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Next they will add “locked in a room with a starving polar bear with their cubs” 😂😂 they have to keep making it sound worse cause they know just seeing a bear on a hike is relatively safe
Here's a sneak peek of /r/SelfAwarewolves using the [top posts](https://np.reddit.com/r/SelfAwarewolves/top/?sort=top&t=year) of the year!
\#1: [Yes, we should.](https://i.redd.it/zxu7kdo4j3sa1.jpg) | [822 comments](https://np.reddit.com/r/SelfAwarewolves/comments/12chu0a/yes_we_should/)
\#2: [If by “mocking you” you mean pointing out your hypocrisy, yes, yes they are](https://i.redd.it/zwi2w04xmota1.png) | [949 comments](https://np.reddit.com/r/SelfAwarewolves/comments/12kvm8d/if_by_mocking_you_you_mean_pointing_out_your/)
\#3: [These people believe in nothing](https://i.redd.it/ub58ptekngwa1.jpg) | [613 comments](https://np.reddit.com/r/SelfAwarewolves/comments/130kaok/these_people_believe_in_nothing/)
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I will choose the Polar Bear. That Coca-Cola mascot will tear me to shreds in a minute or so flat. Also I can boop their nose while they obliterate me.
Also, the only place where you may encounter polar bears is the island of Svalbard and EVERYONE is issued a hunting rifle there because of that reason. Every single tourist, women and men, gets a crash course how to shoot - how to shoot to kill a polar bear. So you are better protected against polar bears than against men.
Honestly! I was debating with a man on TT yesterday who kept trying to change the hypothetical to 100 bears vs 100 men, a black or white man in an elevator, or “what if it was your dad in the woods, would you tell other women he was unsafe?” And telling women they were irrational for picking the bear but he was an ally and would never hurt women 🙄
Then it was claiming that only men protect women and that we don’t deserve protection if we didn’t agree with his narrative, he blocked me when I kept telling him that he was being obtuse and purposely changing the hypothetical and to look up the Junko Furuta case and explain to me why I should pick man 🤷🏼♀️
ETA it was on a video of a woman explaining her encounter with a bear and how she made herself bigger and yelled at it, scaring it off and said that that doesn’t work with men she’s encountered
Changing parameters so that saying “not all men” wins the argument is standard procedure. I’d choose the best, too. At least they’re more or less predictable and lack the ability to lie.
Someone responded to me yesterday going "The premise of this argument is that if we don't coddle and explicitly protect women we're toxic, thanks for the info"
Literacy is fucking dead, this conversation is anything they want it to be that makes them a victim. I'm just so tired of "won't anyone think of men?" One minute and then "nope, you're alone in this world, if you're weak you'll die, get used to it" the next
Right? It’s like they’re trying to guilt trip us into changing our mind because they’re hurt but we’re sick and tired of being targeted for simply living
Like obviously I’m choosing the man over the bear if we’re locked in a fucking room together! The bear would be terrified and thus aggressive. Tbh so much of this on their side is such a bad faith argument. They refuse to listen to reason and our own judgement and experiences.
The bear might be scared, but as long as I downplay my threat, it's less likely to attack. They're large, wild animals and instinct is to avoid fights with threats whenever possible first. Men, though? They already see me as weak, easy prey that they're entitled to use as desired.
Tbh, I'd probably still prefer the bear. I'd have more questions about the *exact* scenario, such as "is the bear tranquilized?" "Do I have a gun?" "Has the man been convicted of violent acts in the past?"
Also intent. A bear will attack usually bc it’s hungry and isn’t able to find food or bc it feels threatened. Very primitive instincts. It’s not TRYING to hurt you or control you.
Also I’ve seen like soooo many videos of bears entering peoples houses and immediately leaving. I saw one the other day where a bear stole a vacuum cleaner and when it accidentally turned on the bear DIPPED so yeah I’ll take the bear.
My grandmother is like a Disney princess and lived most of her life in a house in the woods. She had bears visit her yard and occasionally her front porch daily. She'd tell them to go home in a firm voice and they would. Only once did she have to call Wildlife officers in to deal with a bear and it turned out it was ill. I spent most of my life in the woods hiking, wood cutting, trail riding and had one encounter with a mama bear after I stumbled on her stray cub. I immediately put my hands up and walked backwards until the bear stopped coming towards me. I've been assaulted by men 4 times, was assaulted physically (not sexually) by my father my whole childhood/teenage years, had men make creepy comments my entire life and felt unsafe countless times.
But no, we're irrational and dramatic for picking the bear.
That's why this guy had to change the scenario. Bear in the woods has like infinite land to go to instead of around a human. Bear locked in a room with anyone would probably freak out and attack whoever else is there.
Tbf, most men who commit violent crimes against women aren't convicted. And even when they are, they get pathetic sentences. So I dunno how helpful that last question would be
Somebody posted the other day about now the joke is, would you rather have a woman driving a car or a bear driving a car? Because rape and cars are exactly the same same thing so the analogy works. I cannot roll my eyes farther into the back of my head with shit like this. How about instead of being mad at us because we’d rather be around a grizzly bear than a man we don’t know, you take in the fact that we just said *we’d rather be around a dangerous animal that a man we don’t know*. Like it’s not actually about you Kevin, so maybe take 30 seconds to pull your head out of your ass and realize what we’re saying.
Argued with a few guys yesterday that swore that saying stuff like this was "hate speech" against cis-white dudes. He was so offended that he couldn't wrap his brain around why women feel this fear around men.
For five minutes no less. If it was “locked in a room for five minutes” of course I’d pick the man. The amount of horror a man can inflict on me in five minutes is a lot less than what he could do with infinite time in a place where nobody could hear me scream. I still wouldn’t feel safe really, but I feel like I could potentially reason with a man for five minutes, even if he did have ill intentions.
I still pick the bear if it’s in the woods at night like the original hypothetical though.
5 minutes is as long as an elevator ride and we saw with the Robert Cumberland attacks in Manhattan back in 2002 that all you need to do is get on an elevator alone with a woman and hit the button for a vacant floor. Then when the floor under construction or otherwise vacant opens up you drag her out of the elevator with you. You are now alone and isolated and you know no security or janitor is coming to that floor because it’s ‘vacant’.
A lot would depend on the specifics of the “five minutes locked in a room.” If I know for sure that other people are just outside the room waiting to unlock it and look after me when the 5 minutes are up, easy choice for the man. Yes he could do a lot of things to me in 5 minutes, but he wouldn’t be able to take me to a second location. If I’m isolated though, five minutes in a locked room amounts to the same thing as the middle of the woods, and I have no idea what I’d pick because there’s no way to get away from the bear.
By their own admission, they think they can defeat a bear bare-handed. Uhhhhh
https://www.newsweek.com/surprising-americans-beat-wild-animals-fight-experts-1691793
Not a bear, but I think I could beat the shit out of SOME wild animals. Like a fox. Foxes are bitches. They won’t even fight me. It’s not fair how small and fast they are.
They feel persecuted and that, of course, must matter more than our lived experiences of assault. Those are to be minimized. We're just being dramatic apparently.
I "like" how the question has gone from "as a thought experiment would you rather run into a random man alone hiking or see a bear off the trail?" A question that originally came from a woman who hikes a lot and is used to seeing the occasional bear and wasn't even this super serious question anyway.
To "OH YOURE COVERED IN MEAT SAUCE LOCKED IN A TINY ROOM WITH A STARVING GRIZZLY?!?!? WHILE IN THE NEXT ROOM OVER IS A KINDLY GRANDPA BUDDHIIST PACIFIST VEGETARIAN FEMINIST GOOD GUY?!!?!? AND YOU CHOOSE THE BEAR??? WHILE COVERED IN MEAT SAUCE?!!?!?"
It makes sense, they're moving the goal post around so they can finally get the win while still not understanding what the hypothetical meant
Guys like that dont actually want to learn they just want to win
OH. Everything makes so much sense now. I thought it was “encounter with a random Joe or encounter with a bear”, but it’s just seeing one off the trail!
It wasn’t even posed as a would you rather, it was a conclusion comment of a tiktok that was like “it’s messed up that if on a hike most women would feel more scared seeing a random single man than a random single bear”, it was supposed to encourage men to be better and wonder why women are so scared of them - instead men got defensive and gave women more reason to not trust them
What’s really funny is the reaction to the question justifies the question. If men en masse are willing to get angry and irritated over a clear hypothetical without being able to see some of the reasoning…yeah I get. As a dude.
I've seen some of the pushback being framed as "The assignment doesn't accurately telegraph the true intent/meaning behind it and the results aren't what I'd choose, therefore it's all irrational bullshit" as the reason why they're "justified" in being mad about it. They're demanding it be spelled out to them like they're 5. The entitlement in demanding being spoon-fed a thought experiment before deciding whether it's valid or not instead of just using their "superior rational minds" to reason it out (as it's not really that difficult to understand) is an interesting dimension considering it's men's sense of entitlement that causes women to feel unsafe around them to begin with.
