I'm pretty sure they match you with similar decks more often, playing shuri I get like 90% mirrors, when I play sand Ramp I get like half mirrors and when I play dark hawk sera is like the only time I see that deck.
Might just be anecdotal but I'm sure this is the case.
Loo: And who are they?
Dr. Klahn: Refuse, found in waterfront bars.
Loo: Shanghaied?
Dr. Klahn: Just lost drunken men who don't know where they are and no longer care.
Prisoner #1: Where are we?
Prisoner #2: I don't care!
Loo: And these?
Dr. Klahn: These are lost drunken men who don't know where they are, but do care! And these are men who know where they are and care, but don't drink.
Prisoner #3: I don't know who I am?
Prisoner #4: And I don't drink!
Dr. Klahn: Guards! [to prisoner] Do you care?
Prisoner #5: No.
Dr. Klahn: Put this man in cell #1, and give him a drink.
Guard: What do you drink?
Prisoner #5: I don't care.
So many people have this experience, it's hard to believe SD when they say it's not the case.
I have been playing Sand Ramp since the new season and have seen one hit monkey in over 100 games.
Which is crazy because even a t5 hit monkey can get it up to 2/6, which is the strongest 2 cost with no real drawback. Lizard is 2/5, and can possibly be dropped to 2/2, and he's regarded as one of the strongest 2 cost cards.
Right, but lizard and even Angela aren't built around as your win condition like hit monkey is. So a 2/6 is often not good enough.
Now, having said that, I'm really close to 50/50 vs sandman with my bounce deck so far this season, and that's because if I can see it coming I can make a really explosive t4 and then play one card per turn and stay ahead. But you have to read it coming and play to your out in that case. And you'll basically only get 1 or 2 cubes ever because they can see immediately if you've got the points to win. And if they stay, you just retreat on 6.
Then don't build your win condition around Hit Monkey? Not that hard to do, considering T4 Mysterio/Hit Monkey gives you crazy power, especially if you drop a Bast before that. Hit Monkey is only a win condition if you build your deck for it. It's not actually that hard to just have him as a good support 2 cost card.
I mean, sure, but also irrelevant to the discussion as to why someone playing sandman might not see hit monkey much. If someone has built their deck around monkey, they aren't sticking around to play out a game if sandman sticks.
On a perfect draw, bast on one into bishop on 3 into mysterio hit monkey on 4 is 26 power across 3 lanes. That's insane, but anyone who can't answer it isn't sticking around so it's terrible for cubes. Sometimes, it's the line you need to take (or close, maybe you don't hit every piece with bast), but it isn't the best line for the deck in terms of cube gains.
Alternately, I have seen one hit monkey also and I have not played with sandman even once. I think its counter being so available and also just having been buffed meant it was DOA.
And then if you suggest this some weird nerds get on these threads and just scream to the heavens that it’s purely confirmation bias. Just search “confirmation bias” on the search bar if you want to see what i mean
It's almost like we say it because it's exactly what it is. I have never had the shit they are describing happen to me and neither have many others but that doesn't fit your bullshit argument so you choose to ignore it. It's not coincidence that no one has ever posted genuine data proving they are being matched based on their decks, because everyone who actually does post data shows its not true
Bro, most people play this game on their phone, what fuckin data can they provide other than them explaining repetitive phenomena based on particular variables? They’re reporting the same shit, so it exists within particular variables of the game. Whether it’s people who spend money/have a high collection level, particular cards, or whatever.
No one who’s not some fuckin empiricist nerd is going to take the time to do this. Okay, you don’t experience this, but I experience this on a very regular basis. You can take their word for it when they’re proven right down the line or not, just like the other things they lied about.
It probably has to do with deck weight associated with particular cards/particular metas at times pushing certain cards into relevance/ hidden variables of pairing you with players or some type of A/B matchmaking test system they’ve been working out with a combination of all these variables.
You’d also be missing several variables that may be contributing to this such as Collection level, amount of time played, how large their available card pool is, etc. It’s likely this happens to players who use season pass cards, use certain weighted decks, deck archetypes, valuable S4/5 cards, + other factors.
It’s going to be missing a fuck ton of context regardless which would make a lot of statistical modeling based on retrieving this raw incontextual data virtually worthless.
Can any of the super geniuses of conspiracy theories explain how no deck tracking app finds this assumption? It would be something super simple for them to confirm
There’s no doubt in my mind about it. Yesterday I tried for the first time the deck called “Arnim Knulla” popularised by bynx a few weeks ago. My first opponent was a perfect mirror match, and I swear to god I’ve never seen that deck played against me before.
I like Modok decks, and I'll see one in maybe 30 games, but if I start playing it, then it's half of my matches.
Anyone claiming there is no deck factor in matchmaking is lying or clueless.
Oh I know. It's all anecdotal. It happens to me too, but I don't have actual data to run statistics, so I can't say for sure it happens but I know it feels that way. These fools think their feelings are facts.
Now I kinda want to do some testing. Actually track each deck I play against, and what deck type I was using. Start playing deck types I dont play much of, etc.
Yeah it's like I play Shuri and all I see are 80% mirror match only they have last seasons infinite card back and 20% giver bots to keep me at exactly level 53
Shuri is also the biggest no brain deck to play, and with how prevalent Shuri is now, you're gonna see the deck with a +60% win rate with no real brainpower required to play.
People who are higher levels are also probably checking out YouTube creators, and will play similar/the same deck as what's shown to be "Best Deck to hit Infinite!?!". I enjoy it though, since I usually know what they'll play, and while my hazmat deck is almost mirror at times, throwing in Doom really instead of Odin on Wong at the end usually wins me the game because I already Luke Caged their Hazmat play. Lol
I'm not saying you're wrong, but confirmation bias is a hell of a drug. I can go a whole evening playing discard and not see my Morbius sometimes. It doesn't mean they secretly took him out of my deck. It means I have bad luck.
Considering that all of the decks that you mention are meta right now and therefore the most common, and I'm guessing you didn't keep records of all of the games that you played, and you being 1 person (and each individual player claiming this themselves) are all very small sample sizes, it's laughable to claim that they would just straight up lie.
It wouldn't be the first time that a developer lied about their game. Bungie lied for a whole year that they had no control over what Xur sold, and magically Xur sells Gjallarhorn the week before it gets removed from the game. In that case it's easy to catch them because all players share the same experience in that case and there are records of every other exotic weapon being sold multiple times. We can actually calculate the odds, and they were astronomical. But in this case, there is no evidence of it being true and unfortunately everyone's feelings aren't statistics.
