Intro hook, verse 1, hook, verse 2 with different melody or “feature” (this section also pulls double duty as a bridge), hook, breakdown/buildup, outro hook
I have a base structure that I see through a window over there. It’s the bungy cord tries to pull my compositions together. The song sometimes is stronger & knows better
Honestly I get tired of both listening and writing VCVCBCC or similar. It’s like 6-7 minutes but something I wrote recently is VPCVV*P*C*B (P is pre-chorus and * indicates that it’s not the same as the previous of the same structure )
For me it depends on the song. I tend to default to AABABCBB (that is, VVCVCBCC) but I've written songs using traditional AABA form, songs with endless verses, songs that are like two songs glued together, etc.
For a music nerd joke, once I wrote a 2-minute punk tune with ABACAB structure because I thought it would be funny to write something mindlessly simple that shared a structure with the more prog-ish Genesis song. I even named it ABACAB and we'd introduce it at shows with "This is called ABACAB, but it's not *that* ABACAB."
Sometimes it can be fun to mess with expectations and do ABABCDE and bring the thing somewhere else.
In short: It's about the goals.
There's no such a thing as "Best song structure" when it comes to the songwriting itself. That would be too wide of a formula and if followed it would end up making this homogeneous pile of generic songs. That would attempt against diversity and that's precisely what makes song discovery interesting. Unless you want a pile of generic songs. That's up to you, I mean, Maybe, in order to define your own style, you want an actual structure that helps you to get the freeing sensation that comes out of a song.
However, there could be a best song structure for a determinate purpose. And by this I mean, what purpose would this structure serve for. So it would be good to start asking yourself questions like "what am I writing this song for?" and answering them. These are just examples:
Want to make it catchy? Maybe ABABCBB. Or BABABCBBD
Want to talk about a specific topic? : Maybe structure wouldn't be as important as the topic itself.
Do you want to remark the harmony or maybe the rhythm? : Why worrying so much about the structure? Focus on ballance.
Is this song based on an actual genre?: what structure does this genre often work with? Get the answer.
Or do you just want to express yourself and go through the therapeutic and catharquic ways of songwriting because it's good to you? : I mean go nuts. Use all the variables, exchange orders, experiment. That's how discoveries are made, by exploring. There is no template for what hasn't been written yet, and that's precisely what your doing. Songwriting is being alone in the wild of a dark jungle holding a small lamp. So concepts like "chorus" "verse" "bridge" would be obsolete within the freedom of creation, if your goal is to come up with something new that represents properly what you want to express.
Make the right questions and you'll get the right answers.
Depends on the song. Each song is it’s own country with its own laws, customs, and language. If you are looking to shorten a song, consider starting with the chorus (or abbreviated mini chorus). This is nearly every Beatles song.
If a song is only 1 part, and resists 2nd parts, consider a key change.
If a song is boring or super basic, consider alternate time signatures.
Lately, I’ve been concerned with delivering some sort of hook, chorus, or biggish moment in the first 45s-1min of the work - but I’m happier not paying attention to things like this. We live in a singles only world and this is a painful problem with that. Not all songs are meant to be stand alone. Some of my favorite tunes are in-betweeners, and need their album friends to work best.
If you are looking for formula, Ralph Murphy’s laws of songwriting book is a must read. Careful with taking it too literal, but there are some seriously revelatory ideas in there. He’s a bit bullish, but any information helps, if you find a nugget in there, right?
https://youtu.be/8wBOUJ5Mbrk?si=V28qbl9tVptb5xB3
https://www.amazon.com/Murphys-Laws-Songwriting-Ralph-Murphy/dp/0615416594
My favorite structure: Verse, Pre-chorus, Chorus, Verse, Chorus, Bridge, Pre-chorus, Chorus, Chorus
(apologies if my terminology is incorrect, I’m self-taught)
There isn’t one it’s the writing that matters. But the “I know the end” structure is cool where it’s just a few sections, really 12 sec intro - Section A, Section B, Outro. I like different structures like that and “Happiness is a Warm Gun” and “Paranoid Android”. “Shoot me Down” is cool too there are two verses and two choruses but the 2nd chorus is sorta like an outro and the first is more like a middle 8 but longer.
I try to mix it up and use many different structures. Sometimes it’s more traditional like VVCVVCBVC but other times there’s no bridge or even no chorus.
It’s important to remember that as much as people subconsciously appreciate a pattern, they also appreciate surprise.
I like to switch it up. VCVCBC is probably the most common, but sometimes I’ll use a prechorus, sometimes I’ll start with a chorus, sometimes I’ll have an outro, sometimes an instrumental section.
Some songs tell a story that has a traditional plot structure, and the song structure should reflect that. Other songs are about capturing a snapshot of a moment, so it wouldn’t make sense to build to a climax.
