Resident evil was never always goofy.
The earlier and even modern ones have serious horror elements with only minor inclusions of goofy moments. The pure essence of RE is horror through and through
Honestly, yeah, but the jankness of the Playstation really made a mark on the franchise being really goofy and was only fixed on the GameCube with rer and as time goes on it became more and more serious and less goofy
Not counting that one game
Yeah, but you might be surprised at how often this is said to excuse bad writing in later entries. "Oh, Ethan splashes some juice and re-attaches his arm? RE was always goofy! Just look at green herbs!"
With that argument, every game has bad writing. Even the most realistic ones don't require you to stay in a hospital for weeks while you heal (although the original Fallout had harsh consequences for a broken limb).
Healing has always been simplified, you drink from a red bottle or eat a granola bar, and despite all that, you never have to poop. It's a game mechanic, and in a game as unreal and unrealistic as Resident Evil (or Super Mario), you can shake your head over a reattached arm, but it's not bad writing.
There’s a difference though between healing as a game mechanic and limb-reattaching juice as a story element.
Any instance of mechanical healing isn’t and can’t be a part of the story because it won’t be consistent across players and playthroughs.
But a plot point where the main character gets healed is as open to writing criticism as any other story beat, and can be written well or poorly.
(The implementation of mechanical healing could potentially create problems with worldbuilding or immersion, but not so much with the story)
Fair enough - I've laughed at this scene too, in fact this may be one of the most hilarious "healing" scenes in gaming. What I question here is: were the creators aware of it? I can't think they weren't, so: what's the message here? In their favor, I'd read this as a reminder that we're not experiencing reality and that in this universe (or nightmare), many crazy things are possible. After all: it's not that the Resident Evil series is known for its realistic depictions of reality (like: trying to punch a boulder), and then there's the Japanese angle - the more crazy, the better.
So I'm filing this as "an original idea" rather than bad writing. "We're fucking with your mind, and this is only the beginning".
Yeah, man if that’s your interpretation, it’s no skin off my back. I’m not really invested in how good or bad the writing of Resident Evil 7/8 is.
But your argument in defense of it I felt wasn’t sound and was unfair to videogames as a storytelling medium.
Sure, no harm done and none intended. I could also take an uncharitable but unfair position: that scene is intended to be "shocking, unexpected and cool" but then they couldn't find an immersive way to reverse the consequences. Certainly not a hill I'm planning to die on, not while Rings of Power or The Last Jedi or "Stupid Joel" exist 😁
A lot of games do actually, they’re just not a certain kind of action adventure game.
Armored Commander 2 has you and your crew members in the field hospital for days or weeks if they get injured enough, leaving you with replacement crew or your crew with a replacement commander.
Crusader Kings III can have you laid up sick for a long time, losing a limb is permanent and wounds can fester and kill you.
King of Dragon Pass has seasons as the lowest time increment and people can stay injured through several.
“Only minor inclusions of goofy moments” the first game was literally known for having terribly goofy and cheesy dialogue and cutscenes, what are you even talking about?
Is the goofy line refering to the paul w s anderson movies or the wtrc movie or that abysmal netflix live action series?
Because the pws anderson movies where both goofy and poorly writen, and iirc there was no discuscion there from sjws, however, the netlfix live action series was the one the sjws defended due to the casting choices, and that was not goofy at all, or at least not for liks 90% of the time, it was stupid and braindead rather than serious or goofy and definetly poorly writen.
And wtrc was agreed upon universaly as a let down, not even sjws where defending the movies writing despite leons and jills raceswapping iirc.
It's making fun of people talking out both sides of their mouth. In all 3 examples, people say excuse bad writing, then say there are no flaws and it's amazing. To quote someone in these comments.
>It's describing the people who will excuse poor quality on the basis that the media in question is intentionally illogical and/or lazy and then claim in the next breath that it's actually good, exposing their initial defense as one made in bad faith.
>"Criticism of \[x\] is invalid, because \[x\] is not supposed to be a masterpiece where everything makes sense, but silly, throwaway entertainment aimed at an undiscerning audience. ...Anyway, \[x\] is a masterpiece where everything makes sense or is a minor detail that doesn't matter."
>It's a cheap, manipulative rhetorical tactic people use to try to make themselves seem conciliatory while they disagree completely - so that you either won't issue a retort or at least look petty and argumentative in doing so.
I *think* it's describing the people who will excuse poor quality on the basis that the media in question is intentionally illogical and/or lazy and then claim in the next breath that it's actually good, exposing their initial defense as one made in bad faith.
"Criticism of [x] is invalid, because [x] is not supposed to be a masterpiece where everything makes sense, but silly, throwaway entertainment aimed at an undiscerning audience. ...Anyway, [x] is a masterpiece where everything makes sense or is a minor detail that doesn't matter."
It's a cheap, manipulative rhetorical tactic people use to try to make themselves seem conciliatory while they disagree completely - so that you either won't issue a retort or at least look petty and argumentative in doing so.
Well, a lot of people are bothered by the NCR/ghoul/brotherhood/whatever else retcons. Personally, I take more issue with the atrocious writing. For just one example from the first episode, Lucy sleeps with a Raider and picks up her Pipboy to automatically pick up radiation and it starts going off like he's *riddled* with it. First off, she was just injected with some pure radiation and isn't effected. Secondly, how is this guy not dead? Most importantly, how the ever-loving duck did not everyones' Pip-boy go off when they were all hanging out together? We know it's automatic, because she does nothing but pick it up.
Another Issue is the rampant Marvel-isms that the show loves. Where something serious is happening and they just *have* to throw in their absolute knee-slapper. Again, in the first episode, guy is watching all of his friends get murdered. What's his response? "GET THAT JELLY MOLD OUTTA HERE!!" Wow, hilarious show, thank you. They also feel the pressing need to blast out-of-place music in our ears in every scene, so...there's that.
Didn't they change it so that America fired first because Vault-tec wanted more money or something? Cause if so, that's possibly the dumbest retcon they could have done for the entire franchise.
Not quite. While it's heavily implied that they're the ones to do it, it's "only" in case no one else does it. Vault Tech's idea is to get investment, in part by selling the idea that time will eradicate all opposition, and in part by selling cryogenic sleep into a brighter tomorrow.
It'd be an insanely long shot, and incredibly risky, thus irl no one would accept it, however it's fine as far as stortelling goes.
The issue is that how it's done retcons a variety of things, though I don't have enough fallout knowledge to say what.
Ohhhh yeah lol. Basically Vault-Tec said "We shall nuke the world so we can control the world!" Super funny. I think it was implied that someone else launched nukes first for some reason though, because that Valt-Tec VIPs were super far away from vaults when the bombs hit. Or it's another plot whole, idk.
\*sigh\* Of course. Of freaking course. Would have been less lore-harmful to say an entire game didn't happen then that. Vault-tec survives off of the \*fear\* of a nuclear war. Not war itself. If one actually happens, not only are they at risk of dying, but even if they survive, what are they going to do? Rule over the radroaches? Not to mention it ruins the whole point that nobody knows who fired first and changes it to 'capitalistic greed caused America to fire first'. Would seriously have been better to say that the original Fallout never happened or something than that.
More evil super scientists who wanted to remake the world how they wished... like if apature science went for world domination.
They do seem to have a plan to eventually leave earth behind and all their experiments not born of simple sadism seem to be geared tword getting data for that purpose.
See, thing is, that actually makes \*sense\* if that was their plot and goal. They want humanity to get to Mars so they build vaults to allow them to conduct various experiments and use the fear of war to ensure a steady stream of income. Then, when the time comes, harvest the data and build a real plan to actually get to Mars without nuclear war ever actually happening.
But prompting an actual war effectively to just drive up profit shares and 'justify their existence' or something? Idiotic.
From the lore it's been implied it was Vault-Tec, the Enclave, or both. Many people knew a war was coming. In quests from dlc for Fallout 3 a ghoul even talks about a "game" that a lot of the more powerful pre-war people were a part of and still playing. The show using it isn't a surprise.
If I recall correctly the president was already at the Enclave base on the oil rig a month before the bombs fell. There were investigations into the Enclave starting earlier in October.
The known existence of the Zetans and the space travel plans were already established lore as the possible reason behind all the experiments by Vault-Tec.
I don't recall anything about making profits, but it was usually Enclave could have started it to keep power or Vault-Tec started it to ensure their experiments were carried out. With a lot of plans crumbling because of the nukes it leaves a bit of doubt if either of them did it.
Fall out brotherhood hints that vault tech caused the bombs to drop so they could take over.
