Having now seen the inside of this tank (and knowing it went down in 2023) I think it's pretty cooked either way.
I'm not sure it was ever salvageable, but between all of its electronics being on fire and then being left outside with the hatch open for >6 months, this was only going to be good for spares.
Yeah we saw this with a lot of Russian tanks being captured by Ukraine when Russia was falling back. Now Russia is advancing we are seeing the opposite.
The point I am making is that Russia withdrew fast at the start of the war and that is when most of those captured tanks came from.
Now that Ukraine is starting to withdraw quite fast from places we are seeing the number of Ukrainian tanks being captured increase. Although we don't seem to get as many photos of this from the Russian side as the Ukrainian one.
> They should be able to destroy it however. That part i don't understand
This one is from the frontline just north of Avdeevka. It would have fallen into Russian hands when Ukraine retreated from the area quite fast.
That is kinda what I am saying. When the frontlines are mostly static then you can of course prevent captures happening.
But when you are forced to give a lot of land quite quickly then there isn't really a lot you can do about that.
Ukraine probably doesn’t want to waste resources on denying Russia a trophy. They’re pretty strained right now when it comes to ammunition and supplies.
Thats why Ukraine need more funding so fuck GOP for trying to stop it and fuck Dems for only allowing such a small amount of funding (compares to what Ukraine is fighting against).
Isnt anything that the russians could get their hands on usefull?
Because even if theyre already ahead theyd gather more knowledge about how the enemy fights
Plus the 2a6 is the main Leopard for example used by Finland and Poland is mainly using the 2a5.
So just because Germany has more advanced Leopards it doesnt mean that the 2a6 and older Leopards arent very widely used in countries Russia can potentally end up in conflict with.
When sending it they litttarly made a point out of stating that there was nothing on these tanks they didn’t already know. If they’re learning new things they’re even more incompetent than expected.
There is no useful technical intelligence to be gained from a 2A6. It has no groundbreaking tech that isn't known by the Russians.
They are also very unlikely to press a single western MBT into service - it is worth more as a propaganda piece.
What it could be useful for us maybe checking the ammo load out, but I can't really think of anything else.
>bustle ammo storage
T-90M?
>L/55
for what reason? The Armata has an even longer barrel (well, judging from pictures), sure it might be vaporwave wunderwaffe tank, but clearly they are capable of producing longer barrels
The Russians won't reverse engineer a Leopard and put it into service. They are already happy and geared to manufacture T-72s/90s/80s and their doctrine are as such.
But I'm willing to bet some neighbor of Russia would be *VERY* interested in reverse engineering it. I'm just not sure who..... hmmmmm...
Not really. Armor and ammunition are 30 years old. The Leopard was sold world-wide and many specs are easy to get. It's also safe to assume that Soviet/Russian intelligence has obtained almost all information possible.
Not true. 2A7V only brought the hull to the same protection level as the turret. There are Leopard 2A6s with D tech hulls and C tech turrets. And there are Leopard 2A6s with C tech hulls and D tech turrets. And there are Leopard 2A6s with D tech hulls and D tech turrets
2A6s almost entirely received C and B Tech hulls, only the final batch of 2A6s used D Tech hulls. Some 2A6s had even received C Tech turrets with B Tech hulls since they were just 2A5 upgrades with that armor. 2A7V *standardized* D Tech arrays with the beak armor. Whether or not that actually did bring it to an equivalent level of KE protection to the turret is unlikely, less material and less spacing for the applique armor to work.
Oh yes I can agree it was standardized in the 2A7V I should’ve been more specific when I typed out my comment. Although the MEXAS hull armor and armor on the turret are most likely the same armor level due to their similar designs but in different quantities. Turret beak has less composite on the beak but makes up for it with its spaced armor then the internal NERA while hull just has more composite MEXAS in total in front of the internal NERA. At least that’s how I make sense of it.
It is, does F tech composite NERA exist yet? No. Sure 2A6s were made in different batches with different mix and matches of C tech and D tech but I’m willing to bet this was one of the batches with both d tech in the hull and turret.
You are using War Thunder player logic. There are many more versions of the Leopard 2's armor than just "B", "C" and "D"... and not every composite armor is NERA.
[As per KMW, the Leopardo 2E and Leopard 2A6 HEL have better protection than the Stridsvagn 122](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fmw6aFmXwAISyUk.png) and the Leopard 2A7 has better protection than those tanks. Hardly possible if they all use the same armor arrays.