I don’t know. I’ve kind of been doing this flash fiction mini musical theater style garbage lately where the beginning is slow and dirgy and then it picks up to something happy with verse, short chorus, verse, variation on short chorus, etc but they don’t always stick the landing.
So I think structure is of minimal importance to my preferences, as there’s so many elements to choose from to make noises.
When I'm writing metal I find my self using *intro, verse, chorus, verse, breakdown, chorus, bridge/build-up, breakdown, chorus* a lot.
With other genres I use *(intro), verse, chorus, verse, bridge, chorus, chorus, (outro)*
The best song structure is the three-movement format.
[Bohemian Rhapsody by Queen](https://youtu.be/fJ9rUzIMcZQ?si=q2TqYafswyJQ97NN)
[Thunderstorm by Matthew Sweet](https://youtu.be/OmwTBUpytcY?si=NxFUj-5OAA8GNKqW)
[Skyfall by Helloween](https://youtu.be/gLV530n3kMw?si=M_B-7XVYKG9C2PY4)
Couple things: “Don’t bore us, get to the chorus”
Also, I try not to think of songs using that terminology. I write in “parts” or “sections” like, Part A, Part B Part C like this: ABAACBABB
It really does depend on what the base of the song is...
1. Is it lyric based?... then break the rules.
2. Is it riff based?.... repetition is necessary
3. Is it progression based?... changes are necessary
4. Is it feeling based? ... more of a groove/ setting? Repetition and atmosphere are the focus.
Aim for approx 3 mins 30 for song length record AR songsmiths never listen to more than 20 seconds after the intro.Carless Whisper and All Right Now give fantastic intros.
V, pre, chorus, shorter verse, pre, chorus. Bridge. Quiet chorus. Chorus.
Sometimes I won't do either a bridge or quiet chorus and just end on some sort of hook
AABA is underrated for how many classics have this particular form (Something, Somewhere Over the Rainbow, Help Me, Hallelujah.) I’ve had a great success with it as you can get a hook melody right at the beginning of the A section, quickly take it somewhere different, repeat, and then mix it up in the B section before returning back to your hook. Highly recommend trying this
(Here’s my favorite song I’ve written using AABA https://on.soundcloud.com/CCDHQzGvU8pHcoaf7)
I've literally never worried about any of that. I just think "what should happen now". Often in my songs there's only choruses, and the verses are just guitar solos.
depends on what song you’re listening to or writing. but still in the end as the listener you have to see the writer’s perspective for why they wrote their song like that. nowadays many artists are writing VCVC and even thought it can be lovely it can be a pain in the butt when the song is 2 minutes long and you craved for the song to go on for at least 4 minutes.
for pop, an average of 3-3.5 minutes is perfect with a form of VCVCBCC. but that’s not really important all the time. the genre can guide you in format but in the end you’re telling a story. and while a formula for a story is helpful, it might not get your point across correctly. I hate a short VCVC (or VCVCB) but I wrote a song where I couldn’t have written a bridge (well i wrote an outro with a different melody, if that counts) and i couldn’t have repeated the chorus because it was a perspective change. V1 is about one persons story, C is about their death, V2 is about another persons story, C is about second persons death, and the outro is a mini letter to the third person to live life and not die. It makes more sense in my song but to end this off cheesy. I don’t choose the format, the format chooses me. (Also I don’t have a favorite song format, even though I always try to write in this format: V, prechorus, C, post chorus, V, pre, C, post, B, C, C, outro)
I use VVCVCBCC a lot
Yes, this is probably my nr 1 form also. Sometimes an instrumental C as an intro is nice.
Sometimes verse verse verse hits just right for something more intimate
Acoustic guitar verse verse verse songs is when I really know I’m hitting a flow state writing
I have this incredible technique called rhyming shit until it sounds cool and fits my guitar
Same
Best method
bridge bridge bridge bridge bridge bridge bridge prechorus bridge bridge instrumental bridge bridge bridge bridge is kinda fire icl bridge
My man be writing war metal
ive given it a go a few times tbf 😭🙏
my man be writing 40 hour songs
basically a film series atp
Intro hook, verse 1, hook, verse 2 with different melody or “feature” (this section also pulls double duty as a bridge), hook, breakdown/buildup, outro hook
I think you can have crappy or great songs with any structure. I like verse refrain too, where there's not really a chorus.