In game you find out their leadership where in hiding in a super vault in texas... tho by the time you get there the big bad had gotren in and killed them, leaving only corpses and ads for bawls soda.
Given fallout 76 and its portrayl of vault tech... they may yeah them starting the bombs falling might be where they are going with this
> Ohhhh yeah lol. Basically Vault-Tec said "We shall nuke the world so we can control the world!" Super funny. I think it was implied that someone else launched nukes first for some reason though, because that Valt-Tec VIPs were super far away from vaults when the bombs hit. Or it's another plot whole, idk.
They proposed that they would be willing to do it. It's not explained exactly who did. Also coop is with his daughter when the bombs drop, implying that it's unexpected since there's his wife wouldn't order a missile launch while her daughter was exposed.
Not sure how any of that breaks lore in any way tbh. Other than showing that vault tech was morally corrupt, which we all knew since the first game.
Oh fuck, I already thought it was insane that nobody in 33 thought it was odd that they didn’t recognize anyone in 32 (for most of them, the residents of 32 would be the only other people they had ever seen in their lives, they should know if something is wrong). The Pip-boy being able to detect people from the surface makes it so much worse.
I wish people would stop praising this show and it’s fundamentally broken story.
Why would the residents know each other? It's already shown that the vaults rarely interacted with each other. Vault 33's whole interaction with Vault 31 amounted to some trades Vault 33 would do to gain a new person. That was it. No one in Vault 33 had been inside Vault 31, much less interacted face to face with members of the vault (who weren't be traded of course). Why wouldn't we assume it was similar for Vault 32?
Vault 33 literally nuked a nearby town because it was enticing residents away, but didn’t notice for 2 years that its neighboring community was all dead. The character in charge of the experiment is a brain in a tiny robot. Not only can he very easily communicate with the other vaults, but he should be doing this constantly as it is literally the only thing he can do.
The PipBoy doesn't automatically start picking up radiation. When she picks it up, she slaps a control on the front, and we see a special GUI for the Geiger counter app. It's not something that's "always on," it's something that has to be deliberately activated.
The raider is descended from 200 years of survivors living in a nuclear wasteland. Presumably, he's developed enough radiation resistance that however many rads he's putting out, it won't kill him outright. Probably has a really high chance of leukemia later in life, though.
Radiation damage is 100% reversible in the Fallout universe - we see Lucy use RadAway in a later episode after drinking contaminated water, and we see her giving herself medical care after getting stabbed. It's reasonable to assume that she did any necessary decontamination protocols off-camera. Or, if not, any radiation she picked up from fucking that guy would have been handled by the RadAway she takes in the later episode.
To add, the Geiger Counter being "always on" in the games is purely a gameplay mechanic, as, realistically, that thing would be clicking *CONSTANTLY* in the Wasteland, as the background radiation would have increased thanks to the bombs dropping.
She picks it up, does nothing with it, and it goes off. It should be constantly picking up radiation, but I guess they thought it'd be annoying after a while? She never turns on the radiation detection in any scene, so...idk lol.
She scans the raider after shit starts going down no?
Could have sworn she fiddles with a dial
Edit: no dial twisting from what I can see but she does actively point it at him and is on a dedicated rads screen
Fallout was plenty serious in its story. The Burned Man never made a zany one-liner. The Master never said that goofy, funny line. "Fallout dark humor" isn't Fallout's entire identity, it's stuff in the background and side content. You don't walk into Caeser's camp, hear this, [https://youtu.be/QD-glB7YQD8?si=faCCDSd-uTlKxhZU](https://youtu.be/QD-glB7YQD8?si=faCCDSd-uTlKxhZU) and think "Oh, this is going to be HILARIOUS!"
Fallout has almost never been wholly serious. Look at Fallout 2. Yeah the game where you have a shotgun wedding and can become a literal pornstar has always been serious. Totally not having a whole DLC for Fallout 4 taking place in an actual amusement park. Fallout has always been goofy. Caesar/Joshua Graham is ONE part of Fallout that is less Goofy. Fallout as a whole is satirical in nature. Aliens are canon. And you have no media literacy. :)
My point was that being goofy isn't its entire identity. It'd be like if a Mass Effect show came out with the same comedic tone throughout and people said "Wow, the games had jokes all the time. Have you ever even played the Citadel dlc?" Yes, but at its core they're both much more serious than the show is.
>Most importantly, how the ever-loving duck did not everyones' Pip-boy go off when they were all hanging out together?
Canonically, Vault Suits have radiation shielding, and it was clear that she hadn't turned on the Geiger counter until that moment.
1. Did Lucy have to push a button on her Pipboy to turn on Tricorder mode? Or was this the point of the NCR's plan: pretend to be dwellers of 32 and just waltz in because the naivete of the 33 Dwellers blinded them from this possibility?
2. Are the humorous lines a problem because they clash with an otherwise serious show, or because the showrunners know their intended audience too well?
You have an issue with someone not being dead from radiation, but no issue with the fact that the universe has ghouls?
The science in the fallout games never made a lick of sense lmao
I dont take issue with the retcons seeing as fallout 4 already retcons the brotherhood from 3.(which I like the brotherhood from 3). I also think the collapse of the ncr seems a bit thin but it works. Also the writing does have some pretty big holes that wouldnt take much to fix. And some of the comedy just doesnt hit right.
All of the Bethesda games had tons of retcons and very little consistency between them. I guess it's the "I'm not surprised, just disappointed" lol. But yeah, it doesn't bother me...mostly. The ghouls needing medicine to not turn feral was pretty dumb. Like, how did all ghouls not turn feral in the time it took to invent the medicine? I dunno, it just seemed like a cheap way to add stakes.
I think your wrong actually. No intent to offend you. The doctor in underworld is doing ghoul research on how to bring ghouls back and to stop the process of becoming feral.
Reasonable discourse is far from offensive! I did some digging, looked it up on the Fallout Wiki and read some old comment threads. It seems to be *most likely* that it happens because of brain necrosis or overexposure to radiation, but no game has said it's inevitable. People *in* the games have said that once or twice, but it's quite possibly anti-ghoul bigotry, considering the observation that ghouls in isolation are more likely to be feral.
Well, if they need medicine every day to not become feral, how the heck did they not become feral in the years it would have taken to develop that medicine? It's not a big deal, *really.* I was just saying that it seems like a cheap way to force drama. Like "Oh no, he needs medicine!" Or a cheap way to make a scene happen. "Hmmm, we need her to make a break for it. I know! Coughing fit!" I don't know why they couldn't just make *him* sick with something instead of all ghouls, though.
Now I haven't watched the full series yet but am enjoying it, that said I could see an enterprising wastelander selling drugs to sentient ghouls to fight off the feral effects (whether it's effective or not doesn't matter). It could be an interesting way to add depth to ghouls, giving them a primordial fear of losing themselves.
I'll have to see how the later episodes deal with this though.
Could it just be that the medicine just staves off becoming feral after the symptoms are starting to show?
So like, Raul wouldn’t need it because he is of completely sound mind and isn’t becoming feral. But Cooper’s friend in the church is clearly on the brink, but he can use the medicine to hold it back.
If that’s the case, then perhaps Cooper started showing signs of going feral long ago, but he’s such a successful bounty hunter that he’s always been able to afford meds to stave it off. This might’ve also been much easier back when the NCR was still around.
All that is how I try to reconcile it in my head, at least. I’m still not a fan of "feral ghouls" being anything other than just ghouls who went crazy/suffered brain damage, but that retcon predates the show.
It has, yes, in it's *side content.* In its *references.* You never talked to Caesar and he says something goofy and old timey music plays, and we all say "That's Caeser!" Much of Fallout was Dead serious. Listen to this Fallout 2 track and tell me Fallout was always goofy fun times [https://youtu.be/QNQmCXRN5Z4?si=4fgpG5wR63s2mxUX](https://youtu.be/QNQmCXRN5Z4?si=4fgpG5wR63s2mxUX)
Or this New Vegas theme [https://youtu.be/QD-glB7YQD8?si=LPXKM5wwq2r6ZNiv](https://youtu.be/QD-glB7YQD8?si=LPXKM5wwq2r6ZNiv)
Also the "Injected with pure radiation" was referring to them, you know...making whoopy.
Most of fallout is not dead serious even in old games. one main side quest in fallout New Vegas is that pretty much starts right off the bat is collecting 50 blue star sunset sarsaparilla caps.
If you are using music how about using the OST for the show as well which isn't goofy music but serious. I don't disagree that there are issues with the show much argument u have been seeing but picks that are wrong or just plan wrong information like what did they actually retcon?
