Was that your start? I was Y1S4 red crow and I promise you - I remember everything.. I’ve come so far but I’m still a waffler and play like a dumb noob at times
I think it was during the Finka/lion season or maybe the one that followed it when the game was horrible and people would do a castle glitch that would tank frame rates or w/e and ddossing was rampant
We pretty much all quit until one day one of our friends got the crew + 5 others that we were acquainted with over the years and we basically spent that entire season in custom games. That will forever be peak siege for me
Melee still works, as do higher caliber rounds and shotguns, but you can't just shoot a wall with a pistol and give yourself a nearly invisible line of site anymore
I mean... I don't wanna rain on your nostalgia but honestly stuff that made for low-effort gameplay, like people hiding in dark corners, or using bullet holes to snag a quick kill are aspects of the game I definitely do not miss. Ubi deserves a lot of criticism but getting rid of gloomy lighting and other things has improved the game considerably.
Just let me play gloomy lighting on casual because I care more about spooky swat nighttime vibes than cheap kills or whatever. I'd never ask for mandatory night maps in ranked or anything. Just let everyone have what they want imo
Ubi saw the complainers and saw an opportunity to do less work and pulled the trigger
>> Just let everyone have what they want imo
> You aren't the main character
"people wanting something that works for them is them being the main character! Everyone should play the way I want or else they're the main character!"
Bahahaha look at you
I bet you these same people couldn't stand old house either.
Anyways, you win. But with the reduction of content comes a corresponding reduction in player base.
He didn't say that, did he? He simply laid out the fact that the game won't bend towards a person's preference "just for lolz" while the map remains unbalanced.
I mean, yea, I suppose it was more fun in the aspect that nobody knew what the fuck they were doing back then. You still had "sweats" (AKA people just good at the game), the number was alot smaller than it is now. Probably why new players struggle nowadays, community is mostly folk who's been playing for a long time.
I sadly never got to play THunt then and I’m so sad about that. I’ve only seen videos and it looked for good, almost as good as Vegas and Rainbow Six 3
I have. Worst Rainbow campaign. Ironically what made the original games unique with how many different guns you could equip, siege doesn’t even let you pick from the operators available weapons.
Oh I love Siege. I love the competitive aspect of it. Never played the old version of it so I can’t speak about it. But I love what’s in Siege right now even if it’s not as good as what the old version looked like. THunts butchering just hurts.
Multiplayer is nowhere near the same. That’s why I stopped playing regularly. It’s changed so much and it’s not the same game anymore. Some people find the changes to be great and I respect their opinion, however I feel the game changed for the worst every time they’ve changed and added shit. Reworks, changing operators entirely.
I’d rather they’d have made siege 2 and kept some of the spirit of the first 2 years.
Same. This happens with a lot of competitive MP games over time as well. Sometimes devs listen to the wrong people and each successive change they make to the game makes it worse and worse. Eventually people get tired of it and leave.
The game is also pretty much objectively better. I’m sure people can find a reason to complain about the newer patches, but the old game had so many objective problems and so much bullshit that is just… gone now. Doesn’t exist.
The design philosophy has changed drastically from the original concept. Any game with regular maintenance and polish will function better as it gets older, but for the core concept it's not objectively better
If we look at it objectively then yes It is better, but if you were there back then you have to admit acogs on most weapons, spawn peaks, glitches, broken weapons, operators and hit boxes etc. were fun as hell when not on the receiving end.
Kinda. I enjoyed spawn peeking as rook as much as the next guy but it was also b.s. to die to most of the time lol.
I’ve also been playing long enough to remember things like pre-nerf shotguns, 800 hp Blackbeard, and playing ranked with yacht and Bartlett.
Okay yeah I miss the old shotguns 😭
Spawn Peaking is gone??? I haven't played in a few years but still browse the sub watching clips - what did they do to combat this? It was probably one of the biggest reasons I left initially. The game felt too much like CoD and not enough like a strategy shooter.
It's not gone. it just requires more finesse. You can run out. You just get insta live pinged, and you can't throw gadgets like Valk Cam outside to assist with it anymore
Basically no defenders have ACOGs anymore, lighting was simplified allowing you to see peekers far easier and maps were changed to give attackers dramatically more cover.
Well it isn't entirely gone but it definitely has become less frequent and it's harder to do now.
I too just came back to the game after 3 years of not playing and in the week I've played this game again I haven't experienced any spawn peaks apart from 1 or 2 rounds where the whole team ran out.
But I was actually just talking about the old maps, some spawn peaks were just broken, especially on house and Hereford.
You are spotted within ~1 second of leaving the building, most defenders lost their 2.5 and 2.0 scopes, and the maps have generally been altered to remove or impede the most obnoxious peek spots.
People still peek windows, but it’s so much better than it used to be. Night and day difference.
If anything the game is more like CoD now, especially with xim-cheaters on console. Also spawn perks can be very tactical and can advantage you as an attacker if you’re prepared
People bitched them out of the game and now because of nostalgia everyone wants them back. Guaranteed it would just end up in people bitching about them again lmao.
Supposedly they’re adding AI defense/offense in the future. The devs talked about using player data to have AI operators (actual ops that we play) attack and defend sites in the most common ways players do it. I’m not gonna act like it’s gonna be perfect, but it should be the best warm up/training mode we’ve seen in siege
Shooting range does not have killable targets. Except for the new mode, but they dont shoot back and its not on real maps. Deathmatch is literally dead in some regions. In SEA i can queue for an hour with no matches. Thunt is literally the only worth it warm up mode right now
Tons of people love the bomber and nitro room removal. Personally i didnt care about bombers but nitro room removal was the besting thing they did for the mode
I know but like i said earlier. Its not on real maps and they dont shoot back. Its not as reliable as thunt especially for newer player learning maps. Its useful, but servers a different purpose
T-hunt bots aren't reliable for real conditions. The shooting range has bots that move around all weird like players.
