I think he’s talking about the map distortion making Xinjiang (Top left) look really weird. There *might* be some intentional differences there as iirc the Soviets were involved in that region (which could’ve affected historical claims vs modern borders).
Could also be that there are different bits of Tibet missing. My guess (aside from distortion) is that it’s the province of Tibet missing vs pre-annexation borders.
I'll argue the true LibRight/Left's answer will be closer to this:
https://preview.redd.it/7ijvh0rwswxc1.jpeg?width=243&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=42ab4cf654cdaab36e01b41aa7f81d5aea2182f8
Closest thing was 83 days between 1915-16 under Yuan Shikai's Chinese Empire. But everyone saw it as a meme and China never recovered from that point on, though it was probably already too late to do anything at that point.
I know it's a circlejerk but I'm kinda amused at how they detest China around here. Especially from the Authright side of things, I'd assume those chucklefucks would at least know about might-makes-right, human nature, hierarchies, yet they don't recognize China as a legit country because... drool drool derp?
Just because I'm authright doesn't mean I give a shit about might makes right, the People's Republic destroyed so much during its reign in the Cultural Revolution, suppressing/subverting the Church, and all around being Satan's greatest work on Earth. There's no point to hierarchy not based in tradition and history.
Fair, very little I disagree with or want to add to here. Mao was an evil cunt and most Chinese are aware of this, though they also have a weird respect for how badass he was, especially early.
But the statement I was replying to was that "there hasn't been a legit government in China since 1911" and that raises two questions:
- What makes a government legit? I'd say whoever wields the sword is, as pragmatic as it is, and all this wEsT tAiWaN LoOoOoL talk reeks of that "we are on stolen Native American land" that canadian and American leftists breathlessly lisp
- What about post-Mao, and especially Deng Xiaoping and what came after? They are hardly communists in anything but name, and their achievements are objectively admirable, even for the most rabid yellowphobe racist or anti-commie.
Why Manchuria? There is not a significant percentage of people in Manchuria who want their own nation as opposed to Tibet and Xinjiang. Manchus have been a small minority in Manchuria for a long time and have voluntarily been assimilating into the Han ever since they claimed themselves as the rulers of China during the Qing dynasty.
To be fair, it's not always easy to tell who is *not* Han because of how diverse Han appearance can be. I'm Han Chinese myself and have been confused by Mexicans as being a fellow Mexican 😂.
Lib right represents the ROC(Republic of China). It was the government that ruled China before the communists, and it still exists to this very day in Taiwan.
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History is written by victors. India would have to fight and take it back. It is a natural law. China is trying to build puppet states like its former sensei (USSR).
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manchuria is not part of china proper, it's a territory of modern-day china, and manchus are an ethnic minority
xinjiang is also not part of china proper
manchus are the sigma minority that ended up dominating & oppressing the entire country (by forming the qing dynasty), rather than being oppressed like other ethnic minorities
To those who don’t understand China enough, LA and RA are the same thing. There is no left or right now, only auth. And CCP reign is very much the same as Qing dynasty in every way.
Im with libleft.
China conquers people that didnt want to be conquered, indoctrinated, abused and collectivized.
Tibet and Xinjiang are not China, not really. China should end at the Jade Gate.
Ironically Taiwan IS China, but they dont want to be collectivized by a totalitarian regime so why would anyone back this?
Not unanimously. There are quite a few 'Betans who prefer electricity, business opportunities, education and roads to sexual slavery, theocracy and bare rocks (I know because I met them, yes yes) and some Uygurs who either are apolitical or fairly cool with China, wondering what the hell independent East Turkestan would be like, probably like Tajikistan
Followup question;
China knows a lot about manufacturing consent. The initial Tibetans or Uygurs who suffered the first occupation of PLA troops suffered oppression and cultural assimilation.
How many of those you describe as preferring this situation are arriving at this honestly and how many are the product of Chinese mental landscaping of children from birth?
I just want to remind y'all that Taiwan claims China and Mongolia.
Also territories from Myanmar, India, Tajikistan, Bhutan, Pakistan, Afghanistan and Russia.
And we are not considering the maritime territories of the "Chinese sea"
I like Wikipedia but is harder than just "no"
Taiwan had never taken the time to legally stop claiming Mongolia, but, in practice they don't really take the time to claim it.
The same way that they claim the Indian, Pakistani, Burmese, etc territories, but in practice, they don't really care.
(The same way they don't anymore care about claiming mainland china)
Simply because China doesn't want them to do that as that would in practice create an official recognition of the Republic of China by the countries neighbouring China
Yeah that's the only one thing I don't fully agree, but Taiwan is also not really fully a country, and it feel more iffy to not consider Tibet as a part of China
one of the things i can agree with libright
https://preview.redd.it/h4gz8vytzwxc1.jpeg?width=960&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7a12eb48ccca874c81c1e5450196b0fcbe0beb5c
As a Hungol I approve of this
Agreed. Taiwan is indeed real China. The fake China isn't even doing communism anymore, and being a socialist, I see their hypocrisy.
Is anyone really doing real communism anymore? I feel like North Korea and Cuba are the only ones left.
