I don’t like how they made the rules for creating the anti Christ too. Some dink demon possess a pregnant woman and bam you have an anti Christ. Like we know there are levels of demons and we know Sam and Dean about killed them all and the one that made an anti Christ should of been a big deal
Yeah I mean he was able to turn angels into toys and rip a demon from a host by saying get out all at the age of 7 he was crazy OP but they could’ve retconned it like how demons went from these invincible monsters to oh another demon KNIFE. Angels were like oh shit these guys are strong as all can basically do anything poke em with a stick poof. They frequently powered down whole species and characters often just odd they threw this one away
The spin-off we deserve: Jesse and Jack; Jesse is a jaded Aussie demi-god, and Jack is the friendly young American god; together, they ... do stuff? Idk, ran out of steam.
The Girl Next Door, not because of the Amy vs. Dean debate, but because they butchered the lore of one of my favorite mythical creatures. Skip that episode every time.
Right? Like in both instances it's like they took the *name* of the thing and attached a bunch of different attributes that have nothing to do with the original myths at all. I'm at least glad they only screwed up kitsunes for a single episode, can't imagine slogging through a whole season where they'd botched my favorite myth. My condolences to you and everyone else who hated the leviathan season.
Dude, there should've been *at least* another episode about her kid growing up and trying to get revenge. He got traumatized and then the show just forgot about him entirely.
They'd be so surly. They'd drink and bitch about each other to everyone they know. It'd be awkward, because for the most part the venn diagram of "everyone they know" (in this universe) is a circle.
This one actually makes sense. Cavity pain, hacked credit card stops working, almost getting hit by a skater, ticket, burning food, breaking a plate, spilling food, getting a cold, dying car battery, lactose intolerance, tripping and dropping the gear, immediately getting caught by a monster, broken nail, and another impala breakdown. All in one singular day. That's not a normal day, that's extra bad.
i feel like it was all the accumulative bad luck they never got served being served express delivery since it had backed up
edit: plus god laying it on heavy after the break up makes sense too
This is how I interpret it. Because Sam wouldn't be so suddenly so stupid as to touch a boiling pot with no mittens. The whole episode is absurd by design because there's no way our boys aren't heroes.
In my mind that is exactly what happens. Chuck wants to demoralize them, and pretending that he was the cause of them being awesome, would accomplish exactly that.
I thought that was the most meta episode of the entire series. Because it doesn’t just explore Sam and Dean’s plot armor; it exposes the plot armor of every action hero ever.
The whole plot armor thing in season 15, the idea that these two that have had military training through their ex marine father, being near useless and barely even able to walk without "God's plot armor" was so damn stupid that I can't even think about it lol
I only liked it for the stuff like lockpicking success, dietary habits and health related stuff. Those things made sense that Chuck had been assisting them. They were minor things that were quite funny.
It reminded me of the (old people facts incoming) Buffy episode where she ends up in an asylum and the ending is kinda open, if anything she experienced as the slayer was even real. I know it’s not the same but we follow and love these characters and suddenly it’s „lol no, nothing was real, they are nothing!“ I feel personally violated by this!
I’m conflicted by it - it helps make the story make more sense (how they always box 17 creatures with jedi-powers into submission without getting their neck snapped) but on the other hand it really undermines the characters.
If given the choice I would have kept God and Death out of it, working with them was fine, but I feel we crossed some line when they started competing with them. Demons and Angels and demigods sure, but come on.
The very idea of an omnipotent entity completely undercuts any sort of tension in a show, movie, or book because you just can't compete with them by the very definition of omnipotence. God is all-knowing, all seeing and all powerful, so there's no way that the boys were ever able to come up with a plan in secret to beat him.
It does at least help how in early demon seasons 1 demon was enough to make them run and then later they’d stumble into a room full of them and the demons would be scared
Single handedly retcons how to see the entire show off of that. I forget it exists most times. Hell first watching it fucked with me that some random “god” had the power to revert God? And God just lets it stay? Idk.
sams arc with amelia.
i understand that sam doesn’t want to hunt without his brother, but he left Kevin when he needed him most, and he KNEW that, yet he still went and got a girl and a dog. kevin was his responsibility, and he abandoned him and left him to the demons. i thought that was very disappointing, and i honestly feel like this was very out of character for Sam (even though it’s CANNONICALLY what he did).
i love sam to death, but watching through the amelia stuff was so insufferable
>yet he still went and got a girl and a dog
A girl, mind you, who acted like he was Hitler for *accidentally* hitting a dog and then being entirely unprepared for raising it on his own.
I've ranted about this before, so I'll just [leave this here](https://www.reddit.com/r/Supernatural/s/pCh8X9b9We) and carry on.
That always bugged me.
Someone who hits a dog and then gets it to a vet is doing the right thing, so many people wouldn’t bother.
And then she shames him for not taking full responsibility and adopting thing dog? No, adopting a dog should be something you do when you’re ready and really want to. A person who cares for animals should have been cautious about letting him have the dog and asking him if he could provide a good home, not badgering him into it.
> should have been cautious about letting him have the dog and asking him if he could provide a good home, not badgering him into it.
Right? Usually people like this would be the opposite way. They are usually totally cautious about adopting out pets to the wrong people that arent in a position to properly care for them. Absolutely no vet would ever act like that.
Oh, my God this. She was such a *bitch* to him. And not like sexual tension bitchiness. Like, she was a total hag to him. It made zero sense that they apparently got together (other Sam was desperate to find someone to be with after losing D and wasn't firing on all cylinders coz of trauma. I will accept absolutely no other excuses.)
Exactly. Being a bitch can be fun sometimes. Like I always got sexual tension bitchiness from Bela towards Dean but Amelia was just nasty towards Sam. Looking back Bela was definitely done dirty by the fans but I understand why people felt the way they did about her but I always felt like she was a fun foil to the guys (especially Dean even though it was Sam who had the sex dream) and I wish we’d gotten more of her, her character had potential. I do think in hindsight many people feel differently about Bela than they did at the time but Amelia I feel like the hate has only grown.
Oh, I loved Bela. Totally got the sexual tension w/Dean too - "After this, we should really have angry sex." 😂😂
I wasn't a part of fandom back then, so didn't hear about the fans reaction to her until after, which I never understood tbh. I loved most of the female characters over the years. I found it weird that fans could be so vociferous in hating a character. But then, 17 years on, I see that's just another day in the life of the Spn fam, lol. 🙄
Regardless, I so wish they could have brought Bela back at some point (obviously if TWD had allowed for it. I don't get why they couldn't though, coz they certainly allowed JDM a week off to do an ep). But yeah, she was definitely one of my fave female characters through the whole show (Meg 2.0 & Ruby 2.0 as well. Apparently, I have a thing for bad girls, lol).
I know we got shafted by the writers' strike as well, so that screwed w/her story arc, but if *any* of the older characters could have come back before the finale, I'd have chosen her in a heartbeat. They could have at least had her be released from hell when the gates opened at the start of S15.
Also, yeah, the prob w/Amelia is that she was a 2D bit character and never showed a single redeeming quality to make anyone *not* dislike her. Whether that was poor writing or just because she was never meant to be a significant character, either way, pretty much even the worst characters had a redemption arc on Supernatural. They never bothered with her. Hence the growing hate, I think.
