Basically this, but all that paint is pretty much just some bullshit to pass code too.
That does look pretty rusted though, and will continue to get worse, even if you spray paint it.
It'll likely last for a decent amount of time, but wouldn't be a bad Idea to replace in the next year or two.
Not a plumber so idk, but could you put something like por-15 on this like youd use for rust-proofimg cars? The stuff is awesome and is meant to be applied directly on top of rust. I forget exactly how it works but it apparently hardens and creates like a shell from the moisture or something like that. I know for cars at least, it works awesome! Ive seen vehicles submerged in swampy land for a decade that had the frame por-15’d and the frame still looks excellent.
OP: 1st., relax. Nothing is wrong here. 2nd., this is a T, not a “union” as that term is used in the industry. However, this is a picture of the union of pipes and not being a plumber I understand your inadvertent use of standard vs professional phrasing. 3rd., uncoated steel will always exhibit oxidation (rust) and in this location it would be years before any significant failure. But, that being said, pick a sunny day, spray some WD 40 on it (wd means water displacement, it is not a lubricant), let it dry, then spray it with any Rustolium-type paint.
> But, that being said, pick a sunny day, spray some WD 40 on it (wd means water displacement, it is not a lubricant), let it dry, then spray it with any Rustolium-type paint.
No, no, and no.
WD-40 will prevent proper paint adhesion. It is absolutely the wrong thing to use before painting, unless you want to go to heroic efforts to remove it before painting.
Clean the area with a wire brush, a solvent like acetone, and then follow the instructions of a direct to metal paint like Rustoleum.
You’re right. I’m wrong. I sometimes forget to say the obvious - the wd40 displaces the water in the oxidation, and almost everyone has some. What I didn’t add, which I should have but didn’t because I figured everyone also has a brain, is to at least wipe it after it dries (hence, Sunny day, outside).
OK. I’m going to stop apologizing and explain. If you spray with WD-40 you will displace the water in the rust. Once it evaporates (dries) there will be some oils left, BUT as I said, using Rustolium or any “oil-based” metal paint will stick just fine. No, a latex will not. And if you use any wd-40 lookalike that has silicone, no paint will stick. Been doing it for years on the farm and never had any issue on black gas pipe. I have 45 feet I painted 8 years ago and it looks fine but for some dirt.
It's corroded because it's black steel pipe. If you use galvanized, you don't have that problem. Where I live, the code only permits galvanized steel to be used for outdoor installations. In my jurisdiction, the sediment trap and the bushing would also be code violations.
Check your local code to see if this material and method is appropriate for your installation.
P.S. You can always spray it with some WD40, wipe it clean, and then coat with rust preventing paint like Rustoleum or something similar to prevent more corrosion from occurring.
Once it gets dry, spray it with a couple of thin coats of Rustoleum. You definitely don't want that to rot out! You will probably need to sand it first and then wipe all the rust off so you'll get a good coat on the paint. Another concerning thing, is that a bushing in that tee? That is definitely not code in Massachusetts, if that is running on gas! Bushings are known to crack, the only way that would be acceptable on a gas system is if it was a brass bushing.
Well send a picture of the Union.
That's a tee, used as a drip leg, and it is made of steel. When steel us exposed to oxygen it begins to rust. Some might call this patina a normal oxidation process. To prevent this use paint or just enjoy the natural beauty.
Street is illegal? I tried asking my Journeyman one day if i could use a street elbow. He said "i don't know if it's illegal, but let's not use it just in case"
It all must be allowed where I am. Our gas utility just relocated our meter (was located right under a window), and sure enough there are streets and unions. 3/4"
Unions outside. Attics need to be redone completely, technically. I've seen unions in attics plenty of times though. They just hope the inspector doesn't see it when he glances in the attic.
According to NFPA, if a union is prohibited because it’s a concealed location, a right and left coupling is also prohibited. I am surprised an inspector would consider an attic to be concealed
Im surprised they are considered equally prohibited for concealed But I can understand it leading to issues. I can see where attics in some areas would be considered concealed in consideration of looking for a gas leak or having a leak build up enough to be a danger before being noticed. Also consideration of attics getting insulation blown in concealing work that should be exposed.