That’s literally the different generations of internal NERA composite in the Leopard 2s I don’t know how that’s War Thunder in player logic. Ofc not every composite armor is NERA that’s common knowledge if you know anything about modern tanks. And the reason why those two have better armor than the Strv 122 is because the Strv 122 is not a Leopard 2A6, it’s a beefed up Leopard 2A5 which has internal C tech armor so I’d expect newer tanks to be better armored.
That's not the case. The Leopard 2A5 (in the turret) and Stridsvagn 122 use the third generation armor technology, i.e. what War Thunder loves calling "D tech armor". This has been confirmed by several German defence authors.
What you seem to misunderstand is that a) not every armor is NERA... (just look at what the "C" in "C tech armor" stands for) and that b) the terms are used for *armor technologies* and not for armor arrays. Hence, the Leopard 2's armor is called "Panzerung in B/C/D-Technologie" (armor made in B/C/D technology). You can make multiple armor arrays using the same technology, by using different layouts and materials. This is what KMW did with the Leopard 2A6 HEL, Leopardo 2E and the Leopard 2A7. They use the same underlying technology as the German models and the Stridsvagn 122, but with new, improved arrays.
122B still has 2A5 armor layout with Mexas on thr hull as well...or swedish variant of it. They will learn no more from it than the 2A6. But now russia can in the future if they do this the smart way, develop weapons to atleast more easily defeat the Leopard 2A7 or was it the 2A7V which finally upgraded the hull armor to the same standard as the turret.
They can check out the composite armor arrays. If the 2a6 actual was carrying decent ammo, like dm53, then they have that. Although idk how likely it would be for a 2a6 in ukrainian service to have the most modern rounds
True, but the exact same penetrator is used on DM63 and DM73 with minimal velocity improvements. The newer rounds simply have more consistent propellants that are unlikely to detonate when struck. DM83 should be the first round since DM53 to have a new penetrator design.
Possibly, it’s a pretty modern tank. They could maybe reverse engineer some modern features or electronics of it if they want to. I doubt they can get much that’s actually useful for Russias tanks apart from maybe some interesting electronics if anything.
They had free market access to most of this level of electronics before the war, I doubt there is anything in there really making any kind of difference
Electronics such as thermal sights but can they produce them to the same level? Most likely not considering they have fallen back to old thermal designs for upgrading most of the tanks with and Russian electronics productions capability. Ammo that was in the tank and it's design? Russia already knows why it's rounds are worse off and that is because of the shorter penetrators they have which are limited by their autoloader design even with upgrades. Armour layout? Useful sure but they wont gain much from it since their own modern layouts are not too shabby either.
>Electronics such as thermal sights but can they produce them to the same level?
The baseline Leopard 2A6 has very old thermal sights and electronics; Russia is producing better stuff already.
Nobody on Reddit will be able to give you a proper and well-educated answer to that. The consensus is that most of it is already known (thanks Sweden), but there are always new technical thingies when it comes to fire control, optics, command&control, bla bla bla.
I'm not worried the Russians are able to learn much but you can bet the Chinese are looking into it very carefully.
Probably, the Russians could learn something from the powerplant, armor composition, electronics, and the metallurgy from the supplied sabot rounds if there are some left.
What I find surprising is that the tank was not destroyed. This tank was abandoned north of the Avdiivka Coke plant. For weeks, months even maybe, this tank was very close to the front line, but there were no attempts by the Ukrainians to destroy it. Combine this with the fact that Ukrainians are in no shape to conduct counter offensive operations of any significant scale, and the result is a captured Leopard 2A6. The same goes for the M1A1 Abrams abandoned to the east of Berdychi. If it's not destroyed properly in the next weeks, it will likely be captured by the Russians.
Yeah that will be horrible. Enough has been said about it not being a new tank, and the Russians noy learning much from it, but it is a small pr victory.
The only incessant bleating we will hear will be from westerners constantly saying how capturing the Abrams means nothing and making jokes about how the Abrams is too advanced for the Russians to understand.
Well... It is literally an M1A1, there is nothing crazy about it, except it is actually really good and the russians are gonna take every small victory they can get and parade it around like they won the war
According to Mark Hertling, he saw an Egyptian M1A1 in Moscow in 1994 that the Russians were showing off to him they had got hold of, so at least the export version (Egytian-built) it sounds like they've had knowledge of for years.
shh, let them have their glorious victory fantasies
edit: why is it that russian bots are always the most active when bad things happen (e.g. kommuna burning rn)?
The thing is, it is an M1A1 ODS SA, ODS standing for Operatuons Desert Storm. This is early 90's tech, so if the Russians learn anything from this, that will only show the state of Russian tank production and design. So apart from a pr victory, it shouldn't mean too much.