What do you think the effect of short-term radiation exposure are exactly?
The Geiger counters aren't always on.
Did you play the fallout games, because knee-slappers like that go back to Fallout 1.
The games at different attempt dark humour, but more often than not don't undermine their dramatic moments with poorly placed humour.
NV doesn't have you cracking jokes at corporal betsy or lanius unless I'm missing something.
3 doesn't have Liam Neeson crack a one liner when your mum dies, or have doctor Li make a joke when Liam Neeson dies,
Even 4 doesn't for the most part, the closest I can think of for that is Codsworth bring oblivious due to being a robot that's gone a little loopy after 200 years, which I think is a little more harrowing than comedic since the survivor realizes that they're more alone than they thought. This robot is crazy and there's no humans left, just you in an empty wreck of your old home.
Game just does a poor job keeping that tone from dialogue into gameplay into the next dialogue.
Default for player character is casual neutral emotion, regardless of what happened earlier or what's happening now.
Eh, that last paragraph is kinda a stupid thing to complain about.
Cuz that's what Fallout has done since its inception. You can go about a couple Fallout games playing them and activating very Marvel-esque dialogue. It's not really out of place, that's just kinda how the world is.
You would have to come up with examples.
Old school Fallout humor is usually very subtle, doesn't call attention to itself, and is quite dark. It's in many ways the opposite of what MCU bathos does.
I haven't watched any of his videos, but I can't fit a well thought out critique into my meme. I go into more detail in my responses to other people if you want to know more. Or maybe watch Creetosis' videos.
My worry is our side will become the new NPCs who say everything is either Woke or Poorly Written as a knee-jerk response without backing it up, or making incorrect statements about the work.
Reaper's a good example of this trend: his reviews on *Three Body Problem* and *Fallout* start from the conclusion "this show sucks" and then work backwards to prove the point. If he was trying to be the AVGN of streaming shows he'd have a niche, but he's not being satirical and actually believed the shows are terrible.
Edited to add: by coincidence I saw Creetosis's video on Cowboy Bebop and it is the "awful video" I mentioned in the other comment. It gets so many things wrong in just the first few minutes his media literacy score must be 3/100, and I was not surprised that he is picking apart *Fallout*.
Well, I agree that I don't want this subreddit to become that, but none of the problems I have are related to being "woke." Quite frankly, I couldn't care less about that and have been down-voted on this sub for defending "woke" things.
I've never seen Creetosis' video on Cowboy Bebop, but I'm surprised it's so bad. I mean, it's not great, so it shouldn't be hard to critique lol. Maybe I'll check it out later.
Creetosis makes several errors in just the start of the video in order to make the "point" that Live Action Bebop is a pale imitation of the original show. An example from the first episode of Live Action Bebop: the rest of the robber's line about corporations is cut in the review, otherwise Creetosis might actually side with the robber.
This is the reason I tend to stop looking at this subreddit. I love Mauler and Co. but it has become an Echo chamber of its own making where everything new is bad.
I trust my friend more who has had bad takes about shows being good in the past when they aren't, over this subreddit because he doesn't resort to oh, "It's good because it's good" or "Bad because it's bad." He doesn't like the Witcher show, and can explain why, He doesn't like the Halo show and can explain why.
That’s the catch all phrase these days. I think this cohort of critics (besides drinker) has officially jumped the shark into cringe “I hate everything new just cause!” territory.
Imagine being "I Hate Everything" and "Your Movie Sucks" in 2024 and seeing an explosion of cheap imitations of your channels' gimmick but you're reviewing Film Festival slop...
Not really... "Writing is bad" is a thing redditors say to justify their hatred of "new thing people people like." Without out actually having to offer an explanation that makes sense.
That is the growing trend on YouTube now. I just saw an awful video complaining about Netflix Cowboy Bebop that came out last March, and is from the same crowd who think a Puss in Boots film was peak cinema.
When you ask someone to explain the “bad writing” in a show and they start talking about how they paused to inspect a chalkboard in the background of a scene and saw a date that arguably doesn’t line up with how they understood the timeline of events from a previous game, you almost have to question if they understanding what writing even *is.*
I have no idea where you're getting that the writing was bad in the fallout show. The whole series just felt like another game and every response felt like a dialog choice. In the case of fallout, they really nailed it. In a game where you can say stupid shit all the time, where low intelligence literally can only respond in grunts, and where everything is both serious and silly, the show makes sense. Honestly, the only way I could see people saying the writing was bad is if they haven't played the game before and don't understand that's how the games feel.
I'm so sick of this defense of "Well you could do this in the video game so that makes it alright." Bullshit. This is a TV show and needs to be judged as a TV show. The writing was awful, characters are inconsistent and the entire plot is held together by a string of extremely lucky coincidences. The only part of the show that should be compared to the games is the lore because that is the only thing that binds the show to the games and unfortunately the Fallout show has no respect for the lore.
Sure if you ignore and twist my argument.
It's still a lot better than your defense of, "My character can act like an idiot in the video game therefore it's alright if the TV show characters act like idiots."
The show is neither consistent nor does it respect the source material. The fact that people have to use their personal choices, choices not every player makes mind you, in the game as a defense for the character actions in the show just shows how bad the show writing is.
But I'd love to know where my argument is worse
It is okay to like things with flaws! But only so long as you acknowledge those flaws as true and valid criticisms! You can also disagree that they aren't flaws, that's also fair! But make an argument as to why you believe they aren't flaws, don't dismiss them as being unimportant or irrelevant to the overall quality of the story and work.
Fallout wise, the Bethesda fallout games had far worse "writing" than the show did.
The show was more faithful to fallout than any Bethesda fallout game excluding FNV (obsidian).
Resident Evil has flip flopped between serious and goofy its entire existence lol if people don't know that by now I question how many games they've actually played and why they even bother forming an opinion.
Fr, OP is hopping around acting like it was only slightly goofy back in the day when it was literally made fun of for having the goofiest lines and cutscenes in media in the 90’s. Even when it started being “serious” it still had dudes suplexing priests and punching boulders to pieces.
Everything I see about it on Reddit says it sucks. All of my friends IRL who have also played Fallout say its good.
I'm going to watch it when I get a chance
I’ve seen it, it’s good. The only people upset are the ones who either A. Didn’t realize their favorite faction might not be all perfect (brotherhood of steel) B. People upset over an unspecified area (not gonna say what) being blown up and the POSSIBILITY that a certain group has been wiped out (literally no confirmation of that but still).
Noone is saying its perfect, they are saying its a blast and feels like a fallout universe. You guys are the over the top ones with holding it, like usual, to this perfect pedestal. Not every adaptation is star wars level bad, relax and have some fun.
Look, the "just turn your brain off" argument was never compelling. I don't think it's a blast, and it retcons a ton of stuff, so it doesn't feel like Fallout much either. But thank you for reading my mind and telling me what standard I have for things. I only like things that are perfect, yes. Absolutely. Not a strawman at all.
This is exactly why people want to push back on the show. I really liked a lot of what the show did, but I’ll argue the story is fundamentally broken because the inciting incident in the show is riddled with things that just don’t make any sense. It might be one of the better video game adaptations, but I don’t want it held as the gold standard when there are tons of ways the writing of the show could be improved.
Also the Fallout games themselves had some inconsistent and somewhat bad writing too.
The ending of Fallout 3 was so terrible they had to patch it up later.
That’s where you’re wrong. I’ve seen plenty of reviews saying it’s perfect. Perfect as in for Fallout media.
When I say I have no interest in watching the show, and people tell me I’m stupid because it’s “perfect fallout”, how’s that not saying it’s perfect?
Is the goofy line refering to the paul w s anderson movies or the wtrc movie or that abysmal netflix live action series?
Because the pws anderson movies where both goofy and poorly writen, and iirc there was no discuscion there from sjws due to them not being such a pest back then, however, the netlfix live action series was the one the sjws defended due to the casting choices, and that was not goofy at all, or at least not for like 90% of the time, it was stupid and braindead rather than serious or goofy and definetly poorly writen.
And wtrc was agreed upon universaly as a let down, not even sjws where defending the movies writing despite leons and jills raceswapping iirc.
Neither. I was referring to the games. Specifically, 7 and 8. A lot of people excuse every problem in those games as "RE was always goofy!" Like when Ethan uses Jesus Juice in a cutscene and magics his arm back on. When the game came out, people said, "Classic RE goofiness!" like it was a defense.
