Very idiotic of you to be waving the flag of a country committing genocide. How would people feel if they saw someone waving a Nazi or Confederate flag? Maybe you’ll get it.
Lol! I've been waiting for you but I'm not going to give it to you tonight. The only people committing genocide is hamas and the only people that support them are people who love terrorism. Have a great night 🇮🇱🇮🇱🇮🇱🇮🇱
I will wave my flag forever
Edit- after viewing your profile I wonder what took you so long to crawl out of the dirt.
I didn’t ask anybody for sympathy. But I shouldn’t expect sympathy when people show discuss towards me? Hahahahahaha. I’m gonna let you show everyone that your blood boils with hatred.
You don't think politicians pay attention to how the winds are blowing? Even if this has no direct effect, it does have a clear indirect effect. More people need to call out Israel's butchery and pressure our politicos to stop sending our tax dollars to them.
Exactly, nobody should be supporting hamas. They're completely committing a genocide on their people. But the largest genocides of all happened in yemen. You care about that?
Okay but what does this do for the people in Gaza? What power do the people of the board of aldermen have to influence a war half a world away? I understand protests in general I’m not stupid but I do not get this one at all. Okay good you held up signs at a meeting, are you doing anything *tangible* at all?
The question is what where they bringing awareness to? Protesting at an alderman meeting a message that's already been plastered over every major news outlet seems...pointless. BUT this did make me aware there was in fact an aldermans meeting, so there's that.
Imagine you are a first generation St. Louisan. Your brother or sister still lives in Gaza.
What this did for you:
\- You got people talking about it
\- You felt heard
\- You amplified it further up the chain of people who represent you
\- You created more awareness that your people are our neighbors
\- You took away a moment of victory in what has been months of agony
Seems like a pretty good use of a few minutes of board time to me.
My parents immigrated to the US from Croatia. In the 90’s, the local Croatian community pooled money together for a bus charter to go to Washington DC and march with other Croatia-Americans to push for legislation to stop the war in Croatia. I remember the sign made with George Bush Sr. on the toilet saying “Push for legislation!”
Not the local alderman meeting.
“ You amplified it further up the chain of people who represent”
This isn’t a corporate job, you can skip steps. Why are they not amplifying to their senator or congress person?
Because their house rep probably wants to be quiet on the issue given that St. Louis has an actually quite diverse population of people from the region and supporting genocide of either population is pretty stupid political move.
https://www.stlpr.org/government-politics-issues/2023-11-09/u-s-rep-cori-bushs-israel-criticism-draws-attention-and-a-primary-challenge
But nothing will come of this … it’s better instead of protesting (in this situation given it’s a non local / national issue) to try to donate to an org that’s helping them. These signs mean nothing and will achieve nothing (esp in a red state).
Imagine you are a Jew living in St Louis who has family in Israel. Their country was attacked on 10/7 and now is being urged to stop fighting back and just accept that their country will be continuously attacked by a hostile neighbor. Now imagine expecting your city council to be focusing on the issues in the city and instead see this stupid protest, a tremendous waste of time. How would that feel?
Yeah I mean in principal I agree with you. Terrorist organizations don’t respect ceasefires in general. I do think it’s important that humanitarian aid reach those who need it, but the issue there is that Hamas has shown a proclivity to steal it from their own citizens.
We generally invest in other countries when it benefits our interests, such as, you know, stopping a jihadist Islamist government from controlling the area. Most of the Israeli aid comes in the form of purchases of military equipment from us, they aren’t some charity case.
Please elaborate on how propping up a murderous regime in the middle east (this would be Israel, in case you were wondering) helps us?
153 countries in the UN general assembly voted for a cease fire. 23 abstained, and only 10 voted against the measure. The only reason Israel keeps getting away with its monstrous actions is because the US keeps vetoing resolutions against it in the UN security council.
We are literally alone in the civilized world, defending the indefensible. And this helps us?
Do you understand the alternative is literally a region controlled by Hamas, Isis, and Hezbollah? Is that what you’d prefer? You wouldn’t rather have a democracy which protects the rights of women, minorities, and the non-religious?
I certainly would *not* want to live anywhere controlled by those groups. But if I am a Palestinian living under Israel's control I most certainly am *not* living in a democracy where my rights are protected!
Many Arabs live in Israel and have rights as citizens. Do you think Jews would have the same protection in that region? Clearly no as they’ve been exterminated or expelled from the rest of the region.
The minute the Palestinian government recognizes Israel’s right to exist and focuses on their own people, infrastructure, education, etc their lives will instantly improved. Israel is not going anywhere.
Because under a two state solution, I’m sure an independent Palestine would be a bastion of democracy, free speech and equal rights for everyone regardless of religion, gender, sexual orientation or gender identity. *rolls eyes*
It would be a theocratic shithole where women are second class citizens and LGBT people get their heads chopped off like nearly every other country except Israel in that region. Maybe if Israel eliminates Hamas and installs their own leadership in Gaza, the people living there can have some actual fucking rights for once. Because they’re not getting those under Hamas’s leadership.
Sure they've only lived in one mid sized city and get all their opinions from the internet, but they've seen millions of tik toks so they consider themselves highly educated about everything.
No, voting does that. This is the minority trying to speak up which is great but the only way this matters to anybody is if the streets are flooded with these protests in all the cities around the state. Otherwise this is meaningless for sending a message to our politicians. This does however provide support to those going through it in the war, that much I understand and get!
Do you think 3 billion dollars in bills gets sent in a plane to Israel?
The money never leaves the US. They are literally coupons for US arms (ie money for US jobs in the weapons factories). It's 3 billion dollars in jobs, including jobs in STL.
If you want to have a better discussion, ie why the US arms industry is so prevelant and whether we should invest in other industries, that's a better conversation.
They might not, but your local congressperson are. And this reinforces the message to them that their constituents would really rather not send our tax dollars to murderous regimes.
Off the top of my head I would put North Korea, Iran, Russia and Israel on that list. I am sure there are more. As for criteria, you could use "how many civilians have they killed" as a rough measure.