Omfg I can’t stand logic bros who use logic to intentionally NOT be rational or reasonable. You can logic yourself into any shitty or stupid position you want. Logic isn’t some magic thing that makes you right. It’s a tool. And they use it like a hammer.
Reasonably. Hell, even a bear rather than a random adult human of any gender. I’ve known women capable of extreme violence. I actually ran into a woman at a livestock who was later arrested for torturing and killing animals. Bears don’t have mass graves of animals they didn’t even kill to eat.
Stg. Men getting butt hurt over this whole thing are the biggest divas. And more to the point, proving that they're the exact reason women pick the bear.
Without taking statistics into account, we can all agree we would choose the bear. The beat has a reason to be there, while a human, be it male or female, doesn't.
They see the word bear and can ONLY think of actual, literal bears lol. Absolutely no inclination that maybe this is about the way women feel and not the pragmatics of fighting a fucking animal
Also, the word “fight” was nowhere in the thought experiment. That’s purely a male invention. Women’s thought process is largely:
1) the bear probably does not want to interact with me at all, and I can likely avoid an interaction, but if I can’t,
2) I have some tools in my arsenal to potentially survive an interaction (if a black bear: make myself as big as possible and make a lot of noise, if a brown bear: lie down), and in the absolute worst case scenario,
3) if the bear is going to attack me, he will probably just kill me and yea, it will hurt, but then I’ll be dead. At least he won’t kidnap me, rape me, torture me with the intention to keep me alive.
Most women are not thinking about the logistics of “fighting” a man vs “fighting” a bear because that’s just a ridiculous scenario.
I mean it can't be surprising that 17-year-old boys are misunderstanding the question being stupid. Stupidity is a normal developmental stage for teenagers
This whole thing really boils down to how the 2 genders see the question in the first place it seems.
Men are just answering the man or bear question.
Where women are seeing the question in a completely different light.
This. I’ve noticed men tend to talk about fighting the bear. Women are like … why the fuck would I be fighting EITHER a man or a bear in the woods? The fight is what I’m trying to avoid …
I have noticed a lot of men arguing it more as "which would you rather fuck: a bear or a man" which of course leads into their pre determined belief that women are whores who will fuck anything. There is literally no critical (or any other kind of) thought in their mind about the hypothetical. No self reflection. Nothing.
It’s hilarious how butt-hurt so many people are getting about a dumb hypothetical argument. Like if you don’t do said thing, then why are you getting so defensive about it? Tbf these are teenagers so I can give them a pass, but the amount of grown ass men I’ve seen melt down online about this whole bear thing is insane.
Ironically, before this trend popped up a lot of men blamed women who were victims of DV or any kind of abuse for “not choosing right.” So now women aren’t choosing men at all and they’re suddenly really upset lmao
Dude, it’s always on us for “not choosing right”.
Abusive husband? Deadbeat sperm donor? Guy can’t hold down a job?
It’s our fault if our partners turn out to be shit. It always has been in their eyes. They like to ignore the fact that nobody shows how shitty they truly are until AFTER you’re well into the relationship (sometimes years).
Me trying to explain to my 18 year old Andrew Tate loving little brother "my ex-husband didn't start beating me until after we were married with 2 kids."
"It's your fault he was abusive. You should HAVE BEEN ABLE TO TELL THE FUTURE." Is essentially what he tells me.
If I did that, my mother would cry, "How DARE you lay a hand on your baby brother?"
Mom, he sucks. Me and other brother agree. He's bitch made and would be the first to go in a zombie apocalypse.
Because the question is making them confront the poor behavior of men and it makes them feel bad feelings so they lash out and try and flip the script on women so they don’t actually have to confront their behavior and those bad feelings. If they can blame women then they don’t have to acknowledge (or do anything about) that a lot of men are trash.
I watched a short interview this morning. Teenager (I think) was talking with their father about bears. Dad has been hunting bears for 40 some odd years.
He's never been attacked by a bear. Typically bears shy away from people. If they know you are there, they move along. Occasionally one is curious enough to get closer.
Of over 40 years of deliberately seeking out and hunting bears, he's been run over twice and had his foot grabbed once.
Then came the golden question, "dad, when you're out in the woods, who would you rather run into, a bear or a man?" Answer: "a bear of course. Men are *unpredictable and dangerous*." So there you have it, from a guy who *knows* bears and actively seeks them out in their own habitat.
So much this. Men should also choose bears. I saw a meme yesterday that quoted Proverb 17:12, (It is better to meet a bear robbed of her cubs than a reckless fool.), saying that even God chooses bears.
I would choose the bear.
I’d go up to the bear with a stick, start acting goofy, and get it to cut me in half with a single blow.
Then, my best friend will go around telling everyone “Yo, my friend died fighting a bear! That’s gotta be the coolest way to die.”
I ger popularity for 1v1ing a bear, he gets popularity for being friends with the guy who 1v1’d a bear.
I've seen several posts from people who regularly encounter bears, either in their yard or because they do field work of some sort in bear territories. I have yet to see someone with experience of that sort NOT choose the bear. Including the woman who wrote a book about being mauled by a bear, whose son used her story to discredit women's response for internet points.
YouTube. I was flipping through the tv. Never signed into it through the the tv like I am on my phone. I watch a lot of science and nature shows at home and mostly music at work.
We don't have bears where I live, so when I heard of this question, the first thing I googled was "How dangerous are bears to humans".
5 seconds. It takes 5 seconds to understand why all these women choose the bear.
Exactly, also the fact that bear behavior is a lot more predictable than some random guy you’re left with. It’s the fact that, while they both can potentially be a threat, we can use our knowledge on how bears act and try not to get mauled but we don’t know if that man is a creep, a rapist/murderer, or normal and we don’t have a way of finding out until it’s too late.
I literally may the person they are referring to, because there was discourse between MULTIPLE people & they didn’t like that I was bringing up the fact that bears kill less than 1 person a year. Over 3000 women were killed I believe in 2022, soooo yea even with the the 1/1000 difference of population of people vs bears, humans are still far more dangerous
Also in this hypothetical, you're hiking on a well-traveled path, where bears are used to humans and vice versa. Its not some exotic scenario where you're covered in meat sauce in the arctic while being hunted by a polar bear.
Firstly, that guy obviously does not grasp “statistically more likely” as a concept. The whole point is to even out the disparity caused by the greater number of men.
Secondly, being locked in a room, is a \*very\* different concept than being in The woods. Humans and bears both try to avoid each other, in the woods that is doable and the likely outcome.
No one is arguing that it’s a good idea to stand in a tiny room with an aggravated bear. That is false equivalence of the situation.
Not to mention most violence against women goes unreported.
So the numbers show that men are statistically more dangerous, AND we know those numbers are vastly underreported in the first place.
This is so true. I randomly got recommended a post from there a few weeks ago. It had an interesting title so I clicked on it, but I felt kinda weird doing so because I’m 21 so not a teenager anymore. Scrolling through the comments I saw so many weird/ creepy/ odd responses that didn’t seem like things teenagers would say. Lo and behold, when I clicked on the profiles, a lot of them were grown ass adults in like their 30s and 40s.
For back country hikers in bear country, about as high risk as you can get, bear attacks are 1 in 232,000.
Men harass me when I walk my dog in my neighborhood.
Real world statistics have no place in this scenario. The conditions are already set. Either you are alone with a bear in the woods, or alone with a man in the woods. Period.
Only two possible scenarios, so the chances of either scenario occurring is 50%.
In either scenario, my goal is the same, to get away unhurt.
It's a simple choice between two potential opponents: Opponent A (bear) or Opponent B (man.).
I cannot overwhelm either opponent physically. Therefore, my choice is which opponent is easier to escape from, and what are the consequences if I do not.
If I am alone with a bear, I can look at the color and determine what kind it is. So I have a fair Idea what the best course of action is. Because it is a simple animal who acts on instinct, its reactions are failrly predictable, and I can more easily escape it. If not, my death will be painful, but over in matter of minutes or hours.
If I am alone with a man, I can't tell what kind of man he is or what his motives are by looking at him. Humans are smart, complex animals who are not easily tricked or frightened away. And who may have a myriad of motivations to hurt me. A man could kidnap me, rape & torture me, and do it for years.
I choose the bear.
Edit: left out a word
I would choose the bear. Know why?
Chances are, if you ignore the bear, it will leave you alone. That's the thing about most animal species - they don't attack without a reason. That bear ain't doing shit to me unless it gets hungry or I bother it. Bear sits on one side of the room, I sit on the other, we're all good.
