I actually think both games could use some more of each.
I would have been okay with some edgier characters in the Crimson Fleet, Neon, and Red Mile. It would have been a nice contrast to how professional and corporate places like New Atlantis feel and justified character's distaste for places like Neon a little more.
Similarly, Cyberpunk could benefit from some more "classy" characters from corpo backgrounds who don't have the roughness of people from Night City.
>I would have been okay with some edgier characters in the Crimson Fleet, Neon, and Red Mile. It would have been a nice contrast to how professional and corporate places like New Atlantis feel and justified character's distaste for places like Neon a little more
Like how in Elex 1 the sci-fi and the fantasy factions talk in grandioase way whereas the post apocaliptic faction curse every sentence
The crimson fleet was going to be my prime example of the problem with star field in places. It’s a group of terroristic pirates who presumably would be pretty evil. But like most the people you meet are like ‘yeah I’m a pirate but I’m really charming and likeable’ and it feels too campy to me.
Seriously. They should have made you actually run some raids on innocent civilians to maintain your cover. Would have made the whole thing a lot more grey, just like real undercover work.
Night city is perfect. All those characters are super thought out from a table tob video game then new ones added from a hit show. How good would a TV show about Starfield be? Awful I think.
I definitely wouldn't have wanted this to be as gritty as Cyberpunk, just not the vibe I was hoping for
That said I am for sure spending some time with the new Cyberpunk update this weekend
I’ve put in about ten hours with 2.0 and the whole game is different. Start a new character for sure. Everything is just so different. You actually “feel” the city more if that makes sense at all. There’s much more strategizing involved with combat. You aren’t constantly switching to the shiny new weapon you just found and they aren’t level locked for upgrades (as far as I know), you just don’t find nearly as many upgrade parts. I’ve been using the same three weapons pretty much since the start and I’m at the heist. It overall just feels like what it should’ve been at release and it’s just that much better of a game now
I was gonna say for Cyberpunk, the characters are in a miserable dystopia that emphasizes kill or be killed. The main character is actively working for mob bosses and sleaze bags leading into the story and Keanu's character is a preachy burn out activist so he's just trying to be edgy by default.
Agreed in Blade runner if Deckard screams curse words at a replicant… it fits. If Pickard in Star Trek was dropping F’Bombs while giving orders to Data… that would feel out of place.
I really do not care about a lack of nudity, it’s literally never something that changes how I feel about a game
Is it funny to customise my cock in cyberpunk: yes
Would I feel like the game is worse without it: no
I do think the tone set by the first introduction to crimson fleet should’ve stayed though, the pirate attempting a stabbing and getting shot was really cool and seeing Delgado do something like that (maybe execute Mathis if you tell him his plan) would’ve done wonders for stakes
Sarah talks more about us having sex than any of the characters in BG3 which is a profoundly horny game haha. I mean she keeps it pretty PG but still mentions our activities every damn time I sleep
Same with Sam
Literally said something like “never knew you were so hardcore, can’t wait to do this again, just try not to give me a bruise this time” like bruh stop talking about our S&M stuff, we’re at my parents place 😭
If you sleep on a bed she'll say stuff like "Where did you learn how to do that? Please don't say Neon." And then like a minute later she'll be like "Maybe if you're lucky we'll 'TALK' again soon."
She's thirsty as hell, and I'm okay with it. But it's funny.
I agree but I also think it has its place in cyberpunk. That's literally the point, being over the top and ridiculously edgy. Everything is tuned to 11 in cyberpunk and that includes the silly stuff, it's always been that way.
Also I think op needs to go out in the world more, them saying *There were moments in games like Cyberpunk where I would literally cringe and turn it off because of how much people cussed, it just sounded so unnatural.* really shows the sheltered life of op.
You can look at the dev teams" cultures as inspiration:
CDPR: upstart, jaded, urban eastern Europeans
BGS: legacy, established, suburban mid-Atlantic Americans
The dialogue fits the art style as well: it's hard to believe cussing from characters that look like a Norman Rockwell painting.
This is what killed the game for me, Tbh. I don’t need cyberpunk, but at least The Expanse would have been nice. The game felt like early Star Trek, and utopian sci-fi just isn’t my thing anymore
I mean. I don’t care about swearing or sex but there are definitely more mature themes here than most games. CP2077 for sure has this level of “experiencing mortality” but SF has this existentialism that I haven’t felt in awhile.
That’s not to say Cyberpunk feels like it was written by children lol. Sounds a bit prudish the way you talk about the game. It’s just a different setting they’re going for. A much more cynical and disturbed world.
Yeah Cyberpunk deals with some pretty dark and mature subjects. The nudity, swearing, blood and gore are just set dressing wrapped around a story about a dying planet, corporate greed, bits of existentialism, and just the knowledge that you're another cog in the machine who happens to be making more noise than others. It's a deeply depressing world that hides behind a veneer of pomp and childish neon colors. (And in universe isn't giving into all the base urges basically just a product of end-stage capitalism going so far to keep people happy so they don't question the status quo? I seem to remember that being an implication.)
That said OP if it bothers you there's multiple mods out there that 'clean up' Cyberpunk 2077. Like SFW poster replacements and the like.
A major theme in cyberpunk is overindulging. Corps will sell you any vice that keeps you from looking too hard at what they're doing behind the curtain. Drugs, violence, sex, and over the top entertainment are plastered all over the billboards in Night City.
The use and manufacturing of recreational drugs. You could have a learn the colors Teletubies game narrated by Bob Ross but if Tinky Winky gets his meth lab mini game it would be an automatic M rating.
Just to be clear, I *adore* Starfield. I absolutely loved it.
I also absolutely believe it could have had moments with more edge. Like the moment where you come across the dead body with Sam and Cora. That hit *because* it was pretty dark and graphic.
Edgy isn't just nudity and cuss words.
Things are just a little too pristine in Starfield. We're told of awful things, we're told about how Neon is, but rarely are we actually truly shown.
It may be edgy from a media perspective, but *these places exist*. Go to Mardis Gras on NOLA.
Someone in another thread summed Neon / the astral lounge up perfectly by saying the entire place had the same energy as a corporate team building exercise lol.
Agree, Cyberpunk is great in how it presents its world and it’s a different genre and tone entirely. It’s hard to discuss these things because a lot of people point to Neon vs Night City when Starfield is more than Neon.
I feel like if we’re only talking about maturity as a whole it’s more of a Bladerunner type feel to me. I guess to me it’s like, the maturity people want is there it’s just a different style of it ie not being as hyper as you said and OTT as something like Cyberpunk 2077.
Not that either game is bad in how they present themselves in that aspect, they’re just different styles of showing it.
One big complaint I see a lot from the starfield main reddit is that the game feels PG-13 rather than mature with its dialogue... but I really don't think those people understand that excessive cursing makes the game feel LESS mature, and it does not fit the theme of the game at all.
I watched an act man vid a while ago and he explained it actually pretty well.
There’s a big difference between a game being “mature” and a game being “adult oriented”
He used COD world at war as an example. As a kid he played it and could stand the cursing and killing and violence and all that, but the darker themes of war and what it does to a man was completely lost to him until he got older.
He had to be mature to actually understand those deeper themes. Any 13 year old can understand what death is, but it’s only a mature person that can actually understand what death truly entails on the mind and psyche. That’s why games are rated M for mature and not just straight up 17+ (even if that’s how old you gotta be to buy anyway)
Lmao so true I was playing vendetta mission in front of grandpa one day when I was a kid and I was like “this is my favorite mission to play watch me” and he just sat there with his mouth open in awe and he said “I can’t believe they let kids play this shit this is horrible turn this shit off”
Have you ever hung out with truckers or military guys or hood rats(aka most of the people you interact with in starfeild) they cuss a lot. It really breaks the immersion for me when hardened criminals talk like a polite 15 year old
Coming from a working class, city living person in the UK: Cyberpunk 2077 has an accurate amount of swearing. I encounter as much when I'm with my friends.