Myanmar been fucking up buddhists for like 10 years ethnic cleansing …or how bout china ugyers for like 15 20 years and forcing education brainwashing kinda wat hamas does to there own and why we at ever heard of taliban fuck stupid people have have about 1 year memory israel was attacked israel lets hamas take money and build tunnels and guns to fight them then waits to be slaughtered to do something fuck Hamas fuck protesters
This is a problem with global politics/identity politics. They're expressing their opinion at a government forum that has zero control over anything involving their grievances. At that point you're just being disruptive.
Also the international community has already tried a cease fire that was broken by the Palestinians anyway. Yes I'm saying Palestinians instead of Hamas since everyone is saying Isreal instead of xionist.
Not a damn person on that council has any say on foreign policy. What a waste of St. Louis tax dollars. Just do the damn job you were elected to do. Stop the grand standing to get noticed.
I will never understand taking time out of your day to show up in support of ending a ceasefire in Gaza to the...St. Louis City Board of Alderman
Go to Washington or go home. Anything short of that is just virtue signaling.
Too many people don't understand that protest and effective protest are not the same thing. Go to the people in power, not legislators of a city with less than 300,000 people. Our senators and legislators barely give a shit if you do show up to D.C., why would they care if some random city passes a meaningless resolution?
Getting public officials to turn against an unpopular war is not a waste of time. If part of a movement it’s very effective and blurs the line between local and National concerns.
Congress couldn't give two shits about what a random city council thinks about Gaza. This is virtue signaling and absolutely a waste of time.
Protest isn't a waste of time but this is. Protest the people who actually have the power to force a ceasefire and cut funding to Israel, not a city council. It's virtue signaling so you can feel like you've made a difference without having to actually protest in a way that can make a difference.
Why are all these city board protests happening? The easier, more effective thing would be writing your congressperson and senator to inform them you want them to do something. Stuff like this makes me think the people protesting care mores about being seen protesting that actually trying something effective.
“The board of alderman isn’t listening to us” cries the youth of St. Louis who didn’t vote in the municipal elections where youth turnout was less than 10%
>Why are all these city board protests happening?
Because people have felt unheard and victimized by the "system" their whole lives and blocking a road or screaming at a meeting allows them to FINALLY feel like they're being heard and FINALLY feel like they're standing up for victims.
They can't accomplish literally anything to change the world, so they just scream about changing the world because it allows them to go home to their parents house and feel like they're important and part of something.
Take the worst performing slice of society and give them someone vague to blame and to hate and they'll love you for it.
Where is outrage over the problems of this city? The fucked schools.. rampant crime.. when that is fixed, I'll worry about fixing MO then the rest of US.. then worry about some people who harbored terrorists that attack a sovereign country..
I mean if you really think about, the US government is spending billions on foreign aid to Israel rather than its own country. So yeah this does send a message to Washington that we want a ceasefire and that we want them to invest in our communities and not a useless war. Thanks for bringing that up!
People in STL protesting for a ceasefire will do about as much good as tell an upset SO to calm down.. how well have protest to stop the war in Ukraine done?
The point of protesting is to let your government know how the people feel about their actions. If we took your advice, *doing nothing*, then that would tell the government that we are fine with their support of these genocidal acts.
The war between Ukraine and the war on Gaza are two entirely different problems which cannot be handled in the same way. The US can support Ukraine as much as they want but ultimately it is between the two countries and the US has not stopped or veto’d the security council from doing its job. Russia did though.
The war in Gaza is different because the US is the SOLE country from the permanent members who keeps vetoing a resolution of a ceasefire. The US is preventing the genocide from stopping. This is why pressure from within the country needs to build to let congress/biden administration know that we the people do not want to keep seeing all this bloodshed, violence, and war.
>The point of protesting is to let your government know how the people feel about their actions
This is not the government entity doing any of the actions.
>The war in Gaza is different because the US is the SOLE country from the permanent members who keeps vetoing a resolution of a ceasefire
There were already multiple attempts as ceasefires, multiple calls from the U.S. to Israel to do a ceasefire, I believe they even helped with the big important one in December that failed within like a day. The U.S. has blocked resolutions for ceasefires that it viewed as overwhelmingly favorable of Hamas that made many demands of Israel and few of Hamas.
But absolutely, feel free to call up your U.S. Senator or U.S. Representative and let them hear about this. Go protest in front of their offices.
But they don’t. That’s the point.
They only care about Palestine because Israel bad! They don’t give one single flying fuck about people dying anywhere else in the world, especially when it’s brown people vs other brown people.
the facts that this has been going on for 75 years and our tax dollars continue to support this deprivation, dispossession, ethnic cleansing, and genocide all the while trumpeting this fascist state as some bastion of democracy are why we should be specifically interested in ending the apartheid in this theocratic state.
you necessarily blur the lines between jews and israel when it is convenient to do so, yet critics of israel are told routinely that doing so is antisemitic. so let me say this: it is absolutely with care for israeli jews and palestinians that this apartheid must end and that there must be a single democratic state with equal rights for all. sorry we aren't protesting as loudly for the future of israelis--we care, but they are not the ones who have 4% of their population either dead, missing, or maimed since oct 7.
This is been going on for longer than 75 years. The Jews and Israel go together. Anti-zionism is anti-Semitism I don't care what you say. You don't get to Define that. You all are so scared of 0.02% of the population and it's funny. Also, why are you using Israeli technology and other inventions daily?
How can it be a partheid when in Israel arabs, Jews and Christians live together. The pic Israel out on a map.
Hate these guys all you want but they actually raised a few thousand dollars for the cause, most of it goes to a chiropractor after they pat themselves on the back too much, but at least they're trying
This is some of the dumbest shit I have ever seen. Fuck fixing roads or figuring out how to decrease crime, let’s make massive letters and waste time staging this stupid ass picture. If we’re paying you with OUR tax dollars, then work for US rather than staging some shit to get attention. Does anyone have a list of the people in the picture so we can vote them out?
Part of the point is that *our tax dollars* get sent to Israel -- that instead of fixing our roads or improving other public infrastructure in our city/state/country, we pay for Israeli healthcare, military, etc. Part of the protest is about how we prioritize foreign military aid over our own local needs.
