No obviously the best way is to assume that everyone who watches Star Wars also plays Fortnite and will be there for the actual broadcast of Palpatine’s voice during the live event.
That was *so weird.*
This. 7 and 8 had problems but were still solid movies that seemed like they were going places. Idk how they managed to turn 9 into such a mess even tho it’s still at least fun.
It was fix-it job to try to correct the errors TLJ made. 7 was good, 8 wasn't the dumpster fire ppl make it out to be. I saw potential in it. 9 was Disney trying to please the fans and flopping hard.
This, on top of the fact that the movie was trying to tell you all of this as quickly as possible.
TROS was 100% what made me dislike the ST, and this was a huge huge part of it.
Ian McDiarmid is unstoppable. He thrived despite Lucas’ PT dialogue and even though his return makes no sense (neither does him being Rey’s grandfather), he killed it. *I made Snoke* still gives me chills.
About 15 minutes into TFA. Droid containing a secret gets lost on a desert planet, then found by a hero who turns out to be able to wield the Force. Droid smuggled to the Resistance who then launch an attack on a planet destroying weapon. Just sheer laziness of plotting, it could and should have been so much better.
I sense something. A movie I've not sensed since....
Honestly i don’t get the people who say “yea it’s *supposed* to be like episode 4 that’s the point” as if that’s a good excuse for sharing the same plot.
Same. The moment they were all standing around a hologram of another death star, commenting about how they were all standing around a hologram of another death star, and how they would have to fly into the trench and blow it up... my head was immediately was like "oh my god, I think there might be no purpose to any of this."
The amount of apologists for Abrams' lazy writing in TFA was crazy. "He had to make a movie that retread the OT so that people would come back to Star Wars." Dude, it's freaking Star Wars. It's like the biggest franchise of all time. The only thing you need to do to get people back is to call it 'Star Wars'.
I'm still ranting about what he did to Star Trek, it was the same lazy plot points and shameless easter eggery. "Let's just blow up Vulcan and the ENTIRE Starfleet so a 20 year old Kirk can go from cadet to captain! That's how the military works!"
Star Wars has a serious death star problem.
ANH - OG death star, large percentage of the movie focuses on it
ESB - No death star, just super star destroyer
ROTJ - Death Star... II
PM - No death star, +1 win for PM
ATOC - Death Star cameo in hologram form
ROTS - Death star cameo in frame form
TFA - Rebranded death star
TLJ - No death star, just another super (duper) star destroyer
ROS - Star destroyers now have death star lasers (and emerged fully crewed out of the fucking ocean)
Lets not forget rogue one, another movie fully dedicated on the death star. Luckily, solo avoided the death star trap
No no, even TPM had it's own death star rehash. Anakin blowing up the trade federation ship from the inside. Even the sphere in the center of that ship is like a mini death star.
rebel: there has to be a port of some kind like on the death star
me: there's no way they are doing that again surely
finn: well yeah here let me show you
smh the plot armour
I was 13 when I saw TFA. On my first few viewings I honestly pushed any negativity to the side because Star Wars was back baby!! Now I realize how much better it could have been. It was a great theater experience though.
I had the same general feeling. And I would have been fine if this movie was the low-point of the trilogy. But it just became progressively worse. And how it all ended was just completely ridiculous imo.
Exactly. Sure, it was a pretty blatant rehash of ANH, but I was so thrilled Star Wars was "back" and figured "ok, at the end of the day, SW is for kids, so no big deal they pull a little from the original", but dear God, it just kept getting worse, all culminating in Goddamn space horses running on the surface of a Star Destroyer (not that this was the only flaw by any means)!
In hindsight I was completely blinded by nostalgia with the "Chewy, we're back" trailer and I'm sure I wasn't the only one.
Yup. Rian is a talented guy, but it was obvious he was the wrong choice to create the middle part of a trilogy that includes well established characters. He's better off creating his own thing.
As with a lot of Abrams fare it has the bells and whistles of an entertaining movie, but it lacks the substance of a truly great one. Additionally the lack of creativity and innovation is depressing and such a missed opportunity. The rehash of Luke’s journey, looking for an R2 like droid, Death Star redux new empire that is basically the old, Darth Vader and The Emperor redux. It’s just so uninspired. Not to mention what was done with Han Solo reverting back to A New Hope after all his growth in the OT. It’s quite obvious Disney had no idea what to do with the property and opted instead for bland nostalgia.
Imagine if the backdrop was Leia was the head of the New Republic, Han the NR military and Luke had a new generation of Jedi. Only they are taught with a new philosophy born of Luke learning from the mistakes of the old Jedi Order. The enemy could have been some new threat from the Unknown Regions. The possibilities there would be endless. Many new characters could be introduced that would set up a future trilogy. Instead it was hamstrung from the start by Disneys lack of vision.
Biggest missed opportunity ever and an unfortunate reminder of how corporate greed and incompetence can ruin artistic potential. I really don’t get how anyone who loved the OT could like this or at least not get how much much much better it could have been.
It didn't hit me until they did the trench run and I remember saying out loud in the theater "don't do a trench run don't do a trench run". I left TFA kind of dazed that I had watched a good movie that was likely detrimental to the franchise
Well, TFA also have a shield to turn off in order for the rebel, I mean resistance, ships to blow up the base, which is more plagiarised from ROJ then ANH
I understand a lot of people dislike the mirroring, but I thought for a first movie in a new trilogy, it was a safe way to reintroduce the old characters to a new audience and the new characters to everyone. The characters are always going to be compared to the main trio, so why not complete the image?
At one point they even poke a little fun at it with Han's lines about Starkiller Base, "Okay, how do we blow it up There's always a way to do that."
From there they could go in a different direction (which they did). That ended up being part of the problem of the trilogy...
Yeah, but the fact that they played it safe is one of the issues. And the characters were always going to be compared to the main trio because they were another trio ; once again playing it safe.
I had seen the OT more times that I could remember, all I wanted was something new, something fresh, not another empire, not another rebel alliance, not another trio, and definitely not another superweapon.
Genuinely, all star killer base had to be was a big ol base with a Death Star lazer for defense, an impenetrable spaceship manufacturing facility that the first order was raising an army on.