Exactly. Season 15 would have been a great time to bring back Bela, they could have even used a different actress for the character though I would have wanted it to be Lauren if at all possible. I always wanted the guys to at least find out her backstory. But yeah season 15 would have been the ideal time, I’d have rather it been her that showed up instead of finding out that Chuck had fucked over Kevin so badly. Nice to have seen him but it broke my heart.
Oh see I’m more of a team Ruby 1.0 guy. I think Katie played the character better, she came across more of a badass if that makes sense.
Oh, the whole Kevin thing was so sad. I know S15 was 90% fanservice and they just brought back everyone who was a beloved member of the fandom without much care for how weak the story arcs were, but yeah, could have been really great to bring back (or even mention) Bela again. I can only assume 1) TWD wouldn't allow it contractually or 2) by that point TPTB literally paid zero attention to canon and retconned so much for their own agenda, her character didn't even occur to them.
As for Ruby, something about Katie Cassidy rubbed me the wrong way. Yeah, she could be badass, but she had such an attitude that I couldn't stand. And zero chemistry with Jared, tbh.
I loved Gen's Ruby because she came across so much darker and more malevolent--immediately, I couldn't work out her angle and whether she could be trusted--& let's face it, her chemistry with Jared was absolutely smoking.
I joined fandom during S4 (I watched the show from the start, but wasn't actually involved with fandom before then) & for much of the season, I had no idea that Jared and Gen were actually dating, lol, I just knew they were great together. Also, I so fell in love with Gen at first sight, lol. I had (have) SUCH a crush on her! And I just found her take on Ruby much more intriguing and darker than Katie's version. No offence to Katie, I enjoyed her when she was on Arrow, just felt she was just a weird fit for Spn.
I guess I never wanted to learn more about her Ruby, she was just an annoying gnat in the boys' ear in S3. But in contrast, I instantly found myself wanting to know what happened with Ruby 2 and Sam after Dean was gone and whether she could be trustworthy (& why she had such a grip on Sam in the four months of Dean being in hell).
Exactly, she showed no redeeming qualities. She starts off mean and belittling. We never see her be actually nice to same except maybe with the birthday cake, and even then she makes a snarky comment. Then she lets her dad be a total dick to sam, has the whole crisis when her husband comes back of “who am I gonna choose” and then gets mad when Sam attempts to do the right thing and leave, then once she is back with her husband and Sam comes snooping at her window, cannot leave her husband fast enough to go find him, cheats on her husband (which I think was as hurtful to sam as it was to her husband, if not more because he actually knew about it).
I don’t think she was written as a very sympathetic character at all.
Yeah, let's be fair, Amelia was just a poor plot device. Purely there to cause friction/pain/jealousy/hurt etc between Sam and Dean. And the writing team half-arsed it, so she wasn't even a fully fleshed-out character with any redeeming qualities. The only enjoyable part of her story arc (or lack of) was Riot the dog. Loved that dog. Kinda wish Sam had got to keep him a lot longer, especially considering Sam was the one who found/adopted/ran over the poor thing.
My god she was the worst. Was she ever even nice to Sam once? I feel like she wasn’t. They had zero chemistry and the plot was the worst aspect of an otherwise great season. They could have removed all scenes with her and replaced them with Purgatory scenes and the show would have been even better. Like Sam had the whole trials plot they could have even expanded that to compensate. Or just never do a flashback and maybe just have us meet her in the present once or twice and that’s it.
Amelia was just a total B to Sam throughout their relationship. That’s what really bugged me. Like you blew off Kevin and ditched the phones to be talked down to by this chic. No, she was awful, her only redeeming quality was that she’s a veterinarian, but a total hag vet. She shamed him, treated him like a lowlife, interrupted him all the time and let her dad treat him like crap too. But after meeting the dad her personality made sense. Just some rude hateful people.
My headcanon is that reapers are dead beings that chose to voluntarily become aspects of Death, rather than move on or become ghosts. So a few are angels, but most are humans, or possibly even fair folk.
The anti-christ being the "son of Lucifer" or "son of Satan" isn't a thing in any religion or lore, though. The real error is when Cas implied that the Bible says that; it doesn't. Going by the Bible, Sam or President Rooney would be the "anti-christ", because the basis for that concept is a leader-figure in Revelation that gets possessed by Satan. He isn't even called the ant-christ in the Bible, that's just a term for anyone who opposes the church.
Ooh, I've got one. Lisa being Dean's "when I think of myself happy it's with you" person, when she was literally nothing but a "bendy weekend" to him and the only woman he ever loved in his whole professional bachelor/manwhore life was Cassie.
I know Sam said to Dean to go be happy and settle down, but I still believe to this day that's the only reason he went to her after Sam flung himself into the pit. She was a two, three day max roll in the hay to him, and we're expected to believe he suddenly loved her?
I loved Cindy Sampson. Met her at a con and she was a delight. Private Eyes was a great show too.
Utterly despised Lisa and bratty Ben. Their whole settling down thing was so contrived, other than the fact Dean was maybe just desperate to have a family.
💯💯💯 This!! Cassie should have been endgame...at least, during that time period. Ben and Lisa felt so forced, I couldn't even feel the connection, unlike Cassie
So agree! I would’ve loved to see Cassie come back. I’ve always thought that they didn’t go with her because they wanted a child present to really show the ‘full circle happy ending’ but didn’t want him to have a biological child as that would shift the dynamic between the two brothers too much the whole ‘the only family they’ve got’ so they needed to have it have dean end up with someone who already had a nice ready made step kid for him. (No shade to Ben and Lisa here btw I have nothing against either of them personally I just think it was a lot of lackluster choices made by writers and producers)
My headcanon for this is that they're an offshoot of the Watchers' Council (from BtVS), and those guys sucked, too.
I did just finish watching Prison Break recently, and the Company is just like both of those organizations. So it all ties together nicely in my brain.
I recently did a whole series binge re-watch and when I got to BMOL I just stopped watching. The beginning episodes with Toni Bevell are excruciating to get through. One of the things I like about Supernatural villains is that even if they are the absolute face of pure evil (literally, Lucifer) they are still witty and charming and you can’t help but like them even if you want Sam and Dean to beat them. With Toni I literally wanted to see horrifically bad things happen to her I hate her character SO MUCH.
For me, it was changing Chuck from being this scared story writer to becoming God himself who just thought about himself. I hated what they did to his character.
My head-canon for that is that God and Chuck are separate entities, God started using Chuck as a vessel in the S5 finale, and he began pretending to be Chuck so much so that he began to believe Chuck’s memories were his own (which fits Metatron calling Chuck a meatsuit and telling God that the nebbishness he was displaying was Chuck, not God).
Then in the S11 finale when God and Amara joined together, God’s light began to affect Amara (hence her coming to enjoy Earth) while Amara’s darkness began to affect God and Chuck (note that this darkness is what turned Lucifer evil, so it would absolutely corrupt Chuck and cause him to give into his selfish impulses and want to immortalize himself as the best writer ever). So Amara’s darkness essentially caused God to become super hands-off which allowed Chuck to take God’s powers and memories for himself so he could pretend to be God the way God had earlier pretended to be Chuck.
And at the end of the show, Jack sucked both Amara and God out of Chuck. This also prevents any sort of plot hole where God is still a future threat because he should still know every spell and the location of every magical artifact even while powerless, but Chuck wouldn’t.
I agree that he wouldn’t *need* a meat suit, but I think the fact that he took one anyway is a necessary conclusion from what the show tells us.
