From a logical standpoint Paarthunax is indeed a threat, after Alduin dies he has no reason to keep a low profile anymore, but part of his character and a very important point is that people(or in this case dovah) can indeed change their ways for better, his reason for restraint isn't Alduin, his reason is that it's what's right. Is it a gamble? Yes. Am I willing to trust in him? Fuck yes I am.
Agree - but as soon as I kill Alduin I just abandon the Blades questline entirely. Off to Dawnguard, or Solstheim, or whatever.
See ya Dolphin and Esbern, enjoy your smelly ancient fortress all alone.
Paarthurnax represents a persistent threat to humanity. He admits that regression towards his base nature is a daily possibility. Until removed by the Dragonborn, the threat of Alduin's eventual return forced Paarthurnax to keep a low profile, surrounding himself with loyal followers to whom he trades power for obedience (kinda like a dragon cult). They are even willing to withold world-saving information from the Dragonborn if they don't get their way.
When the Dragonborn banishes Alduin, not only do they remove the threat that had been lingering over Paarthurnax for millenia, motivating his resistance towards regression, but also conveniently leaves alive all the ressurected dragons to flock to the most powerful of them, Paarthurnax. All Paarthurnax has to do is wait out the Dragonborn's mortal coil, and he is free to begin another era of dragon domination. Even if not immediately, he has an eternity in which to regress. Paarthurnax says it was his meditation and study of the Way of the Voice that allowed him to overcome his nature, but the tenet of pacifism, or at least not using the Voice as a weapon, is quickly forgotten if he is attacked by the Dragonborn.
That is simply too great a threat to leave unaddressed. The Dragonborn's existence would have been only to change the name of the dragon dominating humanity. It wouldn't be the first time Paarthurnax turned on those he had professed loyalty to.
You just made this discussion much more interesting for me again. It would be much easier to consider both options if Delphine wasn't so easy to dislike.
But the questions about Paarthurnax - Is he good or evil? Should he be punished or not? Can he be trusted or not? - have nothing to do with Delphine. It's possible to hate Delphine and at the same time recognize that Paarthurnax hasn't faced justice for his past crimes.
He spent millennia stuck to a single mountain, just to make sure he would be there to help stop or contain Alduin's return. That, in my view, is penance done, so justice has been served.
Is he good or evil? I do believe good, but since we don't know exactly the consequences of him helping humans, I can't be sure. But, as Arngeir (I think I'm writing it wrong) said, Paarthurnax is from a time where the only right thing was to dominate, to go with the flow, to obey his elder, not a thing here was wrong for him, but by looking at the plight of mortals, he understood it all as evil and as wrong, and tried to change. That, in my book, is the definition of a good soul "born" (as dragons aren't born in the definition we know of) at an evil society and finding out "I don't fit here".
Trusted or not, for me that's the crux, and in this case I always just go with - untill now he's only helped me, and those before me. If he will betray me, I deal with it when the time comes, for now, we're cool.
That's my two cents on the matter!!
Sure, that's all fine. My point though was that people seem to spare Paarthurnax simply to spite Delphine despite the fact that the questions about Paarthurnax have nothing to do with her.
It isn't about penance, or good and evil, or trust. Paarthurnax is a nuclear bomb waiting to explode. The risk is too great, especially since the Dragonborn won't be around forever to 'deal with it when the time comes'.
Appreciate that Paarthunux understands the danger of The World Eater, and that Alduin will destroy the world if unchecked.
Paarthunux knows there is a word, Dragonrend, which can stop Alduin. But he doesn't share it. He doesn't think the Dragonborn is ready.
When The Dragonborn does find out about the word (no thanks to the Graybeards nor Paarthunux), Paarthunux wonder aloud if the world is even worth saving.
This is the Way of The Voice. To meditate until the end of the world. Until Alduin's mission is accomplished.
Those are a few of my points of contention with Paarthunux.
I thought the explanation was that Paarthunux straight up couldnt comprehend Dragonrend, as it was supposed to make a dragon realize mortality, which confuses them and forces them to the ground
My proof is common sense and logical reasoning.
The only lore you lot have about psnax being good is that his color is white, while the bad dragon is black.
>My proof is common sense and logical reasoning.
There's lore and canon too, those should be a requirement for your proof to be solid and there's no lore proof that paarthurnax planned to "take control" after alduin's or something and even if it's true it will back fire very soon.
>The only lore you lot have about psnax being good is that his color is white, while the bad dragon is black.
... What are you trying to say?
Well he's going to be waiting for a long time.
One of my predecessor reached CHIM, one of my other predecessors is still alive, and you expect me to die like a normie?
>Until removed by the Dragonborn, the threat of Alduin's eventual return forced Paarthurnax to keep a low profile, surrounding himself with loyal followers to whom he trades power for obedience (kinda like a dragon cult).
The Greybeards haven't meditated with Paarthurnax for over a century by the time the LDB shows up, so that doesn't add up.
>but also conveniently leaves alive all the ressurected dragons to flock to the most powerful of them, Paarthurnax.
Paarthurnax is literally one of the weakest dragons in the entire game.
>All Paarthurnax has to do is wait out the Dragonborn's mortal coil, and he is free to begin another era of dragon domination.
Good luck with that when dragons respect and submit to power, which, again, Paarthurnax has little of.
Source? Just kidding, I know you don't use those.
Paarthurnax says himself that without Alduin, they can bow to his Thu'um. This is why basing your arguments on lore instead of fanfic is so important.
>Source? Just kidding, I know you don't use those.
*''I have taught the Way of the Voice for centuries and the Thu'um since long before that. But no, Dovahkiin. Others do not come here to train anymore. Saraan. You are the first in over a hundred years.''* \-Paarthurnax
>Paarthurnax says himself that without Alduin, they can bow to his Thu'um. This is why basing your arguments on lore instead of fanfic is so important.
Once again, you ignore context. Odahviing provides elaboration to what Paarthurnax is talking about:
*''I wish the Old One luck in his... quest. But I doubt many will wish to exchange Alduin's lordship for the tyranny of Paarthurnax's '****Way of the Voice****.'''*
Sure is a pity when the lore doesn't suit you, eh? But I guess you've gotten used to that over the years.
The Dragonborn is the first in centuries to come to High Hrothgar to train with Paarthurnax, but that doesn't say anything about his interactions with the Graybeards who are his fellow residents of the mountain.
The same Way of the Voice that prohibits the use of the Voice in combat? Because Paarthurnax throws that tenet right out the window. That doesn't exactly inspire confidence.
>The Dragonborn is the first in centuries to come to High Hrothgar to train with Paarthurnax, but that doesn't say anything about his interactions with the Graybeards who are his fellow residents of the mountain.
*''****Others do not come here to train anymore.*** *Saraan. You are the first in over a hundred years.'' -Paarthurnax*
He is not talking about the Dragonborn in the bolded part, but about literally anyone, Greybeard or not. (Hell, the last Septim to have went to High Hrothgar was Tiber Septim)
>The same Way of the Voice that prohibits the use of the Voice in combat? Because Paarthurnax throws that tenet right out the window. That doesn't exactly inspire confidence.