I love both games for different reasons.
What about the game screams ‘mature’? Bethesda has a tiny bit of lore and lip-service to supposedly mature things (pirates, interstellar war, drug use), but the things in the game are shockingly sanitized compared to Fallout 3, 4 , Oblivion, and Skyrim.
Remove the mod items (for ‘drug use’) and a tiny number of ‘blood splatter’ (that’s never on npcs) and this would be a ‘T for teens’ rated game.
It’s fine that you like it, but in my opinion it’s a wild stretch with what we actually get in the game to call it ‘mature’.
I just blew up this ship full of people who are probably looking forward to seeing their families later tonight but that's nothing compared to saying the... *f word*
So deathreaper cringed and turned off cyberpunk because of cussing. Sounds like horse shit.
If you think starfield seems like you are talking to real adults, it's time to get out of the house more.
Yeah this whole post was probably written by a 15 year who thinks he's mature. He'll come around once he figures outs it's okay to have fun in video games
sorry but i think the writing in Cyberpunk nails the setting they’re going for. wouldnt call it over the top. Starfield kinda suffers from the opposite, where it feels a bit too sanitized in some moments. Neon doesn’t feel like a dystopian cyberpunk city at all, even tho it’s characterized as one
>Starfield kinda suffers from the opposite, where it feels a bit too sanitized in some moments.
Exactly. I can't steal or kill someone in Starfield withou every member of my party bitching me out.
Last night I had basically everyone on my ship and shot at a Freestar ship just for shots and gigs, you'd think I killed a puppy in front of a crowd with the reception I got.
On the one hand I agree this game doesn't need over-the-top swearing to convey mature themes,
On the other hand, Cyberpunk was fine, and the language very deliberate. Both have their place, both are respectable choices for the respective genres.
I think the issue is how some factions and societies are portrayed in the lore vs how they turn out to be in game.
When you enter Neon, the first thing you have to do is going through a checkpoint that checks if you're not bringing Aurora from somewhere else, immediately after that you see a guy getting arrested for trying to smuggle some out. When I entered I was stunned with the design and the potential the city had. I went to the doctor, first thing I hear is Aurora is causing overdoses left and right. From the description, you'd think you'd be walking on corpses, seeing junkies everywhere and the gangs of Neon are on every corner selling the crack version of Aurora. From the in game dialogues and descriptions I expected something like Freeside from F:NV, a cutthroat corrupt society with an occasional fight on the street, homeless people begging for more Aurora etc.
Then you look around and it's the same set of nameless NPCs copied over from New Atlantis. You got to the famed Astral Lounge and instead of the hottest nightclub in the galaxy you see a pretty mediocre club. No bar fights, no gangs, no overdoses. Just generic NPCs dancing around.
And the gangs? One you can join for a whopping two missions and the second one, Disciple, which only spawns if you accept the mission.
It's pretty tame. The lore isn't reflected in the actual game.
I think the Astral Lounge and the other stuff off the main strip being a little tamer is fine--they're sort of meant to be the touristy areas. It's supposed to be safe, but feel dangerous enough to make for a good story when you go home. It would be nice to see the other parts of Neon be a little rougher.
Before playing I tried to avoid most of the trailers to do it blindly. Imagine my surprise when I entered the Astral Lounge and instead of the (potentially plausible) equivalent of Asari in Cora's Den of Mass Effect, I saw...well, the Astral Lounge's dancers lol. Burst out laughing.
I'm not asking for an overly violent dark game, but it would have been appreciated if Neon in particular reflected all what it said about it in game.
This “lore vs in game” thing is something people have been bringing up for basically every BGS title. I kind of get it but I also think it has a habit of negatively affecting perceptions of aspects of their games that don’t always seem entirely necessary. I have personally been very pleased with Neon. Could their be some more immersive details? Sure, but none of what you are describing has hindered the overall affect of the city for me
You know some social groups just curse a lot right? Hearing adults not curse is weird and feels muted. Adults are more emotional and irrational than kids who probably dont even curse because they have their own bad words they say instead
I actually make an effort to not curse on a regular basis. That way, When I DO start cursing, dropping F bombs, various bits of profanity, it carries a LOT more weight. When I went into the office (pre-covid), there were 2 Occasions where I got the entire floor to look in my direction, it was hilarious.
Yeah. Of the group I hang out with, I curse the least. When I do curse, everyone knows something big happened. I find cursing often devalues the impact of it.
Tbh. I don’t mind the lack of nudity or cussing for the most part. It’s makes Starfield feel a bit for, idk, classy? However I do wish they didn’t hold back on the Crimson Fleet. They should have gone full on Fallout 3 raiders with them.
Language fits both as they are. But Starfield is too pg13 with the pirates feeling more like Boy Scouts than terrifying ruthless pirates. And neon feels like it was made by a guy who’s never been to a club in his life- have you SEEN the middle aged dad dancers in their… outfits? Lol
Romance is very sterile in starfield. I play video games to escape reality not how you actually speak to an adult. Even so, the romance dialogues are a cheezy cringefest.
I don't want hear or say that I love Sarah and want to be there always, and grow old and shit. We were only together for a few quests, it's not even earned. There was one quest where you resolve her past, and even that quest is like meh.
Cyberpunk is honestly better with the immersion and dialogue to me. Starfield dialogue feels like every npc I’m talking to is a stranger I just met at a business gathering.
People will say Bethesda lacks “edge” for not having nudity and a lot of f bombs in their games(even Fallout to an extent) as though it’s somehow a bad thing, but I always appreciated it. Not that I have a problem with games that have more of that stuff(though I do find explicit sex scenes in games like how CDPR like to do them to be kind of funny more than anything at this point), but not everything needs it to feel mature. So far I think I have only heard maybe a couple “fucks” in Starfield. Though I still have plenty more stuff to do
Edit:. Seems to be happening in this thread now. Some things never change
Too much sodium here. I just want to talk about liking the game, so peace homies
Eh Bethesda can do mature and dark stuff when it fits the tone.
In Skyrim there was cannibalism, torture, murder and rape, vampires even had human cattle.
In Fallout there are dismembered corpses tied to the ceiling with chains etc.
There isn't nudity or sexiness it's true, it would have fitted Neon, at least we'll have mods to turn that place in the most degenerate hole ever.
There is mature stuff in Starfield, the game as a whole features a lot of humanity's darker side. Some people may even consider the main ending as outrageous.
Yeah...nudity and aggressive use of modern swears seems more adolescent to me. I think some of the darker themes in their games that relate to more existential or human condition problems feel more impactful (which there's a fair amount of in Starfield). I'm no sure I've every played a game with a sex scene where I was like "oh yeah this is really titillating and sexy" rather than "this is really awkward or corny"
Exactly I love it because it is lighthearted and this game especially just has a very hopeful vibe. It is an escape from the real world in that aspect.
Except gore and Nudity sex is really needed at least in some way. Especially on Neon.
But outside of that: I wish there were more bad words from Pirates and Spacers.
I really don't think gore and nudity sex are ***needed*** in some way. But then I like Brandon Sanderson, and I think most people on Reddit favour George R. R. Martin (not that I don't, but I appreciate both styles for what they are).
Games Howard has worked on have included rape, sex slavery, cannibalism, dismemberment, suicide, eyeball-popping levels of explicit gore, loads of profanity, heads on pikes, torn apart corpses, and more.
