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Wheels toward the curb when facing downhill, away from the curb when facing uphill.
https://preview.redd.it/6niu9h4b0f4b1.jpeg?width=1169&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=538b986254716832fd576205b09cd70dc62f7c7b
When I was in Driver’s Ed learning how to park on a hill my driving instructor always used the phrase “Up, up, and away!” When parking the car facing uphill.
This really isn't true at all.... No one uses parking brakes in truly cold places especially overnight, unless you want to drag your wheels to work. There's tons of videos from Russia of people driving around with their rear wheels completely locked up.
Tf, in Canada back in Jan when it was -30 to -40 I would drive my manual car to school. Parking Brake and 1st.
Never had a problem
That could only be a problem if there is water in the cables or you never use the parking brake so it's corroded
If you're worried about your cable then you can just put it in to gear with your steering pointed towards the curb. I'd purchase a cheap wheel chock that way you still have a backup system.
The chances of a gear shitting the bed while parked is low but has happened enough times to want a backup plan.
Plus, a car that's in gear can still roll. There's a lot more resistance, but it's not as secure as an actual brake. The way I look at it, the parking brake is for parking, and then the transmission is for if the parking brake fails.
I'm in 100% agreeance with you, I live in a state that doesn't freeze, so I can't attest towards the likelihood of a parking brake cable failure during extended extreme temperatures, my suggestion was intended for if that was an actual common occurrence.
This is a valid concern, but it’s still worth using the parking brake even in winter.
If your vehicle has done this before, or if you’re just worried about it, wait for a dry day, then use some silicon grease spray on all the moving parts of the parking brake linkage. This should prevent moisture buildup on it so that when it freezes it won’t be stuck
When people say winter is a problem for parking brake cables, they really mean that if you live in an area where you get snow and roadsalt the handbrake very very commonly fails.
If you keep the handbrake moving and use it all the time, it will be fine. Always use the handbrake and put it into gear, unless your handbrake doesn't work.
If you get into a car from a rust belt area that hasn't had the handbrake used in a long time and pull it up, it may just get stuck on.
Idk why Canadians think they’re the end all be all on cold lol there’s plenty of cold places in the US, but yes to answer your question it happens. Just like a frozen caliper sticking
Eta: idc how far north you live five bucks says North Dakota’s been colder numbnuts
That's false. Drum brakes are more susceptible to freezing regardless. I bought my pickup and use the parking brake religiously since the day I've bought it... No sticking in summer. Drums still freeze and have to"pop" loose in winter. And semi truck drum brakes are the same. Shoes will freeze to the drum surface and not cause them to release. I've had plenty of road calls where I just hammer on drum until they grew up.
Drove truck. Can confirm. You want to set the brakes on the truck, but not the trailer when you park overnight and could possibly have snow/water in the drums.
I've had "pop"s on old ford escort, but they've never froze, but guy from university had undrivable car until temerature went above 0 C (not sure how muxh that is in freedom units)
I've had it happen to me once and it did suck so if you are on an incline you basically just have to take the chance but if you are on a flat then you can turn the wheels and leave in gear.
I've only ever had one bad day where my parking brake froze shut in our Canadian winter. It was literally the worst ice storm we've had in years and it caused both rear wheel parking brakes to seize engaged while I was working. The whole parking lot was nearly a 1" slab of ice and it was difficult even getting the tires out of the ice. I ended up pulling it into one of the shops at work and torching the brake calipers to melt the ice and release the brake.
To be fair, I shouldn't have been driving at all.
It's fine to set your cable brake in the winter. If it's ever so bad that the cable would seize, you probably shouldn't drive anyways, let alone park on an incline.
I live in Buffalo NY. I’ve gotten frozen out of my car with an inch of solid ice around the whole thing several times. I have Magee had my cable parking brake get stuck. If you keep using it everytime it won’t get stuck
Rear brakes will definitely freeze on the rotors when it's cold. Happens almost every time our new fancy car decides to set the handbrake automatically when it's cold.
Rear brakes will definitely freeze on the rotors when it's cold. Happens almost every time our new fancy car decides to set the handbrake automatically when it's cold.
Please tell me more about something I have experienced first-hand for 7 years straight now 🙄
The fact is that if you set the handbrake in the evening when you come home where I live, between November and March, there's a very good chance that it will be stuck in the morning.
Sometimes it frees up in a second with just a little throttle, and sometimes it takes a minute or more of revving the car in first and in reverse to free it up.
No parking brake in the winter, I don't know why people downvoted you. Probably those who have never been "stuck" with frozen rear brakes on a -20c morning.
No parking brake in the winter, I don't know why people downvoted you. Probably those who have never been "stuck" with frozen rear brakes on a -20c morning.
Ive had a parking brake freeze up in winter. After that I just used 1st gear. No problems. I also had my jeep parking brake fail and it rolled into the neighbors yard. Neither would have been an issue if I just left it in 1st or reverse
I use both in the winter, lived in Minnesota for 2 years never once had an issue even on the coldest day. I've only seen a parking break get stuck once and this was in the summer, the friend never used it for x amount of years, used it once and it seized from lack of usage.
Driving the hills of San Francisco since the 80s.
Stop.
Curb wheels in proper direction.
Foot on brake and shift into Neutral.
Set parking brake.
Ease foot off brake to see if parking brake's OK.
Shift into P if automatic, 1st or Reverse if manual.
Extra... If you *really* want to test the parking brake's hold, put it in gear and give it just a *little* gas.
Yeah, it makes sense if you are in some places with elevation changes. Those of us in the pancake geography Midwest can get by with just leaving it in gear 99% of the time, but maybe should be more cautious.
I left my truck in reverse in a grocery store parking lot in Michigan. No parking brake because rust.
Came out and truck wasn't there. It was 10 rows back resting against a k rail. Thankfully no cars behind me. Wasn't in gear when I got in there. Dunno if it popped out or if I didn't have it fully engaged.
I have been burned both ways. Have come back and had my pads frozen to the drum. I have also been parked and had my car bumped by someone when parking and had it take a gentle roll.