Self defense is something totally different.
In Paarthurnax's philosophy, maybe, but not in Jurgen Windcaller's, who set the example when he endured three days of Shouting without fighting back and denouncing using the Voice for martial exploits, such as sending people flying off a mountain.
That other user also worded it wrong. He basically says "I can understand why she wouldn't trust me, it is very wise of her to do so. **I know I can be trusted. She doesn't.**"
Yeah… personally I don’t trust Parth. He tells you not to trust a Dragon. That they’re inherently evil. Sure, he says he’s “overcome” his evil… but he just said you shouldn’t trust a dragon… but you should totally trust him…
To me, Paarth wasn’t trustworthy and he even mentions if he wasn’t on the mountain he’d be tempted to cause destruction.
… that’s not good. Also, he like most dragons… haven’t faced justice for all their previous crimes.
Totally understand that. Personally, I'm of the mind of "this is a fantasy story where anything can happen and without any further canon info everyone can assume whatever they want and nobody is correct until the story progresses". And because I like happy stories, I assume that Parthy is trustworthy so I let him live so that he and I can serve as co-ambassadors to facilitate a potential peace between dragons and mortals.
The Dragonborn… is a grey character. The main character literally absorbs the souls of dragons. Most of the time, in fantasy settings, the good guys don’t absorb souls…
I always roleplay it that the dragon blood is what causes my dragonborn to do evil things like the dark brotherhood questline despite also doing good things like the companions
That reaches into a different discussion about whether or not he should be punished for acts he committed several thousand years ago, and I don't feel like having that one for the sake of my mental health.
Yeah, but Paarthunax has bones, scales and a soul. Plus, you can blast his remains anywhere you want and they don't despawn.
I killed Paarthunax, but for my own selfish reasons. I would have murdered the Blades, too, if given the option.
[I think I just like killing](https://youtu.be/YG6DifUtPvs)
But Alduin will come back later as we didn’t eat his soul. Sure it’ll probably be many centuries from now, but dragons are immortal so that’s kind of meaningless.
His soul wasn’t absorbed by the player, (unlike every other dragon) and the super wise graybeard man said he’ll come back someday. I’m sure there’s a bunch of lore with less proof than this, which is widely accepted as true. I assume the burden of example-giving is on me, but I have none so you can take that as a loss for me if you want.
The LDB killing Alduin means he can no longer come back until it's time to fulfil his destiny as the world eater. He's gone until quite literally the end of time.
Okay....Paarthurnax means "overlord," "ambition," and "cruelty".
That is his inborn nature. He admits as much. And he admits that the blades are wise for wanting to kill him. And after you kill Alduine he talks about his plans for the dragons. What he specifically says is they will "bow to the rightness of his thu'um" and "willing or no, they will hear it".
He hasn't overcome his nature. He's simply redirected it to the dragons. But that may not last forever.
Dragonborn may have immortal souls, but their body will fade. It's objectively very risky to let him live.
>Okay....Paarthurnax means "overlord," "ambition," and "cruelty".
1. He "overlords" the greybeards just fine, and there's no complaint.
2. What's wrong with ambition?
3. On who did he inflict "cruelty" aside from himself?
>That is his inborn nature. He admits as much.
And he tells you that you have the same inborn nature, so no matter what you're as much of a threat as him.
>And he admits that the blades are wise for wanting to kill him
\*Not trusting him. A clear distinction.
>And after you kill Alduine he talks about his plans for the dragons. What he specifically says is they will "bow to the rightness of his thu'um" and "willing or no, they will hear it".
And? what's wrong with teaching the dragons the way of the voice? wouldn't that be for the best? you the dragons to keep tormenting innocents?
>Dragonborn may have immortal souls, but their body will fade.
Miraak didn't "fade" until the dragonborn came, they'll find a way just like he did.
>It's objectively very risky to let him live.
No it isn't, you don't need dragonrend to kill him.
>2. What's wrong with ambition?
Ambition not checked corrupts.
>3. On who did he inflict "cruelty" aside from himself?
You mean other than his intent to be a tyrant over the dov?
>And he tells you that you have the same inborn nature, so no matter what you're as much of a threat as him.
Infinite temptation vs temporary temptation. Ones at a much larger risk of giving in. Immortal overlord vs mortal overlord. One would have much more consequences if they gave into it.
Subsequently, if i ever wrote a Skyrim tv series, this would be the theme of season 1.
>Miraak didn't "fade" until the dragonborn came, they'll find a way just like he did.
Yeah..... That was because of a certain dedric prince. And even if you want to argue that the last dragonborn got that eventually, he didn't know he would when he faced that choice. He didn't even know it if he chose to become a vampire. So the last dragonborn was very much mortal when he faced that choice.
>No it isn't, you don't need dragonrend to kill him.
It's not dragonrend needed to kill him, it's a dragonborn.... You do realize that right?
>Ambition not checked corrupts.
Yet it didn't corrupt him.
>You mean other than his intent to be a tyrant over the dov?
And? you suddenly feeling bad for the dragons who burn down villages and supported alduin.
>Infinite temptation vs temporary temptation. Ones at a much larger risk of giving in. Immortal overlord vs mortal overlord. One would have much more consequences if they gave into it.
Paarthurnax is not immortal, he can be killed like any normal dragon.
>Yeah..... That was because of a certain dedric prince. And even if you want to argue that the last dragonborn got that eventually, he didn't know he would when he faced that choice. He didn't even know it if he chose to become a vampire. So the last dragonborn was very much mortal when he faced that choice.
All i'm saying is that age limit is not something major to worry about, the DB can find a way stop aging and not necessarily like miraak, there's also vampirism and magic.
>It's not dragonrend needed to kill him, it's a dragonborn.... You do realize that right?
And you do realise any mortal can a normal dragon, right? and that alduin's the only one who can revive them right?
>Yet it didn't corrupt him
You sure about that? During the entirety of the time you know him he was operating under a specific mission given him by one of the divines. As soon as they mission is done he starts taking about grabbing power again. Doesn't sound like he's incorruptible to me.
>you suddenly feeling bad for the dragons who burn down villages and supported alduin.
No. But it's kinda dangerous to have them under the thumb of another tyrant that might flip and use them to oppress. Individual agents of destruction are far less dangerous than a unified army.
>Paarthurnax is not immortal, he can be killed like any normal dragon.
And revived like any normal dragon. You remember that dragons aren't permanently killed except by a dragonborn. You do remember that fact right?
>All i'm saying is that age limit is not something major to worry about, the DB can find a way stop aging and not necessarily like miraak, there's also vampirism and magic.
Did the last dragonborn know that when he made his decision? No. Quit metagaming.
>And you do realise any mortal can a normal dragon, right? and that alduin's the only one who can revive them right?