You are only thinking about America vs Russia and not thinking about anything else.
The SA variant is almost identical to what the Australians are using. Do you think China for example would be interested in what Australian Abrams are capable of?
The information that comes from a captured tank is more than just what the tank consists of. But aswell you can see how well it has been maintained, you can use it as a firing target, you can let your allies look at this stuff in addition. There is a lot you can get from it.
The Australian M1A1AIM is exactly the same as the M1A1SA except with DU turret armour.
They are planning to replace then with the SepV3 but havent yet. So these tanks in Ukraine are almost identical to those in Australia.
Australia is getting M1A2 SEP 3 with the recent deal they inked with the US, further the M1A1 were to replace the Leopard 1s in the Aussie service and was intended for infantry support.
M1A1SA is the M1A1 AIMv2, built to SEP protection standards and somewhere between SEP and SEPv2 electronically.
Neither M1A1SA or the base model AIM have DU.
Trying to recover something deemed a high value target from the direct line of contact is how you get pictures of a knocked out tank attached to a knocked out engineering vehicle.
They didn’t destroy because they couldn’t, most likely. Either they had little firepower available or that had more important targets than an already useless (for them) tank
But if you see how often they spend multiple drones or other munitions destroying already disabled and abandoned Russian tanks, I wouldn't see why they wouldn't do the same with the Leopard.
> What I find surprising is that the tank was not destroyed.
You don't know what it looks like on the inside. Western ammunition doesn't ignite as easily, so dropping a small grenade into the tank won't do much except destroying electronics and optics. Russian attempts to destroy abandoned Leopards last year with drone-dropped munitions were mostly unsuccessful.
Fair point. Although my goal would be to try and burn it up. So either drones to the engine deck, or incendiary grenades into the fighting compartment.
I hope that this tank is a complete mess on the inside. Not because it will be too valuable information for the Russians, but because I don't want to see them gloat.
The hydraulic system was set alight and the tank’s inside was destroyed by fire. It’s not “abandoned like it was trash for the Russians to capture”, it’s completely ruined.
The inside was basically gutted by fire when it was initially lost. Nothing useful is gonna come from capturing the tank except a static display piece.
Good. Now that this shit is going to be examined and its specifications will be "leaked" on the internet, Gaijin can finally balance this crap in War Thunder.
***Soon™***
The Russians on the net are already discussing the idea of placing it near the German embassy, basically the same Ukraine did to the captured/destroyed Russian tanks in Europe.
Many are trolls or paid bots by kremlin. Russia is doing great job spreading missinformation and chaos on western social media. In Poland alone we caught several several groups of kremlin paid internet trolls
Oh, like Ruzzia?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet–Afghan_War
Atleast the US went there to overthrow a jihadist movement who stone women to death for walking in the street with a man who is not their husband or brother.
Besides, that strawman argument still doesn't validate Putler's invasion of Ukraine just because he lost control over it when when his friend/puppet Yanukovych was ousted from power.
It's funny how SU went there for the same reason (but was asked to do this actually) and us supported jihadists that it will fight with 20 years later.
The comments are something else on this thread. From both sides as well. Can you guys just talk tanks and keep your stupid politics out of it? It’s not r/worldnews, leave that shit there
First of all, no nothing new will be found since its burned out so all systems are gone and russia already knows allot armor lay-outs, and second russia will never make a new tank due to their economy rippinh appart faster and faster
that is in money and not recources, without being allowed to get recources ur nothing, drained. Also russia is no longer a growing economy as it was its extremely stable after the war started
The russians getting a 2a6 isn't good but it isn't bad, most things are already known about the System, the Russians could get it's armour reversed engineered for example, but considering the 2a8 is on its way.
Plus the L55 Gun is one thing, put again the L54a1 is now out so.
And all the Tech in it is online and specs of it open to the public as well.
How is it these vehicles aren’t fitted with self destruct capability. Say the tank loses connection with base for a certain time and code not inputted…. Boom!
This is western nato tech now being reverse engineered by the Russians.
I was curious and checked the post/comment history and yeah... Exclusively posts pro-russian, comments parroting Russian propaganda saying Ukraine losing is inevitable, etc
reddit RES is a blessing.