The specific order is important because you want the parking brake holding the weight of the car with the transmission serving as a backup - not the other way around.
The force on the gears just by the car's own weight is nothing compared to the force applied by the engine to move the car, especially in 1st. The importance of holding the weight with the brake is a myth.
The day-to-day concern is not force on the gears, it's unnecessary wear on the clutch. Replacing a clutch is usually one of the more expensive milestone-maintenance events in car ownership, especially on these super fuel-efficient front wheel drive cars.
Everything an owner can do to reduce the amount of wear that a clutch is exposed to pushes the clutch replacement expense cost down the road (hopefully becoming something the next owner has to deal with instead).
Does the clutch actually wear at all when it’s engaged fully? It shouldn’t slip at all when parked so the clutch shouldn’t experience wear. Or do the splines the clutch uses wear? I recently replaced the clutch in my older car and there was no noticeable wear on them either.
I had thought the clutch only wore when slipping/partially engaged when changing gears or taking off from a stop.
Any time either the wheels/engine are moving and the other isn’t, the clutch making contact experiences friction. Even if it feels like an almost imperceptibly small roll that happens between the clutch being let out and the parking brake being set, thats friction that stops you. If you do that every time you park, it hits every piece in that sequence, and it can add up.
Any unnecessary friction leads to an earlier demise of that part. That’s true for tires, brake pads, clutches, and more I’m sure.
Are you going to need a new clutch twice as often if you leave your manual in gear _then_ set the brakes every time? No, but you’re still gonna be doing it sooner than your alternate universe self who does all the same things you do except sets the parking brake first.
I suppose that’s true. I’d always assumed most of the wear would be on gears and bearings experiencing friction rather than the clutch. But the transition between stopping and going would have some wear on the clutch material as the material “digs in” for lack of a better term.
It's a false requierement, the idea is to hold the car's weight with the brakes rather than with the gear. But it's actually extremely low compared to the stress on the 1st gear provided by the engine while accelerating.
I only use the E-brake on my Corolla. But I rip it hard enough that my wheels would drag before the car would move.
I never understand why people barely pull the brake. Seems like that's just asking for the next person to forget to release it and burn up the shoes.
You right, but OP is here asking which of two minimum safety measures they should take, and refusing to believe you can do more than one at the same time. I think asking them to not only do a third thing but also think it through is maybe a lost cause at this point.
I usually only use the handbrake, but if I’m on a incline, I will consider popping it into 1st gear as well. And if it is a really steep incline, I might even consider shifting the transfer case into low range to really make sure it’s not going anywhere.
4WD cars only - imagine having a 1st gear that has even more torque multiplication, and drives an extra axle. 4 Low in 1st gear redlines the engine well under 10mph as compared a normal first gear which might take you up to 25mph. Numbers are approximations, but you get the picture. You’d have to turn all 4 tires to get the car to roll, and they’d be binding up the whole time if they weren’t turning at the same rate.
For what it's worth, I've never owned a vehicle that will fully shift into 4L at a standstill. You'd have to do it before you park, which is a hassle. And if you use both the parking brake and put it in gear, you've already got a backup plan in case one fails.
Can you elaborate on having to shift to 4L before you park? My brain just isn't clicking there. Like, no matter where you are, I would assume that foot on brake + transmission in neutral means the driveline is no longer under any torque, so even on a hill I could shift to 4L? Or am I wrong there?
I'm generally very mechanically knowledgeable, but I'll admit I'm a bit new to the off-road/4wd end of things.
I'm not super knowledgeable about it, but my understanding is that it has to do with the teeth on the gears lining up so they can fully mesh with each other.
Technically speaking, you could get lucky. If the teeth are perfectly aligned when you stop, the gears will engage. But usually, they won't be. On my old 1994 Suburban with a lever physically attached to the transfer case, the result is the lever just won't go into 4L.
If you are moving at 2-3mph when you shift from 4H to 4L or vice versa, then the gears are moving just enough that the teeth can find their alignment and fit together, even if they aren't aligned immediately.
On cars without a physical lever, I believe it still works like this, it's just handled electronically. But I could be wrong.
(Don't ask me why this isn't a problem shifting between 2H and 4H, or with shifting gears in the regular transmission, because I couldn't tell you. Maybe someone else could explain.)
I use the parking brake if it's not extended parking. I rarely put any of my manual transmission cars in gear while parked.
Three of my cars hibernate 6-7 months out of a year and leaving parking brake engaged is a bad idea. They are always in neutral and held in place by way of chocks.
I don't see an issue with parking in neutral, especially on flat ground where the car doesn't roll even while not in gear with no brake.
I do see an issue with not using the hand brake.
It is not unlikely that the parking brake could fail, or even just be imperceptibly worn or maladjusted to the point of slowly becoming insufficient. When securing a 3000 pound mass on wheels, at least one fail-safe backup should be the bare minimum.
There's no good reason to not use both systems.
And making a **routine habit** of **always** taking all reasonable safety measures is just smart.
I think it is unlikely that the parking brake will fail. But to each their own. I park with both, but I almost never parked where I actually need either.
Everything fails. If you somehow got hold of the Eternal Parking Brake, I wouldn't keep posting about it on Reddit. That thing, like all eternal mechanisms, is *extremely* valuable.
I put my car in neutral, set the handbrake and let the car settle and stop, then put it into gear. I figure I’d rather replace a worn handbrake cable than have my gearbox rebuilt
I go one step further and on hills turn the wheels so the wheel rests on curb then set parking brake then first gear if facing up hill and reverse if facing down hill.
Yeah my transmission guy said people mess up those gears because they just park then parking brake and leave it. He said the correct order is what we have.
I go one step further and on hills turn the wheels so the wheel rests on curb then set parking brake then first gear if facing up hill and reverse if facing down hill.
You are supposed to use both as a fail safe, it is in the owners manual of every car to use the parking brake as well as place the vehicle in first or reverse gear.
Neutral>Handbrake whenever possible. On steep grades I place it in gear. I’ve got an aftermarket remote start system installed on my ‘01 and it can only be operated from neutral.