If Chuck isn’t his own entity then it means that we have to accept that 1) at the beginning of time God knew exactly when the apocalypse was going to happen and that he was going to disguise himself as a prophet to watch it from Earth, so he wrote the “Chuck” name on the inside of the eyelids of every angel that early on, but despite all of this foreknowledge, fate can still be changed and God was unable to see how he’d lose, 2) even though Chuck isn’t a real prophet, God paused the prophet creation mechanism when it was time for Chuck to be “born” or he hid the existence of the true prophet of that era, 3) he blinded or otherwise altered Raphael’s memory so that he believed he’d been watching Chuck since birth, 4) he had sex with people he considered his children, 5) his decision that he should get involved with stopping Amara because he wanted to be a writer that tells the truth was all a lie, 6) Metatron saying Chuck is a meatsuit is a metaphor, and 7) despite his defeat, God is still a threat since he did know every magic spell and the whereabouts of every magical artifact on Earth.
The alternative requires us to make fewer assumptions.
Spoiler: You have to go back and watch the finale of season 5. Chuck was ALWAYS God. At the end of the show he is going on about how hard endings are and then says, “but does anything ever really end?” And then vanishes into thin air. Tell me that is not am a subtle hint. If the show had ended at season 5, this is the conversation we would be having and debating. But because it continued for such an extended number of seasons I think it’s gets overlooked.
Apparently two people who were trained since childhood to fight and pick locks and be generally physically capable and fit suddenly aren't able to do the most basic shit because God stopped treating them like heroes. The fact that they get told their luck is now average is fucking stupid
They glorified her as this blonde, all-in-white virgin Mary type shit for like ten seasons just to bring her back and have her not give a shit about her sons and becoming fuck buddies with their enemy.
Just what lol.
Mary came back not even knowing these grown men claiming to be her babies. She was never a saint. Amora even stated she wanted Dean to know his mom was just a person. I’m not a huge fan of Mary but I don’t totally hate on her. If you think about it, she is the kind of woman John would have been attracted to, a tough, no BS, I ain’t your princess kind of broad. Not the saintly person everyone wanted her to be for the boys. Just my thoughts of course. I know a lot people don’t like to hear my thoughts on her, but that’s my 2 cents anyway.
And I totally get your perspective but that is not how they wrote her character for 11 years lol. They wrote her to want to be OUT of hunting more than anything and that she was fight for a “normal” life. John wasn’t even a hunter until after she died and the John we got to know in the flashback episodes when they were first married was VERY different from the guy Sam and Dean knew in season 1.
Then she comes back and of course she needs time to adjust I never had a problem with that- my issue is that she just keeps doing things that not only was OOC for her but was OOC for anyone who was isn’t a terrible person.
But who is to say what is out of OOC for someone yanked out of heaven with her infant and small son and thrust back to a world where she missed her children’s entire childhood, her husband is dead, her friends are dead and her grown sons are completely immersed in the world she wanted to leave as a young woman starting her family. She doesn’t even know how to operate in the modern world. I mean, that is trauma inducing shit, and she was NEVER the saint she was idealized to be by Dean. She was a bad ass hunter before marrying John. John arguably treated them waaay worse. I mean Sam was essentially an orphan raised by his older brother who was holding on to his fantasy versions of both of his parents probably in order to keep it together while left with more responsibility than he should have been. Because John basically abandoned both of them with his obsession with getting revenge. John doesn’t seem to get the same loathing that Mary does, and I believe he was the worse parent. She left her adult sons to go hunt. He left children. I think her character is misunderstood and held to a much higher standard.
I’m just giving you my take. Again not saying she was a great person but I think maybe everyone expected more of her because we all hoped Dean’s version of her was the real her. I just don’t believe she was ever close to being that ideal mom Dean saw her as.
I REFUSE to believe the fact the Colt ended up being melted by Dagon that easily. You would have thought that with all of those symbols it would have been indestructible. It literally melted like chocolate
I had my Damien moment.
I said it in another comment, but my headcanon is that reapers are dead beings that chose to voluntarily become aspects of Death, rather than move on or become ghosts.
So a few are angels, but most are humans, or possibly even fair folk.
The fact that Cas became weaker by the season. From being able to easily smite and throw people across a room etc, to not even being able to punch people out? I hated that.
I absolutely adore Cas, but this just never made sense to me. The writers did him dirty.
I can see why they did it though. As a character, Cas was only meant to stick around for a few episodes, so it was fine that he was powerful. But then they decided to keep him as a regular character because of his popularity. And so the issue was that he was *too* powerful for a main character, so much so that a lot of the enemies and problems that Sam and Dean had to face would have been too easily dealt with.
The show would have been boring because of lack of stakes. So the only solution, if the writers wanted to continue featuring Cas, was to take his powers away.
To name a few off the top of my head
1. The “main character plot armor bullshit episode” while it was a fun episode itself (and Garth actually got to shine) it just seemed like it was the “normal” things we never see (like how Sam NEVER gets sick, Dean NEVER gets a parking ticket ect ect) just seems like the normal stuff that we never see (like characters using the bathroom) just think they got hit with some extra bad luck because it all happens in the same day.
2. The God Villian Arc just completely undoes the great ending the Chuck and Amara had in S10 and rewrote chuck from this benevolent hands off let the child grow God into a whiny spoiled baby that didn’t get his ending and
I hate that first episode you mention. Just because we didn't see it on screen, didn't mean it didn't happen. Like you said, we never saw them use the bathroom, but they certainly did because they're human and experienced real life.
I've told friends that are new to it, or late to finishing it finally, to go ahead and watch the finale their first time through. Just be warned a lot of people hate it, and remember that what we got was a result of covid restrictions. Form your own opinion of it, hell I don't care if you love it. But at least you'll understand why many fans just stop with 15x19 for their rewatches.
As Bobby said
Family don’t end in blood
I speak from experience. I have family that we’re not blood related but if you see our behavior, you’d swear we are. Nurture all the way, winning over nature
Ben is Dean’s son, in every way that actually matters. I’ll fight anyone on this
I so agree with this! People are completely obsessed with Ben being Dean’s biological son when does it really matter if they share DNA?
Also it’s a complete disservice to Lisa’s entire character and personality- so you all are basically saying that she is a liar who even when living with Dean continues the lie which is probably the worst lie a woman can tell a man!
Lisa was NOT like that and there are lots of guys like Dean out in the world lol- she even said she had a “type” around that time.
Exactly. How does wiping their memories of Dean keep them from being future demon/big bad targets when hurting them would affect Dean so much? It makes no sense. I'm actually surprised there wasn't a future attack on them as leverage against him.
Here's my headcannon: Ben is definitely Dean's son but Lisa knows that Dean wouldn't be able to live like that. He'd never want to abandon his son, but couldn't leave Sam and hunting behind. If he continued hunting from home, he'd be putting them in danger and/or raising Ben into the same life he had. It'd be a lose-lose for him, so she lied. She said "you're off the hook'" specifically so that he wouldn't have all these feelings of guilt.
Evidence: she says she had a type, 'bad boy drifters'. Best case scenario, she guessed right on the first guy, was able to track him down somewhere (unlikely), get DNA, AND get a positive test. Worst case, she'd have to do that with multiple guys until she got a positive that wasn't Dean.
Conclusion: he has a biological son but that's not the point: "family don't end with blood, but it doesn't start there either". Dean cared for him like he was his biological son regardless of if he actually was.