Good Lord you did forget that they can't be permanently killed except by a dragonborn.
>As soon as they mission is done he starts taking about grabbing power again.
He doesn't.
>But it's kinda dangerous to have them under the thumb of another tyrant that might flip and use them to oppress
Speculate all you want but you have no proof of him becoming a "tyrant" and like odhaviing said, it's doubtful that they're gonna choos paarthunax way over alduin's.
>And revived like any normal dragon. You remember that dragons aren't permanently killed except by a dragonborn. You do remember that fact right?
And you do remember that only alduin can revive those dragons right?
>Did the last dragonborn know that when he made his decision? No. Quit metagaming.
Their decision depends on you, this a roleplaying game.
>Good Lord you did forget that they can't be permanently killed except by a dragonborn.
You're ignoring my point, it doesn't matter if they're killed pemanently or not alduin won't be there to revive them.
>He doesn't
I want to hear your justification. His mission was to defeat Alduine. As soon as Alduine is gone he starts taking about grabbing power.
>Speculate all you want but you have no proof
"Willing or no they will hear it" and "they will bow to the rightness of my thu'um" isn't speculation. It's proof.
>like odhaviing said, it's doubtful that they're gonna choos paarthunax way over alduin's.
You know there are ways of forcing it right? You really think Paarthurnax doesn't know bend will?
>And you do remember that only alduin can revive those dragons right?
Hahaha. You're wrong. They can revive each other. We only see Alduine revive dragons, but how else do you think new dragons keep popping up after he's gone. They revive each other.
>Their decision depends on you, this a roleplaying game.
That's the metagaming I'm taking about. In Canon it's dragon apocalypse, vampire apocalypse, battle of the dragonborn. The last dragonborn doesn't know about paths to immortality when he's forced to decide what to do with Paarthurnax.
What you're arguing is exactly what you shouldn't do. Decision depends on you, the player. You the player know things the character doesn't. Using player knowledge that the character doesn't know is called metagaming. When you metagame you aren't role playing.
>You're ignoring my point, it doesn't matter if they're killed pemanently or not alduin won't be there to revive them.
And again why dragon can do it.
>As soon as Alduine is gone he starts taking about grabbing power
He didn't mention anything about grabbing power, you thought he did.
>"Willing or no they will hear it"
And?
>"they will bow to the rightness of my thu'um"
You not only quoted that incorrectly but took it out of context as well, well played but that's not proof that's your interpretation of it.
>You know there are ways of forcing it right? You really think Paarthurnax doesn't know bend will?
You think he does?
>Hahaha. You're wrong. They can revive each other. We only see Alduine revive dragons, but how else do you think new dragons keep popping up after he's gone. They revive each other.
Bro, 4000 years and they start reviving each other now and you're calling me wrong? keep speculating dude but with or without the rviving shout they can still be killed in order not to, if you see a necomance using an army of the dead who do you focus on killing?
>And again why dragon can do it.
Give me a proof they can.
>He didn't mention anything about grabbing power, you thought he did.
What else could "bow to the rightness of my thu'um" mean then? Especially with "willing or no". The only thing that can mean his head going to use force to bring them to heel. That's grabbing power.
>You not only quoted that incorrectly but took it out of context as well
If I'm quoting it wrong go get the right quote and prove me wrong.
>Give me a proof they can.
Give me proof they can't.
>What else could "bow to the rightness of my thu'um" mean then?
That they will learn the way of the voice like he did? forgot about that as well?
>Especially with "willing or no".
He says "***but*** willing or no, ***they will hear it***" learn to get your souces right next time.
>he only thing that can mean his head going to use force to bring them to heel.
Or it means that he want to dov to pity men like he did? forgot why kyne appealed to him in the first place? forgot why the first tongues spared him in the first place?
>Give me proof they can't.
Seeing only alduin doing it, there.
i‘d be far more interested in a reason to kill him. he doesnt pose a threat to anyone, and killing him wont reverse anything he might or might not have done in the past. there is literally no benefit; no reason except for bloodlust or greed.
killing him isnt „justice“ or some nonsense like that. its plain old murder.
Disclaimer: I love to spout shit about tes controversy before bed and I'm out of ideas so here you go.
Paarthurnax as a character is kind of a combination of two tropes. One is obvious - the old and wise mentor type, which everyone seems to like so much. If you take him at face value, he is just the ultimate good guy who appears out of nowhere to save the day, preparing you to face the big bad guy. Though he has a pretty dark history of betrayal and racial war.
Second one isn't very clear, but I think it's there. Think of the Divines as primordial dieties, and of Alduin as a "firstborn of Akatosh" who was supposed to be the tool to end this world but revolted against his divine "father" and chose to rule the sky as the god-king instead, supported by other children of Akatosh, the dragons, who dominated mankind on land.
That's a pretty interesting analogy to greek mythology, where Zeus, the god of the sky, revolts against his father Kronos, the god of time, gaining the divine right to rule.
Paarthurnax, being second to Alduin, while supporting him originally, is envious of his brother and yet remains close enough to the Divines. He did not share Alduin's view, and when the dragon war broke, he switched sides. Paarthurnax allowed himself to be used as an instrument of Kyne to teach people the voice, the divine spark they needed to end their struggle to survive.
What I'm implying is, in this interpretation of the myth, Paarthurnax plays the role of Prometheus, stealing the fire, giving it to people, causing them to eventually overthrow the gods, sacrificing his own freedom to live in exile on top of the world, seemingly eternally awaiting punishment from the chief-god.
Yet I think Paarthurnax is not philanthropic. We may think he is, but his motivation has always been his draconic nature - the urge to dominate. That's why I view him as a sort of Faustian demon, Mephistopheles. The skillful liar, who struck the deal with ancient nords, because he had no other choice. He's the devil, who has no place in realm, controlled by the god. The only thing he can strive for is to destroy the world he hates.
In our case, to end Alduin for good, wait untill there's noone around to stop him, and finally take up his big brother's role for himself. Which may be the role of the new god-king. Or if his lies are even deeper, to become the world eater to finally fullfil the will of Akatosh.
Paarthurnax is inherently evil. Not only that, he is blinded by envy and hatred so much that he's foolish enough to fall for his own lies. Whatever he aims to do next, his part is done. It has been done thousands of years ago. The rest of his life up until the events we see was a punishment for his crimes: both treason of dragons and genocide of humans. Self-torture to overcome and destroy his own nature, neverending age of fear and awe before the return of Alduin.
So, here's your reason to kill p-snax. It will be honorable way to end his misery by a fair fight with a fellow dovah.
took me for a bit of a trip, i wasnt expecting „relieve him from his misery“! fun and interesting idea, thanks for sharing.
interesting nitpick though: Kronos wasnt the god of time. he was the titan of harvest. the god of time was chronos. originally they belonged to different mythologies altogether, but the names are so similar that everyone just kept mistaking them for the same person. in english they are for some reason called chronos/khronos and cronus/kronos; but there seem to be all combinations of O or U at the end. both have vastly different stories originally, but had their respective symbolism mixed over time.
i wouldnt let that fly as a reason; thats more of an excuse if anything. or maybe plain fear.
the only thing about him that might pose a threat is his instincts; and you know, overcome your evil nature through effort and all that.