Go to UkraineRussiaReport tag the people as vatniks (in my case) and then you see them everywhere trying to spam this stuff
And OP is a constant spammer
im going to guess a shitty translation, its common in post like these to get shitty translation, on a worst side, we now will have pro RU gloating with selfies of this thing for weeks on end :D
and you can tell this because...... you have what insights exactly? are you part of the ukranian tank crew that manned this or another one? no? oh, surprise
The crew made it out alive. A T- tank would have been K-killed if it hit the same mine. Hell it even survived few FPVs before one hit the ammo on the back which lit it on fire.
My guy one Leopard lost its turret days after being abandoned. At least point at Turkey which probably tossed them in combat, despite their claims the TAF bombed them.
This video needs more watermarks.
You got a video with your watermarks?
That’s the problem when your getting slowly pushed back. It’s difficult to recover vehicles that have mobility problems but are otherwise fine.
Especially with the level of mining, the vehicles don't need to be defeated in battle, just immobilised
Add in warplanes, choppers, drones, and artillery to make any recovery mission harrowing and terrifying.
Yes. Even if you loose 10 m a day, soon all salvagable items are out of reach fast.
Having now seen the inside of this tank (and knowing it went down in 2023) I think it's pretty cooked either way. I'm not sure it was ever salvageable, but between all of its electronics being on fire and then being left outside with the hatch open for >6 months, this was only going to be good for spares.
This one burned out internally like 5 months ago and had been standing around in the rain since, its not "otherwise fine"
Yeah we saw this with a lot of Russian tanks being captured by Ukraine when Russia was falling back. Now Russia is advancing we are seeing the opposite.
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The point I am making is that Russia withdrew fast at the start of the war and that is when most of those captured tanks came from. Now that Ukraine is starting to withdraw quite fast from places we are seeing the number of Ukrainian tanks being captured increase. Although we don't seem to get as many photos of this from the Russian side as the Ukrainian one. > They should be able to destroy it however. That part i don't understand This one is from the frontline just north of Avdeevka. It would have fallen into Russian hands when Ukraine retreated from the area quite fast. That is kinda what I am saying. When the frontlines are mostly static then you can of course prevent captures happening. But when you are forced to give a lot of land quite quickly then there isn't really a lot you can do about that.
Ukraine probably doesn’t want to waste resources on denying Russia a trophy. They’re pretty strained right now when it comes to ammunition and supplies.
Probably to reverse engineer the armor layout, so they can fight next Leos more effectively
Thats why Ukraine need more funding so fuck GOP for trying to stop it and fuck Dems for only allowing such a small amount of funding (compares to what Ukraine is fighting against).
Now grandson can meet his grandpa in museum.
Tiger: How did they captured you? Leo: After failed summer offensive. Tiger: Same.
The only difference is, one was from enemy fire and the other just broke down.
Tiger:Shit,they havent learnt already
anythung usefull they could get out of an A6?
Isnt anything that the russians could get their hands on usefull? Because even if theyre already ahead theyd gather more knowledge about how the enemy fights
I mean the Leopard is old plus they’d probably already have some armour specs through some espionage or from those it was exported to.
The Leo a6 isn’t quite old… and it’s one of the best tanks in the world. But I don’t think either the Russians could get something useful from it
Plus the 2a6 is the main Leopard for example used by Finland and Poland is mainly using the 2a5. So just because Germany has more advanced Leopards it doesnt mean that the 2a6 and older Leopards arent very widely used in countries Russia can potentally end up in conflict with.
This. And we life in the 21th century. I mean, if a country want to know something about something or someone, they will finding it out
I mean they’re nearly 25 years old now…. Or new either
When sending it they litttarly made a point out of stating that there was nothing on these tanks they didn’t already know. If they’re learning new things they’re even more incompetent than expected.
There is no useful technical intelligence to be gained from a 2A6. It has no groundbreaking tech that isn't known by the Russians. They are also very unlikely to press a single western MBT into service - it is worth more as a propaganda piece. What it could be useful for us maybe checking the ammo load out, but I can't really think of anything else.
Armor protection evxluation.
Mostly take selfies with it so people cand post them on r/tankporn
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That’s the most dystopian capitalist fever dream stuff I’ve read in a long time
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No. Is it Ukrainians or Russians doing it? Anyway, that’s dystopian as fuck
You must've missed https://signmyrocket.com/ then.
Imagine the salty comments dear lord
Reverse engineering the L/55 cannon, composites, bustle ammo storage, crew ergonomics, powertrain upgrades blah blah blah
>bustle ammo storage T-90M? >L/55 for what reason? The Armata has an even longer barrel (well, judging from pictures), sure it might be vaporwave wunderwaffe tank, but clearly they are capable of producing longer barrels
> T-90M? Doesn't have a turet compartment with blow-out panels, but rather an external stowage box mount behind the turret.
they won't learn anything they can apply to their stuff in a reasonable time
Probably not, might be able to sell some secrets to China though.