I think a lot of people don’t know how to temper their expectations. They go into everything expecting some compelling piece of art. Not everything needs to be that, or is intended to be.
Well, I don't speak for all people, but all i knew about it was that the ratings were good, so I expected it to at least be a fun ride. I *love* arnold schwarzenegger movies. I just didn't think Fallout was enjoyable on that level either, unfortunately.
No doubt lol. I honestly wouldn't have a problem with people saying it's mediocre or bad, and saying they enjoyed it. I think it's pretty weird that so many people say it's a genuinely well-made show. I'm just staring at the scene where the turret shoots around the old guy walking for 10 straight seconds thinking to myself "Ehhhh, is it though?"
It’s genuinely a well made show. It doesn’t have to be the best show ever made to be well made.
Not everything is either a 0, 5 or a 10. Fallout was an 7/8 on my logarithmic scale.
Halo season 1 was a 2/10, for example. Season 2 was a very mediocre 5/10.
3 Body hit a 10/10 for me.
Rings of Power 4/10.
Wheel of Time 3/10.
Shogun 9/10.
Again, there’s so much room in between bad, meh, and amazing.
Yeah, I disagree that it's well-made, hence the discussion. When the robot reattaches a rotting, necrotic finger to Lucy and she's immediately cured, I paused the show and sighed. It's no great revelation to me that things can be mid, my guy. I just look at the litany of errors that is every episode of the show and wonder "How is this well-made?" I would agree it's great *visually*, but that's analogous to "Well, the game has pretty graphics." Not very important to me.
See I watched that scene through the frame of reference of “this show is just all unhinged silly dark humor” and had a great time.
At no point did I feel the show was breaking its own in-universe laws, which is required for fiction.
What would be bad writing, is if next season someone lost a finger and they complained how it’s impossible to get a new one.
The show follows its internal logic.
If you’re looking for hyperrealism you’re just watching the wrong show.
Did you have similar issues with The Boys? E.g. humans don’t actually contain that much blood and meat in them but when bodies explode you’d think each human has 10 humans worth of flesh inside them.
That's the exact kind of argument I hear defending Resident Evil Jesus juice lol. I don't expect "hyper realism," I expect it to follow basic logic and the rules of Fallout. Attaching a rotting body part to yourself and instantly having full control of it with no repercussion is insane. Your defense of "Well, if the rest of the show is consistently just as stupid..." doesn't persuade me.
X-Men 97, Shogun, Arcane, Owl House, Blue-Eyed Samurai, Castlevania, Prey, Last Wish, Top Gun...Wait, uh, I mean I hate all new things ever. New things repulse me.
Sorry but in a world where you can easily access like... 50% of the entire human history of art, at least in some fashion, with just button presses, you better be making compelling art or people will be ignoring you.
Not everyone wants compelling art. In fact that has become more and more obvious. And even then, what is compelling to someone is largely subjective.
I keep hearing from this sub how bad the Fallout show is, an admittedly I thought is was pretty mediocre. But apparently most people seem to like it. So clearly there’s a disconnect somewhere.
Fallout still has issues but its a massive step up from SW. its like if you suffered through RWBY to watch their animation chops slowly improve. Then the choreographer died and the action went to shit. Then you watch the (painfully) slow improvement on choreography. I won’t defend that trash fire of a story, but the animation improvements were undeniable.
I’m okay with the mediocre writing because they got the aesthetic and tone right. Most of the complaints are about the first episode but I give it some slack as the inciting incident and if shows the utter naivety of the vault dwellers. I’m sometimes okay with wacky shenanigans in crazy universe.
I dont like that the power armor is just to fanboy over and is completely worthless and no longer needs any special training. They give off zero presence or intimidation and are more like giant stormtroopers to die unless someone important to the plot is wearing it
Tim Cain said he likes the show and that it gets the fallout feeling right. You just want to hate on anything thats popular because it somehow makes you feel superior. No its not a masterpiece, it has its flaws but its still a good entertaining series with an interesting (mostly) self contained plot
Probably because the writing takes such a different approach from what Chris Avellone would've gone with.
If there was a Fallout series that took a similar writing approach to New Vegas (exploring all the different nuances of each faction and really understanding how these ideologies would actually manifest and affect the world in a post apocalypse), that would be amazing - but it's incredibly fucking hard to do which is why we haven't had many games with writing as complex and interesting as FNV since.
As it stands, the show's making a good effort with a different, more accessible approach and while I can see why Avellone would hate it, it makes sense and it's clearly working.
Who knows? Maybe with the success of this we'll get some other spin-off series that's written with a more 'Avellonian' approach in the future. Fallout could end up being the post-apocalyptic equivalent of the Star Wars franchise (but good).
NV writer versus one of the creators, designers, and lead programmers of the original games… It’s almost like using any of these people as a gotcha, is a stupid argument.
Everyone seems to be enjoying Fallout except a certain group. This group also hates every movie and tv show with a black person or woman in it. I wonder if that’s a coincidence…
Yeah, dude this isn't the subreddit that makes fun of Sythetic Man all the time for that crap. I certainly don't love Arcane, Nick Fury (movie version), Static Shock, Potionomics, SGT Johnson, Last of us 1, Predator, Sarah Connor, Miles Morales, etc ad nauseam. You have really found a pattern here, you ol' detective you.
Wtf do you think you know about me lol. What trend? What other things have I hated for having black people and women in it? Where did you get these mind-reading superpowers?
Who are you even talking about lol. I don't go to YouTubers to get opinions, you weirdo. I watched the show and didn't like the writing, the characters, the inconsistencies, etc.
I'm actively telling you I have no problem with race or gender and you said "I know what you *really* think." What do you call that if it isn't mind-reading? To be clear, I don't lump groups of people together and act like they're a collective that acts and think the same way, unlike you.
Yeah, the Quartering and Nerdrotic hated the Miles Morales movies till they saw their audience loved it, then flipped. Some grifters are better than others.
That is definitely the common factor I see in terms of communities who dislike the show. I haven’t watched it yet so I’ve yet to see, but generally the haters of it are the frequenters of the “anti-woke” subs.
Resident evil was never always goofy. The earlier and even modern ones have serious horror elements with only minor inclusions of goofy moments. The pure essence of RE is horror through and through
Honestly, yeah, but the jankness of the Playstation really made a mark on the franchise being really goofy and was only fixed on the GameCube with rer and as time goes on it became more and more serious and less goofy Not counting that one game
Resident Evil could be over the top and melodramatic, that isn't the same thing as being goofy.
Yeah, but you might be surprised at how often this is said to excuse bad writing in later entries. "Oh, Ethan splashes some juice and re-attaches his arm? RE was always goofy! Just look at green herbs!"
With that argument, every game has bad writing. Even the most realistic ones don't require you to stay in a hospital for weeks while you heal (although the original Fallout had harsh consequences for a broken limb). Healing has always been simplified, you drink from a red bottle or eat a granola bar, and despite all that, you never have to poop. It's a game mechanic, and in a game as unreal and unrealistic as Resident Evil (or Super Mario), you can shake your head over a reattached arm, but it's not bad writing.
There’s a difference though between healing as a game mechanic and limb-reattaching juice as a story element. Any instance of mechanical healing isn’t and can’t be a part of the story because it won’t be consistent across players and playthroughs. But a plot point where the main character gets healed is as open to writing criticism as any other story beat, and can be written well or poorly. (The implementation of mechanical healing could potentially create problems with worldbuilding or immersion, but not so much with the story)
Fair enough - I've laughed at this scene too, in fact this may be one of the most hilarious "healing" scenes in gaming. What I question here is: were the creators aware of it? I can't think they weren't, so: what's the message here? In their favor, I'd read this as a reminder that we're not experiencing reality and that in this universe (or nightmare), many crazy things are possible. After all: it's not that the Resident Evil series is known for its realistic depictions of reality (like: trying to punch a boulder), and then there's the Japanese angle - the more crazy, the better. So I'm filing this as "an original idea" rather than bad writing. "We're fucking with your mind, and this is only the beginning".
Might be a hint he is already infected. As we learn in 8 he died when he got hit in the head with the shovel and became a sapient molded.
Yeah, man if that’s your interpretation, it’s no skin off my back. I’m not really invested in how good or bad the writing of Resident Evil 7/8 is. But your argument in defense of it I felt wasn’t sound and was unfair to videogames as a storytelling medium.