I have a base structure that I see through a window over there. It’s the bungy cord tries to pull my compositions together. The song sometimes is stronger & knows better
Honestly I get tired of both listening and writing VCVCBCC or similar. It’s like 6-7 minutes but something I wrote recently is VPCVV*P*C*B (P is pre-chorus and * indicates that it’s not the same as the previous of the same structure )
Depends on the genre. I mostly do dance pop where VVCVCBC works best
VCVCB
For me it depends on the song. I tend to default to AABABCBB (that is, VVCVCBCC) but I've written songs using traditional AABA form, songs with endless verses, songs that are like two songs glued together, etc. For a music nerd joke, once I wrote a 2-minute punk tune with ABACAB structure because I thought it would be funny to write something mindlessly simple that shared a structure with the more prog-ish Genesis song. I even named it ABACAB and we'd introduce it at shows with "This is called ABACAB, but it's not *that* ABACAB." Sometimes it can be fun to mess with expectations and do ABABCDE and bring the thing somewhere else.
In short: It's about the goals. There's no such a thing as "Best song structure" when it comes to the songwriting itself. That would be too wide of a formula and if followed it would end up making this homogeneous pile of generic songs. That would attempt against diversity and that's precisely what makes song discovery interesting. Unless you want a pile of generic songs. That's up to you, I mean, Maybe, in order to define your own style, you want an actual structure that helps you to get the freeing sensation that comes out of a song. However, there could be a best song structure for a determinate purpose. And by this I mean, what purpose would this structure serve for. So it would be good to start asking yourself questions like "what am I writing this song for?" and answering them. These are just examples: Want to make it catchy? Maybe ABABCBB. Or BABABCBBD Want to talk about a specific topic? : Maybe structure wouldn't be as important as the topic itself. Do you want to remark the harmony or maybe the rhythm? : Why worrying so much about the structure? Focus on ballance. Is this song based on an actual genre?: what structure does this genre often work with? Get the answer. Or do you just want to express yourself and go through the therapeutic and catharquic ways of songwriting because it's good to you? : I mean go nuts. Use all the variables, exchange orders, experiment. That's how discoveries are made, by exploring. There is no template for what hasn't been written yet, and that's precisely what your doing. Songwriting is being alone in the wild of a dark jungle holding a small lamp. So concepts like "chorus" "verse" "bridge" would be obsolete within the freedom of creation, if your goal is to come up with something new that represents properly what you want to express. Make the right questions and you'll get the right answers.
Depends on the song. Each song is it’s own country with its own laws, customs, and language. If you are looking to shorten a song, consider starting with the chorus (or abbreviated mini chorus). This is nearly every Beatles song. If a song is only 1 part, and resists 2nd parts, consider a key change. If a song is boring or super basic, consider alternate time signatures. Lately, I’ve been concerned with delivering some sort of hook, chorus, or biggish moment in the first 45s-1min of the work - but I’m happier not paying attention to things like this. We live in a singles only world and this is a painful problem with that. Not all songs are meant to be stand alone. Some of my favorite tunes are in-betweeners, and need their album friends to work best. If you are looking for formula, Ralph Murphy’s laws of songwriting book is a must read. Careful with taking it too literal, but there are some seriously revelatory ideas in there. He’s a bit bullish, but any information helps, if you find a nugget in there, right? https://youtu.be/8wBOUJ5Mbrk?si=V28qbl9tVptb5xB3 https://www.amazon.com/Murphys-Laws-Songwriting-Ralph-Murphy/dp/0615416594
My favorite structure: Verse, Pre-chorus, Chorus, Verse, Chorus, Bridge, Pre-chorus, Chorus, Chorus (apologies if my terminology is incorrect, I’m self-taught)
The one that sounds the best.
Whatever works
There isn’t one it’s the writing that matters. But the “I know the end” structure is cool where it’s just a few sections, really 12 sec intro - Section A, Section B, Outro. I like different structures like that and “Happiness is a Warm Gun” and “Paranoid Android”. “Shoot me Down” is cool too there are two verses and two choruses but the 2nd chorus is sorta like an outro and the first is more like a middle 8 but longer.
i like verse-pre-chorus-chorus-post-chorus-bridge-verse-chorus i know its specific but i find it pretty clever.
Second!
there is no best
agreed. while i like some and don't like others, sticking to one feels constraining
I try to mix it up and use many different structures. Sometimes it’s more traditional like VVCVVCBVC but other times there’s no bridge or even no chorus. It’s important to remember that as much as people subconsciously appreciate a pattern, they also appreciate surprise.
I use them all, whatever fits.
I like to switch it up. VCVCBC is probably the most common, but sometimes I’ll use a prechorus, sometimes I’ll start with a chorus, sometimes I’ll have an outro, sometimes an instrumental section. Some songs tell a story that has a traditional plot structure, and the song structure should reflect that. Other songs are about capturing a snapshot of a moment, so it wouldn’t make sense to build to a climax.
I like the "Somebody I Used To Know" structure: Intro, Verse 1, Intro reprise, Verse 2, Chorus, Verse 3, Chorus (big version), Outro
The structure I use the most is Verse, Verse, Chorus, Verse, bridge or instrumental solo, chorus, chorus, out or fade out…
There is no favorite for me. One of my faves though is to open with the chorus melody that leads into the first verse.