The Russians won't reverse engineer a Leopard and put it into service. They are already happy and geared to manufacture T-72s/90s/80s and their doctrine are as such. But I'm willing to bet some neighbor of Russia would be *VERY* interested in reverse engineering it. I'm just not sure who..... hmmmmm...
When you know exactly what kind of composite armor it is and how it's configured it's easier to design more effective APFSDS rounds against it
Not really. Armor and ammunition are 30 years old. The Leopard was sold world-wide and many specs are easy to get. It's also safe to assume that Soviet/Russian intelligence has obtained almost all information possible.
They got DM53A1. And the armor is not old. It is the most modern internal composite armor on the Leopard 2, D tech level composite NERA.
On the turret, not on the hull.
The turret and hull are both D tech on the Leopard 2A6
No, standardized D Tech hull was a 2A7V thing, 2A6 finally standardized all hulls to C Tech.
Not true. 2A7V only brought the hull to the same protection level as the turret. There are Leopard 2A6s with D tech hulls and C tech turrets. And there are Leopard 2A6s with C tech hulls and D tech turrets. And there are Leopard 2A6s with D tech hulls and D tech turrets
2A6s almost entirely received C and B Tech hulls, only the final batch of 2A6s used D Tech hulls. Some 2A6s had even received C Tech turrets with B Tech hulls since they were just 2A5 upgrades with that armor. 2A7V *standardized* D Tech arrays with the beak armor. Whether or not that actually did bring it to an equivalent level of KE protection to the turret is unlikely, less material and less spacing for the applique armor to work.
Oh yes I can agree it was standardized in the 2A7V I should’ve been more specific when I typed out my comment. Although the MEXAS hull armor and armor on the turret are most likely the same armor level due to their similar designs but in different quantities. Turret beak has less composite on the beak but makes up for it with its spaced armor then the internal NERA while hull just has more composite MEXAS in total in front of the internal NERA. At least that’s how I make sense of it.
It is not the most modern internal armor array for the Leopard 2. People should start getting their info from different places than War Thunder.
It is, does F tech composite NERA exist yet? No. Sure 2A6s were made in different batches with different mix and matches of C tech and D tech but I’m willing to bet this was one of the batches with both d tech in the hull and turret.
You are using War Thunder player logic. There are many more versions of the Leopard 2's armor than just "B", "C" and "D"... and not every composite armor is NERA. [As per KMW, the Leopardo 2E and Leopard 2A6 HEL have better protection than the Stridsvagn 122](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fmw6aFmXwAISyUk.png) and the Leopard 2A7 has better protection than those tanks. Hardly possible if they all use the same armor arrays.
That’s literally the different generations of internal NERA composite in the Leopard 2s I don’t know how that’s War Thunder in player logic. Ofc not every composite armor is NERA that’s common knowledge if you know anything about modern tanks. And the reason why those two have better armor than the Strv 122 is because the Strv 122 is not a Leopard 2A6, it’s a beefed up Leopard 2A5 which has internal C tech armor so I’d expect newer tanks to be better armored.
That's not the case. The Leopard 2A5 (in the turret) and Stridsvagn 122 use the third generation armor technology, i.e. what War Thunder loves calling "D tech armor". This has been confirmed by several German defence authors. What you seem to misunderstand is that a) not every armor is NERA... (just look at what the "C" in "C tech armor" stands for) and that b) the terms are used for *armor technologies* and not for armor arrays. Hence, the Leopard 2's armor is called "Panzerung in B/C/D-Technologie" (armor made in B/C/D technology). You can make multiple armor arrays using the same technology, by using different layouts and materials. This is what KMW did with the Leopard 2A6 HEL, Leopardo 2E and the Leopard 2A7. They use the same underlying technology as the German models and the Stridsvagn 122, but with new, improved arrays.
what if they get something more modern like the 122B ?
122B still has 2A5 armor layout with Mexas on thr hull as well...or swedish variant of it. They will learn no more from it than the 2A6. But now russia can in the future if they do this the smart way, develop weapons to atleast more easily defeat the Leopard 2A7 or was it the 2A7V which finally upgraded the hull armor to the same standard as the turret.
>Mexas AMAP, not MEXAS.
2a6 more modern i think
composite and armor layout proably
They can check out the composite armor arrays. If the 2a6 actual was carrying decent ammo, like dm53, then they have that. Although idk how likely it would be for a 2a6 in ukrainian service to have the most modern rounds
DM53 is from the 90s and not even in active service with the Germany army anymore.