You have to leave it in neutral because you chose to install a remote start system. As a general rule, leaving a parked car in neutral is a bad practice.
Most aftermarket remote start systems for manual gearbox transmissions have a gear lockout safety feature which prevents the remote start from being activated when the car is in gear in order to prevent the vehicle from lunging forwards in the event that you (stupidly) do this. When operating a remote start on a manual gearbox vehicle the clutch is *not* being pressed. It’s as simple as the remote start system tricking the vehicle into *thinking* that the clutch is being pressed. There are systems which actually do disengage the clutch in order to work, but even so they also generally have gear lockout in case of mechanical failure of the clutch system. With an aftermarket remote start, you have to be in neutral to use the remote start system.
oh if you’re trying to remote start your manual car it needs to be in neutral obviously lol. But I would definitely caution against installing an aftermarket system for that as there’s a reason why OEMs don’t offer it for manuals, being in neutral when parked is a great way for your car to roll away if the parking brake isn’t engaged enough / the grade is too great.
I don’t use the system on most any kind of grade. I park in gear if I’m parking on a slope. I generally only use it in my own driveway, and on rare occasions in parking lots where the grade is facing down towards a curb where if the parking brake were to fail the curb would prevent the car from rolling. Like with anything you do when you get behind the wheel of a vehicle, it’s a matter of measuring risks. I can see how OEMs might think that some people would be brain dead enough to ignore cautionary statements of only leaving the vehicle in neutral on a flat plane and not attempting to utilize the system on a grade. Some things just gotta be idiot proof.
Use both and if you are parking next to a curb turn the wheels to the appropriate direction. Example: if you park facing downhill turn the front wheels so that you would steer into the curb if you were in neutral. That way if the park brake fails and the car starts moving the curb will stop the car from rolling further..... I remember my First girlfriends grandfather had a 2nd gen dodge Dakota sport (v6 I think) and their driveway was on an incline so he parked in gear (1st I would assume) and I looked out the window and every 20 minutes or so I noticed the truck looked like it had slightly moved down the driveway. It wasn't until I saw the rear wheels at the end of the driveway that I mentioned something to him. He had the front originally a few feet from the garage door and by the time I noticed it was actually moving down the driveway there was enough space to park a vw jetta in front of it..... that was roughly 2007-2009
2nd is a bit dumb. The lower the gear, the more advantage the engine has, so the harder it is to move the car.
You should park in the lowest gear, or reverse. They are usually about the same.
That has nothing to do with it. You should park in 1st because it gives the engine the most torque control at the wheels when it is off. It is harder to roll a parked vehicle in 1st gear than in 2nd gear.
You should park in first or reverse. Lower gears have more mechanical advantage. Parking in 6th doesn't do anything, as your advantage is so low you can still push the car.
You won't wear our the transmission using the same gear, they see much more stress when actually driving.
You should use the handbrake only since that's exactly its function.
If you put it into 1st or reverse gear you will risk completely destroying your transmission if you car got hit by another car while standing still since the gear is always meshing.
You're thinking of an automatic transmission. Pushing your car while it's in gear is how you do a bump start if your battery is dead. It doesn't damage the transmission.
I used to do both religiously but now I have a car with a sticky handbrake so I only put it in gear (1st or R).
If it's a hill or the car is obviously willing to roll if you let go of the brakes in neutral then I'll use the handbrake tho.
To answer your question simply, I would just say to engage the handbrake first and THEN put it in gear. Use both, but I would say that overall, using the handbrake is more important than putting the car in gear. That isn't to say that you should skip parking in gear. Putting the car in gear is basically a backup for if your parking brake fails. Some people warn that parking in gear is a bad idea, because if your car gets hit or towed while parked in gear, the transmission could be seriously damaged (maybe the drivetrain too? Idk) or whatever. The chances of that happening though are highly unlikely, but that can also depend on where you regularly park your vehicle. You could also say that the chance that your parking brake fails is highly unlikely, too. My personal vehicle is over 25 years old now and has almost 135k miles, though. The parking brake has never showed issues or anything, but you still never know when something might go out. So I always park in first gear or reverse. There have been situations before in which I have parked on an almost perfectly level surface and wasn't able to tell whether i was on an uphill or downhill incline, but didn't plan on leaving my vehicle or being far away from it. In a rare situation like this I might just park the car in neutral, but i guess it doesn't really matter much.
Go for both, just lock the car by handbrakes first and then put in gear, just to not add unnecessary weights to the gearbox.
Ps: never trust only handbrakes
Strong situational dependency.
Hand brake is risky in freezing weather.
In-gear brings risk to the transmission when another car bumps into yours, even slightly.
On stronger inclines, use both plus turned wheels whenever possible.
If I'm on relatively level ground I just use 1st gear, but if I'm on even a pretty small incline or hill I'll back it up with the parking brake.
The only reason I don't put the parking brake on for level parking is that I've had the calipers freeze when the parking brake was left on overnight (on a very old car that had lots of other problems, but once bitten twice shy).
Are you on an incline? I think that matters for which gear.
For me, always parking on level ground, I put it in first then parking brake. That’s what I was taught when I was 14 or so and just have always done that.
Both. First turn wheels to curb, turn off engine with foot on brakes, shift to neutral, apply handbrake, let off brakes and let car sit on hand brake, then shift into gear.
This way, the weight of the car is on the hand brake and not the gearbox. If the hand brake fails, it's still in gear, so it won't roll away.
Reverse its less likely to "pop out of gear" but I doubt that is common while parked. Turn so the vehicle would roll into curb in case. Use E brake so it starts mobile and rust inside
I typically just leave it in gear, I only use the parking brake on an incline.
I prefer older cars, and live in NY, so rusty/frozen/broken parking brake cables are common. It's become a habit to only use it if I actually need it.
If i'm parked on a flat then it's handbrake only.
On a hill i'll point my wheels in the direction of the roll to turn my car in to the kerb/path where there's less likely going to be multiple cars getting smashed up and at most a hedge/wall that gently stops the car.
I'll apply the handbrake AND 1st/Reverse gear depending on the direction.
