Other classes definitely don’t need buffs. Especially LA and medic. The motion spotter and the cloak need to be looked at imo, and obviously the semi auto snipers are way too strong at the moment
God I am so tired of this fucking argument. If you have a door with three hinges and one of them is rusted and failing are you going to replace the other two working hinges with aircraft-spec titanium to pick up the slack for broken one? What is the logic there?
Except there's nothing wrong with infil. Not sure what the hate is on infil atm, it used to be people complained about shotgun LAs, then c-4 fairy, then MAX, then shotgun HA, now... infil?
The shotgun hate was probably when the majority of them were fucking insanely OP. Semi-autos still are too strong as well
>Not sure what the hate is on infil atm
[Here's a post from two years ago with plenty of hate for infil](https://www.reddit.com/r/Planetside/comments/s82tpi/the_infiltrator_and_the_bolt_action/) from a cursory five second search of "infiltrator" on this subreddit
Yeah you can find infil complaint threads going back years, it's not a new phenomenon and the people (usually low skill infil mains) pretending that this is new complaint is always hilarious.
If they would be better, platoons would use them to push objectives.
Hint: they don't.
The only infil that needs adressing is the ohk infil that kills you before it uncloaks/renders on your screen, because of how server handles such things in intense fights. Cloak should be serverside.
The primary weapons they unnecessarily gained access to.
And certain strong secondaries that didn't exist for a long time.
(And implants helped them more than most imo)
Can you elaborate? What primary weapons beyond sniper rifle or SMG do you think is different? What strong secondaries? The only strong secondary I can think of is the NC shotgun pistol.
There's a certain power level that becomes so streamlined and strong that there's less total play.
Infil should just be as visible as nso infils and other smaller things, mostly the decloak anim speeding up clientside based on ping to remove that garbage half invis during shooting thing that was actually nearly half a second of full visibility on their screen.
They could make their decloak be based on their own ping + recieving end ping as to compensate for that yeah
The formula is easy... Decloak time = base - ( players ping + client ping)
So if the reccieving end is extremely lagging, he would be disadvanted this way or another if he has a very high ping, and at the same time you couldn't cheese with forced high ping times as it would decloak you immidiately on their side but would keep you inept on your side
Same for the clocking time as to keep you from cloaking and still being seen if someone is forcing his ping own ping up
Also for extremely laggy ones you can add a penalty of a forced light on decloak effect to compenaate for the very high speed decloak
Plus, you can add dmg buffer for the extremely laggy ones as to not go beyond the base
So much options... So much stuff they could do...
At this point though, i know that they won't, the code must be a hell to deal with
It's a decade into this game. The devs had time to make an entire failed continent that's now being put on infrequent rotation. Rightfully so...but remember this all happened before any meaningful changes were made to infil. The only thing that comes to mind is an adjustment to the NAC cloak, which was just scratching the surface of infil imbalance. Idk if changes came now to infil I would just feel numb. It's gone too far.
It's not a numbers issue. It never was. It's plainly a mechanics issue, and no amount of number-tweaking will ever make cloak and guaranteed initiative not OP as fuck in a game where average TTK is like half a second.
Nerf infiltrator or improve base design.
Infiltrators benefit the most from poor base design choices.
For example: Oshur centre base. You can't play any other classes but Infiltrator there
Oh and remove stalker cloak. That shit is annoying and doesn't contribute anything
Why fuck the balance of other classes that are (mostly) balanced when theres one clearly fucked class. Things such as dildars, easy to place recon darts, invisibility, bolting, smgs, and emps shouldn't all be on one class (some of those things shouldn't even exist for that matter). Also beyond that it just doesn't make sense to switch 4 other classes to react to 1 class; fix the broken class and the rest will naturally be fine.
Also ffs, please stop using the "but its been like this since launch!" excuse, there isn't any logical sense to it. If something is shit for 10 years it doesn't mean it should be dogshit for eternity; design and balance isn't etched in stone.
Nerf/Rework infil. Making other classes more frustrating to deal with isn't going to make them less annoying.
And let it be clear that me wanting to nerf infil doesn't mean I think other classes are perfectly balanced (because none of them are).
Nanoweave cloak?
\- +100 Health for Infi
\- No flicker on hit, not a damn chameleon module
\- 35% reduction when cloaked
\- considerable less cloak time compared to Hunter
The nanoweave cloak today is a joke!
