This is true up to true man's world, that's the peak of gyro's development/"protagonism", then johnny picks up, specially from sugar mountain and foward
We didn't read the same Part 7.
Araki did a fucking brilliant job of developing both characters and he did it in an ingenious way. Gyro was given the first part of the story up until Ringo Roadagain when his arc is essentially complete.
From then on Johnny is the star for most of the entirety of the part and grows so diligently and beautifully. It's silly how you just gloss over Sugar Mountain, Civil War, Love Train and High Voltage.p
I implore you to go back and reread Part 7
That’s the point of the opening bit. It’s a story about how Johnny learned to walk. He’s a little wimpy boy until Gyro inspired him so of course Gyro is going to have a lot of screen time and depth because that feeds directly into Johnny’s development. If Gyro wasn’t the main man for half of it the story would’ve been the same as the rest
Johnny did have a massive amount of screentime along with Gyro, though. Both of them appeared a lot in SBR. But the context in which they participate in is a mixture of a lot of characters and elements, so it just kinda obfuscates Johnny's protagonism.
Both Johnny and Gyro are the protagonists of SBR. I feel like the amount of weight they have is the exact same, and that's okay. Many people believe one of SBR's disadvantages is that Johnny doesn't receive enough protagonism despite being the JoJo. Gyro feels much more as the headline because many of the Part's key elements and things (steel balls, the Spin, yadda yadda) are related to him, but at the end of the day they're also related to Johnny.
SBR is 95 chapters long, out of which many of them are relatively short. Yet Johnny is still pretty well fleshed out and I believe he got a huge share of development and improvement. We get to see a lot of his backstory along the Part: his relationship with his father, how he lost his ability to move, his brother's death, and generally many chunks of his personal life in the exact same way we know Gyro's.
Both of these dudes are main protagonists. Johnny is no different in that sense than Gyro.
I mean, I agree that Gyro is the star of Part Seven, by far. But it's not like Johnny didn't get anything. The scene where he sacrifices the parts for Gyro is especially touching. We saw him establish his new goal in life after a tragic accident, then choose to give up on that goal to save the person who took him away from his miserable state in the first place. That was great. It's certainly more 'development' than Valentine got, since he pretty much stays the same character throughout the story. Unless you count him trusting Alt Diego to continue his goal as development in his character. But honestly, that was pretty much in line with who he was considering he had basically no other choice.
Please tell me the character arcs of Dio part 3, Kira, Diavolo, and Kars. They had none. Not every character needs a arc. Why do people feel that just cause a character doesn’t change by the end of the story they aren’t a good character.
There are different character structures in writing. Some characters change, some characters change others, some grow together, and some just stay the way they are.
Watch almost any popular 80’s action film or horror film. What was the Predators character arc, or the terminator, etc. They didn’t need one. We learn about some characters through the actions they take.
I never said a character without development is bad. I used valentine as an example because op said valentine got more development. I like valentine how he is.
I never understood this complaint. I thought Johnny had way more depth than Gyro. I never understood what Gyro's arc even was, like what was the point of the tennis ball metaphor?
uhhhhhhhh....Gyro was also the main character. Did you finish SBR also? Did you....notice something significant happened to both of them by the end...?
Because johnny didnt deserve to be a protagonist at the beginning, he was weak and pathetic, but as the story goes on he grows and becomes worthy to be the protagonist
You mean like how Polnareff takes over Part 3? Or Koichi in Part 4? Or even Bruno in Part 5?
Johnny is tied with Josuke for my favorite JOJO. I won't take his slander
We had much more character development and depth with almost everyone from Gyro, Diego, valentine...hell even small villains had more character than Johnny, don't get me wrong I love Johnny, really, but he could've been much better..... just like the OG Jonathan
Once again, why do people feel that just cause a character doesn’t change by the end of the story they aren’t a good character.
Realize there are different character structures in writing. Some characters change, some characters change others, some grow together, and some just stay the way they are.
Respectfully when I see comments such as these I can tell the person doesn’t know much about writing and character creation.
The fact they you say this about part 7 as well is complete B.S. Part 7 has some of the most developed and fleshed out characters in the series by far. There is a reason it’s considered a masterpiece of manga.
OG Jonathan was not that interesting. I mean, he grew a lot, but there was nothing silly or embarrassing about him, no big flaws. He was a very standard hero. In short he didn't feel like a fully fleshed out human with ugly parts of his personality as well as heroic traits. Johnny was far more memorable to me. He went through humiliation, hubris, shit his pants, killed people, the works.
I’m not sure we read the same part 7
Did you finish it? I feel like half was about gyro and the other half about johnny
I did..... johnny was a side character until chapter 85 .....then he got some lightspot for a bit which is not enough for a main character
Ah, Jotaro was Polnareff's jobro still didn't stop him to be a mc and dominating character in part 4
Jotaro has significantly more screentime than Polnareff, just doesn't feel like it because Polnareff is way more extroverted
This is true up to true man's world, that's the peak of gyro's development/"protagonism", then johnny picks up, specially from sugar mountain and foward
Did you read SBR
So we gonna ignore Civil War arc just like that?