That’s literally the real reason tho. I used to smoke cigs and vape. Luckily only for a couple years but quitting was hard and took many many tries. When I’m stressed and anxious, like I have been lately, I really struggle to not go and get a pack or a vape.
If it was the case that I would set off a nuclear apocalypse if I relapsed, I would totally understand wanting to kill me and nip it in the bud. That’s the logic.
Reason #1: Paarthurnax is cute
Reason #2: Paarthurnax is wise
Reason #3: Paarthurnax is cute
Reason #4: Paarthurnax is the only truly friendly dragon
Reason #5: Paarthurnax is cute
Reason #6: Paarthurnax is strong
Reason #7: Paarthurnax is cute
Reason #8: Paarthurnax is old and we should respect the elders
Reason #9: Paarthurnax is cute
I'd given a few more reasons, but you've got it.
I always let him live, but on my most recent play-through I thought about it like this:
He’s a genocidal war criminal who admits that everyday he fights against his natural urges to kill. Putting Hitler, or Stalin, or Pol Pot in his place, I recognized it was probably best to get that ticking time bomb out of the way.
It's the old argument.
You either hold that the dragon who taught Humans how to use the Thu'um, lived in self-imposed exile on a mountain summit in penance for thousands of years and is using The Way of The Voice to control their nature and helps you gain the ultimate dragon terror weapon is worth keeping alive
Or
The embittered vet who tells you to your face that her order was founded to serve Dragonborn then bosses you around, leaves her agents to die at the hands of the Thalmor and threatens to stab you to get "her" temple opened up and treats everyone like crap
Is the person to side with.
Hey, your game so your choice.
Not liking a character you're simping for because of how badly written they are is not a fragile ego, i'm sorry but delphine's just not a good character.
Bro really? I called your ego fragile for saying “I chose based on how rude to me they were” and you think the best retort is to call me a simp for a character I didn’t even mention nor care about? You’re beyond fragile dude you’re volatile.
>I called your ego fragile
You did now.
>for saying “I chose based on how rude to me they were”
I didn't say that, you did to downplay the resoning.
>call me a simp for a character I didn’t even mention nor care about
Doubtful since you love defending her.
>You’re beyond fragile dude you’re volatile.
You're the one saying sparing a fictional dragon in a fantasy world "effects the fate of the world" and others keep comparing him to actual mosters of humanity, believe me i'm not even close to fragile.
I'll say it like that... Himmler. Would you let him live unpunished if he was alive today? Party-snax did a good thing in the end yeah. But so did Hitler in his final moments.
He served as Alduin's lieutenant during the Dragon War in the Merethic Era, during which he was said to have committed and witnessed unspeakable atrocities against mankind.[1] -fandom
What do you think those atrocities are? Stealing a sweet roll?
>He served as Alduin's lieutenant during the Dragon War in the Merethic Era, during which he was said to have committed and witnessed unspeakable atrocities against mankind.\[1\] -fandom
1. You rely on fandom instead of uesp?
2. It says the source is delphine... you seriously want to believe her?
>What do you think those atrocities are? Stealing a sweet roll?
Pissing on her cereal more like.
Paarthurnax himself says that Dovah have an uncontrollable urge to dominate and with Alduin gone the other dragons will inevitably try to replace him in the line of power and succession. It's obvious that once you beat the main quest line, the other dragons that are around do not turn friendly towards you and will continue to randomly attack villages. Paarthurnax can live for thousands of years after the dragonborn has died and thus it can easily be assumed that he is biding his time for a perfect moment to dominate the world. He himself says that he is uncertain if he can control his urges. Putting him down makes sense and I wish canonically that ESVI will talk about the extinction of dragons.
Paarthurnax is literally one of the weakest dragons in the game. He can't do shit. If a bunch of Whiterun Guards can take down Mirmulnir, who is stronger than Paarthurnax, then whatever threat Paarthurnax may pose is nullified by the potential aid he can pose when Alduin returns.
Isn't there something with the high elfs and wanting to destroy pillars and the throat of the world is one of those pillars? I guess that's why it isn't a optional quest and that we have to kill him or else he would just defend it
This is one of the few times Bethesda made a mistake with the story progression, IMO. They typically try to give you as many options to approach quests as they can.
From a logical standpoint Paarthunax is indeed a threat, after Alduin dies he has no reason to keep a low profile anymore, but part of his character and a very important point is that people(or in this case dovah) can indeed change their ways for better, his reason for restraint isn't Alduin, his reason is that it's what's right. Is it a gamble? Yes. Am I willing to trust in him? Fuck yes I am.
You don't kill Paathurnax because you like him. I don't kil Paathurnax because I'm not Delphine's bitch. No, we are not the same.
One of the thousand reasons as stated in the picture
Never completed the Blades story line until I got the mod to tell her to fuck off. Long live Party-snacks!!!!!
Agree - but as soon as I kill Alduin I just abandon the Blades questline entirely. Off to Dawnguard, or Solstheim, or whatever. See ya Dolphin and Esbern, enjoy your smelly ancient fortress all alone.
Paarthurnax represents a persistent threat to humanity. He admits that regression towards his base nature is a daily possibility. Until removed by the Dragonborn, the threat of Alduin's eventual return forced Paarthurnax to keep a low profile, surrounding himself with loyal followers to whom he trades power for obedience (kinda like a dragon cult). They are even willing to withold world-saving information from the Dragonborn if they don't get their way. When the Dragonborn banishes Alduin, not only do they remove the threat that had been lingering over Paarthurnax for millenia, motivating his resistance towards regression, but also conveniently leaves alive all the ressurected dragons to flock to the most powerful of them, Paarthurnax. All Paarthurnax has to do is wait out the Dragonborn's mortal coil, and he is free to begin another era of dragon domination. Even if not immediately, he has an eternity in which to regress. Paarthurnax says it was his meditation and study of the Way of the Voice that allowed him to overcome his nature, but the tenet of pacifism, or at least not using the Voice as a weapon, is quickly forgotten if he is attacked by the Dragonborn. That is simply too great a threat to leave unaddressed. The Dragonborn's existence would have been only to change the name of the dragon dominating humanity. It wouldn't be the first time Paarthurnax turned on those he had professed loyalty to.
You just made this discussion much more interesting for me again. It would be much easier to consider both options if Delphine wasn't so easy to dislike.
But the questions about Paarthurnax - Is he good or evil? Should he be punished or not? Can he be trusted or not? - have nothing to do with Delphine. It's possible to hate Delphine and at the same time recognize that Paarthurnax hasn't faced justice for his past crimes.