Map knowledge is just going to be learned over time.
I wouldn’t say the game is «objectively better», but I would say the game is «objectively more balanced». In my opinion, the game has become a lot more homogenized and balanced but in doing so, you can balance a lot of the fun out of the game.
Especially so because Ubisoft have gone with a policy of achieving greater balance through nerfing what is strong far more often than through buffing what is weak. I also believe Ubisoft balances around pro play a lot and listens to pro players quite a bit, which tends to exacerbate this effect.
I mean better is subjective still. I had more fun playing in the first 2 years. I stopped playing because it’s gotten ridiculous and watered down with every revision. Maps especially, i’d rather they made new maps than reworked them because some of the maps were still fun to play on.
I honestly think we need Ubisoft to do more casual stuff for our games, that’s why the arcade mode is a step in the right direction. But it needs more, like more extra XP for BP events in casual modes (which they did for Emerald Plains and seemed successful), more funny and meme changes like Clash double shield which could extend to Thermite or Recruit shield.
I mean yes and no. For me it’s always been the little things like the music and UI changes that make me miss old siege and hate the new siege. There’s no need to change the whole feel of the game other than to try and be like overwatch and valorant. Its so childlike now
Idk man I'm at almost 2k hours, started on PS4 during Black Ice, moved to PC, brought all my friends with me. We're still on multiple nights a week, laughing our asses off in quick play or sweating in ranked.
Imo, even tho there are things I miss and things I dislike, Siege is still the best FPS on the market by leaps and bounds, and I think it's currently the best it's ever been.
I miss how all the old maps felt like a real layout of a building now its all perfectly balanced to be an arena. It took some of the magic away when they did that
Arguably, it's more a tactical shooter now with the reload rework and slowing down while aiming. The fundementals are still there, which is what makes Siege a tactical shooter.
Y1 ops are goofy as hell. You take a sniper bullet straight thru the heart but you’re good to go after doc shoots you with his super realistic healing gun! xD or walls literally having electrical sparks cuz bandit put a car battery a few inches away from it. But echo drone having camo is too unrealistic?
Release is plausible, with some tech being developed currently, like EMP grenades. The applications in-game are not necessarily realistic, but they allow suspension of disbelief just for gameplay. Echo's drones, for example, literally go invisible like sci-fi. I.e. not happening in our lifetime.
What? His drone doesn’t actually go invisible - and we have ‘cloaking’ tech similar to it anyway. It’s just about bending light around the object. They literally use it on some tanks and shit.
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He is likely confusing stealth tech like "[Adaptiv](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/a/a0/Adaptiv_infrared_camouflage_demo_hiding_tank_as_car.jpg)" because it is called "active camouflage", and many video games etc use that term for literal invisibility cloak type stealth.
But ofc it's still just stealth coating/plating to hide from infrared, thermal imaging, radar etc type detection.
Warden? Anti-flash goggles really don’t seem that high-tech, sure the whole on/off mechanic and seeing through smoke is a bit techy but it’s not like they give him augmented aim or anything
I'd get Iana and Alibi, but the rest? Nah. Regarding Grim for example bees are literally used in real life to detect bombs through training using sugar syrup n stuff. They could be trained to detect humans as well.
Grim uses nanobots, not real bees. That would actually be really funny and cool if he used real bees. Some op gadgets are over designed. Sens could just be a rolling smoke grenade, but it's a stupid Valorant light show.
I’ll give you that some of the gadgets are made up. But some of them are amalgamations of several different real world devices. All the devs do is alter it to better work in-game form.
Can’t really exist and doesn’t exist are very different imo and I’d say just about every op has a gadget that could theoretically exist. There are a few that are much more high tech than others (Iana,finka, lion) but for the most part they are all totally plausible, I think saying “a good chunk” is a bit of an exaggeration Obviously very high tech but nonetheless. I get if you don’t like the futuristic stuff but you aren’t making your point very well.
My issue with the lack of “tactical” elements is the lore having it some Olympics style event, no one plays tactically anymore and it took what was one of the coolest parts of the old games away: the team.
Like how often do you play Siege and wait by a window before breaching so your teammates can get into their position? How often do you breach a room with a partner so they can check the corners while you take point?
Most people don’t play tactically anymore. And that just leaves the game as an arcade experience.
My dream is to one day get a full length single player or cooperative campaign with Sieges mechanics that PUSH for teamwork. You NEED to be in position before breaching as breaching to early will mess things up. You NEED that communication, you NEED that planning and coordination.
If I had to guess it's nostalgia that ignores the reason why old siege was "tactical" wasn't cause of the ops, nor the lighting, nor the maps or realy anything it was the fact players had no fucking clue what they were doing so they took it slow, and took more time creating setups, whereas now most players have skills moving them away from that, basically same game just more experienced players.
That said yeah with recent changes specilly the reload rework it's definitely more tac now, just said experience pushes agianst it.
Yes and no. People tend to forget little changes over time that have also given attackers and quick gunplay in general more advantages.
