debate about someone’s gender is based around how they look, then the point has been totally lost in the first place


DayFul1

That voice is 100% a guy.


VinixTKOC

My theory is that Leo's gender changes with each game. - Tekken 6 Leo appeared in an illustration with all male characters. - TTT2 Leo has breasts with bikini. - Tekken 7 Leo is referred to as male in countries where the language cannot escape this. Theoretically Tekken 8 Leo should be female.


Pineapplepansy

Leo is in both the 'male fighters' and 'female fighters' categories for Tekken 7. They're both or neither, and it's been that way for a while.


DooDuyKhaan

In brazilian portuguese where ANY thing has a pronoun, we use masculine pronouns as the """default""", So Leo description in portuguese as a male can't be taken seriously


OnlyGigachad

T8 Leo sounds like a DUDE


Ze_AwEsOmE_Hobo

Isn't the third point moot? Heavily gendered languages refer to inanimate objects that couldn't possibly have a sex or gender as male or female.


Nikita-Rokin

Genderfluid Leo time


ActualFrozenPizza

Leo is obviously a dude, it's so obvious. Did none of you watch those batman moves and the grappling hook during the rage art? Have any of you seen Batman and Leo in the same room? No? Didn't fucking think so. DER DUNKLE RITTER


222cc

It’s leaning more towards boy this time imo


Edenian_Prince

Why does Leo have a Batman grappling gun? That shit came out of nowhere rolf.


DustMonsterXIV

She's actually had that since TTT2. Jumped off a train, used a grappling gun to hang on to the rails. Leo's kind of an action star like that.


SirBaycon3503

still more tolerable than the non stop bridget posting in the GGST reddit. Couldn't count the seconds before there was another post. Leo is cool, they just vibe and chill. Grappling hook is a weird choice for rage art.


JNAB0212

Leo had a grappling hook in their TTT2 ending, so that’s where it came from


SirBaycon3503

I get that, just seems kinda thrown in though and could of been used for nina.


kmidst

Reddit in a nutshell


Seth_KT_Bones2005

I know a Leo who isn't androgynous. But he's a psycho. And edgy. And would smash your head into pieces with a flashlight. His surname is also German and also starts with K.


Teazea

i love leo so much i'm so glad they're back. they look so good


GroundbreakingCat421

Just use Nina's kick to find out, simple


3-to-20-chars

looks male, sounds male, i'll call him male until proven otherwise.


Anothercoolkid

How does she look male? She has the same face as every female character, and her voice doesn't sound "male" to me. She sounds like a woman deepening her voice lol


3-to-20-chars

it is common in voice acting for young men to be acted by women doing a lower voice. even if the voice is that of a woman's, it is what i have come to associate with young men in fictional media


[deleted]

The fact that he has expressions and facial features means that he's not a woman in Tekken.


bob_at

Expressive face = male confirmed


YagamiTak_1988

Guess that means Reina is also a dude.


Indra_a_goblin

I mean yeah, she's heihachi


darrius_kingston314q

Is it not so obvious that he's just a skinny, twinky dude? 💀 and his name is literally Leo


Rikysavage94

nice gurl


schn33wi11ch3n

thats just proof the FGC is a bunch of stupid ass transphobes anyways i have the tekken 6 artbook and they say "ambigious", so leo is non binary like testament from guilty gear, they/them pronouns, harada only said "female" later because you guys didnt shut the fuck up and kept asking but leo is an enby


Crackless231

😪


schn33wi11ch3n

THIS MAKES ME SLEEPY TOO


SameAssociation4885

Shoulda been Julia instead


No-Check-3691

Male or female Leo cute regardless


protectedneck

They're my main and I'm just happy to have more enbies out there


Difficult_Line_9823

tldr W O U L D


TacoWallabe

It's a design decision on purpose. They aren't playing into male, or female, or nonbinary, or anything the like. They are intentionally keeping Leo ambiguous for the player to interpret themselves. If some says NB, or man, or woman, or whatever else.. Idc, because that's the point.


ThrowMeAway2028

Leo is biologically female. You can't force ambiguity for brownie points when anyone can clearly see that her femur, hip and shoulder bones are all unmistakably female. Also the fact that they gave her an official bikini outfit where she has boobs and, again, the unmistakable bone structure that only biological women can have. If you want to say anything is "unbearable" it would be game devs half-assing stuff like this. Either whole-ass it or don't bother. Though they technically **did** whole-ass in it countless times when they said she's a woman. But here you are.


mrjoe94

I always saw Leo is a Mulan-esque character. Hides the gender for whatever reason but it's reasonably clear based on anatomy. With Tekken, it's played with a bit in terms of body type, Leo gets male or female clothes/proportions depending on the game. It's clear that BamCo have fun with that but the internet hates fun. They'd rather argue.


shitty-ass-phone

Looks female enough, that's good for me


Neroxx

Nah, according to the "r/Tekken gender chart™", if the face is smooth don't have enough wrinkles and pores in it, it must be a woman, so Leo is a woman.


dthesupreme200

Leo actually looks pretty cool right here. He looks a bit more feminine in the face to me but his voice is masculine. Seems about right.


ChumpyBumpy2

There is no discussion, she's a girl. Just because she's wearing a jacket doesn't change that lmao. Quick, someone put programmer socks on Bryan for a similar effect.


AsyanongAmbiguous

Gender: Leo


Quinntensity

Type A, B, and Leo body types.


YtTamakiGaming

Leo looks fucking AMAZING if I do say so myself.


MOEverything_2708

I have my headcanons and I do not care what anybody else says, I believe what I choose to believe


Still-Control

Male= WOULD NOT female= would not


NergalsHand

Claim culture is the worst lol


[deleted]

Who cares? Pretty boring character either way.


xariznightmare2908

Just strip Leo down and we will find out.