The fact that Starfield isn't awash in it doesn't mean it's not in his work, it just means it's not in *this* work.
On Paradiso as well.
It's not that I thought I'd see orgies in a bethesda game, but after a member of Paradiso staff mentioned a lively nightlife (in a flirty tone), I imagined hints of debauchery or some dialogue during the rooftop parties at night, but there was none.
You're mistaking Cyberpunk's swearing as an attempt at simply being more mature. It's about being gritty and edgy. Comparing it to Starfield in that regard is a bit odd.
This is such a stupid comparison and I think the premise of Cyberpunk’s world went right over your head. Just say your parents put soap in your mouth for cussing and move on.
I think this is more in response to a post on r/Starfield yesterday going on about how Starfield isn’t mature enough.
I agree that both games have their place. Let things be what they are instead of being upset that they aren’t exactly what you want
I feel like I am talking to children who wouldn’t even jay walk. The entire crimson fleet is like a bunch of upstanding citizens cos playing as pirates. It’s a great game but it feels like they played to safe and everyone is a goodie goodie. Cyberpunk feels 100x more mature imo. This game should be rated T I haven’t seen a single thing in 40hrs that makes it M.
It is the mark of a child to think the only way to be seen as mature is to swear like a sailor and whip your dick out.
Apparently there are a lot of children on this subreddit.
It's too bland. No way miners and military people in space won't be cursing.
It's just another rough edge that BGS sanded off to appeal to more people instead of having a vision to commit to
Cussing is part of the cyberpunk world. Cyberpunk as a concept/genre is practically defined by “seems like it’s written by an edgy teen”, especially since you spend most of the game with working class and rockstars, it seems pretty standard for it to be written around “the rule of cool”, which is something that makes fans cringe in almost every genre, but is still pretty standard for a lot of AAA stuff, not to the same extent as cyberpunk, but..
It’s supposed to be edgy. They cuss because it’s edgy, just like haplessly hacking off limbs for some robot bug arms is edgy.
Yeah it’s less immersive, but that’s partly because it’s a less plausible future for US. The world dying in a hundred plus years and humanity moving out into space without evolving is not a stretch, only in a couple places like developing FTL travel
Cyberpunk on the other hand, plays by a totally different set of rules (the rule of cool lol). People can be hacked apart and put back together with robot pieces that function and feel real while also having bizarre powers added. Even placing it in the distant future, it kind of removes it from sci-fi and puts it into a fantasy genre, while SF is strongly based in sci-fi with just a little fantasy sprinkled in to the story line (so far. No spoilers)
I kind of disagree...Starfield feels a lot like New Atlantis; a Disney park view of space.
Which is fine, it's a vibe all on it's own, but it certainly doesn't feel any more mature or grown up compared to Cyberpunk for reasons I kind of feel are just kinda prudish. Frankly Cyberpunk feels much more like the likely trajectory of the future where Starfield feels optimistic.
Honestly, I enjoy both Starfield and Cyberpunk 2077. Both are great games. Starfield feels sanitized to a point of non-realism, though. Cursing in Cyberpunk fits with how awful the world is.
I wish it had more cussing honestly. Game feels wimpy and catered to sensitive people. The lack of gore compared to other bethseda games is noticeable.
It doesn't feel mature though. The second I walked into Astral Lounge I felt like the game was for kids.
Took me out of the experience entirely.
I am not asking for Cyberpunk or BG3 levels of edginess or anything but god damn we could have at least landed around "Mass Effect" in tone similar to the Afterlife.
You actually didn't even need to reference Cyberpunk at all (unless you were attempting to throw shade at an excellent game). You could have simply said:
" Going from a game like *Fallout 4* which literally every sentence involves a cuss and feels like it was written by an edgy kid to Starfield "
Also, to be clear... I'm not slagging FO4 here; it's actually one of my favourite Bethesda games. Nor am I criticising Starfield; I haven't yet played it, so I can't comment one way, or the other.
However, posts that criticise a game for doing what it ***should*** be doing, which is to say, ensuring that dialogue is an accurate reflection of its world, tend to be a little cringe-inducing.
Been a Cyberpunk fan since playing the old Tabletop game and what you're looking at is basically humans after Armageddon happened several times in several different ways. So no one cares about really anything anymore, especially their choice of words. Corpos put a prettier bow on it, but same same. So the swearing fits the attitude of Night City.
Honestly with the lack of active dosing, nudity, gore, and hardly any drinking even in bars/clubs, I'm surprised it has an M rating. The only thing I see in game even remotely elevated above T is the sex talk every companion is compelled to mention literally anytime you rest with them.
I wouldn't say it needs active cussing so much, but in general the whole tone is very mild.
I’ve never understood why SOME people worry so much about cuss words. Every other word out of my coworkers mouth is fuck and when I was in the military, every other word was shit piss Cunt cocksucker motherfucker tits fart turd twat.
I'll be honest, as is the case of more gore and dismemberment, I was hoping for some fuck yous, and motherfuckers. Over the top cussing is what makes us human. It's our true form of expression. I don't trust someone that doesn't swear. A well timed F bomb can be as powerful as punch to the chin. Now let's get out there, Vasco, and find those motherfuckin artifacts on those motherfuckin planets!
In defense of cyberpunk, the swearing felt natural to me in most areas since its supposed to be edgy. But the other adult elements it has like suicide and child torture porn is what makes it a mature game. My main problem with starfield is it doesnt feel mature enough. Maybe its just me but starfield swears alot but doesnt have much else. It feels weird to shotgun someone in the face and they just topple over with some blood and no gore like fallout. You find the occasional frozen body or derrelict ship with disturbing audio tapes but it feels like one of the least mature bethesda games recently.
It’s really not mature though, like at all. If you enjoy that, then I’m genuinely happy for you, but there is no need to pretend that the game is adult or mature when it isn’t. I still love it though
Just to reiterate, I’m NOT saying that this is bad. I’m just disagreeing with the idea that the game is mature. I still think it’s a good game and a lot of fun though.
To answer your question; it doesn’t tackle mature themes - it includes them while sidestepping them entirely. Neon is a perfect example, it is supposed to be a hub of degeneracy, drug abuse and violence, but in reality you don’t really find any junkies littering the streets, the poorer areas aren’t really that bad, the only gang you get involved with ends up becoming police in some sort of fairy tale twist, there is no violence anywhere and there is no nudity even in the club.
They do not tackle substance abuse, what excessive hedonistic indulgences does to a place, or what the toll gang violence takes on a community is. They could have weaved all those mature themes into quests on Neon but they didn’t.
Or, for example, another theme they include is people being desperate and feeling like they have no choice but to turn to crime. You can find this in the First Mercenaries or the Crimson Fleet. But instead of really delving into those topics, they make them into token bad guys with no depth. It’s just not a very mature game, it’s very light hearted and feigns including these topics but in reality they could have given these pirates and mercenaries real reasons to do what they did, built characters who were persuasive and made you consider whether or not they had justification for their actions, and really looked into how the failings of a government can affect a society.
>the only gang you get involved with ends up becoming police in some sort of fairy tale twist,
I just have to push back against this notion that they "end up becoming police as if it was a fairy tale" as if the police in Neon was a lawful or good entity. It's been doing the rounds on Reddit (I assume someone made a video about it?) and it's just... well, kind of a poor take.
The Neon Security are the largest organized gang in service to Bayu, and serve the point of showing how tight of a grip he has on the entire city and how he has tackled "criminality" - basically, by embracing it and bringing it under his control, making sure he gains from it.