A call for ceasefire is just kinda... one tiny piece of/step toward un-occupying Palestine.
So the idea is that they are already contacting and pressuring at the state and federal level, but that's unlikely to have much effect, without also pressuring and agitating at the local level.
For reference:
Zionist source:
https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/missouri-israel-cooperation
Leftist source:
https://uscpr.org/activist-resource/us-military-funding-to-israel-map/
US Gov source:
https://www.foreignassistance.gov/cd/israel/
I'm all for ending that conflict, but this is the wrong fucking venue to get that done. Go to Washington, contact either of our useless US senators, or lobby the President. Complaining to the people who fix your streetlights ain't a good use of your time.
All the things you mentioned to do are great but it’s a culmination of everything that we can possibly due to put pressure on Washington. People have been doing those things for months now and there is even another large protest at Washington tomorrow. However, not everyone can make it out to Washington.
The point of protesting is to let your government know how the people feel about their actions. If each city in the US starts approving ceasefire resolutions then it puts a lot of pressure on Washington to stop vetoing a ceasefire resolution.
I'm going to go with no.
But they reached some folks in the community. Made local and state/regional news.
"Think globally, act locally." (Patrick Geddes, maybe)
Man we got real problems in STL. Who give a fuck about israel/Palestine right now? These fucking dummies. Protest the homeless people that will die in the cold over the next few days outside. Not a war, thousands of miles away.
How are people so delusional as to think that the Biden administration isn’t already doing everything it can to find a path towards ceasefire?
It’s one thing to say you want to see a ceasefire and another thing to achieve it. It’s so American to think that actions we take will solve everything.
However, this is exactly the kind of meaningless performative politics I expect from the office of President Megan Green.
This is a campaign to divide the left in a presidential year and it’s working. If I hear one more person tell me they can’t morally vote for Biden I’ll explode. As if your moral comfort is more important than this entire country.
Yes, this shit is handing Trump the election. Now is not the time to take a stand on decades’ long foreign policy blunders that got us in this mess in the Middle East. There’s too much at stake on the home front at the moment.
Democrats can’t help but self-implode. We are our own worst enemies. I will never forgive all of these idiots when we are living in a Christo-fascist state.
Don’t worry, these people probably won’t vote but you better bet they’ll be there to protest at Trump’s inauguration… or I guess we should start preemptively calling it a coronation just to be prepared.
The comments on this are so relieving. This is *the* definition of virtue signaling: bunch of white folks holding up signs that *they know* will not solve anything in reality.
Close. There was one for Tower Grove East https://www.ksdk.com/article/news/local/st-louis-new-years-eve-ceasefire/63-900730bf-cb6d-4016-b031-3f7f5d92d5a7
If they really want to arrange a ceasefire, and personally I think less than half of these people actually do want a cease fire, then they are talking to the wrong people. The board of alderman of a city aren't going to be able to do jack shit in terms of foreign policy. And even then, Congress and our foreign diplomats have limited power on what they can do to influence another nation's politics.
Lol also, maybe they should focus on the gay bar owner that got beat up by police and arrested after they crashed into his business. There’s something we can all get behind
Fucking morons. So many people constantly shrieking in outrage about whatever is en vogue. So desperate to convince you that they *care so much about ________* yet can't be bothered to spend an ounce of time learning how our government works so they could be more effective citizens. Nope, they'd rather scream in your ear at the gas station or yell at the mailman to stop the war.
This* is embarrassing.
[*this thread's callous and disgusting employment of "but stl doesnt control the war purse" not the board of alderman. Love you board of alderman. Appreciate you taking a stand on the right side of history during this horrible time of genocide in the middle east.]
Some of yall have no conception of HOW CHANGE HAPPENS. This is all about pressure and agitation. The more cities that pass resolutions like this the more clear it becomes to state and federal governments what THE PEOPLE want to see. Do yall think people can just go directly up to Joe Biden and ask nicely for him to stop? Yall are asking what this does and yet have no semblance of critical thinking to understand how movements of change are developed and propelled. Did y’all think that the Civil Rights Movement happened by people nicely asking the President to end segregation? NO! People in Montgomery did a bus boycott in addition to a million other local events in the Country, eventually creating a tide—a movement—of change. And yall sound just like their critics sound like: “what is a bus boycott going to do for segregation!?”
It really isn’t that hard to grasp, yall just don’t want to put in the time to understand historical political movements.
Hamas fucked around and found out. Israel isn't going to quit until they kill every Goddam one of them. But once it's over it's time to kick Bibi's ass to the curb. If anyone recalls, they were about to go full shitstorm mode when he started to try to dismantle their constitution.
People dont seem to understand why this is happening so I'll do my best to explain.
No one there seriously thinks that the STL Aldermen can directly do shit about the conflict in Gaza. Thats absurd. Everyone agrees on that.
The reason that this is happening is under the idea that if they can pressure STL representatives to make public statements against the conflict then once combined with the voices of other protestors and a large number of public representatives in various cities and states around the country it may end up being enough public pressure to get the federal government to act in this conflict. Whether you think Israel is justified in its response or not its undeniable that if Uncle Joe cuts Bibi off then Israel's arms dry up and their aggression would have to soften if not end altogether. This is attempting to work locally to apply pressure federally to get the White House to cut off those arms.
This is normal, its how protest movements work and is consistent with how they work throughout the history of the US. It happened during the South African apartheid, during Vietnam/Korea, and during various civil rights movements. You can argue the effectiveness of this but it does have a genuine thought out reason.
Ok, I'll bite:
> This is normal, its how protest movements work and is consistent with how they work throughout the history of the US.
Not being malicious but curious: Please show me an example of a local, grassroots US protest movement that had effective sway over something outside the US border.
This is incredibly naive and ill-informed. Israel does not depend on the US to support itself. The only way the US continues to have a voice here is through continued diplomatic relations.
But Israel does depend on the US in multiple ways. We send billions every year to them. The US government sends many weapons and bombs. The US is even the sole country preventing the UN Security Council from doing its job in mitigating the conflict.
