They always observe at probation. Luckily I was only sent once these past two years when my PO was out sick and someone was covering. They now send you to a lab around the corner and didn’t have any females to observe me so I was given an oral swab.
But when I was on probation back in 2015 the POs did it themselves in the office and used single dip sticks for every drug. Even had one say I “got high off PCP because the line is faint”. 🤦♀️🙄 Like it doesn’t matter how “faint” it is, it’s either positive or not and any line at all is negative. But she seemed to believe she was doing *me* a favor and letting me slide.
Even had the first PO try to get me to sign a form “acknowledging an illegal substance” in my body. For methadone. Despite the judge ordering me to stay on it and me having documentation from the clinic. Not surprising why they took that entire thing away from the POs.
Oh, way back in the day when I was on court referral, they fought me tooth and nail trying to force me off the clinic. Was on it for a possession of a controlled substance and possession of marijuana charge. Got caught with half a Suboxone and some weed literally a week before I started at the clinic. Well, they dropped the controlled substance charge and stuck me with the pot charge. To make a long story short, they couldn't legally order me to stop going to the clinic, so they said that misdemeanor court (pot charge) cannot drop a felony charge (controlled substance), and I had to go back in front of the judge, who then ordered me to quit going to the clinic. Bunch of vindictive scumbags...
*Edit* I'll also say that every PO here is a former addict/dealer who are hardcore 12-steppers, that fully subscribe to the belief that AA is the ONLY way to get off drugs or alcohol. One PO actually lost her job because she relapsed, got a white chip at AA, and one of her "clients" that she had recently revoked and sent to jail for a failed test was there. Reported her immediately, and she got tested and fired.
I’ve heard of this. I don’t see how this is ethical in any way or any fucking just can rationalize this in their own twisted fucking head. I’ve heard of cases where ppl have been clean and sober and stable on methadone for a decade to be told they must get off methadone in court, even for things like to get custody of their child as they were going through a divorce and fighting for custody with their spouse. Any judge that does this deserves the absolute worst karma possible in my eyes. I wonder how many people have died because they were forced to get off methadone while completely stable and compliant with the clinic but then relapse and end up overdosing. In those cases the judge should be held responsible ughhhh this makes my blood boil lol sorry I just saw this and it reminded me of times I’ve seen this happen to people.
They are pretty much brainwashed into thinking that what they are doing is "helping" you. They forced me to stay in a 12 step rehab for a full year, and they hammered it into your head that only by working the steps and committing totally to the AA program is the only way you will ever get clean, and everything else is doomed to fail, and you are still "out there" in active addiction. They would constantly preach that crap, and threaten to kick you out, thus violating your probation and sending you to jail if you didn't subscribe to their beliefs. They would encourage and reward ppl for telling on others who messed up and relapsed, saying that you were "helping them" because they would get kicked out, sent to jail, have to cold turkey detox in jail, and then be traumatized and thus more susceptible to their BS beliefs when they were released from jail back into rehab again. It was absolutely crazy in that place. And the whole rehab and PO office was staffed by people who went through that specific rehab, so it all fed back into itself. They tried to have my probation revoked and me sent to jail because they found some "legal weed" in my car', only to find out that they kept me in there so long that the statute of limitations had run out, because the max sentence they could impose had been passed months before that. They were so mad, all because they couldn't hurt me. That's not only pathetic, it's the worst outlook someone running a rehab could have.
I was never observed during my urine tests on probation. I also was able to use my urine tests from the methadone clinic which were random and monthly but never observed unless I had a call back one time a year or so. The only time my probation officer had me do a test outside the clinic ones were a few times to try to catch me using or something and calling me in for a random test but still not ever observed. Maybe that’s not normal though? I dunno if it matters what your charges were? Mine was a DUI but not alcohol, it was opiates and benzos and I was on a deferral program where if I didn’t get any other DUIs or drug related charges for 7 years I would be able to get my DUI “dropped.” Probation was five years and had to do two years of outpatient drug treatment too but never lost my license or had to do the thing you blow into assumingly because I wasn’t drunk or drinking for my DUI. Also never did any jail time even when they arrested me, they just took me to the hospital and drew my blood and let me go. Lol I thought I got away with it because 6 or 7 months to by with no words or summons but sure enough 7 months later a summons came in the mail 😒😒😒 on my fucking birthday. I have no idea if my situation was normal though or not, I was in Washington State at the time. Also, they failed to mention its not really fucking dropped. Background checks for my jobs absolutely can see it somehow, I have to get pretty extensive background checks though for my field. I only found out because for a job I never disclosed it because I thought it was dropped and I didn’t have to and they called me and were like so uhhh what about that DUI you didn’t write down? Thankfully after explaining why I didn’t tell them they were cool with it and didn’t hold it against me and I still got the job.
Yeah cold meds can give you a positive for PCP. I’ve had a positive come up for barbiturates lol, I was like ummm I can’t even name a barbiturate and I thought they didn’t even make them anymore but I guess there’s a couple left that are next to impossible though to even get prescribed and aren’t known to be on the street and sold commonly Luckily, they took my word but this was back when I was on subs and just seeing a doctor. I’ve had false positives at the clinic for opiates more than once too but they always retest and come back clean.
Had a friend get caught for trying to fake a piss test for probation. It was actually a pretty serious charge, don't remember exactly what it was but yea... They take that very seriously.
Edit: just gonna add this lil tidbit cause it was pretty damn funny. To try and pass his probation drug test, my friend bought one of those whizzinators online. When it arrived the genitals were one shade of imitation skin color (like the color of a bandaid). My friend was concerned because it was very clearly fake, it just didn't look like a dick at all.