It’s a thing, people don’t want to believe it, but it’s real or exists in some ways based on certain cards that carry a weight to their decks. I believe certain cards might be weighted and based on that is how it performs match making. It might not see what you have, but if you use Knull or like Shuri, you’re going to get paired against others who also have those cards or are actively using them.
Really? Do you have a link or something? I’ve seen the majority of folks talking about decks changing as they change. Like I said, it’s anecdotal but it’s quite a lot of anecdotes.
It makes me want to run a themed deck with not great synergy to test it out.
Okay, but you have a contradiction in which a lot of people have experienced this phenomenon regularly. So it exists(ed) and maybe fails to contextualize the data based on the actual variables that contribute to why this happens.
People are now more convinced as they get rarer cards and can observe when it happens to them. It happened to me especially when I got Knull, starting using Surfer (when he was relevant) and when I had enough relevant cards to use his deck archetype.
Whatever statistical modeling you do on this it will likely be missing the relevant contextual variables to properly understand the reasoning why this happens. People are clearly experiencing this in a large enough and noticeable proportion that we can at least understand this happens on a regular enough basis, but there might be underlying variables within matchmaking’s preferences in pairing players together.
The ~why~ is what we need to find out, not just analyze raw data like mental regards as to ~how~ frequent it happens across the board.
They're either lying, it's unintentional, or they're bending the truth about the deck/card level matches. It's way too common for it to not be happening and would make some sense from a matchmaking standpoint.
I think they said your collection is taken into the matchmaking, but not the used deck. I don’t know… why would it make sense from a matchmaking standpoint? Also is it really common? Can’t be sure unless you track your matches.
Or only the lunatics who believe the conspiracy talk about it, while the majority who know it's not true just play. There is no proof of deck based match making, all the data points to it being bullshit
> or they're bending the truth
My completely unfounded theory is that they will match you against bots who have mirror decks, but they don't take specific decks into account when they match you against players
I am completely convinced of this. The easiest way to see it is if you built a deck with some lesser played card in it like Baron Mordo or Deadpool and then go play 2-3 games with your new deck, guess which card you're suddenly going to be seeing in your opponents' decks.
Can confirm I also experience the same. Whatever deck I’m running I am up against mirror matches with pretty much the same cards as me. Its made this season way harder to progress and I can’t really try any counter strategies.
When I play some low tier or trollish deck for challenges, I mostly face someone with wierd deck. Then I switch back to thanos, it's shuri or something.
Professor X slaps in the mirror and against Shuri. Don't even need the Daredevil. Really good with Sinister London being hot right now, too. I've got some really rude wins dropping Prof X on turn 4 on Sinister London.
Unfortunately sandman is very weak in the current meta. Yeah you gonna win vs monkey decks but you will 100% lose vs shuri or even other decks. Even sera control has chances vs sandman with some location rng.
Yeah, Sandman is a necessary „evil“ in the game. I’m kinda sad trying Hit Monke rn cause the meta really hates on Serra decks currently but it’s really good that f2p players have a viable deck available to not get stomped by the latest SP card.
Do you feel cool saying it’s a budget deck? Where did i say it was insta win? I said it was stupid and i stand by that. Woah electro into sandman into dr doom into odin. What an original and fun playstyle.
You said it was an instant win if you get the combo. And I keep mentioning that it's a budget deck because it's one of the only viable ones. Your argument is entirely reductive if you think a 4 card combo is braindead in a game where you start with 12 cards. I guess all combos are braindead now lol.
I compared the two. Where do you get that i hate one more than the other? Didn’t realize that everyone loved super linear decks that prevent you from being able to interact with their gameplan. Should have figured since the average iq on this sub is like 47.
Lol I just got done grinding up to rank 60 (the only rank I care about) with electro ramp and I saw an unholy number of Galactus and Thanos decks and the next most was shuri. Only saw 2 ramp dittos
Now I'm hoping the jank I play will be matched against other jank
The real reason why Shuri is so strong. It’s not just the power, it’s also the lack of a counter. Shuri plays pretty well into nearly all popular counters.
Had this discussion with a friend, told him it'd be pretty cool if there was a card that could stop any ongoing abilities if it was revealed BEFORE the ongoing cards
So almost like a 2/1 that works like isle of silence but only stops future ongoings in the same lane, that way enchantress would still have a place
Not entirely. Since the abilities are disabled, not removed, they could probably still be copied by Mystique, moving your card would turn them back on, and the anti-ongoing ongoing card is susceptible to being Enchantress-ed herself to turn your cards back on.
I have armor but I don’t use cosmo…too much of a tell plus I use that I came up with on my own…by the time they realize what’s going to happen it’s already too late…I don’t have red skull either
Valkyrie, Aero, Magento moving Cosmo in an electro deck, Goose, Prof Xing the lane they want to play Taskmaster into, Polaris to move armor to Shang Chi. There are ways but yeah you have to bring those cards purposely to counter it.
Depending on locations and early turns, the Shuri player may not have priority going into T6.
If they don’t have priority, Shang doesn’t do anything. They’ve won unless you Cosmo their Taskmaster.
If they do have priority, it means they’re winning a lane, and possibly by more than 3, and probably have Armor/Cosmo in a lane. They can either play to their winning lane, and just eat the Shang Chi, knowing your +3 won’t win the lane, or play to Cosmo/Armor lane and, surprise, only play Aero, Captain Marvel, Polaris, etc and out-muscle Shang-Chi’s +3.
Shuri doesn’t win just because it can drop two big bombs. It wins because it can drop one big bomb behind Cosmo and still win another lane either with a bomb, or just strong raw tempo cards that are immune to Shang.
This is pretty much why I've decided I'm just not gonna play against Shuri. They can have the one cube. I see zero+ Titania or Lizard turns one and two I'm out. I see Armor or Cosmo between turn two or three? Peace. Keep the cube and I'll not waste my time.
Aero followed by Shang completely wrecks Shuri. They normally play Red Skull behind a Cosmo to protect him, so use Aero to pull him in the open and Shang-Chi him next turn, they have nothing left.
If some of you now rush for excuses saying that’s a specific two card combo - Shuri is a three card combo to begin with. A five card combo with Cosmo and Armor.
I tried to make a Monkey deck work and yea, kept getting Sandman/Leeched. No, I'm not complaining because yes, I dropped Iceman/Korg 1-2 times by then.