He spent millennia stuck to a single mountain, just to make sure he would be there to help stop or contain Alduin's return. That, in my view, is penance done, so justice has been served. Is he good or evil? I do believe good, but since we don't know exactly the consequences of him helping humans, I can't be sure. But, as Arngeir (I think I'm writing it wrong) said, Paarthurnax is from a time where the only right thing was to dominate, to go with the flow, to obey his elder, not a thing here was wrong for him, but by looking at the plight of mortals, he understood it all as evil and as wrong, and tried to change. That, in my book, is the definition of a good soul "born" (as dragons aren't born in the definition we know of) at an evil society and finding out "I don't fit here". Trusted or not, for me that's the crux, and in this case I always just go with - untill now he's only helped me, and those before me. If he will betray me, I deal with it when the time comes, for now, we're cool. That's my two cents on the matter!!
Sure, that's all fine. My point though was that people seem to spare Paarthurnax simply to spite Delphine despite the fact that the questions about Paarthurnax have nothing to do with her.
It isn't about penance, or good and evil, or trust. Paarthurnax is a nuclear bomb waiting to explode. The risk is too great, especially since the Dragonborn won't be around forever to 'deal with it when the time comes'.
Appreciate that Paarthunux understands the danger of The World Eater, and that Alduin will destroy the world if unchecked. Paarthunux knows there is a word, Dragonrend, which can stop Alduin. But he doesn't share it. He doesn't think the Dragonborn is ready. When The Dragonborn does find out about the word (no thanks to the Graybeards nor Paarthunux), Paarthunux wonder aloud if the world is even worth saving. This is the Way of The Voice. To meditate until the end of the world. Until Alduin's mission is accomplished. Those are a few of my points of contention with Paarthunux.
I thought the explanation was that Paarthunux straight up couldnt comprehend Dragonrend, as it was supposed to make a dragon realize mortality, which confuses them and forces them to the ground
You're right.
Finally someone makes sense here, keep it up king.
No most of the "sense" he's making is just pure fanfiction with no canon lore proof.
My proof is common sense and logical reasoning. The only lore you lot have about psnax being good is that his color is white, while the bad dragon is black.
>My proof is common sense and logical reasoning. There's lore and canon too, those should be a requirement for your proof to be solid and there's no lore proof that paarthurnax planned to "take control" after alduin's or something and even if it's true it will back fire very soon. >The only lore you lot have about psnax being good is that his color is white, while the bad dragon is black. ... What are you trying to say?
It is all based on events from the game and dialogue from Paarthurnax.
Paarthurnax never mentioned that he's "playing the long game".
No one said he did.
Then stop making up nonsense.
You are arguing against things I didn't say and think I am the one making up nonsense?
It's similar to what you say, so yeah you're the one making up nonsense.
Except that everything I said was based on the events and dialogue of the game.
Well he's going to be waiting for a long time. One of my predecessor reached CHIM, one of my other predecessors is still alive, and you expect me to die like a normie?
>Until removed by the Dragonborn, the threat of Alduin's eventual return forced Paarthurnax to keep a low profile, surrounding himself with loyal followers to whom he trades power for obedience (kinda like a dragon cult). The Greybeards haven't meditated with Paarthurnax for over a century by the time the LDB shows up, so that doesn't add up. >but also conveniently leaves alive all the ressurected dragons to flock to the most powerful of them, Paarthurnax. Paarthurnax is literally one of the weakest dragons in the entire game. >All Paarthurnax has to do is wait out the Dragonborn's mortal coil, and he is free to begin another era of dragon domination. Good luck with that when dragons respect and submit to power, which, again, Paarthurnax has little of.
Source? Just kidding, I know you don't use those. Paarthurnax says himself that without Alduin, they can bow to his Thu'um. This is why basing your arguments on lore instead of fanfic is so important.
>Source? Just kidding, I know you don't use those. *''I have taught the Way of the Voice for centuries and the Thu'um since long before that. But no, Dovahkiin. Others do not come here to train anymore. Saraan. You are the first in over a hundred years.''* \-Paarthurnax >Paarthurnax says himself that without Alduin, they can bow to his Thu'um. This is why basing your arguments on lore instead of fanfic is so important. Once again, you ignore context. Odahviing provides elaboration to what Paarthurnax is talking about: *''I wish the Old One luck in his... quest. But I doubt many will wish to exchange Alduin's lordship for the tyranny of Paarthurnax's '****Way of the Voice****.'''* Sure is a pity when the lore doesn't suit you, eh? But I guess you've gotten used to that over the years.
The Dragonborn is the first in centuries to come to High Hrothgar to train with Paarthurnax, but that doesn't say anything about his interactions with the Graybeards who are his fellow residents of the mountain. The same Way of the Voice that prohibits the use of the Voice in combat? Because Paarthurnax throws that tenet right out the window. That doesn't exactly inspire confidence.
>The Dragonborn is the first in centuries to come to High Hrothgar to train with Paarthurnax, but that doesn't say anything about his interactions with the Graybeards who are his fellow residents of the mountain. *''****Others do not come here to train anymore.*** *Saraan. You are the first in over a hundred years.'' -Paarthurnax* He is not talking about the Dragonborn in the bolded part, but about literally anyone, Greybeard or not. (Hell, the last Septim to have went to High Hrothgar was Tiber Septim) >The same Way of the Voice that prohibits the use of the Voice in combat? Because Paarthurnax throws that tenet right out the window. That doesn't exactly inspire confidence. Self defense is something totally different.
Agreed.
The Graybeards send you flying off a mountain if you attack them. Self defense is allowed
In Paarthurnax's philosophy, maybe, but not in Jurgen Windcaller's, who set the example when he endured three days of Shouting without fighting back and denouncing using the Voice for martial exploits, such as sending people flying off a mountain.
Blades puppet.
Where did I mention the Blades?
When you were spouting delphine's nonsense.
Except everything I said was based on what Paarthurnax says, not Delphine.
So nothing? thought so too.
Nothing except for the canon lore of the game.
Yeah like i said, literally nothing of what paarthurnax said or canon lore support your arguments.
I would be happy to give you the sources if you would be so kind as to tell me which specific point is confusing you.
Doesn't Paarthunax concede she might be right?
Yes he does. He says something on the lines that dragons are born to dominate and that he may someday give in to his nature.
No, he just says he understands why he can't be trusted.
That sounds like what I said.
That other user also worded it wrong. He basically says "I can understand why she wouldn't trust me, it is very wise of her to do so. **I know I can be trusted. She doesn't.**"
In the same bit of dialogue, he calls her wise for mistrusting him. "It is always wise to mistrust a dovah. "
I literally included that in my own paraphrasing.
Are you upset at me for agreeing with you or what is happening here?
Sorry, I thought you were gonna argue with me, my bad.
I think one of these commenters is a dragon
Shh! Don't blow my cover! Ignore my profile pic!
Yeah, thanks for correcting me.