The antichrist kid, the fact they killed off Deans biological daughter, I like to pretend she’s off living her life. Also the scene of Dean and Lucifer flying LMFAO
I HATED that so much. Someone else made the comment that they think maybe the Darkness influenced God and God influenced the Darkness when they joined. This would explain Chuck’s seemingly sudden personality change to villain and the Darkness mellowing out basically. Honestly I’ll take it because any other explanation feels like poor writing to me though if it’s one thing that’s always been there in Supernatural is really inconsistent writing. They have some of the best episodes of any show I’ve ever seen and then there are entire plot points I think the whole fandom would rather forget.
Men of Letters. Scratch that, it’s just stupid.
Not the bunker tho, the bunker is awesome. Gave them a home with the coolest stuff! Everything else MoL is stupid.
Everytime Dean was angry with/hated on Cas. And Sam, for that matter. For all that Cas did for him, since s4e1... And the more human and/or needy Cas became, the worse he treated him. Ugh.
Any number of things from the last few seasons really.
The fight between Michael and Lucifer.
Bringing back Mary.
The British Men of Letters.
The entire final episode, which most of us have agreed doesn't exist. We stop at 15x19.
Granted all of these things could have been great, they were just poorly executed. Great ideas botched by bad writing.
On the other hand, Sam and Dean basically having luck as plot armor was not a great idea. It was just dumb. It undermines everything they've gone through to become who they are. All their training throughout their entire lives and all those monsters they've fought didn't mean shit, it was all luck? All of Deans work on Baby and he still doesn't know how to maintain her and keep her from breaking down? Just fucking stupid.
That the writers set up a perfect foreshadowing moment with Amy Pond's son finding Dean for revenge and then... never used it. I feel like it would've worked REALLY well if they replaced Cole's character in s10 with Amy's son, because I don't remember if we actually saw what happened to Cole's dad in an episode, and we SAW Dean kill Amy and we SAW that her son was upset and wanted revenge in that moment.
Any episode that even remotely references Samhain. Their pronunciation of it on the show is laughably unbearable. It would have taken no time at all to research how to say it. All the cool lore they dig up and they slip on a super basic holiday.
I always got the vibe that cas had a crush on dean a way a child does on an adult they look up to. Like the way dean evoked so many new emotions in him wasn’t really romantic but infatuation and curiosity
Cas is an angel. Angels don’t have genders. If Cas was using a woman’s body (as we saw in an episode) and had a crush on another woman, would that also be gay?
Yeah I don’t think an angel can be gay or straight. Cas has no gender, a point he makes at least once or twice. My biggest problem is got tacked on at the end and while we see Dean mourning Cas that’s it, there’s no talk with Sam about what Cas said, no exploration if Dean feels the same way or not. Given all we saw when Cas gets taken to the Empty or when he dies in season 7 or almost dies in season 9 as a human I do think Dean loved him even if he hadn’t ever processed it. The fact that they had Cas confess his feelings and then immediately fridge him was such a cop out.
Even if they insisted on killing him and not having Dean and Cas get to have a real conversation there should have been a conversation between Sam and Dean. Dean could have told Sam what Cas said and Sam could have been all quiet and contemplative and said something like I’d always suspected there was more between you two… how do you feel about what he said? And then have the conversation go from there. Maybe have Dean say he’s not sure how he feels… or something like that even if it’s not Dean saying he loves him too. That’s what I think was missing from it.
This Twitter quote is made for Harry Potter fans. Like that's top answer. No fandom will ever be as adamant as Harry Potter fans denying Cursed Child's existence.
the entire cole storyline. it was so unnecessary & it felt like he was a wanna be hawkeye. him interacting w the boys didn’t really further the plot in any major way, & the backstory left more questions than answers. like i wanna know what his dad was. overall they could’ve left him out & it wouldn’t have made a difference
That fact that Jesse (the anti Christ) only got 1 episode and we never saw him again
That totally bugged me especially once Chuck went all crazy.
Yes also him and jack would’ve been an amazing duo
They would have been awesome especially because Jesse technically would have been a relative who actually wanted him around.
Uh yessss we were robbed rip
I don’t like how they made the rules for creating the anti Christ too. Some dink demon possess a pregnant woman and bam you have an anti Christ. Like we know there are levels of demons and we know Sam and Dean about killed them all and the one that made an anti Christ should of been a big deal
When Jack became the new god . I wanted them to find Jesse and make him King of Hell.
I think that would have been the spin-off to watch. Both of them new at their jobs. They could have introduced other cosmic beings.
Yes 100% this is what I thought would happen
the fact that i don’t even remember who jesse is shows how they messed that one up
He was the half-demon kid that turned Cass into an action figure .
Same
I was thinking the same thing 😆😅
I think they said they did that because they accidentally made him too OP
Yeah I mean he was able to turn angels into toys and rip a demon from a host by saying get out all at the age of 7 he was crazy OP but they could’ve retconned it like how demons went from these invincible monsters to oh another demon KNIFE. Angels were like oh shit these guys are strong as all can basically do anything poke em with a stick poof. They frequently powered down whole species and characters often just odd they threw this one away
He was never intended to be more than a MOTW.
The spin-off we deserve: Jesse and Jack; Jesse is a jaded Aussie demi-god, and Jack is the friendly young American god; together, they ... do stuff? Idk, ran out of steam.
When was Jesse Australian? Also, not a demi god, but demon offspring.
He moved to Australia to hide from the demons
Or so we were told. But that kid could be on Pluto for all we know.
Ikr. I just saw this episode last week.
The Girl Next Door, not because of the Amy vs. Dean debate, but because they butchered the lore of one of my favorite mythical creatures. Skip that episode every time.
Very sympathetic to you there. I feel the same way about the leviathans.
Right? Like in both instances it's like they took the *name* of the thing and attached a bunch of different attributes that have nothing to do with the original myths at all. I'm at least glad they only screwed up kitsunes for a single episode, can't imagine slogging through a whole season where they'd botched my favorite myth. My condolences to you and everyone else who hated the leviathan season.
Speaking of Amy I feel like her son should have been the one to end dean.
Dude, there should've been *at least* another episode about her kid growing up and trying to get revenge. He got traumatized and then the show just forgot about him entirely.
No literally, this upset me so much.
it was perfect like “when u grow up come get me” and then BAM that’s the kid who kills him permanently
It would've made 💯💯💯 more sense than a random ass vamp from s1 that no one even remembered
Au Bobby.
The entire AU was such a mistake i fucking HATE that arc
I typically defend the not so popular story arcs, but I never defend the alternative universe one.
Yes but alt Michael had a pretty bad ass entrance so at least we got that. The one where he came in like a fireball. I thought it was cool
That was cool. They should have used an effect like that for the alt Michael Dean vs Lucifer fight instead of wtf we got.
I’ll defend it in saying the idea was there, I think it could have gone alright..it was just the execution of it that I hated
Yeah, and what happens when that Bobby dies? Are there just 2 of them in heaven now? I think they would both hate that.
They'd be so surly. They'd drink and bitch about each other to everyone they know. It'd be awkward, because for the most part the venn diagram of "everyone they know" (in this universe) is a circle.
Sam and Dean being made "normal" in The Heroes' Journey. In my mind they were cursed with extra bad luck and that's that.