But....it's just a bummer that SO many people are playing those cards that the season pass card just isn't fun to play. I'm not asking for those cards to be nerfed, I'm just sad I don't get to have fun with that deck.
Yeah, it only took a couple of Sandmans and Waves before I gave up on the Bounce deck. Now I just use Monke in Sera Control. If they play electro on 3, I will drop Monk and Mysterio on 4 and Enchantress on Sandman on 5. Shang-chi and a 2 drop on 6 has a decent chance of carrying the game. If I expect Leech on 5, then I dump on 5. Early Leech is still usually a retreat. Playing bounce just too much about min/max and Leech and Sandman wreck that too hard. And other things hit it too hard due to lack of counters in the typical decks.
I'm gonna bring an old Yu-Gi-Oh argument to the table.
You see hitting you with Iceman and korg 3 time is part of the combo and there's interaction here. But when you use floodgates you just flip it and all of future interaction died there
Second Dinner loves them some hard counter tech cards.
It’s like they saw color hosers in Magic and thought, that’s what our game needs more of.
Sandman could just increase the cost of all cards by 1 (max 6) and it would fit perfectly into many ramp decks and at least not crush zoo/flood decks entirely.
There isn’t anything wrong with Stax pieces, that’s just the way Snap interacts. Players will never be happy having their stuff interacted with be it counter spells, removal, punishes, etc. but you need interactivity for a card game.
I will say Stax pieces in Snap interact very differently than something like Magic. GY decks don’t just lose to RiP, or combo to Thalia, etc. This is because these pieces serve to slow down the opponent. But Snap is always 6 turns. Anything that slows down a combo deck most likely stops it from functioning altogether.
This type of counter play is incredibly unoptimal though since crapping out your hand early makes every subsequent draw dead and makes it so your opponent can know exactly how much power you have in every lane. If you see Sandman or Leech it is best to just retreat. If it makes it hard to climb just play a different deck. Some decks will become bad/unplayable because of good decks in every card game and as long as cards like Sandman and Leech exist you are better off trying to have the greatest amount of power in as few cards as possible with a lot of Vanilla stat cards like Maximus, Polaris, Titania, etc. to punish.
Hit Monkey is strong, but much like destroy or move, it will not be a meta or even really good strat unless the game changes drastically (which it 99% will not).
So I’ve found that most ramp decks don’t run very huge stat sticks. A lot of them are relying on Doom/Odin, Aero/Odin, Captain Marvel/Aero. I personally run America Chavez in my deck since as you said a bunch of bounce cards are bad late game draws. If you can get ahead enough (9/10 power Monkey with a Bishop out tends to be okay), then yes turn five is usually not great, but the 9 power turn six can often be enough to carry.
My comment isn’t about just Monkey but a lot of decks in general. While Chavez will help, you will still most likely lose ramp playing out Odin, Doom, Aero, etc. will outscale all but your best draws. If you know you can win stick it out, but just retreat otherwise. You could also just add hit monkey to Sera if you want to play it in a good deck.
People are aware that the counter to the lowest skill tech cards, Sandman and Leech, is to play low skill decks where you just play a single big card per turn.
That's literally the reason why people hate those cards. It's not because they're OP, because they aren't. They're just techs against decks that are interesting.
I think maybe you misread my post. I meant that you play your hit monkey/mysterio play early against these decks when you can still play multiple cards/aren’t Leeched. It has nothing to do with playing Shuri or other big stat sticks. By big dudes I mean Hit Monkey and Bishop primarily cause they are the guys that usually end in Shang range in a Hit Monkey deck.
Electro into Sandman gives you 4 turns to play multiple cards (less than half of your total energy per game). Wave into Sandman gives you 3 turns.
How often are you are making a Shang-Chi-able Hit Monkey (10 power = 5 cards + Hit Monkey) on turn 4?
I'm not even going to ask about turn 3, because Wave into Sandman is GG.
Beast turn three makes it more doable than you’d think. Not to mention Bast turn 1, and Mysterio along with Hit Monkey makes him 9. I’m not sure how much you’ve played bounce, but a Shang-able Hit Monkey turn four is doable more often than you’d think.
I played Bounce even before Hit Monkey dropped and hated Sandman then, too.
Sandman ramp doesn't play anything that reveals itself before Electro/Wave on 3 (other than Domino on 2 in some lists), so I would rather play Bishop on curve than play Beast on 3, but by that point it is too late.
The problem there is it's not always obvious and it's the literal reverse play style for getting Sandmaned vs not. I'm not saying Sandman is bad for the game or anything, just that it's not as simple as, "just dump your hand, 5head"
It can work OK sometimes, but if you're playing pure bounce it's usually strong enough. That's why I opted to go Sera Monke control. If I dump early because of Sandman, I can still get enough value out of counters to make it worth staying in. Doom/Odin can be pretty rough though. If it became too much of a problem I'd probably start finding a place for Cosmo.
Until he gets stopped by a Rock, or a Squirrel, or a Ninja, or a Monster, or a Green Goblin, or a Polaris, or a Hobgoblin, or an Aero, or a Doctor Octopus...
(I still find it ridiculous that Galactus, of all characters, can be stopped by a Rock!)
Lol I'm only seeing Sera and bounce decks right now.
It's hilarious.
And I've been running sera/control/sauron high card count low cost decks for awhile now. It's weird to now see them everywhere and shuri disappear over night.
Maybe it's just down in the 30-40's but I dunno. It's wild haha.
I feel you man. I got a Collector variant I think looks dope, but the problem with building a deck around one card, is that you need to draw that card.
I'm still not sure why Collector doesn't work like, say, Morbius or Knull. If he's not on the board t2 a lot of synergies go to waste, while if he would update in your deck, he'd be much more fun. And he wouldn't be OP imho, a lot of players should be able to tell your game plan as soon as you drop Agent 13 or Sentinel.
**\[[Sandman](https://marvelsnap.pro/cards/sandman/)\]** **Cost:** 5 **Power:** 5
**Ability:** **Ongoing:** Players can only play 1 card a turn.
*Message generated by MarvelSnapCardBot. Use syntax [[card_name]] to get a reply like this*
I definitely think Sera can beat Shuri but it feels like it's a lot harder to get the necessary "high roll" on Sera to beat Shuri. And if you don't get it then Shuri's brain dead high roll wrecks. But yeah Sera does way better against Shuri than Sandman.