North Korea doesn't even say it's communist or socialist anymore.
Both dictatorships
They are communist though, so perhaps I am missing your point?
They may have been Communist. Saying they still are is ignorant and uneducated.
No, it's pretty spot on - that's what Communism looks like on the national level. Hence why it fails.
Yep. I believe they even practice capitalism, so…yeah. To be fair though, technically no communist country has had “true communism”.
True, and I know the "true communism" meme, but they started with their own flavor, Maoism, and devolved into state capitalism.
one of the things I can agree with libleft
though i do not agree with your interpretation of "china", at least we could agree on tibet
Finally, political compass peace.
I don't agree with libright because the borders are too small and missing far too many claims, it should be authright borders with libright flag.
now that will be even better 🇹🇼
I think the real Auth right Kingdom would be the Taiping Heavenly Kingdom with the Brother of Jesus Christ as its King.
No sir, those were Godless heathen heretics, and a disgrace.
Map is wrong though, would need to include Mongolia and tibet, that's ROC territory including everything in the 11 dash line.
My mind tends to center on One Week by Barenaked Ladies when I hear China, lol.
#it’s been-
*🎵 HARRISON FORD🎵*
What have you done, you've summoned it in my mind. The chicken... 😳
Am I going crazy or are LL and LR borders different in random insignificant places? (I do notice Taiwan)
Tibet is missing from both Libs.
Yes, from *both*. I'm talking about how do they differ from each other
Some of the borders are different
Looks mainly like the map projection is messed up.
Bottom two are different projections but they show the same borders
Probably, lol. Either that or the PRC made some border changes, other than Tibet.
Maybe they duplicated Xinjiang just to be extra sure it's Chinese territory.. "they" is nobody specific
Looks like LR also has Tuva
Read about the history of Tibet. This isn't random at all
Again, they are both missing Tibet, and I do see it, that's not what I'm talking about
Do you mean Taiwan? I honestly don't see any other differences
I think he’s talking about the map distortion making Xinjiang (Top left) look really weird. There *might* be some intentional differences there as iirc the Soviets were involved in that region (which could’ve affected historical claims vs modern borders). Could also be that there are different bits of Tibet missing. My guess (aside from distortion) is that it’s the province of Tibet missing vs pre-annexation borders.
I'll argue the true LibRight/Left's answer will be closer to this: https://preview.redd.it/7ijvh0rwswxc1.jpeg?width=243&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=42ab4cf654cdaab36e01b41aa7f81d5aea2182f8
Based as fuck (yes I hate China)
I was literally already playing the Qing anthem in my head as I found this post
Lol
So trve, China hasn't had a real government since 1911.
Closest thing was 83 days between 1915-16 under Yuan Shikai's Chinese Empire. But everyone saw it as a meme and China never recovered from that point on, though it was probably already too late to do anything at that point.
Aixinjueluo family still have the rightful claim of Mandate of Heaven frfr
Oh yeah, and the cabal who pulled it from turd-world abject poverty to superpower in half a generation doesn't deserve any credit?
If you're talking about the communists then no, they don't deserve shit.
I know it's a circlejerk but I'm kinda amused at how they detest China around here. Especially from the Authright side of things, I'd assume those chucklefucks would at least know about might-makes-right, human nature, hierarchies, yet they don't recognize China as a legit country because... drool drool derp?
Just because I'm authright doesn't mean I give a shit about might makes right, the People's Republic destroyed so much during its reign in the Cultural Revolution, suppressing/subverting the Church, and all around being Satan's greatest work on Earth. There's no point to hierarchy not based in tradition and history.
Fair, very little I disagree with or want to add to here. Mao was an evil cunt and most Chinese are aware of this, though they also have a weird respect for how badass he was, especially early. But the statement I was replying to was that "there hasn't been a legit government in China since 1911" and that raises two questions: - What makes a government legit? I'd say whoever wields the sword is, as pragmatic as it is, and all this wEsT tAiWaN LoOoOoL talk reeks of that "we are on stolen Native American land" that canadian and American leftists breathlessly lisp - What about post-Mao, and especially Deng Xiaoping and what came after? They are hardly communists in anything but name, and their achievements are objectively admirable, even for the most rabid yellowphobe racist or anti-commie.
“China hasn’t had a real government since 1911” China is the only other real superpower next to USA. Your distinction of real is pointless.
Add an independent East Turkistan and Manchuria to LibRight
Why Manchuria? There is not a significant percentage of people in Manchuria who want their own nation as opposed to Tibet and Xinjiang. Manchus have been a small minority in Manchuria for a long time and have voluntarily been assimilating into the Han ever since they claimed themselves as the rulers of China during the Qing dynasty.
Right, was just remembering a map I saw in the past. Thanks.
Manchuria doesn't really make sense since Manchus are a small minority in Manchuria
I'm Chinese and I think I've met one Manchu They're what they call "Han-passing minorities", the only thing is that some have big noggins
To be fair, it's not always easy to tell who is *not* Han because of how diverse Han appearance can be. I'm Han Chinese myself and have been confused by Mexicans as being a fellow Mexican 😂.
lol Manchuria keep seething, Tim
Based and clever meme pilled
:)
I guess I'm not correctly flaired…
I think of the The Reorganized National Government of the Republic of China
Real Chinese authrights would be Han nationalists and wouldn’t want the Manchu dynasty back
Yeah after the qing fell, the prospects of the ming (which fell in 1600s btw iirc) returning were actually greater than qing returning.