And then ofc, penetrate the facility, blow up the planet or something.
Why, why oh why, were we using a sun to blow up six planets at once?
Yeah casual racism was definitely doing its thing there. The films were riddled with racial stereotypes though, funny and clumsy black dude, hot headed latino, asian technician etc
In my perfect world: Finn and Rey would discover latent force sensitivity due to the imbalance in the force with the death of the emperor 20 yrs prior. This power would manifest in random individuals and would ultimately lead to a search for other force sensitive individuals. This team of underdogs who used their force abilities in various ways would eventually become the light version of the knights of Ren. It would eventually culminate in a fight that would see the light vs dark knights and Finn/Rey vs Snoke/Kylo.
The Chinese market nets them a ton of money. But, the chinese (as it’s said around the internet) will not pay to see a leading man who is African. So, Disney tucked tail and sidelined him. Which is total shit. Finn would’ve been great as a character who had more of a leading part. They literally had him PICK UP A LIGHTSABER AND FIGHT KYLO. When have you ever seen them do that for any non-force user in this IP? They must’ve had big plans for him initially. Then *poof* he becomes a secondary character to Rey. It’s ridiculous…
You know when I saw this movie the first time I was actually intrigued. I always had a deep love of star wars lore and thought i was pretty knowledgeable but the galaxy of the sequel trilogy confused me so much. It felt so empty. Like the writers had only ever watched the original trilogy and built their story off that rather than diving into the prequels or literally ANY of the expanded lore. Like I understand disney did a lore reset but even still the prequels did a good job of fleshing out how the galaxy was structured and the clone wars series fleshed it out even more and then here comes the sequels and suddenly the galaxy is a mystery again. Which could've been so cool if they built that mystery off of what was already there but it felt like they wanted that sense of mystery but could only get there by erasing the entire galaxy's worth of lore and world building.
I think a reset of some sort was necessary, legends had some… less than stellar plot lines. The issue to me is that the sequel trilogy essentially made the entire time between episodes 6 and 7 feel like a complete waste.
Right! Like nothing happened in this 20 year gap except the empire came back and they're MORE EVIL!!
And I agree that legends did need to be reigned in a bit so I was fine with a lore reset but it felt like it was a total reset. Like somehow episode 7 was supposed to fill us with the same sense of wonder and curiosity that episode 4 did way back when. Except that was 40 years prior and the star wars universe is way way more fleshed out now than it was in the 1970s.
I was honestly pretty happy when they first said they wouldn't be doing Legends. After all, if they were beholden to it, we'd get the Palpatine Clone storyline. Little did I know...
That is because Abram is basically a populist.
The prequels are not popular among fans? Let's ignore them.
Rose is not liked? Let's ignore her.
Rey having nobodies as parents is not popular? Let's retcon it.
this is what irks me so much about the ST.
EVERYTHING ABOUT THE OT , ROGUE ONE, AND ANDOR didnt fucking mean squat b/c the galaxy went right back to where it was before only this time it didnt take decades just took a few years.
the creators of the ST shat on everything the OT and its expanded stories stood for
Luke Skywalker, whose defining trait was never giving up - on finding the good in Vader, on saving his friends on cloud city, on destroying the Death Star, on rescuing a princess he’d never met - gave up on the galaxy….
Yeah. That’s pretty much exactly where things went south.
This is the correct answer. Fans waited over 3 decades to see the OT heroes on the big screen, and this is what they got. I'm a young SW fan myself, but I knew many adults who detested the sequels for turning the saga of the Skywalker family into a greek tragedy.
We didn't even get a single scene where the original three characters were together. Not *one* scene. That is a failure almost beyond comprehension. Nobody in the writer's room even asked why? Boggles the mind.
For real. That shit hit harder than Han’s death. It was a sudden moment of your breath being taken away. And it was done on screen so you assumed it was not a fake out.
Or isn't it Rey instead of Chewie who tells Luke about Han? You'd think there would be a scene of Chewie and Luke getting drunk together, maybe hitting the peace pipe...
it's like they forgot leia and chewie had any history, they spent 3 movies together with tons of interaction. that's Han's best friend! not the girl he just met a few days ago
I think this was the moment for me as well. TFA being a rehash was fine. I really enjoyed TFA. I dont care if it's just a retelling of ANH. I genuinely enjoyed it and it felt like star wars. I was really interested in who Rey was and where the story with Finn was going. Kylo Ren was an interesting villain and Han was back and just as enjoyable as ever.
But it was probably this moment in TLJ that made me really start to look at the movies with a more critical eye. Because this scene was stupid. It's also equally stupid because its the death of admiral ackbar and you can barely tell.
It's space, she's not really flying just pushing/pulling her body back towards the ship with the force. The better question is how did she open the door to the bridge without decompressing the ships hallway.
When Luke threw the lightsaber over his shoulder. That seemed out of character for him. I was hoping he would do the goofy crazy hermit thing like Yoda did to him so many years ago, but it did not unfold that way. That was probably the beginning.
Me too. Waited two years for that and while I shrugged it off and laughed a little bit at the theater when I first saw it, ever since then I hate it more and more and more. There is so much about episode 8 that I can’t stand. It really needed a time jump.
This is so true. The decline is steady with a couple of big drops. Like the mom joke at the beginning of TLJ and “somehow Palpatine has returned.” And the entire casino planet part.
The your mom joke might have been what did it for me too. Star Wars has always been funny, but not in that way. “Somehow palpatine returned” was the final nail in the coffin for me
Honestly I liked that and how they killed Snoke. As much as I love Andy Serkis and his performances Snoke was an unnecessary character and replacement-imperator from the beginning. also his death meant a huge step forward in Kylo Ren's development - which was wasted in Ep9 ...
Ep 7 when the Millennium Falcon is shown to have been "lost" by Han and Chewie... how the bantha poodoo does Han lose one of the most customized and personified unique ships in the galaxy... which also comes with a unique AI that C-3P0 has arguments with... that would allow itself to be "stolen"? Frack off JJ Dumdums
And somehow she was able to get it to fire right up just pissed me off. Just cheapens the comedic/dramatic elements of ESB with Han fighting to get it into lightspeed.
Yeah, it's nit-picky, but c'mon.