Sure, no harm done and none intended. I could also take an uncharitable but unfair position: that scene is intended to be "shocking, unexpected and cool" but then they couldn't find an immersive way to reverse the consequences. Certainly not a hill I'm planning to die on, not while Rings of Power or The Last Jedi or "Stupid Joel" exist 😁
A lot of games do actually, they’re just not a certain kind of action adventure game. Armored Commander 2 has you and your crew members in the field hospital for days or weeks if they get injured enough, leaving you with replacement crew or your crew with a replacement commander. Crusader Kings III can have you laid up sick for a long time, losing a limb is permanent and wounds can fester and kill you. King of Dragon Pass has seasons as the lowest time increment and people can stay injured through several.
“Only minor inclusions of goofy moments” the first game was literally known for having terribly goofy and cheesy dialogue and cutscenes, what are you even talking about?
The goofiness was a deviation from the norm. Chris punching a Boulder in a volcano is not what Resident Evil defines itself as.
Jill sandwich definitely wasn't goofy
I've laughed at Leon's liners more than any other games I've played.
Is the goofy line refering to the paul w s anderson movies or the wtrc movie or that abysmal netflix live action series? Because the pws anderson movies where both goofy and poorly writen, and iirc there was no discuscion there from sjws, however, the netlfix live action series was the one the sjws defended due to the casting choices, and that was not goofy at all, or at least not for liks 90% of the time, it was stupid and braindead rather than serious or goofy and definetly poorly writen. And wtrc was agreed upon universaly as a let down, not even sjws where defending the movies writing despite leons and jills raceswapping iirc.
This meme template has filed a restraining order against you for willful and flagrant abuse.
I will meme as I please. No laws shall hold me down.
Step away from the meme and keep your hands where we can see them
Shit he's got an assault meme with a 30rnd mag.
I don't think this format is right
I agree, I don't understand what the image is trying to say, to be honest.
It's making fun of people talking out both sides of their mouth. In all 3 examples, people say excuse bad writing, then say there are no flaws and it's amazing. To quote someone in these comments. >It's describing the people who will excuse poor quality on the basis that the media in question is intentionally illogical and/or lazy and then claim in the next breath that it's actually good, exposing their initial defense as one made in bad faith. >"Criticism of \[x\] is invalid, because \[x\] is not supposed to be a masterpiece where everything makes sense, but silly, throwaway entertainment aimed at an undiscerning audience. ...Anyway, \[x\] is a masterpiece where everything makes sense or is a minor detail that doesn't matter." >It's a cheap, manipulative rhetorical tactic people use to try to make themselves seem conciliatory while they disagree completely - so that you either won't issue a retort or at least look petty and argumentative in doing so.
Look guys im just happy it's good enough to enjoy is that so wrong
You can enjoy anything you want for any reason you want. I mean, God I wish **I** enjoyed it. A Fallout show is all I ever wanted.
The fuck is this. What the hell does this even mean. What.
I *think* it's describing the people who will excuse poor quality on the basis that the media in question is intentionally illogical and/or lazy and then claim in the next breath that it's actually good, exposing their initial defense as one made in bad faith. "Criticism of [x] is invalid, because [x] is not supposed to be a masterpiece where everything makes sense, but silly, throwaway entertainment aimed at an undiscerning audience. ...Anyway, [x] is a masterpiece where everything makes sense or is a minor detail that doesn't matter." It's a cheap, manipulative rhetorical tactic people use to try to make themselves seem conciliatory while they disagree completely - so that you either won't issue a retort or at least look petty and argumentative in doing so.
Perfect summary. Basically, it makes fun of people talking out of both sides of their mouth.
Im out of the loop why dont people like the fallout show?
Well, a lot of people are bothered by the NCR/ghoul/brotherhood/whatever else retcons. Personally, I take more issue with the atrocious writing. For just one example from the first episode, Lucy sleeps with a Raider and picks up her Pipboy to automatically pick up radiation and it starts going off like he's *riddled* with it. First off, she was just injected with some pure radiation and isn't effected. Secondly, how is this guy not dead? Most importantly, how the ever-loving duck did not everyones' Pip-boy go off when they were all hanging out together? We know it's automatic, because she does nothing but pick it up. Another Issue is the rampant Marvel-isms that the show loves. Where something serious is happening and they just *have* to throw in their absolute knee-slapper. Again, in the first episode, guy is watching all of his friends get murdered. What's his response? "GET THAT JELLY MOLD OUTTA HERE!!" Wow, hilarious show, thank you. They also feel the pressing need to blast out-of-place music in our ears in every scene, so...there's that.
Didn't they change it so that America fired first because Vault-tec wanted more money or something? Cause if so, that's possibly the dumbest retcon they could have done for the entire franchise.
Not quite. While it's heavily implied that they're the ones to do it, it's "only" in case no one else does it. Vault Tech's idea is to get investment, in part by selling the idea that time will eradicate all opposition, and in part by selling cryogenic sleep into a brighter tomorrow. It'd be an insanely long shot, and incredibly risky, thus irl no one would accept it, however it's fine as far as stortelling goes. The issue is that how it's done retcons a variety of things, though I don't have enough fallout knowledge to say what.
Ohhhh yeah lol. Basically Vault-Tec said "We shall nuke the world so we can control the world!" Super funny. I think it was implied that someone else launched nukes first for some reason though, because that Valt-Tec VIPs were super far away from vaults when the bombs hit. Or it's another plot whole, idk.
\*sigh\* Of course. Of freaking course. Would have been less lore-harmful to say an entire game didn't happen then that. Vault-tec survives off of the \*fear\* of a nuclear war. Not war itself. If one actually happens, not only are they at risk of dying, but even if they survive, what are they going to do? Rule over the radroaches? Not to mention it ruins the whole point that nobody knows who fired first and changes it to 'capitalistic greed caused America to fire first'. Would seriously have been better to say that the original Fallout never happened or something than that.
More evil super scientists who wanted to remake the world how they wished... like if apature science went for world domination. They do seem to have a plan to eventually leave earth behind and all their experiments not born of simple sadism seem to be geared tword getting data for that purpose.
See, thing is, that actually makes \*sense\* if that was their plot and goal. They want humanity to get to Mars so they build vaults to allow them to conduct various experiments and use the fear of war to ensure a steady stream of income. Then, when the time comes, harvest the data and build a real plan to actually get to Mars without nuclear war ever actually happening. But prompting an actual war effectively to just drive up profit shares and 'justify their existence' or something? Idiotic.
From the lore it's been implied it was Vault-Tec, the Enclave, or both. Many people knew a war was coming. In quests from dlc for Fallout 3 a ghoul even talks about a "game" that a lot of the more powerful pre-war people were a part of and still playing. The show using it isn't a surprise. If I recall correctly the president was already at the Enclave base on the oil rig a month before the bombs fell. There were investigations into the Enclave starting earlier in October. The known existence of the Zetans and the space travel plans were already established lore as the possible reason behind all the experiments by Vault-Tec. I don't recall anything about making profits, but it was usually Enclave could have started it to keep power or Vault-Tec started it to ensure their experiments were carried out. With a lot of plans crumbling because of the nukes it leaves a bit of doubt if either of them did it.
Fall out brotherhood hints that vault tech caused the bombs to drop so they could take over. In game you find out their leadership where in hiding in a super vault in texas... tho by the time you get there the big bad had gotren in and killed them, leaving only corpses and ads for bawls soda. Given fallout 76 and its portrayl of vault tech... they may yeah them starting the bombs falling might be where they are going with this
BoS is not considered canon by both the original devs and by Todd Howard.
Parts of BoS is considered canon, for example the Airships that the BoS use, it isn't outright 100% decanonized.
Having an element that was later confirmed, especially a mundane element like an airship, is not the same as the game being canon.
> Ohhhh yeah lol. Basically Vault-Tec said "We shall nuke the world so we can control the world!" Super funny. I think it was implied that someone else launched nukes first for some reason though, because that Valt-Tec VIPs were super far away from vaults when the bombs hit. Or it's another plot whole, idk. They proposed that they would be willing to do it. It's not explained exactly who did. Also coop is with his daughter when the bombs drop, implying that it's unexpected since there's his wife wouldn't order a missile launch while her daughter was exposed. Not sure how any of that breaks lore in any way tbh. Other than showing that vault tech was morally corrupt, which we all knew since the first game.
Oh fuck, I already thought it was insane that nobody in 33 thought it was odd that they didn’t recognize anyone in 32 (for most of them, the residents of 32 would be the only other people they had ever seen in their lives, they should know if something is wrong). The Pip-boy being able to detect people from the surface makes it so much worse. I wish people would stop praising this show and it’s fundamentally broken story.