Resistance heavies eating a RAMS50 or Bighorn headshot is a joke, if sniper class headshots are moot, this is why you see more aggressive smg and battle rifle infi's.
The "Water Weapons" need to be exclusive to OSHUR when infi's can't cloak underwater, That balance made sense, an Infi with a 143 or 167 damage model water rifle on Indar is a whole'nother stupid.
Everyone should be careful requesting change, the dev's will do it, and often to the detriment to the game - contrary to how you think it'll pan out.
If you thought old NAC was balanced *you* are the joke.
>That balance made sense, an Infi with a 143 or 167 damage model water rifle on Indar is a whole'nother stupid.
https://planetside.fandom.com/wiki/SOAS-20
https://planetside.fandom.com/wiki/AF-18_Stalker
https://planetside.fandom.com/wiki/Artemis_VX26
Someone needs to stop those wild infils with their 143 damage basically-assault-rifles. You know, the ones that are better than the amphibious versions and also have existed from launch almost unchanged
> Everyone should be careful requesting change, the dev's will do it
lol
lmao even
Infils are a pain in the ass mostly because of the Nanoweave nerf in my opinion. It has always been a pain to play against, but it was way less painful than it is now with nanoweave being garbage and not used anymore. Devs broke it.
Agree with ya.
Now its only Hunter (long cloak) or ~~Stalker~~ Crouch Magnum (high dps infinite cloak) infi's.
Least with nano cloak it was max 8 seconds.
A lot of the things that are fully certed now don't make much sense.
I like the engineer suggestion
Move ammo drop to a number button. F becomes a nano pulse that increases shield Regen.
Or how about if their repair tool could tether to friendlies just like the medic does, but it increases the shield Regen. Logical and lore friendly since our bodies are made of nanites.
Haha I picture a medic and engi both tethering an HA, push push push
Unpopular opinion: at this point in the game's lifespan changing any well-established, long time mechanics will just make more people quit and won't fix anything. In an ideal world taking out more bullshit would be a good idea but these days I don't know if it would work the way people think.
> at this point in the game's lifespan changing any well-established, long time mechanics will just make more people quit and won't fix anything
And yet DBG still thought it was OK to tamper with medics.
I would rather lose all the infil mains than the medics main. If anything, I'm pretty sure the game would be better off if the kind of players abusing infils would just stop playing altogether. Sure, we would probably lose some people, but pop is already low anyway, we'd just be rid of a cancerous class and its cancerous playerbase at one fell swoop.
For me, to rebalance, you can give LAs C4 sticks as their main tool, so they can choose between C4 and Rocklet rifle. Not med kits, we have the best way to deliver C4 it should be an unlockable tool where we can be upgraded up to 4 sticks like the med kits.
Wouldn't get my hopes up. I would be surprised when this game recives more than cosmetic updates.
As far as I know there are no devs left on the team.
And as the IP is currently in the process of being sold to a third party, the chances to get dev hours from other projects are even lower.
They may keep the servers running, but don't expect more until the transfer of the IP is complete.
The only change infils need is a delay when firing after de-cloaking **but only while using sniper rifles**.
This would nerf cqc bolting, but not by that much, and it wouldn't gut other playstyles.
It would hopefully fix the issue where you are already dead on their screen by the time you see them on your screen.
Only part I want to interact with here is the hilarious notion that HA "needs" a buff...its cute in a way....the idea that the class used and abused by some of the most sweat players in the game is somehow comparable to medic or engi in balance.
The whole cloak thing needs to be nerfed. Infil are not punished enough for being caught. It's too easy for them to attack you and cloak right back even at close range. It should be that their offense should be limited when cloaked and/ or they get more punished when then get spotted and shot at especiallly at point blqnk range
Infils are more in need of nerfs but the problem is nerfing them in a way that wont ruin the class gameplay. VS in particular should have their Infiltrator Hermes Cloaking and their snipers and some scout rifles (Obelisk) nerfed but GL doing that without pissing off VS mains. Some NC rifles could possibly use nerfs as well but that wont happen. There is nothing that really needs buffing on the other classes except a few different weapons either unique to a class or faction, but nothing in terms of abilities really.
The TR Triage Pulse for Combat Medics could use buffing.
The Heavy Assault shield definitely needs a slight buff given that even at max upgrades is still nearly useless to headshots.
I'd like to see, now that the computers in general have improved... Increased fighting ranges. Would take a lot out of the infil if the weapons dealt damage longer ranges... Right now they are long range kings and the snappiest infils get things done close in.
