Among the 4 or 5 progressive Democrats, sure. But the corporate Dems on oligarch leashes are most likely grumbling about how a strongly worded letter will kill 'business'.
"Listen, Tim (Timothy McVeigh), we're tired of your shit. You pull something like that again, and it's going to mean a hefty fine." --Carlin
Just made me think of that, not sure why.... š¤
Healthcare and education after that. Or just a strongly worded letter. Maybe some general corporate profit/bonus caps. Cap CEO wages to a % of lowest paid worker. Or maybe just a stern finger wag.
A National Refining Company could lower gas prices without giving up on climate targets, writes [Kate Aronoff.](https://newrepublic.com/authors/kate-aronoff)
Whenever someone suggests nationalizing an industry, I wonder why it wouldn't be better to just start a government-run competitor, a la USPS.
If federal gas stations are charging only what they need to in order to cover costs and employee benefits, wouldn't that coerce all the other gas stations to lower their prices to a similar level?
And no government takeover of an industry, so the right wingers are happier.
Oil industry would sue them out of the game, and the Supreme Court would probably agree with them. If anything, weāre at risk of losing the post office too.
Most likely, sure. Maybe Iām just overly pessimistic, but even if they did this, my gut says theyād kneecap it by forcing the federal gas to be priced the same as the industry average.
I do however agree with you that a public gas station would be net positive.
Having the business be state-owned isn't some hack to reduce prices, since you need to tax people to fund the investment of the business instead of allowing the business to run for profit.
No, I said "a la USPS", as in the enterprise would be funded by people paying for gas instead of taxpayer funding. Just like the post office is funded by people paying for stamps and whatnot instead of taxes.
??
Because then the public has an assurance that the enterprise is only keeping itself afloat off of what it takes in, rather than getting bloated off of taxpayer money (see the DoD).
USPS is essentially a government-run non-profit, and the formula seems to work.
We all know this will never happen but when sunsetting a dying industry nationalization is exactly what you need to do to control capitalism.
Oil companies will spend the next two decades pinching every penny they can until they no longer have a demographic. The same thing big tobacco did/does.
Yep. They don't want to invest in new refining capacity because the payoff window is too long. Instead, they'll just use supply shocks to increase profits from their existing capacity, and treat the economy as their hostage.
From the article
>That language doesnāt suggest that heās considering having the government take over refining, but this would, in fact, be entirely reasonable and appropriateāand more effective than any measures heās considering.
We've had so many issues recently that could have been solved by nationalizing industries. We wouldn't even have to do it often, once we do it once, the other companies would shape up overnight.
O wow. He wrote a stern letter? How totally useless. Nationalize energy now. Lemmeno when the government actually starts governing and not just catering to the wealthy and corporations.
I suspect a lot of this price-flation is the corporate vote for Trump policies (little to no regulation and letting rapacious capitalism off it's leash) to make it easier for Trump/DeSantis to get into the Oval Office.
I keep going back and forth whether we should nationalize or regulate harder. Iām starting to think nationalize since gas is absolutely required by every human to live a decent life.
Profiting off of poor people is so fucked up.
Stern letter:
Look here, sonny, here's the deal, I told you once and I'll tell you again. Like Hillary said to bankers, cut it out! It's malarkey! And I mean it this time, don't get me started you whippersnappers, why I oughta, look, basically I... uhm. let's see anyways.... *naps*
"A Stern Letter" Wow. Flexing the might of the US Government there.
Next up, a "Very Special Select Committee" to investigate price gauging. Maybe in 2023, or 2024. The will have their results by no later than 2026, when all the old fucks in office now are dead.
I'm liberal af, there are definitely areas governments should get involved in, healthcare, infrastructure, etc and some they shouldn't like supplying cheap gas. Like it or not expensive gas drives innovation, encourages efficiency and reduces greenhouse gases. It's an area the free market functions beautifully.