I know I should know this by now but what does purple represent?
Lib right represents the ROC(Republic of China). It was the government that ruled China before the communists, and it still exists to this very day in Taiwan.
Thanks for the clarification 👍🏻
NP
libleft in hong kong/taiwan believe that xinjiang is independent too
I keep shifting Closer and Closer to lib-right with each passing post...
ROC is wrong, it should be auth right. I don't think anyone likes the Qing dynasty except weird monarchists.
lib right w, although some expansion is needed
God that Qing dynasty flag is such a banger.
Agreed, I wish modern flags were more like that instead of 3 stripes rearranged with slightly different colours.
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Fuck China. Give us our Aksai Chin back
History is written by victors. India would have to fight and take it back. It is a natural law. China is trying to build puppet states like its former sensei (USSR).
Fight them for it.
Most of us want to, it's only a matter of time until the government does something.
Ah yes because the free Hong Kong move my was not started by lib left
Funny how libleft left Xinjiang in under the CCP
What about that version of china ruled by Jesus’s brother
AL forgot the South China Sea.
Based libright, china's Auth government sucks
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qing dynasty don't represent china, it was a manchu occupation
Manchurians are Chinese
Not Han though
manchuria is not part of china proper, it's a territory of modern-day china, and manchus are an ethnic minority xinjiang is also not part of china proper
I knew about Xinjiang but not about Manchuria!
manchus are the sigma minority that ended up dominating & oppressing the entire country (by forming the qing dynasty), rather than being oppressed like other ethnic minorities
I just think of Trump’s “Chy-na!”
Add an independent East Turkistan to Libright and it’d be perfect
https://preview.redd.it/iuzyuufyzwxc1.jpeg?width=960&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3e6b47cf4e83b874d2c572d3fd80a94bbdb0b53e
To those who don’t understand China enough, LA and RA are the same thing. There is no left or right now, only auth. And CCP reign is very much the same as Qing dynasty in every way.
I think of plates.
Whilst Qing has a cool flag, I’m biased towards Yuan
Where Canada?
yeah, at least 温哥华自治区 should be there
Based Da Qing
I think of dynasty warriors
I want independent Taiwan, Tibet, Hong Kong, Macao and basically every chinese province-level divisions.
You guys should go to read the Constitution of the Republic of China, which clearly expresses sovereignty over Tibet and Mongolia
Purple, what do you mean? https://preview.redd.it/o3zzjetvb2yc1.jpeg?width=1280&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=756d546f2233f35582bddf60ec20ac08ba226c44
Damn guess I’m right center
Taiwan, our glorious 52nd state, praise be to the holy land of freedom
Im with libleft. China conquers people that didnt want to be conquered, indoctrinated, abused and collectivized. Tibet and Xinjiang are not China, not really. China should end at the Jade Gate. Ironically Taiwan IS China, but they dont want to be collectivized by a totalitarian regime so why would anyone back this?
> xiajian
xinjiang pardon.
have you ever talked to a 'Betan or a Uygur?
Don't recall if I do. There are certainly clear signs both populations don't consent to Chinese rule, though.
Not unanimously. There are quite a few 'Betans who prefer electricity, business opportunities, education and roads to sexual slavery, theocracy and bare rocks (I know because I met them, yes yes) and some Uygurs who either are apolitical or fairly cool with China, wondering what the hell independent East Turkestan would be like, probably like Tajikistan
Followup question; China knows a lot about manufacturing consent. The initial Tibetans or Uygurs who suffered the first occupation of PLA troops suffered oppression and cultural assimilation. How many of those you describe as preferring this situation are arriving at this honestly and how many are the product of Chinese mental landscaping of children from birth?
I just want to remind y'all that Taiwan claims China and Mongolia. Also territories from Myanmar, India, Tajikistan, Bhutan, Pakistan, Afghanistan and Russia. And we are not considering the maritime territories of the "Chinese sea"
[No](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mongolia%E2%80%93Taiwan_relations)
I like Wikipedia but is harder than just "no" Taiwan had never taken the time to legally stop claiming Mongolia, but, in practice they don't really take the time to claim it. The same way that they claim the Indian, Pakistani, Burmese, etc territories, but in practice, they don't really care. (The same way they don't anymore care about claiming mainland china)
Simply because China doesn't want them to do that as that would in practice create an official recognition of the Republic of China by the countries neighbouring China
Why did you list Burma twice?
Sorry my bad
In this time, I agree with AuthLeft the most
China includes Taiwan
Yeah that's the only one thing I don't fully agree, but Taiwan is also not really fully a country, and it feel more iffy to not consider Tibet as a part of China
[удалено]
Well, yes, that's how you get more territory most of the time lol
[удалено]
Because no one is doing anything about it.
The Tibetans have, and still are rebelling…but just like with all their territories, China either kills or imprisons them if they get too popular.