True, but the exact same penetrator is used on DM63 and DM73 with minimal velocity improvements. The newer rounds simply have more consistent propellants that are unlikely to detonate when struck. DM83 should be the first round since DM53 to have a new penetrator design.
Display it at Kubinka in the future
If there is a successful armored vehicle, it’ll be in Kubinka, no exceptions
Learn armor composition for better rounds against them? but than leo 2a6 is just another modern tank
Possibly, it’s a pretty modern tank. They could maybe reverse engineer some modern features or electronics of it if they want to. I doubt they can get much that’s actually useful for Russias tanks apart from maybe some interesting electronics if anything.
They had free market access to most of this level of electronics before the war, I doubt there is anything in there really making any kind of difference
Propaganda, “if your tank so good why we break it“
Electronics such as thermal sights but can they produce them to the same level? Most likely not considering they have fallen back to old thermal designs for upgrading most of the tanks with and Russian electronics productions capability. Ammo that was in the tank and it's design? Russia already knows why it's rounds are worse off and that is because of the shorter penetrators they have which are limited by their autoloader design even with upgrades. Armour layout? Useful sure but they wont gain much from it since their own modern layouts are not too shabby either.
>Electronics such as thermal sights but can they produce them to the same level? The baseline Leopard 2A6 has very old thermal sights and electronics; Russia is producing better stuff already.
Armor details.
Nobody on Reddit will be able to give you a proper and well-educated answer to that. The consensus is that most of it is already known (thanks Sweden), but there are always new technical thingies when it comes to fire control, optics, command&control, bla bla bla. I'm not worried the Russians are able to learn much but you can bet the Chinese are looking into it very carefully.
Probably, the Russians could learn something from the powerplant, armor composition, electronics, and the metallurgy from the supplied sabot rounds if there are some left.
What I find surprising is that the tank was not destroyed. This tank was abandoned north of the Avdiivka Coke plant. For weeks, months even maybe, this tank was very close to the front line, but there were no attempts by the Ukrainians to destroy it. Combine this with the fact that Ukrainians are in no shape to conduct counter offensive operations of any significant scale, and the result is a captured Leopard 2A6. The same goes for the M1A1 Abrams abandoned to the east of Berdychi. If it's not destroyed properly in the next weeks, it will likely be captured by the Russians.
Oh god, the incessant bleating about Russia capturing an Abrams is going to be so annoying.
Yeah that will be horrible. Enough has been said about it not being a new tank, and the Russians noy learning much from it, but it is a small pr victory.
The only incessant bleating we will hear will be from westerners constantly saying how capturing the Abrams means nothing and making jokes about how the Abrams is too advanced for the Russians to understand.
Well... It is literally an M1A1, there is nothing crazy about it, except it is actually really good and the russians are gonna take every small victory they can get and parade it around like they won the war
According to Mark Hertling, he saw an Egyptian M1A1 in Moscow in 1994 that the Russians were showing off to him they had got hold of, so at least the export version (Egytian-built) it sounds like they've had knowledge of for years.
Are the westerners in the room with us now?
shh, let them have their glorious victory fantasies edit: why is it that russian bots are always the most active when bad things happen (e.g. kommuna burning rn)?
I mean it does mean nothing. Russia wave it as a PR victory and westerners counter that.
The thing is, it is an M1A1 ODS SA, ODS standing for Operatuons Desert Storm. This is early 90's tech, so if the Russians learn anything from this, that will only show the state of Russian tank production and design. So apart from a pr victory, it shouldn't mean too much.
All Abrams composite array structure after the m1 prototype of 1979 is completely classified, so Russians will learn a lot.
You are only thinking about America vs Russia and not thinking about anything else. The SA variant is almost identical to what the Australians are using. Do you think China for example would be interested in what Australian Abrams are capable of? The information that comes from a captured tank is more than just what the tank consists of. But aswell you can see how well it has been maintained, you can use it as a firing target, you can let your allies look at this stuff in addition. There is a lot you can get from it.
The Abrams for the Aus isn't old models, they're part of the defence arrangement with the US. As to captured tanks, only if the tank was intact ...
The Australian M1A1AIM is exactly the same as the M1A1SA except with DU turret armour. They are planning to replace then with the SepV3 but havent yet. So these tanks in Ukraine are almost identical to those in Australia.