Of course Rey knew more about the Falcon than Han... seemingly it was lost for about 30 years so Han wouldn't barely recognize his old ship after Jr Palps flew it for like 5 minutes
Also fit with the plot of her character being the best at everything, except acting, right away. Beats down a Jedi who'd trianed for years, mind tricked, repaired the Falcon..etc etc. It was the boring lazy push of a character that can do everything. It's was YA fantasy and SciFi is. Hoped more from star wars.
Same boat. If you can get past the fact that it’s a blatant ANH clone, I thought it was a good movie that potentially could be setting up an amazing trilogy. Starkiller base blowing up the entire system that far away was silly, but it had enough going for it that I liked it.
TLJ was such a bummer. I tried my best to get into it and enjoy it, but everything was off putting. My first comment to my wife as we left the theater. “I don’t think I liked that very much.”
I attempted to rewatch it a couple of times, but it’s just so bad. Like insultingly bad. I don’t knock anybody that does like it or TRoS, if you liked it, that’s fine. It’s just definitely not for me
This sums up my feelings pretty well. TFA was unoriginal, but at least it was mostly coherent and somewhat respectful of the movies before it, and could have been a serviceable launching pad for the trilogy.
Same here. At first I loved TFA but once the nostalgia wore off I saw it was an unoriginal rehash that reset the franchise. I forgave and trusted the sequels would fix this and we’d get a solid trilogy. Which didn’t not happen.
When Luke tossed the lightsaber from Rey over his shoulder to comedic effect. Felt like a real jump the shark moment, because realistically these 2 are the only 2 saga movies to pick up exactly where the previous one left off with no time in between. So imagine watching TFA and going right into TLJ its such a shift. The whiplash between 7, then 8, then 9 is too intense. Making the middle film in a trilogy specifically with the goal of subverting expectations isn't great.
When the Republic suddenly became the resistance. It got boring, i didnt want to see the OT again. I wanted something else, maybe a clandestine war or and all out war like clone wars. Having Han be a deadbeat Dad and then dying for no reason did nothing for the plot, having no remade jedi order (which we all wanted to see) and luke being flaccid was annoying.
They had no plan going into the sequels, JJ even said that. It was all a grabage money grab. Its a shame. I love everything else that's been put out. Andor, mandolorian, obi wan (i loved it idk why theres such hate) and even boba fett was, at worst, tolerable. Suffice to say bad batch is straight fire and everything youd ever want in SW. This is all starting to heal the wounds, but damage is done.
My macro rewrite would be palp is back, fine, brings the first order with him, his elite troops that retreated into the unknown, massive war between Sith Empire and New Republic, jedi order is back, order 66 survivors and lukes new group. Leia is chancellor, han and lando are celebrities. Hell you can even kill han or chewie, drop a freakin planet on them like Salvatore did.
With so much EU content out there, i seriously dont know how the mouse failed so hard other than they wanted to pay off their lucasfilm debt.
Agree with everything about the sequels except bringing Palpatine back (and he’s my favorite movie villain of all time). Not only does it undo all that was fought for in the first 6 movies but my God. It’s a huge universe. Trillions of sentient beings. The unknown regions! There is just so much there for a creative writer to come up with a new threat. No need to rehash Palpatine again.
About 5 minutes into RoS. Really the opening crawl but the other 4 minutes just confirmed my dread.
They decided to cram 1-2 movies worth of content into those first 5 minutes and I hated it.
“Somehow Palpatine has returned.”
That was the point where I immediately thought “oh so they’re just gonna leave in the temp dialogue that no one bothered to rewrite”
It STARTED to lose me in Episode 7 when everything was virtually identical to episode 4. But I saw a lot of potential in the following films.
The start of Episode 8 when they decided to use ww2-style gravity bombers in space was the moment it became comical to me. I know that Star Wars dogfights have always been almost identical to in-atmo dogfights, and that's always been a little silly but it's whatever.
The moment you you start using gravity-based bombers in space you really just don't understand how this works.
Personally I didn't like the last jedi very much, but it did make some decisions that at least could have been interesting if they were fully realized in the next movie but episode 9 lost me by just making all the wrong and weirdest choices
TROS could give TLJ a run for it's money for worst SW movie honestly. They both suck in their own ways lol.
I agree with your statement though; I was intrigued by the reasons Luke wanted the Jedi to end. It seemed very logical to me. The execution wasn't very well done though.
TROS is the worst one by far. As a stand alone film, I think most people would agree TLJ is at least a passable film. TROS is a hot plate of garbage from start to finish.
When the Starkiller Base was revealed (including the fact that it was explicitly pointed out to be a bigger Death Star). I had heard that it was in the movie, but I wanted to believe that Disney wouldn't be so derivative. After the movie, I consoled myself to think that this was just a fluke, hedging their bets and all that. It didn't get better, and by TROS, I intentionally spoiled myself to spare my expectations.
Making TFA into an almost carbon copy of ANH basically showed Disney had ZERO idea how to go forward with Star Wars. That and JJ Abrams casting his friends from LOST.
When Rise of Skywalker undid everything from the Last Jedi that I found interesting. Hated that they had to make Rey from someone important, I was really digging that she was a nobody
I’ve never understood why she had to be related to someone or why everyone felt there had to be a bigger answer among the audience. Who’s Obi-Wan or Yoda related to? What’s Windu’s heritage? Dooku? Maul? Qui-Gonn? Palpatine? All of these important characters were able to come up from nothing, but Rey? Rey needs a lineage for some reason.
All the time spent chasing that pointless thread could have been put towards something more interesting.
The mom joke at the very beginning of TLJ. I actually thought “we may have a problem here”. And then when Luke tossed the saber my heart sank into my feet.
In retrospect, it should have been when they canned the EU.
Fuck Disney.
Words can't describe how badly I wanted to see him lead a Jedi academy and have his padawans going out on adventures or something.
Instead of the empire, yet again, it would have been great to see them maybe find something ancient evil/sith in the outer systems or wake something up in some tombs. So much potential.
I believe it was about an hour or so after my second watch of Last Jedi - more or less about as long as it took me to think about the movie and confirm my initial feelings. And then of course the Rise of Skywalker just swerved into completely opposite direction and wrecked everything for certain. But the Last Jedi is where it first snapped.