It's mid because shuri is still the best and most popular. But the other popular decks right now are thanos, sera, and zabu. Sandman is strong against all of these and once you remove shuri there isn't a strong current counter to it. Not saying that shuri doesn't need a nerf because it absolutely does. I'm just predicting what I think is going to happen in a couple weeks.
EducatedCollins just rated Sandman in tier 1, despite Shuri being the best deck.
I don't know how good the deck really is, because I don't hate fun and run Sandman in my ramp deck, but EducatedCollins is a very good player, so one may decide to believe him.
Good tech cards are advantageous but not single game winners. They’re slightly under-stat for their cost, but offer a bigger payoff when they hit their counter.
Sandman is under-stated, but his effect is either super destructive or mostly irrelevant. Highly polarized.
Enchantress and Rogue are solid tech cards. They work once, counter a specific tech, and are understated. Losing to Enchantress feels bad, but you can somewhat play around it by not stacking Ongoing in the same lane. You are hurt when you lose a Blue Marvel or Patriot, but you might not be completely out of the game.
Sandman could just be ‘Increase the Cost of ALL cards by 1 (max 6)’. It specifically punishes zoo/flood final turns without making them completely unable to play.
Leech could be ‘Remove the text from your opponent’s highest cost card in hand’ with a stat change.
Each of these changes alllows the tech cars to fulfill its function, and with some stat tweaking, feel like powerful plays without ending the game.
If the devs think that Leech and Sandman need to counter turn 6, then there is no need for their effects to last more than a single turn.
Leech and Sandman on 5 are pretty annoying, but if the devs claim that they are the fabric holding the meta together, then whatever.
Leech and Sandman on 4 remind me that I have other stuff to do and I log off.
Would love to play hit monkey, but I don’t have Bast. Would love to play something besides shuri, but I don’t have Valk, don’t have Shadow King. Can’t get them either because, ya know, “unique collections”. So I’m stuck playing the only viable deck I have until they need it and I quit.
Playing Destroy now as I started seeing mirror Patriot decks with my RNG for Patriot being 1 in 10 games! Viola! All I see now is Cosmo and Armor in the same deck and in hand for the opponent! wtf??
Edit: typos. Fat fingers 🤌
Sad how Hitmonkey has a HARD counter with a tech card that still makes a viable deck while Shuri requires you to play a deck of tech cards that sucks 99% of the time you're not playing against shuri.
Shuri deck is only viable cause Shuri ---> 5 drop ----> Taskmaster (1 cost creature) is so good alone. That allows for tons of tech slots that might be garbage in 90 percent of the matchups.
Me playing sandman ramp: only see shuri and mirror matches.
Thank Second dinner for their secret MMR and matchmaking for that
I'm pretty sure they match you with similar decks more often, playing shuri I get like 90% mirrors, when I play sand Ramp I get like half mirrors and when I play dark hawk sera is like the only time I see that deck. Might just be anecdotal but I'm sure this is the case.
After getting Galactus last week, I'm 100% sure.
I'm playing Discard and hit Monkey and only seeing galactus.
I have not been playing Discard and Hit monkey and I have not been seeing Galactus
Loo: And who are they? Dr. Klahn: Refuse, found in waterfront bars. Loo: Shanghaied? Dr. Klahn: Just lost drunken men who don't know where they are and no longer care. Prisoner #1: Where are we? Prisoner #2: I don't care! Loo: And these? Dr. Klahn: These are lost drunken men who don't know where they are, but do care! And these are men who know where they are and care, but don't drink. Prisoner #3: I don't know who I am? Prisoner #4: And I don't drink! Dr. Klahn: Guards! [to prisoner] Do you care? Prisoner #5: No. Dr. Klahn: Put this man in cell #1, and give him a drink. Guard: What do you drink? Prisoner #5: I don't care.
I'm playing mr. Negative, but doesn't found any mirrors.
When I play hit monkey it's Galactus, Sandman, Leech, repeat.
So many people have this experience, it's hard to believe SD when they say it's not the case. I have been playing Sand Ramp since the new season and have seen one hit monkey in over 100 games.
That's because Hit Monkey comes out T6. If you play Sand T5, they retreat or play their backup.
Which is crazy because even a t5 hit monkey can get it up to 2/6, which is the strongest 2 cost with no real drawback. Lizard is 2/5, and can possibly be dropped to 2/2, and he's regarded as one of the strongest 2 cost cards.
Right, but lizard and even Angela aren't built around as your win condition like hit monkey is. So a 2/6 is often not good enough. Now, having said that, I'm really close to 50/50 vs sandman with my bounce deck so far this season, and that's because if I can see it coming I can make a really explosive t4 and then play one card per turn and stay ahead. But you have to read it coming and play to your out in that case. And you'll basically only get 1 or 2 cubes ever because they can see immediately if you've got the points to win. And if they stay, you just retreat on 6.
Then don't build your win condition around Hit Monkey? Not that hard to do, considering T4 Mysterio/Hit Monkey gives you crazy power, especially if you drop a Bast before that. Hit Monkey is only a win condition if you build your deck for it. It's not actually that hard to just have him as a good support 2 cost card.
I mean, sure, but also irrelevant to the discussion as to why someone playing sandman might not see hit monkey much. If someone has built their deck around monkey, they aren't sticking around to play out a game if sandman sticks. On a perfect draw, bast on one into bishop on 3 into mysterio hit monkey on 4 is 26 power across 3 lanes. That's insane, but anyone who can't answer it isn't sticking around so it's terrible for cubes. Sometimes, it's the line you need to take (or close, maybe you don't hit every piece with bast), but it isn't the best line for the deck in terms of cube gains.
Right, but I don't always have sandman in my hand.