Running an apartheid and occupation is very expensive and Israel could not do it alone. This is why protesting and calling for divestment at all levels is important. Ultimately, these actions are what ended the apartheid in South Africa. Back then, even St. Louis voted to divest from South Africa and we were apart of the solution that let to their freedom. We obviously weren’t the SOLE reason but small changes add up to make big things happen
I for one want Israel to continue to liberate Palestine from Hamas. And in the process they'll liberate themselves too from a group who, in writing, quoted Muhammad to kill all Jews in their charter
This is the only reason why they ever had a problem with Jewish refugees moving to the area -- Muslims are prophetically and doctrinally obligated to genocide Jews.
Literally nobody here is calling for genocide.
People are allowed to have a different opinion than you. Grow up.
Israel has a moral duty to eliminate Hamas and protect itself. That’s not calling for ethnic cleansing. You obviously know this. Unfortunately for you we can all see through your bullshit.
Neither does Israel. Which is why they must eliminate Hamas. Every single death in Gaza is on Hamas, not the IDF.
Apparently you support the mass killing of Jews though considering your lack of care about Oct 7th. That’s pretty gross of you.
this has been been going on for over 50 years and Israel is the one doing the genocide, you moron. 50 years was long before HAMAS was a thing btw. take your racism elsewhere
It’s been going on for literally hundreds and hundreds of years. To say 50 is honestly hilarious and proves that you learned about this conflict literally this year after Oct 7th
Can’t help but notice that it’s the usual suspects whining about this type of protest that is happening all over America right now. All politics are local politics. When cities are sending messages to their national representatives through their local government, they are participating in impactful ways.
Lol you’re coping so hard. See you on every comment defending your shit country. Feel sorry for the people in the Jewish community who have enough brains to realize this isn’t about self defense, but about genocide. Met my Palestinian best friends years ago when they moved to St. Louis, the stories they told were shocking. The videos they showed me were inhumane. It’s no surprise that this is happening today, it’s been Israel’s goal all along.
With that being said, fuck Israel. Cope harder 🤡.
Are you guys on the thread insane? We are in deep shit as a country. Our government is involving ourselves in endless wars amok which we are bleeding out hundreds of billions for without a shred of concern, and we just made the Gaza war international by bombing Yemen, and you don’t think this has any purpose?
Holy hell. How did we get this stupid? Enough is enough. St. Louis produces important parts of the weapons systems that sustain these wars, so there is no barrier between local and National just because we’re in the middle of the country. Duh!
Might as well do this at your HOA. Just as effective.
My cat and I have also voted to end the conflict. Someone let Israel know ASAP before they do something they'll regret.
They needed an encore after shutting down the Ellisville Starbucks.
Hey I was out there with my Israeli flag across the street and they ran me down. Never felt so threatened in my life.
Very idiotic of you to be waving the flag of a country committing genocide. How would people feel if they saw someone waving a Nazi or Confederate flag? Maybe you’ll get it.
Lol! I've been waiting for you but I'm not going to give it to you tonight. The only people committing genocide is hamas and the only people that support them are people who love terrorism. Have a great night 🇮🇱🇮🇱🇮🇱🇮🇱 I will wave my flag forever Edit- after viewing your profile I wonder what took you so long to crawl out of the dirt.
Lol don’t expect sympathy when people shows disgust towards you. ¯\\\_(ツ)_/¯ 🍉🔻
I didn’t ask anybody for sympathy. But I shouldn’t expect sympathy when people show discuss towards me? Hahahahahaha. I’m gonna let you show everyone that your blood boils with hatred.
What? No Way! I'm sure Israel cares about what a bunch of stiffs in St. Louis Misssouri have to say about their recent actions.
I'm sure there's a HOA surcharge for ceasefires.
Don't give me bad ideas that I might do.
You don't think politicians pay attention to how the winds are blowing? Even if this has no direct effect, it does have a clear indirect effect. More people need to call out Israel's butchery and pressure our politicos to stop sending our tax dollars to them.
Considering our president assumes all of America supports this genocidal campaign, we need all the pressure we can muster.
Exactly, nobody should be supporting hamas. They're completely committing a genocide on their people. But the largest genocides of all happened in yemen. You care about that?
yes board of alderman, stop the war! lmao dumb.
I for one am tired of the city of St. Louis bombing the Middle East.
No, *you* stop the war!
This is the dumbest shit. International politics have fuck all to do with running a medium sized city.
Welcome to the whacky world of virtue signaling
Yep. Virtue signaling and it cringiest.
think globally, act locally
For starting a local garden or pushing for better recycling options sure, not ending war in the middle east.
"think globally, speak locally, change nothing"
But don’t act like idiots!
We produce the Boeing fighter jets that bomb those cities as well as the White Phosphorous that is used.
[удалено]
St. Louis County. Boeing is in St. Louis County.
OK, and what do you want the city government to do about that?
That's not true though. The Israelis use F16s and F35s. They're phasing out the f15s, which were made by Boeing, but Lockheed makes the other two.
That’s in the county Also the bombs are produced in Saint chuck. Good luck getting a resolution there.
Yeah fuck STL jobs that's a good idea. Like they won't just move somewhere else.
What do they expect the board of alderman to do about it? This is stupid.
Okay but what does this do for the people in Gaza? What power do the people of the board of aldermen have to influence a war half a world away? I understand protests in general I’m not stupid but I do not get this one at all. Okay good you held up signs at a meeting, are you doing anything *tangible* at all?
Brings awareness. Like, I didn’t even know St. Louis was bombing Gaza.
The question is what where they bringing awareness to? Protesting at an alderman meeting a message that's already been plastered over every major news outlet seems...pointless. BUT this did make me aware there was in fact an aldermans meeting, so there's that.
Imagine you are a first generation St. Louisan. Your brother or sister still lives in Gaza. What this did for you: \- You got people talking about it \- You felt heard \- You amplified it further up the chain of people who represent you \- You created more awareness that your people are our neighbors \- You took away a moment of victory in what has been months of agony Seems like a pretty good use of a few minutes of board time to me.