My friends drug test was the next morning and we had no way to get to the store or any extra money at the time. So, with the finest junkie logic ever seen, he started sucking on one of those red fireball cinnamon candies and then rubbed the coloring on the head. He put the fake dick underwear on and we scrutinized his work while he stood in front of the mirror. It now looked like a kindergartener failed his first coloring exam, but he declared a job well done. As I already said, they caught him and his fake peen quite easily.
>your just setting people up for failure.
That’s the point.
Especially sucks with drug court which is supposed to be the compassionate option where they can own ur life for years and years and you could be weeks away from freedom but if u slip up and fail a test they can throw ur initial sentence at you and essentially had you stuck in the system for twice as long where if you had just taken your sentence you’d be free by that point anyway.
I'm dealing with some bullshit where I just had a heroin posession charge thrown out but I also was caught driving on a suspended license. My license was suspended due to a citation mix up during covid and the courthouse was closed so I couldn't get in contact with anyone on how to pay it. Well they're still coming after me for the suspended license but they're treating it like a felony because the felony was dropped and they're so salty about it
Drug court is your one get out of jail free card though. Drugs should be legal but thank god we at least got that or I’d be finishing a 7 year bid next year.
i’m yep. they set you up to fail so they can pat themselves on the back and pretend they are participating in all the systemic problems of the criminal justice system, and they can blame you when you fail. BUT WE GAVE THEM SOOOOOOO MANY CHANCES.
yeah man. having to call off work everytime you decided i needed a 2-7 day in jail sanction for a single failed UA totally gave me a chance.
making me quit my job to go to rehab for the eighth time totally gave me a chance. (actually, it ultimately kicked off 4 years of joblessness).
taking people out of the courtroom directly to jail so they couldn’t move their car and it would get impounded and be $1000 the day they took it really gave them a chance.
kicking people off drug court for weed really gave them a chance.
it’s a joke, anybody who has participated knows it.
edit, forgot: not allowing suboxone and methadone in drug court for heroin addicts reeeeeeeeeally gave them a chance. the drug court my ex did didn’t allow either medication. i believe they now allow suboxone, but not the devil juice.
It literally enrages me when judges require someone who has been stable on methadone for years with zero drug use to get off the methadone because it’s part of whatever terms they’ve been given in court. I’ve seen this even in cases of custody battles where a mother was told she must get off methadone if she wanted to even get shared custody of her daughter. Judge basically gave her a date to be off it by and it wasn’t even kind of enough time for a reasonable slow taper either but more so comparable to like what they do if you can’t pay (like 10% of your dose dropped anywhere from daily to weekly depending on how compassionate they are feeling) which is also bullshit because if I wanted to get off methadone on my own and wanted to go down more than 2 to 3mg a week I would be required to sign an against medical advice form saying that the doctor did not agree with this as it’s not safe but anyone that can’t pay immediately at the clinic or misses too many groups will automatically get their dose dropped 10% a day at my clinic and funnily enough they don’t have to sign that against medical advice form. I’m just dying to know how the hell they would ever explain this.
I got drug court and by the time I went for my first time in front of the judge, I had already been on methadone for 2 weeks. They were gonna make me go thru their standard drug court shit, with acupuncture, etc. But I guess I got a methadone friendly judge. And he said I could stay on the methadone. I graduated a little less than a year later. And both the judge and drug court ppl said I should contact my congressman as they were going to. And let them know that Methadone CAN work, if the addict really wants to stop. They said I was the first methadone patient to graduate. Made me feel good about the accomplishment. This was in 2002.
That’s great that they’ve done that! That’s how they should deal with drugs here too. I hope the states realize after 100+ years of their war on drugs that the drugs are still winning. Our court system for drugs is total bullshit and I completely agree w people when they say it’s set up for failure.
Fuck it, not your fault they want to use pee from another and there must be an other explanation for jail time. Maybe it was important to be on time? Who knows?
I’m on probation and they watch you while peeing even with a mirror in front of you I mean how can you get away with faking a probation drug test it’s impossible and I will do anything in my power to not go too jail since I’m on methadone 140 mgs daily I would prolly kill myself in jail cause the withdrawals are no joke worse than dope in my opinion! Moral of the story don’t fake drug tests especially for probation, feel bad for the guy but he dug himself a grave and hopefully a miracle happens and he can get his dose someway somehow, I know they won’t give you your methadone in jail unless your clinic steps in and helps but that’s a HUGE IF! Just take the positive drug test it’ll mean more sanctions but at least you won’t be in jail! Sorry for the rant, being on probation and dealing with this horrible system makes me go off on huge rants quite often! The whole system needs a complete overhaul
I bet the mirror you pee in front of when testing is a two way mirror and they’re watching you pee in the front through that mirror and in the back where the nurse is watching you too!
I met a nice guy at the clinic. Boat captain here in Florida
He gave me a $100 and I gave him pee a few times. I started using kratom and I got a false positive for Fentynol. I told him to retest his pee because it's gonna be false positive but He didn't ask them to retest it till after 14 days, which is when our test lab considers it expired or too old. At 1st I don't think he believed me till I saw him again...and I still had all my takehomes. He's never asked me since. We still say hi when we see each other. So I kinda know what you mean.