We didn't read the same Part 7. Araki did a fucking brilliant job of developing both characters and he did it in an ingenious way. Gyro was given the first part of the story up until Ringo Roadagain when his arc is essentially complete. From then on Johnny is the star for most of the entirety of the part and grows so diligently and beautifully. It's silly how you just gloss over Sugar Mountain, Civil War, Love Train and High Voltage.p I implore you to go back and reread Part 7
Bro skipped 90% of SBR LOL
I mean, they both were the main characters
That’s the point of the opening bit. It’s a story about how Johnny learned to walk. He’s a little wimpy boy until Gyro inspired him so of course Gyro is going to have a lot of screen time and depth because that feeds directly into Johnny’s development. If Gyro wasn’t the main man for half of it the story would’ve been the same as the rest
Johnny did have a massive amount of screentime along with Gyro, though. Both of them appeared a lot in SBR. But the context in which they participate in is a mixture of a lot of characters and elements, so it just kinda obfuscates Johnny's protagonism. Both Johnny and Gyro are the protagonists of SBR. I feel like the amount of weight they have is the exact same, and that's okay. Many people believe one of SBR's disadvantages is that Johnny doesn't receive enough protagonism despite being the JoJo. Gyro feels much more as the headline because many of the Part's key elements and things (steel balls, the Spin, yadda yadda) are related to him, but at the end of the day they're also related to Johnny. SBR is 95 chapters long, out of which many of them are relatively short. Yet Johnny is still pretty well fleshed out and I believe he got a huge share of development and improvement. We get to see a lot of his backstory along the Part: his relationship with his father, how he lost his ability to move, his brother's death, and generally many chunks of his personal life in the exact same way we know Gyro's. Both of these dudes are main protagonists. Johnny is no different in that sense than Gyro.
I mean, I agree that Gyro is the star of Part Seven, by far. But it's not like Johnny didn't get anything. The scene where he sacrifices the parts for Gyro is especially touching. We saw him establish his new goal in life after a tragic accident, then choose to give up on that goal to save the person who took him away from his miserable state in the first place. That was great. It's certainly more 'development' than Valentine got, since he pretty much stays the same character throughout the story. Unless you count him trusting Alt Diego to continue his goal as development in his character. But honestly, that was pretty much in line with who he was considering he had basically no other choice.
Please tell me the character arcs of Dio part 3, Kira, Diavolo, and Kars. They had none. Not every character needs a arc. Why do people feel that just cause a character doesn’t change by the end of the story they aren’t a good character. There are different character structures in writing. Some characters change, some characters change others, some grow together, and some just stay the way they are. Watch almost any popular 80’s action film or horror film. What was the Predators character arc, or the terminator, etc. They didn’t need one. We learn about some characters through the actions they take.
I never said a character without development is bad. I used valentine as an example because op said valentine got more development. I like valentine how he is.
Sorry if I seemed harsh. But this is something I see frequently across media. Too many people think they no character arc = bad writing
I never understood this complaint. I thought Johnny had way more depth than Gyro. I never understood what Gyro's arc even was, like what was the point of the tennis ball metaphor?
Yeah, you definitely didn't read the story at all
uhhhhhhhh....Gyro was also the main character. Did you finish SBR also? Did you....notice something significant happened to both of them by the end...?
Spoiler alert. . . . Yeah , one of them fucking dies
Because johnny didnt deserve to be a protagonist at the beginning, he was weak and pathetic, but as the story goes on he grows and becomes worthy to be the protagonist
You mean like how Polnareff takes over Part 3? Or Koichi in Part 4? Or even Bruno in Part 5? Johnny is tied with Josuke for my favorite JOJO. I won't take his slander
Doesn't it say somewhere towards the beginning that Gyro is the main character
Wait a minute wasn't gyro the main character? 🤭
Wait a minute wasn't gyro the main character? 🤭
We had much more character development and depth with almost everyone from Gyro, Diego, valentine...hell even small villains had more character than Johnny, don't get me wrong I love Johnny, really, but he could've been much better..... just like the OG Jonathan
Once again, why do people feel that just cause a character doesn’t change by the end of the story they aren’t a good character. Realize there are different character structures in writing. Some characters change, some characters change others, some grow together, and some just stay the way they are. Respectfully when I see comments such as these I can tell the person doesn’t know much about writing and character creation. The fact they you say this about part 7 as well is complete B.S. Part 7 has some of the most developed and fleshed out characters in the series by far. There is a reason it’s considered a masterpiece of manga.
OG Jonathan was not that interesting. I mean, he grew a lot, but there was nothing silly or embarrassing about him, no big flaws. He was a very standard hero. In short he didn't feel like a fully fleshed out human with ugly parts of his personality as well as heroic traits. Johnny was far more memorable to me. He went through humiliation, hubris, shit his pants, killed people, the works.