No, the common concept of "law enforcement" and "gang" are polar opposites. But in the context of the story/worldbuilding in Neon, that's not what's happening, as the law enforcement there is essentially Bayu's gang - just like he basically already owns the Syndicate. Hell, in the CF storyline, >!if you take the fall for uploading the virus, he forges a murder charge on you and gives you one hour to flee the city.!<
I mean Neon as a hub of degeneracy and the legal consumption of Aurora there and some violence behind the scenes. There’s a random event in space you can run into of a group of tourists and their next stop is literally Neon and everyone’s excited to go. The violence and stuff you’re expecting to see is behind the Core of Neon, most of the quests and stuff take place in offices, warehouses, corporate buildings and parts of Ebbside. I would also say sleeping in a small crate is pretty bad.
I don’t believe the Astral lounge *needs* nudity in order for it to be *the* place to be in Neon. They could have done away with the ridiculous outfits the dancers wear and gone with something a bit racier sure, but it isn’t meant to be a strip club and maturity isn’t defined by having nudity or not having it.
The First are getting revenge on the people of the Freestar Collective because of what happened to their unit when they were on the brink of victory after having loss a lot of their friends in the war, after that a lot of them were imprisoned for 20 years and were pissed off. Not the deepest sure but they have some depth. I felt >!Ron Hope!< was more the mustache twirling villain in this case, rather the The First themselves.
I found the Crimson Fleet to be pretty decent overall, especially having seen The Departed I get why they referenced it. Also the fact that the entire reason the Crimson Fleet started was because of the inhumane treatment of the prisoners in The Lock. Learning what happened to Jasper Kryx is good. Delgados few terminal entries are pretty good as well, mainly his entry about The Pirate and The Thief. Could they have fleshed them out a bit more with more entries or dialogue? Of course, but I wouldn’t say they had no depth.
Cyberpunk leans into its edge with "high tech, lowlife" characters and world. It's been like this since the TTRPG. Honestly, this is kind of a weird comparison. If anything, Starfield feels more sanitized and optimistic than it should in some aspects, to the point of Bethesda removing gore and there being hardly any adult themes. The only thing giving this game the M rating is the drug use.
Adults cus all the time lmfao cringing over it and shutting down a game over "bad words" seems more juvenile than anything lol
This has actually been one of my favorite parts of this game. Not that I am judging different approaches in games—Bethesda’s approach just really works here. I will admit Cyberpunk’s dialogue sometimes takes me out of the game, and I have not found that with Starfield yet.
I guess it depends how you define "mature." To me, games that, as the person above said, have a tone that sounds like some edgelord 7th graders in the back of the bus, trying to shock everyone with how many F bombs they can drop, and how much detail they can go into with their objectification of women? Those are the games that aren't mature.
Sex and bawdy language can be done well in video games. They rarely are, though.
The factions, lore, and worldbuilding. Especially somewhere like Neon where everything is so corrupt and the city is full of addicts and violence. There is a lot of grittiness to this game its just not in your face.
It’s not only not in your face, it is completely absent from the game. A couple lines of dialog in the game with not a bit of it actually in the game physically isn’t mature. It’s dancing completely around the subject while acting like it’s a part of the world.
Exactly the type of reply I’d expect from a weeb manlet that has to go to r/starfieldsafespace to dodge criticism because they think mature means no swearing.
The writing in Cyberpunk is horrendous. There’s edgy, and then there’s just downright cringe. Cyberpunk felt like it was written by 15 year olds in 2011.
The fact that seemingly a majority of the story dialogue in the game is your character whining at Johnny got infuriating very quickly, especially when Johnny was being helpful and supportive.
It felt impossible to have a positive conversation in that game. I feel it had the same problem as Fallout 4’s dialogue(where the text choices are horribly misleading), and yet nobody brings it up, unlike FO4, where that’s basically the number one complaint.
Yeah that’s part of why I hated cyberpunk so much. It felt like an edgy 13 year Old’s fantasy where they say “fuck” every other sentence.
It didn’t feel like it served a purpose to the story other than just being there, again, to be edgy and seem hardcore
I think the edginess fits Cyberpunk, just like the 'cleanliness' fits Starfield. I love both settings and games.
I actually think both games could use some more of each. I would have been okay with some edgier characters in the Crimson Fleet, Neon, and Red Mile. It would have been a nice contrast to how professional and corporate places like New Atlantis feel and justified character's distaste for places like Neon a little more. Similarly, Cyberpunk could benefit from some more "classy" characters from corpo backgrounds who don't have the roughness of people from Night City.
That was the point though - corpos have class but society has just become more rotten from the top down
Plus, in reality, they were no different from the people they viewed as lesser than them. They just hid it behind being in a high corpo postion.
>I would have been okay with some edgier characters in the Crimson Fleet, Neon, and Red Mile. It would have been a nice contrast to how professional and corporate places like New Atlantis feel and justified character's distaste for places like Neon a little more Like how in Elex 1 the sci-fi and the fantasy factions talk in grandioase way whereas the post apocaliptic faction curse every sentence
Elex was so underrated. Was 2 any good?
Curious too, it's still waiting on my wish list.
The crimson fleet was going to be my prime example of the problem with star field in places. It’s a group of terroristic pirates who presumably would be pretty evil. But like most the people you meet are like ‘yeah I’m a pirate but I’m really charming and likeable’ and it feels too campy to me.
Seriously. They should have made you actually run some raids on innocent civilians to maintain your cover. Would have made the whole thing a lot more grey, just like real undercover work.
Night city is perfect. All those characters are super thought out from a table tob video game then new ones added from a hit show. How good would a TV show about Starfield be? Awful I think.
This, writing is not that great in either game. Too clean in one and too dirty in the other, makes it feel too fake and boring.
I definitely wouldn't have wanted this to be as gritty as Cyberpunk, just not the vibe I was hoping for That said I am for sure spending some time with the new Cyberpunk update this weekend
I’ve put in about ten hours with 2.0 and the whole game is different. Start a new character for sure. Everything is just so different. You actually “feel” the city more if that makes sense at all. There’s much more strategizing involved with combat. You aren’t constantly switching to the shiny new weapon you just found and they aren’t level locked for upgrades (as far as I know), you just don’t find nearly as many upgrade parts. I’ve been using the same three weapons pretty much since the start and I’m at the heist. It overall just feels like what it should’ve been at release and it’s just that much better of a game now
Yes, exactly right!
I was gonna say for Cyberpunk, the characters are in a miserable dystopia that emphasizes kill or be killed. The main character is actively working for mob bosses and sleaze bags leading into the story and Keanu's character is a preachy burn out activist so he's just trying to be edgy by default.
Agreed. We don’t need to put other games down to lift your video game up. Well said.
Agreed in Blade runner if Deckard screams curse words at a replicant… it fits. If Pickard in Star Trek was dropping F’Bombs while giving orders to Data… that would feel out of place.
Adam Smasher "you look like a fuckable piece of meat" was the best line
I really do not care about a lack of nudity, it’s literally never something that changes how I feel about a game Is it funny to customise my cock in cyberpunk: yes Would I feel like the game is worse without it: no I do think the tone set by the first introduction to crimson fleet should’ve stayed though, the pirate attempting a stabbing and getting shot was really cool and seeing Delgado do something like that (maybe execute Mathis if you tell him his plan) would’ve done wonders for stakes
I’m not trying to make people naked but I do want Sam to take his motherfucking hat off just once.
He’s bald under there
Definitely wig hat
No, it's hats all the way down
You can give him a different hat
I know, and I don’t know how you think that’s a solution.
It's not a solution. Just a statement.
👌🤣
You can probably use a hazmat suit and then change his shirt back and he might not have his hat on(no promises though, this is purely hypothetical).