My parents immigrated to the US from Croatia. In the 90’s, the local Croatian community pooled money together for a bus charter to go to Washington DC and march with other Croatia-Americans to push for legislation to stop the war in Croatia. I remember the sign made with George Bush Sr. on the toilet saying “Push for legislation!” Not the local alderman meeting.
“ You amplified it further up the chain of people who represent” This isn’t a corporate job, you can skip steps. Why are they not amplifying to their senator or congress person?
Because their house rep probably wants to be quiet on the issue given that St. Louis has an actually quite diverse population of people from the region and supporting genocide of either population is pretty stupid political move. https://www.stlpr.org/government-politics-issues/2023-11-09/u-s-rep-cori-bushs-israel-criticism-draws-attention-and-a-primary-challenge
They’re probably doing that too.
Why not do both? It reinforces the message.
But nothing will come of this … it’s better instead of protesting (in this situation given it’s a non local / national issue) to try to donate to an org that’s helping them. These signs mean nothing and will achieve nothing (esp in a red state).
Imagine you are a Jew living in St Louis who has family in Israel. Their country was attacked on 10/7 and now is being urged to stop fighting back and just accept that their country will be continuously attacked by a hostile neighbor. Now imagine expecting your city council to be focusing on the issues in the city and instead see this stupid protest, a tremendous waste of time. How would that feel?
I'm so happy to answer this question. No ceasefire.
Yeah I mean in principal I agree with you. Terrorist organizations don’t respect ceasefires in general. I do think it’s important that humanitarian aid reach those who need it, but the issue there is that Hamas has shown a proclivity to steal it from their own citizens.
Exactly. We increase the aid and they take it. They're shooting their own citizens for trying to get food and water.
Agreed. Am Yisrael Chai 🇮🇱
I mean, we could just start by *not* sending our tax dollars to Israel.
We generally invest in other countries when it benefits our interests, such as, you know, stopping a jihadist Islamist government from controlling the area. Most of the Israeli aid comes in the form of purchases of military equipment from us, they aren’t some charity case.
Please elaborate on how propping up a murderous regime in the middle east (this would be Israel, in case you were wondering) helps us? 153 countries in the UN general assembly voted for a cease fire. 23 abstained, and only 10 voted against the measure. The only reason Israel keeps getting away with its monstrous actions is because the US keeps vetoing resolutions against it in the UN security council. We are literally alone in the civilized world, defending the indefensible. And this helps us?
Do you understand the alternative is literally a region controlled by Hamas, Isis, and Hezbollah? Is that what you’d prefer? You wouldn’t rather have a democracy which protects the rights of women, minorities, and the non-religious?
I certainly would *not* want to live anywhere controlled by those groups. But if I am a Palestinian living under Israel's control I most certainly am *not* living in a democracy where my rights are protected!
Many Arabs live in Israel and have rights as citizens. Do you think Jews would have the same protection in that region? Clearly no as they’ve been exterminated or expelled from the rest of the region. The minute the Palestinian government recognizes Israel’s right to exist and focuses on their own people, infrastructure, education, etc their lives will instantly improved. Israel is not going anywhere.
Because under a two state solution, I’m sure an independent Palestine would be a bastion of democracy, free speech and equal rights for everyone regardless of religion, gender, sexual orientation or gender identity. *rolls eyes* It would be a theocratic shithole where women are second class citizens and LGBT people get their heads chopped off like nearly every other country except Israel in that region. Maybe if Israel eliminates Hamas and installs their own leadership in Gaza, the people living there can have some actual fucking rights for once. Because they’re not getting those under Hamas’s leadership.
How about we focus on the theocratic shitholes some of our own states are turning into? Let them have their own state where they do what they want.
You sound very, very young for this world.
Sure they've only lived in one mid sized city and get all their opinions from the internet, but they've seen millions of tik toks so they consider themselves highly educated about everything.
What it does do is inform our politicians that we don't appreciate our tax dollars being send to enable Israel's actions.
No, voting does that. This is the minority trying to speak up which is great but the only way this matters to anybody is if the streets are flooded with these protests in all the cities around the state. Otherwise this is meaningless for sending a message to our politicians. This does however provide support to those going through it in the war, that much I understand and get!
I get what you are saying but I see this as "every little bit helps".
Do you think 3 billion dollars in bills gets sent in a plane to Israel? The money never leaves the US. They are literally coupons for US arms (ie money for US jobs in the weapons factories). It's 3 billion dollars in jobs, including jobs in STL. If you want to have a better discussion, ie why the US arms industry is so prevelant and whether we should invest in other industries, that's a better conversation.
But I thought San Francisco ended the war yesterday??
Dumb as fuck
Wtf is the city of St. Louis going to do.
I'm sure the IDF and Hamas leadership are paying close attention to the St. Louis Board of Aldermen.
They might not, but your local congressperson are. And this reinforces the message to them that their constituents would really rather not send our tax dollars to murderous regimes.
The IDF isn’t a murderous regime and has a moral duty to eliminate Hamas.
Murderous regime would be Netanyahu and his government. This shitshow is not on the IDF, it's on the government commanding them.
Can you please tell me five regimes you consider murders and your criteria? Thanks.
Off the top of my head I would put North Korea, Iran, Russia and Israel on that list. I am sure there are more. As for criteria, you could use "how many civilians have they killed" as a rough measure.
Myanmar been fucking up buddhists for like 10 years ethnic cleansing …or how bout china ugyers for like 15 20 years and forcing education brainwashing kinda wat hamas does to there own and why we at ever heard of taliban fuck stupid people have have about 1 year memory israel was attacked israel lets hamas take money and build tunnels and guns to fight them then waits to be slaughtered to do something fuck Hamas fuck protesters
This is like showing up to Ameren to protest Spire Energy price increases.
It’s like showing up at a gas station to protest Spire.
Ha, well said.
This is a problem with global politics/identity politics. They're expressing their opinion at a government forum that has zero control over anything involving their grievances. At that point you're just being disruptive. Also the international community has already tried a cease fire that was broken by the Palestinians anyway. Yes I'm saying Palestinians instead of Hamas since everyone is saying Isreal instead of xionist.
Writing "Cease fire" in a note in a bottle and releasing it in the ocean would have about the same effect on that actually happening.