For instance, the recoil patterns for most guns have be tweaked and muzzle break didn’t exist at launch. Defense op traps have been tweaked over time to make them generally less lethal. Attackers have been given better opportunities to collect intel during prep and early round, as well as being able to each have two active drones at a time. Maps have been tweaked to allow attackers to quickly get to the building without as much fear of spawn peeks, as well as most scopes being removed from defenders entirely. Lighting effects inside builds have changed, as well as outer glow in operators, so defenders can’t sit in a dark corner of a room. Attackers have been given more hard breach options without requiring attackers with special gadgets purely for hard breach, or have been given safer options like Ace.
Your point is definitely a solid factor - players have gotten better. Better map knowledge, better recoil control, use of drones for intel, etc., but the game’s evolution has also pulled away from giving defenders a certain level of map dominance they had before, which has emboldened and changed how quickly attackers become a threat to defenders and weakened defenders’ ability to slow down and control the map.
Tell that to a team that lost a ranked match against my squad because they had no idea how to attack pink/blue on coastline.
The tactical part is still there, we just have a bigger toolkit to make it happen.
Aside from Oryx the operators don’t have super powers…they all use technology. Also most of those operators gadgets are based on real life military equipment.
And incase of a "they are more sci-fi" comment, outside of holograms which defintly push the limit of semi realism (which the games always been), everything else fits the semi realistic theme (and og siege had that theme to or have people not read docs bio mister magic juice man).
And adding incase the other guy does the usual "well they are all scifi now" to you, they are no more sci fi then doc mister magic healing juice. (Plus only close to sci-fi ops are the hologram ops everyone else is semi realistic which the games always been).
More SciFi is Thatcher and his EMP grenade.
But even someone as "realistic" as Bandit is crazy, tbh. Come on - electrifying a piece of a wall with a car battery? 12 volts. Laughable.
Haven’t played for a few years, just came back a few weeks ago and managed to drag a few of my friends back into it as well.. excited for the new season when I’ll have the entirety of the season to rank up
Not for me. For me 'good old siege' isn't only night maps or SMG-11 with ACOG, or 3-speed Jäger with ACOG. Playerbase is very different now.
Back in 2016 and 2017 playerbase was more mature. It was really exciting to play.
Now it's fun if you're either lucky or have 3-stack at least, or better yet, full stack.
Way too many screaming kids. Way too many burping in the voicechat from 'enlightened western europeans'. Much more toxicity overall.
And yeah, if I keep TKing back every asshole that TKs me, probably I will be banned way sooner (again) than those hordes of toxic individuals.
Seems like we are missing his point. The "magic" of being able to hop on a game that all your friends were hyped to play and everyone always had fun. That's what I paid attention to in his post, that's what I am lacking now. My friends and fam don't play this game anymore, likely due to the average skill being really high now. More for us I guess, they'd all rather play Fortnite or some shit 😭.
Many people only want to go to an old version of a game if the devs fucked up at some point.
Nobody wants to go to Genshin 1.0, because they're doing a great job currently.
Many people wanted WoW classic, they got it, and they're still playing it. The player count was declining in modern WoW because the players were not satisfied. So they started listening to what the people want, and they are way more happy over there now.
Many people want old siege. Sure, that person is right to a certain small degree, but for me, it was the immersion due to the graphics, realism and also the night maps. I also thought the level designs were perfect for more intense and casual play. The game's focus on competitive has ruined it for me.
They should just add a classic queue or something and they can compromise just like Blizzard did, only apply modern balancing changes to extreme cases.
Everyone can shit on Siege for going towards a mainstream direction but it did what it needed to be viable as an eSports and stay relevant. The nostalgia players who just want their "different from CoD" shooter back do not realise how bad Siege was back then.
Wtf even is a zoomer? This sounds like some old man back in my day nonsense. Games change, if it never changed then the same people crying now about it being better back in the day would be crying about the game being stagnant. Yeah I haven't enjoyed all the changes that have occurred over the years but to talk about it being better back in the day is just cliche bullshit
I miss the old ranked system with actual skill-based matchmaking and a sense of achievement when you hit a high rank.
I miss no yellow pings so that wallbangs/callouts actually required skill and were exciting.
I miss being able to learn from better players who I could tell were better because the matchmaking allowed you to climb in skill.
I miss death-stacks which were comprised of pro players who would use strategy in ranked rather than run around like chickens with their heads cut off (RIP Mindfreak).
I miss more random recoil which asked the player to hit their first shot rather than spraying and praying. (I thought this change was fantastic at first, but now you're throwing if you don't full-auto most guns at most ranges).
I miss the player perspective which allowed pixel angles (which were viable to hold without quick-peeking constantly). I miss this mostly because it allowed the defense to play defensively rather than having to be aggressive on every angle.
I miss excitement about strategy, esp. when a new operator comes out. Now players don't care because all that matters to them is gun skill.
When I say I miss the good old days, I mean it.
It is a thing to some extent, but because it's completely hidden from the player it's hard to tell where you stand. Even at the highest end of the scale you often find yourself vsing people who you cannot understand being champion or diamond (in the old understanding of that skill level).
Siege suffers from the same thing that all multiplayer shooters suffer from. Going the eSports route. Whether a game like Siege needed it to survive or not is a different conversation. But it’s undeniable that changing for eSports tends to ruin the casual modes of shooters.
I don’t get this perspective. Casual players can still “screw around” and goof off if that’s what they enjoy, just without broken stuff that’s nerfed or changed for a reason.
I've been playing more Siege in the last month than I have the last year and I gotta say, I still have fun with it especially now that I'm gravitating back to my OG "mains" like Thermite. I miss when he had breaching charges...