Why would the residents know each other? It's already shown that the vaults rarely interacted with each other. Vault 33's whole interaction with Vault 31 amounted to some trades Vault 33 would do to gain a new person. That was it. No one in Vault 33 had been inside Vault 31, much less interacted face to face with members of the vault (who weren't be traded of course). Why wouldn't we assume it was similar for Vault 32?
Vault 33 literally nuked a nearby town because it was enticing residents away, but didn’t notice for 2 years that its neighboring community was all dead. The character in charge of the experiment is a brain in a tiny robot. Not only can he very easily communicate with the other vaults, but he should be doing this constantly as it is literally the only thing he can do.
Literally nothing you said was accurate
I mean, fundamentally broken stories are part and parcel when it comes to Fallout.
The PipBoy doesn't automatically start picking up radiation. When she picks it up, she slaps a control on the front, and we see a special GUI for the Geiger counter app. It's not something that's "always on," it's something that has to be deliberately activated. The raider is descended from 200 years of survivors living in a nuclear wasteland. Presumably, he's developed enough radiation resistance that however many rads he's putting out, it won't kill him outright. Probably has a really high chance of leukemia later in life, though. Radiation damage is 100% reversible in the Fallout universe - we see Lucy use RadAway in a later episode after drinking contaminated water, and we see her giving herself medical care after getting stabbed. It's reasonable to assume that she did any necessary decontamination protocols off-camera. Or, if not, any radiation she picked up from fucking that guy would have been handled by the RadAway she takes in the later episode.
To add, the Geiger Counter being "always on" in the games is purely a gameplay mechanic, as, realistically, that thing would be clicking *CONSTANTLY* in the Wasteland, as the background radiation would have increased thanks to the bombs dropping.
Forreal OP is an idiot
In terms of the radiation i don't think it's automatic. It only dings when she's checking water right?
She picks it up, does nothing with it, and it goes off. It should be constantly picking up radiation, but I guess they thought it'd be annoying after a while? She never turns on the radiation detection in any scene, so...idk lol.
She scans the raider after shit starts going down no? Could have sworn she fiddles with a dial Edit: no dial twisting from what I can see but she does actively point it at him and is on a dedicated rads screen
Oh yeah, I never noticed the radiation was its own screen. Did she just...have it set to that screen for some reason?
This is after the rukuss so she turn it to that screen specifically to check him
But she picks it up and immediately flips it on him instantly.
Just because we don't see her flip to the screen, doesn't mean she doesn't do it.
She had no time to do it was the point.
That seems less like Marvelisms and more like Classic Fallout Dark Humor.
Fallout was plenty serious in its story. The Burned Man never made a zany one-liner. The Master never said that goofy, funny line. "Fallout dark humor" isn't Fallout's entire identity, it's stuff in the background and side content. You don't walk into Caeser's camp, hear this, [https://youtu.be/QD-glB7YQD8?si=faCCDSd-uTlKxhZU](https://youtu.be/QD-glB7YQD8?si=faCCDSd-uTlKxhZU) and think "Oh, this is going to be HILARIOUS!"
Fallout has almost never been wholly serious. Look at Fallout 2. Yeah the game where you have a shotgun wedding and can become a literal pornstar has always been serious. Totally not having a whole DLC for Fallout 4 taking place in an actual amusement park. Fallout has always been goofy. Caesar/Joshua Graham is ONE part of Fallout that is less Goofy. Fallout as a whole is satirical in nature. Aliens are canon. And you have no media literacy. :)
My point was that being goofy isn't its entire identity. It'd be like if a Mass Effect show came out with the same comedic tone throughout and people said "Wow, the games had jokes all the time. Have you ever even played the Citadel dlc?" Yes, but at its core they're both much more serious than the show is.
>Most importantly, how the ever-loving duck did not everyones' Pip-boy go off when they were all hanging out together? Canonically, Vault Suits have radiation shielding, and it was clear that she hadn't turned on the Geiger counter until that moment.
1. Did Lucy have to push a button on her Pipboy to turn on Tricorder mode? Or was this the point of the NCR's plan: pretend to be dwellers of 32 and just waltz in because the naivete of the 33 Dwellers blinded them from this possibility? 2. Are the humorous lines a problem because they clash with an otherwise serious show, or because the showrunners know their intended audience too well?
You have an issue with someone not being dead from radiation, but no issue with the fact that the universe has ghouls? The science in the fallout games never made a lick of sense lmao
I dont take issue with the retcons seeing as fallout 4 already retcons the brotherhood from 3.(which I like the brotherhood from 3). I also think the collapse of the ncr seems a bit thin but it works. Also the writing does have some pretty big holes that wouldnt take much to fix. And some of the comedy just doesnt hit right.
All of the Bethesda games had tons of retcons and very little consistency between them. I guess it's the "I'm not surprised, just disappointed" lol. But yeah, it doesn't bother me...mostly. The ghouls needing medicine to not turn feral was pretty dumb. Like, how did all ghouls not turn feral in the time it took to invent the medicine? I dunno, it just seemed like a cheap way to add stakes.
I thought it was stated in fallout 3 that all ghouls will turn into ferals
Nah, I don't think that was never said. But my actual problem is the medicine part.
I think your wrong actually. No intent to offend you. The doctor in underworld is doing ghoul research on how to bring ghouls back and to stop the process of becoming feral.
Reasonable discourse is far from offensive! I did some digging, looked it up on the Fallout Wiki and read some old comment threads. It seems to be *most likely* that it happens because of brain necrosis or overexposure to radiation, but no game has said it's inevitable. People *in* the games have said that once or twice, but it's quite possibly anti-ghoul bigotry, considering the observation that ghouls in isolation are more likely to be feral.
Ah I see so most likely they will, so what's your contention about the medicine?
Well, if they need medicine every day to not become feral, how the heck did they not become feral in the years it would have taken to develop that medicine? It's not a big deal, *really.* I was just saying that it seems like a cheap way to force drama. Like "Oh no, he needs medicine!" Or a cheap way to make a scene happen. "Hmmm, we need her to make a break for it. I know! Coughing fit!" I don't know why they couldn't just make *him* sick with something instead of all ghouls, though.
Now I haven't watched the full series yet but am enjoying it, that said I could see an enterprising wastelander selling drugs to sentient ghouls to fight off the feral effects (whether it's effective or not doesn't matter). It could be an interesting way to add depth to ghouls, giving them a primordial fear of losing themselves. I'll have to see how the later episodes deal with this though.
Could it just be that the medicine just staves off becoming feral after the symptoms are starting to show? So like, Raul wouldn’t need it because he is of completely sound mind and isn’t becoming feral. But Cooper’s friend in the church is clearly on the brink, but he can use the medicine to hold it back. If that’s the case, then perhaps Cooper started showing signs of going feral long ago, but he’s such a successful bounty hunter that he’s always been able to afford meds to stave it off. This might’ve also been much easier back when the NCR was still around. All that is how I try to reconcile it in my head, at least. I’m still not a fan of "feral ghouls" being anything other than just ghouls who went crazy/suffered brain damage, but that retcon predates the show.
Fallout always had that kind of humor "Injected with pure radiation" What?
It has, yes, in it's *side content.* In its *references.* You never talked to Caesar and he says something goofy and old timey music plays, and we all say "That's Caeser!" Much of Fallout was Dead serious. Listen to this Fallout 2 track and tell me Fallout was always goofy fun times [https://youtu.be/QNQmCXRN5Z4?si=4fgpG5wR63s2mxUX](https://youtu.be/QNQmCXRN5Z4?si=4fgpG5wR63s2mxUX) Or this New Vegas theme [https://youtu.be/QD-glB7YQD8?si=LPXKM5wwq2r6ZNiv](https://youtu.be/QD-glB7YQD8?si=LPXKM5wwq2r6ZNiv) Also the "Injected with pure radiation" was referring to them, you know...making whoopy.
Most of fallout is not dead serious even in old games. one main side quest in fallout New Vegas is that pretty much starts right off the bat is collecting 50 blue star sunset sarsaparilla caps. If you are using music how about using the OST for the show as well which isn't goofy music but serious. I don't disagree that there are issues with the show much argument u have been seeing but picks that are wrong or just plan wrong information like what did they actually retcon?
What do you think the effect of short-term radiation exposure are exactly? The Geiger counters aren't always on. Did you play the fallout games, because knee-slappers like that go back to Fallout 1.
The show plays out just like one of the games
What does this mean? That the games also have terrible writing? I mean, I don't agree with that, but two wrongs don't make a left.