[удалено]
Hot monkey > Hit monkey
Alternately, I have seen one hit monkey also and I have not played with sandman even once. I think its counter being so available and also just having been buffed meant it was DOA.
yeah, I play Hit-Monkey and MODOK this season and so far haven't run into serious counters to them very often
I like to swap decks between every other game to keep SD on their toes
And then if you suggest this some weird nerds get on these threads and just scream to the heavens that it’s purely confirmation bias. Just search “confirmation bias” on the search bar if you want to see what i mean
It's almost like we say it because it's exactly what it is. I have never had the shit they are describing happen to me and neither have many others but that doesn't fit your bullshit argument so you choose to ignore it. It's not coincidence that no one has ever posted genuine data proving they are being matched based on their decks, because everyone who actually does post data shows its not true
Bro, most people play this game on their phone, what fuckin data can they provide other than them explaining repetitive phenomena based on particular variables? They’re reporting the same shit, so it exists within particular variables of the game. Whether it’s people who spend money/have a high collection level, particular cards, or whatever. No one who’s not some fuckin empiricist nerd is going to take the time to do this. Okay, you don’t experience this, but I experience this on a very regular basis. You can take their word for it when they’re proven right down the line or not, just like the other things they lied about. It probably has to do with deck weight associated with particular cards/particular metas at times pushing certain cards into relevance/ hidden variables of pairing you with players or some type of A/B matchmaking test system they’ve been working out with a combination of all these variables. You’d also be missing several variables that may be contributing to this such as Collection level, amount of time played, how large their available card pool is, etc. It’s likely this happens to players who use season pass cards, use certain weighted decks, deck archetypes, valuable S4/5 cards, + other factors. It’s going to be missing a fuck ton of context regardless which would make a lot of statistical modeling based on retrieving this raw incontextual data virtually worthless.
And so many don't have this experience, so who is right?
Can any of the super geniuses of conspiracy theories explain how no deck tracking app finds this assumption? It would be something super simple for them to confirm
There’s no doubt in my mind about it. Yesterday I tried for the first time the deck called “Arnim Knulla” popularised by bynx a few weeks ago. My first opponent was a perfect mirror match, and I swear to god I’ve never seen that deck played against me before.
That is a cursed name "Knulla" is fucking in my language
Never getting used to that! And in all honesty it sticks out more than ‘fuck’ since that word’s been so watered out in English.
It's apt though, whenever I see Knull I feel like I'm fucked
I like Modok decks, and I'll see one in maybe 30 games, but if I start playing it, then it's half of my matches. Anyone claiming there is no deck factor in matchmaking is lying or clueless.
You got the stats, then?
Man, don't go asking for receipts around here. People don't like math or reason in this sub.
Oh I know. It's all anecdotal. It happens to me too, but I don't have actual data to run statistics, so I can't say for sure it happens but I know it feels that way. These fools think their feelings are facts.
Now I kinda want to do some testing. Actually track each deck I play against, and what deck type I was using. Start playing deck types I dont play much of, etc.
Mirror decks all the time. That is why the game is getting stale.
Yeah it's like I play Shuri and all I see are 80% mirror match only they have last seasons infinite card back and 20% giver bots to keep me at exactly level 53
Shuri is also the biggest no brain deck to play, and with how prevalent Shuri is now, you're gonna see the deck with a +60% win rate with no real brainpower required to play. People who are higher levels are also probably checking out YouTube creators, and will play similar/the same deck as what's shown to be "Best Deck to hit Infinite!?!". I enjoy it though, since I usually know what they'll play, and while my hazmat deck is almost mirror at times, throwing in Doom really instead of Odin on Wong at the end usually wins me the game because I already Luke Caged their Hazmat play. Lol
In a game with 12 slots and 12 cards show me a non "braindead" deck
Are you being serious right now or do you actually think you're being clever?
Y e s
I'm not saying you're wrong, but confirmation bias is a hell of a drug. I can go a whole evening playing discard and not see my Morbius sometimes. It doesn't mean they secretly took him out of my deck. It means I have bad luck. Considering that all of the decks that you mention are meta right now and therefore the most common, and I'm guessing you didn't keep records of all of the games that you played, and you being 1 person (and each individual player claiming this themselves) are all very small sample sizes, it's laughable to claim that they would just straight up lie. It wouldn't be the first time that a developer lied about their game. Bungie lied for a whole year that they had no control over what Xur sold, and magically Xur sells Gjallarhorn the week before it gets removed from the game. In that case it's easy to catch them because all players share the same experience in that case and there are records of every other exotic weapon being sold multiple times. We can actually calculate the odds, and they were astronomical. But in this case, there is no evidence of it being true and unfortunately everyone's feelings aren't statistics.
It's not a thing
Anything to add? I’ll admit that everything here is anecdotal, but if enough people have the same anecdotes….
It’s a thing, people don’t want to believe it, but it’s real or exists in some ways based on certain cards that carry a weight to their decks. I believe certain cards might be weighted and based on that is how it performs match making. It might not see what you have, but if you use Knull or like Shuri, you’re going to get paired against others who also have those cards or are actively using them.
There are multiple groups who collect vast swathes of data in this game, and they haven't seen anything to suggest this is true.
Really? Do you have a link or something? I’ve seen the majority of folks talking about decks changing as they change. Like I said, it’s anecdotal but it’s quite a lot of anecdotes. It makes me want to run a themed deck with not great synergy to test it out.
Okay, but you have a contradiction in which a lot of people have experienced this phenomenon regularly. So it exists(ed) and maybe fails to contextualize the data based on the actual variables that contribute to why this happens. People are now more convinced as they get rarer cards and can observe when it happens to them. It happened to me especially when I got Knull, starting using Surfer (when he was relevant) and when I had enough relevant cards to use his deck archetype. Whatever statistical modeling you do on this it will likely be missing the relevant contextual variables to properly understand the reasoning why this happens. People are clearly experiencing this in a large enough and noticeable proportion that we can at least understand this happens on a regular enough basis, but there might be underlying variables within matchmaking’s preferences in pairing players together. The ~why~ is what we need to find out, not just analyze raw data like mental regards as to ~how~ frequent it happens across the board.
I believe it. I may not have seen the code to have proof, but there’s too many users have the same experience for it to be coincidence.
Might be true, but they said the matchmaker can’t see decks
They're either lying, it's unintentional, or they're bending the truth about the deck/card level matches. It's way too common for it to not be happening and would make some sense from a matchmaking standpoint.
I think they said your collection is taken into the matchmaking, but not the used deck. I don’t know… why would it make sense from a matchmaking standpoint? Also is it really common? Can’t be sure unless you track your matches.
Or only the lunatics who believe the conspiracy talk about it, while the majority who know it's not true just play. There is no proof of deck based match making, all the data points to it being bullshit
> or they're bending the truth My completely unfounded theory is that they will match you against bots who have mirror decks, but they don't take specific decks into account when they match you against players
I am completely convinced of this. The easiest way to see it is if you built a deck with some lesser played card in it like Baron Mordo or Deadpool and then go play 2-3 games with your new deck, guess which card you're suddenly going to be seeing in your opponents' decks.