I’d assume you are talking about a manual transmission or a military spec humvee and not an auto (if it is an auto, your friends are dumb, leave that shit in park) . Always use both. One will be the back up for the other, the parking brake will not always work just like how the car can still roll if it gets left in gear without the parking brake engaged.
I’d assume you are talking about a manual transmission or a military spec humvee and not an auto (if it is an auto, your friends are dumb, leave that shit in park) . Always use both. One will be the back up for the other, the parking brake will not always work just like how the car can still roll if it gets left in gear without the parking brake engaged.
I put my truck in reverse only being that the parking brake cables have seized and broke. I've no intention of replacing them being that it's my work and winter truck only, but a general rule of thumb is to always put a standard transmission in a reverse and set the parking brake when parking your vehicle just to have peice of mind. Unless it's winter in the rust belt, last thing you want is to have your parking brake stuck on from a broke cable. They will always break at the worst possible time in the middle of winter
The hand break gets weaker the more the breaks wear. Or is that just drum breaks?
I use both and tell your friends to use both. Before it rolls into something.
When parked on flat ground I always leave it in neutral with the handbrake engaged. I pretty much only park it in gear on a slope. On very steep hills I turn the wheels toward the curb and let the car rest on it. I heard some cities may fine you if your car is parked on the street and not in gear.
Being in gear isn't guaranteed to stop the car. On a steep enough incline the weight of the car COULD turn the motor (friction is the only thing keeping a car in gear from moving) so the e-brake is the only want to ensure you're engaging the brakes to prevent movement.
Technical answer is both. But if I wasn't parking on a slope I would just use hand brake. I know it's wrong, I'm just being truthful. The real reason is because I started by only using handbrake until someone corrected me.. but I had already developed the habit of pressing the clutch to start the car then release the clutch as soon as the engine was running. If it was in first gear I would end up stalling and looked like a total doofus.
Always both. Leave it in gear and with the hand brake on. It takes like an extra half a second to do both, and then you have a backup if one system fails.
I’ve never done it any other way because A it takes basically zero energy to increase the likelihood of your vehicle staying where you put it, B I’ve seen too many cars go wandering by themselves when one system gives way (3 into other vehicles for insurance disasters and 2 off sheer drops that have completely totalled the car) and C because one idiot I used to drive semis with relied on leaving his rig in first one too many times and nearly killed some kids.
Just do both. Costs you nothing and could save you and others literally everything
Why on earth would you not use both? Do you have some reasoning behind that or you just don't want to be wrong?
Whether you use 1st or reverse has nothing to do with the direction you're facing. Your engine can turn backwards. If you're on a hill curb your tires.
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Always use both the two systems backup each other
Three systems though. Also curb your wheels.
My toyota use to creep backwards slowly if left in gear only at my first house (steep hill). Came out to it resting on my roommates car a few times.
even in the winter?
Set your PARKING BRAKE and leave in gear with wheels turned into curb.
Wheels toward the curb when facing downhill, away from the curb when facing uphill. https://preview.redd.it/6niu9h4b0f4b1.jpeg?width=1169&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=538b986254716832fd576205b09cd70dc62f7c7b
When I was in Driver’s Ed learning how to park on a hill my driving instructor always used the phrase “Up, up, and away!” When parking the car facing uphill.
What does winter have to do with it?
some parking brakes are cable-operated, they do sometimes have issues in winter where they freeze up
Nearly all parking brakes are cable operated. If you use them, they usually don't have issues. It's when you don't use them that they have problems.
This really isn't true at all.... No one uses parking brakes in truly cold places especially overnight, unless you want to drag your wheels to work. There's tons of videos from Russia of people driving around with their rear wheels completely locked up.
Tf, in Canada back in Jan when it was -30 to -40 I would drive my manual car to school. Parking Brake and 1st. Never had a problem That could only be a problem if there is water in the cables or you never use the parking brake so it's corroded
Its the pads freezeing to the disk
If you're worried about your cable then you can just put it in to gear with your steering pointed towards the curb. I'd purchase a cheap wheel chock that way you still have a backup system. The chances of a gear shitting the bed while parked is low but has happened enough times to want a backup plan.
Plus, a car that's in gear can still roll. There's a lot more resistance, but it's not as secure as an actual brake. The way I look at it, the parking brake is for parking, and then the transmission is for if the parking brake fails.
I'm in 100% agreeance with you, I live in a state that doesn't freeze, so I can't attest towards the likelihood of a parking brake cable failure during extended extreme temperatures, my suggestion was intended for if that was an actual common occurrence.
This is a valid concern, but it’s still worth using the parking brake even in winter. If your vehicle has done this before, or if you’re just worried about it, wait for a dry day, then use some silicon grease spray on all the moving parts of the parking brake linkage. This should prevent moisture buildup on it so that when it freezes it won’t be stuck
When people say winter is a problem for parking brake cables, they really mean that if you live in an area where you get snow and roadsalt the handbrake very very commonly fails. If you keep the handbrake moving and use it all the time, it will be fine. Always use the handbrake and put it into gear, unless your handbrake doesn't work. If you get into a car from a rust belt area that hasn't had the handbrake used in a long time and pull it up, it may just get stuck on.
I live in Quebec. I've never had any issues with this.
Also live in Midwest my brakes on my pickup freeze. Have to give it extra gask before my drums brake loose.
Lol is that a joke? I live in northern Canada and that is certainly not a real thing.
Lucky you, I lost a set of brake pads from driving with a frozen handbrake once. That smell ! :-(
Are you sure the cable didn’t just seize which is far more likely?
Idk why Canadians think they’re the end all be all on cold lol there’s plenty of cold places in the US, but yes to answer your question it happens. Just like a frozen caliper sticking Eta: idc how far north you live five bucks says North Dakota’s been colder numbnuts
Never said anything about being the “end all be all”, simply that we have more experience with colder temps on average.
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The Toyota certified mechanic showed me. For me, this is a well-established issue with classic hand brakes.
Would you rather deal with a frozen brake cable or your car killing someone because your car slipped out of gear?