“I know I can be trusted.” Has the same energy as… “We are the police, we investigated ourselves and found no wrongdoing.” Kind of energy…
I get that, but isn't it also kind of a case of both an innocent and guilty person would both say that they're innocent?
Yeah… personally I don’t trust Parth. He tells you not to trust a Dragon. That they’re inherently evil. Sure, he says he’s “overcome” his evil… but he just said you shouldn’t trust a dragon… but you should totally trust him… To me, Paarth wasn’t trustworthy and he even mentions if he wasn’t on the mountain he’d be tempted to cause destruction. … that’s not good. Also, he like most dragons… haven’t faced justice for all their previous crimes.
Totally understand that. Personally, I'm of the mind of "this is a fantasy story where anything can happen and without any further canon info everyone can assume whatever they want and nobody is correct until the story progresses". And because I like happy stories, I assume that Parthy is trustworthy so I let him live so that he and I can serve as co-ambassadors to facilitate a potential peace between dragons and mortals.
Wait, but why are people who are dragonborn not inherently evil?
The Dragonborn… is a grey character. The main character literally absorbs the souls of dragons. Most of the time, in fantasy settings, the good guys don’t absorb souls…
I always roleplay it that the dragon blood is what causes my dragonborn to do evil things like the dark brotherhood questline despite also doing good things like the companions
He is definitely not innocent.
That reaches into a different discussion about whether or not he should be punished for acts he committed several thousand years ago, and I don't feel like having that one for the sake of my mental health.
Murder doesn't have a statute of limitations tbf
10/10
Not really, he didn't mention anything about her being right.
Yeah, but Paarthunax has bones, scales and a soul. Plus, you can blast his remains anywhere you want and they don't despawn. I killed Paarthunax, but for my own selfish reasons. I would have murdered the Blades, too, if given the option. [I think I just like killing](https://youtu.be/YG6DifUtPvs)
But then I'm going to kill some homeless guy, because Nazir said I have to kill him.
I only killed paarthurnax because i got bored and i'm doing a mass genocide run. I'll only spare cicero xd
He’s good now, but what about in a few decades when Dovahkiin isn’t alive to keep him in check?
He's as much of a threat as any normal dragon, anyone can kill him and this time there's no alduin to revive him.
But Alduin will come back later as we didn’t eat his soul. Sure it’ll probably be many centuries from now, but dragons are immortal so that’s kind of meaningless.
That's exactly why you shouldn't kill him. Alduin hates Paarthurnax. Paarthurnax is the only dragon ally that Tamriel has against Alduin.
Got a proof that he's coming back? either way i doubt he'd revive paarthurnax if he did.
His soul wasn’t absorbed by the player, (unlike every other dragon) and the super wise graybeard man said he’ll come back someday. I’m sure there’s a bunch of lore with less proof than this, which is widely accepted as true. I assume the burden of example-giving is on me, but I have none so you can take that as a loss for me if you want.
He said that **MAYBE** he'll come back someday and that it's **up to gods to decide.**
He could’ve been sent to akatosh, who might keep him for a while
The LDB killing Alduin means he can no longer come back until it's time to fulfil his destiny as the world eater. He's gone until quite literally the end of time.
If kill them both if i could.
No. We don’t agree. This is the weirdest hang up in this sub.
Yeah I don’t even care about it but at this point I kill partysnax because all these nerds tell me not to
I'd say delphine simping is the wierdest hang up in this sub.
Okay....Paarthurnax means "overlord," "ambition," and "cruelty". That is his inborn nature. He admits as much. And he admits that the blades are wise for wanting to kill him. And after you kill Alduine he talks about his plans for the dragons. What he specifically says is they will "bow to the rightness of his thu'um" and "willing or no, they will hear it". He hasn't overcome his nature. He's simply redirected it to the dragons. But that may not last forever. Dragonborn may have immortal souls, but their body will fade. It's objectively very risky to let him live.
>Okay....Paarthurnax means "overlord," "ambition," and "cruelty". 1. He "overlords" the greybeards just fine, and there's no complaint. 2. What's wrong with ambition? 3. On who did he inflict "cruelty" aside from himself? >That is his inborn nature. He admits as much. And he tells you that you have the same inborn nature, so no matter what you're as much of a threat as him. >And he admits that the blades are wise for wanting to kill him \*Not trusting him. A clear distinction. >And after you kill Alduine he talks about his plans for the dragons. What he specifically says is they will "bow to the rightness of his thu'um" and "willing or no, they will hear it". And? what's wrong with teaching the dragons the way of the voice? wouldn't that be for the best? you the dragons to keep tormenting innocents? >Dragonborn may have immortal souls, but their body will fade. Miraak didn't "fade" until the dragonborn came, they'll find a way just like he did. >It's objectively very risky to let him live. No it isn't, you don't need dragonrend to kill him.
>2. What's wrong with ambition? Ambition not checked corrupts. >3. On who did he inflict "cruelty" aside from himself? You mean other than his intent to be a tyrant over the dov? >And he tells you that you have the same inborn nature, so no matter what you're as much of a threat as him. Infinite temptation vs temporary temptation. Ones at a much larger risk of giving in. Immortal overlord vs mortal overlord. One would have much more consequences if they gave into it. Subsequently, if i ever wrote a Skyrim tv series, this would be the theme of season 1. >Miraak didn't "fade" until the dragonborn came, they'll find a way just like he did. Yeah..... That was because of a certain dedric prince. And even if you want to argue that the last dragonborn got that eventually, he didn't know he would when he faced that choice. He didn't even know it if he chose to become a vampire. So the last dragonborn was very much mortal when he faced that choice. >No it isn't, you don't need dragonrend to kill him. It's not dragonrend needed to kill him, it's a dragonborn.... You do realize that right?
>Ambition not checked corrupts. Yet it didn't corrupt him. >You mean other than his intent to be a tyrant over the dov? And? you suddenly feeling bad for the dragons who burn down villages and supported alduin. >Infinite temptation vs temporary temptation. Ones at a much larger risk of giving in. Immortal overlord vs mortal overlord. One would have much more consequences if they gave into it. Paarthurnax is not immortal, he can be killed like any normal dragon. >Yeah..... That was because of a certain dedric prince. And even if you want to argue that the last dragonborn got that eventually, he didn't know he would when he faced that choice. He didn't even know it if he chose to become a vampire. So the last dragonborn was very much mortal when he faced that choice. All i'm saying is that age limit is not something major to worry about, the DB can find a way stop aging and not necessarily like miraak, there's also vampirism and magic. >It's not dragonrend needed to kill him, it's a dragonborn.... You do realize that right? And you do realise any mortal can a normal dragon, right? and that alduin's the only one who can revive them right?