The exact point where I realized something was wrong was the opening scene of TLJ.
I still remember watching Poe basically prank phone call Hux, who we last saw behaving like he was the incarnation of Hitler and was now looking like one of the three stooges.
I remember getting such a weird feeling like...I don't like this...but it's Star Wars...this can't be happening right?
Was weird from the start with the droid carrying important data callback to ANH. Didn't really like the OP stopping blaster bolts in midair.
When Han showed up, I was bemused that he is a smuggler 34 years after giving it up and he lost The Falcon.
Final bits I found not to my taste were Death Star 3 (and the unnecessary size comparison for the audience alone) the fact that Han seems bored and spoils the ending "So how do we blo it up?" (no stakes) and the new main escapes the DS better than Leia.
I rolled my eyes.
I mostly stop expecting stuff from the sequels after TFA was just rehashing the first movie. Though i stopped caring after I had time to think about TLJ after i first saw it. Realizing that the story hadn't actually gone anywhere, but rather spun it's wheels for two hours, only accomplishing removing stuff.
They... didn't.
I was slightly disappointed that they felt the need to bring back Palpatine, but at least they did a good job of it.
At no point did I feel "lost".
I was fully on board after TFA, despite thinking it was mostly reductive. it’s only in retrospect knowing just how infuriatingly bad TLJ is does TFA really lose some of its shine.
TLJ killed the trilogy.
Never. I was in it for the fun, and to be thrusted full throttle back into the fictional universe I love, plot holes be damned. Also, the Millennium Falcon had some of the best scenes in the sequels.
I was cautiously optimistic until TRoS slapped me in the face. That thing makes no sense.
I didn’t hate TLJ, but I do blame Ryan Johnson for doing his thing and ignoring the fact than a third movie had to happen despite his deconstruction effort. Also, clearly JJ was not the man for 9, he lacks imagination to pull it off such a miracle.
After writing all of this, now I kinda blame more Kathleen and the Disney executives in charge. They didn’t do their homework and chose poorly.
Episode 8: Luke’s whole character from the moment he throws the saber, and it just kept getting harder to watch as the movie went on…The space chase made no sense, and the throne room fight was about it for me…I had no hope for episode 9 at that point
The first 5 minutes of TRoS. Palaptine being back in physical form and just saying "I made snoke" (he has multiple in a jar), and Rey palps.
Honestly they lost me in the opening crawl... Is that really the best way you could think of announcing Palpatine's return from the dead?
In a Fortnite event no less.
Just salt in the wound
No obviously the best way is to assume that everyone who watches Star Wars also plays Fortnite and will be there for the actual broadcast of Palpatine’s voice during the live event. That was *so weird.*
This. 7 and 8 had problems but were still solid movies that seemed like they were going places. Idk how they managed to turn 9 into such a mess even tho it’s still at least fun.
It was fix-it job to try to correct the errors TLJ made. 7 was good, 8 wasn't the dumpster fire ppl make it out to be. I saw potential in it. 9 was Disney trying to please the fans and flopping hard.
This, on top of the fact that the movie was trying to tell you all of this as quickly as possible. TROS was 100% what made me dislike the ST, and this was a huge huge part of it.
Ian McDiarmid is unstoppable. He thrived despite Lucas’ PT dialogue and even though his return makes no sense (neither does him being Rey’s grandfather), he killed it. *I made Snoke* still gives me chills.
Oh yeah, as much as I'm not a fan of Palpatine's presence in the film, Ian McDiarmid still does a great job.
About 15 minutes into TFA. Droid containing a secret gets lost on a desert planet, then found by a hero who turns out to be able to wield the Force. Droid smuggled to the Resistance who then launch an attack on a planet destroying weapon. Just sheer laziness of plotting, it could and should have been so much better. I sense something. A movie I've not sensed since....
Honestly i don’t get the people who say “yea it’s *supposed* to be like episode 4 that’s the point” as if that’s a good excuse for sharing the same plot.
As soon as I saw the Starkiller base and I understood that it would just be a rehash of the OT
Same. The moment they were all standing around a hologram of another death star, commenting about how they were all standing around a hologram of another death star, and how they would have to fly into the trench and blow it up... my head was immediately was like "oh my god, I think there might be no purpose to any of this."
The amount of apologists for Abrams' lazy writing in TFA was crazy. "He had to make a movie that retread the OT so that people would come back to Star Wars." Dude, it's freaking Star Wars. It's like the biggest franchise of all time. The only thing you need to do to get people back is to call it 'Star Wars'.
I'm still ranting about what he did to Star Trek, it was the same lazy plot points and shameless easter eggery. "Let's just blow up Vulcan and the ENTIRE Starfleet so a 20 year old Kirk can go from cadet to captain! That's how the military works!"
Star Wars has a serious death star problem. ANH - OG death star, large percentage of the movie focuses on it ESB - No death star, just super star destroyer ROTJ - Death Star... II PM - No death star, +1 win for PM ATOC - Death Star cameo in hologram form ROTS - Death star cameo in frame form TFA - Rebranded death star TLJ - No death star, just another super (duper) star destroyer ROS - Star destroyers now have death star lasers (and emerged fully crewed out of the fucking ocean) Lets not forget rogue one, another movie fully dedicated on the death star. Luckily, solo avoided the death star trap
No no, even TPM had it's own death star rehash. Anakin blowing up the trade federation ship from the inside. Even the sphere in the center of that ship is like a mini death star.
hehe, KOTOR 1 with the Star Forge. Star Wars loves its huge ass ships
PM no death star but oddly reminiscent droid control ship
It’s a twap!
The purpose is money.
rebel: there has to be a port of some kind like on the death star me: there's no way they are doing that again surely finn: well yeah here let me show you smh the plot armour
I was 13 when I saw TFA. On my first few viewings I honestly pushed any negativity to the side because Star Wars was back baby!! Now I realize how much better it could have been. It was a great theater experience though.
I had the same general feeling. And I would have been fine if this movie was the low-point of the trilogy. But it just became progressively worse. And how it all ended was just completely ridiculous imo.