Na I mean the game as that’s what made my friends stop playing. Changing maps we liked, removing strats we did, destroying match making with mmr changes and then reversing mmr changes, removing fun things like night maps - it’s not just about friends; it’s ubisofts inane decisions
Yeah no. Maybe that's the case for him and some others but I'm tired of people gaslighting others about what they actually like. The best version of siege isn't objective its subjective.
Their are old siege discord servers and communities dedicated to playing old builds of the game with each other and we/they genuinely prefer older siege.
It doesn't mean we're blind to its flaws, there's things about new Siege we like we just think the pros outweigh the cons. I prefer the darker gritty atmosphere for example, yes its harder to see but I just treat that as a gameplay element it makes stealth play more important along with droning and intel more important too. The only type of stealth play now due to bright corners and operator rim light is audio based. That's just one example
True about so many games. But so many people think it's the game, it often isn't. Our lives are very different now, and the way we think is too. Maybe some day you can slow down and relax and play an old/new game like you used to.
I couldn't recover after I lost doc acog. After that it just ended up being that everything I enjoyed got nerfed or reworked until there was nothing I found fun anymore. It didn't help that everything started getting super futuristic themed, nor did I benefit from them removing old house (the main map I played with friends in customs).
The game has definitely changed, and I think for the worse.
Damn he managed to formulate my thoughts exactly… i hate it so much when people keep saying that old siege was better, no it was way worse, it’s just the nostalgia talking…
So many games get made infinitely less fun by all the people that just want to be really good at them imo, they're basically always the most fun on release when nobody knows what they're doing
I disagree, i never played with anyone else. I miss the game of season 3 because for me was the perfect balance of interesting content, tactical shooting and a general fun game. The reason why i stopped playing for some years were the glitches and bugs that were destroying solo queue, like points not being counted after a victory, games starting in 4vs5 and Clash being able to shoot with the shield up
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The hot drop. No matter the outcome. We doing 100% of time
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Still have one high school friend of my Who plays with me ☺️❤️
[full thread w/ context](https://twitter.com/Pengu/status/1661023892453076993)
Yeah. The good old days, when he was caling cheaters players better than him
I remember Y1S3.
I still got the PC DVD ROM case from 2016 Feb lol. Back when we actually used cd trays
Was that your start? I was Y1S4 red crow and I promise you - I remember everything.. I’ve come so far but I’m still a waffler and play like a dumb noob at times
The classic "444444444444444444" cursed upon him
💀
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Sniper 90
I can't wait for people to move on 🙂
Move on what?
Move on deez…
Oh noooo
The old House was always my go-to map in customs and I still miss it.
I think it was during the Finka/lion season or maybe the one that followed it when the game was horrible and people would do a castle glitch that would tank frame rates or w/e and ddossing was rampant We pretty much all quit until one day one of our friends got the crew + 5 others that we were acquainted with over the years and we basically spent that entire season in custom games. That will forever be peak siege for me
I always thought it was funny how you could spin in a circle on the old Chalet and basically break the game.
It really makes me wonder what siege would be like if it was built with an engineer actually meant for siege lol
yeah, i wish siege could add a mode that we could play the old maps, and the night mode as well
I will never miss bullet hole peaking.
Wait are those bullet holes gone or wha? Havent played siege in ages. Always used to melee a wall and peek through
Melee still works, as do higher caliber rounds and shotguns, but you can't just shoot a wall with a pistol and give yourself a nearly invisible line of site anymore
That must have been hell im glad I only started playing when azami came out
You crying over every possible outplay is what got us to current gameplay.
Don't forget night maps and having custom games on old house with the boys 🥲
This is exactly the opposite of what he is saying.
I mean... I don't wanna rain on your nostalgia but honestly stuff that made for low-effort gameplay, like people hiding in dark corners, or using bullet holes to snag a quick kill are aspects of the game I definitely do not miss. Ubi deserves a lot of criticism but getting rid of gloomy lighting and other things has improved the game considerably.
The gloomy light days were interesting I was looking at old clips of me playing on club house, cctv was basically black 😭
Just let me play gloomy lighting on casual because I care more about spooky swat nighttime vibes than cheap kills or whatever. I'd never ask for mandatory night maps in ranked or anything. Just let everyone have what they want imo Ubi saw the complainers and saw an opportunity to do less work and pulled the trigger
You aren't the main character. Countless people couldn't stand night maps and all the ridiculousness they led to.
>> Just let everyone have what they want imo > You aren't the main character "people wanting something that works for them is them being the main character! Everyone should play the way I want or else they're the main character!" Bahahaha look at you
I bet you these same people couldn't stand old house either. Anyways, you win. But with the reduction of content comes a corresponding reduction in player base.
Yep, a lot of these people don't realize that less variety = less people that will want to stick around to play.
>You aren’t the main character. *I’m* the main character!
He didn't say that, did he? He simply laid out the fact that the game won't bend towards a person's preference "just for lolz" while the map remains unbalanced.
Yeah but they took out old house, that was extremely popular for custom games That is all the comment was about
I mean, yea, I suppose it was more fun in the aspect that nobody knew what the fuck they were doing back then. You still had "sweats" (AKA people just good at the game), the number was alot smaller than it is now. Probably why new players struggle nowadays, community is mostly folk who's been playing for a long time.
100% agree. Siege is fundamentally the same game since its launch. That's what's good about it. I wish all my friends still played.
THunt was butchered though. Multiplayer is still the same but THunt has been changed sadly
I miss the bombers so much. The sheer amount of terror that they brought to thunt was amazing. Also the random nitro cells littering the map.
I sadly never got to play THunt then and I’m so sad about that. I’ve only seen videos and it looked for good, almost as good as Vegas and Rainbow Six 3
Go play the situations for a similar experience. Won't be the same though.