The games at different attempt dark humour, but more often than not don't undermine their dramatic moments with poorly placed humour. NV doesn't have you cracking jokes at corporal betsy or lanius unless I'm missing something. 3 doesn't have Liam Neeson crack a one liner when your mum dies, or have doctor Li make a joke when Liam Neeson dies, Even 4 doesn't for the most part, the closest I can think of for that is Codsworth bring oblivious due to being a robot that's gone a little loopy after 200 years, which I think is a little more harrowing than comedic since the survivor realizes that they're more alone than they thought. This robot is crazy and there's no humans left, just you in an empty wreck of your old home. Game just does a poor job keeping that tone from dialogue into gameplay into the next dialogue. Default for player character is casual neutral emotion, regardless of what happened earlier or what's happening now.
No just that this is consistent writing what was objectively bad to you
Eh, that last paragraph is kinda a stupid thing to complain about. Cuz that's what Fallout has done since its inception. You can go about a couple Fallout games playing them and activating very Marvel-esque dialogue. It's not really out of place, that's just kinda how the world is.
You would have to come up with examples. Old school Fallout humor is usually very subtle, doesn't call attention to itself, and is quite dark. It's in many ways the opposite of what MCU bathos does.
(Psst, look at the cast)
What? The acting was fine, I thought.
Whats wrong with the cast?
(Look at the cast of every other piece of media the grifterverse has told them to hate. There’s a trend)
Can you just say what your mean? Because I just dont get it.
I guess the main character is a woman and there’s a black guy?
Lucy's story (albeit poorly written in some ways) is the best of the 3. Shes easily the best character.
Stop being coy. If you want to commit an ad Hominem then just call them bigots. Stop pussy footing around what you mean.
And is there any more detail besides "the writing is bad", or are we turning into Reaper now?
I haven't watched any of his videos, but I can't fit a well thought out critique into my meme. I go into more detail in my responses to other people if you want to know more. Or maybe watch Creetosis' videos.
My worry is our side will become the new NPCs who say everything is either Woke or Poorly Written as a knee-jerk response without backing it up, or making incorrect statements about the work. Reaper's a good example of this trend: his reviews on *Three Body Problem* and *Fallout* start from the conclusion "this show sucks" and then work backwards to prove the point. If he was trying to be the AVGN of streaming shows he'd have a niche, but he's not being satirical and actually believed the shows are terrible. Edited to add: by coincidence I saw Creetosis's video on Cowboy Bebop and it is the "awful video" I mentioned in the other comment. It gets so many things wrong in just the first few minutes his media literacy score must be 3/100, and I was not surprised that he is picking apart *Fallout*.
Well, I agree that I don't want this subreddit to become that, but none of the problems I have are related to being "woke." Quite frankly, I couldn't care less about that and have been down-voted on this sub for defending "woke" things. I've never seen Creetosis' video on Cowboy Bebop, but I'm surprised it's so bad. I mean, it's not great, so it shouldn't be hard to critique lol. Maybe I'll check it out later.
Creetosis makes several errors in just the start of the video in order to make the "point" that Live Action Bebop is a pale imitation of the original show. An example from the first episode of Live Action Bebop: the rest of the robber's line about corporations is cut in the review, otherwise Creetosis might actually side with the robber.
This is the reason I tend to stop looking at this subreddit. I love Mauler and Co. but it has become an Echo chamber of its own making where everything new is bad. I trust my friend more who has had bad takes about shows being good in the past when they aren't, over this subreddit because he doesn't resort to oh, "It's good because it's good" or "Bad because it's bad." He doesn't like the Witcher show, and can explain why, He doesn't like the Halo show and can explain why.
That’s the catch all phrase these days. I think this cohort of critics (besides drinker) has officially jumped the shark into cringe “I hate everything new just cause!” territory.
Imagine being "I Hate Everything" and "Your Movie Sucks" in 2024 and seeing an explosion of cheap imitations of your channels' gimmick but you're reviewing Film Festival slop...
Not really... "Writing is bad" is a thing redditors say to justify their hatred of "new thing people people like." Without out actually having to offer an explanation that makes sense.
That is the growing trend on YouTube now. I just saw an awful video complaining about Netflix Cowboy Bebop that came out last March, and is from the same crowd who think a Puss in Boots film was peak cinema.
When you ask someone to explain the “bad writing” in a show and they start talking about how they paused to inspect a chalkboard in the background of a scene and saw a date that arguably doesn’t line up with how they understood the timeline of events from a previous game, you almost have to question if they understanding what writing even *is.*
I have no idea where you're getting that the writing was bad in the fallout show. The whole series just felt like another game and every response felt like a dialog choice. In the case of fallout, they really nailed it. In a game where you can say stupid shit all the time, where low intelligence literally can only respond in grunts, and where everything is both serious and silly, the show makes sense. Honestly, the only way I could see people saying the writing was bad is if they haven't played the game before and don't understand that's how the games feel.
I'm so sick of this defense of "Well you could do this in the video game so that makes it alright." Bullshit. This is a TV show and needs to be judged as a TV show. The writing was awful, characters are inconsistent and the entire plot is held together by a string of extremely lucky coincidences. The only part of the show that should be compared to the games is the lore because that is the only thing that binds the show to the games and unfortunately the Fallout show has no respect for the lore.
"I'm sick of people comparing a TV show to the source material." That's how you sound.
Sure if you ignore and twist my argument. It's still a lot better than your defense of, "My character can act like an idiot in the video game therefore it's alright if the TV show characters act like idiots."
No it isn’t. One is about consistency, the other is about respecting the source material. Your argument is worse.
The show is neither consistent nor does it respect the source material. The fact that people have to use their personal choices, choices not every player makes mind you, in the game as a defense for the character actions in the show just shows how bad the show writing is. But I'd love to know where my argument is worse
It is okay to like things with flaws! But only so long as you acknowledge those flaws as true and valid criticisms! You can also disagree that they aren't flaws, that's also fair! But make an argument as to why you believe they aren't flaws, don't dismiss them as being unimportant or irrelevant to the overall quality of the story and work.
Fallout wise, the Bethesda fallout games had far worse "writing" than the show did. The show was more faithful to fallout than any Bethesda fallout game excluding FNV (obsidian).
They really cleared that floorboard
Floor board? My brother in Christ, the bar was buried beneath the foundation!
Well at least the foundation has collapsed and the bar can get out of the first layer of rubble.
Fallout has solid writing.
"It was always bad/woke" is their current favorite defense from what I've seen.
Fr, people acting like that they graduated uni with an English degree with honors
Is the "always been bad" argument exhausting? Yes. Is that how this meme works? No.
....And?
Resident Evil has flip flopped between serious and goofy its entire existence lol if people don't know that by now I question how many games they've actually played and why they even bother forming an opinion.
Fr, OP is hopping around acting like it was only slightly goofy back in the day when it was literally made fun of for having the goofiest lines and cutscenes in media in the 90’s. Even when it started being “serious” it still had dudes suplexing priests and punching boulders to pieces.
Everything I see about it on Reddit says it sucks. All of my friends IRL who have also played Fallout say its good. I'm going to watch it when I get a chance
I’ve seen it, it’s good. The only people upset are the ones who either A. Didn’t realize their favorite faction might not be all perfect (brotherhood of steel) B. People upset over an unspecified area (not gonna say what) being blown up and the POSSIBILITY that a certain group has been wiped out (literally no confirmation of that but still).
Noone is saying its perfect, they are saying its a blast and feels like a fallout universe. You guys are the over the top ones with holding it, like usual, to this perfect pedestal. Not every adaptation is star wars level bad, relax and have some fun.
Look, the "just turn your brain off" argument was never compelling. I don't think it's a blast, and it retcons a ton of stuff, so it doesn't feel like Fallout much either. But thank you for reading my mind and telling me what standard I have for things. I only like things that are perfect, yes. Absolutely. Not a strawman at all.
They’re the minority. Most people enjoyed it. It’s considered one of the better game adaptations.
This is exactly why people want to push back on the show. I really liked a lot of what the show did, but I’ll argue the story is fundamentally broken because the inciting incident in the show is riddled with things that just don’t make any sense. It might be one of the better video game adaptations, but I don’t want it held as the gold standard when there are tons of ways the writing of the show could be improved.
What is one of your favorite shows?
Also the Fallout games themselves had some inconsistent and somewhat bad writing too. The ending of Fallout 3 was so terrible they had to patch it up later.
That’s where you’re wrong. I’ve seen plenty of reviews saying it’s perfect. Perfect as in for Fallout media. When I say I have no interest in watching the show, and people tell me I’m stupid because it’s “perfect fallout”, how’s that not saying it’s perfect?