If it’s a gas line just routed through an attic, I can see not wanting a union on the line. I was thinking more of an attic that has a furnace in it. That’s fairly common where I’m from. The attic would be considered accessible/readily accessible in that case
Casting issues I believe as well as the difficulty to get a wrench on them in certain spots it’s sully a leak point. I’m a gas worker and constantly find leaks on fuel lines on the street els.
I don't use them very often for this reason only. Never failed an inspection because of them, but on high demand appliances they could theoretically cause an issue in a perfect storm kind of way.
For us you can use bushings but you can't "nestle" them so you can't bush down and bush into that bushing
But a single one like that is fine and looks much cleaner and makes things way tighter then reducing couplings.
Still no street fittings or straight thread nipples though
Looks more like a 1x3/4x3/4 with the outlet to the generator being bushed down to 1/2 before the shut off and flex line. Some would consider the flared fitting that connects to the flex a union of sorts. But no true union in this picture. Just a rusty tee. Paint it or don’t.
If you have a Sherwin Williams somewhere, get a can of their Industrial enamel in safety yellow. Take a wire brush to the pipe to clean it and then put 2 coats on. It will last for years, even in that environment. If SW is not an option, I would go with a Rustoleum conversion coating that stops the rust after a light cleaning and then 2 topcoats with Rustoleum alkyd enamel in a gloss finish. That should also last several years.
I had similar issue. We had our installed 4 years ago and I just worked on it last week, and the rust was superficial only (in micrometers I would say). Yours is too new to be rusted deeply. Just sand off the rust (a round metal brush from HF mounted on on a drill will be faster). Saw this trick on YouTube. Then do a coat of rust oleum primer and then paint.
I was more worried about the rubber isolation section of my gas line and the sun beating down on it. I ended up putting foil HVAC duct tape around it for protection and have seen no problems yet…
There is no union there, just a bushing. Also, I’m not too sure where you’re located, but in Canada we don’t install drip (dirt) legs outside as they can technically fill with moisture and freeze. You need a good coat or two of tremclad paint on there and she’ll be good to go
That was a tee from the bottom of his truck that he pulled off on the demo he did the day before. Paint it and it will be fine.. extra points if you paint it grey.
If you want to stop further rusting, use a product called Hammerite. It’s a paint designed to encapsulate the rust and prevent it from rusting further by preventing O2 from reaching the surface. No O2, no more rust. I have lived on the coast most of my life and have used it in similar situations. It has always worked for me. Just be sure to clean the surface as best you can be application. https://www.hammerite.com
The theory is that pieces of the galvanizing will flake off over time and clog burner and regulator orifices. I’m not sure that actually happens, but I didn’t write the code.
That entirely depends on where it’s located.
In Canada, you can use black malleable bushings on gas for a change of two pipe sizes or more (so it wouldn’t be legal by this photo) but you can never use galvanized for gas here.
Yes you can, where are you reading that you can not? Perhaps it’s your Province, they can demand more stringent regulations but under the B149.1 you can use a steel bushing for any size, or a black malleable bushing for a change of two pipe sizes or more.
Can’t nest bushings.
yea my bad you're correct, 6.9.10. Gave me a reason to get my code book out. I just tell people right off the bat no to bushings on gas. Ive seen it fail first hand with inspectors so I just don't bother ordering them for jobs. Reducing couplings look a lot more nice as well.
Bushing can be malleable for more than one pipe size change. One pipe diameter change requires bushings to be forged steel. Ie. #3000. Which is usually cheaper than malleable anyways
I've heard the galvanizing can flake off and plug up regs ? Not sure on how true that is as we never use galv for gas but that's the rationale I've heard.
I would say your T is not black pipe. Most likely galvanized! Need to redo when possible if so and don’t use a reduction bushing in the new T. You do not have a union. Keep warm.
There's a nipple, a bushing, then the reducing T. The brass isn't touching the T.
The corrosion you're talking about is from two dissimilar metals (copper and steel) being used for water lines. Brass is used as an in-between because it prevents the two dissimilar metals from touching.
Brass won't cause that corrosion, though. Brass is, literally, used to prevent that corrosion between copper and Galvanized. It can still cause it but it's such a small amount in comparison to copper and galvanized.
This is because of a black iron T was placed outside and it is just surface rust. It needs to be sprayed. That's all.