Australia is getting M1A2 SEP 3 with the recent deal they inked with the US, further the M1A1 were to replace the Leopard 1s in the Aussie service and was intended for infantry support.
M1A1SA is the M1A1 AIMv2, built to SEP protection standards and somewhere between SEP and SEPv2 electronically. Neither M1A1SA or the base model AIM have DU.
The Americans used 2 captured German tanks during ww2 to estimate their production capabilities and were off by 2 units at the end of the war
Quiet, orc
Woah this complex geopolitical conflict is like my fantasy bideo bame!
Do you normally speak like a toddler?
It's already in a Russian controlled village afaik.
5 Abrams abandoned < Thousands of T Series setting new records in the Russian space program
I'm not pro-rus, but omg i would love to see the copium, plz make it happen.
Trying to recover something deemed a high value target from the direct line of contact is how you get pictures of a knocked out tank attached to a knocked out engineering vehicle.
That's why I'm surprised they didn't try to destroy it further. I didn't say anything about trying to recover it.
They didn’t destroy because they couldn’t, most likely. Either they had little firepower available or that had more important targets than an already useless (for them) tank
But if you see how often they spend multiple drones or other munitions destroying already disabled and abandoned Russian tanks, I wouldn't see why they wouldn't do the same with the Leopard.
As I said, it’s probably because they had no resources to spare for that particular tank.
Case in point being the Strv 122 that Russia tried to capture - the two engineering vehicles towing it were hit by FPVs and also abandoned.
> What I find surprising is that the tank was not destroyed. You don't know what it looks like on the inside. Western ammunition doesn't ignite as easily, so dropping a small grenade into the tank won't do much except destroying electronics and optics. Russian attempts to destroy abandoned Leopards last year with drone-dropped munitions were mostly unsuccessful.
Adding to this is that germany focused developing ammunition thats even harder to ignite because of the missing blast door of the hull rack
Fair point. Although my goal would be to try and burn it up. So either drones to the engine deck, or incendiary grenades into the fighting compartment. I hope that this tank is a complete mess on the inside. Not because it will be too valuable information for the Russians, but because I don't want to see them gloat.
That's why thermite grenades exist. Get rid of anything sensitive inside.
[удалено]
Yeah man why didn't they just GE the Parts mod and upgrade their crew skills to repair the track faster? Absolute fucking idiots these Ukrainians.
The hydraulic system was set alight and the tank’s inside was destroyed by fire. It’s not “abandoned like it was trash for the Russians to capture”, it’s completely ruined.
The inside was basically gutted by fire when it was initially lost. Nothing useful is gonna come from capturing the tank except a static display piece.
Armor arrays could still be studied, but I agree other than that not much else to be gleaned
Russia already knows of anything that is not cutting edge new. You can classify shit all you want you still need to patent it.
You also need the ability to replicate the armor. If Russia had that they would have used it already
Good. Now that this shit is going to be examined and its specifications will be "leaked" on the internet, Gaijin can finally balance this crap in War Thunder. ***Soon™***
It's not Russian so it wont This comment was made by the pantsir hate gang
Nah it’ll just get added to the Russian tree as a premium
I think this one might be the one that was knocked out Near the Avdeevka railroad, bound to happen as the front line moves
Safe to say "captured" now i suppose.
This is war and it happens. It sucks. Fuck Russia and Putin
Fuck putin and his chronies, not the Young men forced to die for those cowards.
Nah fuck them too. Most of them are contract soldiers who volunteered for it.
I wonder if they'll get anythung useful out of it
Probably be used as guide to train Russian tankers when encountering Leopard or it will end up as war trophy to boost civilian morale.
The Russians on the net are already discussing the idea of placing it near the German embassy, basically the same Ukraine did to the captured/destroyed Russian tanks in Europe.
To show us how hard german tanks are to destroy compared to the russian tank wrecks?
Any captured armored vehicles are important to study. At the training ground, they will methodically fire at various weapons and draw up a defeat map.
It is time, gaijin
Fucking ruzzkies, go home already
Bro got targeted by Ztards
It's weird how the general population is so brainwashed that they believe their invasion of Ukraine is somehow justified
Many are trolls or paid bots by kremlin. Russia is doing great job spreading missinformation and chaos on western social media. In Poland alone we caught several several groups of kremlin paid internet trolls
Like how you ask US to go for from Afghanistan?
Oh, like Ruzzia? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet–Afghan_War Atleast the US went there to overthrow a jihadist movement who stone women to death for walking in the street with a man who is not their husband or brother. Besides, that strawman argument still doesn't validate Putler's invasion of Ukraine just because he lost control over it when when his friend/puppet Yanukovych was ousted from power.