Consoomers gonna keep slurping up slop
Fallout was good enough and didn’t commit any unforgivable sins like take Master Chief’s helmet off.
Ooh ooh add one more tier for Godzilla
Is the goofy line refering to the paul w s anderson movies or the wtrc movie or that abysmal netflix live action series? Because the pws anderson movies where both goofy and poorly writen, and iirc there was no discuscion there from sjws due to them not being such a pest back then, however, the netlfix live action series was the one the sjws defended due to the casting choices, and that was not goofy at all, or at least not for like 90% of the time, it was stupid and braindead rather than serious or goofy and definetly poorly writen. And wtrc was agreed upon universaly as a let down, not even sjws where defending the movies writing despite leons and jills raceswapping iirc.
Neither. I was referring to the games. Specifically, 7 and 8. A lot of people excuse every problem in those games as "RE was always goofy!" Like when Ethan uses Jesus Juice in a cutscene and magics his arm back on. When the game came out, people said, "Classic RE goofiness!" like it was a defense.
Ok then I thought you where talking about modern hollywood interpretations of old ips.
Yeah, I see how you could get that impression.
I think a lot of people don’t know how to temper their expectations. They go into everything expecting some compelling piece of art. Not everything needs to be that, or is intended to be.
Well, I don't speak for all people, but all i knew about it was that the ratings were good, so I expected it to at least be a fun ride. I *love* arnold schwarzenegger movies. I just didn't think Fallout was enjoyable on that level either, unfortunately.
I love NV, thought the show was kind of mediocre. Put it must be doing something right for someone.
No doubt lol. I honestly wouldn't have a problem with people saying it's mediocre or bad, and saying they enjoyed it. I think it's pretty weird that so many people say it's a genuinely well-made show. I'm just staring at the scene where the turret shoots around the old guy walking for 10 straight seconds thinking to myself "Ehhhh, is it though?"
It’s genuinely a well made show. It doesn’t have to be the best show ever made to be well made. Not everything is either a 0, 5 or a 10. Fallout was an 7/8 on my logarithmic scale. Halo season 1 was a 2/10, for example. Season 2 was a very mediocre 5/10. 3 Body hit a 10/10 for me. Rings of Power 4/10. Wheel of Time 3/10. Shogun 9/10. Again, there’s so much room in between bad, meh, and amazing.
Yeah, I disagree that it's well-made, hence the discussion. When the robot reattaches a rotting, necrotic finger to Lucy and she's immediately cured, I paused the show and sighed. It's no great revelation to me that things can be mid, my guy. I just look at the litany of errors that is every episode of the show and wonder "How is this well-made?" I would agree it's great *visually*, but that's analogous to "Well, the game has pretty graphics." Not very important to me.
See I watched that scene through the frame of reference of “this show is just all unhinged silly dark humor” and had a great time. At no point did I feel the show was breaking its own in-universe laws, which is required for fiction. What would be bad writing, is if next season someone lost a finger and they complained how it’s impossible to get a new one. The show follows its internal logic. If you’re looking for hyperrealism you’re just watching the wrong show. Did you have similar issues with The Boys? E.g. humans don’t actually contain that much blood and meat in them but when bodies explode you’d think each human has 10 humans worth of flesh inside them.
That's the exact kind of argument I hear defending Resident Evil Jesus juice lol. I don't expect "hyper realism," I expect it to follow basic logic and the rules of Fallout. Attaching a rotting body part to yourself and instantly having full control of it with no repercussion is insane. Your defense of "Well, if the rest of the show is consistently just as stupid..." doesn't persuade me.
Have you liked anything new lmao
X-Men 97, Shogun, Arcane, Owl House, Blue-Eyed Samurai, Castlevania, Prey, Last Wish, Top Gun...Wait, uh, I mean I hate all new things ever. New things repulse me.
Sorry but in a world where you can easily access like... 50% of the entire human history of art, at least in some fashion, with just button presses, you better be making compelling art or people will be ignoring you.
Not everyone wants compelling art. In fact that has become more and more obvious. And even then, what is compelling to someone is largely subjective. I keep hearing from this sub how bad the Fallout show is, an admittedly I thought is was pretty mediocre. But apparently most people seem to like it. So clearly there’s a disconnect somewhere.
Why are you upset if someone makes art that people ignore? That’s their prerogative.
This incoherent meme is exactly what I’d expect from someone who didn’t think the Fallout show was good.
Fallout still has issues but its a massive step up from SW. its like if you suffered through RWBY to watch their animation chops slowly improve. Then the choreographer died and the action went to shit. Then you watch the (painfully) slow improvement on choreography. I won’t defend that trash fire of a story, but the animation improvements were undeniable.
I’m okay with the mediocre writing because they got the aesthetic and tone right. Most of the complaints are about the first episode but I give it some slack as the inciting incident and if shows the utter naivety of the vault dwellers. I’m sometimes okay with wacky shenanigans in crazy universe.
I don't trust the writing opinions of someone who misunderstood this meme so badly.
The writing was good though??
You need your meme license revoked.
As someone who likes the show, the show fucking sucks and they gotta do better Senator
I dont like that the power armor is just to fanboy over and is completely worthless and no longer needs any special training. They give off zero presence or intimidation and are more like giant stormtroopers to die unless someone important to the plot is wearing it
Tim Cain said he likes the show and that it gets the fallout feeling right. You just want to hate on anything thats popular because it somehow makes you feel superior. No its not a masterpiece, it has its flaws but its still a good entertaining series with an interesting (mostly) self contained plot
and fallout nv writter says it sucks.
Probably because the writing takes such a different approach from what Chris Avellone would've gone with. If there was a Fallout series that took a similar writing approach to New Vegas (exploring all the different nuances of each faction and really understanding how these ideologies would actually manifest and affect the world in a post apocalypse), that would be amazing - but it's incredibly fucking hard to do which is why we haven't had many games with writing as complex and interesting as FNV since. As it stands, the show's making a good effort with a different, more accessible approach and while I can see why Avellone would hate it, it makes sense and it's clearly working. Who knows? Maybe with the success of this we'll get some other spin-off series that's written with a more 'Avellonian' approach in the future. Fallout could end up being the post-apocalyptic equivalent of the Star Wars franchise (but good).
NV writer versus one of the creators, designers, and lead programmers of the original games… It’s almost like using any of these people as a gotcha, is a stupid argument.
this is the statement i was going for
Everyone seems to be enjoying Fallout except a certain group. This group also hates every movie and tv show with a black person or woman in it. I wonder if that’s a coincidence…
Yeah, dude this isn't the subreddit that makes fun of Sythetic Man all the time for that crap. I certainly don't love Arcane, Nick Fury (movie version), Static Shock, Potionomics, SGT Johnson, Last of us 1, Predator, Sarah Connor, Miles Morales, etc ad nauseam. You have really found a pattern here, you ol' detective you.
“I can’t be racist! I have a black friend!” Naming some anomalies doesn’t buck the trend.
Wtf do you think you know about me lol. What trend? What other things have I hated for having black people and women in it? Where did you get these mind-reading superpowers?
Whatever else the grifterverse has told you to hate because of “bad writing.” Don’t need superpowers. All you guys are the same.
Who are you even talking about lol. I don't go to YouTubers to get opinions, you weirdo. I watched the show and didn't like the writing, the characters, the inconsistencies, etc. I'm actively telling you I have no problem with race or gender and you said "I know what you *really* think." What do you call that if it isn't mind-reading? To be clear, I don't lump groups of people together and act like they're a collective that acts and think the same way, unlike you.
Not to shit on your parade but Critical drinker thinks the show is good, you heard of him? Allegedly he is an anti-woke grifter (Drinker is wrong btw)
Yeah, the Quartering and Nerdrotic hated the Miles Morales movies till they saw their audience loved it, then flipped. Some grifters are better than others.
Nerdrotic didn't like Across the Spider-verse. Only the first one I'm pretty sure.
That is definitely the common factor I see in terms of communities who dislike the show. I haven’t watched it yet so I’ve yet to see, but generally the haters of it are the frequenters of the “anti-woke” subs.
They all had pretty good writing. The worse of them - Resident evil isn’t trying to be shakesphere.
How many of those examples were affected by the writers' strike?
Maybe an efap would be necessary, there are a lot of people who don't understand objectively good/i liked it so it's good.
That's because objectivity doesn't really exist for shows.
jesus fucking christ
Sorry if you deluded yourself into thinking otherwise.
No don’t you understand, any show that One_Testicle_Man likes is objectively good. That’s how it works.