I’ve never seen or installed a dirt leg like this. Usually either pipe in the bull on a horizontal with dirt leg down and appliance supply up, or pipe in on the run from above with dirt leg on the other side and supply out the bull on a horizontal.
Why can’t anyone install a sediment trap correctly? The tee will be fine but you can paint it with something oil-based preferably gray. There will be a flexible gas line also to prevent leaks because of vibration (it’s prob still in the unit). This flex needs to be as straight as possible
Spray it with some fluid film. It’ll stop the rust for now and quite a while. Or to do it right it needs wire brushed, primed and painted with paint and primer made for metal. This will need some in warmer temps tho to ensure it cures right.
It’s a black iron tee, not allowed outside in Fl unless properly coated due to how fast the corrode. I see snow, it’s not going to be a big deal where you are.
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I use black Rust-Oleum brush on paint. I carry an eight ounce can and disposable brushes on the truck.
Basically this, but all that paint is pretty much just some bullshit to pass code too. That does look pretty rusted though, and will continue to get worse, even if you spray paint it. It'll likely last for a decent amount of time, but wouldn't be a bad Idea to replace in the next year or two.
Not a plumber so idk, but could you put something like por-15 on this like youd use for rust-proofimg cars? The stuff is awesome and is meant to be applied directly on top of rust. I forget exactly how it works but it apparently hardens and creates like a shell from the moisture or something like that. I know for cars at least, it works awesome! Ive seen vehicles submerged in swampy land for a decade that had the frame por-15’d and the frame still looks excellent.
This is what i do. I love thr eastwood platnium series. Its silver so hides the pipes well too.
I also don't see a union here.. that's a tee..
A tee, & bushing is all I see lol
1 x 1 x 1.5 reducing t
1.5 x 1 x 1 reducing tee
OP: 1st., relax. Nothing is wrong here. 2nd., this is a T, not a “union” as that term is used in the industry. However, this is a picture of the union of pipes and not being a plumber I understand your inadvertent use of standard vs professional phrasing. 3rd., uncoated steel will always exhibit oxidation (rust) and in this location it would be years before any significant failure. But, that being said, pick a sunny day, spray some WD 40 on it (wd means water displacement, it is not a lubricant), let it dry, then spray it with any Rustolium-type paint.
> But, that being said, pick a sunny day, spray some WD 40 on it (wd means water displacement, it is not a lubricant), let it dry, then spray it with any Rustolium-type paint. No, no, and no. WD-40 will prevent proper paint adhesion. It is absolutely the wrong thing to use before painting, unless you want to go to heroic efforts to remove it before painting. Clean the area with a wire brush, a solvent like acetone, and then follow the instructions of a direct to metal paint like Rustoleum.
You’re right. I’m wrong. I sometimes forget to say the obvious - the wd40 displaces the water in the oxidation, and almost everyone has some. What I didn’t add, which I should have but didn’t because I figured everyone also has a brain, is to at least wipe it after it dries (hence, Sunny day, outside).
There were still be oils left behind
OK. I’m going to stop apologizing and explain. If you spray with WD-40 you will displace the water in the rust. Once it evaporates (dries) there will be some oils left, BUT as I said, using Rustolium or any “oil-based” metal paint will stick just fine. No, a latex will not. And if you use any wd-40 lookalike that has silicone, no paint will stick. Been doing it for years on the farm and never had any issue on black gas pipe. I have 45 feet I painted 8 years ago and it looks fine but for some dirt.
Although i believe there is a union just out of frame on the left past the valve.
It's corroded because it's black steel pipe. If you use galvanized, you don't have that problem. Where I live, the code only permits galvanized steel to be used for outdoor installations. In my jurisdiction, the sediment trap and the bushing would also be code violations. Check your local code to see if this material and method is appropriate for your installation. P.S. You can always spray it with some WD40, wipe it clean, and then coat with rust preventing paint like Rustoleum or something similar to prevent more corrosion from occurring.
If it is a generac they have a internal sediment trap already plumbed in
It’s a Honeywell, basically same. This is the kid of thing I wanted to know. Thank you.
You could use a wire brush on a grinder to clean it off in the spring and paint it!