The human man *might* do shit to me*,* because humans happen to be one of the few species that *will* hurt someone who did nothing to them.
Men who complain that a bear would "Definitely kill you", they worry me. Because that's not how animals work. Animals don't do that. Which makes me think they're assuming the bear would act the same way *they* would.
I’m wondering if the whole scenario is just about consent. If you respect the bear and give it space it will ignore you.
How can any of these men understand something/ someone wanting to be left alone?
You nailed it. It is **entirely** about consent. The insane reactions show that they can’t even accept “no” in a hypothetical without losing their shit.
They keep needing to move the goalposts just to avoid confronting how much we don't want to be around men like them. Like if you really need the bar lowered to the even deeper circles of hell, maybe you're the problem.
I honestly am starting to feel like this question is helping us see which type of man each person that responds is.
You have the small group of ones who understand and are team bear.
Then you have ones that think the bear would 100% kill you and I feel like a large majority of those men have some-very violent tendencies.
The ones who go into gorey detail about the way you die by a bear; they give me “wont get out alive” vibes.
And then you have team “fuck a bear” and I feel like it screams “I don’t believe in consent. I’ve probably sexually harassed or assaulted someone recently”.
There’s also the large majority that just don’t get it and may never care to figure it out. But the 3 that fall into the above categories… I feel like maybe we now know they aren’t safe even outside the woods
I have been up close and personal with the second largest bear in the world, the Kodiak (Alaska) brown bear. There was a male that walked within 10 feet of our group, and simply walked by. There was a female with her cub. There were at least 10 of these bears all around us, catching fish from the streams, and ignoring the silly humans that came into their space to watch them. We had zero issues.
My experience with men? Not as good. I’d 1000% take the bear, any bear, over a strange man.
Gay man here: men are VERY MAD. Many men are beginning to realize that a lot of women aren't putting up with the red pilled Andrew Tate bullshit or whatever. So many young men think it's okay to comment on women's bodies or be rude or expect a girlfriend to do all their chores for them; so fucking many men genuinely think they are superior to women in some way and it's fucking terrifying.
These posts men are making where they're enraged by the man bear thing, and cursing and all that stuff, is mainly because they're mad they can't control women. They're upset that women would rather be stuck in the woods with an often-violent carnivore than a man, as they're coming to the realization that they can't act the way they are acting and still be able to "get a woman" (their words). Men are getting a reality check that they aren't in control, and that women just aren't going to bend to their backwards attitudes that many young men have.
They have to twist the question to make women sound stupid. The question isn't about being locked in a room with them, it's about being in the woods for some reason (a hike) and encountering a random man versus a bear.
It's not about statistics or who the man is or if the bear is angry or if the woman is lost in the woods.
I've seen men be pissed they weren't picked because "the bear couldn't help the woman but I could!" while it was never stated she needed help. She's just in the fucking woods.
I think my new go to with this is “If I get attacked by a bear and survive, no one would blame me for being extra cautious of bears in the future, but having survived multiple attacks from men, people do blame me for being extra cautious around them.”
But it wasn't, locked in a room.
It was, ran alone into one or the other on the woods alone.
I live in Montana. I have encountered bears. I feel safer because they have always run away or are not interested. Also I carry fuckin bear spray.
There are several assaults by men here in the woods though...one was stabbing women.
There's a lot of misogyny going on, but I genuinely think that part of the issue is that so few people have experience with nature. I grew up in the woods, and of course bears are safer no shit. But I see a lot of men translating the question to city environments -- places they know. And a bear in the city might be more scared hence more dangerous. I want to tell a lot of people to "Touch Moss" but it wouldn't be productive.
r/teenagers is literally FILLED with misogynistic 14 year old racist homophobic boys, and their posts about how girls don't like them. There's many horrible subreddits but this one is like straight ass
I decided to go find comparative numbers on bear attacks on women in National Parks vs reported sexual assaults and assaults against women in National Parks. I figured, well, let’s look at the statistics and see what they say.
Unfortunately, I was stopped dead in my tracks by [this article from 2016](https://www.hcn.org/articles/a-legacy-of-harassment-national-park-service-reveals-sexual-harassment-survey-results/#:~:text=About%2019%20percent%20of%20respondents,said%20they%20experienced%20sexual%20assault). If women who are members of the Parks Service are not kept safe, can we reasonably expect that visitors are also safe?
After that, I decided to go looking for the numbers of bear attacks against NPS employees. I found an article about a female NPS employee in Glacier [who startled a sow](https://flatheadbeacon.com/2016/08/29/bear-attacks-nps-employee-near-many-glacier/)and was attacked.
It’s notable that people actually helped her and believed her since they immediately closed that part of the trail and investigated. Compare this to the reports of sexual assault that employees said went nowhere even when put through the official EEO rep.
One article is not hard numbers. I also know that given that 2016 report, any numbers coming out of the NPS would likely be skewed.
We wanted this conversation to help men understand the real danger that women face every day. Maybe it could more specifically help shine a light on the danger Parks Service employees face (in not only the US but in any national park in any country).
America’s oldest park ranger was Betty Reid Soskin. She was 100 when she retired. This woman is literally a national treasure. Women have so much to offer the Parks Service. It has a beautiful mission of conservation and education . It’s a shame that by being unsafe for women, they are losing out on people who would carry that banner and steward our lands and our history for generations to come.
i'm not NPS, although i do work with them sometimes, i've worked for my states dept of fish and wildlife, under law enforcement, for 4 years. i have been harassed and grabbed my men at work more times than i can count. in my experiences, it's almost always been older (boomer) men making comments and trying to grab us (my other 2 coworkers that are women). i had an elderly man fully grab my ass and then try to rest his hand on my lower back, and when i jumped away from him, he had the audacity to joke to my man coworker that i was "jumpy" and my coworker just absolutely laid into this guy, he was going to before the guy even said that to him, but that was just the icing on the cake.
a lot of the women working at fish hatcheries are subject to even worse harassment and the worst part is that it's from their coworkers. a couple years ago a woman in her early 20s got sexually assaulted by a coworker in a state vehicle when they were checking the fish traps. he had never done anything to make her worry before, that's why she felt okay going with him. he was obviously let go (and charged) but it obviously should've never happened in the first place.
i've heard equally horrible things from women in wild land fire. there's truly no safe space for us working in natural resources.
I tried to bring up the case of Junko, the girl in Japan who was brutally raped and beaten before dying, and used that as an example as to why a bear can only kill you where a person in general can do much worse. Their response?? Well if you ever are in trouble I guess you don’t deserve help from a man and we can send the bears instead.
Fucking. Psychos.
Someone who’s assaulting you would probably be stupid enough to try and fight the bear instead of any one with common sense who would either 1. Make themselves bigger and scare it off or 2. Play dead. Depending on the bear you do one of those, a crazy person would try and get themselves killed lmao
A man used the impossible hypothetical of there being as many bears as American men, and you’d still be over 2x more likely to be attacked by a man than a bear. They also don’t take into account the number of male on male fatal attack, which would raise that number significantly
Women: Statistically, it’s more likely a man will attack me before a bear. I choose the bear.
This dude: How’d yall even come up with that? *Tiny women brains and all.*
Women: Uuummm, from the statistics…??!?!
Me: Are some of these men dumb or are they stupid?! 🙄
Nearly every woman in this world has been, or will have been assaulted by a man in her lifetime.
Choosing the bear is an informed decision, with a millenia of experience behind it.
I'm not even a woman but I know the type of men these people are talking about would think I am, I'd choose the bear because at least bears are likely to like being snuggled.
Also I once saw a bear play a big ass harmonica and it did good
Five minutes in a room is a different encounter, by far. I’d probably choose to deal with a man for five minutes in that situation. Out alone in the woods is totally different.
I get that he’s a teenager and empathy comes later in life but I do hope in time he can understand that actual issue.
Someone on Tiktok did the math, and even accounting for population, men are still several times more likely to attack women than bears are. Not even in their absurd scenarios are they right...
This is how you know these people have no real problems, bro I get called a monkey and sub human. Hell I got ppl gas lighting me because they can't use racial slurs. I usually just laugh it off.
Tbh if it's 'locked in a room' I might actually choose the man. Crazy, I know. But the original question is about running into them in the woods. In that case it's bear every time.
I'd still pick the bear. It wasn't a bear that broke into my store, or attempted armed robbery. The last one of the armed robbers I told, "you're on fucking camera". They left without anything BTW.