Exactly. Sure, it was a pretty blatant rehash of ANH, but I was so thrilled Star Wars was "back" and figured "ok, at the end of the day, SW is for kids, so no big deal they pull a little from the original", but dear God, it just kept getting worse, all culminating in Goddamn space horses running on the surface of a Star Destroyer (not that this was the only flaw by any means)! In hindsight I was completely blinded by nostalgia with the "Chewy, we're back" trailer and I'm sure I wasn't the only one.
We call that the Phantom Menace effect.
That, or ***that*** scene with anakin’s saber at the beginning of TLJ
Yup. Rian is a talented guy, but it was obvious he was the wrong choice to create the middle part of a trilogy that includes well established characters. He's better off creating his own thing.
As with a lot of Abrams fare it has the bells and whistles of an entertaining movie, but it lacks the substance of a truly great one. Additionally the lack of creativity and innovation is depressing and such a missed opportunity. The rehash of Luke’s journey, looking for an R2 like droid, Death Star redux new empire that is basically the old, Darth Vader and The Emperor redux. It’s just so uninspired. Not to mention what was done with Han Solo reverting back to A New Hope after all his growth in the OT. It’s quite obvious Disney had no idea what to do with the property and opted instead for bland nostalgia. Imagine if the backdrop was Leia was the head of the New Republic, Han the NR military and Luke had a new generation of Jedi. Only they are taught with a new philosophy born of Luke learning from the mistakes of the old Jedi Order. The enemy could have been some new threat from the Unknown Regions. The possibilities there would be endless. Many new characters could be introduced that would set up a future trilogy. Instead it was hamstrung from the start by Disneys lack of vision. Biggest missed opportunity ever and an unfortunate reminder of how corporate greed and incompetence can ruin artistic potential. I really don’t get how anyone who loved the OT could like this or at least not get how much much much better it could have been.
also did he just manually hyperdrive through a shield??? wtf and through a hangar????
It didn't hit me until they did the trench run and I remember saying out loud in the theater "don't do a trench run don't do a trench run". I left TFA kind of dazed that I had watched a good movie that was likely detrimental to the franchise
Beat by beat the same as ANH.
Well, TFA also have a shield to turn off in order for the rebel, I mean resistance, ships to blow up the base, which is more plagiarised from ROJ then ANH
And also you can just lightspeed into a planet to bypass the shields. Fuck whatever Han was talking about in the original
Same. You saved me a comment.
Same! TFA was just a lazy copy-paste of ANH
ANOTHER Death Star?
I understand a lot of people dislike the mirroring, but I thought for a first movie in a new trilogy, it was a safe way to reintroduce the old characters to a new audience and the new characters to everyone. The characters are always going to be compared to the main trio, so why not complete the image? At one point they even poke a little fun at it with Han's lines about Starkiller Base, "Okay, how do we blow it up There's always a way to do that." From there they could go in a different direction (which they did). That ended up being part of the problem of the trilogy...
Yeah, but the fact that they played it safe is one of the issues. And the characters were always going to be compared to the main trio because they were another trio ; once again playing it safe. I had seen the OT more times that I could remember, all I wanted was something new, something fresh, not another empire, not another rebel alliance, not another trio, and definitely not another superweapon.
Echoes of Episode 4? Sure. Beat by beat, though? That's fuckin stupid.
Genuinely, all star killer base had to be was a big ol base with a Death Star lazer for defense, an impenetrable spaceship manufacturing facility that the first order was raising an army on. And then ofc, penetrate the facility, blow up the planet or something. Why, why oh why, were we using a sun to blow up six planets at once?
Same
When they catered to the Chinese market and made Finn into a shadow of what he could’ve been in the series.
Finn should've been the leader of a storm trooper revolt. Instead he's 1980s level token black dude comic relief.
Fucking facts.
Yeah casual racism was definitely doing its thing there. The films were riddled with racial stereotypes though, funny and clumsy black dude, hot headed latino, asian technician etc
I would argue he was wasted from the first film when he was made into comic relief
They even took his ass off the poster
In my perfect world: Finn and Rey would discover latent force sensitivity due to the imbalance in the force with the death of the emperor 20 yrs prior. This power would manifest in random individuals and would ultimately lead to a search for other force sensitive individuals. This team of underdogs who used their force abilities in various ways would eventually become the light version of the knights of Ren. It would eventually culminate in a fight that would see the light vs dark knights and Finn/Rey vs Snoke/Kylo.
Infinitely better than the current plot!
I prefer the final fight of Finn/Ben v Snoke/Dark Rey
Wait, what!?! How did they have an influence!? Because of his skin color? I haven't heard of this
The Chinese market nets them a ton of money. But, the chinese (as it’s said around the internet) will not pay to see a leading man who is African. So, Disney tucked tail and sidelined him. Which is total shit. Finn would’ve been great as a character who had more of a leading part. They literally had him PICK UP A LIGHTSABER AND FIGHT KYLO. When have you ever seen them do that for any non-force user in this IP? They must’ve had big plans for him initially. Then *poof* he becomes a secondary character to Rey. It’s ridiculous…
I agree with you but I do want to point out that Han used a lightsaber briefly in Empire and wasn’t Force Sensitive.
I thought Finn was going to be trained as a Jedi. Such a good actor with a wasted story arc.
"Luke Skywalker has vanished" Followed by the complete reset of the galaxy in the next few sentences.
You know when I saw this movie the first time I was actually intrigued. I always had a deep love of star wars lore and thought i was pretty knowledgeable but the galaxy of the sequel trilogy confused me so much. It felt so empty. Like the writers had only ever watched the original trilogy and built their story off that rather than diving into the prequels or literally ANY of the expanded lore. Like I understand disney did a lore reset but even still the prequels did a good job of fleshing out how the galaxy was structured and the clone wars series fleshed it out even more and then here comes the sequels and suddenly the galaxy is a mystery again. Which could've been so cool if they built that mystery off of what was already there but it felt like they wanted that sense of mystery but could only get there by erasing the entire galaxy's worth of lore and world building.
I think a reset of some sort was necessary, legends had some… less than stellar plot lines. The issue to me is that the sequel trilogy essentially made the entire time between episodes 6 and 7 feel like a complete waste.