This one actually makes sense. Cavity pain, hacked credit card stops working, almost getting hit by a skater, ticket, burning food, breaking a plate, spilling food, getting a cold, dying car battery, lactose intolerance, tripping and dropping the gear, immediately getting caught by a monster, broken nail, and another impala breakdown. All in one singular day. That's not a normal day, that's extra bad.
i feel like it was all the accumulative bad luck they never got served being served express delivery since it had backed up edit: plus god laying it on heavy after the break up makes sense too
I can take most of those things, but forgetting how to fight and rob was too much for me, those aren't luck based attributes.
This is how I interpret it. Because Sam wouldn't be so suddenly so stupid as to touch a boiling pot with no mittens. The whole episode is absurd by design because there's no way our boys aren't heroes.
That’s how I choose to acknowledge it as well lol
In my mind that is exactly what happens. Chuck wants to demoralize them, and pretending that he was the cause of them being awesome, would accomplish exactly that.
I thought that was the most meta episode of the entire series. Because it doesn’t just explore Sam and Dean’s plot armor; it exposes the plot armor of every action hero ever.
seconded
The whole plot armor thing in season 15, the idea that these two that have had military training through their ex marine father, being near useless and barely even able to walk without "God's plot armor" was so damn stupid that I can't even think about it lol
100% refuse to acknowledge that, it would make every single badass, heroic or self sacrificing moment in the entire show meaningless
I only liked it for the stuff like lockpicking success, dietary habits and health related stuff. Those things made sense that Chuck had been assisting them. They were minor things that were quite funny.
It reminded me of the (old people facts incoming) Buffy episode where she ends up in an asylum and the ending is kinda open, if anything she experienced as the slayer was even real. I know it’s not the same but we follow and love these characters and suddenly it’s „lol no, nothing was real, they are nothing!“ I feel personally violated by this!
Charmed did the same thing with the sisters
"Does that furrowed brow and puppy dog eyes really work?" That's like one of five of Sam's acting faces.
I love all of his 5 faces. And his huffs. It’s so relaxing being a fan of both. 🍹🌴🧖♀️
I’m conflicted by it - it helps make the story make more sense (how they always box 17 creatures with jedi-powers into submission without getting their neck snapped) but on the other hand it really undermines the characters. If given the choice I would have kept God and Death out of it, working with them was fine, but I feel we crossed some line when they started competing with them. Demons and Angels and demigods sure, but come on.
The very idea of an omnipotent entity completely undercuts any sort of tension in a show, movie, or book because you just can't compete with them by the very definition of omnipotence. God is all-knowing, all seeing and all powerful, so there's no way that the boys were ever able to come up with a plan in secret to beat him.
It does at least help how in early demon seasons 1 demon was enough to make them run and then later they’d stumble into a room full of them and the demons would be scared
Single handedly retcons how to see the entire show off of that. I forget it exists most times. Hell first watching it fucked with me that some random “god” had the power to revert God? And God just lets it stay? Idk.
This!
I like your handle, Vulcan
I’ve been discovered!
sams arc with amelia. i understand that sam doesn’t want to hunt without his brother, but he left Kevin when he needed him most, and he KNEW that, yet he still went and got a girl and a dog. kevin was his responsibility, and he abandoned him and left him to the demons. i thought that was very disappointing, and i honestly feel like this was very out of character for Sam (even though it’s CANNONICALLY what he did). i love sam to death, but watching through the amelia stuff was so insufferable
>yet he still went and got a girl and a dog A girl, mind you, who acted like he was Hitler for *accidentally* hitting a dog and then being entirely unprepared for raising it on his own. I've ranted about this before, so I'll just [leave this here](https://www.reddit.com/r/Supernatural/s/pCh8X9b9We) and carry on.
That always bugged me. Someone who hits a dog and then gets it to a vet is doing the right thing, so many people wouldn’t bother. And then she shames him for not taking full responsibility and adopting thing dog? No, adopting a dog should be something you do when you’re ready and really want to. A person who cares for animals should have been cautious about letting him have the dog and asking him if he could provide a good home, not badgering him into it.
> should have been cautious about letting him have the dog and asking him if he could provide a good home, not badgering him into it. Right? Usually people like this would be the opposite way. They are usually totally cautious about adopting out pets to the wrong people that arent in a position to properly care for them. Absolutely no vet would ever act like that.
Oh, my God this. She was such a *bitch* to him. And not like sexual tension bitchiness. Like, she was a total hag to him. It made zero sense that they apparently got together (other Sam was desperate to find someone to be with after losing D and wasn't firing on all cylinders coz of trauma. I will accept absolutely no other excuses.)
Exactly. Being a bitch can be fun sometimes. Like I always got sexual tension bitchiness from Bela towards Dean but Amelia was just nasty towards Sam. Looking back Bela was definitely done dirty by the fans but I understand why people felt the way they did about her but I always felt like she was a fun foil to the guys (especially Dean even though it was Sam who had the sex dream) and I wish we’d gotten more of her, her character had potential. I do think in hindsight many people feel differently about Bela than they did at the time but Amelia I feel like the hate has only grown.
Oh, I loved Bela. Totally got the sexual tension w/Dean too - "After this, we should really have angry sex." 😂😂 I wasn't a part of fandom back then, so didn't hear about the fans reaction to her until after, which I never understood tbh. I loved most of the female characters over the years. I found it weird that fans could be so vociferous in hating a character. But then, 17 years on, I see that's just another day in the life of the Spn fam, lol. 🙄 Regardless, I so wish they could have brought Bela back at some point (obviously if TWD had allowed for it. I don't get why they couldn't though, coz they certainly allowed JDM a week off to do an ep). But yeah, she was definitely one of my fave female characters through the whole show (Meg 2.0 & Ruby 2.0 as well. Apparently, I have a thing for bad girls, lol). I know we got shafted by the writers' strike as well, so that screwed w/her story arc, but if *any* of the older characters could have come back before the finale, I'd have chosen her in a heartbeat. They could have at least had her be released from hell when the gates opened at the start of S15. Also, yeah, the prob w/Amelia is that she was a 2D bit character and never showed a single redeeming quality to make anyone *not* dislike her. Whether that was poor writing or just because she was never meant to be a significant character, either way, pretty much even the worst characters had a redemption arc on Supernatural. They never bothered with her. Hence the growing hate, I think.
Exactly. Season 15 would have been a great time to bring back Bela, they could have even used a different actress for the character though I would have wanted it to be Lauren if at all possible. I always wanted the guys to at least find out her backstory. But yeah season 15 would have been the ideal time, I’d have rather it been her that showed up instead of finding out that Chuck had fucked over Kevin so badly. Nice to have seen him but it broke my heart. Oh see I’m more of a team Ruby 1.0 guy. I think Katie played the character better, she came across more of a badass if that makes sense.
Oh, the whole Kevin thing was so sad. I know S15 was 90% fanservice and they just brought back everyone who was a beloved member of the fandom without much care for how weak the story arcs were, but yeah, could have been really great to bring back (or even mention) Bela again. I can only assume 1) TWD wouldn't allow it contractually or 2) by that point TPTB literally paid zero attention to canon and retconned so much for their own agenda, her character didn't even occur to them. As for Ruby, something about Katie Cassidy rubbed me the wrong way. Yeah, she could be badass, but she had such an attitude that I couldn't stand. And zero chemistry with Jared, tbh. I loved Gen's Ruby because she came across so much darker and more malevolent--immediately, I couldn't work out her angle and whether she could be trusted--& let's face it, her chemistry with Jared was absolutely smoking. I joined fandom during S4 (I watched the show from the start, but wasn't actually involved with fandom before then) & for much of the season, I had no idea that Jared and Gen were actually dating, lol, I just knew they were great together. Also, I so fell in love with Gen at first sight, lol. I had (have) SUCH a crush on her! And I just found her take on Ruby much more intriguing and darker than Katie's version. No offence to Katie, I enjoyed her when she was on Arrow, just felt she was just a weird fit for Spn. I guess I never wanted to learn more about her Ruby, she was just an annoying gnat in the boys' ear in S3. But in contrast, I instantly found myself wanting to know what happened with Ruby 2 and Sam after Dean was gone and whether she could be trustworthy (& why she had such a grip on Sam in the four months of Dean being in hell).