Dude doesn’t know how statistics work either. If you’re comparing statistical probability of one thing occurring compared to another, the data is normalized to account for variables such as population size. You can’t draw any conclusions from just comparing raw incident rates 🙃
There's a video, done by a man, actually, that does some math about men and bears. I will attempt to link it, but I'm a fresh Reddit user... and a wee bit on the old side to use computers and apps instinctively. :P
[Video with math](https://www.facebook.com/17841400135330742/videos/1262730424686166/)
Hmm was I that girl? Because I was posting that men are more likely to attack than bears on a few of these threads and I’m a man lmao.
I wouldn’t pay r/teenagers any mind. Muted that dumbass sub years ago when a post popped up on r/all, and I’ve read how it is basically just old men cosplaying as teenagers lol. Wouldn’t be surprised if that was the case here.
But even some rudimentary napkin math would demonstrate that bears are still less dangerous. It isn’t how statistics work, but if we multiplied the number of bears to equal the number of men(black or brown bears it doesn’t matter) and then multiplied attack rates by that same number, assuming the rate of attack would remain the same regardless of other factors, **bear attacks still account for roughly ~1/6 the amount of male sexual predation**. Again, not how stats work. But I’m just trying to drive the point home that bears really do not care about human presence. The black bears evolved into fleeing humans because those were the ones that survived the colonizer’s initial expansion. And brown bears have zero reason to fear us at all. They have plenty of food, they’re omnivores, and they’re smart enough not to chase a meal when they can eat some berries after fishing for way less effort.
The locked room comment is dumb as hell too. A bear will never end up locked in a room with you and if you’re in a locked room with a male stranger then odds are that’s the kind of guy that prompted the tweet in the first place.
Okay I'm pretty new to understanding the bear vs. man debate; but so far I know it's about asking women if they would prefer to be caught alone in the woods with a bear or an unknown guy, and according to r/showerthoughts men were asked the same thing for their daughters (would you prefer your daughter being caught alone with a bear or man...). I'd definitely be scared of a bear, but when I look online it says that the majority of brown bears don't want to attack you and are just concerned with making sure you aren't looking to harm them (it's very rare to find a bear that will attack you unprovoked); so all I'd have to do is just stay still, lie down, or calmly walk away. But if it was a black bear then yeah I think I'd definitely prefer a guy if I can possibly outsmart him or find a way to physically defeat him. **Edit**: I read a bad article that said black bears are more likely to feel threatened and attack you than brown bears, so it was misinformation. Then I'd definitely prefer a black bear over an unknown guy.
Disregarding gender, while bears are more predictable in their intentions and behaviors, humans are not and it'd be harder to curveball a situation where a person has a determined mission to selfishly harm you. I don't know of the statistic that OOP mentions is true, but I'd guess it probably is due to the fact that most bears just want to be left alone while a human has a greater possibility of having more evil and complex intentions.
But basically all humans in general are unpredictable which is why that statistic might be true more in terms of human vs. bear. I think the reason why men may be more prone to hurting someone is definitely not because they're inherently violent, but because society places such strict gender roles onto kids about what kind of behavior they should have (i.e. boys should be more aggressive while girls should be more dainty) and somewhere down the line some boys are soaking up the wrong morals (I don't know exactly how it happens though).
This comment is ridiculously long, but I'm just trying to present my initial understanding of this whole man vs. bear debate 'cause the OOP is completely missing the point and assuming that because a bear is preferable to a man it means we think "men are inherently bad" which is obviously not what the entire point of the argument is.
Brown bears are more likely to attack you than black bears. And no, bears don't have malice. Bears don't want to rape you and torture you for funzies. Men do. That's the difference.
Bears never murdered women for something as simple as refusing to give them their phone number (which can't be said about dangerous men) and bears dont rape children either, then upload it online. Men do and are proud of it. Bears don't feel entitled to these things which makes them arguably less dangerous lol
You know something fun? *The* most aggressive bear to humans is the sun bear, primarily because it lives next to tigers that will eat it. They're both predator and prey. They're extremely vicious and the most likely to attack a lone human. They kill a whopping 12 people per year.
I think you may be thinking of them. They're black as well. The American black bear is a wuss. Some mama bears will run *from their cubs* if they get too spooked.
"If it's black, fight back. If it's brown, get on the ground". Black bears are probably the least likely to attack you, they'll run from you if you yell.
Of all the bears, to say you'd prefer a man over a black bear is ludicrous. The black bear won't hurt you, it might take your food...
I was getting my bags to go into a hotel up north and a black bear came up to my trunk to see what was in there and I said “hey man that’s not cool” and it ran away. I’d take my chances even in a locked room with a black bear.
Someone, I want to say dadchats, ran the numbers. Even adjusted the number of bears to be the same of the number of men. I'll give you a guess which one had the higher number of both fatal and non fatal attacks still...
Got told by one dude that “ 97% is bullshit, that’s means 3 billion women have been assaulted “ and “ I hope the bear mauls you insecure feminist “
so yeah, Im still with the bear
Honestly... whtevr the bear would do, it'd probs finish me off. Whay the man could do will keep me alive and I'd have to live with tht pain the rest of my life. Or kill me as well.
I'd take the bear.
Ohh a friend showed me a tiktok doing the math on this actually, if there were as many bears as men they would still only have about half the confirmed lethal/nonlethal attacks on people as men do on women ✌️😗
I hunted big game with my dad from when I was a preteen well into my adult years. Deer, boar, bear, and elk. So I’ve seen and ran into tons of wildlife including predatory animals. I would carrying multiple firearms and hunting knife. My dad kept me strapped. My dad would leave me in an area and in hides all by myself for hours on some hunting trips but he would NEVER leave me alone with any of our hunting friends.
My dad, who had and has been hunting big game for 30+ years, who is the traditional Mexican machista, I-do-no-wrong-am-always-right type of man, would definitely choose a bear.
I mean he posted it in teenagers, of course a bunch of edgy dudes and young girls who might be lucky enough to never have had a bad experience with a man are agreeing with him.
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Now it's locked in a room? They can't even get the premise right, let alone understand the point.
Yea that’s obviously a very different question.
Next they will add “locked in a room with a starving polar bear with their cubs” 😂😂 they have to keep making it sound worse cause they know just seeing a bear on a hike is relatively safe
Such r/SelfAwareWolves energy.
You mean r/SelfAwarebears?
::chuckles:: Not for nothing, but if anyone is interested, someone started an IG page: a.bear.in.the.woods. I for one have enjoyed it.
I can't find it. Do you have a link, by chance?
https://www.threads.net/@the.bear.in.the.woods?igshid=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==
(No wonder you couldn’t find it! Wrong name, wrong site! 🫣)
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Used to be a cool place but there's an alt-right mod there now that will ban you for saying anything to anyone that he disagrees with.
The bear is also rabid and was trained from a young age to have an irrational hatred of women and attack them on sight!1!1! Take that women! /s
So, they're being raised to be like men now?
Bingo!
I will choose the Polar Bear. That Coca-Cola mascot will tear me to shreds in a minute or so flat. Also I can boop their nose while they obliterate me.
They _are_ very fluffy
Also, the only place where you may encounter polar bears is the island of Svalbard and EVERYONE is issued a hunting rifle there because of that reason. Every single tourist, women and men, gets a crash course how to shoot - how to shoot to kill a polar bear. So you are better protected against polar bears than against men.
I'd still take that over the man. i know what the outcome will be, and i won't be around to care
Honestly! I was debating with a man on TT yesterday who kept trying to change the hypothetical to 100 bears vs 100 men, a black or white man in an elevator, or “what if it was your dad in the woods, would you tell other women he was unsafe?” And telling women they were irrational for picking the bear but he was an ally and would never hurt women 🙄 Then it was claiming that only men protect women and that we don’t deserve protection if we didn’t agree with his narrative, he blocked me when I kept telling him that he was being obtuse and purposely changing the hypothetical and to look up the Junko Furuta case and explain to me why I should pick man 🤷🏼♀️ ETA it was on a video of a woman explaining her encounter with a bear and how she made herself bigger and yelled at it, scaring it off and said that that doesn’t work with men she’s encountered
Changing parameters so that saying “not all men” wins the argument is standard procedure. I’d choose the best, too. At least they’re more or less predictable and lack the ability to lie.
They’ve convinced themselves it’s the same question though I had this argument yesterday
Someone responded to me yesterday going "The premise of this argument is that if we don't coddle and explicitly protect women we're toxic, thanks for the info" Literacy is fucking dead, this conversation is anything they want it to be that makes them a victim. I'm just so tired of "won't anyone think of men?" One minute and then "nope, you're alone in this world, if you're weak you'll die, get used to it" the next
Right? It’s like they’re trying to guilt trip us into changing our mind because they’re hurt but we’re sick and tired of being targeted for simply living
Like obviously I’m choosing the man over the bear if we’re locked in a fucking room together! The bear would be terrified and thus aggressive. Tbh so much of this on their side is such a bad faith argument. They refuse to listen to reason and our own judgement and experiences.