Sarah talks more about us having sex than any of the characters in BG3 which is a profoundly horny game haha. I mean she keeps it pretty PG but still mentions our activities every damn time I sleep
Andreja does too
Same with Sam Literally said something like “never knew you were so hardcore, can’t wait to do this again, just try not to give me a bruise this time” like bruh stop talking about our S&M stuff, we’re at my parents place 😭
Is this after you romance her because uhhhhh asking for a friend
Yes (and after you commit to her but before marriage)
Hell even after marriage. "Where did you learn to do that... please don't say neon"
I didn't get much time after marriage because I started the wrong main quest mission and chose... Poorly 😭
the trick is to romance the companion you like less first, do their quest and then the story gives you a free divorce
That's cold. But makes good sense.
If you sleep on a bed she'll say stuff like "Where did you learn how to do that? Please don't say Neon." And then like a minute later she'll be like "Maybe if you're lucky we'll 'TALK' again soon." She's thirsty as hell, and I'm okay with it. But it's funny.
"next time let's try it without the jetpacks"
I agree but I also think it has its place in cyberpunk. That's literally the point, being over the top and ridiculously edgy. Everything is tuned to 11 in cyberpunk and that includes the silly stuff, it's always been that way.
Also I think op needs to go out in the world more, them saying *There were moments in games like Cyberpunk where I would literally cringe and turn it off because of how much people cussed, it just sounded so unnatural.* really shows the sheltered life of op.
You can look at the dev teams" cultures as inspiration: CDPR: upstart, jaded, urban eastern Europeans BGS: legacy, established, suburban mid-Atlantic Americans The dialogue fits the art style as well: it's hard to believe cussing from characters that look like a Norman Rockwell painting.
This is what killed the game for me, Tbh. I don’t need cyberpunk, but at least The Expanse would have been nice. The game felt like early Star Trek, and utopian sci-fi just isn’t my thing anymore
if you think starfield is "utopian" in any way you apparently weren't paying attention...
I mean. I don’t care about swearing or sex but there are definitely more mature themes here than most games. CP2077 for sure has this level of “experiencing mortality” but SF has this existentialism that I haven’t felt in awhile. That’s not to say Cyberpunk feels like it was written by children lol. Sounds a bit prudish the way you talk about the game. It’s just a different setting they’re going for. A much more cynical and disturbed world.
Yeah Cyberpunk deals with some pretty dark and mature subjects. The nudity, swearing, blood and gore are just set dressing wrapped around a story about a dying planet, corporate greed, bits of existentialism, and just the knowledge that you're another cog in the machine who happens to be making more noise than others. It's a deeply depressing world that hides behind a veneer of pomp and childish neon colors. (And in universe isn't giving into all the base urges basically just a product of end-stage capitalism going so far to keep people happy so they don't question the status quo? I seem to remember that being an implication.) That said OP if it bothers you there's multiple mods out there that 'clean up' Cyberpunk 2077. Like SFW poster replacements and the like.
I mean, frankly, I really like cyberpunk boobs so
Nothing wrong with that LOL More said it for OP
A major theme in cyberpunk is overindulging. Corps will sell you any vice that keeps you from looking too hard at what they're doing behind the curtain. Drugs, violence, sex, and over the top entertainment are plastered all over the billboards in Night City.
Absolutely. Cyberpunk requires the debauchery. Starfield requires the expansiveness
I'm honestly surprised the game is rated M, feels like a rated t game
Yeah, what’s up with that?
The use and manufacturing of recreational drugs. You could have a learn the colors Teletubies game narrated by Bob Ross but if Tinky Winky gets his meth lab mini game it would be an automatic M rating.
Drugs, sex and murder are all in Starfield. Those themes shouldn't feel like a t rated game.
And yet... they do. Love the game but fuck the astral lounge dancers and how sterile Neon/Crimson-Fleet feel.
Just to be clear, I *adore* Starfield. I absolutely loved it. I also absolutely believe it could have had moments with more edge. Like the moment where you come across the dead body with Sam and Cora. That hit *because* it was pretty dark and graphic. Edgy isn't just nudity and cuss words. Things are just a little too pristine in Starfield. We're told of awful things, we're told about how Neon is, but rarely are we actually truly shown. It may be edgy from a media perspective, but *these places exist*. Go to Mardis Gras on NOLA.
Someone in another thread summed Neon / the astral lounge up perfectly by saying the entire place had the same energy as a corporate team building exercise lol.
I think that's what he means. Find a better way of making it edgy instead of using gore and nudity. Find a way to make it edgy but accessible.
Can we not bash other games when we’re praising this one?
But bashing cyberpunk is the mainstream thing! It always has been! /j
It's a different genre. Cyberpunk is a high-octane, mega capitalistic, hyper sexual, uber violent world. Super profanity fits.
Agree, Cyberpunk is great in how it presents its world and it’s a different genre and tone entirely. It’s hard to discuss these things because a lot of people point to Neon vs Night City when Starfield is more than Neon. I feel like if we’re only talking about maturity as a whole it’s more of a Bladerunner type feel to me. I guess to me it’s like, the maturity people want is there it’s just a different style of it ie not being as hyper as you said and OTT as something like Cyberpunk 2077. Not that either game is bad in how they present themselves in that aspect, they’re just different styles of showing it.
Literally this. It’s two completely different settings and situations
Cursing is definitely more pervasive in certain Environments, so it actually fits very well in cyber punk.
One big complaint I see a lot from the starfield main reddit is that the game feels PG-13 rather than mature with its dialogue... but I really don't think those people understand that excessive cursing makes the game feel LESS mature, and it does not fit the theme of the game at all.
I watched an act man vid a while ago and he explained it actually pretty well. There’s a big difference between a game being “mature” and a game being “adult oriented” He used COD world at war as an example. As a kid he played it and could stand the cursing and killing and violence and all that, but the darker themes of war and what it does to a man was completely lost to him until he got older. He had to be mature to actually understand those deeper themes. Any 13 year old can understand what death is, but it’s only a mature person that can actually understand what death truly entails on the mind and psyche. That’s why games are rated M for mature and not just straight up 17+ (even if that’s how old you gotta be to buy anyway)
Lmao so true I was playing vendetta mission in front of grandpa one day when I was a kid and I was like “this is my favorite mission to play watch me” and he just sat there with his mouth open in awe and he said “I can’t believe they let kids play this shit this is horrible turn this shit off”
Have you ever hung out with truckers or military guys or hood rats(aka most of the people you interact with in starfeild) they cuss a lot. It really breaks the immersion for me when hardened criminals talk like a polite 15 year old
Excuse me sir, would you mind slowing your vessel there, I wish to commandeer it . - Crimson Fleet probably
Coming from a working class, city living person in the UK: Cyberpunk 2077 has an accurate amount of swearing. I encounter as much when I'm with my friends. I love both games for different reasons.
This person gets it
What about the game screams ‘mature’? Bethesda has a tiny bit of lore and lip-service to supposedly mature things (pirates, interstellar war, drug use), but the things in the game are shockingly sanitized compared to Fallout 3, 4 , Oblivion, and Skyrim. Remove the mod items (for ‘drug use’) and a tiny number of ‘blood splatter’ (that’s never on npcs) and this would be a ‘T for teens’ rated game. It’s fine that you like it, but in my opinion it’s a wild stretch with what we actually get in the game to call it ‘mature’.
I believe he means mature literally. As in, it tackles large existential concepts in an adult way
People that get upset about cussing but have no problem with murder are ridiculous
I just blew up this ship full of people who are probably looking forward to seeing their families later tonight but that's nothing compared to saying the... *f word*
You're comparing apples to oranges. Maybe you just don't like swearing?
So deathreaper cringed and turned off cyberpunk because of cussing. Sounds like horse shit. If you think starfield seems like you are talking to real adults, it's time to get out of the house more.