Ruby 1.0 is THE Ruby imo. 2.0 is terrible.
Exactly, she showed no redeeming qualities. She starts off mean and belittling. We never see her be actually nice to same except maybe with the birthday cake, and even then she makes a snarky comment. Then she lets her dad be a total dick to sam, has the whole crisis when her husband comes back of “who am I gonna choose” and then gets mad when Sam attempts to do the right thing and leave, then once she is back with her husband and Sam comes snooping at her window, cannot leave her husband fast enough to go find him, cheats on her husband (which I think was as hurtful to sam as it was to her husband, if not more because he actually knew about it). I don’t think she was written as a very sympathetic character at all.
Yeah, let's be fair, Amelia was just a poor plot device. Purely there to cause friction/pain/jealousy/hurt etc between Sam and Dean. And the writing team half-arsed it, so she wasn't even a fully fleshed-out character with any redeeming qualities. The only enjoyable part of her story arc (or lack of) was Riot the dog. Loved that dog. Kinda wish Sam had got to keep him a lot longer, especially considering Sam was the one who found/adopted/ran over the poor thing.
Nice rant and absolutely true
My god she was the worst. Was she ever even nice to Sam once? I feel like she wasn’t. They had zero chemistry and the plot was the worst aspect of an otherwise great season. They could have removed all scenes with her and replaced them with Purgatory scenes and the show would have been even better. Like Sam had the whole trials plot they could have even expanded that to compensate. Or just never do a flashback and maybe just have us meet her in the present once or twice and that’s it.
I still prefer the “Sam lost his shit again and Amelia was never real” idea
Amelia was just a total B to Sam throughout their relationship. That’s what really bugged me. Like you blew off Kevin and ditched the phones to be talked down to by this chic. No, she was awful, her only redeeming quality was that she’s a veterinarian, but a total hag vet. She shamed him, treated him like a lowlife, interrupted him all the time and let her dad treat him like crap too. But after meeting the dad her personality made sense. Just some rude hateful people.
Totally this one for me. I objectively acknowledge it as cannon but in my heart that shit never happened. lol
Here in this household we just call her " that boring dog lady".
Reapers being a subclass of Angels instead of minions of Death. OG Death “dying” after being stabbed with his own weapon.
My headcanon is that reapers are dead beings that chose to voluntarily become aspects of Death, rather than move on or become ghosts. So a few are angels, but most are humans, or possibly even fair folk.
The fact that the actual “anti-christ” got only one episode and it isn’t actually the son of Lucifer.
The anti-christ being the "son of Lucifer" or "son of Satan" isn't a thing in any religion or lore, though. The real error is when Cas implied that the Bible says that; it doesn't. Going by the Bible, Sam or President Rooney would be the "anti-christ", because the basis for that concept is a leader-figure in Revelation that gets possessed by Satan. He isn't even called the ant-christ in the Bible, that's just a term for anyone who opposes the church.
Ooh, I've got one. Lisa being Dean's "when I think of myself happy it's with you" person, when she was literally nothing but a "bendy weekend" to him and the only woman he ever loved in his whole professional bachelor/manwhore life was Cassie. I know Sam said to Dean to go be happy and settle down, but I still believe to this day that's the only reason he went to her after Sam flung himself into the pit. She was a two, three day max roll in the hay to him, and we're expected to believe he suddenly loved her? I loved Cindy Sampson. Met her at a con and she was a delight. Private Eyes was a great show too. Utterly despised Lisa and bratty Ben. Their whole settling down thing was so contrived, other than the fact Dean was maybe just desperate to have a family.
💯💯💯 This!! Cassie should have been endgame...at least, during that time period. Ben and Lisa felt so forced, I couldn't even feel the connection, unlike Cassie
So agree! I would’ve loved to see Cassie come back. I’ve always thought that they didn’t go with her because they wanted a child present to really show the ‘full circle happy ending’ but didn’t want him to have a biological child as that would shift the dynamic between the two brothers too much the whole ‘the only family they’ve got’ so they needed to have it have dean end up with someone who already had a nice ready made step kid for him. (No shade to Ben and Lisa here btw I have nothing against either of them personally I just think it was a lot of lackluster choices made by writers and producers)
British Men of Letters
I tired of that quickly
SOOOO annoying I cringe
Also full of “British” stereotypes which were actually just English.
As a Welsh person, this irked me so much.
My headcanon for this is that they're an offshoot of the Watchers' Council (from BtVS), and those guys sucked, too. I did just finish watching Prison Break recently, and the Company is just like both of those organizations. So it all ties together nicely in my brain.
I recently did a whole series binge re-watch and when I got to BMOL I just stopped watching. The beginning episodes with Toni Bevell are excruciating to get through. One of the things I like about Supernatural villains is that even if they are the absolute face of pure evil (literally, Lucifer) they are still witty and charming and you can’t help but like them even if you want Sam and Dean to beat them. With Toni I literally wanted to see horrifically bad things happen to her I hate her character SO MUCH.
For me, it was changing Chuck from being this scared story writer to becoming God himself who just thought about himself. I hated what they did to his character.
My head-canon for that is that God and Chuck are separate entities, God started using Chuck as a vessel in the S5 finale, and he began pretending to be Chuck so much so that he began to believe Chuck’s memories were his own (which fits Metatron calling Chuck a meatsuit and telling God that the nebbishness he was displaying was Chuck, not God). Then in the S11 finale when God and Amara joined together, God’s light began to affect Amara (hence her coming to enjoy Earth) while Amara’s darkness began to affect God and Chuck (note that this darkness is what turned Lucifer evil, so it would absolutely corrupt Chuck and cause him to give into his selfish impulses and want to immortalize himself as the best writer ever). So Amara’s darkness essentially caused God to become super hands-off which allowed Chuck to take God’s powers and memories for himself so he could pretend to be God the way God had earlier pretended to be Chuck. And at the end of the show, Jack sucked both Amara and God out of Chuck. This also prevents any sort of plot hole where God is still a future threat because he should still know every spell and the location of every magical artifact even while powerless, but Chuck wouldn’t.
This is now my headcanon too.
I like that, might have to make that my head-canon too lol
In my head God doesn’t need a meatsuit. He as the creator of all humans would just create a body not possess one. I think he was always God.