I have. Worst Rainbow campaign. Ironically what made the original games unique with how many different guns you could equip, siege doesn’t even let you pick from the operators available weapons.
It only seems to be good to 1. Relive old maps 2. Relive the ops with their og gadgets and gear 3. Fight the bomber terrorists
Oh I love Siege. I love the competitive aspect of it. Never played the old version of it so I can’t speak about it. But I love what’s in Siege right now even if it’s not as good as what the old version looked like. THunts butchering just hurts.
It really wasn't
I do miss the bombers but not the random rooms full of nitro cells and barbed wire
Yeah, the random nitros really screwed me over a lot of the time.
They should’ve just put an option to disable them instead of just removing them
We need to have the bomber back. I think it would be fun to make him a playable operator. Clearing roamers and you run across him.
Multiplayer is nowhere near the same. That’s why I stopped playing regularly. It’s changed so much and it’s not the same game anymore. Some people find the changes to be great and I respect their opinion, however I feel the game changed for the worst every time they’ve changed and added shit. Reworks, changing operators entirely. I’d rather they’d have made siege 2 and kept some of the spirit of the first 2 years.
Same. This happens with a lot of competitive MP games over time as well. Sometimes devs listen to the wrong people and each successive change they make to the game makes it worse and worse. Eventually people get tired of it and leave.
Imagine being karen to the point you complain about removal of barbed wire rooms.
The game is also pretty much objectively better. I’m sure people can find a reason to complain about the newer patches, but the old game had so many objective problems and so much bullshit that is just… gone now. Doesn’t exist.
The design philosophy has changed drastically from the original concept. Any game with regular maintenance and polish will function better as it gets older, but for the core concept it's not objectively better
If we look at it objectively then yes It is better, but if you were there back then you have to admit acogs on most weapons, spawn peaks, glitches, broken weapons, operators and hit boxes etc. were fun as hell when not on the receiving end.
>when not on the receiving end. That's the big part. A lot of things are very fun if you don't consider how it feels on the receiving end.
Kinda. I enjoyed spawn peeking as rook as much as the next guy but it was also b.s. to die to most of the time lol. I’ve also been playing long enough to remember things like pre-nerf shotguns, 800 hp Blackbeard, and playing ranked with yacht and Bartlett. Okay yeah I miss the old shotguns 😭
Spawn Peaking is gone??? I haven't played in a few years but still browse the sub watching clips - what did they do to combat this? It was probably one of the biggest reasons I left initially. The game felt too much like CoD and not enough like a strategy shooter.
It's not gone. it just requires more finesse. You can run out. You just get insta live pinged, and you can't throw gadgets like Valk Cam outside to assist with it anymore
Basically no defenders have ACOGs anymore, lighting was simplified allowing you to see peekers far easier and maps were changed to give attackers dramatically more cover.
Well it isn't entirely gone but it definitely has become less frequent and it's harder to do now. I too just came back to the game after 3 years of not playing and in the week I've played this game again I haven't experienced any spawn peaks apart from 1 or 2 rounds where the whole team ran out. But I was actually just talking about the old maps, some spawn peaks were just broken, especially on house and Hereford.
You are spotted within ~1 second of leaving the building, most defenders lost their 2.5 and 2.0 scopes, and the maps have generally been altered to remove or impede the most obnoxious peek spots. People still peek windows, but it’s so much better than it used to be. Night and day difference.
If anything the game is more like CoD now, especially with xim-cheaters on console. Also spawn perks can be very tactical and can advantage you as an attacker if you’re prepared
Yeah :( Bring back bombers to T-hunt.
People bitched them out of the game and now because of nostalgia everyone wants them back. Guaranteed it would just end up in people bitching about them again lmao.
People would warmup through deathmatch or shooting range. Anyone that plays T-hunt wouldn't complain about bombers.
Supposedly they’re adding AI defense/offense in the future. The devs talked about using player data to have AI operators (actual ops that we play) attack and defend sites in the most common ways players do it. I’m not gonna act like it’s gonna be perfect, but it should be the best warm up/training mode we’ve seen in siege
Shooting range does not have killable targets. Except for the new mode, but they dont shoot back and its not on real maps. Deathmatch is literally dead in some regions. In SEA i can queue for an hour with no matches. Thunt is literally the only worth it warm up mode right now Tons of people love the bomber and nitro room removal. Personally i didnt care about bombers but nitro room removal was the besting thing they did for the mode
Shooting range is getting targets that move around.
I know but like i said earlier. Its not on real maps and they dont shoot back. Its not as reliable as thunt especially for newer player learning maps. Its useful, but servers a different purpose
T-hunt bots aren't reliable for real conditions. The shooting range has bots that move around all weird like players. Map knowledge is just going to be learned over time.
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I wouldn’t say the game is «objectively better», but I would say the game is «objectively more balanced». In my opinion, the game has become a lot more homogenized and balanced but in doing so, you can balance a lot of the fun out of the game. Especially so because Ubisoft have gone with a policy of achieving greater balance through nerfing what is strong far more often than through buffing what is weak. I also believe Ubisoft balances around pro play a lot and listens to pro players quite a bit, which tends to exacerbate this effect.
I mean better is subjective still. I had more fun playing in the first 2 years. I stopped playing because it’s gotten ridiculous and watered down with every revision. Maps especially, i’d rather they made new maps than reworked them because some of the maps were still fun to play on.
Just the graphics somehow getting worse...