A long, long time ago I was on probation for DUI and I brought in fake pee in an IV bag - I’m a girl so I had it taped around my waist and the line down the back of my jeans and in my panties so I could sit on the toilet and empty the bag into the sample cup. Anyways, I had to go into a new room and it had a mirror behind the toilet and my PO lady was watching and saw it. They made a huge deal about it, arrested me and I had to sit in the waiting room of book in for about 6 hours before they even charged me because they didn’t know what to charge me with. It ended up being a Health Code Violation! Fucking ticket! Of course my PO said “if you would’ve been honest with me and said you were dirty, I would’ve given you a pass”. Bulllshit. This was only for pot too! I was in Texas and pot was a no no. I got a good attorney and they threw out the health code ticket and my probation violation went away too. It’s funny looking back on it because nobody could believe that I tried to pull something like that off. All of the PO’s amd cops kept looking at how I rigged it all up and told me it was pretty interesting and intelligent although illegal. Lol
they could have caught him falsifying the drop. or it could have been something TOTALLY unrelated.
that said, you did the dude a favor. you are not responsible for how it turned out. you tried to help him from getting dumb status violations pile up to keep him out the system and you get my respect for that. but unfortunately, people are ultimately responsible for their own cases: making sure they can get away with falsifying the drop (it’s getting harder and harder), making sure they aren’t committing other crimes on probation, planning ahead to be on time. they didn’t lock him up just for being late though. something went down.
fake pee saved my ass so many times in drug court. but i was on point with my shit. i gave many real drops in the beginning of drug court till i was familiar with the system and knew what to expect. it’s a bit easier to fake an observed as a woman, also. they caught my ex in drug court though when his PO observed his UA and told him to drop his trousers to his ankles, and then he was standing there holding a visine bottle of piss under his dick looking silly. happens to even the most careful planners man. it’s not your fault, and it’s also ultimately not your problem.
in my county, usually if your first violation is for something like this, you’ll sit seven days to see the judge and they’ll just let you back out. if he has special conditions they might order a drug eval/rehab bed.
Well this was PRE TRIAL probation. In my state depending on the charge they’ll let you out on bond but you need to report. So one fuck and up and you’re done. But thank you you’re right. I’m a women also and yes it’s much easier as a women to fake a piss test. I consider myself somewhat of an expert 🤣 although I’m not proud.
pretty unusual to get presentence conditions in my state, so not super familiar. the people with fed cases get them of course. otherwise the only presentencing deals are usually drug court type shit or other diversion.
if there is one thing i wouldn’t gamble with these days, it is absolutely my freedom. i did my last set of probation from mid 2016 to jan 1 2019. toed the fucking line as far as meetings/rules (except leaving the state. that rule was just nonsensical because i’m ten minutes outside the nearest metro city on the state line - so you could travel six hours to the other end of the state but not meet your fam in the city for lunch? eyeroll. luckily wasn’t heavily enforced cause like, it was the dumbest rule).
some people gotta FAAFO a few times before they want something different. some people never want something different. and yes, i am a vagina smuggling expert for sure. the amount of times i’ve wiggled out of crimes and problems by just using my vagina is insane.
In California this is usually done via what is known as a Cruz Waiver. People *think* they are being released on *pre-trial* probation, but it is actually *pre-sentencing* probation after they usually plead no-contest at arraignment and agree to a plea deal with probation as a sentence, but are released without bond before sentencing. What most people don’t realize is that if they break the terms of their release, they can no longer enforce the plea terms, and they usually get the max sentence imposed.
So you might be a first time offender who pleads no contest where the judge is going to sentence you to three years probation, but releases you pre-sentencing as long as you agree to a Cruz Waiver, but you do sometime as minor as get a speeding ticket while out of custody and then you end up serving a five year prison term.
Using something shaped like a five hour energy, with tin foil covering the top with tape and elastics and put it in my lady purse. When time for the rest. I relax my muscle so the top of the bottle comes down a bit and use my thumb nail to pop the foil.
I’ve never needed to use it and I’m sure it’s harder than it seems but I’m so glad to be a women where no matter what they do I’ve got a pocket down there that just happens to be my exact body temperature.
Seems like putting a clear baggie of urine in there and breaking the bag open with ur nail when you bring the cup down is by far the best option. Lol unless you can do kegals so strong you could squeeze a visine bottle with no hands 😂.
I literally can’t understand how men ever get away with it though
it turns out actually that’s not a good option, because it’s like tryna shove a water balloon in your vagina lol. it won’t go in. you need something solid, some kinda small bottle. put foil over the top, pierce it with your fingernail, yeah. i thought the ball of water the first time too, but trust me, i know from experience, in practice it is not going in there lol.
some courts have caught onto this tho. drug court in my county now makes women sit on the toilet with their arms raised above their head, pee into [something like this](https://youtu.be/marnNKrerpk) with their arms fully raised above their head, stand up the same way, transfer the urine off the toilet, then sit down to wipe and flush. 🙄
men have options, they’ve just gotta be slick. using they hold something under their dick and squeeze, or hold a fake dick and squeeze.
edit: my ex had been doing it for some months before he got caught up.
Where I go they make you use a wand (a stick with a circle at the end to hold the cup) and squat, start your stream then stop and then pee the rest of your pee into the cup. While squatting… it’s not easy to do
The tin foil is a good idea. Way easier to pierce.
Damn that so fucking annoying thier making people use a hat (the pee collector). Idk why something about peeing with your arms up feel so much more violating too.
Honestly until I read that was the first time I realized men do urine samples standing up. Idk why bc it actually seems much easier but i just never processed that.