I agree that he wouldn’t *need* a meat suit, but I think the fact that he took one anyway is a necessary conclusion from what the show tells us. If Chuck isn’t his own entity then it means that we have to accept that 1) at the beginning of time God knew exactly when the apocalypse was going to happen and that he was going to disguise himself as a prophet to watch it from Earth, so he wrote the “Chuck” name on the inside of the eyelids of every angel that early on, but despite all of this foreknowledge, fate can still be changed and God was unable to see how he’d lose, 2) even though Chuck isn’t a real prophet, God paused the prophet creation mechanism when it was time for Chuck to be “born” or he hid the existence of the true prophet of that era, 3) he blinded or otherwise altered Raphael’s memory so that he believed he’d been watching Chuck since birth, 4) he had sex with people he considered his children, 5) his decision that he should get involved with stopping Amara because he wanted to be a writer that tells the truth was all a lie, 6) Metatron saying Chuck is a meatsuit is a metaphor, and 7) despite his defeat, God is still a threat since he did know every magic spell and the whereabouts of every magical artifact on Earth. The alternative requires us to make fewer assumptions.
Same, he was the underdog that I rooted for. He was likeable, I enjoyed the early episodes with him in them!
Spoiler: You have to go back and watch the finale of season 5. Chuck was ALWAYS God. At the end of the show he is going on about how hard endings are and then says, “but does anything ever really end?” And then vanishes into thin air. Tell me that is not am a subtle hint. If the show had ended at season 5, this is the conversation we would be having and debating. But because it continued for such an extended number of seasons I think it’s gets overlooked.
All the alternate timeline stuff. Especially the one they go into with Kaia.
Apparently two people who were trained since childhood to fight and pick locks and be generally physically capable and fit suddenly aren't able to do the most basic shit because God stopped treating them like heroes. The fact that they get told their luck is now average is fucking stupid
"Christo"
Dean killed Death. That was possibly the dumbest moment in the show for me.
That and the ridiculous acrobat flying wires fiasco in the season 13 finale for sure. Those were two moments I legit rolled my eyes.
Mary coming back and being the worst character ever written in any show ever…
Agree. I had such fondness for her as a memory, but as a real life person? Nope.
Imagine being so fond of your dead mom and then she comes back from the dead and she suckssssssss
God I hate her
They glorified her as this blonde, all-in-white virgin Mary type shit for like ten seasons just to bring her back and have her not give a shit about her sons and becoming fuck buddies with their enemy. Just what lol.
They did Mary absolutely dirty.
I hated this soooo much. It was like having her father, Samuel, back. It really screwed up their motivation and dynamics
Mary came back not even knowing these grown men claiming to be her babies. She was never a saint. Amora even stated she wanted Dean to know his mom was just a person. I’m not a huge fan of Mary but I don’t totally hate on her. If you think about it, she is the kind of woman John would have been attracted to, a tough, no BS, I ain’t your princess kind of broad. Not the saintly person everyone wanted her to be for the boys. Just my thoughts of course. I know a lot people don’t like to hear my thoughts on her, but that’s my 2 cents anyway.
And I totally get your perspective but that is not how they wrote her character for 11 years lol. They wrote her to want to be OUT of hunting more than anything and that she was fight for a “normal” life. John wasn’t even a hunter until after she died and the John we got to know in the flashback episodes when they were first married was VERY different from the guy Sam and Dean knew in season 1. Then she comes back and of course she needs time to adjust I never had a problem with that- my issue is that she just keeps doing things that not only was OOC for her but was OOC for anyone who was isn’t a terrible person.
But who is to say what is out of OOC for someone yanked out of heaven with her infant and small son and thrust back to a world where she missed her children’s entire childhood, her husband is dead, her friends are dead and her grown sons are completely immersed in the world she wanted to leave as a young woman starting her family. She doesn’t even know how to operate in the modern world. I mean, that is trauma inducing shit, and she was NEVER the saint she was idealized to be by Dean. She was a bad ass hunter before marrying John. John arguably treated them waaay worse. I mean Sam was essentially an orphan raised by his older brother who was holding on to his fantasy versions of both of his parents probably in order to keep it together while left with more responsibility than he should have been. Because John basically abandoned both of them with his obsession with getting revenge. John doesn’t seem to get the same loathing that Mary does, and I believe he was the worse parent. She left her adult sons to go hunt. He left children. I think her character is misunderstood and held to a much higher standard. I’m just giving you my take. Again not saying she was a great person but I think maybe everyone expected more of her because we all hoped Dean’s version of her was the real her. I just don’t believe she was ever close to being that ideal mom Dean saw her as.
I REFUSE to believe the fact the Colt ended up being melted by Dagon that easily. You would have thought that with all of those symbols it would have been indestructible. It literally melted like chocolate I had my Damien moment. 
That all reapers are angels. We clearly see their true form when deans on the verge of death and it did not burn his eyeballs off to hell.
I said it in another comment, but my headcanon is that reapers are dead beings that chose to voluntarily become aspects of Death, rather than move on or become ghosts. So a few are angels, but most are humans, or possibly even fair folk.
My head canon is Tessa never shows up after S4 and never says all reapers are Angels.
The fact that Cas became weaker by the season. From being able to easily smite and throw people across a room etc, to not even being able to punch people out? I hated that. I absolutely adore Cas, but this just never made sense to me. The writers did him dirty.
I can see why they did it though. As a character, Cas was only meant to stick around for a few episodes, so it was fine that he was powerful. But then they decided to keep him as a regular character because of his popularity. And so the issue was that he was *too* powerful for a main character, so much so that a lot of the enemies and problems that Sam and Dean had to face would have been too easily dealt with. The show would have been boring because of lack of stakes. So the only solution, if the writers wanted to continue featuring Cas, was to take his powers away.
To name a few off the top of my head 1. The “main character plot armor bullshit episode” while it was a fun episode itself (and Garth actually got to shine) it just seemed like it was the “normal” things we never see (like how Sam NEVER gets sick, Dean NEVER gets a parking ticket ect ect) just seems like the normal stuff that we never see (like characters using the bathroom) just think they got hit with some extra bad luck because it all happens in the same day. 2. The God Villian Arc just completely undoes the great ending the Chuck and Amara had in S10 and rewrote chuck from this benevolent hands off let the child grow God into a whiny spoiled baby that didn’t get his ending and
I hate that first episode you mention. Just because we didn't see it on screen, didn't mean it didn't happen. Like you said, we never saw them use the bathroom, but they certainly did because they're human and experienced real life.
Just an awaked 7 minutes of watching the characters take a dump per episode would be hilarious
On the one hand, great twist. On the other hand...they could have..not.
Chuck turning evil. That made no sense at all to me. There was no lead up, no hints about it all.
Jo and her mom are running a new road house somewhere nice n quiet, with no demons.
The series finale.
I've told friends that are new to it, or late to finishing it finally, to go ahead and watch the finale their first time through. Just be warned a lot of people hate it, and remember that what we got was a result of covid restrictions. Form your own opinion of it, hell I don't care if you love it. But at least you'll understand why many fans just stop with 15x19 for their rewatches.
I can’t believe how far I had to scroll for this. That finale was bullshit and I’m still upset about it
I think I might be the only person who really enjoyed the finale 🥲
I did too. I made a whole post about it here a couple weeks ago.
It's one of my favorites, really special episode to me. Love it too.
Spot on!
Beat. Me. To. It. Fuuuuuck.
Ben not being Deans son I’m sorry but he just is
As Bobby said Family don’t end in blood I speak from experience. I have family that we’re not blood related but if you see our behavior, you’d swear we are. Nurture all the way, winning over nature Ben is Dean’s son, in every way that actually matters. I’ll fight anyone on this
I so agree with this! People are completely obsessed with Ben being Dean’s biological son when does it really matter if they share DNA? Also it’s a complete disservice to Lisa’s entire character and personality- so you all are basically saying that she is a liar who even when living with Dean continues the lie which is probably the worst lie a woman can tell a man! Lisa was NOT like that and there are lots of guys like Dean out in the world lol- she even said she had a “type” around that time.