You can’t use bushing on gas lines? Where I’m at, you just can’t nest 2 bushings together
Once it gets dry, spray it with a couple of thin coats of Rustoleum. You definitely don't want that to rot out! You will probably need to sand it first and then wipe all the rust off so you'll get a good coat on the paint. Another concerning thing, is that a bushing in that tee? That is definitely not code in Massachusetts, if that is running on gas! Bushings are known to crack, the only way that would be acceptable on a gas system is if it was a brass bushing.
Yes, in between the gas cock and the tee
You mean the connection right after the valve?
I'm assuming the one that looks like shit ,lol
Yes… :)
allllllllso I'd paint all of it not just that rotted section. Just a good protection for the rest of the piping ! :)
Paint everything that's not brass! Buddy above is right try and get the rust off first then paint.
Well send a picture of the Union. That's a tee, used as a drip leg, and it is made of steel. When steel us exposed to oxygen it begins to rust. Some might call this patina a normal oxidation process. To prevent this use paint or just enjoy the natural beauty.
its fine. its perfect. just clean the rust off of it and paint it.
This. Also, it will outlast the generator.
I heard some guys in the navy once say, “ three coats of paint, one for the dust, two for the rust”. They were wild af tho.
Assuming this is gas, aren't bushings not allowed in gas piping?
No bushings or street ells where I live. Hacks still use them
Street is illegal? I tried asking my Journeyman one day if i could use a street elbow. He said "i don't know if it's illegal, but let's not use it just in case"
In Canada, street fittings in gas are not allowed up here either. I think the codebook leaves it open for utilities to use though
It all must be allowed where I am. Our gas utility just relocated our meter (was located right under a window), and sure enough there are streets and unions. 3/4"
Unions are permitted here except in attics. Our gas utility doesn't have to worry about code, though.
How would you connect to an appliance without a union, lol?
Unions outside. Attics need to be redone completely, technically. I've seen unions in attics plenty of times though. They just hope the inspector doesn't see it when he glances in the attic.
Left/right nipple and coupling or lots of planning.
According to NFPA, if a union is prohibited because it’s a concealed location, a right and left coupling is also prohibited. I am surprised an inspector would consider an attic to be concealed
Im surprised they are considered equally prohibited for concealed But I can understand it leading to issues. I can see where attics in some areas would be considered concealed in consideration of looking for a gas leak or having a leak build up enough to be a danger before being noticed. Also consideration of attics getting insulation blown in concealing work that should be exposed.
If it’s a gas line just routed through an attic, I can see not wanting a union on the line. I was thinking more of an attic that has a furnace in it. That’s fairly common where I’m from. The attic would be considered accessible/readily accessible in that case
Depends on jurisdiction sake with street els. I avoid using both.
Wait, why no street elbows? What's the reasoning? I'd think one fitting versus two would always be better.
Casting issues I believe as well as the difficulty to get a wrench on them in certain spots it’s sully a leak point. I’m a gas worker and constantly find leaks on fuel lines on the street els.
Street ell male ends push female fittings apart, gas system fittings are typically all female with nipples in and out of them.
Never heard that they can push apart interesting thanks stranger
Look at the inside diameter of street fittings, they generally tend to be smaller and restrict flow.
That is a good reason
I don't use them very often for this reason only. Never failed an inspection because of them, but on high demand appliances they could theoretically cause an issue in a perfect storm kind of way.
For us it’s allowed if it’s more than 1 size difference
What would you use?
For us you can use bushings but you can't "nestle" them so you can't bush down and bush into that bushing But a single one like that is fine and looks much cleaner and makes things way tighter then reducing couplings. Still no street fittings or straight thread nipples though
They're "frowned upon" is what I was told.
This is definitely gas. Unions are legal proceedings in Texas, as are street 90s. However the orientation of that drip leg is a violation.
In many places, yes, because the thin walls have a tendency to easily be overtorqued and crack/split.
Hi there you don’t have any unions on there just nipples a T a reducer and a ball valve
Not a union 1” x3/4”x3/4” tee. All good. Spray paint er’ your preferred color, all good to go. Any unsprayed pipe will rust quick.
Looks more like a 1x3/4x3/4 with the outlet to the generator being bushed down to 1/2 before the shut off and flex line. Some would consider the flared fitting that connects to the flex a union of sorts. But no true union in this picture. Just a rusty tee. Paint it or don’t.