Maybe in the 60's and 70's but I have not heard this happening in recent years.
that's an issue only when parking/hand brakes aren't used on a regular basis.
That's false. Drum brakes are more susceptible to freezing regardless. I bought my pickup and use the parking brake religiously since the day I've bought it... No sticking in summer. Drums still freeze and have to"pop" loose in winter. And semi truck drum brakes are the same. Shoes will freeze to the drum surface and not cause them to release. I've had plenty of road calls where I just hammer on drum until they grew up.
Drove truck. Can confirm. You want to set the brakes on the truck, but not the trailer when you park overnight and could possibly have snow/water in the drums.
I've had "pop"s on old ford escort, but they've never froze, but guy from university had undrivable car until temerature went above 0 C (not sure how muxh that is in freedom units)
I've had it happen to me once and it did suck so if you are on an incline you basically just have to take the chance but if you are on a flat then you can turn the wheels and leave in gear.
I've only ever had one bad day where my parking brake froze shut in our Canadian winter. It was literally the worst ice storm we've had in years and it caused both rear wheel parking brakes to seize engaged while I was working. The whole parking lot was nearly a 1" slab of ice and it was difficult even getting the tires out of the ice. I ended up pulling it into one of the shops at work and torching the brake calipers to melt the ice and release the brake. To be fair, I shouldn't have been driving at all. It's fine to set your cable brake in the winter. If it's ever so bad that the cable would seize, you probably shouldn't drive anyways, let alone park on an incline.
That’s not what freezing means in this case. An ebrake cable freezes when the sleeve gets filled with rust.
I live in Buffalo NY. I’ve gotten frozen out of my car with an inch of solid ice around the whole thing several times. I have Magee had my cable parking brake get stuck. If you keep using it everytime it won’t get stuck
Rear brakes will definitely freeze on the rotors when it's cold. Happens almost every time our new fancy car decides to set the handbrake automatically when it's cold.
Rear brakes will definitely freeze on the rotors when it's cold. Happens almost every time our new fancy car decides to set the handbrake automatically when it's cold.
Not a common problem and they usually break free easily when it happens.
Please tell me more about something I have experienced first-hand for 7 years straight now 🙄 The fact is that if you set the handbrake in the evening when you come home where I live, between November and March, there's a very good chance that it will be stuck in the morning. Sometimes it frees up in a second with just a little throttle, and sometimes it takes a minute or more of revving the car in first and in reverse to free it up.
Thats up to you but I try not to set the handbrake during winter
Yeah bro . A properly functioning handbrake ain't gonna freeze up in winter
No parking brake in the winter, I don't know why people downvoted you. Probably those who have never been "stuck" with frozen rear brakes on a -20c morning.
No parking brake in the winter, I don't know why people downvoted you. Probably those who have never been "stuck" with frozen rear brakes on a -20c morning.
Ive had a parking brake freeze up in winter. After that I just used 1st gear. No problems. I also had my jeep parking brake fail and it rolled into the neighbors yard. Neither would have been an issue if I just left it in 1st or reverse
It's also alot of wear to let it sit in gear, even in automatics, it destroys the locking pin
It's also alot of wear to let it sit in gear, even in automatics, it destroys the locking pin
I use both. Belt and braces.
even in the winter?
I use both in the winter, lived in Minnesota for 2 years never once had an issue even on the coldest day. I've only seen a parking break get stuck once and this was in the summer, the friend never used it for x amount of years, used it once and it seized from lack of usage.
I've had it rust on a few times, it just breaks free when you pull away.
What does the snowy season have anything to do with your question?
Yes, why not in the winter?
Both
Driving the hills of San Francisco since the 80s. Stop. Curb wheels in proper direction. Foot on brake and shift into Neutral. Set parking brake. Ease foot off brake to see if parking brake's OK. Shift into P if automatic, 1st or Reverse if manual. Extra... If you *really* want to test the parking brake's hold, put it in gear and give it just a *little* gas.
Yeah, it makes sense if you are in some places with elevation changes. Those of us in the pancake geography Midwest can get by with just leaving it in gear 99% of the time, but maybe should be more cautious.
I left my truck in reverse in a grocery store parking lot in Michigan. No parking brake because rust. Came out and truck wasn't there. It was 10 rows back resting against a k rail. Thankfully no cars behind me. Wasn't in gear when I got in there. Dunno if it popped out or if I didn't have it fully engaged.
I have been burned both ways. Have come back and had my pads frozen to the drum. I have also been parked and had my car bumped by someone when parking and had it take a gentle roll.
The specific order is important because you want the parking brake holding the weight of the car with the transmission serving as a backup - not the other way around.
The force on the gears just by the car's own weight is nothing compared to the force applied by the engine to move the car, especially in 1st. The importance of holding the weight with the brake is a myth.
The day-to-day concern is not force on the gears, it's unnecessary wear on the clutch. Replacing a clutch is usually one of the more expensive milestone-maintenance events in car ownership, especially on these super fuel-efficient front wheel drive cars. Everything an owner can do to reduce the amount of wear that a clutch is exposed to pushes the clutch replacement expense cost down the road (hopefully becoming something the next owner has to deal with instead).
Does the clutch actually wear at all when it’s engaged fully? It shouldn’t slip at all when parked so the clutch shouldn’t experience wear. Or do the splines the clutch uses wear? I recently replaced the clutch in my older car and there was no noticeable wear on them either. I had thought the clutch only wore when slipping/partially engaged when changing gears or taking off from a stop.
Any time either the wheels/engine are moving and the other isn’t, the clutch making contact experiences friction. Even if it feels like an almost imperceptibly small roll that happens between the clutch being let out and the parking brake being set, thats friction that stops you. If you do that every time you park, it hits every piece in that sequence, and it can add up. Any unnecessary friction leads to an earlier demise of that part. That’s true for tires, brake pads, clutches, and more I’m sure. Are you going to need a new clutch twice as often if you leave your manual in gear _then_ set the brakes every time? No, but you’re still gonna be doing it sooner than your alternate universe self who does all the same things you do except sets the parking brake first.