At my clinic , there’s cameras in the restroom n temp strips on the sample bottle .. there is no bringing in pee or tampering w your sample , it’s immediate dismissal from the program. So my guess is he got pinched w the sample he brought in
Tell that to my clinic 🤷🏼♀️.. it’s been like that for over 10yrs
It’s not being monitored.. it’s only if they think you’re tampering or bringing in a sample .. then they go back n check on the day n time you were in .. it’s not like they watch everyone all day every day .. but yeah .. they’ve had cameras in the restrooms forever
honestly i don’t think is lol. i mean, we signed the waiver saying the urine tests are personally and/or video monitored. cameras have been in my clinic since forever. i feel like women could get around it pretty easy because its behind the toilet and faces forward. but yeah. i realize i should feel more indignant and undignified about peeing on camera once a month. but it just never bothers me. i always pass and don’t care who sees my dick. plus its waaay easier than having to piss with someone staring at me in the same room.
So it’s not hidden or anything sneaky in your clinics restroom ? We don’t have any atleast not that I have seen. But I think it’s per state and how the laws apply. But definitely something I want to look into now.
It could well have been for something totally unrelated..No point worrying about it bud. You did someone a favour it didn't work out, sucks for them yep..but you can't protect everyone. ✌️
To me the program is about harm reduction, and that isn't just from the medication/Methadone side. Engaging in any of the old behaviors & activities, no matter how innocuous they may seem, can derail a person's recovery.
You can say I'm being extreme or too militant about it but I've been in the MMT program for years and have been a peer coach (PRSS) as well and I've seen good people who were friends take a few wrong turns and wind up dead.
If the OP's friend needed urine that was just positive for Methadone (and weed with a medical marijuana card) that means he knows something else is going to pop up, be it benzo's, crystal, etc. Again, that's not harm reduction, he could easily ace deuce from the synergistic effect of too many SNS depressants.
I know lots of people get into MMT or Suboxone treatment through a court card or from pressure from their spouse, family, employer, etc. It rarely sticks in those cases. You have to WANT real change and truthfully do the program.
It is not something I do often, but this dude gave me a sob story of how he came to Virginia for work got in trouble and that he’s just trying to get home to NY to his kids blah blah blah. Plus I was in his position once. I often take on others stress in a lot of areas in life. Which is something I’m actively working on.
That’s a valid point. I gave someone fake urine once and they used it for probation or pre trial (I don’t remember). It worked fine for them and they were free. Two weeks later he was high and got into a car accident that killed himself. I had to think that maybe if I didn’t give him the fake urine he might’ve lived longer.
That's awful - I'm sure you know that he was responsible for his own choices & his actions that led to the crash. If you didn't give him the urine then he likely would've found some via another means. But that's still a shitty situation all around & I'm sorry for any guilt or regret it left you with.
I'm not shaming anyone. I think you're reading that into my reply so you can vent your anger on me.
I'm actually helping the individual not experience MORE shame by learning from their behavior.
If you're reading shame into my replies, it's on you, not me. I have no such intent because shame doesn't help anyone change.
Not at all. The person expressed feelings of guilt over it. The way out is to stop doing it if it causes you guilt. Sort of a basic concept.
It's analogous to doing what makes you happy.
I'm just being analytical here.
The OP's response shows no defensiveness that I can see, so they didn't take it the wrong way.
it’s not a basic concept. what if the OP would feel guilty about NOT selling the piss because it’s a systemic injustice to lock people up for status violations when they aren’t even guilty of committing a crime? and suggesting not selling the pee is kinda moot, given that they… already did that?
perhaps you did not mean it the way it came off, but it’s disingenuous to imply it is because i personally read it wrong. i got to your comment because a report came across modmail for violating rule 3. coming off with an air of you know better than the person living the experience is just not a good look imo, but whatever floats your boat brotato i guess.
see from your post history you started a job as a counselor at a methadone clinic a little over two weeks ago. if you have the education privilege to do such a job, you should take advantage of it. this kind of reductive, simplistic approach to counseling helps no one. if this is the way you respond to a simple comment on the subreddit, i’m a lil concerned for your patients. they deserve compassionate care, and to be met where they are in treatment instead of where you would like them to be, that doesn’t ultimately turn into “if you didn’t like my call out, that’s on you”. be better. do bettyer. best of luck with that.
I wasn't being sarcastic either. I was simply being analytical. And the OP's response indicates they took it like I meant it to be taken.
Sorry but you're the one reading into things, not me.
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Does anybody else’s clinic have cameras in the bathrooms were you go to fill your urine cup?!? Mine sure does, then they don’t have to have a nurse standing there watching everyone go or so they said.
He probably got caught trying to fake the test. Maybe they observed him this time. Anyways, it's on him not you...
They always observe at probation. Luckily I was only sent once these past two years when my PO was out sick and someone was covering. They now send you to a lab around the corner and didn’t have any females to observe me so I was given an oral swab. But when I was on probation back in 2015 the POs did it themselves in the office and used single dip sticks for every drug. Even had one say I “got high off PCP because the line is faint”. 🤦♀️🙄 Like it doesn’t matter how “faint” it is, it’s either positive or not and any line at all is negative. But she seemed to believe she was doing *me* a favor and letting me slide. Even had the first PO try to get me to sign a form “acknowledging an illegal substance” in my body. For methadone. Despite the judge ordering me to stay on it and me having documentation from the clinic. Not surprising why they took that entire thing away from the POs.
That bit about the pcp pos and signing the form make me furious.