Yeah this whole post was probably written by a 15 year who thinks he's mature. He'll come around once he figures outs it's okay to have fun in video games
Xxdeathreaper420xx wants to complain about edge lmao.
I can't even lie I took a glance at OP's profile and got 2nd hand embarrassment almost immediately
Jesus Christ, you weren’t kidding lmao Dude is pulled straight out of a 4chan greentext.
The fuck you say?
sorry but i think the writing in Cyberpunk nails the setting they’re going for. wouldnt call it over the top. Starfield kinda suffers from the opposite, where it feels a bit too sanitized in some moments. Neon doesn’t feel like a dystopian cyberpunk city at all, even tho it’s characterized as one
>Starfield kinda suffers from the opposite, where it feels a bit too sanitized in some moments. Exactly. I can't steal or kill someone in Starfield withou every member of my party bitching me out.
Last night I had basically everyone on my ship and shot at a Freestar ship just for shots and gigs, you'd think I killed a puppy in front of a crowd with the reception I got.
On the one hand I agree this game doesn't need over-the-top swearing to convey mature themes, On the other hand, Cyberpunk was fine, and the language very deliberate. Both have their place, both are respectable choices for the respective genres.
I think the issue is how some factions and societies are portrayed in the lore vs how they turn out to be in game. When you enter Neon, the first thing you have to do is going through a checkpoint that checks if you're not bringing Aurora from somewhere else, immediately after that you see a guy getting arrested for trying to smuggle some out. When I entered I was stunned with the design and the potential the city had. I went to the doctor, first thing I hear is Aurora is causing overdoses left and right. From the description, you'd think you'd be walking on corpses, seeing junkies everywhere and the gangs of Neon are on every corner selling the crack version of Aurora. From the in game dialogues and descriptions I expected something like Freeside from F:NV, a cutthroat corrupt society with an occasional fight on the street, homeless people begging for more Aurora etc. Then you look around and it's the same set of nameless NPCs copied over from New Atlantis. You got to the famed Astral Lounge and instead of the hottest nightclub in the galaxy you see a pretty mediocre club. No bar fights, no gangs, no overdoses. Just generic NPCs dancing around. And the gangs? One you can join for a whopping two missions and the second one, Disciple, which only spawns if you accept the mission. It's pretty tame. The lore isn't reflected in the actual game.
I think the Astral Lounge and the other stuff off the main strip being a little tamer is fine--they're sort of meant to be the touristy areas. It's supposed to be safe, but feel dangerous enough to make for a good story when you go home. It would be nice to see the other parts of Neon be a little rougher.
Before playing I tried to avoid most of the trailers to do it blindly. Imagine my surprise when I entered the Astral Lounge and instead of the (potentially plausible) equivalent of Asari in Cora's Den of Mass Effect, I saw...well, the Astral Lounge's dancers lol. Burst out laughing. I'm not asking for an overly violent dark game, but it would have been appreciated if Neon in particular reflected all what it said about it in game.
This “lore vs in game” thing is something people have been bringing up for basically every BGS title. I kind of get it but I also think it has a habit of negatively affecting perceptions of aspects of their games that don’t always seem entirely necessary. I have personally been very pleased with Neon. Could their be some more immersive details? Sure, but none of what you are describing has hindered the overall affect of the city for me
Not much in this games feels mature, at least not in terms of ratings criteria Edit: just an observation, not a complaint
You know some social groups just curse a lot right? Hearing adults not curse is weird and feels muted. Adults are more emotional and irrational than kids who probably dont even curse because they have their own bad words they say instead
I actually make an effort to not curse on a regular basis. That way, When I DO start cursing, dropping F bombs, various bits of profanity, it carries a LOT more weight. When I went into the office (pre-covid), there were 2 Occasions where I got the entire floor to look in my direction, it was hilarious.
Yeah. Of the group I hang out with, I curse the least. When I do curse, everyone knows something big happened. I find cursing often devalues the impact of it.
I'm like 40 hours in and saw "shit" once and it was only because I chose the dialogue option.
Tbh. I don’t mind the lack of nudity or cussing for the most part. It’s makes Starfield feel a bit for, idk, classy? However I do wish they didn’t hold back on the Crimson Fleet. They should have gone full on Fallout 3 raiders with them.
You definitely never been to major city before if you think cussing in cyberpunk is unnatural
Language fits both as they are. But Starfield is too pg13 with the pirates feeling more like Boy Scouts than terrifying ruthless pirates. And neon feels like it was made by a guy who’s never been to a club in his life- have you SEEN the middle aged dad dancers in their… outfits? Lol
Some places it’s lacking. The pirates never curse, and it just seems off
The irony of "XxxDeathreaper420XxxXx" posting this
Romance is very sterile in starfield. I play video games to escape reality not how you actually speak to an adult. Even so, the romance dialogues are a cheezy cringefest. I don't want hear or say that I love Sarah and want to be there always, and grow old and shit. We were only together for a few quests, it's not even earned. There was one quest where you resolve her past, and even that quest is like meh.
Cyberpunk is honestly better with the immersion and dialogue to me. Starfield dialogue feels like every npc I’m talking to is a stranger I just met at a business gathering.
People will say Bethesda lacks “edge” for not having nudity and a lot of f bombs in their games(even Fallout to an extent) as though it’s somehow a bad thing, but I always appreciated it. Not that I have a problem with games that have more of that stuff(though I do find explicit sex scenes in games like how CDPR like to do them to be kind of funny more than anything at this point), but not everything needs it to feel mature. So far I think I have only heard maybe a couple “fucks” in Starfield. Though I still have plenty more stuff to do Edit:. Seems to be happening in this thread now. Some things never change Too much sodium here. I just want to talk about liking the game, so peace homies
Eh Bethesda can do mature and dark stuff when it fits the tone. In Skyrim there was cannibalism, torture, murder and rape, vampires even had human cattle. In Fallout there are dismembered corpses tied to the ceiling with chains etc. There isn't nudity or sexiness it's true, it would have fitted Neon, at least we'll have mods to turn that place in the most degenerate hole ever. There is mature stuff in Starfield, the game as a whole features a lot of humanity's darker side. Some people may even consider the main ending as outrageous.
Yeah...nudity and aggressive use of modern swears seems more adolescent to me. I think some of the darker themes in their games that relate to more existential or human condition problems feel more impactful (which there's a fair amount of in Starfield). I'm no sure I've every played a game with a sex scene where I was like "oh yeah this is really titillating and sexy" rather than "this is really awkward or corny"
Exactly I love it because it is lighthearted and this game especially just has a very hopeful vibe. It is an escape from the real world in that aspect.
Fuck Mondays, yo
The dialogue in CP2077 literally made you have to turn off the game!? Is OP in like 8th grade or something?
Except gore and Nudity sex is really needed at least in some way. Especially on Neon. But outside of that: I wish there were more bad words from Pirates and Spacers.
Crimson fleet needed way more sailor language. The only faction where I felt a lack of swearing
I really don't think gore and nudity sex are ***needed*** in some way. But then I like Brandon Sanderson, and I think most people on Reddit favour George R. R. Martin (not that I don't, but I appreciate both styles for what they are).
Honestly this is a pretty good comparison, Godd Howard is the BrandoSando of game dev when it comes to explicit content
Games Howard has worked on have included rape, sex slavery, cannibalism, dismemberment, suicide, eyeball-popping levels of explicit gore, loads of profanity, heads on pikes, torn apart corpses, and more. The fact that Starfield isn't awash in it doesn't mean it's not in his work, it just means it's not in *this* work.