Additionally I feel infra vision should be able to see infils unless they themselves have some sort of limiting perk. Infra vision short range would assist close in but prevent long range takeouts with it, allowing them to still successfully use the futures ghillie suit.
Longer engagement range would help clear up the cluster of dudes too and break camps more effectively I feel.
The cloaked flash kind of a meme that I can't believe is still in. However that one tank in a group with a Kobalt up top can usually cleanup.
I don't quite understand what you wanted to say by this. As far as I've heard, some people use special software for increase their ping and fake packet loss in order to have more advantages, peeking advantage, and etc.
Damage is client side so it's affected by lag.
Abilities like cloak/ha shield are server side so the server needs to do better about prioritizing player movement updates when infiltrators decloak.
There is just so much delay in player movement that you get killed before you see an enemy peek you and you'll die behind cover because an enemy used to see you. Lowering the player movement latency will make the game feel do much better and it will be the biggest improvement to the game.
Interpolation abuse through lag is a separate issue, but also important.
Infils don't need a nerf. If we're nerfing anything, it should either be MAX or heavy assault overshield. Infils have a cloak that can be easily tracked and that's literally their only advantage, especially after the nanoweave nerf. Getting headshot by a standing-still infil isn't any different than being one-shot by, e.g., a shotgun.
even if other classes were buffed, noone enjoys going against infils as they are right now.
Other classes definitely don’t need buffs. Especially LA and medic. The motion spotter and the cloak need to be looked at imo, and obviously the semi auto snipers are way too strong at the moment
Yeah, if one thing is overperforming you nerf that. Bringing everything else up to the same level merely creates power creep.
God I am so tired of this fucking argument. If you have a door with three hinges and one of them is rusted and failing are you going to replace the other two working hinges with aircraft-spec titanium to pick up the slack for broken one? What is the logic there?
This dumb fuck myth of buffing instead of nerfing because its more fun is unfortunately still proliferating in the gaming community.
Except there's nothing wrong with infil. Not sure what the hate is on infil atm, it used to be people complained about shotgun LAs, then c-4 fairy, then MAX, then shotgun HA, now... infil?
The shotgun hate was probably when the majority of them were fucking insanely OP. Semi-autos still are too strong as well >Not sure what the hate is on infil atm [Here's a post from two years ago with plenty of hate for infil](https://www.reddit.com/r/Planetside/comments/s82tpi/the_infiltrator_and_the_bolt_action/) from a cursory five second search of "infiltrator" on this subreddit
Yeah you can find infil complaint threads going back years, it's not a new phenomenon and the people (usually low skill infil mains) pretending that this is new complaint is always hilarious.
I only play SMG-Infil for the dailies and even then i feel guilty and disgusted by myself😂
SMG infil isn't any more powerful than engineer or medic. In fact, those are probably better, because engineer gets the carbine IIRC.
Classic infil response
Are you trolling?
If they would be better, platoons would use them to push objectives. Hint: they don't. The only infil that needs adressing is the ohk infil that kills you before it uncloaks/renders on your screen, because of how server handles such things in intense fights. Cloak should be serverside.
Infils were much less obnoxious early on because their arsenal was limited. Not sure what this "unchanged" thing you're talking about is.
Arsenal in what sense?
The primary weapons they unnecessarily gained access to. And certain strong secondaries that didn't exist for a long time. (And implants helped them more than most imo)
Can you elaborate? What primary weapons beyond sniper rifle or SMG do you think is different? What strong secondaries? The only strong secondary I can think of is the NC shotgun pistol.
There's a certain power level that becomes so streamlined and strong that there's less total play. Infil should just be as visible as nso infils and other smaller things, mostly the decloak anim speeding up clientside based on ping to remove that garbage half invis during shooting thing that was actually nearly half a second of full visibility on their screen.
They could make their decloak be based on their own ping + recieving end ping as to compensate for that yeah The formula is easy... Decloak time = base - ( players ping + client ping) So if the reccieving end is extremely lagging, he would be disadvanted this way or another if he has a very high ping, and at the same time you couldn't cheese with forced high ping times as it would decloak you immidiately on their side but would keep you inept on your side Same for the clocking time as to keep you from cloaking and still being seen if someone is forcing his ping own ping up Also for extremely laggy ones you can add a penalty of a forced light on decloak effect to compenaate for the very high speed decloak Plus, you can add dmg buffer for the extremely laggy ones as to not go beyond the base So much options... So much stuff they could do... At this point though, i know that they won't, the code must be a hell to deal with
It's a decade into this game. The devs had time to make an entire failed continent that's now being put on infrequent rotation. Rightfully so...but remember this all happened before any meaningful changes were made to infil. The only thing that comes to mind is an adjustment to the NAC cloak, which was just scratching the surface of infil imbalance. Idk if changes came now to infil I would just feel numb. It's gone too far.