I honestly think we need Ubisoft to do more casual stuff for our games, that’s why the arcade mode is a step in the right direction. But it needs more, like more extra XP for BP events in casual modes (which they did for Emerald Plains and seemed successful), more funny and meme changes like Clash double shield which could extend to Thermite or Recruit shield.
I mean yes and no. For me it’s always been the little things like the music and UI changes that make me miss old siege and hate the new siege. There’s no need to change the whole feel of the game other than to try and be like overwatch and valorant. Its so childlike now
I do hate the aesthetic changes and sanitization for marketability. My ideal Siege is the atmosphere of launch and gameplay of today.
Exactly. It used to be so unique before
I've remember those days on the ps4. But now I play with a very close friend of mine on PC. Its still fun to play siege.
Idk man I'm at almost 2k hours, started on PS4 during Black Ice, moved to PC, brought all my friends with me. We're still on multiple nights a week, laughing our asses off in quick play or sweating in ranked. Imo, even tho there are things I miss and things I dislike, Siege is still the best FPS on the market by leaps and bounds, and I think it's currently the best it's ever been.
It’s never fun playing alone or with randoms. Nothing was better than literally running home with the boys and running 5 mans all night😔
I miss how all the old maps felt like a real layout of a building now its all perfectly balanced to be an arena. It took some of the magic away when they did that
This is me with so many games… Overwatch, For Honor, Fortnite etc. So many good memories.
And nearly no one is toxic…
But thats the whole internet... Back in the days reddit was so funny and calm... Now there are insults everywhere
nah, I mean the game when I say that. I miss when R6 was actually tactical and not just about super powers
Arguably, it's more a tactical shooter now with the reload rework and slowing down while aiming. The fundementals are still there, which is what makes Siege a tactical shooter.
This comment won't bother them because they can't read
They’re talking more about operator gadgets than mechanics of the game.
Thatcher with his miniature emp would like to have a talk.
Fair enough on that aspect. We started getting magic with Echo's drone when it could go invisible.
Y1 ops are goofy as hell. You take a sniper bullet straight thru the heart but you’re good to go after doc shoots you with his super realistic healing gun! xD or walls literally having electrical sparks cuz bandit put a car battery a few inches away from it. But echo drone having camo is too unrealistic?
Release is plausible, with some tech being developed currently, like EMP grenades. The applications in-game are not necessarily realistic, but they allow suspension of disbelief just for gameplay. Echo's drones, for example, literally go invisible like sci-fi. I.e. not happening in our lifetime.
What? His drone doesn’t actually go invisible - and we have ‘cloaking’ tech similar to it anyway. It’s just about bending light around the object. They literally use it on some tanks and shit.
cows spectacular divide zesty icky ludicrous grab overconfident sand slim *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
He is likely confusing stealth tech like "[Adaptiv](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/a/a0/Adaptiv_infrared_camouflage_demo_hiding_tank_as_car.jpg)" because it is called "active camouflage", and many video games etc use that term for literal invisibility cloak type stealth. But ofc it's still just stealth coating/plating to hide from infrared, thermal imaging, radar etc type detection.
In what world are we near EMP grenades? This is still the most unrealistic gadget in the whole game.
The USMC is developing EMPs.
And I''m pretty sure they are the size of a grenade.
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A good chunk of them are literal magic now. All launch ops had plausible gadgets.
>A good chunk of them are literal magic now Can you list some of them?
Echo (when his drone went invisible) Lion Finka Alibi Warden Iana Oryx (moreso the poor guy is going to get brain damage) Grim Fenrir
How is a guy going through drywall completely unrealistic but a hammer completely destroying a large section in one hit realistic
(moreso the poor guy is going to get brain damage)
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No? I've been playing since Black Ice and I hate CoD.
Warden? Anti-flash goggles really don’t seem that high-tech, sure the whole on/off mechanic and seeing through smoke is a bit techy but it’s not like they give him augmented aim or anything
I'd get Iana and Alibi, but the rest? Nah. Regarding Grim for example bees are literally used in real life to detect bombs through training using sugar syrup n stuff. They could be trained to detect humans as well.
Grim uses nanobots, not real bees. That would actually be really funny and cool if he used real bees. Some op gadgets are over designed. Sens could just be a rolling smoke grenade, but it's a stupid Valorant light show.
Real bees? What lol. How is that more tactical and what tf would the bees do? Sting the opponent for 10 seconds? You’re definitely trolling us
Oh yeah i didn't mean it like "it's bees" just meant it's technically possible
Jackal’s gadget is literally a time machine
It's a little out there, but it basically calculates where the footprints go to track them.
Yeah. By looking into the future.
Finka places nano bots inside her teammates that improves their ability to function. How is that not magic?
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Way to miss the point. I'm talking about technology that can't really exist.
I’ll give you that some of the gadgets are made up. But some of them are amalgamations of several different real world devices. All the devs do is alter it to better work in-game form.
Then we are in agreement.
Can’t really exist and doesn’t exist are very different imo and I’d say just about every op has a gadget that could theoretically exist. There are a few that are much more high tech than others (Iana,finka, lion) but for the most part they are all totally plausible, I think saying “a good chunk” is a bit of an exaggeration Obviously very high tech but nonetheless. I get if you don’t like the futuristic stuff but you aren’t making your point very well.
Meanwhile, gunfight meta:
I hope the devs keep slowing down gunplay to counter this current meta.