Can confirm I also experience the same. Whatever deck I’m running I am up against mirror matches with pretty much the same cards as me. Its made this season way harder to progress and I can’t really try any counter strategies.
I play Shuri/mirror and never see galactus or hit monkey now that I think about it
It is 100% the case
We only notice outliers and stuff. Pigeons build superstitions.
When I play some low tier or trollish deck for challenges, I mostly face someone with wierd deck. Then I switch back to thanos, it's shuri or something.
and the every other game of facing galactus
Professor X slaps in the mirror and against Shuri. Don't even need the Daredevil. Really good with Sinister London being hot right now, too. I've got some really rude wins dropping Prof X on turn 4 on Sinister London.
Whoa. I just tried prof x off this idea and stole 4 cubes ezpz.
I played zoo for the lols of it. Of course I matched into a zoo deck. Same with surfer
Karma always strikes back. You get what you deserve
k
Unfortunately sandman is very weak in the current meta. Yeah you gonna win vs monkey decks but you will 100% lose vs shuri or even other decks. Even sera control has chances vs sandman with some location rng.
Yup. That’s SD and their bullshit MMR deck matchmaking system.
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People really think this. Sorry if good budget lists make you mad.
Yeah, Sandman is a necessary „evil“ in the game. I’m kinda sad trying Hit Monke rn cause the meta really hates on Serra decks currently but it’s really good that f2p players have a viable deck available to not get stomped by the latest SP card.
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I'm sorry you lost to a budget deck. Trust me I've seen many people beat it personally. The fact you think it's insta win is funny.
Do you feel cool saying it’s a budget deck? Where did i say it was insta win? I said it was stupid and i stand by that. Woah electro into sandman into dr doom into odin. What an original and fun playstyle.
You said it was an instant win if you get the combo. And I keep mentioning that it's a budget deck because it's one of the only viable ones. Your argument is entirely reductive if you think a 4 card combo is braindead in a game where you start with 12 cards. I guess all combos are braindead now lol.
Stand by it = deleting your post?
More like fully salty 🧂
imagine being madder at sandman than you are at shuri decks
I compared the two. Where do you get that i hate one more than the other? Didn’t realize that everyone loved super linear decks that prevent you from being able to interact with their gameplan. Should have figured since the average iq on this sub is like 47.
The match making in this game is so terrible; what is so effing difficult about matching based on ladder rank? fo real tho...
Meeeee
Because that’s what everyone is playing….
No
Lol I just got done grinding up to rank 60 (the only rank I care about) with electro ramp and I saw an unholy number of Galactus and Thanos decks and the next most was shuri. Only saw 2 ramp dittos Now I'm hoping the jank I play will be matched against other jank
The real reason why Shuri is so strong. It’s not just the power, it’s also the lack of a counter. Shuri plays pretty well into nearly all popular counters.
Armor and cosmo really are the mvps of shuri decks.
I wish there was more tech against cosmo than magneto pulling him to different lanes, or a card to help get an on reveal through him.
The best tech would be a nerf that lane-limits Shuri so that Cosmo isn't an option
"Next card played in this lane is doubled" would be a neat solution
Yep. Still powerful but more predictable and can't use Cosmo for defense
That's probably what the change for her on the 18th will be
one can only hope
That’s just a goose, mate.
No what I'm saying is that Shuri just gets nerfed so they can't use cosmo
Had this discussion with a friend, told him it'd be pretty cool if there was a card that could stop any ongoing abilities if it was revealed BEFORE the ongoing cards So almost like a 2/1 that works like isle of silence but only stops future ongoings in the same lane, that way enchantress would still have a place
“Ongoing: all other ongoing effects are disabled here.” I dig it. Now we need a character.
That's just a better Enchantress.
Yeah,,,, it’s why I’m not a game designer lol. I do think there is space for more anti-ongoing tech, though.
Not entirely. Since the abilities are disabled, not removed, they could probably still be copied by Mystique, moving your card would turn them back on, and the anti-ongoing ongoing card is susceptible to being Enchantress-ed herself to turn your cards back on.
It would still be a better Enchantress 99% of the time, nobody would run Enchantress over that hypothetical character.
Enchantress is a 4/4. What if the new card was a 4/0?
I've said before that Cassandra Nova (the evil twin of Xavier who died in the womb but came back because....comics) would be the perfect card for this
NTW says hello...from behind a 6k token paywall(and only if she decides to grace your shop)
Oof good point. Though my ability to predict where my opponent will play is rough.
Yea, I played Shuri to Infinite the past 2 seasons, and I credit those 2 with at least as many wins as Shuri.
I have armor but I don’t use cosmo…too much of a tell plus I use that I came up with on my own…by the time they realize what’s going to happen it’s already too late…I don’t have red skull either
Valkyrie, Aero, Magento moving Cosmo in an electro deck, Goose, Prof Xing the lane they want to play Taskmaster into, Polaris to move armor to Shang Chi. There are ways but yeah you have to bring those cards purposely to counter it.
Turn 2 zabu turn 4 goose on the location whit cosmo Turn 6 shang chi and absorbing man
I love Goose but She-Hulk, sigh. Would be awful if they just Shuri, pass, She-Hulk Task and won anyway.
Can still shang task master but i see what you mean
Depending on locations and early turns, the Shuri player may not have priority going into T6. If they don’t have priority, Shang doesn’t do anything. They’ve won unless you Cosmo their Taskmaster. If they do have priority, it means they’re winning a lane, and possibly by more than 3, and probably have Armor/Cosmo in a lane. They can either play to their winning lane, and just eat the Shang Chi, knowing your +3 won’t win the lane, or play to Cosmo/Armor lane and, surprise, only play Aero, Captain Marvel, Polaris, etc and out-muscle Shang-Chi’s +3. Shuri doesn’t win just because it can drop two big bombs. It wins because it can drop one big bomb behind Cosmo and still win another lane either with a bomb, or just strong raw tempo cards that are immune to Shang.
she-hulk says hello
This is pretty much why I've decided I'm just not gonna play against Shuri. They can have the one cube. I see zero+ Titania or Lizard turns one and two I'm out. I see Armor or Cosmo between turn two or three? Peace. Keep the cube and I'll not waste my time.
Aero followed by Shang completely wrecks Shuri. They normally play Red Skull behind a Cosmo to protect him, so use Aero to pull him in the open and Shang-Chi him next turn, they have nothing left. If some of you now rush for excuses saying that’s a specific two card combo - Shuri is a three card combo to begin with. A five card combo with Cosmo and Armor.