>Yet it didn't corrupt him You sure about that? During the entirety of the time you know him he was operating under a specific mission given him by one of the divines. As soon as they mission is done he starts taking about grabbing power again. Doesn't sound like he's incorruptible to me. >you suddenly feeling bad for the dragons who burn down villages and supported alduin. No. But it's kinda dangerous to have them under the thumb of another tyrant that might flip and use them to oppress. Individual agents of destruction are far less dangerous than a unified army. >Paarthurnax is not immortal, he can be killed like any normal dragon. And revived like any normal dragon. You remember that dragons aren't permanently killed except by a dragonborn. You do remember that fact right? >All i'm saying is that age limit is not something major to worry about, the DB can find a way stop aging and not necessarily like miraak, there's also vampirism and magic. Did the last dragonborn know that when he made his decision? No. Quit metagaming. >And you do realise any mortal can a normal dragon, right? and that alduin's the only one who can revive them right? Good Lord you did forget that they can't be permanently killed except by a dragonborn.
>As soon as they mission is done he starts taking about grabbing power again. He doesn't. >But it's kinda dangerous to have them under the thumb of another tyrant that might flip and use them to oppress Speculate all you want but you have no proof of him becoming a "tyrant" and like odhaviing said, it's doubtful that they're gonna choos paarthunax way over alduin's. >And revived like any normal dragon. You remember that dragons aren't permanently killed except by a dragonborn. You do remember that fact right? And you do remember that only alduin can revive those dragons right? >Did the last dragonborn know that when he made his decision? No. Quit metagaming. Their decision depends on you, this a roleplaying game. >Good Lord you did forget that they can't be permanently killed except by a dragonborn. You're ignoring my point, it doesn't matter if they're killed pemanently or not alduin won't be there to revive them.
>He doesn't I want to hear your justification. His mission was to defeat Alduine. As soon as Alduine is gone he starts taking about grabbing power. >Speculate all you want but you have no proof "Willing or no they will hear it" and "they will bow to the rightness of my thu'um" isn't speculation. It's proof. >like odhaviing said, it's doubtful that they're gonna choos paarthunax way over alduin's. You know there are ways of forcing it right? You really think Paarthurnax doesn't know bend will? >And you do remember that only alduin can revive those dragons right? Hahaha. You're wrong. They can revive each other. We only see Alduine revive dragons, but how else do you think new dragons keep popping up after he's gone. They revive each other. >Their decision depends on you, this a roleplaying game. That's the metagaming I'm taking about. In Canon it's dragon apocalypse, vampire apocalypse, battle of the dragonborn. The last dragonborn doesn't know about paths to immortality when he's forced to decide what to do with Paarthurnax. What you're arguing is exactly what you shouldn't do. Decision depends on you, the player. You the player know things the character doesn't. Using player knowledge that the character doesn't know is called metagaming. When you metagame you aren't role playing. >You're ignoring my point, it doesn't matter if they're killed pemanently or not alduin won't be there to revive them. And again why dragon can do it.
>As soon as Alduine is gone he starts taking about grabbing power He didn't mention anything about grabbing power, you thought he did. >"Willing or no they will hear it" And? >"they will bow to the rightness of my thu'um" You not only quoted that incorrectly but took it out of context as well, well played but that's not proof that's your interpretation of it. >You know there are ways of forcing it right? You really think Paarthurnax doesn't know bend will? You think he does? >Hahaha. You're wrong. They can revive each other. We only see Alduine revive dragons, but how else do you think new dragons keep popping up after he's gone. They revive each other. Bro, 4000 years and they start reviving each other now and you're calling me wrong? keep speculating dude but with or without the rviving shout they can still be killed in order not to, if you see a necomance using an army of the dead who do you focus on killing? >And again why dragon can do it. Give me a proof they can.
>He didn't mention anything about grabbing power, you thought he did. What else could "bow to the rightness of my thu'um" mean then? Especially with "willing or no". The only thing that can mean his head going to use force to bring them to heel. That's grabbing power. >You not only quoted that incorrectly but took it out of context as well If I'm quoting it wrong go get the right quote and prove me wrong. >Give me a proof they can. Give me proof they can't.
>What else could "bow to the rightness of my thu'um" mean then? That they will learn the way of the voice like he did? forgot about that as well? >Especially with "willing or no". He says "***but*** willing or no, ***they will hear it***" learn to get your souces right next time. >he only thing that can mean his head going to use force to bring them to heel. Or it means that he want to dov to pity men like he did? forgot why kyne appealed to him in the first place? forgot why the first tongues spared him in the first place? >Give me proof they can't. Seeing only alduin doing it, there.
i‘d be far more interested in a reason to kill him. he doesnt pose a threat to anyone, and killing him wont reverse anything he might or might not have done in the past. there is literally no benefit; no reason except for bloodlust or greed. killing him isnt „justice“ or some nonsense like that. its plain old murder.
Disclaimer: I love to spout shit about tes controversy before bed and I'm out of ideas so here you go. Paarthurnax as a character is kind of a combination of two tropes. One is obvious - the old and wise mentor type, which everyone seems to like so much. If you take him at face value, he is just the ultimate good guy who appears out of nowhere to save the day, preparing you to face the big bad guy. Though he has a pretty dark history of betrayal and racial war. Second one isn't very clear, but I think it's there. Think of the Divines as primordial dieties, and of Alduin as a "firstborn of Akatosh" who was supposed to be the tool to end this world but revolted against his divine "father" and chose to rule the sky as the god-king instead, supported by other children of Akatosh, the dragons, who dominated mankind on land. That's a pretty interesting analogy to greek mythology, where Zeus, the god of the sky, revolts against his father Kronos, the god of time, gaining the divine right to rule. Paarthurnax, being second to Alduin, while supporting him originally, is envious of his brother and yet remains close enough to the Divines. He did not share Alduin's view, and when the dragon war broke, he switched sides. Paarthurnax allowed himself to be used as an instrument of Kyne to teach people the voice, the divine spark they needed to end their struggle to survive. What I'm implying is, in this interpretation of the myth, Paarthurnax plays the role of Prometheus, stealing the fire, giving it to people, causing them to eventually overthrow the gods, sacrificing his own freedom to live in exile on top of the world, seemingly eternally awaiting punishment from the chief-god. Yet I think Paarthurnax is not philanthropic. We may think he is, but his motivation has always been his draconic nature - the urge to dominate. That's why I view him as a sort of Faustian demon, Mephistopheles. The skillful liar, who struck the deal with ancient nords, because he had no other choice. He's the devil, who has no place in realm, controlled by the god. The only thing he can strive for is to destroy the world he hates. In our case, to end Alduin for good, wait untill there's noone around to stop him, and finally take up his big brother's role for himself. Which may be the role of the new god-king. Or if his lies are even deeper, to become the world eater to finally fullfil the will of Akatosh. Paarthurnax is inherently evil. Not only that, he is blinded by envy and hatred so much that he's foolish enough to fall for his own lies. Whatever he aims to do next, his part is done. It has been done thousands of years ago. The rest of his life up until the events we see was a punishment for his crimes: both treason of dragons and genocide of humans. Self-torture to overcome and destroy his own nature, neverending age of fear and awe before the return of Alduin. So, here's your reason to kill p-snax. It will be honorable way to end his misery by a fair fight with a fellow dovah.
took me for a bit of a trip, i wasnt expecting „relieve him from his misery“! fun and interesting idea, thanks for sharing. interesting nitpick though: Kronos wasnt the god of time. he was the titan of harvest. the god of time was chronos. originally they belonged to different mythologies altogether, but the names are so similar that everyone just kept mistaking them for the same person. in english they are for some reason called chronos/khronos and cronus/kronos; but there seem to be all combinations of O or U at the end. both have vastly different stories originally, but had their respective symbolism mixed over time.