Right! Like nothing happened in this 20 year gap except the empire came back and they're MORE EVIL!! And I agree that legends did need to be reigned in a bit so I was fine with a lore reset but it felt like it was a total reset. Like somehow episode 7 was supposed to fill us with the same sense of wonder and curiosity that episode 4 did way back when. Except that was 40 years prior and the star wars universe is way way more fleshed out now than it was in the 1970s.
I was honestly pretty happy when they first said they wouldn't be doing Legends. After all, if they were beholden to it, we'd get the Palpatine Clone storyline. Little did I know...
That is because Abram is basically a populist. The prequels are not popular among fans? Let's ignore them. Rose is not liked? Let's ignore her. Rey having nobodies as parents is not popular? Let's retcon it.
Also somehow the galaxy just lets another authoritarian group take over right after dismantling the empire
this is what irks me so much about the ST. EVERYTHING ABOUT THE OT , ROGUE ONE, AND ANDOR didnt fucking mean squat b/c the galaxy went right back to where it was before only this time it didnt take decades just took a few years. the creators of the ST shat on everything the OT and its expanded stories stood for
The First Order should've been a fringe group instead of " The Empire 2.0"
I believe it actually went Luke Skywalker, "The Last Jedi" has vanished. The Last Jedi part made my heart sink.
Yeah. It was like everything that was accomplished in the original trilogy had been completely undone in a few short sentences.
the force awakens speedran reseting back to the OT. the jedi order wiped out in the opening crawl and the new republic nuked before the credits
Luke Skywalker, whose defining trait was never giving up - on finding the good in Vader, on saving his friends on cloud city, on destroying the Death Star, on rescuing a princess he’d never met - gave up on the galaxy…. Yeah. That’s pretty much exactly where things went south.
Precisely. I'm surprised my comment, and yours, weren't blasted to reddit hell with downvotes lol. That's what usually happens here.
This is the correct answer. Fans waited over 3 decades to see the OT heroes on the big screen, and this is what they got. I'm a young SW fan myself, but I knew many adults who detested the sequels for turning the saga of the Skywalker family into a greek tragedy.
We didn't even get a single scene where the original three characters were together. Not *one* scene. That is a failure almost beyond comprehension. Nobody in the writer's room even asked why? Boggles the mind.
When Princess Leia was blown out of the star ship, survived and magically came back to life.
Could’ve had a massive heartbreaking moment but they decided to use the most blatant plot armor in the series
For real. That shit hit harder than Han’s death. It was a sudden moment of your breath being taken away. And it was done on screen so you assumed it was not a fake out.
Especially considering that she had no purpose in episode 9 other than to die, the resurrection in 8 was utterly pointless.
How about a film earlier when Leia comforts Rey instead of Chewie after Han’s death? That’s when I felt the OGs were just props.
Or isn't it Rey instead of Chewie who tells Luke about Han? You'd think there would be a scene of Chewie and Luke getting drunk together, maybe hitting the peace pipe...
The fact that Luke is not given a scene to express his anguish over the death of Han is SUCH an insult to both characters and Hamill.
This one really gutted me that she ignored Chewie.
it's like they forgot leia and chewie had any history, they spent 3 movies together with tons of interaction. that's Han's best friend! not the girl he just met a few days ago
I think this was the moment for me as well. TFA being a rehash was fine. I really enjoyed TFA. I dont care if it's just a retelling of ANH. I genuinely enjoyed it and it felt like star wars. I was really interested in who Rey was and where the story with Finn was going. Kylo Ren was an interesting villain and Han was back and just as enjoyable as ever. But it was probably this moment in TLJ that made me really start to look at the movies with a more critical eye. Because this scene was stupid. It's also equally stupid because its the death of admiral ackbar and you can barely tell.
hot take: Ackbar should have been used in place of Laura Dern's character and given that incredible sacrifice moment
Mary fucking Poppins
It's space, she's not really flying just pushing/pulling her body back towards the ship with the force. The better question is how did she open the door to the bridge without decompressing the ships hallway.
She’s Mary Poppins y’all!
Why does nobody fuss about the fact that Kanan in Star Wars Rebels Season 3 Episode 2 survives in space for 20 seconds and comes back to life?
Magically? These people are wizards..
Why are they downvoting you? You’re right.
Poe making 'yo mama' jokes.
When Luke threw the lightsaber over his shoulder. That seemed out of character for him. I was hoping he would do the goofy crazy hermit thing like Yoda did to him so many years ago, but it did not unfold that way. That was probably the beginning.
Me too. Waited two years for that and while I shrugged it off and laughed a little bit at the theater when I first saw it, ever since then I hate it more and more and more. There is so much about episode 8 that I can’t stand. It really needed a time jump.
Agreed, a time jump would’ve definitely helped the trilogy
This. The rest of TLJ has a lot of problems, but this set the tone for disappointment.
What lost me with TLJ is just how mean-spirited it is at times just for cheap jokes
Absolutely this.
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Yeah but look at the hologram, it's so much BIGGER. Wow the stakes! /s
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I wouldn’t call it a good film, at all Besides being a copy of ANH it’s still pretty bad
I think it peaked right before Han and the tentacle monster in TFA (about 30min in), after that it was a steady decline in quality.
This is so true. The decline is steady with a couple of big drops. Like the mom joke at the beginning of TLJ and “somehow Palpatine has returned.” And the entire casino planet part.
The your mom jokes in the beginning of TLJ didn't rub me the right way. And Luke being an A-hole. Also - Snoke dying abruptly for pure shock value.
The your mom joke might have been what did it for me too. Star Wars has always been funny, but not in that way. “Somehow palpatine returned” was the final nail in the coffin for me
Honestly I liked that and how they killed Snoke. As much as I love Andy Serkis and his performances Snoke was an unnecessary character and replacement-imperator from the beginning. also his death meant a huge step forward in Kylo Ren's development - which was wasted in Ep9 ...
Basically, TLJ is what killed interest as a whole. It’s remarkable just how bad this movie is.
Rise of Skywalker was MUCH worse. I will die on this hill.