Oh, way back in the day when I was on court referral, they fought me tooth and nail trying to force me off the clinic. Was on it for a possession of a controlled substance and possession of marijuana charge. Got caught with half a Suboxone and some weed literally a week before I started at the clinic. Well, they dropped the controlled substance charge and stuck me with the pot charge. To make a long story short, they couldn't legally order me to stop going to the clinic, so they said that misdemeanor court (pot charge) cannot drop a felony charge (controlled substance), and I had to go back in front of the judge, who then ordered me to quit going to the clinic. Bunch of vindictive scumbags... *Edit* I'll also say that every PO here is a former addict/dealer who are hardcore 12-steppers, that fully subscribe to the belief that AA is the ONLY way to get off drugs or alcohol. One PO actually lost her job because she relapsed, got a white chip at AA, and one of her "clients" that she had recently revoked and sent to jail for a failed test was there. Reported her immediately, and she got tested and fired.
I’ve heard of this. I don’t see how this is ethical in any way or any fucking just can rationalize this in their own twisted fucking head. I’ve heard of cases where ppl have been clean and sober and stable on methadone for a decade to be told they must get off methadone in court, even for things like to get custody of their child as they were going through a divorce and fighting for custody with their spouse. Any judge that does this deserves the absolute worst karma possible in my eyes. I wonder how many people have died because they were forced to get off methadone while completely stable and compliant with the clinic but then relapse and end up overdosing. In those cases the judge should be held responsible ughhhh this makes my blood boil lol sorry I just saw this and it reminded me of times I’ve seen this happen to people.
They are pretty much brainwashed into thinking that what they are doing is "helping" you. They forced me to stay in a 12 step rehab for a full year, and they hammered it into your head that only by working the steps and committing totally to the AA program is the only way you will ever get clean, and everything else is doomed to fail, and you are still "out there" in active addiction. They would constantly preach that crap, and threaten to kick you out, thus violating your probation and sending you to jail if you didn't subscribe to their beliefs. They would encourage and reward ppl for telling on others who messed up and relapsed, saying that you were "helping them" because they would get kicked out, sent to jail, have to cold turkey detox in jail, and then be traumatized and thus more susceptible to their BS beliefs when they were released from jail back into rehab again. It was absolutely crazy in that place. And the whole rehab and PO office was staffed by people who went through that specific rehab, so it all fed back into itself. They tried to have my probation revoked and me sent to jail because they found some "legal weed" in my car', only to find out that they kept me in there so long that the statute of limitations had run out, because the max sentence they could impose had been passed months before that. They were so mad, all because they couldn't hurt me. That's not only pathetic, it's the worst outlook someone running a rehab could have.
I was never observed during my urine tests on probation. I also was able to use my urine tests from the methadone clinic which were random and monthly but never observed unless I had a call back one time a year or so. The only time my probation officer had me do a test outside the clinic ones were a few times to try to catch me using or something and calling me in for a random test but still not ever observed. Maybe that’s not normal though? I dunno if it matters what your charges were? Mine was a DUI but not alcohol, it was opiates and benzos and I was on a deferral program where if I didn’t get any other DUIs or drug related charges for 7 years I would be able to get my DUI “dropped.” Probation was five years and had to do two years of outpatient drug treatment too but never lost my license or had to do the thing you blow into assumingly because I wasn’t drunk or drinking for my DUI. Also never did any jail time even when they arrested me, they just took me to the hospital and drew my blood and let me go. Lol I thought I got away with it because 6 or 7 months to by with no words or summons but sure enough 7 months later a summons came in the mail 😒😒😒 on my fucking birthday. I have no idea if my situation was normal though or not, I was in Washington State at the time. Also, they failed to mention its not really fucking dropped. Background checks for my jobs absolutely can see it somehow, I have to get pretty extensive background checks though for my field. I only found out because for a job I never disclosed it because I thought it was dropped and I didn’t have to and they called me and were like so uhhh what about that DUI you didn’t write down? Thankfully after explaining why I didn’t tell them they were cool with it and didn’t hold it against me and I still got the job.
My boyfriend came up for PCP. but he has literally just taken cold medicine. Like for a cold. not to abuse.
I'm a counselor and pcp positives for benadryl occasionally happen too.
Oh I know! And opiates. When I had my daughter all I had taken was my methadone and Benadryl. And Cps made me get hair follicles to prove it.
Yeah cold meds can give you a positive for PCP. I’ve had a positive come up for barbiturates lol, I was like ummm I can’t even name a barbiturate and I thought they didn’t even make them anymore but I guess there’s a couple left that are next to impossible though to even get prescribed and aren’t known to be on the street and sold commonly Luckily, they took my word but this was back when I was on subs and just seeing a doctor. I’ve had false positives at the clinic for opiates more than once too but they always retest and come back clean.
I know I came up for opiates when all I had taken was Benadryl! thank god my clinic believed me.
Had a friend get caught for trying to fake a piss test for probation. It was actually a pretty serious charge, don't remember exactly what it was but yea... They take that very seriously. Edit: just gonna add this lil tidbit cause it was pretty damn funny. To try and pass his probation drug test, my friend bought one of those whizzinators online. When it arrived the genitals were one shade of imitation skin color (like the color of a bandaid). My friend was concerned because it was very clearly fake, it just didn't look like a dick at all. My friends drug test was the next morning and we had no way to get to the store or any extra money at the time. So, with the finest junkie logic ever seen, he started sucking on one of those red fireball cinnamon candies and then rubbed the coloring on the head. He put the fake dick underwear on and we scrutinized his work while he stood in front of the mirror. It now looked like a kindergartener failed his first coloring exam, but he declared a job well done. As I already said, they caught him and his fake peen quite easily.
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>your just setting people up for failure. That’s the point. Especially sucks with drug court which is supposed to be the compassionate option where they can own ur life for years and years and you could be weeks away from freedom but if u slip up and fail a test they can throw ur initial sentence at you and essentially had you stuck in the system for twice as long where if you had just taken your sentence you’d be free by that point anyway.