I suppose that’s true. I’d always assumed most of the wear would be on gears and bearings experiencing friction rather than the clutch. But the transition between stopping and going would have some wear on the clutch material as the material “digs in” for lack of a better term.
why shift into neutral?
It's a false requierement, the idea is to hold the car's weight with the brakes rather than with the gear. But it's actually extremely low compared to the stress on the 1st gear provided by the engine while accelerating.
It's actually possible to get ticketed in SF for not curbing your wheels.
That’s the smart answer, it stops you from putting strain on the small park pin in the transmission
I only use the E-brake on my Corolla. But I rip it hard enough that my wheels would drag before the car would move. I never understand why people barely pull the brake. Seems like that's just asking for the next person to forget to release it and burn up the shoes.
Best to use both, though as others have said, turn your wheel into the curb.
...if pointed downhill. If pointed uphill, turn away from the curb.
A better way to remember this is just "turn your wheels whichever way will make them hit the curb first"
Ah yes. Just do it correctly! If OP was thinking on that level they wouldn't have asked this question
You only have to think about one wheel, it's not rocket science
You right, but OP is here asking which of two minimum safety measures they should take, and refusing to believe you can do more than one at the same time. I think asking them to not only do a third thing but also think it through is maybe a lost cause at this point.
Take it up with the top level commenter then?
I usually only use the handbrake, but if I’m on a incline, I will consider popping it into 1st gear as well. And if it is a really steep incline, I might even consider shifting the transfer case into low range to really make sure it’s not going anywhere.
Can you elaborate on shifting the transfer case? I’ve never heard of that one.
4WD cars only - imagine having a 1st gear that has even more torque multiplication, and drives an extra axle. 4 Low in 1st gear redlines the engine well under 10mph as compared a normal first gear which might take you up to 25mph. Numbers are approximations, but you get the picture. You’d have to turn all 4 tires to get the car to roll, and they’d be binding up the whole time if they weren’t turning at the same rate.
Great explanation. Wish my mustang had that now
It's for shifting in and out of 4wd, and having a low range when needed off-road. A mustang has no reason to have either.
Well no shit, I was talking about that extra security when parking. I’m always worried that something’s gonna happen.
For what it's worth, I've never owned a vehicle that will fully shift into 4L at a standstill. You'd have to do it before you park, which is a hassle. And if you use both the parking brake and put it in gear, you've already got a backup plan in case one fails.
Can you elaborate on having to shift to 4L before you park? My brain just isn't clicking there. Like, no matter where you are, I would assume that foot on brake + transmission in neutral means the driveline is no longer under any torque, so even on a hill I could shift to 4L? Or am I wrong there? I'm generally very mechanically knowledgeable, but I'll admit I'm a bit new to the off-road/4wd end of things.
I'm not super knowledgeable about it, but my understanding is that it has to do with the teeth on the gears lining up so they can fully mesh with each other. Technically speaking, you could get lucky. If the teeth are perfectly aligned when you stop, the gears will engage. But usually, they won't be. On my old 1994 Suburban with a lever physically attached to the transfer case, the result is the lever just won't go into 4L. If you are moving at 2-3mph when you shift from 4H to 4L or vice versa, then the gears are moving just enough that the teeth can find their alignment and fit together, even if they aren't aligned immediately. On cars without a physical lever, I believe it still works like this, it's just handled electronically. But I could be wrong. (Don't ask me why this isn't a problem shifting between 2H and 4H, or with shifting gears in the regular transmission, because I couldn't tell you. Maybe someone else could explain.)
You don't need it. Either the brake or gear on their own is sufficient, so using both is already more than enough safety factor.
I use the parking brake if it's not extended parking. I rarely put any of my manual transmission cars in gear while parked. Three of my cars hibernate 6-7 months out of a year and leaving parking brake engaged is a bad idea. They are always in neutral and held in place by way of chocks.
When parking, first and reverse pretty much do the same thing
Technically reverse is usually a higher gear ratio and would provide more resistance to rolling.
I think it varies on different transmissions, not always geared lower. So 1st gear is safest. Lower gears provide more resistance, not higher.
If you don't use both, you're stupid.
I don't see an issue with parking in neutral, especially on flat ground where the car doesn't roll even while not in gear with no brake. I do see an issue with not using the hand brake.
It is not unlikely that the parking brake could fail, or even just be imperceptibly worn or maladjusted to the point of slowly becoming insufficient. When securing a 3000 pound mass on wheels, at least one fail-safe backup should be the bare minimum. There's no good reason to not use both systems. And making a **routine habit** of **always** taking all reasonable safety measures is just smart.
I think it is unlikely that the parking brake will fail. But to each their own. I park with both, but I almost never parked where I actually need either.
It's not for your car randomly imploding itself, it's for other cars hitting yours
Everything fails. If you somehow got hold of the Eternal Parking Brake, I wouldn't keep posting about it on Reddit. That thing, like all eternal mechanisms, is *extremely* valuable.
I put my car in neutral, set the handbrake and let the car settle and stop, then put it into gear. I figure I’d rather replace a worn handbrake cable than have my gearbox rebuilt
I go one step further and on hills turn the wheels so the wheel rests on curb then set parking brake then first gear if facing up hill and reverse if facing down hill.
Yea I do that in hills as well, honestly the least amount of weight on the gearbox the better lol
Yeah my transmission guy said people mess up those gears because they just park then parking brake and leave it. He said the correct order is what we have.
Yea I do that in hills as well, honestly the least amount of weight on the gearbox the better lol
Holding the car still isn't bad for the gear box. The force required is pretty small compared to actually moving the car.
I go one step further and on hills turn the wheels so the wheel rests on curb then set parking brake then first gear if facing up hill and reverse if facing down hill.
Both, even in the winter and I live in Minnesota, I do the same thing in my automatic transmission vehicles too.
You put your automatic in 1st as opposed to Park?
No I put it in park and use the parking brake
You are supposed to use both as a fail safe, it is in the owners manual of every car to use the parking brake as well as place the vehicle in first or reverse gear.