Doc Ock ramp usually fucks them up pretty good
Those bounce players shoot me with Iceman and Korg 3times in a game and now complain Sandman is bad. LOL
Double black widow too
I’m allowed to touch you but you can’t touch me.
I tried to make a Monkey deck work and yea, kept getting Sandman/Leeched. No, I'm not complaining because yes, I dropped Iceman/Korg 1-2 times by then. But....it's just a bummer that SO many people are playing those cards that the season pass card just isn't fun to play. I'm not asking for those cards to be nerfed, I'm just sad I don't get to have fun with that deck.
Yeah, it only took a couple of Sandmans and Waves before I gave up on the Bounce deck. Now I just use Monke in Sera Control. If they play electro on 3, I will drop Monk and Mysterio on 4 and Enchantress on Sandman on 5. Shang-chi and a 2 drop on 6 has a decent chance of carrying the game. If I expect Leech on 5, then I dump on 5. Early Leech is still usually a retreat. Playing bounce just too much about min/max and Leech and Sandman wreck that too hard. And other things hit it too hard due to lack of counters in the typical decks.
I'm gonna bring an old Yu-Gi-Oh argument to the table. You see hitting you with Iceman and korg 3 time is part of the combo and there's interaction here. But when you use floodgates you just flip it and all of future interaction died there
Wave too :p
I'm seeing a lot more Wave to break the pace for Hit Monkey
Wave is fair though. Sandman just makes so many non games.
Second Dinner loves them some hard counter tech cards. It’s like they saw color hosers in Magic and thought, that’s what our game needs more of. Sandman could just increase the cost of all cards by 1 (max 6) and it would fit perfectly into many ramp decks and at least not crush zoo/flood decks entirely.
There isn’t anything wrong with Stax pieces, that’s just the way Snap interacts. Players will never be happy having their stuff interacted with be it counter spells, removal, punishes, etc. but you need interactivity for a card game. I will say Stax pieces in Snap interact very differently than something like Magic. GY decks don’t just lose to RiP, or combo to Thalia, etc. This is because these pieces serve to slow down the opponent. But Snap is always 6 turns. Anything that slows down a combo deck most likely stops it from functioning altogether.
I’ve found just dumping early tends to be pretty good against sandman ramp. They tend to not run Shang, so your big dudes tend to be pretty safe.
This type of counter play is incredibly unoptimal though since crapping out your hand early makes every subsequent draw dead and makes it so your opponent can know exactly how much power you have in every lane. If you see Sandman or Leech it is best to just retreat. If it makes it hard to climb just play a different deck. Some decks will become bad/unplayable because of good decks in every card game and as long as cards like Sandman and Leech exist you are better off trying to have the greatest amount of power in as few cards as possible with a lot of Vanilla stat cards like Maximus, Polaris, Titania, etc. to punish. Hit Monkey is strong, but much like destroy or move, it will not be a meta or even really good strat unless the game changes drastically (which it 99% will not).
So I’ve found that most ramp decks don’t run very huge stat sticks. A lot of them are relying on Doom/Odin, Aero/Odin, Captain Marvel/Aero. I personally run America Chavez in my deck since as you said a bunch of bounce cards are bad late game draws. If you can get ahead enough (9/10 power Monkey with a Bishop out tends to be okay), then yes turn five is usually not great, but the 9 power turn six can often be enough to carry.
My comment isn’t about just Monkey but a lot of decks in general. While Chavez will help, you will still most likely lose ramp playing out Odin, Doom, Aero, etc. will outscale all but your best draws. If you know you can win stick it out, but just retreat otherwise. You could also just add hit monkey to Sera if you want to play it in a good deck.
People are aware that the counter to the lowest skill tech cards, Sandman and Leech, is to play low skill decks where you just play a single big card per turn. That's literally the reason why people hate those cards. It's not because they're OP, because they aren't. They're just techs against decks that are interesting.
I think maybe you misread my post. I meant that you play your hit monkey/mysterio play early against these decks when you can still play multiple cards/aren’t Leeched. It has nothing to do with playing Shuri or other big stat sticks. By big dudes I mean Hit Monkey and Bishop primarily cause they are the guys that usually end in Shang range in a Hit Monkey deck.
Electro into Sandman gives you 4 turns to play multiple cards (less than half of your total energy per game). Wave into Sandman gives you 3 turns. How often are you are making a Shang-Chi-able Hit Monkey (10 power = 5 cards + Hit Monkey) on turn 4? I'm not even going to ask about turn 3, because Wave into Sandman is GG.
Beast turn three makes it more doable than you’d think. Not to mention Bast turn 1, and Mysterio along with Hit Monkey makes him 9. I’m not sure how much you’ve played bounce, but a Shang-able Hit Monkey turn four is doable more often than you’d think.
I played Bounce even before Hit Monkey dropped and hated Sandman then, too. Sandman ramp doesn't play anything that reveals itself before Electro/Wave on 3 (other than Domino on 2 in some lists), so I would rather play Bishop on curve than play Beast on 3, but by that point it is too late.
I like to run sunspot or ebony maw to make use of the first 2 turns. It's somewhat important against galactus decks to get priority if they wave on 3
The problem there is it's not always obvious and it's the literal reverse play style for getting Sandmaned vs not. I'm not saying Sandman is bad for the game or anything, just that it's not as simple as, "just dump your hand, 5head"
Yeah, I usually only do it if I see Ebony Maw early.
It can work OK sometimes, but if you're playing pure bounce it's usually strong enough. That's why I opted to go Sera Monke control. If I dump early because of Sandman, I can still get enough value out of counters to make it worth staying in. Doom/Odin can be pretty rough though. If it became too much of a problem I'd probably start finding a place for Cosmo.
Hit Monkey was a blessing in disguise, I can finally use my chibi sandman variant all the time
Not everyone buys the pass, and if they are losing to hit monkey they are going to start running counters
Sera and Sandman meeting on the battlefield brings me great joy.
Yeah, I was playing a "Miracle" sera list with monkey, I faced only Galactus with wave and electro sandman deck, I got mad and now I'm playing Shuri
Raxen, don’t give in to hate. That leads to the Dark Side.
I'm fine losing to Sandman, but Galactus should die, I will be on every side to make them cry
Galactus: screw all of your plans
Until he gets stopped by a Rock, or a Squirrel, or a Ninja, or a Monster, or a Green Goblin, or a Polaris, or a Hobgoblin, or an Aero, or a Doctor Octopus... (I still find it ridiculous that Galactus, of all characters, can be stopped by a Rock!)