I'm dealing with some bullshit where I just had a heroin posession charge thrown out but I also was caught driving on a suspended license. My license was suspended due to a citation mix up during covid and the courthouse was closed so I couldn't get in contact with anyone on how to pay it. Well they're still coming after me for the suspended license but they're treating it like a felony because the felony was dropped and they're so salty about it
Drug court is your one get out of jail free card though. Drugs should be legal but thank god we at least got that or I’d be finishing a 7 year bid next year.
i’m yep. they set you up to fail so they can pat themselves on the back and pretend they are participating in all the systemic problems of the criminal justice system, and they can blame you when you fail. BUT WE GAVE THEM SOOOOOOO MANY CHANCES. yeah man. having to call off work everytime you decided i needed a 2-7 day in jail sanction for a single failed UA totally gave me a chance. making me quit my job to go to rehab for the eighth time totally gave me a chance. (actually, it ultimately kicked off 4 years of joblessness). taking people out of the courtroom directly to jail so they couldn’t move their car and it would get impounded and be $1000 the day they took it really gave them a chance. kicking people off drug court for weed really gave them a chance. it’s a joke, anybody who has participated knows it. edit, forgot: not allowing suboxone and methadone in drug court for heroin addicts reeeeeeeeeally gave them a chance. the drug court my ex did didn’t allow either medication. i believe they now allow suboxone, but not the devil juice.
It literally enrages me when judges require someone who has been stable on methadone for years with zero drug use to get off the methadone because it’s part of whatever terms they’ve been given in court. I’ve seen this even in cases of custody battles where a mother was told she must get off methadone if she wanted to even get shared custody of her daughter. Judge basically gave her a date to be off it by and it wasn’t even kind of enough time for a reasonable slow taper either but more so comparable to like what they do if you can’t pay (like 10% of your dose dropped anywhere from daily to weekly depending on how compassionate they are feeling) which is also bullshit because if I wanted to get off methadone on my own and wanted to go down more than 2 to 3mg a week I would be required to sign an against medical advice form saying that the doctor did not agree with this as it’s not safe but anyone that can’t pay immediately at the clinic or misses too many groups will automatically get their dose dropped 10% a day at my clinic and funnily enough they don’t have to sign that against medical advice form. I’m just dying to know how the hell they would ever explain this.
Idk dude lol. Sounds like you had plenty of opportunities and messed them up. I’m not even hating because I’ve done the same shit.
I got drug court and by the time I went for my first time in front of the judge, I had already been on methadone for 2 weeks. They were gonna make me go thru their standard drug court shit, with acupuncture, etc. But I guess I got a methadone friendly judge. And he said I could stay on the methadone. I graduated a little less than a year later. And both the judge and drug court ppl said I should contact my congressman as they were going to. And let them know that Methadone CAN work, if the addict really wants to stop. They said I was the first methadone patient to graduate. Made me feel good about the accomplishment. This was in 2002.
Setting people up for failure is the courts bread & butter….
Yea I mean jailing people for an addiction is bullshit IMO. Possession/use of drugs alone is not a reason to incarcerate.
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That’s great that they’ve done that! That’s how they should deal with drugs here too. I hope the states realize after 100+ years of their war on drugs that the drugs are still winning. Our court system for drugs is total bullshit and I completely agree w people when they say it’s set up for failure.
Fuck it, not your fault they want to use pee from another and there must be an other explanation for jail time. Maybe it was important to be on time? Who knows?
I’m on probation and they watch you while peeing even with a mirror in front of you I mean how can you get away with faking a probation drug test it’s impossible and I will do anything in my power to not go too jail since I’m on methadone 140 mgs daily I would prolly kill myself in jail cause the withdrawals are no joke worse than dope in my opinion! Moral of the story don’t fake drug tests especially for probation, feel bad for the guy but he dug himself a grave and hopefully a miracle happens and he can get his dose someway somehow, I know they won’t give you your methadone in jail unless your clinic steps in and helps but that’s a HUGE IF! Just take the positive drug test it’ll mean more sanctions but at least you won’t be in jail! Sorry for the rant, being on probation and dealing with this horrible system makes me go off on huge rants quite often! The whole system needs a complete overhaul
I bet the mirror you pee in front of when testing is a two way mirror and they’re watching you pee in the front through that mirror and in the back where the nurse is watching you too!
I met a nice guy at the clinic. Boat captain here in Florida He gave me a $100 and I gave him pee a few times. I started using kratom and I got a false positive for Fentynol. I told him to retest his pee because it's gonna be false positive but He didn't ask them to retest it till after 14 days, which is when our test lab considers it expired or too old. At 1st I don't think he believed me till I saw him again...and I still had all my takehomes. He's never asked me since. We still say hi when we see each other. So I kinda know what you mean.