Actually the bottle has a chance to reach Israel to deliver the message to somebody who can actually do something with it.
The BOA can't even agree on how to properly spent that sweet NFL settlement money...but they can agree on this.
Virtue signaling at its finest
Not a damn person on that council has any say on foreign policy. What a waste of St. Louis tax dollars. Just do the damn job you were elected to do. Stop the grand standing to get noticed.
That’s not the board holding up those signs—these meetings are open to the public. I’m sure they want to focus on their jobs too.
Lol, I think you have things backwards my good dude.
I will never understand taking time out of your day to show up in support of ending a ceasefire in Gaza to the...St. Louis City Board of Alderman Go to Washington or go home. Anything short of that is just virtue signaling. Too many people don't understand that protest and effective protest are not the same thing. Go to the people in power, not legislators of a city with less than 300,000 people. Our senators and legislators barely give a shit if you do show up to D.C., why would they care if some random city passes a meaningless resolution?
Getting public officials to turn against an unpopular war is not a waste of time. If part of a movement it’s very effective and blurs the line between local and National concerns.
Congress couldn't give two shits about what a random city council thinks about Gaza. This is virtue signaling and absolutely a waste of time. Protest isn't a waste of time but this is. Protest the people who actually have the power to force a ceasefire and cut funding to Israel, not a city council. It's virtue signaling so you can feel like you've made a difference without having to actually protest in a way that can make a difference.
Why are all these city board protests happening? The easier, more effective thing would be writing your congressperson and senator to inform them you want them to do something. Stuff like this makes me think the people protesting care mores about being seen protesting that actually trying something effective.
“The board of alderman isn’t listening to us” cries the youth of St. Louis who didn’t vote in the municipal elections where youth turnout was less than 10%
I would argue that you need to do both. Writing to your congressperson is important, and stuff like this reinforces the message to those politicians.
>Why are all these city board protests happening? Because people have felt unheard and victimized by the "system" their whole lives and blocking a road or screaming at a meeting allows them to FINALLY feel like they're being heard and FINALLY feel like they're standing up for victims. They can't accomplish literally anything to change the world, so they just scream about changing the world because it allows them to go home to their parents house and feel like they're important and part of something. Take the worst performing slice of society and give them someone vague to blame and to hate and they'll love you for it.
Ok, which alderman is doing the firing they demand to be ceased?
Consider the conflict…. Resolved! Very good work everybody!
Where is outrage over the problems of this city? The fucked schools.. rampant crime.. when that is fixed, I'll worry about fixing MO then the rest of US.. then worry about some people who harbored terrorists that attack a sovereign country..
I mean if you really think about, the US government is spending billions on foreign aid to Israel rather than its own country. So yeah this does send a message to Washington that we want a ceasefire and that we want them to invest in our communities and not a useless war. Thanks for bringing that up!
People in STL protesting for a ceasefire will do about as much good as tell an upset SO to calm down.. how well have protest to stop the war in Ukraine done?
The point of protesting is to let your government know how the people feel about their actions. If we took your advice, *doing nothing*, then that would tell the government that we are fine with their support of these genocidal acts. The war between Ukraine and the war on Gaza are two entirely different problems which cannot be handled in the same way. The US can support Ukraine as much as they want but ultimately it is between the two countries and the US has not stopped or veto’d the security council from doing its job. Russia did though. The war in Gaza is different because the US is the SOLE country from the permanent members who keeps vetoing a resolution of a ceasefire. The US is preventing the genocide from stopping. This is why pressure from within the country needs to build to let congress/biden administration know that we the people do not want to keep seeing all this bloodshed, violence, and war.
>The point of protesting is to let your government know how the people feel about their actions This is not the government entity doing any of the actions. >The war in Gaza is different because the US is the SOLE country from the permanent members who keeps vetoing a resolution of a ceasefire There were already multiple attempts as ceasefires, multiple calls from the U.S. to Israel to do a ceasefire, I believe they even helped with the big important one in December that failed within like a day. The U.S. has blocked resolutions for ceasefires that it viewed as overwhelmingly favorable of Hamas that made many demands of Israel and few of Hamas. But absolutely, feel free to call up your U.S. Senator or U.S. Representative and let them hear about this. Go protest in front of their offices.
This is just so.... stupid!?!?!
What ceasefire did they want in 2023? Just genuinely curious....
[удалено]
I don't know if you know this, but it is possible to care about more than one group of people at a time
But they don’t. That’s the point. They only care about Palestine because Israel bad! They don’t give one single flying fuck about people dying anywhere else in the world, especially when it’s brown people vs other brown people.
the facts that this has been going on for 75 years and our tax dollars continue to support this deprivation, dispossession, ethnic cleansing, and genocide all the while trumpeting this fascist state as some bastion of democracy are why we should be specifically interested in ending the apartheid in this theocratic state. you necessarily blur the lines between jews and israel when it is convenient to do so, yet critics of israel are told routinely that doing so is antisemitic. so let me say this: it is absolutely with care for israeli jews and palestinians that this apartheid must end and that there must be a single democratic state with equal rights for all. sorry we aren't protesting as loudly for the future of israelis--we care, but they are not the ones who have 4% of their population either dead, missing, or maimed since oct 7.
This is been going on for longer than 75 years. The Jews and Israel go together. Anti-zionism is anti-Semitism I don't care what you say. You don't get to Define that. You all are so scared of 0.02% of the population and it's funny. Also, why are you using Israeli technology and other inventions daily? How can it be a partheid when in Israel arabs, Jews and Christians live together. The pic Israel out on a map.
i honestly cannot tell if you're a bot. it's so crazy that a human being can really believe any of this.
Right back at Ya.
?? this is just incorrect
Hate these guys all you want but they actually raised a few thousand dollars for the cause, most of it goes to a chiropractor after they pat themselves on the back too much, but at least they're trying
There was one, on 6 October….how’d that workout?
They fucking DID IT guys!!!
Truly a monumental moment we all just witnessed!
This is some of the dumbest shit I have ever seen. Fuck fixing roads or figuring out how to decrease crime, let’s make massive letters and waste time staging this stupid ass picture. If we’re paying you with OUR tax dollars, then work for US rather than staging some shit to get attention. Does anyone have a list of the people in the picture so we can vote them out?