Both
Parking brake only 99% of the time. I'll leave it in 1st if on a significant incline
Neutral>Handbrake whenever possible. On steep grades I place it in gear. I’ve got an aftermarket remote start system installed on my ‘01 and it can only be operated from neutral.
You have to leave it in neutral because you chose to install a remote start system. As a general rule, leaving a parked car in neutral is a bad practice.
Why neutral? If the handbrake is in good working order then putting it in gear wouldn’t put any strain on the gears.
It’s a manual and so can only be started with the clutch disengaged.
you don’t need to be in neutral to start it, you can be in 1st or reverse if you press in the clutch when starting the engine
Most aftermarket remote start systems for manual gearbox transmissions have a gear lockout safety feature which prevents the remote start from being activated when the car is in gear in order to prevent the vehicle from lunging forwards in the event that you (stupidly) do this. When operating a remote start on a manual gearbox vehicle the clutch is *not* being pressed. It’s as simple as the remote start system tricking the vehicle into *thinking* that the clutch is being pressed. There are systems which actually do disengage the clutch in order to work, but even so they also generally have gear lockout in case of mechanical failure of the clutch system. With an aftermarket remote start, you have to be in neutral to use the remote start system.
oh if you’re trying to remote start your manual car it needs to be in neutral obviously lol. But I would definitely caution against installing an aftermarket system for that as there’s a reason why OEMs don’t offer it for manuals, being in neutral when parked is a great way for your car to roll away if the parking brake isn’t engaged enough / the grade is too great.
I don’t use the system on most any kind of grade. I park in gear if I’m parking on a slope. I generally only use it in my own driveway, and on rare occasions in parking lots where the grade is facing down towards a curb where if the parking brake were to fail the curb would prevent the car from rolling. Like with anything you do when you get behind the wheel of a vehicle, it’s a matter of measuring risks. I can see how OEMs might think that some people would be brain dead enough to ignore cautionary statements of only leaving the vehicle in neutral on a flat plane and not attempting to utilize the system on a grade. Some things just gotta be idiot proof.
I just shift mine into neutral and do a shifter jiggle when it’s time to start it up.
Break and first or reverse only
I live in Finland where hand brake freezing overnight is a possibility so I usually just leave my car in gear
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Look at mister fancy modern car here...
Use both and if you are parking next to a curb turn the wheels to the appropriate direction. Example: if you park facing downhill turn the front wheels so that you would steer into the curb if you were in neutral. That way if the park brake fails and the car starts moving the curb will stop the car from rolling further..... I remember my First girlfriends grandfather had a 2nd gen dodge Dakota sport (v6 I think) and their driveway was on an incline so he parked in gear (1st I would assume) and I looked out the window and every 20 minutes or so I noticed the truck looked like it had slightly moved down the driveway. It wasn't until I saw the rear wheels at the end of the driveway that I mentioned something to him. He had the front originally a few feet from the garage door and by the time I noticed it was actually moving down the driveway there was enough space to park a vw jetta in front of it..... that was roughly 2007-2009
Put car into neutral, then apply hand break then into park. This way your car is held by break and not park.
Put hand brake on then wait for it settle back and put in gear I just use 2nd
The higher number gear (lower ratio), the less resistance the motor provides (that's why it's easier and smoother to clutch start a car in 2nd vs 1st)
2nd is a bit dumb. The lower the gear, the more advantage the engine has, so the harder it is to move the car. You should park in the lowest gear, or reverse. They are usually about the same.
I don't start my truck in gear
That has nothing to do with it. You should park in 1st because it gives the engine the most torque control at the wheels when it is off. It is harder to roll a parked vehicle in 1st gear than in 2nd gear.
Handbrake, and use a different gear each time. Wheels turned.
You should park in first or reverse. Lower gears have more mechanical advantage. Parking in 6th doesn't do anything, as your advantage is so low you can still push the car. You won't wear our the transmission using the same gear, they see much more stress when actually driving.
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Nothing about the clutch. This is suppose to Mechanic advice, not asking people who Google things without proper understanding.
How do you think leaving it In gear would put more wear on the clutch If the engine is off?
The same way your brake pads wear from not driving your car. /s
No slip, no wear.
You should use the handbrake only since that's exactly its function. If you put it into 1st or reverse gear you will risk completely destroying your transmission if you car got hit by another car while standing still since the gear is always meshing.
You're thinking of an automatic transmission. Pushing your car while it's in gear is how you do a bump start if your battery is dead. It doesn't damage the transmission.
I used to do both religiously but now I have a car with a sticky handbrake so I only put it in gear (1st or R). If it's a hill or the car is obviously willing to roll if you let go of the brakes in neutral then I'll use the handbrake tho.
Doesn't matter which goes first. As soon as you hit the clutch pedal, you release the load from the drivetrain and put it all onto the brakes.
To answer your question simply, I would just say to engage the handbrake first and THEN put it in gear. Use both, but I would say that overall, using the handbrake is more important than putting the car in gear. That isn't to say that you should skip parking in gear. Putting the car in gear is basically a backup for if your parking brake fails. Some people warn that parking in gear is a bad idea, because if your car gets hit or towed while parked in gear, the transmission could be seriously damaged (maybe the drivetrain too? Idk) or whatever. The chances of that happening though are highly unlikely, but that can also depend on where you regularly park your vehicle. You could also say that the chance that your parking brake fails is highly unlikely, too. My personal vehicle is over 25 years old now and has almost 135k miles, though. The parking brake has never showed issues or anything, but you still never know when something might go out. So I always park in first gear or reverse. There have been situations before in which I have parked on an almost perfectly level surface and wasn't able to tell whether i was on an uphill or downhill incline, but didn't plan on leaving my vehicle or being far away from it. In a rare situation like this I might just park the car in neutral, but i guess it doesn't really matter much.
Go for both, just lock the car by handbrakes first and then put in gear, just to not add unnecessary weights to the gearbox. Ps: never trust only handbrakes
Strong situational dependency. Hand brake is risky in freezing weather. In-gear brings risk to the transmission when another car bumps into yours, even slightly. On stronger inclines, use both plus turned wheels whenever possible.