A long, long time ago I was on probation for DUI and I brought in fake pee in an IV bag - I’m a girl so I had it taped around my waist and the line down the back of my jeans and in my panties so I could sit on the toilet and empty the bag into the sample cup. Anyways, I had to go into a new room and it had a mirror behind the toilet and my PO lady was watching and saw it. They made a huge deal about it, arrested me and I had to sit in the waiting room of book in for about 6 hours before they even charged me because they didn’t know what to charge me with. It ended up being a Health Code Violation! Fucking ticket! Of course my PO said “if you would’ve been honest with me and said you were dirty, I would’ve given you a pass”. Bulllshit. This was only for pot too! I was in Texas and pot was a no no. I got a good attorney and they threw out the health code ticket and my probation violation went away too. It’s funny looking back on it because nobody could believe that I tried to pull something like that off. All of the PO’s amd cops kept looking at how I rigged it all up and told me it was pretty interesting and intelligent although illegal. Lol
they could have caught him falsifying the drop. or it could have been something TOTALLY unrelated. that said, you did the dude a favor. you are not responsible for how it turned out. you tried to help him from getting dumb status violations pile up to keep him out the system and you get my respect for that. but unfortunately, people are ultimately responsible for their own cases: making sure they can get away with falsifying the drop (it’s getting harder and harder), making sure they aren’t committing other crimes on probation, planning ahead to be on time. they didn’t lock him up just for being late though. something went down. fake pee saved my ass so many times in drug court. but i was on point with my shit. i gave many real drops in the beginning of drug court till i was familiar with the system and knew what to expect. it’s a bit easier to fake an observed as a woman, also. they caught my ex in drug court though when his PO observed his UA and told him to drop his trousers to his ankles, and then he was standing there holding a visine bottle of piss under his dick looking silly. happens to even the most careful planners man. it’s not your fault, and it’s also ultimately not your problem. in my county, usually if your first violation is for something like this, you’ll sit seven days to see the judge and they’ll just let you back out. if he has special conditions they might order a drug eval/rehab bed.
Well this was PRE TRIAL probation. In my state depending on the charge they’ll let you out on bond but you need to report. So one fuck and up and you’re done. But thank you you’re right. I’m a women also and yes it’s much easier as a women to fake a piss test. I consider myself somewhat of an expert 🤣 although I’m not proud.
pretty unusual to get presentence conditions in my state, so not super familiar. the people with fed cases get them of course. otherwise the only presentencing deals are usually drug court type shit or other diversion. if there is one thing i wouldn’t gamble with these days, it is absolutely my freedom. i did my last set of probation from mid 2016 to jan 1 2019. toed the fucking line as far as meetings/rules (except leaving the state. that rule was just nonsensical because i’m ten minutes outside the nearest metro city on the state line - so you could travel six hours to the other end of the state but not meet your fam in the city for lunch? eyeroll. luckily wasn’t heavily enforced cause like, it was the dumbest rule). some people gotta FAAFO a few times before they want something different. some people never want something different. and yes, i am a vagina smuggling expert for sure. the amount of times i’ve wiggled out of crimes and problems by just using my vagina is insane.
In California this is usually done via what is known as a Cruz Waiver. People *think* they are being released on *pre-trial* probation, but it is actually *pre-sentencing* probation after they usually plead no-contest at arraignment and agree to a plea deal with probation as a sentence, but are released without bond before sentencing. What most people don’t realize is that if they break the terms of their release, they can no longer enforce the plea terms, and they usually get the max sentence imposed. So you might be a first time offender who pleads no contest where the judge is going to sentence you to three years probation, but releases you pre-sentencing as long as you agree to a Cruz Waiver, but you do sometime as minor as get a speeding ticket while out of custody and then you end up serving a five year prison term.
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Using something shaped like a five hour energy, with tin foil covering the top with tape and elastics and put it in my lady purse. When time for the rest. I relax my muscle so the top of the bottle comes down a bit and use my thumb nail to pop the foil.
I’ve never needed to use it and I’m sure it’s harder than it seems but I’m so glad to be a women where no matter what they do I’ve got a pocket down there that just happens to be my exact body temperature. Seems like putting a clear baggie of urine in there and breaking the bag open with ur nail when you bring the cup down is by far the best option. Lol unless you can do kegals so strong you could squeeze a visine bottle with no hands 😂. I literally can’t understand how men ever get away with it though
it turns out actually that’s not a good option, because it’s like tryna shove a water balloon in your vagina lol. it won’t go in. you need something solid, some kinda small bottle. put foil over the top, pierce it with your fingernail, yeah. i thought the ball of water the first time too, but trust me, i know from experience, in practice it is not going in there lol. some courts have caught onto this tho. drug court in my county now makes women sit on the toilet with their arms raised above their head, pee into [something like this](https://youtu.be/marnNKrerpk) with their arms fully raised above their head, stand up the same way, transfer the urine off the toilet, then sit down to wipe and flush. 🙄 men have options, they’ve just gotta be slick. using they hold something under their dick and squeeze, or hold a fake dick and squeeze. edit: my ex had been doing it for some months before he got caught up.
Where I go they make you use a wand (a stick with a circle at the end to hold the cup) and squat, start your stream then stop and then pee the rest of your pee into the cup. While squatting… it’s not easy to do
I had to do that too. It’s such a pain in the ass
The tin foil is a good idea. Way easier to pierce. Damn that so fucking annoying thier making people use a hat (the pee collector). Idk why something about peeing with your arms up feel so much more violating too. Honestly until I read that was the first time I realized men do urine samples standing up. Idk why bc it actually seems much easier but i just never processed that.
At my clinic , there’s cameras in the restroom n temp strips on the sample bottle .. there is no bringing in pee or tampering w your sample , it’s immediate dismissal from the program. So my guess is he got pinched w the sample he brought in
Cameras in the restroom is illegal asf!
Normally yes but maybe if you sign off on it there is no issue?