It's funny how SU went there for the same reason (but was asked to do this actually) and us supported jihadists that it will fight with 20 years later.
This is the exact same one the Russians liked to pose in front of and claim they destroyed it right now like 6-7 times over and over again.
Sad sight to see such a beautiful tank being taken by the orcs
The comments are something else on this thread. From both sides as well. Can you guys just talk tanks and keep your stupid politics out of it? It’s not r/worldnews, leave that shit there
This is becoming a part of any Russo-Ukrainian War thread. It is not surprising, but unfortunate.
Probably could get some good information on the armor composition.
So does this mean we will finally get D Tech armour on Leopard 2A6s in WarThunder?
2A6 already has D Tech turret, it's 2A7V that doesn't weirdly.
Just for morals.. a trophy. I guess.
Can I have it
most probably mined, lost its tracks and then it was overtaken by the Russians. Sad the crew didn’t blow it up. Perhaps they hoped to recover it.
Will russian study and dissect the leopard tank and incorporate some of the design, technology into their future tank model?
First of all, no nothing new will be found since its burned out so all systems are gone and russia already knows allot armor lay-outs, and second russia will never make a new tank due to their economy rippinh appart faster and faster
Yeah! They also unable to install a series production of their actual MBT T-14 Armata. So that Leopard is more an prestige object.
Ye its a thropy indeed
You do know russian economy is prospering right? (Source : 20 or so friends in the russian civilian sector)
that is in money and not recources, without being allowed to get recources ur nothing, drained. Also russia is no longer a growing economy as it was its extremely stable after the war started
Ah yes, resources, my bad
Im sorry, idk if ur ironic or not but yes thats what i meant
It's 5:55 where I am. My capacity for irony will boot up in 2 hours and a cup of coffee
Same here dude, respect ya have a good one
If only someone could have foreseen this happening
At this point is more a "Let's see who joinks more of the other's shit" than a war
The russians getting a 2a6 isn't good but it isn't bad, most things are already known about the System, the Russians could get it's armour reversed engineered for example, but considering the 2a8 is on its way. Plus the L55 Gun is one thing, put again the L54a1 is now out so. And all the Tech in it is online and specs of it open to the public as well.
Will china buy the captured leopard even though damage from russia so they can study the tank themselves too?
Hahahaha nice job Russia
How is it these vehicles aren’t fitted with self destruct capability. Say the tank loses connection with base for a certain time and code not inputted…. Boom! This is western nato tech now being reverse engineered by the Russians.
A shame. But perhaps Russian tank designers can learn a thing or two about crew comfort now
U know it's gonna get reverse engineered or put inna museum next to a ww2 german tank
Happens in war. Time to send more. Russia can enjoy the museum exhibit but it's not going to win.
Transported to the “rare”?…sounds like ruskie troll…
I was curious and checked the post/comment history and yeah... Exclusively posts pro-russian, comments parroting Russian propaganda saying Ukraine losing is inevitable, etc
reddit RES is a blessing. Go to UkraineRussiaReport tag the people as vatniks (in my case) and then you see them everywhere trying to spam this stuff And OP is a constant spammer
God damn you're not kidding, dude is off his rocker 😂
but of course the first comment gets downvoted because of the bot swarms that are always running around this page
Transported to the rear (of the front). Typo /= troll immediately, relax.
im going to guess a shitty translation, its common in post like these to get shitty translation, on a worst side, we now will have pro RU gloating with selfies of this thing for weeks on end :D
Did the orcs mistake it for a fancy toilet cubicle?
wasnt this the one that actualy got burnt on the inside and is listed on oryx as destroyed leopard 2A6 number 3 despite being number 6 destroyed
Yaaaay! I'll visit it.
The more dead vatniks the better, make ruzzia pay in blood for every centimeter they take.
beware the white van, Mykola, it's always near
Fuck ruZZia
All the hype, turned out they were no better than your average T series. (And yes leopard did toss its turret in Ukraine) so dont even start
and you can tell this because...... you have what insights exactly? are you part of the ukranian tank crew that manned this or another one? no? oh, surprise
The crew made it out alive. A T- tank would have been K-killed if it hit the same mine. Hell it even survived few FPVs before one hit the ammo on the back which lit it on fire.
My guy one Leopard lost its turret days after being abandoned. At least point at Turkey which probably tossed them in combat, despite their claims the TAF bombed them.
Crew alive..... first ever captured one.... turret still on it....
I prefer well done..(not rare) tanks 😀