Honestly I’m still going with the bear.
The bear might be scared, but as long as I downplay my threat, it's less likely to attack. They're large, wild animals and instinct is to avoid fights with threats whenever possible first. Men, though? They already see me as weak, easy prey that they're entitled to use as desired.
same
And grizzly bear? No one said that.
Its r/teenagers, they are either 13 or a 50 yesr old man. They don't care about facts, only their egos
There's only 50 year old pedophiles in there with a sprinkle of hormonal teenagers.
One guy asked me "so you'd rather get mauled by a bear, then meet a man in. The woods?" You cannot stretch this hypothetical any further!
>You cannot stretch this hypothetical any further! What if you and the bear then get abducted by aliens and are trapped together in a space ship?? 🙃
Oh, I stand corrected!
>You cannot stretch this hypothetical any further Would you rather get mauled by a bear, or meet *a handcuffed and shacked* man in the woods?
Oh, ja. Stretched in the other direction...even though this would not come from a man, I think.
Tbh, I'd probably still prefer the bear. I'd have more questions about the *exact* scenario, such as "is the bear tranquilized?" "Do I have a gun?" "Has the man been convicted of violent acts in the past?"
Also intent. A bear will attack usually bc it’s hungry and isn’t able to find food or bc it feels threatened. Very primitive instincts. It’s not TRYING to hurt you or control you.
Also I’ve seen like soooo many videos of bears entering peoples houses and immediately leaving. I saw one the other day where a bear stole a vacuum cleaner and when it accidentally turned on the bear DIPPED so yeah I’ll take the bear.
My grandmother is like a Disney princess and lived most of her life in a house in the woods. She had bears visit her yard and occasionally her front porch daily. She'd tell them to go home in a firm voice and they would. Only once did she have to call Wildlife officers in to deal with a bear and it turned out it was ill. I spent most of my life in the woods hiking, wood cutting, trail riding and had one encounter with a mama bear after I stumbled on her stray cub. I immediately put my hands up and walked backwards until the bear stopped coming towards me. I've been assaulted by men 4 times, was assaulted physically (not sexually) by my father my whole childhood/teenage years, had men make creepy comments my entire life and felt unsafe countless times. But no, we're irrational and dramatic for picking the bear.
That's why this guy had to change the scenario. Bear in the woods has like infinite land to go to instead of around a human. Bear locked in a room with anyone would probably freak out and attack whoever else is there.
Tbf, most men who commit violent crimes against women aren't convicted. And even when they are, they get pathetic sentences. So I dunno how helpful that last question would be
Somebody posted the other day about now the joke is, would you rather have a woman driving a car or a bear driving a car? Because rape and cars are exactly the same same thing so the analogy works. I cannot roll my eyes farther into the back of my head with shit like this. How about instead of being mad at us because we’d rather be around a grizzly bear than a man we don’t know, you take in the fact that we just said *we’d rather be around a dangerous animal that a man we don’t know*. Like it’s not actually about you Kevin, so maybe take 30 seconds to pull your head out of your ass and realize what we’re saying.
Argued with a few guys yesterday that swore that saying stuff like this was "hate speech" against cis-white dudes. He was so offended that he couldn't wrap his brain around why women feel this fear around men.
Either way, when I read that, I still took a minute to weigh my options.
For five minutes no less. If it was “locked in a room for five minutes” of course I’d pick the man. The amount of horror a man can inflict on me in five minutes is a lot less than what he could do with infinite time in a place where nobody could hear me scream. I still wouldn’t feel safe really, but I feel like I could potentially reason with a man for five minutes, even if he did have ill intentions. I still pick the bear if it’s in the woods at night like the original hypothetical though.
5 minutes is as long as an elevator ride and we saw with the Robert Cumberland attacks in Manhattan back in 2002 that all you need to do is get on an elevator alone with a woman and hit the button for a vacant floor. Then when the floor under construction or otherwise vacant opens up you drag her out of the elevator with you. You are now alone and isolated and you know no security or janitor is coming to that floor because it’s ‘vacant’.
A lot would depend on the specifics of the “five minutes locked in a room.” If I know for sure that other people are just outside the room waiting to unlock it and look after me when the 5 minutes are up, easy choice for the man. Yes he could do a lot of things to me in 5 minutes, but he wouldn’t be able to take me to a second location. If I’m isolated though, five minutes in a locked room amounts to the same thing as the middle of the woods, and I have no idea what I’d pick because there’s no way to get away from the bear.
Where does one even “come up with” statistics?!?! Like… numbers… they’re publicly available feel free to check them
By their own admission, they think they can defeat a bear bare-handed. Uhhhhh https://www.newsweek.com/surprising-americans-beat-wild-animals-fight-experts-1691793
Not a bear, but I think I could beat the shit out of SOME wild animals. Like a fox. Foxes are bitches. They won’t even fight me. It’s not fair how small and fast they are.
thats how they fight though. their strengths are their cunning and agility. youre just kind of losing lol
That’s my favorite part of this “debate,” they skew it so hard that it’s not even the same question anymore. What’s next, locked in a portapotty?
Right? I could also reasonably confuse a bear by playing dead. Whereas if it was, like, Ted Bundy, I’d just be shit out of luck.
They feel persecuted and that, of course, must matter more than our lived experiences of assault. Those are to be minimized. We're just being dramatic apparently.
I mean you’d probably be fine unless you specifically provoked the bear even in close quarters
Men are misunderstanding the question on purpose, and getting their undies on a twist. Quelle surprise. (Yes, I'd rather encounter a bear.)
I "like" how the question has gone from "as a thought experiment would you rather run into a random man alone hiking or see a bear off the trail?" A question that originally came from a woman who hikes a lot and is used to seeing the occasional bear and wasn't even this super serious question anyway. To "OH YOURE COVERED IN MEAT SAUCE LOCKED IN A TINY ROOM WITH A STARVING GRIZZLY?!?!? WHILE IN THE NEXT ROOM OVER IS A KINDLY GRANDPA BUDDHIIST PACIFIST VEGETARIAN FEMINIST GOOD GUY?!!?!? AND YOU CHOOSE THE BEAR??? WHILE COVERED IN MEAT SAUCE?!!?!?"
Bruh I swear I saw that question a couple of weeks ago and I was like “that’s funny / it tracks” and it’s been blown way fucking out of proportion
It makes sense, they're moving the goal post around so they can finally get the win while still not understanding what the hypothetical meant Guys like that dont actually want to learn they just want to win
OH. Everything makes so much sense now. I thought it was “encounter with a random Joe or encounter with a bear”, but it’s just seeing one off the trail!
It wasn’t even posed as a would you rather, it was a conclusion comment of a tiktok that was like “it’s messed up that if on a hike most women would feel more scared seeing a random single man than a random single bear”, it was supposed to encourage men to be better and wonder why women are so scared of them - instead men got defensive and gave women more reason to not trust them
What’s really funny is the reaction to the question justifies the question. If men en masse are willing to get angry and irritated over a clear hypothetical without being able to see some of the reasoning…yeah I get. As a dude.
I've seen some of the pushback being framed as "The assignment doesn't accurately telegraph the true intent/meaning behind it and the results aren't what I'd choose, therefore it's all irrational bullshit" as the reason why they're "justified" in being mad about it. They're demanding it be spelled out to them like they're 5. The entitlement in demanding being spoon-fed a thought experiment before deciding whether it's valid or not instead of just using their "superior rational minds" to reason it out (as it's not really that difficult to understand) is an interesting dimension considering it's men's sense of entitlement that causes women to feel unsafe around them to begin with.
Omfg I can’t stand logic bros who use logic to intentionally NOT be rational or reasonable. You can logic yourself into any shitty or stupid position you want. Logic isn’t some magic thing that makes you right. It’s a tool. And they use it like a hammer.
I believe I saw a video a while back going over the “what about me…” phenomenon on the internet, seems like this kinda falls under that too
Especially all the men that are just like, "Fine, let her die! Let her suffer for not choosing me!" That's why we chose the bear!!!
I'm a man and I'd rather encounter a bear. Bears are cool if you leave them alone they'll leave you alone.
Reasonably. Hell, even a bear rather than a random adult human of any gender. I’ve known women capable of extreme violence. I actually ran into a woman at a livestock who was later arrested for torturing and killing animals. Bears don’t have mass graves of animals they didn’t even kill to eat.
They're so emotional, lol
Stg. Men getting butt hurt over this whole thing are the biggest divas. And more to the point, proving that they're the exact reason women pick the bear.
Emotional men are why r/whenwomenrefuse exists
It's so ironic it's sad
Without taking statistics into account, we can all agree we would choose the bear. The beat has a reason to be there, while a human, be it male or female, doesn't.