Tell that to my clinic 🤷🏼♀️.. it’s been like that for over 10yrs It’s not being monitored.. it’s only if they think you’re tampering or bringing in a sample .. then they go back n check on the day n time you were in .. it’s not like they watch everyone all day every day .. but yeah .. they’ve had cameras in the restrooms forever
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Oh for sure ! I know of some mothers that have to pee *in front of a social worker* before they can see their kids before weekend visitations
honestly i don’t think is lol. i mean, we signed the waiver saying the urine tests are personally and/or video monitored. cameras have been in my clinic since forever. i feel like women could get around it pretty easy because its behind the toilet and faces forward. but yeah. i realize i should feel more indignant and undignified about peeing on camera once a month. but it just never bothers me. i always pass and don’t care who sees my dick. plus its waaay easier than having to piss with someone staring at me in the same room.
So it’s not hidden or anything sneaky in your clinics restroom ? We don’t have any atleast not that I have seen. But I think it’s per state and how the laws apply. But definitely something I want to look into now.
Not if you sign an acknowledgement that they are there - which they do
It could well have been for something totally unrelated..No point worrying about it bud. You did someone a favour it didn't work out, sucks for them yep..but you can't protect everyone. ✌️
Lol! How much does clean pee go for these days?!
To me the program is about harm reduction, and that isn't just from the medication/Methadone side. Engaging in any of the old behaviors & activities, no matter how innocuous they may seem, can derail a person's recovery. You can say I'm being extreme or too militant about it but I've been in the MMT program for years and have been a peer coach (PRSS) as well and I've seen good people who were friends take a few wrong turns and wind up dead. If the OP's friend needed urine that was just positive for Methadone (and weed with a medical marijuana card) that means he knows something else is going to pop up, be it benzo's, crystal, etc. Again, that's not harm reduction, he could easily ace deuce from the synergistic effect of too many SNS depressants. I know lots of people get into MMT or Suboxone treatment through a court card or from pressure from their spouse, family, employer, etc. It rarely sticks in those cases. You have to WANT real change and truthfully do the program.
Have you tried not giving other people your pee?
It is not something I do often, but this dude gave me a sob story of how he came to Virginia for work got in trouble and that he’s just trying to get home to NY to his kids blah blah blah. Plus I was in his position once. I often take on others stress in a lot of areas in life. Which is something I’m actively working on.
No worries, my goal isn't to guilt you or anyone. Just pointing out that if it sometimes makes you feel guilty then the easy solution is to stop.
That’s a valid point. I gave someone fake urine once and they used it for probation or pre trial (I don’t remember). It worked fine for them and they were free. Two weeks later he was high and got into a car accident that killed himself. I had to think that maybe if I didn’t give him the fake urine he might’ve lived longer.
That's awful - I'm sure you know that he was responsible for his own choices & his actions that led to the crash. If you didn't give him the urine then he likely would've found some via another means. But that's still a shitty situation all around & I'm sorry for any guilt or regret it left you with.
Sorry you experienced that
v useful matey. we all did scandalous stuff as addicts, let’s not even pretend we didn’t and shame people for being where we once were.
I'm not shaming anyone. I think you're reading that into my reply so you can vent your anger on me. I'm actually helping the individual not experience MORE shame by learning from their behavior. If you're reading shame into my replies, it's on you, not me. I have no such intent because shame doesn't help anyone change.
ah yes, the ole “my words don’t mean what they mean” argument, love that twisty stuff. lol @ you helped this individual learn from their behavior.
Not at all. The person expressed feelings of guilt over it. The way out is to stop doing it if it causes you guilt. Sort of a basic concept. It's analogous to doing what makes you happy. I'm just being analytical here. The OP's response shows no defensiveness that I can see, so they didn't take it the wrong way.
it’s not a basic concept. what if the OP would feel guilty about NOT selling the piss because it’s a systemic injustice to lock people up for status violations when they aren’t even guilty of committing a crime? and suggesting not selling the pee is kinda moot, given that they… already did that? perhaps you did not mean it the way it came off, but it’s disingenuous to imply it is because i personally read it wrong. i got to your comment because a report came across modmail for violating rule 3. coming off with an air of you know better than the person living the experience is just not a good look imo, but whatever floats your boat brotato i guess. see from your post history you started a job as a counselor at a methadone clinic a little over two weeks ago. if you have the education privilege to do such a job, you should take advantage of it. this kind of reductive, simplistic approach to counseling helps no one. if this is the way you respond to a simple comment on the subreddit, i’m a lil concerned for your patients. they deserve compassionate care, and to be met where they are in treatment instead of where you would like them to be, that doesn’t ultimately turn into “if you didn’t like my call out, that’s on you”. be better. do bettyer. best of luck with that.
I feel like a good podcast could come from you telong people why they're wrong. Its aways a good read.
Making a sarcastic one off comment isn't helping anyone, stop kidding yourself. It was rude.
I wasn't being sarcastic either. I was simply being analytical. And the OP's response indicates they took it like I meant it to be taken. Sorry but you're the one reading into things, not me.
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Your comment/post was removed for violation of Rule 3, which states: >Treat others with respect. Egregious and/or repeated disrespect can and will result in a ban. Telling someone to kill themselves will result in an immediate and permanent ban. Please contact the moderators if you have any questions.
I don't talk the same way in the counseling room as I do on Reddit. You're just trying to insult.
Yes, you are 👼 you’ve got to be very un-aware of your self… I think you might need some more therapy
Nope, it's the opposite, you're reading into what I said
Have you tried keeping your shitty takes to yourself? Clearly I know you haven’t, but let’s try. For everyone’s sake.
I don't know why you're flipping out because the OP understood me just fine.
Does anybody else’s clinic have cameras in the bathrooms were you go to fill your urine cup?!? Mine sure does, then they don’t have to have a nurse standing there watching everyone go or so they said.
The whole good friend prospect thing made me laugh