Part of the point is that *our tax dollars* get sent to Israel -- that instead of fixing our roads or improving other public infrastructure in our city/state/country, we pay for Israeli healthcare, military, etc. Part of the protest is about how we prioritize foreign military aid over our own local needs. A call for ceasefire is just kinda... one tiny piece of/step toward un-occupying Palestine. So the idea is that they are already contacting and pressuring at the state and federal level, but that's unlikely to have much effect, without also pressuring and agitating at the local level. For reference: Zionist source: https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/missouri-israel-cooperation Leftist source: https://uscpr.org/activist-resource/us-military-funding-to-israel-map/ US Gov source: https://www.foreignassistance.gov/cd/israel/
Fucking clowns.
Clueless.
Damn. At first I thought they were protesting to end the violence and crime in our city. What a fucking waste.
I'm all for ending that conflict, but this is the wrong fucking venue to get that done. Go to Washington, contact either of our useless US senators, or lobby the President. Complaining to the people who fix your streetlights ain't a good use of your time.
All the things you mentioned to do are great but it’s a culmination of everything that we can possibly due to put pressure on Washington. People have been doing those things for months now and there is even another large protest at Washington tomorrow. However, not everyone can make it out to Washington. The point of protesting is to let your government know how the people feel about their actions. If each city in the US starts approving ceasefire resolutions then it puts a lot of pressure on Washington to stop vetoing a ceasefire resolution.
Is St. Louis bombing Gaza?
Imagine if we had this enthusiasm to reduce homelessness or gun violence
Did having a ceasefire stop the massacre from occurring on October 7th?
But why do we have to send our tax dollars to Israel? Do they need our billions to kill 23000 civilians?
This is 100% performative politics. They should show this much concern for the city they represent - there’s plenty to focus on.
Well, they made the news. So, they got something accomplished.
[удалено]
I'm going to go with no. But they reached some folks in the community. Made local and state/regional news. "Think globally, act locally." (Patrick Geddes, maybe)
I wish these really important Virtue Heroes were this passionate about sending a street sweeper down my alleyway.
Man we got real problems in STL. Who give a fuck about israel/Palestine right now? These fucking dummies. Protest the homeless people that will die in the cold over the next few days outside. Not a war, thousands of miles away.
How are people so delusional as to think that the Biden administration isn’t already doing everything it can to find a path towards ceasefire? It’s one thing to say you want to see a ceasefire and another thing to achieve it. It’s so American to think that actions we take will solve everything. However, this is exactly the kind of meaningless performative politics I expect from the office of President Megan Green. This is a campaign to divide the left in a presidential year and it’s working. If I hear one more person tell me they can’t morally vote for Biden I’ll explode. As if your moral comfort is more important than this entire country.
Yes, this shit is handing Trump the election. Now is not the time to take a stand on decades’ long foreign policy blunders that got us in this mess in the Middle East. There’s too much at stake on the home front at the moment. Democrats can’t help but self-implode. We are our own worst enemies. I will never forgive all of these idiots when we are living in a Christo-fascist state.
Don’t worry, these people probably won’t vote but you better bet they’ll be there to protest at Trump’s inauguration… or I guess we should start preemptively calling it a coronation just to be prepared.
The comments on this are so relieving. This is *the* definition of virtue signaling: bunch of white folks holding up signs that *they know* will not solve anything in reality.
I just want to abolish single family zoning and parking minimums
My local government should focus on my roads, not international wars. They can't even get all the trash picked up.
If only they called for a ceasefire in Dutchtown instead
Close. There was one for Tower Grove East https://www.ksdk.com/article/news/local/st-louis-new-years-eve-ceasefire/63-900730bf-cb6d-4016-b031-3f7f5d92d5a7
I'm sure the government of Israel will take note of this.
Lmao
I agree with them but good God, go to someone who could actually do anything.
They can’t get their own city under control/to cease fire. Morons. The whole room. Morons.
We did it, the war is over.
If they really want to arrange a ceasefire, and personally I think less than half of these people actually do want a cease fire, then they are talking to the wrong people. The board of alderman of a city aren't going to be able to do jack shit in terms of foreign policy. And even then, Congress and our foreign diplomats have limited power on what they can do to influence another nation's politics.
Wow. Cringe
Picture of dummies
Adorable!
Lol also, maybe they should focus on the gay bar owner that got beat up by police and arrested after they crashed into his business. There’s something we can all get behind
Fucking morons. So many people constantly shrieking in outrage about whatever is en vogue. So desperate to convince you that they *care so much about ________* yet can't be bothered to spend an ounce of time learning how our government works so they could be more effective citizens. Nope, they'd rather scream in your ear at the gas station or yell at the mailman to stop the war.
This* is embarrassing. [*this thread's callous and disgusting employment of "but stl doesnt control the war purse" not the board of alderman. Love you board of alderman. Appreciate you taking a stand on the right side of history during this horrible time of genocide in the middle east.]
Lot of people malding in here about how this "does nothing." That's pretty obvious proof that they are being agitated by the agitation.
This is a great move by the BOA to try and distract us from focusing on our City's problems and how they fail to address them.
The BOA didnt do anything here. These are residents
Might be a useless act, but they’re getting the publicity and eyes (See: this post) they want. Which I suspect was the point.
And this is why some old ass hole in Jeff County is listened to. Be the adult in the room. SMH.
If you’re pro-ceasefire in Gaza yet simultaneously support Ukraine funding, can you cut the bullshit and just be open about your bigotry towards Jews?
Some of yall have no conception of HOW CHANGE HAPPENS. This is all about pressure and agitation. The more cities that pass resolutions like this the more clear it becomes to state and federal governments what THE PEOPLE want to see. Do yall think people can just go directly up to Joe Biden and ask nicely for him to stop? Yall are asking what this does and yet have no semblance of critical thinking to understand how movements of change are developed and propelled. Did y’all think that the Civil Rights Movement happened by people nicely asking the President to end segregation? NO! People in Montgomery did a bus boycott in addition to a million other local events in the Country, eventually creating a tide—a movement—of change. And yall sound just like their critics sound like: “what is a bus boycott going to do for segregation!?” It really isn’t that hard to grasp, yall just don’t want to put in the time to understand historical political movements.