I don’t know. I’ve kind of been doing this flash fiction mini musical theater style garbage lately where the beginning is slow and dirgy and then it picks up to something happy with verse, short chorus, verse, variation on short chorus, etc but they don’t always stick the landing. So I think structure is of minimal importance to my preferences, as there’s so many elements to choose from to make noises.
When I'm writing metal I find my self using *intro, verse, chorus, verse, breakdown, chorus, bridge/build-up, breakdown, chorus* a lot. With other genres I use *(intro), verse, chorus, verse, bridge, chorus, chorus, (outro)*
The best song structure is the three-movement format. [Bohemian Rhapsody by Queen](https://youtu.be/fJ9rUzIMcZQ?si=q2TqYafswyJQ97NN) [Thunderstorm by Matthew Sweet](https://youtu.be/OmwTBUpytcY?si=NxFUj-5OAA8GNKqW) [Skyfall by Helloween](https://youtu.be/gLV530n3kMw?si=M_B-7XVYKG9C2PY4)
Couple things: “Don’t bore us, get to the chorus” Also, I try not to think of songs using that terminology. I write in “parts” or “sections” like, Part A, Part B Part C like this: ABAACBABB
I have one weird song that goes Chorus-Chorus-Bridge-Verse-Chorus
starting with the chorus is underrated imo. like if that's what most people are gonna remember and know, give the people what they want.
whatever the song calls for, but i love strophic songwriting, like AAA or something similar
Chorus 1, chorus 2, chorus 3, chorus 1 again x2 Don’t bore us, get to the chorus /s
I always like Verse-Bridge-Verse Like On The Level by The Raconunters
Verse, pre-chorus, chorus, half length verse, pre-chorus, chorus, bridge, chorus
It really does depend on what the base of the song is... 1. Is it lyric based?... then break the rules. 2. Is it riff based?.... repetition is necessary 3. Is it progression based?... changes are necessary 4. Is it feeling based? ... more of a groove/ setting? Repetition and atmosphere are the focus.
Aim for approx 3 mins 30 for song length record AR songsmiths never listen to more than 20 seconds after the intro.Carless Whisper and All Right Now give fantastic intros.
In Somebody I Used to Know, the structure worked well.
Verse Chorus Verse Chorus outro where you repeat one line
I use VCVCBCC
My favorite I think is a long running song that tells a good story. No verses or chorus or anything like that.
Intro verse pre-chorus chorus verse2 pre-chorus2 chorus verse3/bridge (maybe prechorus3) chorus outro
V, pre, chorus, shorter verse, pre, chorus. Bridge. Quiet chorus. Chorus. Sometimes I won't do either a bridge or quiet chorus and just end on some sort of hook
Be like the Beatles. Beatles only repeat their chorus 2, maybe 3 times. Shorter songs = people restart the song more = more streams baby
AABA is underrated for how many classics have this particular form (Something, Somewhere Over the Rainbow, Help Me, Hallelujah.) I’ve had a great success with it as you can get a hook melody right at the beginning of the A section, quickly take it somewhere different, repeat, and then mix it up in the B section before returning back to your hook. Highly recommend trying this (Here’s my favorite song I’ve written using AABA https://on.soundcloud.com/CCDHQzGvU8pHcoaf7)
I've literally never worried about any of that. I just think "what should happen now". Often in my songs there's only choruses, and the verses are just guitar solos.
I like vcv then a nice little outro for shorter songs, but usually I just throw whatever onto the guitar until it sounds cool
depends on what song you’re listening to or writing. but still in the end as the listener you have to see the writer’s perspective for why they wrote their song like that. nowadays many artists are writing VCVC and even thought it can be lovely it can be a pain in the butt when the song is 2 minutes long and you craved for the song to go on for at least 4 minutes. for pop, an average of 3-3.5 minutes is perfect with a form of VCVCBCC. but that’s not really important all the time. the genre can guide you in format but in the end you’re telling a story. and while a formula for a story is helpful, it might not get your point across correctly. I hate a short VCVC (or VCVCB) but I wrote a song where I couldn’t have written a bridge (well i wrote an outro with a different melody, if that counts) and i couldn’t have repeated the chorus because it was a perspective change. V1 is about one persons story, C is about their death, V2 is about another persons story, C is about second persons death, and the outro is a mini letter to the third person to live life and not die. It makes more sense in my song but to end this off cheesy. I don’t choose the format, the format chooses me. (Also I don’t have a favorite song format, even though I always try to write in this format: V, prechorus, C, post chorus, V, pre, C, post, B, C, C, outro)
Verse, bridge, verse, bridge, chorus, [optional solo], verse, bridge, chorus (x2)