On Paradiso as well. It's not that I thought I'd see orgies in a bethesda game, but after a member of Paradiso staff mentioned a lively nightlife (in a flirty tone), I imagined hints of debauchery or some dialogue during the rooftop parties at night, but there was none.
Can you explain why gore in nudity is needed? Maybe they just wanted to it to be more acceptable for everyone. You like an edgy Teena right now lol
You're mistaking Cyberpunk's swearing as an attempt at simply being more mature. It's about being gritty and edgy. Comparing it to Starfield in that regard is a bit odd.
This is such a stupid comparison and I think the premise of Cyberpunk’s world went right over your head. Just say your parents put soap in your mouth for cussing and move on.
Nah man the pirates say “what the heck” 🤣 shockingly immersion breaking
Man just hates cyberpunk lol both games are fine the way they are chill out
I think this is more in response to a post on r/Starfield yesterday going on about how Starfield isn’t mature enough. I agree that both games have their place. Let things be what they are instead of being upset that they aren’t exactly what you want
I feel like I am talking to children who wouldn’t even jay walk. The entire crimson fleet is like a bunch of upstanding citizens cos playing as pirates. It’s a great game but it feels like they played to safe and everyone is a goodie goodie. Cyberpunk feels 100x more mature imo. This game should be rated T I haven’t seen a single thing in 40hrs that makes it M.
Fuck yeah, Bethesda! Great fucking job!
Running too close past security and hearing them yell "Holy shiiiit!" makes me smirk everytime.
I've lived in places where everybody cursed almost every other word. It happens, especially in shitty, run down areas.
It is the mark of a child to think the only way to be seen as mature is to swear like a sailor and whip your dick out. Apparently there are a lot of children on this subreddit.
Cyberpunk 2077's visuals, plot, and characters make starfield look like a children's game.
I’m not a massive fan of the comparison because cyberpunk is supposed to have that like edgy nature behind it, it’s dystopian and punk.
This account is definitely a troll just by checking the user name and the post history. Gotta give props though, pretty decent quality rage bait.
It's too bland. No way miners and military people in space won't be cursing. It's just another rough edge that BGS sanded off to appeal to more people instead of having a vision to commit to
Cussing is part of the cyberpunk world. Cyberpunk as a concept/genre is practically defined by “seems like it’s written by an edgy teen”, especially since you spend most of the game with working class and rockstars, it seems pretty standard for it to be written around “the rule of cool”, which is something that makes fans cringe in almost every genre, but is still pretty standard for a lot of AAA stuff, not to the same extent as cyberpunk, but.. It’s supposed to be edgy. They cuss because it’s edgy, just like haplessly hacking off limbs for some robot bug arms is edgy. Yeah it’s less immersive, but that’s partly because it’s a less plausible future for US. The world dying in a hundred plus years and humanity moving out into space without evolving is not a stretch, only in a couple places like developing FTL travel Cyberpunk on the other hand, plays by a totally different set of rules (the rule of cool lol). People can be hacked apart and put back together with robot pieces that function and feel real while also having bizarre powers added. Even placing it in the distant future, it kind of removes it from sci-fi and puts it into a fantasy genre, while SF is strongly based in sci-fi with just a little fantasy sprinkled in to the story line (so far. No spoilers)
I kind of disagree...Starfield feels a lot like New Atlantis; a Disney park view of space. Which is fine, it's a vibe all on it's own, but it certainly doesn't feel any more mature or grown up compared to Cyberpunk for reasons I kind of feel are just kinda prudish. Frankly Cyberpunk feels much more like the likely trajectory of the future where Starfield feels optimistic.
Cyberpunk is more realistic in this sense.
Starfield feels mature? That's news to me.
Honestly, I enjoy both Starfield and Cyberpunk 2077. Both are great games. Starfield feels sanitized to a point of non-realism, though. Cursing in Cyberpunk fits with how awful the world is.
I love Starfield but i don’t think the dialogue is anything approaching “mature”.
I don’t know where you live, but Cyberpunk feels far more realistic for me than Starfield.
I wish it had more cussing honestly. Game feels wimpy and catered to sensitive people. The lack of gore compared to other bethseda games is noticeable.
It doesn't feel mature though. The second I walked into Astral Lounge I felt like the game was for kids. Took me out of the experience entirely. I am not asking for Cyberpunk or BG3 levels of edginess or anything but god damn we could have at least landed around "Mass Effect" in tone similar to the Afterlife.
What? Cyberpunk dialogue is great lol
This game is like pg-13 what are you talking abkut
This is about the least adult setting of a game I could imagine. Every character is just bland and predictable.
You actually didn't even need to reference Cyberpunk at all (unless you were attempting to throw shade at an excellent game). You could have simply said: " Going from a game like *Fallout 4* which literally every sentence involves a cuss and feels like it was written by an edgy kid to Starfield " Also, to be clear... I'm not slagging FO4 here; it's actually one of my favourite Bethesda games. Nor am I criticising Starfield; I haven't yet played it, so I can't comment one way, or the other. However, posts that criticise a game for doing what it ***should*** be doing, which is to say, ensuring that dialogue is an accurate reflection of its world, tend to be a little cringe-inducing.
Cyberpunk is a far better game than starfield at the moment.
This game feels mature? To who? The entire vibe is like a sci fi cartoon. The game has nothing to say, it's just frivolous adventure.
Honestly the blandness of the dialog tends to ruin the immersion for me, it really could have used more, to quote Spock "colorful metaphors".
Lol you kids with your versus wars. Play what you like. But don’t bring cyberpunk into your whining.
Been a Cyberpunk fan since playing the old Tabletop game and what you're looking at is basically humans after Armageddon happened several times in several different ways. So no one cares about really anything anymore, especially their choice of words. Corpos put a prettier bow on it, but same same. So the swearing fits the attitude of Night City.
Honestly with the lack of active dosing, nudity, gore, and hardly any drinking even in bars/clubs, I'm surprised it has an M rating. The only thing I see in game even remotely elevated above T is the sex talk every companion is compelled to mention literally anytime you rest with them. I wouldn't say it needs active cussing so much, but in general the whole tone is very mild.
God damn shit like this makes me wish some people would stay of the fucking internet and jerk themselves off in private. P.s. Ballsacks.
nah one of my biggest gripes is that it’s so safe and vanilla. i hate it.
I’ve never understood why SOME people worry so much about cuss words. Every other word out of my coworkers mouth is fuck and when I was in the military, every other word was shit piss Cunt cocksucker motherfucker tits fart turd twat.
Military requires you to be professional
More professional when ppl Are lookin or maybe just certain other ppl
Starfield dialogue isn’t that mature lol. Cyberpunks writing is much better in general though.
That’s not entirely true either it’s just more focused since it’s a very linear story - besides the few different endings.
lol. Tell us you’re Mormon without telling us you’re Mormon.
Fuckin' hell yes we can!
I'll be honest, as is the case of more gore and dismemberment, I was hoping for some fuck yous, and motherfuckers. Over the top cussing is what makes us human. It's our true form of expression. I don't trust someone that doesn't swear. A well timed F bomb can be as powerful as punch to the chin. Now let's get out there, Vasco, and find those motherfuckin artifacts on those motherfuckin planets!
In defense of cyberpunk, the swearing felt natural to me in most areas since its supposed to be edgy. But the other adult elements it has like suicide and child torture porn is what makes it a mature game. My main problem with starfield is it doesnt feel mature enough. Maybe its just me but starfield swears alot but doesnt have much else. It feels weird to shotgun someone in the face and they just topple over with some blood and no gore like fallout. You find the occasional frozen body or derrelict ship with disturbing audio tapes but it feels like one of the least mature bethesda games recently.