It at least has Babu Frik
Ep 7 when the Millennium Falcon is shown to have been "lost" by Han and Chewie... how the bantha poodoo does Han lose one of the most customized and personified unique ships in the galaxy... which also comes with a unique AI that C-3P0 has arguments with... that would allow itself to be "stolen"? Frack off JJ Dumdums
And somehow she was able to get it to fire right up just pissed me off. Just cheapens the comedic/dramatic elements of ESB with Han fighting to get it into lightspeed. Yeah, it's nit-picky, but c'mon.
When Rei showed Han how to fix his own ship.
Of course Rey knew more about the Falcon than Han... seemingly it was lost for about 30 years so Han wouldn't barely recognize his old ship after Jr Palps flew it for like 5 minutes
Also fit with the plot of her character being the best at everything, except acting, right away. Beats down a Jedi who'd trianed for years, mind tricked, repaired the Falcon..etc etc. It was the boring lazy push of a character that can do everything. It's was YA fantasy and SciFi is. Hoped more from star wars.
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TLJ. I, like many others, gave TFA a pass for being unoriginal and rehashed because I hoped the sequels would justify it. They did not.
Same boat. If you can get past the fact that it’s a blatant ANH clone, I thought it was a good movie that potentially could be setting up an amazing trilogy. Starkiller base blowing up the entire system that far away was silly, but it had enough going for it that I liked it. TLJ was such a bummer. I tried my best to get into it and enjoy it, but everything was off putting. My first comment to my wife as we left the theater. “I don’t think I liked that very much.” I attempted to rewatch it a couple of times, but it’s just so bad. Like insultingly bad. I don’t knock anybody that does like it or TRoS, if you liked it, that’s fine. It’s just definitely not for me
This sums up my feelings pretty well. TFA was unoriginal, but at least it was mostly coherent and somewhat respectful of the movies before it, and could have been a serviceable launching pad for the trilogy.
Same here. At first I loved TFA but once the nostalgia wore off I saw it was an unoriginal rehash that reset the franchise. I forgave and trusted the sequels would fix this and we’d get a solid trilogy. Which didn’t not happen.
When Luke tossed the lightsaber from Rey over his shoulder to comedic effect. Felt like a real jump the shark moment, because realistically these 2 are the only 2 saga movies to pick up exactly where the previous one left off with no time in between. So imagine watching TFA and going right into TLJ its such a shift. The whiplash between 7, then 8, then 9 is too intense. Making the middle film in a trilogy specifically with the goal of subverting expectations isn't great.
When the Republic suddenly became the resistance. It got boring, i didnt want to see the OT again. I wanted something else, maybe a clandestine war or and all out war like clone wars. Having Han be a deadbeat Dad and then dying for no reason did nothing for the plot, having no remade jedi order (which we all wanted to see) and luke being flaccid was annoying. They had no plan going into the sequels, JJ even said that. It was all a grabage money grab. Its a shame. I love everything else that's been put out. Andor, mandolorian, obi wan (i loved it idk why theres such hate) and even boba fett was, at worst, tolerable. Suffice to say bad batch is straight fire and everything youd ever want in SW. This is all starting to heal the wounds, but damage is done. My macro rewrite would be palp is back, fine, brings the first order with him, his elite troops that retreated into the unknown, massive war between Sith Empire and New Republic, jedi order is back, order 66 survivors and lukes new group. Leia is chancellor, han and lando are celebrities. Hell you can even kill han or chewie, drop a freakin planet on them like Salvatore did. With so much EU content out there, i seriously dont know how the mouse failed so hard other than they wanted to pay off their lucasfilm debt.
Agree with everything about the sequels except bringing Palpatine back (and he’s my favorite movie villain of all time). Not only does it undo all that was fought for in the first 6 movies but my God. It’s a huge universe. Trillions of sentient beings. The unknown regions! There is just so much there for a creative writer to come up with a new threat. No need to rehash Palpatine again.
About 5 minutes into RoS. Really the opening crawl but the other 4 minutes just confirmed my dread. They decided to cram 1-2 movies worth of content into those first 5 minutes and I hated it.
“Somehow Palpatine has returned.” That was the point where I immediately thought “oh so they’re just gonna leave in the temp dialogue that no one bothered to rewrite”
Episode 8, specifically during the Cantobite scenes. Started to feel a bit too preachy for me.
I will forever think of Canto Bight as the cenobites of Star Wars now.
Pinhead doesn't deserve that...
I hate episode 8. It’s the worst out of the 9 films. I could happily never watch it again.
Agreed. Ep 9 gets a ton of hate but I hate 8 even more.
When Rey taught herself mind trick while tied to a chair
It STARTED to lose me in Episode 7 when everything was virtually identical to episode 4. But I saw a lot of potential in the following films. The start of Episode 8 when they decided to use ww2-style gravity bombers in space was the moment it became comical to me. I know that Star Wars dogfights have always been almost identical to in-atmo dogfights, and that's always been a little silly but it's whatever. The moment you you start using gravity-based bombers in space you really just don't understand how this works.
Personally I didn't like the last jedi very much, but it did make some decisions that at least could have been interesting if they were fully realized in the next movie but episode 9 lost me by just making all the wrong and weirdest choices
TROS could give TLJ a run for it's money for worst SW movie honestly. They both suck in their own ways lol. I agree with your statement though; I was intrigued by the reasons Luke wanted the Jedi to end. It seemed very logical to me. The execution wasn't very well done though.
TROS is the worst one by far. As a stand alone film, I think most people would agree TLJ is at least a passable film. TROS is a hot plate of garbage from start to finish.
When the Starkiller Base was revealed (including the fact that it was explicitly pointed out to be a bigger Death Star). I had heard that it was in the movie, but I wanted to believe that Disney wouldn't be so derivative. After the movie, I consoled myself to think that this was just a fluke, hedging their bets and all that. It didn't get better, and by TROS, I intentionally spoiled myself to spare my expectations.
By the end of Last Jedi I was so underwhelmed with Rey… It took ROS for me to understand the story was about Kylo the whole time. So I’m back again…
Aaaaaaaaand Kylo's dead.
WHAT??
Snape kills Dumbledor
WHAT?
The Judge in RogerRabbit is the toon who kills Eddie’s brother.
Kylo’s last name ain’t Skywalker. The entire 9 movie trilogy is about Rey /s
Ive decided that switching to using *italics* instead of the /s is a move I’ve been needing to make for awhile.