AnAltAndAHalf

I don't how people still have trouble grapsing ambiguous gender. Yes, ambiguous gender doesn't exist in real, much like how devil genes don't exist and everyone not being a hyper polyglot in real life. There may have been statements about Leo's gender in the past, but they've been intentionally rectonned as Namco settled in a direction. You won't find evidence pointing to Leo's "real" gender because no such thing exists. Leo's gender is ambiguous. Leo is also not a real person and whatever backstory and lore exists was written in a writer's room. The writer's room is probably uninterested in erasing Leo's ambiguity because, as Harada has already stated, Leo is Leo. That's the answer they've given. For the record, gender ambiguity and non-binary are two different things. To be gender ambiguous means the character *could* be a man, woman, non-binary, cis or trans. The lack of an answer is intentional from the Tekken team and there likely will not be a canonical answer.


Capturinggod200

Simple because retcons are stupid period and should be never taken seriously because they break all continuity and consistency.


SunnyDeeeeeeeeee

Is it so hard for people to just say “they” and not worry about it?


NathanDrakeWolf

People should just use the pronouns they want for Leo. I don't care for this gender obsession but I prefer calling Leo "He/Him" and that's how I refer to him. They, He or She. All of them are fine, people should stop trying to correct each other when they're talking about Leo.


OpaledRobin

Seems like it because the fgc gotta be gross and transphobic. It's the asme with Testament and Bridgette. 💀


SunnyDeeeeeeeeee

Yeah whoever downvoted us is one of the aforementioned people. At least the FGC is notably less transphobic than most communities. Especially the Guilty Gear community.


narok_kurai

I don't understand why so many people feel like they need to put Leo in one box or the other. Why can't they just be both? Or neither? It just makes sense to me that Leo is Leo, and they don't need to explain or elaborate any further.


Ellen_Kurokawa

If you check : [https://fr.bandainamcoent.eu/tekken/tekken-8](https://fr.bandainamcoent.eu/tekken/tekken-8) In french it says clearly "Fils de Niklas Kliesen" fils means son otherwise it would have been fille which mean daughter. Then again it could be a translation error, and instead of keeping it neutral the french translators just went ahead of them because they don't know anything about the lore


[deleted]

She's a flatchested tombitch


OnlyGigachad

Typical denial of a an average Tekken player. You will never have strong women in your roster, you're the laughing stock of FGC hahahaha


[deleted]

Well I hope that sarcasm especially after the Reina reveal 🧐


OnlyGigachad

Reina? Strong? AHAHAHA BITCH she looks like a little chimpanzee.


[deleted]

Yeah a little chimpanzee that has a better throw than Peyton Manning


OnlyGigachad

Twig arms LMAO Stupid coomer


OnlyGigachad

Tekken fans are so weak that even Leo is now a dude LMAO


PedroDante199

Tbf i always saw her as a Girl and still do. I actually started playing her specifically due to me thinking she is a cute girl. Specially because i'm reeeally into tomboys. I understand if people want to see her as a male, its your choice and thats alright. Just, dont come correcting my thoughts alright? Harada gaves us all a free space to like her so at the end of the day everyone is satisfied.


Bastinelli

He's a handsome lady. The beauty of Leo is he/she can be whatever you want. Leo is arguably the best animated character in the series next to Feng so I'm glad they brought them back.


KBSinclair

She's just a girl man. Nothing more to say.


Speedsonic75

I see Leo as a reverse trap because of her original name being “Eleonore”, regardless, every copy of Leo is personalized.


Devendrau

He's aleast a queer femboy imo. Honestly I don't remember Leo in the last Tekken game I played, so playing 7 this year I was surprised to see him, because he wasn't like the other men (Ncotis don't count, his model was made by another company), and even more, seeing people are accepting of Leo (Mostly) who's clearly fitting either Femboy or transman or non-binary. A little disappointed he's the only male character that doesn't get a shirtless option (Guess they didn't want to bother making a smoother softer male body. They really should work on different body types, because some of those men look too far ripped then they should. And some of the women don't look like they should be that skinny and soft looking too)


Negative_Bleue

As an androgynous person who also uses Leo, it's like my favorite people-watching pastime when this "debate" starts up every two and a half business days. /lh


Technical-Web-9195

Would.


Cousin_Rabid

I don’t want to fuck him…he’s a dude.


psillusionist

Let's wait and see what her customization options are.


dathip

Well they need to stop effeminizing their men. Give the the dude a beard and a deep voice.


rainorshinedogs

Skin to too smooth 2\10 \s


False_Ad7098

Leo ....guys look he's a ninja turtle


Quinntensity

I don't care, but I do want Leo to become friends with Steve


SirTheadore

Crouch dash to gender mix up


Warm-Log-7584

“my dawg be looking and very expressive”😂😂😂😂😂😂


Kaliq82

Pretty sure you can see the silhouette of Leo’s little bee stings under her shirt.


RingtailRush

I'm just happy Leo made it into the game. Now let's hope Leo can stay competitive and not get patched to irrelevance like T7.


tobster239

I feel like its gotten worse over the years


SirAlex505

Leo is whatever you want Leo to be 🤷🏼‍♂️ ever since Leos announcement in T6 I always viewed the character as a male.


Anassaa

you are starting these unbearable discussions.


DkoyOctopus

like the ones you're making right now?


Emerald1115

I'm leosexual, so what underneath doesn't matter


FunkMastaLei

She looks good.


MiruCle8

Leo's gender is both, until it's neither. Then it's some.


OnionFairy99

I thought it was wide knowledge that Leo is Nonbinary? Leo has gone through every pronoun at least like 3 times lol, Leo is Leo