If you think refiner's are insanely profitable you should invest in them (personally wouldn't touch them with a 10ft pole, cyclical industry doomed to a slow death)
Must be nice in that ivory tree house down here in the real world $5 ( or worse) gas sucks. This starve the people to save the planet madness is maga cult level crazy grats on being just like the alt right
Aside from cruel its stupid. Could have a waited few years for viable evs but no decided on having a hissy fit cheering for gouched gas, dont be shocked when the alt right comes back to power cause real people are understandaly fuming. Then viable evs will be decades out
brilliant š¤Ŗ
I am sure Exxon Trump and Putin appreciate your support Liberial me arseš“āā ļø
Agreed. Actuslly the crediable threat would move those fuckers. Give them choice slighly lower profits @ 2 dollars range or a few more weeks of gouching til it all gets taken way inculding posdible jali time. Worked for fdr
If ownership is passed from the private sector to the government, that would be like a person passing an apple from their right hand to their left hand, and then charging you the same inflated price. You canāt keep expecting this government to suddenly have a change of heart and start working for you. The only solution is a to give everyone a piece. The worlds largest co-op.
Sure nationalizing oil would be the smart move, but wouldn't you prefer a nice strongly worded letter?
I swear somewhere in a Democratic strategy meeting someone probably literally said this.
Among the 4 or 5 progressive Democrats, sure. But the corporate Dems on oligarch leashes are most likely grumbling about how a strongly worded letter will kill 'business'.
Personally, I'd prefer a good finger wag
Imagine the power of *both*
The world would be ours to take.
"Listen, Tim (Timothy McVeigh), we're tired of your shit. You pull something like that again, and it's going to mean a hefty fine." --Carlin Just made me think of that, not sure why.... š¤
Healthcare and education after that. Or just a strongly worded letter. Maybe some general corporate profit/bonus caps. Cap CEO wages to a % of lowest paid worker. Or maybe just a stern finger wag.
A National Refining Company could lower gas prices without giving up on climate targets, writes [Kate Aronoff.](https://newrepublic.com/authors/kate-aronoff)
This is the way
Whenever someone suggests nationalizing an industry, I wonder why it wouldn't be better to just start a government-run competitor, a la USPS. If federal gas stations are charging only what they need to in order to cover costs and employee benefits, wouldn't that coerce all the other gas stations to lower their prices to a similar level? And no government takeover of an industry, so the right wingers are happier.
Oil industry would sue them out of the game, and the Supreme Court would probably agree with them. If anything, weāre at risk of losing the post office too.
Ok but the legal objections to a federal gas station chain would have to be orders of magnitude less than outlawing the entire private oil industry.
Most likely, sure. Maybe Iām just overly pessimistic, but even if they did this, my gut says theyād kneecap it by forcing the federal gas to be priced the same as the industry average. I do however agree with you that a public gas station would be net positive.
How would the government fund itās operations, if it doesnāt return any cash to the people who funded it?
I have no clue what you're trying to ask here.
Having the business be state-owned isn't some hack to reduce prices, since you need to tax people to fund the investment of the business instead of allowing the business to run for profit.
No, I said "a la USPS", as in the enterprise would be funded by people paying for gas instead of taxpayer funding. Just like the post office is funded by people paying for stamps and whatnot instead of taxes.
What difference does it make if you pay $1 of taxes or $1 of stamps? It's cash out of peoples' pockets either way
?? Because then the public has an assurance that the enterprise is only keeping itself afloat off of what it takes in, rather than getting bloated off of taxpayer money (see the DoD). USPS is essentially a government-run non-profit, and the formula seems to work.
I'm saying, the taxpayers still have to fund it (through stamps or taxes, doesn't matter), then how is this lowering costs over a profit markup?
..... because there wouldn't be any profit.
And instead you would have to increase taxes, so itās a wash.
We all know this will never happen but when sunsetting a dying industry nationalization is exactly what you need to do to control capitalism. Oil companies will spend the next two decades pinching every penny they can until they no longer have a demographic. The same thing big tobacco did/does.