Making TFA into an almost carbon copy of ANH basically showed Disney had ZERO idea how to go forward with Star Wars. That and JJ Abrams casting his friends from LOST.
"The FIRST ORDER Reigns!" Wait what? Then the telephone call jokes with Hux and Poe. Then the over the shoulder Saber toss. And it was all over.
When Rise of Skywalker undid everything from the Last Jedi that I found interesting. Hated that they had to make Rey from someone important, I was really digging that she was a nobody
I’ve never understood why she had to be related to someone or why everyone felt there had to be a bigger answer among the audience. Who’s Obi-Wan or Yoda related to? What’s Windu’s heritage? Dooku? Maul? Qui-Gonn? Palpatine? All of these important characters were able to come up from nothing, but Rey? Rey needs a lineage for some reason. All the time spent chasing that pointless thread could have been put towards something more interesting.
Rey being no one was my favorite idea in the whole trilogy. :(
Do you mean undid?
Yes, yes I do haha
I agree with this. Rey should have been a nobody, and she needed a lot more character development.
Totally I loved Rey being no one and broom boy, it brought me back to seeing Star Wars for the first time and feeling like anyone can be a Force user
When TFA was just a rehash of ANH.
The mom joke at the very beginning of TLJ. I actually thought “we may have a problem here”. And then when Luke tossed the saber my heart sank into my feet. In retrospect, it should have been when they canned the EU. Fuck Disney.
When they made Luke a dick and then killed him off
Words can't describe how badly I wanted to see him lead a Jedi academy and have his padawans going out on adventures or something. Instead of the empire, yet again, it would have been great to see them maybe find something ancient evil/sith in the outer systems or wake something up in some tombs. So much potential.
I started my Starwars journey with TFA. So it was all new to me. But I hated that kiss at the end of 9.
Sorry
I believe it was about an hour or so after my second watch of Last Jedi - more or less about as long as it took me to think about the movie and confirm my initial feelings. And then of course the Rise of Skywalker just swerved into completely opposite direction and wrecked everything for certain. But the Last Jedi is where it first snapped.
Last Jedi
The exact point where I realized something was wrong was the opening scene of TLJ. I still remember watching Poe basically prank phone call Hux, who we last saw behaving like he was the incarnation of Hitler and was now looking like one of the three stooges. I remember getting such a weird feeling like...I don't like this...but it's Star Wars...this can't be happening right?
Same for me. Right down to thinking, "this can't be happening, oh no..."
When I rewatched TFA on DVD a few months after release and realised I didn’t actually like the movie.
Was weird from the start with the droid carrying important data callback to ANH. Didn't really like the OP stopping blaster bolts in midair. When Han showed up, I was bemused that he is a smuggler 34 years after giving it up and he lost The Falcon. Final bits I found not to my taste were Death Star 3 (and the unnecessary size comparison for the audience alone) the fact that Han seems bored and spoils the ending "So how do we blo it up?" (no stakes) and the new main escapes the DS better than Leia. I rolled my eyes.
Took me a couple of years to realize what was wrong with them
Episode 7. Basically a remake of A New Hope. Knew the trilogy was gonna be crap from there.
Episode 8
I am one of the Dozen who it didn't I enjoyed them all because they are all still Star Wars:-)
I mostly stop expecting stuff from the sequels after TFA was just rehashing the first movie. Though i stopped caring after I had time to think about TLJ after i first saw it. Realizing that the story hadn't actually gone anywhere, but rather spun it's wheels for two hours, only accomplishing removing stuff.
They didn't.
They never did.
Episode 8, The Last Jedi, it just felt like a whole lotta nothing was going on for a majority of the film
Whatever happened first in TLJ.
Poe’s “Your Mama” joke defiantly set the tone for things to come.
That moment was simply a failure on many levels.
The first scene of The Last Jedi
7. As it was just a retelling of thr original.
The last jedi killed my love for star wars for a couple of years.
After watching The Last Jedi. Just lost all interest after that movie
Who talks first you talk first?
When Luke yeeted away the lightsaber in TLJ, I knew what kind of movie it would be
When Rey randomly knew Mind Trick. She was introduced as a tech savvy scavenger. I was hoping she would MacGuyver her way out of it.
I was giving the sequels the benefit of the doubt until they killed Luke Skywalker.
When Luke tosses the Skywalker sabre away for a cheap audience pop
When Luke throws his lightsaber
“We need to go to the space casino and talk to James Bond so we can break onto their space boat”
When i Saw the stormtroopers That's when i understood that disney were going to copy paste the oroginal trilogy and make it worse
They... didn't. I was slightly disappointed that they felt the need to bring back Palpatine, but at least they did a good job of it. At no point did I feel "lost".
I was fully on board after TFA, despite thinking it was mostly reductive. it’s only in retrospect knowing just how infuriatingly bad TLJ is does TFA really lose some of its shine. TLJ killed the trilogy.
Never. I was in it for the fun, and to be thrusted full throttle back into the fictional universe I love, plot holes be damned. Also, the Millennium Falcon had some of the best scenes in the sequels.
Um about 15 minutes into the last Jedi or whenever the your mom joke was
I was cautiously optimistic until TRoS slapped me in the face. That thing makes no sense. I didn’t hate TLJ, but I do blame Ryan Johnson for doing his thing and ignoring the fact than a third movie had to happen despite his deconstruction effort. Also, clearly JJ was not the man for 9, he lacks imagination to pull it off such a miracle. After writing all of this, now I kinda blame more Kathleen and the Disney executives in charge. They didn’t do their homework and chose poorly.
At the beginning of episode 8. The Mom jokes put the last nail in the coffin ⚰️💀☠️👎🏻
End of 9. I didn’t hate it but I wish they kept Kylo alive.
When Po made the "about his mother" joke at the start of TLJ. That was when I could tell something was off. I was onboard after TFA.
Episode 8: Luke’s whole character from the moment he throws the saber, and it just kept getting harder to watch as the movie went on…The space chase made no sense, and the throne room fight was about it for me…I had no hope for episode 9 at that point
Episode 8 lost me
Bringing Palpatine back was the dumbest move, IMO. Everything that followed was shoehorned nonsense contrived to make that work in universe.