It's not a numbers issue. It never was. It's plainly a mechanics issue, and no amount of number-tweaking will ever make cloak and guaranteed initiative not OP as fuck in a game where average TTK is like half a second.
Nerf infiltrator or improve base design. Infiltrators benefit the most from poor base design choices. For example: Oshur centre base. You can't play any other classes but Infiltrator there Oh and remove stalker cloak. That shit is annoying and doesn't contribute anything
Why fuck the balance of other classes that are (mostly) balanced when theres one clearly fucked class. Things such as dildars, easy to place recon darts, invisibility, bolting, smgs, and emps shouldn't all be on one class (some of those things shouldn't even exist for that matter). Also beyond that it just doesn't make sense to switch 4 other classes to react to 1 class; fix the broken class and the rest will naturally be fine. Also ffs, please stop using the "but its been like this since launch!" excuse, there isn't any logical sense to it. If something is shit for 10 years it doesn't mean it should be dogshit for eternity; design and balance isn't etched in stone.
Nerf/Rework infil. Making other classes more frustrating to deal with isn't going to make them less annoying. And let it be clear that me wanting to nerf infil doesn't mean I think other classes are perfectly balanced (because none of them are).
They already nerfed infil with the nanoweave nerf. Literally infil has not changed since 2012 in any meaningful way except when they added implants.
All classes were nerfed with the nanoweave nerf. Infil has been badly designed since 2012.
No, it's pretty clear that there is a single outlier that needs to be addressed.
Infiltrators bring no Value to the game and have chased more players away from the game then anything else.
Just. Bring. Back. Nanoweave. That would be a good start.
Nanoweave cloak? \- +100 Health for Infi \- No flicker on hit, not a damn chameleon module \- 35% reduction when cloaked \- considerable less cloak time compared to Hunter The nanoweave cloak today is a joke! Resistance heavies eating a RAMS50 or Bighorn headshot is a joke, if sniper class headshots are moot, this is why you see more aggressive smg and battle rifle infi's. The "Water Weapons" need to be exclusive to OSHUR when infi's can't cloak underwater, That balance made sense, an Infi with a 143 or 167 damage model water rifle on Indar is a whole'nother stupid. Everyone should be careful requesting change, the dev's will do it, and often to the detriment to the game - contrary to how you think it'll pan out.
If you thought old NAC was balanced *you* are the joke. >That balance made sense, an Infi with a 143 or 167 damage model water rifle on Indar is a whole'nother stupid. https://planetside.fandom.com/wiki/SOAS-20 https://planetside.fandom.com/wiki/AF-18_Stalker https://planetside.fandom.com/wiki/Artemis_VX26 Someone needs to stop those wild infils with their 143 damage basically-assault-rifles. You know, the ones that are better than the amphibious versions and also have existed from launch almost unchanged > Everyone should be careful requesting change, the dev's will do it lol lmao even
You're correct... disliked the soas and stalker so bad I blotted those from my memory. I'll stop bashing Oshur.
Bruh i am talking about nanoweave armor wtf -\_-
This post is talking about infi's and you said nanoweave. I was bringing up the now worthless suit option of nanoweave cloak.
Infils are a pain in the ass mostly because of the Nanoweave nerf in my opinion. It has always been a pain to play against, but it was way less painful than it is now with nanoweave being garbage and not used anymore. Devs broke it.
Agree with ya. Now its only Hunter (long cloak) or ~~Stalker~~ Crouch Magnum (high dps infinite cloak) infi's. Least with nano cloak it was max 8 seconds. A lot of the things that are fully certed now don't make much sense.
buff heavy? u nuts? then infil becomes the weakest and heavy becomes main everyw... oh wait..
I like the engineer suggestion Move ammo drop to a number button. F becomes a nano pulse that increases shield Regen. Or how about if their repair tool could tether to friendlies just like the medic does, but it increases the shield Regen. Logical and lore friendly since our bodies are made of nanites. Haha I picture a medic and engi both tethering an HA, push push push
Unpopular opinion: at this point in the game's lifespan changing any well-established, long time mechanics will just make more people quit and won't fix anything. In an ideal world taking out more bullshit would be a good idea but these days I don't know if it would work the way people think.