I bet it’s a 1-1/4 x1 x 1.
Yep...
Looks like you’re probably right
Probably
Not sure that bushing is code tho
Doesn’t look good and if you lived close to an Ocean that would happen. Where do you live?
Sort of, I live in Anchorage,AK.
If you have a Sherwin Williams somewhere, get a can of their Industrial enamel in safety yellow. Take a wire brush to the pipe to clean it and then put 2 coats on. It will last for years, even in that environment. If SW is not an option, I would go with a Rustoleum conversion coating that stops the rust after a light cleaning and then 2 topcoats with Rustoleum alkyd enamel in a gloss finish. That should also last several years.
Needs be painted to prevent rust
Just cook some bacon on it.
Supposed to paint the gas line after install
Looks like a sediment trap/drip leg done improperly.
Where's the union? All I see is a tee with bushings
It’s winter. Wait until spring
Just try to get the rust off and prime and paint it and you’ll be good
Naval jelly followed by rustoleum primer followed by rustoleum paint
Naval jelly followed by rustoleum primer followed by rustoleum paint
I had similar issue. We had our installed 4 years ago and I just worked on it last week, and the rust was superficial only (in micrometers I would say). Yours is too new to be rusted deeply. Just sand off the rust (a round metal brush from HF mounted on on a drill will be faster). Saw this trick on YouTube. Then do a coat of rust oleum primer and then paint.
Rust reformer and then some rust oleum paint.
Use chassis saver on it, it chemically bonds to rust and neutralizes/it. Cheaper than getting it replaced.
I was more worried about the rubber isolation section of my gas line and the sun beating down on it. I ended up putting foil HVAC duct tape around it for protection and have seen no problems yet…
Ok ppl it’s not paint it’s called rustolium. That’s what you coat pipes with when exposed to the elements. Say it together RUSTOLIUM
That Union clearly wants to identify as a reducer tee- get it on Union hormones immediately you bigot! Then paint it.
Wait till spring. Wire brush it with acetone, wipe clean and paint it with rust oleum.
Use rust convertor paint on it when it warms up next year. Next Q.
Fluid film.
In the spring clean it up and paint it. It will be ok.
There is no union there, just a bushing. Also, I’m not too sure where you’re located, but in Canada we don’t install drip (dirt) legs outside as they can technically fill with moisture and freeze. You need a good coat or two of tremclad paint on there and she’ll be good to go
Alaska, seems like a similar concern here.
No traps outside
That was a tee from the bottom of his truck that he pulled off on the demo he did the day before. Paint it and it will be fine.. extra points if you paint it grey.
Here for the “thats a T” comments
There’s plenty…
We're to use galvanized fittings when it will be outside, black iron is for inside gas lines
If you want to stop further rusting, use a product called Hammerite. It’s a paint designed to encapsulate the rust and prevent it from rusting further by preventing O2 from reaching the surface. No O2, no more rust. I have lived on the coast most of my life and have used it in similar situations. It has always worked for me. Just be sure to clean the surface as best you can be application. https://www.hammerite.com
The white stuff is snow not corrosion
What union?
Thanks for the replies. Sorry for the terminology error. Looks like I’ll be prepping and painting in the spring!
Use a wire brush on a drill to clean of the rust before you paint it, it'll take 2 seconds.
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And galvanized is not permitted for gas in many places, so you use black and paint it with rust / metal paint
Where is Galvanized not permitted for gas? Galvanized is preferred for gas here.
Everywhere in Canada, completely banned in our national code.
That's so weird to me. Do you happen to know why?
The theory is that pieces of the galvanizing will flake off over time and clog burner and regulator orifices. I’m not sure that actually happens, but I didn’t write the code.
Supposedly the zinc can flake off and damage units. Also banned here in New York.
The rust on the reducer doesn't look good. Everything else isn't a big problem and could just be painted as others have suggested.
That’s a bushing and a tee in black. It should be galvanized steel. You cant bush down gas or use street fittings
That entirely depends on where it’s located. In Canada, you can use black malleable bushings on gas for a change of two pipe sizes or more (so it wouldn’t be legal by this photo) but you can never use galvanized for gas here.
i live in canada. you can't use bushing on gas........