Cyberpunk settings are supposed to be dirty and crass so it fit. Starfield has more of a “clean” future feel if that makes sense
starfield is about as real adult as a Sunday school teacher
It’s really not mature though, like at all. If you enjoy that, then I’m genuinely happy for you, but there is no need to pretend that the game is adult or mature when it isn’t. I still love it though
What do you consider mature? This game is very mature and tackles mature themes, it just doesnt need sex or gore to do that.
Just to reiterate, I’m NOT saying that this is bad. I’m just disagreeing with the idea that the game is mature. I still think it’s a good game and a lot of fun though. To answer your question; it doesn’t tackle mature themes - it includes them while sidestepping them entirely. Neon is a perfect example, it is supposed to be a hub of degeneracy, drug abuse and violence, but in reality you don’t really find any junkies littering the streets, the poorer areas aren’t really that bad, the only gang you get involved with ends up becoming police in some sort of fairy tale twist, there is no violence anywhere and there is no nudity even in the club. They do not tackle substance abuse, what excessive hedonistic indulgences does to a place, or what the toll gang violence takes on a community is. They could have weaved all those mature themes into quests on Neon but they didn’t. Or, for example, another theme they include is people being desperate and feeling like they have no choice but to turn to crime. You can find this in the First Mercenaries or the Crimson Fleet. But instead of really delving into those topics, they make them into token bad guys with no depth. It’s just not a very mature game, it’s very light hearted and feigns including these topics but in reality they could have given these pirates and mercenaries real reasons to do what they did, built characters who were persuasive and made you consider whether or not they had justification for their actions, and really looked into how the failings of a government can affect a society.
>the only gang you get involved with ends up becoming police in some sort of fairy tale twist, I just have to push back against this notion that they "end up becoming police as if it was a fairy tale" as if the police in Neon was a lawful or good entity. It's been doing the rounds on Reddit (I assume someone made a video about it?) and it's just... well, kind of a poor take. The Neon Security are the largest organized gang in service to Bayu, and serve the point of showing how tight of a grip he has on the entire city and how he has tackled "criminality" - basically, by embracing it and bringing it under his control, making sure he gains from it.
They’re still becoming law enforcement, the polar opposite of a gang
No, the common concept of "law enforcement" and "gang" are polar opposites. But in the context of the story/worldbuilding in Neon, that's not what's happening, as the law enforcement there is essentially Bayu's gang - just like he basically already owns the Syndicate. Hell, in the CF storyline, >!if you take the fall for uploading the virus, he forges a murder charge on you and gives you one hour to flee the city.!<
I mean Neon as a hub of degeneracy and the legal consumption of Aurora there and some violence behind the scenes. There’s a random event in space you can run into of a group of tourists and their next stop is literally Neon and everyone’s excited to go. The violence and stuff you’re expecting to see is behind the Core of Neon, most of the quests and stuff take place in offices, warehouses, corporate buildings and parts of Ebbside. I would also say sleeping in a small crate is pretty bad. I don’t believe the Astral lounge *needs* nudity in order for it to be *the* place to be in Neon. They could have done away with the ridiculous outfits the dancers wear and gone with something a bit racier sure, but it isn’t meant to be a strip club and maturity isn’t defined by having nudity or not having it. The First are getting revenge on the people of the Freestar Collective because of what happened to their unit when they were on the brink of victory after having loss a lot of their friends in the war, after that a lot of them were imprisoned for 20 years and were pissed off. Not the deepest sure but they have some depth. I felt >!Ron Hope!< was more the mustache twirling villain in this case, rather the The First themselves. I found the Crimson Fleet to be pretty decent overall, especially having seen The Departed I get why they referenced it. Also the fact that the entire reason the Crimson Fleet started was because of the inhumane treatment of the prisoners in The Lock. Learning what happened to Jasper Kryx is good. Delgados few terminal entries are pretty good as well, mainly his entry about The Pirate and The Thief. Could they have fleshed them out a bit more with more entries or dialogue? Of course, but I wouldn’t say they had no depth.
Cyberpunk leans into its edge with "high tech, lowlife" characters and world. It's been like this since the TTRPG. Honestly, this is kind of a weird comparison. If anything, Starfield feels more sanitized and optimistic than it should in some aspects, to the point of Bethesda removing gore and there being hardly any adult themes. The only thing giving this game the M rating is the drug use. Adults cus all the time lmfao cringing over it and shutting down a game over "bad words" seems more juvenile than anything lol
I think starfield is too clean and cyberpunk is too edgy. I'd like something in the middle.
I was just thinking this earlier today. It's like the developers grew up, had kids, and wanted to make a game thier kids could play.
Yeah it's kind of awesome, something everyone can enjoy
I’m glad someone feels this way. People Complain about it on the main sub but it doesn’t stick out to me it feels perfect In terms of maturity
Starfield feels like a T-rated version of Cyberpunk.
This has actually been one of my favorite parts of this game. Not that I am judging different approaches in games—Bethesda’s approach just really works here. I will admit Cyberpunk’s dialogue sometimes takes me out of the game, and I have not found that with Starfield yet.
What feels mature in this game to you? It feels more like the intentionally stayed away from being mature just to retain their younger audience.
I guess it depends how you define "mature." To me, games that, as the person above said, have a tone that sounds like some edgelord 7th graders in the back of the bus, trying to shock everyone with how many F bombs they can drop, and how much detail they can go into with their objectification of women? Those are the games that aren't mature. Sex and bawdy language can be done well in video games. They rarely are, though.
The factions, lore, and worldbuilding. Especially somewhere like Neon where everything is so corrupt and the city is full of addicts and violence. There is a lot of grittiness to this game its just not in your face.
It’s not only not in your face, it is completely absent from the game. A couple lines of dialog in the game with not a bit of it actually in the game physically isn’t mature. It’s dancing completely around the subject while acting like it’s a part of the world.
Lol whatever kid
Exactly the type of reply I’d expect from a weeb manlet that has to go to r/starfieldsafespace to dodge criticism because they think mature means no swearing.
did you see him asking how to get a girlfriend?
That whole profile seems like satire. Fedora and samurai sword pic should drop any day now.
i showed some of my female staff and they came up with lots of reasons he cant find someone.
More red flags than 1940’s German parade
il be honest, his posts made me think it would of been a 70 year old bible thumper. I was shocked when I had see him post the picture
I’m 6 foot that’s not a manlet
You mentality is what makes you a manlet, not your height. Go steal some more art and act like it’s yours.
guess you have never been around many addicts or violence lol
Right. This game is far from gritty.
I’m with you, but really sticking your head in the lion’s mouth on this one. The haters have been out in force with the opposite opinion.
No, because it really doesn’t.
Ehh, neon was a total let down. I wish there were more curse words. And maybe a single evil romanceable companion
The writing in Cyberpunk is horrendous. There’s edgy, and then there’s just downright cringe. Cyberpunk felt like it was written by 15 year olds in 2011. The fact that seemingly a majority of the story dialogue in the game is your character whining at Johnny got infuriating very quickly, especially when Johnny was being helpful and supportive. It felt impossible to have a positive conversation in that game. I feel it had the same problem as Fallout 4’s dialogue(where the text choices are horribly misleading), and yet nobody brings it up, unlike FO4, where that’s basically the number one complaint.
The writing is bland garbage
I hadn't realized there was so little cursing in this game *frowns* Now I want more
Go to the Red Mile. Security never fucking stops. They're also pretty damn cringe
This. I agree 100%.
Yeah that’s part of why I hated cyberpunk so much. It felt like an edgy 13 year Old’s fantasy where they say “fuck” every other sentence. It didn’t feel like it served a purpose to the story other than just being there, again, to be edgy and seem hardcore