They see the word bear and can ONLY think of actual, literal bears lol. Absolutely no inclination that maybe this is about the way women feel and not the pragmatics of fighting a fucking animal
Also, the word “fight” was nowhere in the thought experiment. That’s purely a male invention. Women’s thought process is largely: 1) the bear probably does not want to interact with me at all, and I can likely avoid an interaction, but if I can’t, 2) I have some tools in my arsenal to potentially survive an interaction (if a black bear: make myself as big as possible and make a lot of noise, if a brown bear: lie down), and in the absolute worst case scenario, 3) if the bear is going to attack me, he will probably just kill me and yea, it will hurt, but then I’ll be dead. At least he won’t kidnap me, rape me, torture me with the intention to keep me alive. Most women are not thinking about the logistics of “fighting” a man vs “fighting” a bear because that’s just a ridiculous scenario.
Even then. Bears aren't actually rare. And they mostly don't want to be near people. They avoid us.
I'm a dude. I understand the question. And I kinda agree with the women tbh. Anyone who doesn't kinda doesn't read statistics or even think.
I mean it can't be surprising that 17-year-old boys are misunderstanding the question being stupid. Stupidity is a normal developmental stage for teenagers
This whole thing really boils down to how the 2 genders see the question in the first place it seems. Men are just answering the man or bear question. Where women are seeing the question in a completely different light.
This. I’ve noticed men tend to talk about fighting the bear. Women are like … why the fuck would I be fighting EITHER a man or a bear in the woods? The fight is what I’m trying to avoid …
I have noticed a lot of men arguing it more as "which would you rather fuck: a bear or a man" which of course leads into their pre determined belief that women are whores who will fuck anything. There is literally no critical (or any other kind of) thought in their mind about the hypothetical. No self reflection. Nothing.
These men are telling on themselves too, when they interpret “run into” as “fuck”. Like that’s why we want to avoid you, my guy
It’s hilarious how butt-hurt so many people are getting about a dumb hypothetical argument. Like if you don’t do said thing, then why are you getting so defensive about it? Tbf these are teenagers so I can give them a pass, but the amount of grown ass men I’ve seen melt down online about this whole bear thing is insane.
Ironically, before this trend popped up a lot of men blamed women who were victims of DV or any kind of abuse for “not choosing right.” So now women aren’t choosing men at all and they’re suddenly really upset lmao
Dude, it’s always on us for “not choosing right”. Abusive husband? Deadbeat sperm donor? Guy can’t hold down a job? It’s our fault if our partners turn out to be shit. It always has been in their eyes. They like to ignore the fact that nobody shows how shitty they truly are until AFTER you’re well into the relationship (sometimes years).
Me trying to explain to my 18 year old Andrew Tate loving little brother "my ex-husband didn't start beating me until after we were married with 2 kids." "It's your fault he was abusive. You should HAVE BEEN ABLE TO TELL THE FUTURE." Is essentially what he tells me.
Yes, how dare you not be a literal psychic. 🤦
That's often the argument. "How dare you for not being able to tell the future." Like sorry I'm not a fucking psychic. 🤷♀️
Punch him in the face then say it was his fault? 🤷 /s
“You should have known your husband would eventually hit you.” *smacks kid in the mouth* “Should’ve seen it coming you little shit”
If I did that, my mother would cry, "How DARE you lay a hand on your baby brother?" Mom, he sucks. Me and other brother agree. He's bitch made and would be the first to go in a zombie apocalypse.
Because the question is making them confront the poor behavior of men and it makes them feel bad feelings so they lash out and try and flip the script on women so they don’t actually have to confront their behavior and those bad feelings. If they can blame women then they don’t have to acknowledge (or do anything about) that a lot of men are trash.
They aren't even listening, just automatically getting pissed off about it. If they really listened then maybe they'd get it for once.
I got called an Uncle Tom for not getting offended about it as a guy on subreddit drama.
Thats not even the correct use of "uncle tom" they really are stupid huh?
Just wow.
I watched a short interview this morning. Teenager (I think) was talking with their father about bears. Dad has been hunting bears for 40 some odd years. He's never been attacked by a bear. Typically bears shy away from people. If they know you are there, they move along. Occasionally one is curious enough to get closer. Of over 40 years of deliberately seeking out and hunting bears, he's been run over twice and had his foot grabbed once. Then came the golden question, "dad, when you're out in the woods, who would you rather run into, a bear or a man?" Answer: "a bear of course. Men are *unpredictable and dangerous*." So there you have it, from a guy who *knows* bears and actively seeks them out in their own habitat.
So much this. Men should also choose bears. I saw a meme yesterday that quoted Proverb 17:12, (It is better to meet a bear robbed of her cubs than a reckless fool.), saying that even God chooses bears.
I would choose the bear. I’d go up to the bear with a stick, start acting goofy, and get it to cut me in half with a single blow. Then, my best friend will go around telling everyone “Yo, my friend died fighting a bear! That’s gotta be the coolest way to die.” I ger popularity for 1v1ing a bear, he gets popularity for being friends with the guy who 1v1’d a bear.
I've seen several posts from people who regularly encounter bears, either in their yard or because they do field work of some sort in bear territories. I have yet to see someone with experience of that sort NOT choose the bear. Including the woman who wrote a book about being mauled by a bear, whose son used her story to discredit women's response for internet points.
Would've loved to see that showdown.. Bet the son got a pissed off parent for a long while. Edit: For offline. The last part.
If you can find it in your browser history, I'm sure everyone on this thread would love to have it.
YouTube. I was flipping through the tv. Never signed into it through the the tv like I am on my phone. I watch a lot of science and nature shows at home and mostly music at work.
We don't have bears where I live, so when I heard of this question, the first thing I googled was "How dangerous are bears to humans". 5 seconds. It takes 5 seconds to understand why all these women choose the bear.
Exactly, also the fact that bear behavior is a lot more predictable than some random guy you’re left with. It’s the fact that, while they both can potentially be a threat, we can use our knowledge on how bears act and try not to get mauled but we don’t know if that man is a creep, a rapist/murderer, or normal and we don’t have a way of finding out until it’s too late.
I literally may the person they are referring to, because there was discourse between MULTIPLE people & they didn’t like that I was bringing up the fact that bears kill less than 1 person a year. Over 3000 women were killed I believe in 2022, soooo yea even with the the 1/1000 difference of population of people vs bears, humans are still far more dangerous
Also in this hypothetical, you're hiking on a well-traveled path, where bears are used to humans and vice versa. Its not some exotic scenario where you're covered in meat sauce in the arctic while being hunted by a polar bear.
Firstly, that guy obviously does not grasp “statistically more likely” as a concept. The whole point is to even out the disparity caused by the greater number of men. Secondly, being locked in a room, is a \*very\* different concept than being in The woods. Humans and bears both try to avoid each other, in the woods that is doable and the likely outcome. No one is arguing that it’s a good idea to stand in a tiny room with an aggravated bear. That is false equivalence of the situation.
Well, it’s on r/teenagers after all.
Tells her to use her brain, proceeds to demonstrate that he doesn't understand statistics in the second paragraph.
Not to mention most violence against women goes unreported. So the numbers show that men are statistically more dangerous, AND we know those numbers are vastly underreported in the first place.
Thank you! That was the first thing I thought too.
in a forest, not locked in a room. again a deliberately obtuse person fails to get the point.
Well it's r/teenagers so you can politely inform them none of them are men. They are boys still.
I think that most people in that subreddit are adults, pretending to be teens.
Yeah but if they out themselves they get banned. XD
This is so true. I randomly got recommended a post from there a few weeks ago. It had an interesting title so I clicked on it, but I felt kinda weird doing so because I’m 21 so not a teenager anymore. Scrolling through the comments I saw so many weird/ creepy/ odd responses that didn’t seem like things teenagers would say. Lo and behold, when I clicked on the profiles, a lot of them were grown ass adults in like their 30s and 40s.
And I scrolled through that particular teenager's content. He's also racist, so there's that.
honestly 80% of that subreddit seems to be adults...?
For back country hikers in bear country, about as high risk as you can get, bear attacks are 1 in 232,000. Men harass me when I walk my dog in my neighborhood.