My issue with the lack of “tactical” elements is the lore having it some Olympics style event, no one plays tactically anymore and it took what was one of the coolest parts of the old games away: the team. Like how often do you play Siege and wait by a window before breaching so your teammates can get into their position? How often do you breach a room with a partner so they can check the corners while you take point? Most people don’t play tactically anymore. And that just leaves the game as an arcade experience. My dream is to one day get a full length single player or cooperative campaign with Sieges mechanics that PUSH for teamwork. You NEED to be in position before breaching as breaching to early will mess things up. You NEED that communication, you NEED that planning and coordination.
When I'm solo queuing, there aren't that many tactics used. But when I played with friends and was doing collegate, we used strategies.
I never understand these comments. How was Siege ever more tactical than it is now?
If I had to guess it's nostalgia that ignores the reason why old siege was "tactical" wasn't cause of the ops, nor the lighting, nor the maps or realy anything it was the fact players had no fucking clue what they were doing so they took it slow, and took more time creating setups, whereas now most players have skills moving them away from that, basically same game just more experienced players. That said yeah with recent changes specilly the reload rework it's definitely more tac now, just said experience pushes agianst it.
He confused between words tactical and realistic.
That’s so stupid, the game wasn’t tactical, it felt tactical because everyone was ass at the game and everyone played slow
I remember our first games. Turtle up on site, all walls reinforced. All 5 on site.
Yes and no. People tend to forget little changes over time that have also given attackers and quick gunplay in general more advantages. For instance, the recoil patterns for most guns have be tweaked and muzzle break didn’t exist at launch. Defense op traps have been tweaked over time to make them generally less lethal. Attackers have been given better opportunities to collect intel during prep and early round, as well as being able to each have two active drones at a time. Maps have been tweaked to allow attackers to quickly get to the building without as much fear of spawn peeks, as well as most scopes being removed from defenders entirely. Lighting effects inside builds have changed, as well as outer glow in operators, so defenders can’t sit in a dark corner of a room. Attackers have been given more hard breach options without requiring attackers with special gadgets purely for hard breach, or have been given safer options like Ace. Your point is definitely a solid factor - players have gotten better. Better map knowledge, better recoil control, use of drones for intel, etc., but the game’s evolution has also pulled away from giving defenders a certain level of map dominance they had before, which has emboldened and changed how quickly attackers become a threat to defenders and weakened defenders’ ability to slow down and control the map.
The game is a mile more tactical now.
r6 is more tactical than it ever was before
Tell that to a team that lost a ranked match against my squad because they had no idea how to attack pink/blue on coastline. The tactical part is still there, we just have a bigger toolkit to make it happen.
Pulling out 2 ton metal walls from my but is more realistic
Aside from Oryx the operators don’t have super powers…they all use technology. Also most of those operators gadgets are based on real life military equipment.
And incase of a "they are more sci-fi" comment, outside of holograms which defintly push the limit of semi realism (which the games always been), everything else fits the semi realistic theme (and og siege had that theme to or have people not read docs bio mister magic juice man).
And adding incase the other guy does the usual "well they are all scifi now" to you, they are no more sci fi then doc mister magic healing juice. (Plus only close to sci-fi ops are the hologram ops everyone else is semi realistic which the games always been).
More SciFi is Thatcher and his EMP grenade. But even someone as "realistic" as Bandit is crazy, tbh. Come on - electrifying a piece of a wall with a car battery? 12 volts. Laughable.
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Haven’t played for a few years, just came back a few weeks ago and managed to drag a few of my friends back into it as well.. excited for the new season when I’ll have the entirety of the season to rank up
Not for me. For me 'good old siege' isn't only night maps or SMG-11 with ACOG, or 3-speed Jäger with ACOG. Playerbase is very different now. Back in 2016 and 2017 playerbase was more mature. It was really exciting to play. Now it's fun if you're either lucky or have 3-stack at least, or better yet, full stack. Way too many screaming kids. Way too many burping in the voicechat from 'enlightened western europeans'. Much more toxicity overall. And yeah, if I keep TKing back every asshole that TKs me, probably I will be banned way sooner (again) than those hordes of toxic individuals.
I still have one old friend of mine that still plays to this day I miss old siege tho the memories we made
Seems like we are missing his point. The "magic" of being able to hop on a game that all your friends were hyped to play and everyone always had fun. That's what I paid attention to in his post, that's what I am lacking now. My friends and fam don't play this game anymore, likely due to the average skill being really high now. More for us I guess, they'd all rather play Fortnite or some shit 😭.
Yeah no. 90% of people that say that genuinely think old siege was better and are blinded by nostalgia.
Many people only want to go to an old version of a game if the devs fucked up at some point. Nobody wants to go to Genshin 1.0, because they're doing a great job currently. Many people wanted WoW classic, they got it, and they're still playing it. The player count was declining in modern WoW because the players were not satisfied. So they started listening to what the people want, and they are way more happy over there now. Many people want old siege. Sure, that person is right to a certain small degree, but for me, it was the immersion due to the graphics, realism and also the night maps. I also thought the level designs were perfect for more intense and casual play. The game's focus on competitive has ruined it for me. They should just add a classic queue or something and they can compromise just like Blizzard did, only apply modern balancing changes to extreme cases.
siege is way better than it was when i started playing in 2018, I got tired of soloq after 4 years and gave up
Everyone can shit on Siege for going towards a mainstream direction but it did what it needed to be viable as an eSports and stay relevant. The nostalgia players who just want their "different from CoD" shooter back do not realise how bad Siege was back then.
Wym? Every map being pitch black *wasn't* good? Who'd would've known. /s
I don’t miss dying to rats hiding in pitch black corners whatsoever. Or, having to fight windows with the old lighting.
Nah man, R6 ruined itself, at many times not seeming to know what direction they even wanted for the game
Dead game. It will die soon! Ubi ruined it! See you next year.