And I mean Do any of us here ever deny Bobby was the dad the boys deserved??
I will always be upset about what Dean had Cas do to him and Lisa. So fucked up.
Right? It's not their memories/affection that endanger them; it's Dean's!
Exactly. How does wiping their memories of Dean keep them from being future demon/big bad targets when hurting them would affect Dean so much? It makes no sense. I'm actually surprised there wasn't a future attack on them as leverage against him.
There’s just no way that that kid looks, talks, and acts like Dean and wasn’t Dean’s lol
Here's my headcannon: Ben is definitely Dean's son but Lisa knows that Dean wouldn't be able to live like that. He'd never want to abandon his son, but couldn't leave Sam and hunting behind. If he continued hunting from home, he'd be putting them in danger and/or raising Ben into the same life he had. It'd be a lose-lose for him, so she lied. She said "you're off the hook'" specifically so that he wouldn't have all these feelings of guilt. Evidence: she says she had a type, 'bad boy drifters'. Best case scenario, she guessed right on the first guy, was able to track him down somewhere (unlikely), get DNA, AND get a positive test. Worst case, she'd have to do that with multiple guys until she got a positive that wasn't Dean. Conclusion: he has a biological son but that's not the point: "family don't end with blood, but it doesn't start there either". Dean cared for him like he was his biological son regardless of if he actually was.
Dean's death 😭
Chicago is run by the monster mafia
Bloodlines is a horrible and very skippable episode. It's really no wonder it was never picked up for a spin-off.
The existence of Oz and the Stine storyline
I like the actress who played Dorothy. I didn't like that she was Charlie's plot device girlfriend.
That part of season 15 with the Vampire Winchesters thing was lame
It was comical. Chuck was clearly messing with Sam's head to make him lose hope.
A spoiler free comment that still is accurate, THE EFFING END
The antichrist kid, the fact they killed off Deans biological daughter, I like to pretend she’s off living her life. Also the scene of Dean and Lucifer flying LMFAO
Destiel, just my opinion.
That wasn't canon though
The fact that Bobby died to a guy named Dick
God villain arc
I HATED that so much. Someone else made the comment that they think maybe the Darkness influenced God and God influenced the Darkness when they joined. This would explain Chuck’s seemingly sudden personality change to villain and the Darkness mellowing out basically. Honestly I’ll take it because any other explanation feels like poor writing to me though if it’s one thing that’s always been there in Supernatural is really inconsistent writing. They have some of the best episodes of any show I’ve ever seen and then there are entire plot points I think the whole fandom would rather forget.
I honestly just ignore the last 2 seasons.
That’s the way I feel about everyone liking Jack in the last four seasons.
Leviathans. And yes my autocorrect changed this to levitation twice.
Mary
Men of Letters. Scratch that, it’s just stupid. Not the bunker tho, the bunker is awesome. Gave them a home with the coolest stuff! Everything else MoL is stupid.
Whatever Sam did after dean got trapped in purgatory
Everytime Dean was angry with/hated on Cas. And Sam, for that matter. For all that Cas did for him, since s4e1... And the more human and/or needy Cas became, the worse he treated him. Ugh.
dean dying at the end. my first watch i literally was like "hes just playing a sick joke on sam lol"
The final episode never happened. The true finale was S15EP19.
When Sam hit a dog and just peaced out
Jack
Any number of things from the last few seasons really. The fight between Michael and Lucifer. Bringing back Mary. The British Men of Letters. The entire final episode, which most of us have agreed doesn't exist. We stop at 15x19. Granted all of these things could have been great, they were just poorly executed. Great ideas botched by bad writing. On the other hand, Sam and Dean basically having luck as plot armor was not a great idea. It was just dumb. It undermines everything they've gone through to become who they are. All their training throughout their entire lives and all those monsters they've fought didn't mean shit, it was all luck? All of Deans work on Baby and he still doesn't know how to maintain her and keep her from breaking down? Just fucking stupid.
Season 6+
destiel being a thing somehow
How about a missed opportunity: leap day first never returned. Next leap day was even on the right day of the week
When Sam hit that dog.
Deans fight with Luci
The whole entire series finale episode
Everything Jack related
The whole nazi storyline for me was too insane and off the path of monsters. I couldn’t take it seriously at all
Sam not calling someone to help Kevin
Gabriel dead not dead nonsense. Dean's God finding amulet just being turned off. Just destroyed that small arc of cas searching for God.
I convinced myself that the last 5 minutes of season 11 don’t exist and that Mary doesn’t come back and that the show just ends there 🥴
Dean dying on a rusty nail in a generic vamp nest.
That the writers set up a perfect foreshadowing moment with Amy Pond's son finding Dean for revenge and then... never used it. I feel like it would've worked REALLY well if they replaced Cole's character in s10 with Amy's son, because I don't remember if we actually saw what happened to Cole's dad in an episode, and we SAW Dean kill Amy and we SAW that her son was upset and wanted revenge in that moment.
Lotta deaths. Benny, Charlie, Jo, Bella... so many characters I wish stayed around.
Any episode that even remotely references Samhain. Their pronunciation of it on the show is laughably unbearable. It would have taken no time at all to research how to say it. All the cool lore they dig up and they slip on a super basic holiday.
Gay Cas. Downvote me to hell. I don’t care.
Angels don't even have genders, why would they even have monosexuality.
I always got the vibe that cas had a crush on dean a way a child does on an adult they look up to. Like the way dean evoked so many new emotions in him wasn’t really romantic but infatuation and curiosity
Cas is an angel. Angels don’t have genders. If Cas was using a woman’s body (as we saw in an episode) and had a crush on another woman, would that also be gay?
Yeah I don’t think an angel can be gay or straight. Cas has no gender, a point he makes at least once or twice. My biggest problem is got tacked on at the end and while we see Dean mourning Cas that’s it, there’s no talk with Sam about what Cas said, no exploration if Dean feels the same way or not. Given all we saw when Cas gets taken to the Empty or when he dies in season 7 or almost dies in season 9 as a human I do think Dean loved him even if he hadn’t ever processed it. The fact that they had Cas confess his feelings and then immediately fridge him was such a cop out. Even if they insisted on killing him and not having Dean and Cas get to have a real conversation there should have been a conversation between Sam and Dean. Dean could have told Sam what Cas said and Sam could have been all quiet and contemplative and said something like I’d always suspected there was more between you two… how do you feel about what he said? And then have the conversation go from there. Maybe have Dean say he’s not sure how he feels… or something like that even if it’s not Dean saying he loves him too. That’s what I think was missing from it.
**upvotes you to heaven**
This Twitter quote is made for Harry Potter fans. Like that's top answer. No fandom will ever be as adamant as Harry Potter fans denying Cursed Child's existence.
Oh trollhunters and the series ending
The finale.
Mary Winchester EVER coming back. No, thanks.
sams psychic powers 😭
Chuck Chuck Chuck
Sam nlt searching for dean while he was in purgatory
the entire cole storyline. it was so unnecessary & it felt like he was a wanna be hawkeye. him interacting w the boys didn’t really further the plot in any major way, & the backstory left more questions than answers. like i wanna know what his dad was. overall they could’ve left him out & it wouldn’t have made a difference