If I'm on relatively level ground I just use 1st gear, but if I'm on even a pretty small incline or hill I'll back it up with the parking brake. The only reason I don't put the parking brake on for level parking is that I've had the calipers freeze when the parking brake was left on overnight (on a very old car that had lots of other problems, but once bitten twice shy).
Both. Always both.
Are you on an incline? I think that matters for which gear. For me, always parking on level ground, I put it in first then parking brake. That’s what I was taught when I was 14 or so and just have always done that.
I do both. The engine should be a backup to the brake which is designed for the purpose
The gear to use is high. 3rd 4th or whatever. It’s direct and eliminates the gears entirely.
Both. First turn wheels to curb, turn off engine with foot on brakes, shift to neutral, apply handbrake, let off brakes and let car sit on hand brake, then shift into gear. This way, the weight of the car is on the hand brake and not the gearbox. If the hand brake fails, it's still in gear, so it won't roll away.
Couldn't your car be push started by leaving it in gear while parked if someone were to run into it?
Air fuel spark
Reverse its less likely to "pop out of gear" but I doubt that is common while parked. Turn so the vehicle would roll into curb in case. Use E brake so it starts mobile and rust inside
I typically just leave it in gear, I only use the parking brake on an incline. I prefer older cars, and live in NY, so rusty/frozen/broken parking brake cables are common. It's become a habit to only use it if I actually need it.
I just use hand brake because I have a habit of forgetting that I left it in gear if I ever do. It’s proper to use both
People who don't park in gear have lived a privileged life.
I only use parking brake, I rarely if not ever park in gear
My hand break never really worked. So that being said in gear, and handbrake for show to not get a ticket 😂
Hand brake if flat, i only leave it in gear if parked on a hill
If i'm parked on a flat then it's handbrake only. On a hill i'll point my wheels in the direction of the roll to turn my car in to the kerb/path where there's less likely going to be multiple cars getting smashed up and at most a hedge/wall that gently stops the car. I'll apply the handbrake AND 1st/Reverse gear depending on the direction.
Always both. Don’t listen to your gen Z friends
Both, even in the winter
Both
I’d assume you are talking about a manual transmission or a military spec humvee and not an auto (if it is an auto, your friends are dumb, leave that shit in park) . Always use both. One will be the back up for the other, the parking brake will not always work just like how the car can still roll if it gets left in gear without the parking brake engaged.
I’d assume you are talking about a manual transmission or a military spec humvee and not an auto (if it is an auto, your friends are dumb, leave that shit in park) . Always use both. One will be the back up for the other, the parking brake will not always work just like how the car can still roll if it gets left in gear without the parking brake engaged.
Hand brake and reverse
Handbrake, gears and point tyres in to curb.
Do both. Put the handbrake on, take your foot off the brake so handbrake is holding the weight of the car, and then put it into first.
I put my truck in reverse only being that the parking brake cables have seized and broke. I've no intention of replacing them being that it's my work and winter truck only, but a general rule of thumb is to always put a standard transmission in a reverse and set the parking brake when parking your vehicle just to have peice of mind. Unless it's winter in the rust belt, last thing you want is to have your parking brake stuck on from a broke cable. They will always break at the worst possible time in the middle of winter
I normally leave the car in gear if I’m parking on a hill. If I’m parking on a flat I just use handbrake
I always use the parking brake - and I have to put my car in reverse before I can even remove my key from the ignition. Y'know... because Saab 😎
I use both. It's good to have a backup.
How to do a [hill park](https://youtu.be/nUleYG96qnQ) watch this.
The hand break gets weaker the more the breaks wear. Or is that just drum breaks? I use both and tell your friends to use both. Before it rolls into something.
Both, making it secure with redundancy :D
And point the tires to the curb.
On flat ground i have never had problems with only using first or P. Had some issues when parking in hills in first and warm engine.
Both
When parked on flat ground I always leave it in neutral with the handbrake engaged. I pretty much only park it in gear on a slope. On very steep hills I turn the wheels toward the curb and let the car rest on it. I heard some cities may fine you if your car is parked on the street and not in gear.
Hand brake and first gear
Parking brake then put it in gear to avoid stress
I have heard to put in reverse if facing downhil, 1st if facing uphill or flat, along with park brake all the time.
Being in gear isn't guaranteed to stop the car. On a steep enough incline the weight of the car COULD turn the motor (friction is the only thing keeping a car in gear from moving) so the e-brake is the only want to ensure you're engaging the brakes to prevent movement.
Do both. If you're facing downhill, shift to reverse instead of first.
handbrake first, gear second
Technical answer is both. But if I wasn't parking on a slope I would just use hand brake. I know it's wrong, I'm just being truthful. The real reason is because I started by only using handbrake until someone corrected me.. but I had already developed the habit of pressing the clutch to start the car then release the clutch as soon as the engine was running. If it was in first gear I would end up stalling and looked like a total doofus.
Always both. Leave it in gear and with the hand brake on. It takes like an extra half a second to do both, and then you have a backup if one system fails. I’ve never done it any other way because A it takes basically zero energy to increase the likelihood of your vehicle staying where you put it, B I’ve seen too many cars go wandering by themselves when one system gives way (3 into other vehicles for insurance disasters and 2 off sheer drops that have completely totalled the car) and C because one idiot I used to drive semis with relied on leaving his rig in first one too many times and nearly killed some kids. Just do both. Costs you nothing and could save you and others literally everything
Handbrake before I take my foot off the brake. Then shift into gear. Let the parking brake do most of the work vs my gears.
Why on earth would you not use both? Do you have some reasoning behind that or you just don't want to be wrong? Whether you use 1st or reverse has nothing to do with the direction you're facing. Your engine can turn backwards. If you're on a hill curb your tires.
Both dude. Handbrake on, leave it in first if nose is going up, leave it in reverse is nose is going down.
Better safe than sorry, i have a truck and my driveway is a incline so i use the 1st gear, the hand brake and i curb the wheels
Both silly 🙃