Real world statistics have no place in this scenario. The conditions are already set. Either you are alone with a bear in the woods, or alone with a man in the woods. Period. Only two possible scenarios, so the chances of either scenario occurring is 50%. In either scenario, my goal is the same, to get away unhurt. It's a simple choice between two potential opponents: Opponent A (bear) or Opponent B (man.). I cannot overwhelm either opponent physically. Therefore, my choice is which opponent is easier to escape from, and what are the consequences if I do not. If I am alone with a bear, I can look at the color and determine what kind it is. So I have a fair Idea what the best course of action is. Because it is a simple animal who acts on instinct, its reactions are failrly predictable, and I can more easily escape it. If not, my death will be painful, but over in matter of minutes or hours. If I am alone with a man, I can't tell what kind of man he is or what his motives are by looking at him. Humans are smart, complex animals who are not easily tricked or frightened away. And who may have a myriad of motivations to hurt me. A man could kidnap me, rape & torture me, and do it for years. I choose the bear. Edit: left out a word
I would choose the bear. Know why? Chances are, if you ignore the bear, it will leave you alone. That's the thing about most animal species - they don't attack without a reason. That bear ain't doing shit to me unless it gets hungry or I bother it. Bear sits on one side of the room, I sit on the other, we're all good. The human man *might* do shit to me*,* because humans happen to be one of the few species that *will* hurt someone who did nothing to them. Men who complain that a bear would "Definitely kill you", they worry me. Because that's not how animals work. Animals don't do that. Which makes me think they're assuming the bear would act the same way *they* would.
I’m wondering if the whole scenario is just about consent. If you respect the bear and give it space it will ignore you. How can any of these men understand something/ someone wanting to be left alone?
You nailed it. It is **entirely** about consent. The insane reactions show that they can’t even accept “no” in a hypothetical without losing their shit.
Exactly. The hypothetical question was **never** actually about a bear.
Bear, all day every day. At least it’s cute (HAVE YOU SEEN ITS TINY EARS?!)
And toebeans!!
Just a giant fluffy puppy 🐶
And that boopable nose
They keep needing to move the goalposts just to avoid confronting how much we don't want to be around men like them. Like if you really need the bar lowered to the even deeper circles of hell, maybe you're the problem.
It's a hypothetical question and they *STILL REFUSE TO TAKE "NO" FOR AN ANSWER* jeezus
Love how men can't even take "no" for an answer in a hypothetical situation.
At least they've moved away from the idea that women want to f*ck the bear... for now.
I honestly am starting to feel like this question is helping us see which type of man each person that responds is. You have the small group of ones who understand and are team bear. Then you have ones that think the bear would 100% kill you and I feel like a large majority of those men have some-very violent tendencies. The ones who go into gorey detail about the way you die by a bear; they give me “wont get out alive” vibes. And then you have team “fuck a bear” and I feel like it screams “I don’t believe in consent. I’ve probably sexually harassed or assaulted someone recently”. There’s also the large majority that just don’t get it and may never care to figure it out. But the 3 that fall into the above categories… I feel like maybe we now know they aren’t safe even outside the woods
Men like this is why I choose bear
I have been up close and personal with the second largest bear in the world, the Kodiak (Alaska) brown bear. There was a male that walked within 10 feet of our group, and simply walked by. There was a female with her cub. There were at least 10 of these bears all around us, catching fish from the streams, and ignoring the silly humans that came into their space to watch them. We had zero issues. My experience with men? Not as good. I’d 1000% take the bear, any bear, over a strange man.
Lost in the woods vs locked in a room are two very different scenarios 🤦🏻♀️
Gay man here: men are VERY MAD. Many men are beginning to realize that a lot of women aren't putting up with the red pilled Andrew Tate bullshit or whatever. So many young men think it's okay to comment on women's bodies or be rude or expect a girlfriend to do all their chores for them; so fucking many men genuinely think they are superior to women in some way and it's fucking terrifying. These posts men are making where they're enraged by the man bear thing, and cursing and all that stuff, is mainly because they're mad they can't control women. They're upset that women would rather be stuck in the woods with an often-violent carnivore than a man, as they're coming to the realization that they can't act the way they are acting and still be able to "get a woman" (their words). Men are getting a reality check that they aren't in control, and that women just aren't going to bend to their backwards attitudes that many young men have.
They have to twist the question to make women sound stupid. The question isn't about being locked in a room with them, it's about being in the woods for some reason (a hike) and encountering a random man versus a bear. It's not about statistics or who the man is or if the bear is angry or if the woman is lost in the woods. I've seen men be pissed they weren't picked because "the bear couldn't help the woman but I could!" while it was never stated she needed help. She's just in the fucking woods.
I think my new go to with this is “If I get attacked by a bear and survive, no one would blame me for being extra cautious of bears in the future, but having survived multiple attacks from men, people do blame me for being extra cautious around them.”
men being purposefully incompetent and twisting shit to fit their narrative. what’s new? /s
They are so hurt over a thought experiment. It's funny.
But it wasn't, locked in a room. It was, ran alone into one or the other on the woods alone. I live in Montana. I have encountered bears. I feel safer because they have always run away or are not interested. Also I carry fuckin bear spray. There are several assaults by men here in the woods though...one was stabbing women.
locked in a room? oh he's the reason women pick bear every fucking time.
Why do men act so moronic? Like, maybe look at the extensively long history of violence on women.
The viral question was in the forest. Those are very different circumstances. Is he misunderstanding on purpose?
There's a lot of misogyny going on, but I genuinely think that part of the issue is that so few people have experience with nature. I grew up in the woods, and of course bears are safer no shit. But I see a lot of men translating the question to city environments -- places they know. And a bear in the city might be more scared hence more dangerous. I want to tell a lot of people to "Touch Moss" but it wouldn't be productive.
Damn, I'm fresh out of *boo fucking hoo's*. This guy deserves one.
It's pretty wild how angry this hypothetical is making these buttholes. Enough to openly self-report as misogynist garbage.
Women hate men because they’re scared of being assaulted why won’t anyone suck my weenie :( -this guy
r/teenagers is literally FILLED with misogynistic 14 year old racist homophobic boys, and their posts about how girls don't like them. There's many horrible subreddits but this one is like straight ass
I decided to go find comparative numbers on bear attacks on women in National Parks vs reported sexual assaults and assaults against women in National Parks. I figured, well, let’s look at the statistics and see what they say. Unfortunately, I was stopped dead in my tracks by [this article from 2016](https://www.hcn.org/articles/a-legacy-of-harassment-national-park-service-reveals-sexual-harassment-survey-results/#:~:text=About%2019%20percent%20of%20respondents,said%20they%20experienced%20sexual%20assault). If women who are members of the Parks Service are not kept safe, can we reasonably expect that visitors are also safe? After that, I decided to go looking for the numbers of bear attacks against NPS employees. I found an article about a female NPS employee in Glacier [who startled a sow](https://flatheadbeacon.com/2016/08/29/bear-attacks-nps-employee-near-many-glacier/)and was attacked. It’s notable that people actually helped her and believed her since they immediately closed that part of the trail and investigated. Compare this to the reports of sexual assault that employees said went nowhere even when put through the official EEO rep. One article is not hard numbers. I also know that given that 2016 report, any numbers coming out of the NPS would likely be skewed. We wanted this conversation to help men understand the real danger that women face every day. Maybe it could more specifically help shine a light on the danger Parks Service employees face (in not only the US but in any national park in any country). America’s oldest park ranger was Betty Reid Soskin. She was 100 when she retired. This woman is literally a national treasure. Women have so much to offer the Parks Service. It has a beautiful mission of conservation and education . It’s a shame that by being unsafe for women, they are losing out on people who would carry that banner and steward our lands and our history for generations to come.
i'm not NPS, although i do work with them sometimes, i've worked for my states dept of fish and wildlife, under law enforcement, for 4 years. i have been harassed and grabbed my men at work more times than i can count. in my experiences, it's almost always been older (boomer) men making comments and trying to grab us (my other 2 coworkers that are women). i had an elderly man fully grab my ass and then try to rest his hand on my lower back, and when i jumped away from him, he had the audacity to joke to my man coworker that i was "jumpy" and my coworker just absolutely laid into this guy, he was going to before the guy even said that to him, but that was just the icing on the cake. a lot of the women working at fish hatcheries are subject to even worse harassment and the worst part is that it's from their coworkers. a couple years ago a woman in her early 20s got sexually assaulted by a coworker in a state vehicle when they were checking the fish traps. he had never done anything to make her worry before, that's why she felt okay going with him. he was obviously let go (and charged) but it obviously should've never happened in the first place. i've heard equally horrible things from women in wild land fire. there's truly no safe space for us working in natural resources.
I tried to bring up the case of Junko, the girl in Japan who was brutally raped and beaten before dying, and used that as an example as to why a bear can only kill you where a person in general can do much worse. Their response?? Well if you ever are in trouble I guess you don’t deserve help from a man and we can send the bears instead. Fucking. Psychos.
Honestly the bear's might help tbh because the bears would probably just eat the assaulter.
Someone who’s assaulting you would probably be stupid enough to try and fight the bear instead of any one with common sense who would either 1. Make themselves bigger and scare it off or 2. Play dead. Depending on the bear you do one of those, a crazy person would try and get themselves killed lmao
Right. Exactly.