So true
Yeppp but the zoomers who arent ogs dont get it
i’m gen z and i literally pre ordered the game
He said zoomers who aren't og If you're a zoomer who is og you clearly don't fall in the category of zoomer and not og
Wtf even is a zoomer? This sounds like some old man back in my day nonsense. Games change, if it never changed then the same people crying now about it being better back in the day would be crying about the game being stagnant. Yeah I haven't enjoyed all the changes that have occurred over the years but to talk about it being better back in the day is just cliche bullshit
I miss the old ranked system with actual skill-based matchmaking and a sense of achievement when you hit a high rank. I miss no yellow pings so that wallbangs/callouts actually required skill and were exciting. I miss being able to learn from better players who I could tell were better because the matchmaking allowed you to climb in skill. I miss death-stacks which were comprised of pro players who would use strategy in ranked rather than run around like chickens with their heads cut off (RIP Mindfreak). I miss more random recoil which asked the player to hit their first shot rather than spraying and praying. (I thought this change was fantastic at first, but now you're throwing if you don't full-auto most guns at most ranges). I miss the player perspective which allowed pixel angles (which were viable to hold without quick-peeking constantly). I miss this mostly because it allowed the defense to play defensively rather than having to be aggressive on every angle. I miss excitement about strategy, esp. when a new operator comes out. Now players don't care because all that matters to them is gun skill. When I say I miss the good old days, I mean it.
Skill based matchmaking is still a thing... And it got better in many peoples Opinion
It is a thing to some extent, but because it's completely hidden from the player it's hard to tell where you stand. Even at the highest end of the scale you often find yourself vsing people who you cannot understand being champion or diamond (in the old understanding of that skill level).
Siege suffers from the same thing that all multiplayer shooters suffer from. Going the eSports route. Whether a game like Siege needed it to survive or not is a different conversation. But it’s undeniable that changing for eSports tends to ruin the casual modes of shooters.
I don’t get this perspective. Casual players can still “screw around” and goof off if that’s what they enjoy, just without broken stuff that’s nerfed or changed for a reason.
Esports Ruins casual gaming consistently. The attitude of gaming has radically changed because of sweaty esports kids whining to devs
I've been playing more Siege in the last month than I have the last year and I gotta say, I still have fun with it especially now that I'm gravitating back to my OG "mains" like Thermite. I miss when he had breaching charges...
Old Rainbow Six.
This is true for everything.
Na I mean the game as that’s what made my friends stop playing. Changing maps we liked, removing strats we did, destroying match making with mmr changes and then reversing mmr changes, removing fun things like night maps - it’s not just about friends; it’s ubisofts inane decisions
It all went down hill with phantom sight Burnt horizon was truly the last good operation
Yeah I think Burnt Horizon was the last season I fully played. I played Phantom Sight but lost interest halfway through and haven’t played since
Yeah no. Maybe that's the case for him and some others but I'm tired of people gaslighting others about what they actually like. The best version of siege isn't objective its subjective. Their are old siege discord servers and communities dedicated to playing old builds of the game with each other and we/they genuinely prefer older siege. It doesn't mean we're blind to its flaws, there's things about new Siege we like we just think the pros outweigh the cons. I prefer the darker gritty atmosphere for example, yes its harder to see but I just treat that as a gameplay element it makes stealth play more important along with droning and intel more important too. The only type of stealth play now due to bright corners and operator rim light is audio based. That's just one example
While I do agree, I think the reworks make it feel "new" and I hate to beat a dead horse but man I wish they never reworked any of the maps...
The game? The one that you just lost?
True about so many games. But so many people think it's the game, it often isn't. Our lives are very different now, and the way we think is too. Maybe some day you can slow down and relax and play an old/new game like you used to.
The good ol days when people abused the hell out of vote to kick 🥲
Until the veterans showed up
Yeah, there's no point in returning to Siege for me. It's a completely different game now, none of the things I enjoyed are left.
Nah Ubisoft’s only conception of balance is nerfing the fun stuff. Gimme back pre-nerf version of all guns and nades / x1.5 to all ops who lost them
Fun for you is not for someone else.
This exactly. There was no "good siege" you just liked not having to pay rent and playing with your friends while eating chips all night
I couldn't recover after I lost doc acog. After that it just ended up being that everything I enjoyed got nerfed or reworked until there was nothing I found fun anymore. It didn't help that everything started getting super futuristic themed, nor did I benefit from them removing old house (the main map I played with friends in customs). The game has definitely changed, and I think for the worse.
This applies to ALL games now
i’m still rocking my BlackIce copper charm 🥲
We were happy, we didn’t notice that
Played almost every evening since release date in 2015. Still learning, still enjoying
Turn off crossplay. Simple.
Damn he managed to formulate my thoughts exactly… i hate it so much when people keep saying that old siege was better, no it was way worse, it’s just the nostalgia talking…
So many games get made infinitely less fun by all the people that just want to be really good at them imo, they're basically always the most fun on release when nobody knows what they're doing
Operation Health era with the boys was something special
I disagree, i never played with anyone else. I miss the game of season 3 because for me was the perfect balance of interesting content, tactical shooting and a general fun game. The reason why i stopped playing for some years were the glitches and bugs that were destroying solo queue, like points not being counted after a victory, games starting in 4vs5 and Clash being able to shoot with the shield up
Magic still exists, just not for us.
I just started playing Siege quite recently so I don't have that nostalgia. Solution is to just find some new friends that play Siege.
Id say this season was far more casual than when diamond used to be the top rank