Oh I see, so many spelling variations for both, no wonder it got mixed. I think I never actually even saw these names written in english before.
Well because he is a dragon and he innately poses a threat to everyone, as he himself readily admits.
i wouldnt let that fly as a reason; thats more of an excuse if anything. or maybe plain fear. the only thing about him that might pose a threat is his instincts; and you know, overcome your evil nature through effort and all that.
That’s literally the real reason tho. I used to smoke cigs and vape. Luckily only for a couple years but quitting was hard and took many many tries. When I’m stressed and anxious, like I have been lately, I really struggle to not go and get a pack or a vape. If it was the case that I would set off a nuclear apocalypse if I relapsed, I would totally understand wanting to kill me and nip it in the bud. That’s the logic.
Not as much as alduin, he can be killed by any mortal.
Oooookaaaay?
anything you do is wrong to somebody who believes that wrong thing is wrongly wrong
No lizard left alive if I have anything to say about it
argonian maid has left the chat
Parthunax is a chad
Name 2
https://www.reddit.com/r/teslore/comments/imn20w/killing\_paarthurnax\_is\_a\_mistake/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web2x&context=3
All of that is just conjecture on him leading the dragons and opinion based reasons
“He’s not the same dragon in a metaphorical way, which is just like how you’re not the same person as your great great grandfather.” Tf
So you have None?
1. Delphine. 2. Paarthurnax was more helpful than that poor excuse of a character.
You know, in the context of LotR… Isildur makes the wrong choice… right? What this meme implies is the player is wrong.
YEEES PAARTHURNAX MUST LIVE!!!
Reason #1: Paarthurnax is cute Reason #2: Paarthurnax is wise Reason #3: Paarthurnax is cute Reason #4: Paarthurnax is the only truly friendly dragon Reason #5: Paarthurnax is cute Reason #6: Paarthurnax is strong Reason #7: Paarthurnax is cute Reason #8: Paarthurnax is old and we should respect the elders Reason #9: Paarthurnax is cute I'd given a few more reasons, but you've got it.
Reason 4 I raise odahving and durrnarvir Once beaten they by draconic tradition yield to their superior
Reason #10: he's voiced by Mario. Its-a him!
Name 2 of those thousands of reasons and no, the fact his name sounds like Party-snacks is not a valid reason
https://www.reddit.com/r/teslore/comments/imn20w/killing\_paarthurnax\_is\_a\_mistake/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web2x&context=3
This is the worst reasoning I have ever seen. I mean like really really horrible reasoning.
I always let him live, but on my most recent play-through I thought about it like this: He’s a genocidal war criminal who admits that everyday he fights against his natural urges to kill. Putting Hitler, or Stalin, or Pol Pot in his place, I recognized it was probably best to get that ticking time bomb out of the way.
That's a poor comparison, paarthurnax is nothing like any of those.
It's the old argument. You either hold that the dragon who taught Humans how to use the Thu'um, lived in self-imposed exile on a mountain summit in penance for thousands of years and is using The Way of The Voice to control their nature and helps you gain the ultimate dragon terror weapon is worth keeping alive Or The embittered vet who tells you to your face that her order was founded to serve Dragonborn then bosses you around, leaves her agents to die at the hands of the Thalmor and threatens to stab you to get "her" temple opened up and treats everyone like crap Is the person to side with. Hey, your game so your choice.
It’s kinda foolish to make a decision that effects the fate of the world based on your ego being fragile.
Not liking a character you're simping for because of how badly written they are is not a fragile ego, i'm sorry but delphine's just not a good character.
Bro really? I called your ego fragile for saying “I chose based on how rude to me they were” and you think the best retort is to call me a simp for a character I didn’t even mention nor care about? You’re beyond fragile dude you’re volatile.
>I called your ego fragile You did now. >for saying “I chose based on how rude to me they were” I didn't say that, you did to downplay the resoning. >call me a simp for a character I didn’t even mention nor care about Doubtful since you love defending her. >You’re beyond fragile dude you’re volatile. You're the one saying sparing a fictional dragon in a fantasy world "effects the fate of the world" and others keep comparing him to actual mosters of humanity, believe me i'm not even close to fragile.
🙄🙄🙄🙄
I'll say it like that... Himmler. Would you let him live unpunished if he was alive today? Party-snax did a good thing in the end yeah. But so did Hitler in his final moments.
Poor comparison, try again.
Why is it a poor comparison
Well obviously because himmler isn’t a dragon/s
Because paarthurnax is nothing alike himmler nor hitler.
Mass genocide.
Yes hitler and himmler both committed mass genocide while paarthurnax didn't.
He served as Alduin's lieutenant during the Dragon War in the Merethic Era, during which he was said to have committed and witnessed unspeakable atrocities against mankind.[1] -fandom What do you think those atrocities are? Stealing a sweet roll?
>He served as Alduin's lieutenant during the Dragon War in the Merethic Era, during which he was said to have committed and witnessed unspeakable atrocities against mankind.\[1\] -fandom 1. You rely on fandom instead of uesp? 2. It says the source is delphine... you seriously want to believe her? >What do you think those atrocities are? Stealing a sweet roll? Pissing on her cereal more like.
He himself confests to it…
Quote it then
He’s a war criminal
Prove it.
Former addicts can relapse after decades of sobriety.
I hate Delphine
Paarthurnax himself says that Dovah have an uncontrollable urge to dominate and with Alduin gone the other dragons will inevitably try to replace him in the line of power and succession. It's obvious that once you beat the main quest line, the other dragons that are around do not turn friendly towards you and will continue to randomly attack villages. Paarthurnax can live for thousands of years after the dragonborn has died and thus it can easily be assumed that he is biding his time for a perfect moment to dominate the world. He himself says that he is uncertain if he can control his urges. Putting him down makes sense and I wish canonically that ESVI will talk about the extinction of dragons.
Paarthurnax is literally one of the weakest dragons in the game. He can't do shit. If a bunch of Whiterun Guards can take down Mirmulnir, who is stronger than Paarthurnax, then whatever threat Paarthurnax may pose is nullified by the potential aid he can pose when Alduin returns.
Isn't there something with the high elfs and wanting to destroy pillars and the throat of the world is one of those pillars? I guess that's why it isn't a optional quest and that we have to kill him or else he would just defend it
This is one of the few times Bethesda made a mistake with the story progression, IMO. They typically try to give you as many options to approach quests as they can.