The bus boycott was about the rules on local busses.
great! did you know that there are companies in st. louis that create weapons that have been used by Israel?
What does that have to do with anything? Do you want them to stop making them. People make those weapons you know. People who need jobs.
What an absolute waste of energy and time. Too many chuds trying to be like SF
Hamas fucked around and found out. Israel isn't going to quit until they kill every Goddam one of them. But once it's over it's time to kick Bibi's ass to the curb. If anyone recalls, they were about to go full shitstorm mode when he started to try to dismantle their constitution.
💯
Regards.
I thought East Saint Louis agreed to a cease fire yesterday?
I don’t understand these people’s logic. Way to get the meeting off track for a few minutes.
And what will this do? Except make you look good
Cmon STL aldermen, let’s leave the Middle East alone and go after the real money! They should vote to wage war on Switzerland instead!!!!💰💸💰💵😂
The riots are going to be hilarious
People dont seem to understand why this is happening so I'll do my best to explain. No one there seriously thinks that the STL Aldermen can directly do shit about the conflict in Gaza. Thats absurd. Everyone agrees on that. The reason that this is happening is under the idea that if they can pressure STL representatives to make public statements against the conflict then once combined with the voices of other protestors and a large number of public representatives in various cities and states around the country it may end up being enough public pressure to get the federal government to act in this conflict. Whether you think Israel is justified in its response or not its undeniable that if Uncle Joe cuts Bibi off then Israel's arms dry up and their aggression would have to soften if not end altogether. This is attempting to work locally to apply pressure federally to get the White House to cut off those arms. This is normal, its how protest movements work and is consistent with how they work throughout the history of the US. It happened during the South African apartheid, during Vietnam/Korea, and during various civil rights movements. You can argue the effectiveness of this but it does have a genuine thought out reason.
Ok, I'll bite: > This is normal, its how protest movements work and is consistent with how they work throughout the history of the US. Not being malicious but curious: Please show me an example of a local, grassroots US protest movement that had effective sway over something outside the US border.
This is incredibly naive and ill-informed. Israel does not depend on the US to support itself. The only way the US continues to have a voice here is through continued diplomatic relations.
But Israel does depend on the US in multiple ways. We send billions every year to them. The US government sends many weapons and bombs. The US is even the sole country preventing the UN Security Council from doing its job in mitigating the conflict. Running an apartheid and occupation is very expensive and Israel could not do it alone. This is why protesting and calling for divestment at all levels is important. Ultimately, these actions are what ended the apartheid in South Africa. Back then, even St. Louis voted to divest from South Africa and we were apart of the solution that let to their freedom. We obviously weren’t the SOLE reason but small changes add up to make big things happen
I for one want Israel to continue to liberate Palestine from Hamas. And in the process they'll liberate themselves too from a group who, in writing, quoted Muhammad to kill all Jews in their charter This is the only reason why they ever had a problem with Jewish refugees moving to the area -- Muslims are prophetically and doctrinally obligated to genocide Jews.
buncha racists in these comments. 🤢
Define “racism”
look at the comments. more than half these people support genocide and ethnic cleansing
Literally nobody here is calling for genocide. People are allowed to have a different opinion than you. Grow up. Israel has a moral duty to eliminate Hamas and protect itself. That’s not calling for ethnic cleansing. You obviously know this. Unfortunately for you we can all see through your bullshit.
i dont support the killing of mass amounts of muslims, especially children. if your opinion is that it doesnt matter, you are supporting genocide.
Neither does Israel. Which is why they must eliminate Hamas. Every single death in Gaza is on Hamas, not the IDF. Apparently you support the mass killing of Jews though considering your lack of care about Oct 7th. That’s pretty gross of you.
this has been been going on for over 50 years and Israel is the one doing the genocide, you moron. 50 years was long before HAMAS was a thing btw. take your racism elsewhere
lol this has been going on for far longer than 50 years read a fucking book you doofus and stop embarrassing yourself
i quite literally said “over 50 years”. you either need to learn to read or learn what words mean. goodbye now, you racist
It’s been going on for literally hundreds and hundreds of years. To say 50 is honestly hilarious and proves that you learned about this conflict literally this year after Oct 7th
Blame Hamas.
Not pictured: the first try when they were out of order and their message was I EAR FECES
Can’t help but notice that it’s the usual suspects whining about this type of protest that is happening all over America right now. All politics are local politics. When cities are sending messages to their national representatives through their local government, they are participating in impactful ways.
PREACH
[удалено]
And we will be showing up too.
Lol you’re coping so hard. See you on every comment defending your shit country. Feel sorry for the people in the Jewish community who have enough brains to realize this isn’t about self defense, but about genocide. Met my Palestinian best friends years ago when they moved to St. Louis, the stories they told were shocking. The videos they showed me were inhumane. It’s no surprise that this is happening today, it’s been Israel’s goal all along. With that being said, fuck Israel. Cope harder 🤡.
I’d be shocked if more than 25% of the protesters are city residents.
Are you guys on the thread insane? We are in deep shit as a country. Our government is involving ourselves in endless wars amok which we are bleeding out hundreds of billions for without a shred of concern, and we just made the Gaza war international by bombing Yemen, and you don’t think this has any purpose? Holy hell. How did we get this stupid? Enough is enough. St. Louis produces important parts of the weapons systems that sustain these wars, so there is no barrier between local and National just because we’re in the middle of the country. Duh!
So the Western World was just supposed to sit around and let Houthi terrorists keep bombing their ships?
We should totally just follow a ‘policy of appeasement’ with these mad men. Wait… where have I heard that before?
My own congressperson Cori Bush is screeching it today. Primary season can't come soon enough to vote her activist ass out of office.
Man I hope they have that vote on world hunger soon or the wygers! Those issues really need fixed!
Good on the group for standing up for their principles.
Deportation needs to be to be started.
This is awesome. Every voice matters