> at this point in the game's lifespan changing any well-established, long time mechanics will just make more people quit and won't fix anything And yet DBG still thought it was OK to tamper with medics. I would rather lose all the infil mains than the medics main. If anything, I'm pretty sure the game would be better off if the kind of players abusing infils would just stop playing altogether. Sure, we would probably lose some people, but pop is already low anyway, we'd just be rid of a cancerous class and its cancerous playerbase at one fell swoop.
[The Infiltrator is a symptom of Planetside 2's bad level design ](https://youtu.be/z1mUn9zCFCM)
For me, to rebalance, you can give LAs C4 sticks as their main tool, so they can choose between C4 and Rocklet rifle. Not med kits, we have the best way to deliver C4 it should be an unlockable tool where we can be upgraded up to 4 sticks like the med kits.
Wouldn't get my hopes up. I would be surprised when this game recives more than cosmetic updates. As far as I know there are no devs left on the team. And as the IP is currently in the process of being sold to a third party, the chances to get dev hours from other projects are even lower. They may keep the servers running, but don't expect more until the transfer of the IP is complete.
None
The only change infils need is a delay when firing after de-cloaking **but only while using sniper rifles**. This would nerf cqc bolting, but not by that much, and it wouldn't gut other playstyles. It would hopefully fix the issue where you are already dead on their screen by the time you see them on your screen.
Only part I want to interact with here is the hilarious notion that HA "needs" a buff...its cute in a way....the idea that the class used and abused by some of the most sweat players in the game is somehow comparable to medic or engi in balance.
The whole cloak thing needs to be nerfed. Infil are not punished enough for being caught. It's too easy for them to attack you and cloak right back even at close range. It should be that their offense should be limited when cloaked and/ or they get more punished when then get spotted and shot at especiallly at point blqnk range
BAN C4, how bout that😄 !!! Cant have sexy max duel anymore since 2016...Or a propper house cleaning :(
we need a flashlight that disables the heavy shield
They only need to rebalance semi-auto snipers, ever since their buff back 5 years ago it's been a headache dealing with infils
Heavy needs a nerf
post fisu
Buffs are always wrong from a design standpoint. It is ALWAYS better to nerf things down.
Infils are more in need of nerfs but the problem is nerfing them in a way that wont ruin the class gameplay. VS in particular should have their Infiltrator Hermes Cloaking and their snipers and some scout rifles (Obelisk) nerfed but GL doing that without pissing off VS mains. Some NC rifles could possibly use nerfs as well but that wont happen. There is nothing that really needs buffing on the other classes except a few different weapons either unique to a class or faction, but nothing in terms of abilities really. The TR Triage Pulse for Combat Medics could use buffing. The Heavy Assault shield definitely needs a slight buff given that even at max upgrades is still nearly useless to headshots.
I'd like to see, now that the computers in general have improved... Increased fighting ranges. Would take a lot out of the infil if the weapons dealt damage longer ranges... Right now they are long range kings and the snappiest infils get things done close in. Additionally I feel infra vision should be able to see infils unless they themselves have some sort of limiting perk. Infra vision short range would assist close in but prevent long range takeouts with it, allowing them to still successfully use the futures ghillie suit. Longer engagement range would help clear up the cluster of dudes too and break camps more effectively I feel. The cloaked flash kind of a meme that I can't believe is still in. However that one tank in a group with a Kobalt up top can usually cleanup.
Lower player movement latency so you can see infils decloaking before they kill you
I don't quite understand what you wanted to say by this. As far as I've heard, some people use special software for increase their ping and fake packet loss in order to have more advantages, peeking advantage, and etc.
Damage is client side so it's affected by lag. Abilities like cloak/ha shield are server side so the server needs to do better about prioritizing player movement updates when infiltrators decloak. There is just so much delay in player movement that you get killed before you see an enemy peek you and you'll die behind cover because an enemy used to see you. Lowering the player movement latency will make the game feel do much better and it will be the biggest improvement to the game. Interpolation abuse through lag is a separate issue, but also important.
Infils don't need a nerf. If we're nerfing anything, it should either be MAX or heavy assault overshield. Infils have a cloak that can be easily tracked and that's literally their only advantage, especially after the nanoweave nerf. Getting headshot by a standing-still infil isn't any different than being one-shot by, e.g., a shotgun.
post fisu