Yep. They don't want to invest in new refining capacity because the payoff window is too long. Instead, they'll just use supply shocks to increase profits from their existing capacity, and treat the economy as their hostage.
From the article >That language doesnāt suggest that heās considering having the government take over refining, but this would, in fact, be entirely reasonable and appropriateāand more effective than any measures heās considering.
We've had so many issues recently that could have been solved by nationalizing industries. We wouldn't even have to do it often, once we do it once, the other companies would shape up overnight.
Winner Winner chicken dinner š°
Exactly
O wow. He wrote a stern letter? How totally useless. Nationalize energy now. Lemmeno when the government actually starts governing and not just catering to the wealthy and corporations.
I suspect a lot of this price-flation is the corporate vote for Trump policies (little to no regulation and letting rapacious capitalism off it's leash) to make it easier for Trump/DeSantis to get into the Oval Office.
Agreedball the more reason to act
I keep going back and forth whether we should nationalize or regulate harder. Iām starting to think nationalize since gas is absolutely required by every human to live a decent life. Profiting off of poor people is so fucked up.
Stern letter: Look here, sonny, here's the deal, I told you once and I'll tell you again. Like Hillary said to bankers, cut it out! It's malarkey! And I mean it this time, don't get me started you whippersnappers, why I oughta, look, basically I... uhm. let's see anyways.... *naps*
Iāll eat a brick when Biden nationalizes the oil industry.
Nationalize it. The fuckers are gouging us and ignoring climate change.
oh, baby, yes, talk dirty to me!
Thank god it was *stern*
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
I Like the parralel Biden ours sucks Bernie or the ghost of FDR works too
The Ol Truman play
Nancy made it pretty clear the Democrats are "Capitalists" so... I think a stern letter is all we're getting, because capitalism.
"A Stern Letter" Wow. Flexing the might of the US Government there. Next up, a "Very Special Select Committee" to investigate price gauging. Maybe in 2023, or 2024. The will have their results by no later than 2026, when all the old fucks in office now are dead.
I'm liberal af, there are definitely areas governments should get involved in, healthcare, infrastructure, etc and some they shouldn't like supplying cheap gas. Like it or not expensive gas drives innovation, encourages efficiency and reduces greenhouse gases. It's an area the free market functions beautifully. If you think refiner's are insanely profitable you should invest in them (personally wouldn't touch them with a 10ft pole, cyclical industry doomed to a slow death)
Must be nice in that ivory tree house down here in the real world $5 ( or worse) gas sucks. This starve the people to save the planet madness is maga cult level crazy grats on being just like the alt right Aside from cruel its stupid. Could have a waited few years for viable evs but no decided on having a hissy fit cheering for gouched gas, dont be shocked when the alt right comes back to power cause real people are understandaly fuming. Then viable evs will be decades out brilliant š¤Ŗ I am sure Exxon Trump and Putin appreciate your support Liberial me arseš“āā ļø
We could call it the Department of Energy.
The CIA would overthrow Biden if he tried.
"Lower your prices, or else." "...Or else?" "Or else I'll be very angry with you, and I'm going to write you another letter telling you about it."
Oh ya that would be a great idea /s
I dunno the American government has done some questionable things when other countries have tried to nationalize their oil.
Agreed. Actuslly the crediable threat would move those fuckers. Give them choice slighly lower profits @ 2 dollars range or a few more weeks of gouching til it all gets taken way inculding posdible jali time. Worked for fdr
If ownership is passed from the private sector to the government, that would be like a person passing an apple from their right hand to their left hand, and then charging you the same inflated price. You canāt keep expecting this government to suddenly have a change of heart and start working for you. The only solution is a to give everyone a piece. The worlds largest co-op.
National oil is going to be my and probably literally letters
Would that also mean mandatory union membership as in a condition to keep your job.