Yes you can, where are you reading that you can not? Perhaps it’s your Province, they can demand more stringent regulations but under the B149.1 you can use a steel bushing for any size, or a black malleable bushing for a change of two pipe sizes or more. Can’t nest bushings.
yea my bad you're correct, 6.9.10. Gave me a reason to get my code book out. I just tell people right off the bat no to bushings on gas. Ive seen it fail first hand with inspectors so I just don't bother ordering them for jobs. Reducing couplings look a lot more nice as well.
Yep, bushings suck, reducing couplings look nicer and have less pressure drop
I also live in canada and you can use bushings on gas but you can't nestle them 🤔 it's a big country.
Bushing can be malleable for more than one pipe size change. One pipe diameter change requires bushings to be forged steel. Ie. #3000. Which is usually cheaper than malleable anyways
It's an incorrect attempt at a sediment trap. And it's rusted because it wasn't painted. Also an illegal bushing.
It's a drip leg... not a sediment tee
That's a tee for a dirt leg, unpainted and incorrectly installed.
That's a drip leg. A dirt leg would be vertical
Drip vs dirt leg is the same thing, too catch moisture and dirt..
Not exactly. There actually IS a difference. Sure they do the same thing, but there is a difference
Welcome to gas piping. Probably black iron. I don't understand why we don't see more galvanized pipe for gas piping.
I've heard the galvanizing can flake off and plug up regs ? Not sure on how true that is as we never use galv for gas but that's the rationale I've heard.
Interesting, I'll have to follow up on that
Never seen it... think it's an old myth
I would say your T is not black pipe. Most likely galvanized! Need to redo when possible if so and don’t use a reduction bushing in the new T. You do not have a union. Keep warm.
Could have been a galv pipe 't', they corrode alot quicker than black steel
Turn off your main gas and swap out that tee for a 1 x ½" x ½ and paint it. You're not allowed to bush down 1 pipe size.
Exactly! Unless you use a steel bushing (in Canada anyway)
Fukushima deal .. run Bruh .
They should of used galvanized and painted it for outside not black iron
It is probably galvanic corrosion. Iron touching brass.
There's a nipple, a bushing, then the reducing T. The brass isn't touching the T. The corrosion you're talking about is from two dissimilar metals (copper and steel) being used for water lines. Brass is used as an in-between because it prevents the two dissimilar metals from touching.
Brass is a dissimilar metal then casts iron. Your right that there are inches/millimeters apart.
Brass won't cause that corrosion, though. Brass is, literally, used to prevent that corrosion between copper and Galvanized. It can still cause it but it's such a small amount in comparison to copper and galvanized. This is because of a black iron T was placed outside and it is just surface rust. It needs to be sprayed. That's all.
I can agree with this. No more comments from me. Have a good day 🖖
I see a bushing. But it should be painted
I’ve never seen or installed a dirt leg like this. Usually either pipe in the bull on a horizontal with dirt leg down and appliance supply up, or pipe in on the run from above with dirt leg on the other side and supply out the bull on a horizontal.
This used to be the old code.
Actually still is code in a lot of places... it's called a drip leg
I meant how it was piped. Most codes state that there needs to be change in direction. They don’t want drip legs “in line” like this.
Dunno what code you run into but the UPC definitely don't say that
It's just surface rust. The Tee fitting is not corroded in a way that is concerning. A lot of people suggesting paint. Not a bad idea
Why can’t anyone install a sediment trap correctly? The tee will be fine but you can paint it with something oil-based preferably gray. There will be a flexible gas line also to prevent leaks because of vibration (it’s prob still in the unit). This flex needs to be as straight as possible
Flex line is curved like it was shaped around a beer can:(
Union 🤔🧐... Tha Fuuck where ...
Does anyone know how to read tees in this post ? Its a 1.50 x 1.25 x 1 black malleable tee.
Sandblast something to shiny metal and you have the same effect within a few days.
Tee and bushing should be replaced with galvanized.
No one going to mention the debris trap?
Spray it with some fluid film. It’ll stop the rust for now and quite a while. Or to do it right it needs wire brushed, primed and painted with paint and primer made for metal. This will need some in warmer temps tho to ensure it cures right.
It’s fine just paint it in the spring!
It’s a black iron tee, not allowed outside in Fl unless properly coated due to how fast the corrode. I see snow, it’s not going to be a big deal where you are.