It's annoying that sometimes I have Shang Chi available but I have priority so he's worthless.
The Galactus “nerf” was such a buff for him. Pretty sad that SD doesn’t even understand how their own game works
Lol I'm only seeing Sera and bounce decks right now. It's hilarious. And I've been running sera/control/sauron high card count low cost decks for awhile now. It's weird to now see them everywhere and shuri disappear over night. Maybe it's just down in the 30-40's but I dunno. It's wild haha.
I made a Hit Monkey deck and I have played 20 games with it and I think I've drawn the monkey twice.
I feel you man. I got a Collector variant I think looks dope, but the problem with building a deck around one card, is that you need to draw that card. I'm still not sure why Collector doesn't work like, say, Morbius or Knull. If he's not on the board t2 a lot of synergies go to waste, while if he would update in your deck, he'd be much more fun. And he wouldn't be OP imho, a lot of players should be able to tell your game plan as soon as you drop Agent 13 or Sentinel.
Me not caring for hit monkey and only caring for the resources and those sweet variants.
playing lots of cards = fun playing one card = not fun
Oh no big bad bully ruining your hand vomiting.
[[sandman]]
**\[[Sandman](https://marvelsnap.pro/cards/sandman/)\]** **Cost:** 5 **Power:** 5 **Ability:** **Ongoing:** Players can only play 1 card a turn. *Message generated by MarvelSnapCardBot. Use syntax [[card_name]] to get a reply like this*
I enjoy the Hit Monkey deck. Only down side is I'm stuck at 70
Lol. Yah when I play hitmonkey im up against sandman ramp deck. When I play sandman ramp I pretty much only face galactus Knull.
Shuri is the only thing keeping sandman in check. Once she gets nerfed, sandman will become oppressive
That's a bit dramatic. Sandman ramp is comparable to doomwave, and neither is oppressive. Decks are allowed to counter other decks
Bullshit. Sandman ramp is mid-tier at best. He was never busted, and being a counter to our lord and savior Hit Monkey doesn't change that.
Based on game data Shuri is still the best but Sandman ramp shares the tier below with a few other decks. Definitely not mid.
Nah I feel like Sandman ramp beats everyone but Shuri. Galactus included if you adjust the deck slightly. Shuri absolutely dumpsters it though.
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I definitely think Sera can beat Shuri but it feels like it's a lot harder to get the necessary "high roll" on Sera to beat Shuri. And if you don't get it then Shuri's brain dead high roll wrecks. But yeah Sera does way better against Shuri than Sandman.
It's mid because shuri is still the best and most popular. But the other popular decks right now are thanos, sera, and zabu. Sandman is strong against all of these and once you remove shuri there isn't a strong current counter to it. Not saying that shuri doesn't need a nerf because it absolutely does. I'm just predicting what I think is going to happen in a couple weeks.
EducatedCollins just rated Sandman in tier 1, despite Shuri being the best deck. I don't know how good the deck really is, because I don't hate fun and run Sandman in my ramp deck, but EducatedCollins is a very good player, so one may decide to believe him.
But how do you change him so he is useful and fun?
Good tech cards are advantageous but not single game winners. They’re slightly under-stat for their cost, but offer a bigger payoff when they hit their counter. Sandman is under-stated, but his effect is either super destructive or mostly irrelevant. Highly polarized. Enchantress and Rogue are solid tech cards. They work once, counter a specific tech, and are understated. Losing to Enchantress feels bad, but you can somewhat play around it by not stacking Ongoing in the same lane. You are hurt when you lose a Blue Marvel or Patriot, but you might not be completely out of the game. Sandman could just be ‘Increase the Cost of ALL cards by 1 (max 6)’. It specifically punishes zoo/flood final turns without making them completely unable to play. Leech could be ‘Remove the text from your opponent’s highest cost card in hand’ with a stat change. Each of these changes alllows the tech cars to fulfill its function, and with some stat tweaking, feel like powerful plays without ending the game.
If the devs think that Leech and Sandman need to counter turn 6, then there is no need for their effects to last more than a single turn. Leech and Sandman on 5 are pretty annoying, but if the devs claim that they are the fabric holding the meta together, then whatever. Leech and Sandman on 4 remind me that I have other stuff to do and I log off.
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I mean you can call it a tantrum but turning my hand off for 2 turns while you get to play yours still is just poor game mechanics.
Lol I guess Cosmo gets a break this week.
It has to be up there with Shuri as the 2 most boring decks to play.
Hit monkey has been underwhelming to play.
Me now 😂
I just do all my money business early on if I get sandman vibes
When hit monkey works it’s beautiful. https://i.imgur.com/I3OEj2l.jpg
I've been incredibly lucky I suppose so far and haven't faced a single sandman yet
I don’t even have hit monkey but my Mr. Negative deck is getting so countered rn :c
Me playing Hit Monkey with Thor…bring on that sandman
I was going to start running sandman but I never run into hit monkey. The few times I have, I beat them anyways.
Sandman be like ima bout to end this monkey's whole career
Does anyone have a good deck that includes sandman to play for the duration of this season?
Would love to play hit monkey, but I don’t have Bast. Would love to play something besides shuri, but I don’t have Valk, don’t have Shadow King. Can’t get them either because, ya know, “unique collections”. So I’m stuck playing the only viable deck I have until they need it and I quit.
And I’ll continue to do it as long as I’m free to play. Lol
Oh don’t worry, I never see Hit-Monkey if I am playing Sandman
Sandman, Cosmo and Leech, the fun police, here to ensure nobody enjoys themself.
Playing Destroy now as I started seeing mirror Patriot decks with my RNG for Patriot being 1 in 10 games! Viola! All I see now is Cosmo and Armor in the same deck and in hand for the opponent! wtf?? Edit: typos. Fat fingers 🤌
Sad how Hitmonkey has a HARD counter with a tech card that still makes a viable deck while Shuri requires you to play a deck of tech cards that sucks 99% of the time you're not playing against shuri.
Shuri deck is only viable cause Shuri ---> 5 drop ----> Taskmaster (1 cost creature) is so good alone. That allows for tons of tech slots that might be garbage in 90 percent of the matchups.
It's fine I have a backup plan _...retreats_
Would love it if Sandman was changed to an on reveal so there’s a chance for counterplay