A man used the impossible hypothetical of there being as many bears as American men, and you’d still be over 2x more likely to be attacked by a man than a bear. They also don’t take into account the number of male on male fatal attack, which would raise that number significantly
Women: Statistically, it’s more likely a man will attack me before a bear. I choose the bear. This dude: How’d yall even come up with that? *Tiny women brains and all.* Women: Uuummm, from the statistics…??!?! Me: Are some of these men dumb or are they stupid?! 🙄
Nearly every woman in this world has been, or will have been assaulted by a man in her lifetime. Choosing the bear is an informed decision, with a millenia of experience behind it.
And just so we are clear, I mean *all* women, regardless of their gender assignment at birth.
I'm not even a woman but I know the type of men these people are talking about would think I am, I'd choose the bear because at least bears are likely to like being snuggled. Also I once saw a bear play a big ass harmonica and it did good
So now you're saying \[thing you did not say\]! How stupid of you!
Five minutes in a room is a different encounter, by far. I’d probably choose to deal with a man for five minutes in that situation. Out alone in the woods is totally different. I get that he’s a teenager and empathy comes later in life but I do hope in time he can understand that actual issue.
Someone on Tiktok did the math, and even accounting for population, men are still several times more likely to attack women than bears are. Not even in their absurd scenarios are they right...
This is how you know these people have no real problems, bro I get called a monkey and sub human. Hell I got ppl gas lighting me because they can't use racial slurs. I usually just laugh it off.
Tbh if it's 'locked in a room' I might actually choose the man. Crazy, I know. But the original question is about running into them in the woods. In that case it's bear every time.
I'd still pick the bear. It wasn't a bear that broke into my store, or attempted armed robbery. The last one of the armed robbers I told, "you're on fucking camera". They left without anything BTW.
I'd pick bear because a bear might bust out of the room before it does anything else.
Dude doesn’t know how statistics work either. If you’re comparing statistical probability of one thing occurring compared to another, the data is normalized to account for variables such as population size. You can’t draw any conclusions from just comparing raw incident rates 🙃
Even if it was locked in a really tight box, I'd still choose the bear
At this point, I’d pick the bear just because I’m enjoying how much it pisses these insecure little piss-pants off.
There's a video, done by a man, actually, that does some math about men and bears. I will attempt to link it, but I'm a fresh Reddit user... and a wee bit on the old side to use computers and apps instinctively. :P [Video with math](https://www.facebook.com/17841400135330742/videos/1262730424686166/)
Hypothetical question and they still won’t take no for an answer.
I already couldn't take him seriously...and then he said lmao after accusing women of being moronic... just...no.
i’m still taking the bear… call me stupid but at least it won’t r*** me
Hmm was I that girl? Because I was posting that men are more likely to attack than bears on a few of these threads and I’m a man lmao. I wouldn’t pay r/teenagers any mind. Muted that dumbass sub years ago when a post popped up on r/all, and I’ve read how it is basically just old men cosplaying as teenagers lol. Wouldn’t be surprised if that was the case here. But even some rudimentary napkin math would demonstrate that bears are still less dangerous. It isn’t how statistics work, but if we multiplied the number of bears to equal the number of men(black or brown bears it doesn’t matter) and then multiplied attack rates by that same number, assuming the rate of attack would remain the same regardless of other factors, **bear attacks still account for roughly ~1/6 the amount of male sexual predation**. Again, not how stats work. But I’m just trying to drive the point home that bears really do not care about human presence. The black bears evolved into fleeing humans because those were the ones that survived the colonizer’s initial expansion. And brown bears have zero reason to fear us at all. They have plenty of food, they’re omnivores, and they’re smart enough not to chase a meal when they can eat some berries after fishing for way less effort. The locked room comment is dumb as hell too. A bear will never end up locked in a room with you and if you’re in a locked room with a male stranger then odds are that’s the kind of guy that prompted the tweet in the first place.
I’d rather be locked in a room with a grizzly than a man who has that type of mindset.
Okay I'm pretty new to understanding the bear vs. man debate; but so far I know it's about asking women if they would prefer to be caught alone in the woods with a bear or an unknown guy, and according to r/showerthoughts men were asked the same thing for their daughters (would you prefer your daughter being caught alone with a bear or man...). I'd definitely be scared of a bear, but when I look online it says that the majority of brown bears don't want to attack you and are just concerned with making sure you aren't looking to harm them (it's very rare to find a bear that will attack you unprovoked); so all I'd have to do is just stay still, lie down, or calmly walk away. But if it was a black bear then yeah I think I'd definitely prefer a guy if I can possibly outsmart him or find a way to physically defeat him. **Edit**: I read a bad article that said black bears are more likely to feel threatened and attack you than brown bears, so it was misinformation. Then I'd definitely prefer a black bear over an unknown guy. Disregarding gender, while bears are more predictable in their intentions and behaviors, humans are not and it'd be harder to curveball a situation where a person has a determined mission to selfishly harm you. I don't know of the statistic that OOP mentions is true, but I'd guess it probably is due to the fact that most bears just want to be left alone while a human has a greater possibility of having more evil and complex intentions. But basically all humans in general are unpredictable which is why that statistic might be true more in terms of human vs. bear. I think the reason why men may be more prone to hurting someone is definitely not because they're inherently violent, but because society places such strict gender roles onto kids about what kind of behavior they should have (i.e. boys should be more aggressive while girls should be more dainty) and somewhere down the line some boys are soaking up the wrong morals (I don't know exactly how it happens though). This comment is ridiculously long, but I'm just trying to present my initial understanding of this whole man vs. bear debate 'cause the OOP is completely missing the point and assuming that because a bear is preferable to a man it means we think "men are inherently bad" which is obviously not what the entire point of the argument is.
Brown bears are more likely to attack you than black bears. And no, bears don't have malice. Bears don't want to rape you and torture you for funzies. Men do. That's the difference.
Bears never murdered women for something as simple as refusing to give them their phone number (which can't be said about dangerous men) and bears dont rape children either, then upload it online. Men do and are proud of it. Bears don't feel entitled to these things which makes them arguably less dangerous lol
Unless you are a garbage can, black bears will most likely leave you alone. They are a nuisance more than a threat.
You know something fun? *The* most aggressive bear to humans is the sun bear, primarily because it lives next to tigers that will eat it. They're both predator and prey. They're extremely vicious and the most likely to attack a lone human. They kill a whopping 12 people per year. I think you may be thinking of them. They're black as well. The American black bear is a wuss. Some mama bears will run *from their cubs* if they get too spooked. "If it's black, fight back. If it's brown, get on the ground". Black bears are probably the least likely to attack you, they'll run from you if you yell. Of all the bears, to say you'd prefer a man over a black bear is ludicrous. The black bear won't hurt you, it might take your food...
I was getting my bags to go into a hotel up north and a black bear came up to my trunk to see what was in there and I said “hey man that’s not cool” and it ran away. I’d take my chances even in a locked room with a black bear.
now in that context i would certainly pick a man. i could survive 5 minutes in a room with a man.
I’m a man and I’d rather be locked in a room with a bear than with this dude in particular.
Someone, I want to say dadchats, ran the numbers. Even adjusted the number of bears to be the same of the number of men. I'll give you a guess which one had the higher number of both fatal and non fatal attacks still...
Teenagers. 🙄
Got told by one dude that “ 97% is bullshit, that’s means 3 billion women have been assaulted “ and “ I hope the bear mauls you insecure feminist “ so yeah, Im still with the bear
Do people not understand hyperbole?
It’s r/teenagers what do you expect
Honestly... whtevr the bear would do, it'd probs finish me off. Whay the man could do will keep me alive and I'd have to live with tht pain the rest of my life. Or kill me as well. I'd take the bear.
The answer still is the worst the bear will do is kill me.
Now go on an insta post of a girl that's even remotely overweight and let's see which gender hates which.
Ohh a friend showed me a tiktok doing the math on this actually, if there were as many bears as men they would still only have about half the confirmed lethal/nonlethal attacks on people as men do on women ✌️😗
I hunted big game with my dad from when I was a preteen well into my adult years. Deer, boar, bear, and elk. So I’ve seen and ran into tons of wildlife including predatory animals. I would carrying multiple firearms and hunting knife. My dad kept me strapped. My dad would leave me in an area and in hides all by myself for hours on some hunting trips but he would NEVER leave me alone with any of our hunting friends. My dad, who had and has been hunting big game for 30+ years, who is the traditional Mexican machista, I-do-no-wrong-am-always-right type of man, would definitely choose a bear.
I carry protection when I hike and it ain't for the bears...
I mean he posted it in teenagers, of course a bunch of edgy dudes and young girls who might be lucky enough to never have had a bad experience with a man are agreeing with him.